#garfield Logs

Jan 04 2014

01:19 katsmeow-afk ok, iron off, upstairs lites off, bench outlets off, my brain off, ...................
01:43 katsmeow-afk http://designerthinking.com/images/10a_batterycharger/DSCF6500m.jpg
01:43 katsmeow-afk http://designerthinking.com/images/10a_batterycharger/DSCF6501m.jpg
01:43 katsmeow-afk the two big modules are not in the place they will go eventually
01:44 katsmeow-afk there will be grillwork at each end
01:44 katsmeow-afk to keep bugs out, etc
01:44 katsmeow-afk yep, i hacksawed heatsinks again
01:46 katsmeow-afk the perfbd will hold the current sense resistors (shown) and 14v set opamp, overcurrent sense and throttle down opamp, maybe a tiny44 and 7-seg driver(s)
01:50 katsmeow-afk final rating shuld be 10amps @ 14vdc , overcurrent and overtemp and short proof, 100vac-260vac input, $14 for both laptop psu, $1 for both IRFZ44 and heatsinks and fan, steel case, stainless grillwork, eventually 7-seg displays, hopefully some rf communications to/from
01:52 katsmeow-afk each module is 6amp @ 15v , so i am not using the last amp, and dropping 1v by using linear regulation to reduce the switcher noise from getting into car/truck and current limit
01:53 katsmeow-afk N4WRC, Riverside, Alabama (PWS)
01:53 katsmeow-afk Updated: 1:32 AM CST on January 04, 2014
01:53 katsmeow-afk Clear
01:53 katsmeow-afk 18.0 �F
01:53 katsmeow-afk Clear
01:55 katsmeow-afk i just noticed room for a AT90S4414 in there
02:01 katsmeow-afk can hang the 5w resistors under the pcb where there's more airflow anyhow, and put the avr on top, or vice versa
02:02 tsmeow-afk hangs it up for the
02:07 rue_bed oh man, what do I do NOW?!
02:07 Lola8088 sleep
02:08 rue_bed apparently I did...
02:08 rue_bed for more than the 1/2hr I had in store
02:09 rue_bed I have to get the shop ready for robotics tommorow
02:09 Lola8088 whoohoooo
02:09 rue_bed arrrgg...
02:09 e_bed get
02:13 rue_house I had a can a pasta, wonder if that counts for supper
02:15 katsmeow-afk huh?
02:16 katsmeow-afk yeas, but you NEED iodine, it's not in vitamin pills, not in most foods, the thyroid needs it to make energy
02:16 katsmeow-afk i made more pics, scroll up
02:16 katsmeow-afk gnite
02:18 Lola8088 seaweed
02:32 rue_shop3 seaweed?
02:41 Lola8088 iodine
02:55 rue_shop3 oh
02:56 rue_shop3 how can I made a quick and dirty lead casting mold?
02:58 rue_shop3 my quick and dirty pdf search page for the shop works great
03:01 rue_shop3 stomach isn't happy
03:01 rue_shop3 I must have eaten too much
03:09 katsmeow-afk i cannot help thinking i do not want the case of the charger to be part of the electrical circuit
03:10 katsmeow-afk i haveto cut another set of fins off the heatsinks, so i can slip some FR4 tween them and the case
03:14 katsmeow-afk i paid 59.76 cents for these heatsinks
03:14 rue_shop3 geez, they got ya for the extra .76 cents eh?
03:14 katsmeow-afk yeas
03:16 katsmeow-afk box of 50, no more cutting up the pricey cpu sinks, or the 100 cent scrap yard sinks
03:19 katsmeow-afk for the 59 cents, i can mount two to-247's if i don't get them hot, or a small handfull of to-220
03:19 katsmeow-afk 4x4 cm
03:20 katsmeow-afk 1 cm of fins
03:24 tsmeow-afk gr
03:26 katsmeow-afk i have 4x6 cm od sink now, if i cut another fin off each, i'll have 5.6x4 , while it is more than a 4x4 single, it's only 1.6 more than 4cm
03:27 tsmeow-afk waves at
03:33 katsmeow-afk ok, Lola is back'
03:53 rue_shop3 071 isn't even switching
03:57 rue_shop3 LM386 has it switched on (worst time) in 4us
03:57 rue_shop3 off is faster
04:02 katsmeow-afk ?
