#garfield Logs
Sep 21 2014
#garfield Calendar
00:01 katsmeow-afk cannot be that bad
00:01 katsmeow-afk you can reprogram to lower that
00:01 tsmeow-afk pats rue firmly on his back in cong
00:02 katsmeow-afk that has got to be the lowest parts count to make a damned near perfect 60hz power invertor that i have ever seen
00:02 rue_shop aha
00:02 rue_shop its cant be *the* bottom 5 bits, because those 5 bits go thru the 32 bytes of pwm sample
00:03 rue_shop but the next 5 bits drop the step resolution
00:03 katsmeow-afk ah, well, see i don't know how you did the programming bits, i keep saying that
00:03 rue_shop :) it was your idea
00:03 rue_shop so each pwm cycle is 32 bytes
00:04 rue_shop start high, and goes low after the number of bits for the pwm value
00:04 rue_shop so, if the pwm value for that sample is 3, the first 3 of the 256 bits in the 32 bytes will be high
00:05 katsmeow-afk it looks linear tho, like if you dropped the A0-1-2-3-4 off the 2764 and gnds those pins on the 2764, you would still get a sine wave
00:05 rue_shop I think thats my rc filter
00:05 rue_shop I'm eager to plug it into a transformer and see how a large lump of iron filters it
00:06 katsmeow-afk try any old center tapped xformer
00:06 katsmeow-afk got a generic 6v-0-6v radio shack ?
00:06 rue_shop I dropped out A5, 6, 7, 8 of the rom, and it gets verry steppy
00:06 rue_shop all the ups' use centre tapped transforers
00:06 katsmeow-afk A5 and up is too big a step
00:06 rue_shop I have a pile of them
00:07 katsmeow-afk drop the bottom 5,, try just dropping A0, then try A1, etc
00:07 rue_shop A0-4 are required for the bits of the pwm sample
00:07 rue_shop if you drop them, there basically is no pwm
00:07 katsmeow-afk i am not saying i am all for it, just addressing the chip count on the 74393 solution
00:07 katsmeow-afk ok
00:08 rue_shop I like 256 pwm samples/half wave
00:08 katsmeow-afk works for me :-)
00:08 rue_shop its a number I can live with
00:08 rue_shop one of the ups' I have says its 'stepped sine' output
00:08 rue_shop nothing says how many steps...
00:08 katsmeow-afk did you get a pic of the pwm coming off the 2764 somewhere?
00:09 katsmeow-afk that droop the scope shows in the bottom trace is bugging me
00:10 katsmeow-afk err, you have a full analog scope, right, not a digitising scope?
00:12 katsmeow-afk radio shack sold billions of these over the years : http://www.ebay.com/itm/1x-Power-Transformer-120V-to-12VCT-6-3-0-6-3-at-1-5A-New-/121280047857 , did you get one? good nuff for testing with some irf1404's or irfz44's
00:14 rue_shop aha
00:14 rue_shop I do see glitches in the pwm that are prolly due to the ripple counter
00:14 katsmeow-afk hence the latch i mentioned
00:14 rue_shop yup
00:15 rue_shop analog scope
00:15 katsmeow-afk good
00:15 katsmeow-afk digitising scopes tend to make mush of pwm signals
00:19 katsmeow-afk 24v battery pack driving 2kva 15v buck/boost transformers... that should work awesomely
00:19 rue_shop my scope is actually hard pressed to show the high freq clock for the pwm selection
00:19 katsmeow-afk maybe you got 1Mhz probes
00:20 rue_shop there is the old dc-dc up to 190 and H bridge your output directly
00:20 rue_shop probes are all 60M
00:20 katsmeow-afk trust me, i didn't forget that option :-)
00:21 rue_shop ok I'm gonna eat, maybe sleep
00:21 katsmeow-afk ok
00:21 rue_shop I'm feeling overwhemled with success
00:21 e_shop grumbles over the 17 bit cou
00:22 rue_shop maybe I could drop it to 128 pwm samples/half wave....
