#avr Logs
Sep 14 2017
#avr Calendar
12:07 AM day__ is now known as daey
02:23 AM day__ is now known as daey
03:05 AM polprog: is flux vapor really that harmful?
03:09 AM thardin: it's not medicine exactly. but every once in a while is probably no big deal. it can get annoynig however, since it obstructs your view and is annoying to get in the eyes
03:30 AM _ami_: polprog, its annoying for sure. i plan to make a smoke exhauster from hair dryer
05:55 AM Emil_ is now known as Emil
06:06 AM Lambda_Aurigae: just work in a well ventilated area and you are fine.
06:06 AM Lambda_Aurigae: you don't want to concentrate and huff it repetedly.
06:06 AM Lambda_Aurigae: I've been soldering for 40 years without vent hoods or extractors...
06:09 AM Snert: I just blow gently at the solder joint - easy to blow the fumes away.
06:11 AM Snert: using a noisy whining hair dryer is just nuts.
06:15 AM Lambda_Aurigae: small desk fan works well too.
06:15 AM Lambda_Aurigae: or even a little usb fan
07:54 AM polprog: Snert: Lambda_Aurigae: i usually gently blow at the joint, but im not sure if slightly opening the window can be counted as "Well ventillated"
07:54 AM polprog: i'd have to move the computer awyay to open it fully.
07:55 AM Snert: after a couple decades you don't worry about it anymore. Just open the window.
07:55 AM polprog: like fully open?
07:56 AM Snert: whatever suits ya. In winter that's kinda cold though.
07:56 AM polprog: i guess it's fine as it is now
07:57 AM twnqx: Lambda_Aurigae: isn't it more like only the signalling and core syntax of JTAG is specified so you can chain various vendors and ID them provided you somehow do the voltage conversions, but any vendor can add extra commands and such?
08:00 AM LeoNerd: Yes; the standard parts of JTAG are a very low-level message transport. It doesn't really define the meanings of those messages
08:00 AM LeoNerd: That's all custom vendor stuff
08:05 AM twnqx: so basically, with the right software, any jtag adaptor could do anything :P
08:05 AM polprog: in theory.
08:06 AM polprog: there is a thing calle JTAGULATOR (ive seen it on hackaday shop), iirc is a usb-jtag converter
08:06 AM LeoNerd: Really, a JTAG adapter is just a slightly fancy SPI port
08:06 AM LeoNerd: JTAG still has the SPI-like clock + serial data shift-register loop. It just has slightly fancier wiggling semantics on the select line, than just down or op
08:07 AM LeoNerd: *up
08:07 AM LeoNerd: You can clock instructions along the secondary line too
09:41 AM polprog: new eclipse, oxygen
09:41 AM polprog: im curious how it performs
09:44 AM Emil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvim4rsNHkQ
09:47 AM polprog: this is brilliant
09:47 AM polprog: lmao
09:51 AM tpw_rules: i like how he was late even on that
10:54 AM enh: good afternoon
11:05 AM enh: must google kynar
11:06 AM enh: SublimeText released another stable build today.
11:06 AM polprog: it's a thin wire with kynar insulation
11:06 AM enh: What do you work with?
11:06 AM polprog: meaning? the prototype?
