#avr Logs
Jun 17 2017
#avr Calendar
12:02 AM Tom_itx: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/abcminiuser/articles/avr_interrupts_index.php
12:05 AM Tom_itx: not sure if that would help or not
12:05 AM Tom_itx: yeah, pretty much stock from atmel
12:07 AM motti: thanks, going to try to read through it
12:07 AM motti: yep, pretty much
12:09 AM motti: yea, was going to avrage it anyway :)
12:09 AM Tom_itx: my example would leave it in that function for 200ms minimum though
12:10 AM Tom_itx: which may be too much for you
12:11 AM Tom_itx: it was written as just a test...
12:12 AM Tom_itx: the reflow oven code uses a loop too
12:13 AM motti: well, it's not a crital or precise project
12:13 AM Tom_itx: the toasteroven directory
12:13 AM motti: i am translating i think 4 0-5v inputs
12:13 AM motti: need around 3-5% accuracy
12:13 AM motti: in 0-100 scope
12:15 AM motti: yea i might just go that route, putting it in the loop
12:16 AM motti: thank you for the help tom, bookmarked your page :)
12:16 AM Tom_itx: np
04:48 AM Emil: Hmmm
04:52 AM Emil: https://emil.fi/jako/kuvat/2017-06-17_12-22-08_I9jfKH3O.png
04:52 AM Emil: Very tempting
05:59 AM Emil: https://emil.fi/jako/kuvat/2017-06-17_13-28-51_1Nnupieg.png
06:00 AM Emil: Ah yeah, chip select
06:01 AM cehteh: ?
06:07 AM Emil: https://emil.fi/jako/kuvat/2017-06-17_13-37-05_udTUeDxZ.png
06:10 AM lemm1ngs: emil: what are you designing?
06:11 AM Emil: lemm1ngs: interactive led driver v 2
06:12 AM lemm1ngs: RGBW PWM controller? or what?
06:12 AM Emil: ws2812b
06:12 AM lemm1ngs: ah
06:12 AM Emil: But the way I have it, you could run software pwm
06:13 AM lemm1ngs: yeah, pwm is easy.
06:14 AM Emil: I'd say I could achieve a comfortable 8 bit resolution at 1Khz update rate
06:14 AM lemm1ngs: why not nodejs / nodemcu on these tiny ESP controllers?
06:15 AM Emil: >node
06:15 AM Emil: >on a micro
06:15 AM Emil: top kek
06:15 AM Emil: also we are on #avr ;)
06:15 AM Emil: But yeah
06:15 AM lemm1ngs: heh, yes
06:15 AM Emil: this board also has an esp-12s and another m328pb :DD
06:15 AM Emil: Complexity grows
06:16 AM Emil: I wonder if I should actually add some even smaller micro to do rotary encoder
06:16 AM specing: lmao
06:16 AM Emil: ikr
06:17 AM Emil: "Oh, I need to handle this, too"
06:17 AM lemm1ngs: you could simply take this https://acrobotic.com/media/wysiwyg/products/esp8266_esp01_horizontal-01.png and connect Din / Dout of the ws2812b to the GPIO ports
06:17 AM Emil: "Let's just slap another micro there :D"
06:17 AM Emil: lemm1ngs: It's not that I couldn't use the esp to drive the leds
06:17 AM lemm1ngs: but, yes ... you can do this also with an avr controller
06:17 AM Emil: it's that the esp also handles reflashing the avr, controls the data flow
06:18 AM Emil: and I also want as high update rates as possible
06:18 AM Emil: thus I can't just have the esp control the leds
06:19 AM lemm1ngs: means you need to implement the protocol to use the isp port into the esp
06:20 AM Emil: lolnope
06:20 AM Emil: It's a serial bridge :D
06:20 AM lemm1ngs: ah, ok
06:20 AM Emil: The m328p then flashes the t84a ":D"
06:20 AM Emil: I also realised that avrs support clock daisy chaining quite nicely
06:21 AM lemm1ngs: for me it looks like too much HW to control some LEDs
06:21 AM Emil: well
06:21 AM Emil: I need to:
06:21 AM Emil: 1. Sample and Filter ADC
06:21 AM Emil: 2. Update the leds at a high rate
06:21 AM Emil: 3. Handle rotary encoder
06:22 AM Emil: 4. Handle wifi and external control
06:22 AM Emil: 5. Handle flashing
06:22 AM Emil: I'd say that using only 3 chips is not too bad
06:23 AM lemm1ngs: you would probably need a 4th one to do the voltage regulation ;-)
06:23 AM Emil: I'm talking about programmable chips
06:24 AM Emil: I of course have and agc chip and a ldo there, too
06:24 AM lemm1ngs: but you could do that with the avr
06:24 AM Emil: agc?
