#garfield Logs

Jan 13 2013

00:58 iamturnip the things i miss...
00:59 rue_house miss?
00:59 rue_house about
00:59 rue_house ?
01:00 rue_house oh I missed kat...
01:01 iamturnip the things i miss when i dont pay attention to this channel
01:01 rue_house ah
01:01 iamturnip its the only channel i am on these days
01:01 rue_house its amazing what can happen when you turn your back for a bit
01:01 iamturnip true that
01:02 rue_house I got a usb video capture device,
01:02 rue_house as it turns out, not too linux friendly, the firmware is uploaded by the drivers
01:17 rue_house Lola8088, I'm go play in my shop
01:17 rue_house try to keep an eye on the channel
01:19 rue_shop3 "there is a tree in your kitchen..." "your right, this is crazy, lets go get more."
01:21 rue_shop2 ok I have some firmware to correct, I have a paramiter that takes form 0 to 65535 and I can evaluate values for it form 0 to 9
19:11 TELunus !time
19:11 tobbor My watch says its 05:02PM Sun Jan 13 2013
19:15 Tom_itx !date
19:15 Tom_itx hah
19:40 useless ...
19:40 rue_house kat!
19:40 rue_house sorry I missed you last time
19:40 rue_house what was I going to ask you...
19:40 eless wave
19:41 useless i dunno, sorry
19:58 useless ....
20:00 useless maybe you were going to ask me to leave?
20:17 rue_shop3 :/
20:25 useless several trees near the house have been hit over the years, all died.
20:26 useless i wanted to run ground rods up them 20 yrs ago, to shunt the strike to gnd, but the dogs and legal system here put an end to all that
20:26 useless there was a poplar, biggest i have ever seen, 4ft dia at the base
20:27 useless the strike which took out a modem inside the puter, the phone cord, and the arrestors in the surge protector, hit a tree ~10ft from the corner of the ouse
20:28 useless there was a hit up the hill towards the road, kicked off every circuit breaker and blew every lightbulb that was on, and fried the fridge
20:31 useless if it weren't raining, i'd go see if the baby pump down at the creek was still on, i left it to be pumping all nite, and when i discovered there were storms scheduled i could not get back down there to retrieve it
20:31 useless if it is off, i need to shut off the power going down there, but if it's running, then it's fine
20:41 useless i need a REAL cheap way to make hot water in summer sun
21:09 rue_shop2 and youhave underground power, so thats extra mean
21:10 useless well, the lines i installed are underground, the powerco lines up at the road are on poles
21:10 rue_shop2 yes
21:10 rue_shop2 large mov's
21:10 rue_shop2 in explosion proof boxes
21:11 rue_shop2 (explosions from inside)
21:11 useless that's part of the ticking sound, the cannister of MOVs on the main breakerbox in the utility room
21:12 rue_shop2 :)
21:12 useless it's a fist-sized thing with 10awg wire in and out
21:12 rue_shop2 I dont have to tell you they can only take so many strikes
21:12 rue_shop2 we isntall them
21:12 useless i know, the telco arrestors pop permanently, and they said they'd sue me if i installed anything better
21:12 rue_shop2 and I'v even replaced on that saved a house when there was a primary-secondary short by a tree
21:13 useless have you considered corregated roofing tin as a solar panel?
21:14 rue_shop2 I dont know what directions I want to take the solar right now
21:14 rue_shop2 I was looking at a sandwhich that would spread the water out really far
21:15 useless i am thinking, if i goo some pieces of #12 wire to the top or bottom of ridges on one pane,. let that set hard, then goo the edges and pop rivet two 2x8 panels together, i get a watertght (very low pressure) collector
21:16 rue_shop2 about how much is a sheet worth?
21:16 useless the size of the water channels depends on if i nest the panels, or offset them
21:16 rue_shop2 I'm running the boiler today, I had too much scrap wood and paper stuffed in it
21:17 useless iirc, $10 per 2x8 ft, so putting it as a vertical panel tween two banks of mirror might be best
21:17 rue_shop2 an item/day from ebay leaves a person with a lot of envelopes
21:17 rue_shop2 mm double er up
21:17 useless yeas, but 99 cents per enveolpe? can't you do better if you grabbed up the old phone books?