11:06 AM polprog: a small temp logger
11:08 AM enh: Did not know kynar. Looks good for aggressive environments
11:09 AM polprog: the wire with kynar insulation (which is called usually kynar or modwire) is very good when it comes to, for example, tap into a trace, or cut a trace and change something on a pcb (hence modwire)
11:10 AM polprog: you can also make connections on a universal pcb with it, like here: http://tronola.com/assets/images/Kynar_wiring_detail.jpg
11:12 AM enh: Nice wiring
11:13 AM polprog: mine is only a tad messier :P
11:13 AM Emil: Hmm
11:13 AM polprog: theres also enamel wire which needs no stripping
11:13 AM Emil: Enamel wire would be easier to use but wire with a thicker insulation is more use proof
11:13 AM polprog: maybe i should go into that
11:13 AM Emil: polprog: enamel wire has its own issues
11:13 AM Emil: mainly that soldering it can present challenges
11:14 AM enh: Google says kynar is very stable chemically
11:14 AM polprog: i guess i will stick to kynar then
11:14 AM enh: May be good for harsh environments, like petrol wells
11:14 AM enh: enamel can be easily removed with acid
11:14 AM polprog: you can for example wire a cpu board with it: http://www.pilawa.org/computer/2010/09/20/main-cpu-board-assembly-completed/
11:15 AM Emil: polprog: that's horrible
11:15 AM enh: amazing mess
11:15 AM polprog: it's amazing
11:15 AM Emil: The time and effort wasted on that
11:15 AM Emil: it could have been spend on say 4 layer pcb
11:15 AM Emil: And those components could have been smd
11:16 AM polprog: yes
11:16 AM polprog: but, see, that guy is clearly building his own computer from jelly logic....
11:16 AM enh: everything always can be better
11:16 AM polprog: what the hell do you expect
11:18 AM Emil: Wiring that musthavetaken like over 9000 minutes
11:19 AM polprog: im sure the PCB is extra thicc now
11:19 AM polprog: a 4 layer would be thinner
11:19 AM Emil: Not to mention that moving it is :D
11:19 AM Emil: well
11:20 AM Emil: lets just say that breaking things is easy
11:21 AM enh: the guy is having fun now. Later he won't. But now I'm sure he is
11:22 AM polprog: it's called masochism
11:22 AM enh: probably
11:24 AM enh: https://imagebin.ca/v/3aNKw470RMu8
11:24 AM enh: Next gen mcu module
11:25 AM Tom_itx: it's too big
11:25 AM polprog: are you making an stm breakout
11:25 AM enh: Just a faster module for this: https://hackaday.io/project/11724-yauvec-yet-another-unmanned-vehicle-controller
11:26 AM enh: Tom_itx: It supports submodules like this one: https://hackaday.io/project/11724/gallery#6c429c4befaa9e50acc00ed0fb9fdae8
11:28 AM enh: Or this one: https://hackaday.io/project/11724/gallery#c28885548769f6696a2ff5e652c23e2a
11:28 AM polprog: i love the cardboard case
11:29 AM enh: I'm still thinking about it. Could not find a better, practical way, to give structural stability to the modules and backplane.
11:30 AM polprog: i think you could fold the cardboard to make small T- or U-beams
11:30 AM enh: A MCU module with a cortexm4 chip with FPU can help a lot in flight processing stuff
11:31 AM enh: the cardboard only represent the PCBs
11:36 AM enh: I though about build the case all with PCBs
11:36 AM enh: thought
11:50 AM Tom_itx: enh i could loan you some: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/etching/Copper2.jpg
11:51 AM enh: :)
11:51 AM enh: You could
12:53 PM Emil: enh:
12:53 PM Emil: enh: >4.0.2
12:53 PM Emil: Pls upgrade
01:25 PM lemm|ngs is now known as lemmings
01:32 PM lemm|ngs is now known as lemmings
01:58 PM polprog: on the other window i have a guy who paid 60 bucks for 6 pcs of a 17x89 mm. is this a normal price??
01:58 PM polprog: of a 17x89 2-sided PCB at oshpark*
02:06 PM Emil: hm?
02:06 PM polprog: i mean
02:06 PM polprog: that sounds hella expensive
02:06 PM Emil: 17*89/25.4^2*5*2=23.4515469
02:06 PM LeoNerd: oshpark are not cheap in any significant volume
02:07 PM Emil: That should be the price
02:07 PM Emil: 23.45 usd
02:07 PM Emil: delivered
02:07 PM Emil: If he paid for the supashipping then sure
02:07 PM polprog: at osh or in general?