06:24 AM Emil: Matey
06:24 AM Emil: you do realise that 10 bits is fucking nothing :D
06:25 AM Emil: and that I an't magically amplify with just the avr
06:25 AM Emil: I mean, I could potentially implement a super simple dac to go with vref and do agc in software with that
06:25 AM Emil: but eeeh
06:27 AM Emil: It's better to use a part that's made for the job
06:31 AM Emil: Hmm
06:32 AM Emil: Okay I'm being stupid, why not jus use a spi adc
06:32 AM Emil: The fuck am I thinking with using another avr
06:37 AM Emil: hmm
06:37 AM Emil: well I can filter how I want with that
06:38 AM Emil: well
06:38 AM Emil: allright then
06:38 AM Emil: the avr is cheaper
06:38 AM Emil: Fine, I'll go with the avr
07:01 AM eszett: by how much mm are solder paste areas usually smaller than the pads? Is it 0.05mm on each side?
08:26 AM Tom_itx: eszett_, it varies but a good data sheet will tell you all that
08:27 AM Tom_itx: or the mfg will have a suppliment with package data etc
08:27 AM eszett_: I mean what is a common value?
08:28 AM Tom_itx: just a tad bigger than the part pad
08:28 AM Tom_itx: tad = ~.05mm :)
08:29 AM Tom_itx: if you're solderin by hand, make em bigger
09:11 AM eszett_: ah right, then I did estimate it correctly
09:19 AM eszett_: Tom_itx where can I set this value in Kicad?
09:19 AM eszett_: the config to make the paste layer by value X smaller than the pads?
09:22 AM eszett__: Tom_itx where can I set this value in Kicad?
09:28 AM specing: eszett__: theres a kicad channel too
09:29 AM eszett__: ye ok
09:32 AM Emil: Hmm
09:32 AM Emil: Opininions
09:32 AM Emil: should I should not put the rotary encoder to the auxillary attiny84a
09:32 AM Emil: +or
09:33 AM Emil: Right now the m328p is responsible for updating the leds but also taking care of the rotary encoder
09:33 AM Emil: Updating the leds is serious business so I can't detect shit while it is happening
09:34 AM Emil: not to mention that it takes a whopping 4.5ms (~5ms) to update the whole strip
09:37 AM lemm1ngs: I would consider do use some I²C I/O device instead oft the aux controller ;-)
09:39 AM Lambda_Aurigae: heck, a secondary attiny is probably cheaper than an i2c i/o device.
09:41 AM Emil: Lambda_Aurigae: that's why I have an attiny here already :D
09:43 AM Emil: Yeah
09:44 AM Emil: why the fuck not :D
09:44 AM Emil: Another attiny
09:44 AM Emil: Yeah this works just fine
09:45 AM Emil: Hmm
09:46 AM Emil: If I design by bom then using another attiny84a would be "okay"
09:46 AM Tom_itx: i don't use Kicad i use eagle
09:46 AM Emil: > eagle
09:46 AM Emil: >not kiad or geda
09:46 AM lemm1ngs: what about configuring the attiny to run on 8MHz instead of the default 1Mhz and use a bigger one with more GPIOs?
09:47 AM Emil: eh?
09:47 AM Emil: lemm1ngs: I am no novice to avrs ;)
09:47 AM Tom_itx: are so
09:48 AM Tom_itx: err maybe just to here...