00:23 katsmeow-afk i dug out my igbt , looking them up for Vdrop now
00:23 rue_mohr2 and if I used a 1M rom, I could make each bit pwm output, and have 3 phase offset outputs
00:24 rue_mohr2 er 512M
00:24 rue_mohr2 er 512k
00:24 rue_mohr2 right, *need food*
00:27 rue_mohr2 zlog,
00:28 katsmeow-afk 20N60C3 , 45a - 600v - continuous, TO-247 , 120a - 450v - pulsed , spec'd to 100Khz , 2.5Vdrop@45amps, 1.5Vdrop@20amps
00:28 rue_mohr2 hmmm
00:28 katsmeow-afk so the irf830 might be cheaper overall, i didn't check it's freq spec
00:29 rue_mohr2 its a nose-to-chin rave
00:29 rue_mohr2 race
00:30 rue_mohr2 are those the welder IGBTs?
00:30 katsmeow-afk commercial psu plugin for rack puters, they get fed with 208 3ph a few kw
00:31 e_mohr2
00:31 rue_mohr2 did they come with drivers?
00:31 rue_mohr2 or heatsinks :)
00:31 katsmeow-afk i got 10 of them fairly cheap (< $10), contains the igbt, scrs, triacs, diodes, caps, heat sinks, chokes, etc etc
00:32 katsmeow-afk they were new in box, never used, but the oem won't gimme data sheet on how to power them up and set them on/off
00:32 rue_mohr2 hey, they are 600V. how about going old school and make it like a tube output amp, have the transistors run low current high voltage and step it down to your output?
00:32 katsmeow-afk still have 8 new in oem wrapping
00:33 katsmeow-afk why use more than 200v tho?
00:33 rue_mohr2 to lower your switching current
00:33 katsmeow-afk the higher the volts, the more batteries needed, and more battery chargers
00:33 rue_mohr2 less current draw, smaller wire, thicker gloves...
00:34 katsmeow-afk but if i switch direct to 120vac, i need no output transformer at all, saves 100's lbs on weight, and size, heat, etc
00:34 rue_mohr2 more exciting failures...
00:34 rue_mohr2 indeed
00:35 katsmeow-afk you kow google has a contest for $million right now on switching 450v(?) at a couple kw to 120vac?
00:35 katsmeow-afk you might have just won
00:35 katsmeow-afk there's efficency specs and such, they test it, it hasto win
00:35 rue_mohr2 450dc?
00:36 katsmeow-afk yeas, gawdawefully high for a test jig for a contest
00:36 rue_mohr2 calc 450/13.5
00:36 rue_mohr2 450/13.5 -->> 33.3333
00:36 rue_mohr2 thats lotsa 12V battereis
00:36 katsmeow-afk http://www.cnet.com/news/google-funds-million-dollar-contest-for-better-power-electronics/?_escaped_fragment_=#!
00:37 rue_mohr2 oh maybe I heard about this
00:37 katsmeow-afk Contestants must submit a technical approach by July 15, 2015. <<== damn
00:37 rue_mohr2 size of a credit card and 1kw?
00:37 katsmeow-afk https://www.littleboxchallenge.com/
00:38 katsmeow-afk Applicants contemplating competing in the prize must register their team by the registration deadline: September 30, 2014.
00:38 katsmeow-afk you got 9 days to reg you, me,a nd Tom
00:39 katsmeow-afk 450vdc input, 2kva
00:39 katsmeow-afk 450v @ 4.5amps = 2kva,, i can make that
00:39 katsmeow-afk i got parts, baby
00:40 katsmeow-afk i got transformers: 120, 240, 208, 460, 480
00:40 katsmeow-afk and 15v buck-boost
00:40 rue_mohr2 I dont get it, this barely sounds hard
00:40 katsmeow-afk and 350v - 400v capacitors, 60hz and switcher-rated
00:40 katsmeow-afk i cannot make the box it goes in
00:41 katsmeow-afk and i am one person
00:41 katsmeow-afk so i didn't enter
00:41 katsmeow-afk Must maintain a temperature of no more than 60°C during operation everywhere on the outside of the device that can be touched. <<== *that* is why you'd use the irf830's, dissipate the heat as low level all over the place, no concentrations
00:43 katsmeow-afk gotta be something better than the irf830's but i got 100 sitting here, and can get more
00:45 rue_mohr2 kat, it would be nice, but if I give tis technology to humans I'll be skinned alive
00:45 katsmeow-afk i have the high speed scopes, and 1500v probes
00:46 katsmeow-afk why??