21:18 rue_shop2 :) they come free with my $1 purchase
21:18 useless yeas, like \|/
21:18 rue_shop2 I understand
21:18 rue_shop2 make the backside usefull
21:18 rue_shop2 put on a inclination tracking rig
21:18 useless yeas, since it's also metal and just as conductive
21:18 useless yeas
21:19 rue_shop2 throw a window over the top
21:19 rue_shop2 :) a quartz one
21:20 rue_shop2 or soemthing with a 1 way glazing the wrong way around?
21:20 useless it's 16 sq ft of metal each side, 32 sq ft total, or 5.6 x 5.6 ft of square surface, and in an easy form you can aim 2x the sun at
21:20 rue_shop2 100W/1m^2
21:20 rue_shop2 ?
21:20 rue_shop2 iirc
21:20 useless yeas, best case
21:20 rue_shop2 that might be 2 or 3 square meters
21:21 rue_shop2 get about 400W or so
21:21 rue_shop2 use a water/water heat pump with it
21:21 rue_shop2 would hardly have to work at all
21:22 useless the goal is to have water in contact with the sun-hot metal , so in a way the thinner the water channel is, the better, maybe, which is why i mentioned #12 wire as spacers
21:22 useless might be better to not use copper tho, course, for long term, you need anticorrosives in the water anyhow
21:23 useless finding cheap mirror may be impossible, specially in the usa, from now on
21:24 rue_shop2 making zink strips shouldn't be too challanging
21:24 rue_shop2 here you can get mirrors easy from thriftstroes that cant sell them
21:24 rue_shop2 old widnows with tinfoil rubbed on even :)
21:24 rue_shop2 in a pinch
21:25 rue_shop2 or contact cement..
21:25 rue_shop2 here, everyone has old windows
21:25 useless http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202300825/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=mirror&storeId=10051 <<== $1.66/ft
21:25 rue_shop2 dime a dozen, or cheaper
21:25 rue_shop2 yea
21:26 useless everyone else wants even more
21:26 rue_shop2 a large roll of tinfoil is about $11?
21:27 useless but it doesn't stay put
21:27 useless i get all the window glass i can from the recycler
21:27 useless 24x24, 30x24, 30x30, that size range, some bigger, i have sliding glass doors too
21:28 rue_shop2 spray on contact cement?
21:28 rue_shop2 it would be like doing vynal, one opps and your hooped
21:29 useless not really, it doesn't need to be pretty, and overlaps don't matter
21:32 rue_shop2 !thislog
21:32 tobbor This one: http://rueshouse.dyndns.org:82/~ircjunk/irclogs/html/%23garfield-2013-01-14.html
21:32 rue_shop2 #garfield-2005-10-22.html
21:32 rue_shop2 http://rueshouse.dyndns.org:82/~ircjunk/irclogs/html/%23garfield-2005-10-22.html
21:33 useless ?
21:33 rue_shop2 sorry, if I use irc as a scratchpad I can click the links to open them
21:35 rue_shop2 hmm, didn't work
21:35 rue_shop2 why....
21:35 useless damn ebay wants $30 for what Home Depot wants $10 for
21:36 rue_shop2 oh
21:36 rue_shop2 root@freebee5:/files/programming/c/avr/atmega32/ioman# make usbxtalfuses
21:36 rue_shop2 make: Warning: File `makefile' has modification time 1.5e+02 s in the future
21:36 rue_shop2 avrdude -c usbtiny -P usb -p m32 -U hfuse:w:0xD9:m -U lfuse:w:0xEF:m
21:36 rue_shop2 avrdude: Error: Could not find USBtiny device (0x1781/0xc9f)
21:36 rue_shop2 hehe
21:42 useless this stuff is useless too : http://www.ebay.com/itm/15-Silver-Mirror-Reflective-Glass-Window-Solar-Film-50cm-x-30m-Roll-Tint-Bulk-/190723560027
21:42 useless it delaminates into trash blowing in the wind
21:43 rue_shop2 noted
21:46 rue_shop2 ok direction relays working
22:43 useless ....
22:52 useless all that rain has the creek really stirred up, so the water coming up is real dirty
22:57 rue_shop3 giving it a while to settle?