04:03 katsmeow-afk everyone is back except chanserv
04:05 tsmeow-afk will see if rue posts a url to schematic when she wakes up l
04:20 katsmeow-afk dratitdogwords
04:20 katsmeow-afk i keep thnking of tngs that need doing
04:20 rue_house the lm741 took 15us to switch the fet
04:20 rue_house <rue_shop3> 071 isn't even switching
04:20 rue_house <rue_shop3> LM386 has it switched on (worst time) in 4us
04:20 rue_house <rue_shop3> off is faster
04:20 katsmeow-afk what bias voltage on the 071?
04:21 rue_house all 3V
04:21 katsmeow-afk it should have worked
04:21 rue_house the 386 worked great
04:21 katsmeow-afk better than teh pnp pullup?
04:22 rue_house I didn't try that cause it makest eh circuit too large
04:22 katsmeow-afk err, but the pnp pull up was the circuit yu laid ot all thos pcb for!
04:23 rue_house yea, there wasn't room for another transistor
04:23 tsmeow-afk woke up and found her 60x60mm
04:23 katsmeow-afk got pics/scematics of the opamp circuits?
04:24 rue_house http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Upright-LM386N-op-amp-audio-power-amplifier-LM386-DIP-8-domestic-original/1412851547.html
04:24 rue_house FFFFFFFFFFFet drivers....
04:24 katsmeow-afk i cut his steel for the 60mm fans, and then couldn't find them yesterday
04:24 rue_house the real fet drivers cost $0.50 ea, best price!
04:25 katsmeow-afk the 386 are 3.69 cents?
04:25 rue_house with shipping 6.55c
04:25 rue_house !!
04:26 katsmeow-afk they socked you for the extra 0.55 cents, eh?
04:26 rue_house :)
04:27 tsmeow-afk is gonna use the heck outa these 60mm
04:27 katsmeow-afk they fit this charger, and they fill a lot of the plugins i making
04:28 katsmeow-afk i wnna make up for the lack of good work the last 3 yrs
04:37 rue_house :)
04:39 katsmeow-afk sawed the heatsinks again, they actually loks better, the fet sits in the middle of each sink now
04:40 rue_house I cant imagine...
04:40 rue_house </hint>
04:40 katsmeow-afk i know you do work
04:41 rue_house yea, looks like the lm386 is loads cheaper than equiv fet drivers, hahaha
04:42 katsmeow-afk i be intersted in seeing scope pics of it working too
04:42 rue_house ok
04:42 rue_house (not tonight)
04:42 katsmeow-afk k
04:44 katsmeow-afk ack! the 386 has a lot lower vcc rating
04:45 rue_house oops
04:45 rue_house what is it
04:45 katsmeow-afk did you look?
04:45 katsmeow-afk 12v recommended operating, 15 max,
04:45 katsmeow-afk LM386N-4 is 22v max
04:45 katsmeow-afk LM386N-4 is 18v recommended
04:45 rue_house 4 to 12 or 5 to 18
04:45 rue_house thats ok
04:45 katsmeow-afk yeas
04:46 rue_house only using it 12V anyhow
04:46 rue_house more than that and I'm really pushing the gate too much
04:46 katsmeow-afk as long as your motor doesn't toss spikes at it's vcc
04:46 katsmeow-afk the gate should be able to handle 12, 10 easily in normal operation
04:47 katsmeow-afk the irfz44 has datasheet curves with 15v on it
04:48 rue_house http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bridge-MOSFET-driver-IC-FAN7382/1583141006.html
04:48 rue_house differnt functionality, but I like the price on the 386 better
04:48 katsmeow-afk i wonder why the 071 didn't work
04:49 rue_house dunno
04:49 rue_house its like the 3V wasn't enough
04:52 katsmeow-afk i don't see anything on the datasheet that says it wouldn't work
04:52 katsmeow-afk output with 12v vcc should be 2v-10v , which is about perfect
04:53 katsmeow-afk and inputs are usually as wide as the output, they sorta haveto be in a current buffer circuit, because the (-) is hooked right to the output
04:54 katsmeow-afk try removing the R from the output to (+) , maybe it's got a high freq feedback thing going on
05:04 katsmeow-afk http://designerthinking.com/images/10a_batterycharger/DSCF6526m.jpg
05:05 katsmeow-afk note no insulators
05:06 katsmeow-afk the drain/tab is the vehicle (-)/gnd , i could bolt it all to the chassis, but i'll float the heatsinks up on FR4 anyhow, to cushion them physically from the charger chassis
05:07 katsmeow-afk with the chassis not active electrically, i can drop the charger on the (+) battery terminal with no sparkles
05:07 katsmeow-afk i will use dope before i button it up
05:08 katsmeow-afk i am so tied, will someone turn my brain off?