00:46 katsmeow-afk techically, i think you do not need to give it to anyone, afaik, you do not give google a schematic with parts values, or any software
00:47 rue_mohr2 by the *nice* guys
00:47 katsmeow-afk oh, heh, you realaise if the 450 is /2 up front, it meets spec for my direct-to-120vac convertor?
00:48 katsmeow-afk this suddenly got so trivial, making the box to put it all in really is the hardest part
00:49 katsmeow-afk and it's only 2kw, i was planning on it sustaining repeated surges to 12kw
00:49 katsmeow-afk 2kw is 16amps
00:49 katsmeow-afk figure 20amps
00:50 katsmeow-afk figure 30amp peaks
00:50 katsmeow-afk i can build this without buying any parts at all
00:52 rue_mohr2 what is the IEEE seperation constratint between a 450VDC buss' terminals and a 120VAC bus' terminals?
00:52 katsmeow-afk the box will look like crap tho, if i build it
00:52 katsmeow-afk google says it need not be galvanically isolated
00:52 rue_mohr2 I cant find proper competition data
00:52 katsmeow-afk it just cannot be connected to gnd
00:53 katsmeow-afk "Does not require galvanic isolation"
00:53 katsmeow-afk https://www.littleboxchallenge.com/pdf/LBC-InverterRequirements.pdf
00:54 katsmeow-afk this means you can define the (-) of the 450vdc to be gnd level to the output, or the (+) , or something in between
00:56 katsmeow-afk ouch, they changed it from 120 out to 240 out
00:56 katsmeow-afk In this document, competitors will
00:56 katsmeow-afk list the performance of the inverter they themselves have measured on the following
00:56 katsmeow-afk metrics while testing their inverter on a 2 kW purely resistive load at 240 +/ 12 V AC
00:56 katsmeow-afk output.
00:56 rue_mohr2 10R input impedence, ouch
00:57 katsmeow-afk direct drive makes that easier than you think, you cannot use a transformer anyhow, there's no room
00:59 tsmeow-afk ponder
00:59 tsmeow-afk holds one of her 4700 ufd 400v caps in one paw, and a 3300ufd 330v cap in the other
01:00 katsmeow-afk gotta look at the box specs, see if there's room
01:00 rue_mohr2 you realize their 10R resistor will drop 40V?
01:00 katsmeow-afk ok?
01:01 katsmeow-afk you still haveto function from the whole 450v down to 410v then
01:01 rue_mohr2 interseting
01:01 rue_mohr2 according to their graph, they expect between 400-390 into the inverter
01:01 rue_mohr2 at 5-6A
01:02 katsmeow-afk 240vac peak = 336vdc , switching down from their dc simply should not be a huge problem
01:03 katsmeow-afk 40 cu inch box
01:03 katsmeow-afk that's 3.4 if it's a cube
01:04 katsmeow-afk my big caps take up 36 inches (3" dia x 4" long), and they are 400v, not 450
01:05 katsmeow-afk that 450v seriously bites, because the next cap size is 600v, and they get pricey
01:06 katsmeow-afk i have a few 100 caps: 100u 100v
01:06 katsmeow-afk i can use them to make one 2000ufd @ 500v , i dunno what size atm
01:08 katsmeow-afk ah, i have 40(?) caps 470ufd @ 450v, i can series them to be 230ufd @ 900v , that will do
01:10 katsmeow-afk ok, if the box is a 3.4 x 3.4 x 3.4 (altho it can be any dimentions up to 40 cu inches) , i can put 470ufd 900v of caps in the bottom 2 inches
01:11 katsmeow-afk the top 1.4 iches, and some space on the sides, can hold those 5 chips and some mosfets
01:12 katsmeow-afk so i need to make 315vac, and rectify it, and filter it, tomorrow, or not?
01:13 katsmeow-afk rue, Tom, you wanna get together and win a $million and blow hackaday outa the water?
01:14 rue_mohr2 :)
01:14 rue_mohr2 40"^3
01:14 rue_mohr2 so, just to ballpark
01:15 rue_mohr2 1" thick
01:15 rue_mohr2 5x4"
01:15 rue_mohr2 switching 5A at only 95% eff
01:15 rue_mohr2 or was it 93
01:15 katsmeow-afk my 470/450 caps need 2" x 1.3"
01:16 rue_mohr2 kat, I might falls asleeps
01:16 katsmeow-afk i am tryng to make a cap bank fit 1" right now
01:16 katsmeow-afk fall asleep on a $million?