22:59 useless no time
22:59 useless i have 500 gal inside now, not dirty, i have enough time to put 2000 gal into the outside tank before i haveto drain those lines due to freezing weather
23:00 useless by the time i need to refill the 500 gal inside from the outside tank, it will have settled a lot
23:00 useless but for right now, i need to pump what i can get
23:00 rue_shop3 halp, math broke
23:01 rue_shop3 P = I * V
23:01 rue_shop3 V = I * R
23:01 rue_shop3 so I = V / R
23:01 useless velocity impact * volume
23:01 useless yeas
23:01 rue_shop3 so P = (V/R) * I * R
23:01 rue_shop3 the R's cancel
23:02 rue_shop3 so P = V * I
23:02 useless ok
23:02 rue_shop3 well I damn well want P in terms of V and R
23:02 rue_shop3 damnit
23:02 rue_shop3 oh, wait
23:02 rue_shop3 WAIT
23:02 eless writes it
23:02 useless __v__
23:02 useless I | R
23:03 rue_shop3 its... I
23:03 useless r = v/i
23:03 rue_shop3 P = I * I /R
23:03 rue_shop3 no
23:03 rue_shop3 * R
23:03 rue_shop3 P = I * I * R
23:03 useless so P = v * (v/i)
23:03 useless or
23:04 useless so P = v * (v/r)
23:04 rue_shop3 yes! I wanted V and R
23:04 rue_shop3 thanks kat, apparently I cant think
23:05 useless is ok, i been drinking
23:05 rue_shop3 and I made a C file with one #define in it...
23:09 rue_shop3 printf( " R2 dissipates %fw\n", wattage((V-VR1), R2));
23:09 rue_shop3 printf( " R1 dissipates %fw\n", wattage(VR1, R1));
23:11 rue_shop3 zippo:/files/programming/c/resistor# ./R2
23:11 rue_shop3 +V
23:11 rue_shop3 R2
23:11 rue_shop3 VR1
23:11 rue_shop3 R1
23:11 rue_shop3 GND
23:11 rue_shop3 Divider supply: 57
23:11 rue_shop3 bottom resistor: 10000
23:11 rue_shop3 divider output: 5
23:11 rue_shop3 R2 is :103999.992188
23:11 rue_shop3 R2 dissipates 207999968.750001w
23:11 rue_shop3 R1 dissipates 20000000.000000w
23:11 rue_shop3 I'm gonnna need a bigger pcb
23:11 rue_shop3 and maybe a cooling fan
23:11 useless why? just put the resistor outside
23:12 rue_shop3 I also think this is gonna damage the robots effeciency
23:12 useless might not notice it if the nuke power plant is big enough
23:13 rue_shop3 have to upgrade the frame too
23:14 useless i found a cheap way to make a 600,000 w resistor, fairly small too, but i haven't found anyone with a problem to fit this cure, at least not anyone who will talk to me
23:15 rue_shop3 #define wattage(R,V) ((V*V)/R)
23:15 rue_shop3 oh I think I know what happened
23:15 useless you'd think those peole who had gennys die in hurricane Sandy and New Orleans would want to talk to me about dummy test loads they could use every week, but nope
23:15 rue_shop3 printf( " R2 dissipates %fw\n", wattage((V-VR1), R2));
23:15 rue_shop3 ok
23:16 eless don't
23:16 rue_shop3 the V and R params in the call are backwards
23:17 rue_shop3 zippo:/files/programming/c/resistor# ./R2
23:17 rue_shop3 +V
23:17 rue_shop3 R2
23:17 rue_shop3 VR1
23:17 rue_shop3 R1
23:17 rue_shop3 GND
23:17 rue_shop3 Divider supply: 57
23:17 rue_shop3 bottom resistor: 10000
23:17 rue_shop3 divider output: 5
23:17 rue_shop3 R2 is :103999.992188
23:17 rue_shop3 R2 dissipates 0.026000w
23:17 rue_shop3 R1 dissipates 0.002500w
23:17 rue_shop3 ok
23:19 useless what?
23:20 rue_shop3 I'm playing with values
23:20 rue_shop3 it looks like 4.7k and 47k are not gonna explode in flames
23:20 useless with those valuses i get 5.4807692307692307692307692307692 volts
23:21 rue_shop3 ?