02:07 PM Emil: polprog: at osh
02:07 PM polprog: huh
02:07 PM polprog: well...
02:08 PM Emil: 6 boards two sides
02:08 PM Emil: 17x89 (which is a pretty big board)
02:08 PM Emil: 5 dollaroos per square inch
02:08 PM polprog: it's mm
02:08 PM Emil: I know
02:08 PM polprog: it's not a big board
02:08 PM Emil: it's a relatively big board already
02:09 PM Emil: But 60 dollaroos :D
02:09 PM Emil: he must have paid for the 3 day delivery
02:09 PM polprog: (for me, maybe my 10x12 board was yugee)
02:09 PM polprog: heh, instant gratification, gotta pay extra
02:09 PM polprog: 10x12 cm
02:09 PM Emil: But :D
02:09 PM Emil: He would have gotten it faster from elecrow/china
02:10 PM Emil: We ordered 24h rush on Friday and got them on Wednesday
02:10 PM Emil: From elecrow
02:10 PM Emil: Speedy delivery I say
02:10 PM Emil: Shenzen DHL
02:10 PM polprog: i mean.... there are at least 4 PCB fabhouses in poland which can deliver in a week, im sure in europe and in the US it's similar
02:11 PM Emil: The prices go up
02:11 PM polprog: yeah, but not that high
02:11 PM Emil: Yes that high
02:11 PM Emil: compared to China
04:32 PM Lambda_Aurigae: "The best tank terrain is that without anti-tank weapons."
04:32 PM Lambda_Aurigae: -Russian military doctrine.
04:58 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
07:38 PM rue__ is now known as rue_house
07:40 PM rue_house: I cant understand why you people will pay $20 for soemthings that costs $1, cause you want to order it at the last minute instead of stocking it months before
07:41 PM rue_house: I just for 17 dc-dc stepdown regulators
07:41 PM Lambda_Aurigae: pay?
07:41 PM rue_house: less than 80c ea
07:41 PM Lambda_Aurigae: who pays?
07:41 PM Lambda_Aurigae: it's called free samples and ripping bits out of old copiers.
07:41 PM rue_house: <Emil> But :D
07:41 PM rue_house: <Emil> He would have gotten it faster from elecrow/china
07:41 PM rue_house: <Emil> We ordered 24h rush on Friday and got them on Wednesday
07:41 PM rue_house: <Emil> From elecrow
07:41 PM rue_house: <Emil> Speedy delivery I say
07:41 PM rue_house: <Emil> Shenzen DHL
07:41 PM rue_house: Lambda_Aurigae, thats how you get the good stuff, but thats not what I'm on about
07:42 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I know.
07:42 PM Lambda_Aurigae: but,
07:42 PM Lambda_Aurigae: you know me,,,,always gotta be difficult.
08:01 PM enh: hi
08:02 PM Lambda_Aurigae: iH
08:02 PM enh: End of a long day here. Now I can do some work.
08:03 PM Lambda_Aurigae: took half a day off today myself.
08:03 PM Lambda_Aurigae: now I'm playing WoD and watching Torchwood.
08:13 PM enh: Have you ever heard of orgone, wilhelm reich or james demeo?
08:13 PM enh: There is a lot to be discovered under these names. Useful information. Can save lives.
08:13 PM enh: Or make your life better.
08:13 PM Lambda_Aurigae: religion wrapped in pseudo-science.
08:15 PM enh: nope
08:16 PM enh: there are many people who want to discredit his work. Go for the sources and you will see yourself
08:16 PM Lambda_Aurigae: that's what it all looked like to me.
08:16 PM Lambda_Aurigae: nobody else can recreate the experiments with the same results.
08:16 PM enh: not true too
08:17 PM enh: try a book called "The cancer biopathy"
08:17 PM Lambda_Aurigae: so, go recreate it and revolutionize the world.
08:18 PM enh: I 've been following this for year
08:18 PM enh: s
08:19 PM enh: If you ever get curios about the real thing, go for the sources. The opinions are from ignorant people
08:19 PM enh: curious...