01:22 katsmeow-afk ok, in a 3.4 x 3.4 x 1" space, i can put 42 caps, each 100/100 , wire them for 500v, and get 800ufd@500v of very low impedance cap
01:22 rue_mohr2 I wonder if a volumetric charge storage cell could be modified to modulate
01:22 katsmeow-afk uses 40 caps, i can make at least 4 of thos packs with caps i have sitting on this diesk now
01:23 rue_mohr2 I wonder if the chamber could be set to charge and be discharged at the same time
01:23 katsmeow-afk is it small enough?
01:24 rue_mohr2 if the balance was wrong, it would look like it wasn't efficient, but it would be accumulating the 'lost' power
01:24 rue_mohr2 (charging)
01:24 rue_mohr2 they might get suspicios if, when the dc was removeed, it kept running the 2kw load
01:25 katsmeow-afk the smaller caps work out to be 1.7x the capsaciatce and in 1/2 the space
01:25 katsmeow-afk heh
01:25 rue_mohr2 :)
01:25 katsmeow-afk is 800ufd or 1600ufd enough?
01:26 katsmeow-afk one bank should be good for 8amps
01:26 katsmeow-afk or more
01:26 rue_mohr2 but, there would be no input ripple
01:27 katsmeow-afk google won't allow input ripple now? OUCH
01:27 rue_mohr2 its basicalyl your idea with different tech
01:27 rue_mohr2 no I mean a vca
01:27 rue_mohr2 call it an ion battery
01:27 rue_mohr2 not that that makes sense, whatever
01:28 katsmeow-afk 20% input ripple, way ouch
01:29 rue_mohr2 katsmeow-afk, if you could change the capacitance dynamically, you could do the switching and regulation without "any" loss ;)
01:29 katsmeow-afk ideally, there needs to be 8000ufd, there's no way
01:30 rue_mohr2 how can you effectivly varry the distance between the plates of your capacitors?
01:31 katsmeow-afk only 20% of the ripple can show on the input, then 80% of the sine amps must come from the caps **at 60hz**
01:31 katsmeow-afk cannot vary them
01:31 rue_mohr2 oh cmon
01:31 rue_mohr2 dont use words like that :)
01:32 rue_mohr2 if you take your 8mf cap, double the distance between its plates, charge it up to 400V, and put the plates back to the origional distance, whats the voltage on it?
01:33 katsmeow-afk modern caps are insulated by a layer of aluminum oxide a few atoms thick, and some tracing paper, there's almost no room in there to vary
01:33 katsmeow-afk same
01:34 katsmeow-afk unless it arcs over
01:35 rue_mohr2 electropotentioal field
01:37 rue_mohr2 http://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/82429/why-does-the-voltage-increase-when-capacitor-plates-are-separated
01:37 rue_mohr2 heh, I'm gettting rusty
01:37 tsmeow-afk arrrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggggggssss
01:40 rue_mohr2 isn't it funny sometimes how new technology is just made on a spin of soemthing thats been around forever?
01:40 katsmeow-afk you don't get more voltage by moving your batteries closer together
01:43 rue_mohr2 hahah you do if they touch!
01:43 rue_mohr2 :)
01:43 rue_mohr2 particularily if the + of one touches the - of the other! :)
01:44 rue_mohr2 (sorry)
01:45 katsmeow-afk 25 irf830 in parallel = .060 ohms, but at only 8amps that only .48 v
01:45 rue_mohr2 so why cant a partially charged cap be used to output just a little voltage on the output?
01:46 rue_mohr2 zippo:/files/music/mp3# ohm -v 0.48 -i 8
01:46 rue_mohr2 Wattage is: 3.840000
01:46 rue_mohr2 Current is: 8.000000
01:46 rue_mohr2 Voltage is: 0.480000
01:46 rue_mohr2 Resistance is : 0.060000
01:47 katsmeow-afk at sine peak total both sides of the bridge, that's 1.3v drop
01:47 katsmeow-afk average power dissipation is 8 watts
01:48 rue_mohr2 calc 1.4*240
01:48 rue_mohr2 1.4*240 -->> 336
01:48 rue_mohr2 calc 400-336
01:48 rue_mohr2 400-336 -->> 64
01:48 rue_mohr2 64V headroom
01:48 rue_mohr2 ?