23:21 useless specially with 4.7k and 47k , because 57v / 10 = 5.7
23:22 rue_shop3 zippo:/files/programming/c/resistor# ./VOUT
23:22 rue_shop3 +V
23:22 rue_shop3 R2
23:22 rue_shop3 VR1
23:22 rue_shop3 R1
23:22 rue_shop3 GND
23:22 rue_shop3 Divider supply: 57
23:22 rue_shop3 bottom resistor: 10000
23:22 rue_shop3 top resistor: 104000
23:22 rue_shop3 Vout is : 5.000000
23:22 rue_shop3 zippo:/files/programming/c/resistor#
23:22 rue_shop3 the 47k is otu
23:22 useless a 47k and 4.7k in series with 57v across = 0.0011025145067698259187620889748549 ma
23:22 rue_shop3 zippo:/files/programming/c/resistor# ./VOUT
23:22 rue_shop3 +V
23:22 rue_shop3 R2
23:22 rue_shop3 VR1
23:22 rue_shop3 R1
23:22 rue_shop3 GND
23:22 rue_shop3 Divider supply: 57
23:22 rue_shop3 bottom resistor: 4700
23:22 rue_shop3 top resistor: 47000
23:22 rue_shop3 Vout is : 5.181818
23:22 useless 0.0011025145067698259187620889748549 thru 4.7k = 5.1818181818181818181v
23:23 rue_shop3 ok
23:23 rue_shop3 but I think your rounding
23:23 rue_shop3 :)
23:23 useless if i were you, i'd drop some volts with a resistor, and clamp below 25v with a zener, then use a 78L05 regulator
23:24 rue_shop3 its for ADC to read the level
23:24 useless or, two resistors down to 57/2 or 57/3 , then a 78L05
23:24 useless oh
23:24 useless nm
23:24 rue_shop3 because there are 4 12V in series, I'm gonna put an ADC at every tap, the batteries are badly mismatched
23:24 rue_shop3 I can watch for problems
23:25 useless like my DC_Lighting page then, ok
23:25 rue_shop3 besides, it gives me more stuff to put on grahs for the robots control page
23:25 useless the most accurate way to solve voltage dividers : [23:09] <useless> a 47k and 4.7k in series with 57v across = 0.0011025145067698259187620889748549 ma (then you can figure everything with that current)
23:25 rue_shop3 I doubt I can get the bank to 57V, and the avr can shunt the excess
23:26 rue_shop3 I'v got a 2k 10 turn in the mix
23:26 rue_shop3 so I'm alsolooking for values that will come to something convienient with 1k off the top
23:26 useless yo can prolly overvolt the battts to 14.25 rather easily, not that you shoul;d
23:26 rue_shop3 I dont have a 48V charger
23:26 rue_shop3 have to charge them one at a time
23:27 rue_shop3 ok I should get supper done with
23:28 useless http://designerthinking.com/DC_Lighting.html
23:28 useless Back view. The clear space behind the transformer there is for the ten 150w resistors. They will be for 10amp pulse testing each battery for impedance readings, or to shunt bulk charge current around each battery as they go over 14vdc. Yes, it's a hand-rewound microwave oven transformer.
23:28 useless Each transformer winding is 14vac, good for 3amp, maybe 5amp in a short term pinch. Each of the ~3x5 bakelite represents a stack of 5 PCBs with an individual floating charger and tester on each. I may not need that much pcb space, but better to plan for a lot than need to expand the steel box later.
23:29 rue_shop3 kat, are those $1 ebay pcb's? ;-)
23:29 useless nope, cheaper
23:29 rue_shop3 7x9cm?
23:29 useless nope, cut in half 12 x 18 cm
23:30 rue_shop3 ah, cool
23:30 useless 3 x 4.5 inch
23:30 useless no un-holed borders
23:30 rue_shop3 would you like me to make you a lovejoy coulpling for your pcb driller?