08:19 PM enh: Sh*t. I forgot how to type.
08:19 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I've looked at it in the past.
08:20 PM Lambda_Aurigae: it has no more meaning to me than gods or aether.
08:21 PM enh: DId you get the oranur report/
08:21 PM enh: ?
08:22 PM Lambda_Aurigae: no.
08:22 PM Lambda_Aurigae: but I also didn't drink the koolaid.
08:22 PM enh: A lot of data on the effects of orgone accumulators over radioactive materials
08:23 PM Lambda_Aurigae: if it's so powerful, why isn't it mainstream science?
08:23 PM enh: to change mainstream science, mainstream scientists must die
08:23 PM Lambda_Aurigae: sounds like yet another religion to me.
08:24 PM enh: mainsstream science ~= religion sometimes
08:25 PM enh: I 've put a lifter flying in front of physics teachers in the university i studied. One of them said: This must have a simple explanation. None given.
08:25 PM Lambda_Aurigae: so, prove it.
08:25 PM enh: I did it in vacuum.
08:26 PM Lambda_Aurigae: same line I give every scientist and religious freak who tosses some unproven knowledge my way...prove it.
08:26 PM enh: resources and time windows are scarce if you are not doing mainstream science.
08:26 PM enh: lots of evidences publishes relating superconductivity to gravity
08:27 PM enh: published
08:27 PM enh: many, many papers
08:27 PM enh: try to talk about that in academia and you are off
08:27 PM Lambda_Aurigae: much evidence, many papers, lots of theories.
08:28 PM enh: try to raise money for research in those lines and you are off
08:28 PM Lambda_Aurigae: there's also evidence of god, lots of books going back thousands of years, many theories..
08:28 PM enh: science turned into competition and paper counting
08:28 PM enh: I mean real experiments
08:28 PM enh: real results
08:28 PM Lambda_Aurigae: until I see something that can be repeated in controlled experiments then I'm a skeptic.
08:29 PM enh: many reported
08:29 PM enh: google them
08:29 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I can google cold fusion and find dozens of experiments that prove that too.
08:30 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I can google god's miracles and find hundreds of those easily.
08:30 PM Lambda_Aurigae: doesn't mean I believe in them.
08:31 PM enh: You are smart enough to know the difference between faith and scientific experiments
08:31 PM Lambda_Aurigae: or am going to waste my time trying to prove or disprove them.
08:31 PM Lambda_Aurigae: yes, I am..
08:31 PM Lambda_Aurigae: and have no need to follow orgone
08:31 PM enh: of course not
08:46 PM enh: I'm almost finishing the code to do all the information transfer between modules
10:44 PM rue_shop3: screw the datasheet
10:44 PM rue_shop3: does anyone know what voltage the inputs of an AVR REALLY take as high and low?
10:45 PM rue_shop3: the datasheet says, oh wait,t his gets harder
10:47 PM tpw_rules: what
10:47 PM tpw_rules: it's probably 80% of vcc is high and 10% is low
10:47 PM tpw_rules: or 30%
10:47 PM rue_shop3: I need a circuit that tells the avr when the power is failing
10:47 PM rue_shop3: the datahseets says high is above 0.6Vcc, and low is below 0.2Vcc
10:48 PM tpw_rules: do you not have an adc
10:48 PM rue_shop3: which, for a 5V system is 3V and 1V
10:48 PM tpw_rules: or a BOR interrupt
10:48 PM rue_shop3: no, the power is going down, aka running on the filter cap
10:48 PM rue_shop3: buuuuut
10:48 PM rue_shop3: you might have a point...
10:48 PM rue_shop3: if...