01:49 rue_mohr2 did I get my nuebrs right/
01:49 katsmeow-afk you wanna register us or not?
01:49 rue_mohr2 yes,
01:50 rue_mohr2 right now I want to sleep, but I have to eat first, is supper cooking?
01:50 rue_mohr2 oh my andits only 11:30
01:50 katsmeow-afk ok, 450vdc = 315vac, i can make that easy
01:51 katsmeow-afk i can rectify and put caps onit
01:52 katsmeow-afk yeas
01:54 katsmeow-afk 3.840000 x 2 gonna be ~ 8 watts
01:54 katsmeow-afk i didn't calc the gate current
01:54 katsmeow-afk the trick in this case with fets is to not blow more power into the gates than the fets wastes in drain-source dissipation
01:55 katsmeow-afk else it will be better to go with a new set of MJ15003/4
01:55 katsmeow-afk err
01:56 katsmeow-afk erg,, what were those 800v bipolars....
01:57 katsmeow-afk yeas
01:57 tsmeow-afk looks for her 1980's bipolar
01:58 rue_mohr2 95%
01:59 rue_mohr2 100W
01:59 rue_mohr2 so you have 92W left
02:00 katsmeow-afk ah: mj12xxx and mje12xxx and mj16xxx and mjexxxx and mjhxxxx
02:00 katsmeow-afk and mj10xxxx
02:01 katsmeow-afk bu508 700v 8amp
02:02 rue_mohr2 yay only 83000 left on the mortguage
02:03 rue_mohr2 and so far, I dont hate supper!
02:04 katsmeow-afk http://www.ebay.com/itm/BU508A-NPN-TRANSISTOR-10-PCS-GREAT-PRICE-/161427093692
02:04 rue_mohr2 VceSat?
02:04 katsmeow-afk looking.......
02:05 katsmeow-afk 0.3 at 5amps
02:05 rue_mohr2 k
02:05 rue_mohr2 wow
02:05 rue_mohr2 hfe?
02:06 rue_mohr2 hopefully more than 5....
02:06 katsmeow-afk something wrong here
02:06 katsmeow-afk getting the pdf
02:08 katsmeow-afk mospec text says 1v @ 4.5amp , motorola says 0.3v at 5amp
02:12 tsmeow-afk s
02:14 katsmeow-afk i speepy
02:14 katsmeow-afk sleepy
02:15 tsmeow-afk wavers gn
02:16 katsmeow-afk 2.5" x 4.5" x 3.5" = 40 cu "
02:27 e_house dangles electropotential differentials over kats head while she drifts off to s
05:14 katsmeow-afk i think it cannot be done
05:15 katsmeow-afk the pita about ac power is that every 8ms it's shut off, and twice every cycle for 3ms at a time it's 40% overvoltage
05:16 katsmeow-afk the resistor load them pulls no current every 8ms, and pulls 40% over rms for 3 ms every 8ms,, and the rest of the time it's pulling more or less current
05:17 katsmeow-afk that's 100% ripple
05:19 katsmeow-afk Google's 20% ripple allowance means that at 8amp full load, when the ac load is pulling no current, the convertor box still must pull at least 7.2 amps, and when the load is puling it's 40% over, or 11.2amps, the pull on the dc side can be only 8.8 amps
05:20 katsmeow-afk the only cure is active power factor correction, essentially a boost switcher, maybe to 900v, THEN you buck from 900v down to the desired voltage
05:21 katsmeow-afk and to reach Google's desired 95% efficency, both the boost and the buck convertor must run at 98% or better
05:21 katsmeow-afk i understand the why, and the theory, but i think i cannot meet those input ripple specs in the allowed space
05:22 katsmeow-afk http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_power_factor_correction
05:41 katsmeow-afk if google wants to install a hydrogen-fuel-cell-powered electric car battery charger, and the input ripple is allowed to be 100%, the fuel cell must be sized for the 1.414 x rms current peak , and then every 8ms when the ac voltage goes to zero, the cell is just a very pricey fuel waster
05:43 katsmeow-afk same for solar cells, the 60hz power is 16ms long, and for 2ms, 1/8 of the time, the voltage is essentially zero, if the 100% ripple is allowed then 1/8 of the time the solar cells are useless
05:43 katsmeow-afk and ~40% of the time you are pulling 40% more current than they are rated for
05:44 katsmeow-afk ac power is pretty sucky
05:45 katsmeow-afk building a 2x switched capacitor boost isn't difficult, but then making 240vac from the 900vdc is difficult
05:47 katsmeow-afk and a simple 2x switched cap boost is still pretty noisey on the input lines, but it's filterable
06:03 tsmeow-afk appolog
06:05 katsmeow-afk i wonder if people would rather buy an insanely pricey tiny unit that won the google competition, or a cheaper one that uses older technology and any repair shop can fix
06:06 katsmeow-afk because a simple fix is just use larger capacitors on the input
06:07 tsmeow-afk sighs and appologises a
06:15 katsmeow-afk does anyone know how long you can get 8 amps out of 230ufd at 400vdc before the voltage drops to 340vdc ?