23:30 rue_shop3 I got a lathe
23:30 rue_shop3 !assist projects/lathe
23:30 tobbor Possibly http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/projects/lathe
23:30 useless i have no pcb driller, that's why i haveto hand wire the perfboard
23:31 useless i HAD couplings
23:31 useless i HAD a pcb driller
23:32 rue_shop3 I measured the draw of a CF under dc, its tiny
23:32 useless ~ 100ma
23:32 rue_shop3 I might make a 1:3 smps for operating them off the 48V house bank
23:32 rue_shop3 really easy at those current levels
23:32 useless yeas
23:33 rue_shop3 ok I'm gonna start going down for the night
23:33 useless you need minimum 100v, they light off at ~95vdc, they seem to put out the proper light at 115vdc
23:34 useless so i plan on a 115v linear regulator off the 120v battery stack
23:34 useless the 120vdc is easy to turn into 115v sine too, with some boost up to the sine 165v peak
23:35 rue_house I think I was looking at giving them 144V
23:36 rue_house work tommorw, party is over
23:36 useless dan pricey lathe
23:37 useless now you know why i kept saying you needed exposed beams under the ceiling to hoist things with
23:38 rue_house :)
23:38 useless yo can still mount rails on the long walls, and span the room the narrow way with a bridge crane, you can put anything anywhere
23:38 rue_house it was a challange and a half
23:38 rue_house was ready to make a forklift
23:38 rue_house its a "cheap" one, but I think its fine for me
23:39 useless i have some 8" and some 6.5" steel tube i need turned
23:40 useless your welding needs more practice
23:40 rue_house clean the outside?
23:40 rue_house :)
23:40 useless the bead'ss got voids and bubbles in it
23:40 rue_house which welds dont you like?
23:41 useless the lath jig for making worm gears
23:41 rue_house it was nice to work on new metal
23:41 rue_house oh, heh, yea that didn't go nice
23:41 rue_house I didn't have a thick peice for the mounting bit either
23:41 rue_house dont like that peice of angle
23:42 useless take the tool post off and mount it right to the carriage
23:42 rue_house mm
23:43 rue_house its an option
23:44 useless you can mount a large solid block in such a way that with spacers you can align a tool vertically to be perfect t the chuck, or a known amount above or below
23:45 rue_house I'm much more a fan of the "lamp post" toolholder to those things
23:45 useless sure, until you need to mount a body grinder, or drill
23:45 rue_house http://www.ebay.ca/itm/21mm-Diameter-Hex-Shaft-Alloy-Drill-Bit-Hole-Saw-Tool-/271093278434?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f1e6b26e2
23:45 rue_house its got inserts, how bad could it be?
23:45 useless or a horizontal mill for getting long keyways
23:46 rue_house they look brazed in
23:47 useless they don't look *well* brazed in tho
23:48 rue_house http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Iron-Cutting-HSS-Twist-Drill-Bit-Tool-21mm-Diameter-Hole-Saw-/350639313805?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51a3bb538d
23:48 rue_house look! no .... whats the cat up t
23:48 useless you kow this part of the url is useless? ==>> ?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51a3bb538d
23:49 rue_house no rake!
23:49 useless don't get this one : http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Iron-Cutting-HSS-Twist-Drill-Bit-Tool-21mm-Diameter-Hole-Saw-/350639313805
23:50 rue_house no
23:50 rue_house has no rake
23:50 useless 1) it keeps saying "iron" , it won't cut steel
23:50 rue_house I'm prolly use it for alum and plastic
23:50 rue_house cant get metric in canada
23:50 useless 2) the big "bit" is held to the lil bit with a grub screw, that won't hold
23:50 rue_house I should get one thats atleast $10
23:50 useless grind down a non-metric, you have a lathe now
23:51 rue_house http://www.ebay.ca/itm/21mm-HSS-Reduced-Shank-Twist-Drill-Bit-/110789242321?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19cb8dadd1
23:51 rue_house hmm
23:51 rue_house I dont have anything that big
23:51 useless chuck the bit, put a sanding stone in the tool post, take .002 at a tme off the bit diameter
23:51 useless o
23:54 useless look at "Silver and Deming" and Forstner bits on Harborfreight.com and buy-enco.com
23:55 useless they won't be metric, but with a lathe, you can grind them down a few thou to be metric
23:56 rue_house that does kinda kill the outter rake if you g too far
23:56 useless if you need a real round hole, now that you have a lathe, put a vise on the carriage and use it as a horizontal drill press, with 4-flute, 5-flute, etc mills in the chuck
23:57 useless i find lots of 2-flute normal drill bits make triangular holes
23:57 useless i left dinner in the nukebox, and it's cold now.............