09:53 AM Emil: https://emil.fi/jako/kuvat/2017-06-17_17-22-56_eUqdvkS0.png
10:41 AM Flowjob: can someone tell me where to find some extension boards for the uC STm32F767Zi, at the website from ST i only find some exotic extensions, but im new in uC programming and i wanted first start with some LED, switches, buttons and an display
10:41 AM Flowjob: dont know much about compatibilty between some extension boards, and cant find any good resource to get the information i need
10:48 AM specing: That doesen't sound very much like AVR
10:53 AM Casper: specing: look at the topic that rue decided to put there... and then yell at rue...
10:54 AM specing: I'm disappointed
10:54 AM specing: rue should have just ban forwareded everyone to #stm32 and be done with it
10:56 AM Flowjob: specing: thanks, i didnt noticed there is an channel for it
10:56 AM Flowjob: sorry for asking ;)
11:44 AM eszett: hi
11:44 AM eszett: I have a question about footprints. If I have a diode footprint, the square pad is pad 1. Right?
11:45 AM eszett: Is there any standard about whether pin1/pad2 belongs to cathode or anode?
11:45 AM eszett: pin1/pad1
11:50 AM eszett: most people use anode as pin1/pad1, but screaming circuits does it the other way around, and they say it is the "correct way" http://i.imgur.com/ZhMlDkj.jpg
11:51 AM eszett: That is, according to IPC standards, cathode to the left, beeing pin1/pad1
11:52 AM eszett: It's confusing for me, that common practice and IPC standard is contradicting here.
11:59 AM Casper: don't worry, I've seen a capacitor with the band on the positive side... that was confusing as heck
12:05 PM eszett: a lack of common sense is pretty critical in an science like EE, where one little mistake can bring a rocket down from its way to mars
12:10 PM eszett: ah..
12:11 PM eszett: I finally found the answer. In IPC-7351: http://i.imgur.com/7KMg7nr.jpg Pin 1 is on left side, and pin 1 is cathode.
12:11 PM Casper: but I bet some other doc say the contrary
12:11 PM eszett: that means, the symbol, the arrow, points from right to left, not as you can see in 99% of google images, from left to right
12:12 PM eszett: That is the currently valid IPC standard, Casper..
12:12 PM Casper: I don't doubt it, but seeing how some parts are so insane...
12:13 PM Casper: and that is actually what I would have expected
12:13 PM Casper: you always see the cathode up when vertically drew
12:20 PM eszett: especially in kicad libraries, they are the crappiest
12:23 PM Lambda_Aurigae: the standard is,,,know what you are building and what you are building it with and how you are building it.
12:41 PM eszett_: hm, everyone stirring his own soup? bad idea!
12:42 PM Lambda_Aurigae: it's typical
12:42 PM Lambda_Aurigae: standards AREN'T
12:47 PM Casper: what annoy me is when there is some standards, and everyone violate them, and the compagny that made them do absolutelly nothing...
12:47 PM Casper: I LOOK AT YOU USB GROUP!
12:51 PM Casper: but seriously... I can understand at the begening that they were loose on the specs... but todays, there is no reason to let a big compagny to violate the specs, like modern computer case, with plain wire instead of the proper shielded twisted pair...
12:55 PM Lambda_Aurigae: Casper, IBM, Microsoft, Apple....everybody makes standards then avoids them.
12:55 PM Casper: yup
12:56 PM Casper: microsoft is quite good at that game too, so is apple...
12:56 PM Lambda_Aurigae: ibm came out with the AT standard for cases and connectors and all...then crapped on it with the PS2 computers.
12:56 PM Lambda_Aurigae: AT is the standard! Oh, here's microchannel, have fun fuckers.
12:56 PM Casper: but you have to admit that the ps/2 was in a way better (too fragile but sane size)
12:56 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I'm not talking about the keyboard and mouse plugs.
12:57 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I'm talking about the computers.
12:57 PM Lambda_Aurigae: but, microchannel is probably before your time.
12:57 PM Lambda_Aurigae: AT had the ISA slots.
12:57 PM Lambda_Aurigae: PS2 had microchannel slots.
12:58 PM Lambda_Aurigae: put a board in,,,and pray you have the setup floppy.
01:03 PM Casper: my time started at the 486
01:03 PM Lambda_Aurigae: 8088 here.
01:03 PM Lambda_Aurigae: well, 6502 for my first computer really.