06:15 katsmeow-afk or, aaargggggggggg
06:17 katsmeow-afk if the 450vdc input is switched at a rate to limit the current to 8.5amps max, into two banks of 230ufd, and the caps charge to 450v each, how long can you pull 8amps out before the caps fall to 180vdc?
06:19 katsmeow-afk oh, and i need a choke for 12amps pk at whatever switcher freq that can drop 270v across it,,,, and diodes to clamp it's kickback
06:28 katsmeow-afk rue, can you switcher 450vdc down to half cycles of 120vac?
06:44 katsmeow-afk 2 x 4 x 5.5 can hold 4) 470ufd@450v caps, and two ferrite chokes 2" diameter .5x.75 cores
06:44 katsmeow-afk and have a 2 x 2 x 2 space for the otehr parts
06:45 katsmeow-afk and still be under 40 cu inches
06:47 katsmeow-afk if i can use the input switcher filter to lower the 450vdc input down below 450v, i can use the 450v caps and not series them
06:57 katsmeow-afk 1.25 x 4 x 8 = 40 , i have two 470u 450v caps in it, two of the huge ferrites, and an empty space 4 x 1.25 x 4
07:01 katsmeow-afk rue, does it cost to join the competition?
07:15 katsmeow-afk http://designerthinking.com/DSCF6558.jpg
07:16 katsmeow-afk if those parts will do, they will take 1/2 the space of a 1.25 x 4 x 8 box
07:16 katsmeow-afk 1.25 x 4 x 8 = 40
07:17 katsmeow-afk i have some smaller chokes
07:17 katsmeow-afk afk
07:53 katsmeow-afk [sunday evening] so watching the tv this morning i learned today is the day to buy this car,, but i had boughtit yesterday, but i returned it and bought it today
07:54 katsmeow-afk it's a freaking mess, i can tell you , WOW, because i also learned today is the day to try these laxatives, and they kicked in as i was leaving the car dealer, but i had also learned today is the day to ask my doctor about this new heart medicing, diabtetes pen, and colesteraol dugs, so i stopped by his house
07:55 katsmeow-afk i guess i woke him or he didn't recognise me, but i was a mess from the laxatives banging on his front door, the cops showed up and wrapped me in plastic to put me in their car for a ride to the jail, that was interesting
07:55 katsmeow-afk anyhow, i am home now, and hoping today wasn't the day for anything else [/sunday evening]
10:24 rue_house arg, its only 8! put me back under!
10:24 e_house hands katsmeow-afk a ma
11:44 rue_mohr2 katsmeow-afk, the pwm chip idea wouldn't have worked anyhow
11:44 rue_mohr2 it has a 30Mhz pwm clock, and they are 12 bit pwm channels
11:45 rue_mohr2 thats only 7khz
11:48 rue_mohr2 even 256 samples per full wave is 15.36Khz update rate
11:49 rue_mohr2 if I used a latch on the output of the 151
11:49 rue_mohr2 it could be a 7474
11:50 rue_mohr2 and the other half could be the 17th bit divider
14:14 katsmeow-afk wouldn't have worked on what?
14:50 katsmeow-afk my throat feels like it's beenbreathing peppers
16:30 rue_shop the pwm chip that takes 30Mhz data and generates 12 bit pwm at up to a 30Mhz clock rate would not have worked for generating 60Hz sine pwm with 256 samples per cycle
16:31 rue_shop power supply
16:31 rue_shop I wonder if I can get this power supply going in linear mode
16:34 tsmeow-afk doesn't
16:34 katsmeow-afk sinuses,, bad
16:35 katsmeow-afk so the bottom of the well the radiator cap seals against is eaten up and the caps won't seal watertight, and the overflow hose barb is busted off, how can i secure the water leaks so the spray isn't keeping the ignition system wet?