05:08 katsmeow-afk tired
05:12 katsmeow-afk i thought i had some #4 flathead sht metal screws
05:16 rue_bed among my chips I found some lm377 and 378, I suppose I had what I needed for a headphone amp all alon
05:16 rue_bed g
05:16 tsmeow-afk
05:17 rue_bed nice heatsinks
05:18 rue_bed if available, the 60N05 beats the irfz44
05:18 rue_bed .014R instead of .028
05:18 rue_bed prolly at the expense of gate capacitance
05:19 rue_bed are those resized cpu heatsinks?
05:19 rue_bed oooh god its 3am!
05:20 katsmeow-afk cusswords
05:20 katsmeow-afk 5am here
05:21 katsmeow-afk the IRF1404 or 1406 beats the 60N05 too , but there's that price issue vs what's good enough
05:22 katsmeow-afk even at 5amps max load the IRFZ will drop onl;y 0.14v
05:22 rue_bed and the irf1440?
05:22 katsmeow-afk i don't remember the IRF1440
05:22 rue_bed .7W
05:22 katsmeow-afk .7 is less than the switcher is throwing
05:23 rue_bed indeed
05:23 katsmeow-afk and in current limiting, i back off the gate and let more voltage drop across the fet
05:23 rue_bed ah, linear mode
05:23 katsmeow-afk a real dead 12v battery will soak up all the current you can give it at 10v
05:24 katsmeow-afk yeas, i wanna keep switching spikes out of the vehicle electronics
05:25 katsmeow-afk but the modules shown in http://designerthinking.com/images/10a_batterycharger/DSCF6500m.jpg are switchers, and run real hot at 5amps, rated for 6, i'll have a fan on them pulling max 5
05:26 katsmeow-afk basically, by the time the fets are unloading votage because the battery is charged, i won't need them to be low Ron, i'll still need to drop a full volt off the 15v psu modules
05:27 katsmeow-afk i chose mosfets for the low gate current at dc
05:27 katsmeow-afk i have the 15v to pull them up with, and they are rated to 50watts, which is 10v drop at 5amps
05:28 katsmeow-afk they should never get stressed on these heatsinks with a 60mm fan on them
05:28 rue_bed :) they kinda look like modified laptop bricks
05:29 rue_bed indeed
05:29 rue_bed how many watts ea?
05:29 katsmeow-afk in, out, or delivered?
05:29 rue_bed deliver
05:30 katsmeow-afk each module : 15v and run real hot at 5amps, rated for 6, i'll have a fan on them pulling max 5 each
05:30 rue_bed k
05:30 katsmeow-afk i'll deliver 14v 10amps to the battery
05:30 rue_bed so, almost 75W ea
05:31 katsmeow-afk yeas, rated @ 90
05:31 rue_bed hmm
05:31 rue_bed how much were they?