01:03 PM Lambda_Aurigae: then z80
01:03 PM Lambda_Aurigae: then 8088
01:09 PM rue_bed: we are going back again
01:10 PM rue_bed: sdcc?
01:10 PM FL4SHK: small device C compiler
01:10 PM FL4SHK: no optimization
01:10 PM rue_bed: but I was 6502 - z80 - 386
01:10 PM FL4SHK: (or at least not enough)
01:10 PM Lambda_Aurigae: hehe.
01:11 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I'm working on getting rid of my old gear.
01:11 PM rue_bed: helll of some jumps, 1.023Mhz - 4Mhz - 25Mhz
01:11 PM rue_bed: still have all mine
01:11 PM Lambda_Aurigae: someone is taking all my commodore stuff except the 128 and vic-20 and one disk drive.
01:11 PM rue_bed: the IIe didn't smell good last time it was powered up tho
01:11 PM Lambda_Aurigae: and he wants anything I have from the 70s, 80s, and 90s.
01:11 PM Lambda_Aurigae: well, that's half my basement full of stuff.
01:12 PM rue_bed: double vision has almost merged
01:12 PM Lambda_Aurigae: stop sniffing lead solder fumes.
03:15 PM Emil: olleas: syke tarvis ilmasen linux-läppärin isälle, onko jossain jotain?
03:39 PM Lambda_Aurigae: basch na dae falik daevia!
03:40 PM Emil: oh
03:40 PM Emil: damn
03:40 PM Emil: Weong channel :D
03:44 PM Lambda_Aurigae: hehe.
03:44 PM Lambda_Aurigae: batravia kena fusla na dae.
03:52 PM Emil: Is that afrikaans?
03:52 PM Emil: Well, it's not proper Afrikaans if so
03:52 PM Emil: Oh you are just using translate with random languages?
03:52 PM Emil: Well I'm off to sauna
04:00 PM Lambda_Aurigae: no.
04:01 PM Lambda_Aurigae: it's called gibberish
04:27 PM Emil: Heh
04:27 PM Emil: Hmm
04:27 PM Emil: I wonder if I should use 0603 passives
04:27 PM Emil: or just stick with 0805
04:28 PM Emil: Hmm
04:28 PM Emil: I'll just stick with 0805
04:51 PM xentrac: better for your sanity probably
04:53 PM xentrac: Casper: USB is differential, right? why do you need shielding for the twisted pair, to keep common-mode EMI to a tolerable level?
04:58 PM Emil: xentrac: shielding is always needed when one worries about emi
05:02 PM Lambda_Aurigae: shielding keeps the neutron flow from reversing.
05:03 PM Lambda_Aurigae: you never want to reverse the neutron flow.
05:18 PM Casper: xentrac: also to keep the proper cable impedance
05:18 PM Casper: and also, they used straight wires instead of twisted
05:22 PM Emil: Fuck it
05:22 PM Emil: 0805 is so god damn big
05:22 PM Emil: 0603 it is
05:25 PM Casper: what about 010050?
05:30 PM Emil: heh
05:30 PM Emil: I bet I could actually use 0402
05:33 PM xentrac: Casper: can't you get unshielded twisted pair, or for that matter stripline, to get any transmission line impedance you want by adjusting the size and spacing of the conductors?
06:02 PM specing: Whats up with the 0 prefix?
06:02 PM enhering: Good night!
06:06 PM enhering: Good news today: https://hackaday.com/2017/06/17/hackaday-prize-entry-yet-another-unmanned-vehicle-controller/
06:07 PM enhering: They wrote some wrong stuff, but it seems a goot article.
06:07 PM enhering: good
06:31 PM xentrac: cool, enhering!
06:31 PM enhering: very, xentrac!
06:33 PM enhering: I'm happy.
09:17 PM Thrashbarg_ is now known as Thrashbarg
09:22 PM Casper: xentrac: sure you can, but if you are going to use something else, why not get the proper thing?
09:48 PM enhering: cehteh: Are you awake?
11:23 PM enhering: If I wanted a 40V, 50A power supply, would I be able to find a cheap one?
11:32 PM Casper: no
11:33 PM Casper: don'T go too cheap, it would be a fire hazard
11:44 PM enhering: Makes sense
11:50 PM day is now known as daey