16:37 katsmeow-afk i used 2-part to rebild a mirror flat saling surface, unfortunately it cannot seal to the radiator plastic, it's like sealing to coroplast,, so the cap seals to the new bottom i mande, but the botton won't seal to the radiator
16:37 katsmeow-afk my right paw is all scratched up
16:39 katsmeow-afk i am so tempted to saw off the tube, slip a screw-on base of some sort over the tube stub, reattach the thing with a couple hose clamps and then encapsulate the entire cap-base-overflow
16:41 katsmeow-afk it would prolly all break off the first bump i hit
16:52 katsmeow-afk something else that may be useful , or not : if you are going to put a avr on the pwm ups, like for battery monitoring, *maybe* you can store the existing 8kx8 bitmap in the avr, then on bootup you write it to a 64kx4 ram, you get one bit for the main pwm, one bit for the flow switch, 2 for something you'll think of later (maybe zero-crossing and peak-present?)
16:53 katsmeow-afk since the ram will be continuously read over and over, top to bottom, you can use a cheap dram or lil more pricey static
16:54 katsmeow-afk maybe make the circuits simpler, i dunno, again: depends on how you wrote the eprom bits
16:56 katsmeow-afk i need clean desk space and to run a 240vac line into here?
16:57 rue_mohr2 the steering only switches at 0 duty
16:57 katsmeow-afk can someone decide that for me? because basically, *i* don't need a 450vdc-to-240vac convertor, and cannot win the $million by myself, so it's pointless to try when i have other things need doing
16:58 rue_mohr2 I wonder if I have a 64kx1 sram chip
16:58 katsmeow-afk to cover my butt on a sure win basis, i need to build a 220vdc-to-120vac convertor
16:58 rue_mohr2 I'm trying to sort thu a large pile of thigns myself
16:58 katsmeow-afk erg, ggt, brb
17:08 katsmeow-afk so,, nasal spray does grow mold,, i wonder if anyone should use it?
17:09 katsmeow-afk on the otehr paw, an open jar of jelly won't grow mold even if left out for months, i wonder if anyone shold eat it
17:09 katsmeow-afk the doctors got a prise for packing a kid's sinuses with pork, i won't if jelly isn't better than this saline spray
17:14 tsmeow-afk looks at
17:14 rue_shop how many joules are in a half cycle of 240Vac at 2kw?
17:15 katsmeow-afk i dunno
17:15 katsmeow-afk makes it more complex when you have a nonlinear waveform,a nd the ac reactance of the cap
17:17 katsmeow-afk it would always irritate me that the voltage on the cap would go up 2-5v the nanosec i took the load off it, or i found out i was dissipating 10% of the power in a diode clamp on a coil, etc
17:18 katsmeow-afk that 2-5v rise cold cause an oscillation, and the diode would need a new heatsink, it wasn't trivial stuff when managing horsepower loads
17:20 katsmeow-afk caps age very fast when under high loads, you basically start with 2x the space you believe you will need, make the circuit work, and then go back and add to all the capacitors so each does not work so hard
17:20 katsmeow-afk that's why one doesn't use 450v caps on a 450vdc input :-/
17:22 katsmeow-afk wth, intellicast has not updated the regioal radar since this morning
17:24 katsmeow-afk neither has wunderground
17:25 tsmeow-afk waits a few minutes for Tiggr to update her r
17:26 katsmeow-afk 8 minutes
17:28 katsmeow-afk 300,000 people burned fossil fuels to get to NY and march against global warming caused by burning fossil fuels
17:30 katsmeow-afk SEPT. 21, 2014
17:30 katsmeow-afk TEHRAN — Two Chinese warships have docked at Iran’s principal naval port for the first time in history, Iranian admirals told state television on Sunday, adding that both countries would conduct four days of joint naval exercises.
17:31 katsmeow-afk In related news, usa military leaders are being treated for sever diarhea
17:33 katsmeow-afk how well China copies usa destroyers : http://p3.img.cctvpic.com/program/newsupdate/20130201/images/1359722063202_1359722063202_r.jpg
17:35 katsmeow-afk http://p3.img.cctvpic.com/program/newsupdate/20130201/images/1359722034446_1359722034446_r.jpg
17:37 rue_shop you dont happen to have one of those overlays of all the pinouts of all the rom chips on one socket do you?