05:31 katsmeow-afk the equaliser chargers are basically the same, but with more variable control in the linear section
05:32 katsmeow-afk i forget, i can look them up, under $8 each, pretty sure
05:32 katsmeow-afk the 4amp @ 15v are $7.68 atm , free s&h , seller is inside the usa
05:33 katsmeow-afk in what matters with those, i gave a lot of weight to them each being a totally separate psu, it matters more for that app than the wattage
05:34 katsmeow-afk the rack will still be dumping almost a killowatt into the batetries in *equalise* mode, and one of the variables is i can change the power setpoint of the units
05:36 katsmeow-afk above 100v or so, the psu will try and delive full power output, but if the *power* management of the solar cells or generator say at lighter load the voltage will go up and current will pick up more, i can unload the linear portion till the input goes up, etc
05:37 katsmeow-afk like full throttle at 800rpm vs full throttle at 2500rpm
05:38 katsmeow-afk so total delivered amps to the battery pack will be 64amps, spread across all the batteries as needed to bring each up to 14v
05:40 katsmeow-afk Saturday, January 4th
05:40 katsmeow-afk 5:00 am
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 5:30 am
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 6:00 am
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 6:30 am
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 10:30 am
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 11:00 am
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 11:30 am
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 12:00 pm
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 12:30 pm
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 1:00 pm
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:40 katsmeow-afk 1:30 pm
05:40 katsmeow-afk Paid Programming
05:41 katsmeow-afk basically, commercials until 2pm, then sports and then rehashed news at 5pm, then garbage reruns
05:52 katsmeow-afk N4WRC, Riverside, Alabama (PWS)
05:52 katsmeow-afk Updated: 5:32 AM CST on January 04, 2014
05:52 katsmeow-afk Clear
05:52 katsmeow-afk 16.0 �F
05:52 katsmeow-afk Kansas (PWS)
05:53 katsmeow-afk Updated: 5:36 AM CST on January 04, 2014
05:53 katsmeow-afk Clear
05:53 katsmeow-afk 35.0 �F
05:53 katsmeow-afk something is wronf somewhere
05:54 katsmeow-afk nope, the temperature map confirms it
05:54 katsmeow-afk the high temp from Mexico is reaching way up, and i am on the trailing back edge of the cold Tom had earlier this week
05:55 katsmeow-afk there's another cold finger moving east on it's way out of utah now
05:56 katsmeow-afk and there's a -20f blast coming south out of Canadia
05:58 katsmeow-afk tomorrow may be like last wednesday was
05:59 katsmeow-afk Tom, better make sure the genny is ready to run by Sunday nite
05:59 katsmeow-afk your furnace is no good if there's no power to run the blower
06:06 katsmeow-afk well, this sucks: the epoxy got hard, the popbottle plastic lifted rightoff
06:09 tsmeow-afk ponders a slab of steel, bolting two 2mm slabs to it 3mm apart, pouring in some bondo with fiberglass, scraping off the top of the groove level, and unbolting the two 2mm in a couple days l
06:11 tsmeow-afk then ponders making that a part of the rest of the pro
06:38 katsmeow-afk 1/8 may be .125, but all mine is measuring .128 - .130
11:15 rue_house do I get a picture yet kat?
14:47 katsmeow-afk you?
14:47 katsmeow-afk i was waiting on pics from you, including scope pics
14:47 rue_house me?
14:47 rue_house oh, yea, give me half hour
14:48 rue_house I got my 32.000Khz crystals
14:48 rue_house forks, whatever
14:48 katsmeow-afk [04:26] <katsmeow-afk> i be intersted in seeing scope pics of it working too
14:48 katsmeow-afk [04:26] <rue_house> ok
14:48 katsmeow-afk [04:26] <rue_house> (not tonight)
14:48 katsmeow-afk [04:26] <katsmeow-afk> k
14:49 rue_house yup, just got back from post oriface, working on lunch
14:49 rue_house they had *just* closed, but the layies are quite nice and gave me the package anyhow :)
14:49 katsmeow-afk i didn't get to sleep till like 8:30am
14:50 katsmeow-afk so i just woke up, but got only 6hrs sleep anyhoo
14:55 katsmeow-afk i need to get to the store
14:55 katsmeow-afk before sundown when roads turn back into a skating rink
16:00 rue_shop3 ok images for kat
16:01 rue_shop3 Tom_itx, the firmware you helped me put on the U2 board, thats a different programmer than your programmer, right?
16:01 rue_shop3 to avrdude
16:09 Tom_itx FLIP or DFUprogrammer
16:09 Tom_itx GND HWB then GND Reset to enter Program Mode
16:10 Tom_itx if it's programmer code it would be the same
16:10 Tom_itx however it has been updated slightly
16:11 rue_shop3 ok, I was wondering why a computer didn't work with yours
16:11 rue_shop3 yours is dfu?
16:12 Tom_itx what are you wanting to do?
16:19 rue_shop3 I dont use your programmer often because of the 6 pin thing
16:19 rue_shop3 I found the adapter and was trying it out
16:19 rue_shop3 today we had call for a few programmers
16:19 rue_shop3 I have my parallel ones around here somewhere too
16:22 Tom_itx you had a call for a few programmes?
16:23 rue_shop3 two people programming at once
16:23 Tom_itx so what's that got to do with what you're asking me?