10:48 PM tpw_rules: that figure isn't very accurate
10:49 PM tpw_rules: i'd just connect directly to the power supply and use a diode or something to keep the filter cap from discharging into it
10:50 PM rue_shop3: if I'm running on 5V, and I'm watching the votlage on an led
10:50 PM rue_shop3: at 10 bits
10:50 PM rue_shop3: I should see 286 counts
10:51 PM rue_shop3: I need to catch before the votlage hits 3.5
10:51 PM rue_shop3: so at , 4V
10:51 PM rue_shop3: it would hit 358 counts
10:52 PM rue_shop3: OR
10:52 PM rue_shop3: I use a diode connected to one pin, with the pullup on
10:52 PM rue_shop3: 5V = 143 counts
10:52 PM rue_shop3: 4V = 179 counts
10:53 PM rue_shop3: I can draw a line at 161 counds
10:54 PM rue_shop3: there, I did it in one part!
10:54 PM rue_shop3: see if it works
10:54 PM rue_shop3: how the hell do I test this...
10:55 PM rue_shop3: I wonder if its got time to say "BYE!" at 9600 baud
10:55 PM rue_shop3: :)
10:55 PM rue_shop3: 4ms
11:08 PM rue_shop3: void Delay(unsigned int v) {
11:08 PM rue_shop3: for(; v > 0; v--) NOP();
11:08 PM rue_shop3: }
11:08 PM rue_shop3: this is my optimized delay loop
11:08 PM rue_shop3: heh
11:12 PM Casper: rue_shop3: did you saw my fridge thermostat code? I think it is mostly finished.... I think I have a pin left, I could use it for an heartbeat...
11:12 PM rue_shop3: no, what did yo uuse?
11:12 PM rue_shop3: like I recall it, from quite a while ago
11:13 PM Casper: https://paste.pound-python.org/show/UFzLCgi52ITixH74KufM/
11:13 PM rue_shop3: I'm sure I can see the voltage at 4V with a diode
11:13 PM rue_shop3: that site will not accept firefox
11:13 PM rue_shop3: its dropping the connection
11:13 PM Casper: that site does accept firefox
11:14 PM rue_shop3: wtf does everyone need all this freaking securrity just to visit a page?
11:14 PM rue_shop3: no its not accepting
11:14 PM rue_shop3: iceweasel 24.8.1
11:14 PM rue_shop3: have access to the httpd log?
11:15 PM rue_shop3: https://paste.debian.net/
11:15 PM Casper: http://bpaste.net/show/056134a93647
11:15 PM Casper: better?
11:15 PM rue_shop3: go for that one, they aren't browser anal
11:15 PM rue_shop3: ...
11:15 PM rue_shop3: that worked
11:15 PM Casper: there is some stuff that you may like, or totally hate
11:16 PM Casper: like line 195
11:16 PM rue_shop3: whats the temp sensor?
11:16 PM Casper: and 184
11:16 PM Casper: NTC
11:16 PM rue_shop3: l
11:16 PM rue_shop3: k
11:18 PM Casper: like some of the stuff there?
11:18 PM Casper: 6232 bytes once compiled !
11:32 PM rue_shop3: :)
11:34 PM Casper: it's amazing how expensive is float/fload and log() and uint32_t/int and printf()
11:37 PM rue_shop3: yea
11:38 PM rue_shop3: I'v done fp on a m32 to a lcd screen
11:38 PM rue_shop3: ran it faster than the screen could keep up with
11:38 PM rue_shop3: and it was a pile of trig calcs
11:38 PM rue_shop3: but trig on the appleIIe wasn't slow either
11:38 PM rue_shop3: 1.023Mhz
11:39 PM rue_shop3: http://www.engbedded.com/fusecalc/
11:46 PM rue_shop3: ok, so 1000uF caught the power failing for 23 times
11:47 PM rue_shop3: at 6 characters, 9600 baud
11:48 PM rue_shop3: 330uF caught it
11:48 PM rue_shop3: 9 times
11:48 PM rue_shop3: thats ok then
11:48 PM rue_shop3: even once is ok, I just need to know to stop writing to the NV ram