17:37 katsmeow-afk so Russia is renewing ties to Cuba and Venesuela, and China is gettong cozy with Iran, Argentina, and Oz
17:37 katsmeow-afk prolly
17:37 katsmeow-afk Tiggr's radar source isn't updating right either,, or everyone's national maps are misaligned
17:40 katsmeow-afk well, i do on modules
17:50 katsmeow-afk i don't see it, rue, sorry
17:55 katsmeow-afk http://www.tunercat.com/tnr_desc/eprom_pin/eprom_pins.html
17:56 katsmeow-afk http://www.knurl.com/Eproms.html <<== makes no sense to me
18:00 katsmeow-afk http://sebhc.lesbird.com/documentation/software/docs/Eprom_Pinouts.pdf
18:08 rue_shop the pdf is nice, but its wrong, they only have it pinned out for use, not for programming, aka there is no vpp on it
19:10 any94139434 [16:37] <katsmeow-afk> i need clean desk space and to run a 240vac line into here?
19:10 any94139434 [16:38] <katsmeow-afk> can someone decide that for me? because basically, *i* don't need a 450vdc-to-240vac convertor, and cannot win the $million by myself, so it's pointless to try when i have other things need doing
19:10 any94139434 [16:39] <katsmeow-afk> to cover my butt on a sure win basis, i need to build a 220vdc-to-120vac convertor
19:10 y94139434 eats more sinus d
19:10 any94139434 *** Topic is 'HEY GIVE ME A HALF HOUR TO ANSWER ALREADY!'
19:10 any94139434 i gave you half hour
19:16 y94139434 plays video g
19:21 any94139434 i think this is why i don't do anything any more, when i show any incentive/initiative, everyone backs the hell away from me
19:22 any94139434 the dumbass beer-swilling football fanatics that live around here have it right, trying to be better just works against me
19:37 NotWorthCr4p i see your refusal to talk to me as added proof you don't want anything to do with me , especially in public
19:42 Tom_itx whatever.
19:44 NotWorthCr4p all i can understand from you is if you say something, but the lack of communication also says something
19:48 NotWorthCr4p and you either don't care, or you dislike me
19:49 NotWorthCr4p so i cannot understand why you object to the nick i use saying what you are thinking about me
20:00 rue_shop your back!
20:01 rue_shop ma got lots done today
20:01 NotWorthCr4p k
20:02 rue_shop I figured out the bottom of the hopper for the sand blaster
20:02 NotWorthCr4p i got nothing done after our discussion of a psu fell apart and died
20:02 rue_shop oops I have to finish puttin in the window
20:02 NotWorthCr4p i gave up and totally quit
20:03 NotWorthCr4p i should delete the pic of caps and chokes i posted this morning
20:04 NotWorthCr4p done
20:27 rue_mohr2 quit what kat
20:27 rue_mohr2 hold up, brb, supper is cooking
20:38 rue_mohr2 no fair, I was asleep, then I woke up and had a shower, then I noticed ma was here
20:38 rue_mohr2 and then I worked on stuff, and then james came by
20:38 rue_mohr2 then I worked on the eprom programmer,
20:38 rue_mohr2 then I helped ma
20:38 rue_mohr2 oh and I made breakfast
20:38 rue_mohr2 forgot lunch
20:39 rue_mohr2 oh and zack was here to get the gantry
20:39 rue_mohr2 and I went shopping to get the insulation for the boiler storage tank
20:40 rue_mohr2 and i did a cleanup in the back yard
20:40 rue_mohr2 I think I slept in a chair for about 5 mins before the phone rang
20:44 rue_mohr2 I amputated a UPS' beeper
20:47 rue_mohr2 kat, you realize you get most upset when I'm away from my computer for more than 6 hours at a time?
22:05 rue_mohr2 nick rue_mohr-afk
22:43 NotWorthCr4p i thought there was a serious conversation going, so you walked away from your computer for 6 hours, yeas, i know that gets me upset
22:44 NotWorthCr4p it's one of the reasons i say you do not respect me
22:45 NotWorthCr4p i have a splitting sinus headache atm