16:23 Tom_itx the code is the same
16:24 Tom_itx you could download the hex from my site and put it on the U2 board
16:24 Tom_itx not the U4 though
16:24 Tom_itx that would require a recompile
16:24 Tom_itx which i could do for you easy
16:25 Tom_itx to load the firmware hex file you use FLIP or DFU programmer
16:25 Tom_itx then you use avrdude to download your magic smoke code
16:38 Tom_itx rue_bed if i downloaded files as root how do i change ownership of them to me including the directory?
17:42 Lola8088 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vVblGlIMgw
17:55 katsmeow-afk on tv news: guy put chains on his RC lawn mower and it now tries to blow snow
17:55 katsmeow-afk you could be on the news, Tom, and sell the things
18:08 tsmeow-afk cuts a mess of rings from popbottles, nests them inside each otehr with black plastic tween them, and programs the puter to light up each ring separately in dangerous scifi patt
18:13 katsmeow-afk yanno, if rue makes a parcel delivery drone that flies, and reaches 19 miles up, it's technically a space craft, and may be exempt from various aircraft rules
18:15 katsmeow-afk once you reach 19 miles, yo can use a steerable parachute to land in your back yard, so there's no noise, and you save tons of fuel,, and there's very little traffic to dodge at 100,000 ft up
18:16 katsmeow-afk save off high canada post delivering stuff
18:17 katsmeow-afk tv is saying 10f monday morning, 5f-10-f tuesday morning
18:17 katsmeow-afk great deal i raided the grocery store today
18:18 katsmeow-afk high Monday is to be 19f
18:19 katsmeow-afk it's not rare, there's been whole weeks where it never got above 32f here
18:20 katsmeow-afk idiots still talking about "freeze plugs" on engine blocks
18:22 katsmeow-afk tv is saying it's 40f outside now, that's wrong, when i came in ~5pm, an hr ago, it was colder than that
18:22 katsmeow-afk Sunday Night
18:22 katsmeow-afk Breezy. Much colder. Snow...light sleet and widespread light freezing rain in the evening...then chance of flurries after midnight. Little or no snow and sleet accumulation. Lows around 12.
18:23 katsmeow-afk i think they are all guessing
18:24 katsmeow-afk it is below zero in most of N Dakota now
18:24 katsmeow-afk so maybe they can just peel that spilled oil up in sheets
18:25 katsmeow-afk they can sell thin bricks of crude oil for use in wood heaters and fireplaces
18:26 katsmeow-afk i need to go out and bring groceries in
18:35 atom1 you need a conveyor
18:52 katsmeow-afk i need to be able to park down at the house, and having the Robotic Universal Wheeled Platform running would be nice too
18:54 tsmeow-afk munched a sub sammich while the pizza is cooking *now* in case the power goes out the next couple of
18:57 katsmeow-afk "Pat, i'd like to solve the puzzle: based on the best selling bool !"
19:53 rue_house Lola8088, high you
20:33 Lola8088 nope... not today.
20:33 Lola8088 <snicker>
20:47 rue_shop3 getting closer
20:50 Lola8088 http://www.feynmanlectures.caltech.edu/I_22.html#Ch22-S5
20:52 rue_shop3 the square root of -1 is 1j
20:52 rue_shop3 er j1
20:58 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:58 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:58 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:58 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:58 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:59 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:59 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:59 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:59 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
20:59 rue_house katsmeow-afk,
21:00 rue_house http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/circuits/fetdrive/p1050732.jpg
21:00 rue_house http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/circuits/fetdrive/p1050733.jpg
21:01 rue_house while you work onthat, I' go put etchant away
21:08 rue_house preeeety good sw2itching times eh?
22:40 katsmeow-afk lots better switching
22:43 katsmeow-afk is that the gate drive or the mosfet's drain under load?
22:45 katsmeow-afk it's possible to make a faster switch, but you'd haveto spend more and prolly use more pcb
22:45 katsmeow-afk but it's way better than http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/circuits/fetdrive/p1050730.jpg
23:24 katsmeow-afk one of the beauties of very low Ron is if you reduce the switching time, you reduce the heat thrown, the size of the heatsink, etc
23:26 katsmeow-afk this works up to the point you are drive the gate capacitance with so much wattage you offset the speed gain
23:29 katsmeow-afk conversely, one beauty of a bipolar with a huge soa is you can slow the switching in a controlled way to reduce motor kickback, lowering the need for snubbers and an extremely high Vceo rating
23:31 katsmeow-afk it's just that high powered snubbers can be large and pricey, i have some iron core chokes that are bigger tham most of my transformers, including some MOTs