#avr Logs
Apr 15 2017
#avr Calendar
12:13 AM daey_ is now known as daey
01:31 AM JanC is now known as Guest4061
01:31 AM JanC_ is now known as JanC
03:41 AM Jartza: hallo
03:59 AM julius: morning
04:01 AM Emil: xentrac: "no"
04:01 AM Emil: C top tier
04:01 AM Emil: C++ scrubs
04:07 AM xentrac: I prefer C myself
04:09 AM julius: test
04:10 AM xentrac: tset
04:11 AM julius: sorry...got confused with my second client
04:22 AM _ami_: IMO, C is far better for firmware programming
04:23 AM _ami_: basic philosphy of C is to be closer to machine. C++ is also close to machine but more inclined towards solving a problem
04:28 AM xentrac: you probably have more experience with firmware programming than I do
04:28 AM xentrac: C++ does have some real disadvantages despite often being more "inclined towards solving a problem"
04:44 AM rue_shop3: c++ is just horrible
04:44 AM rue_shop3: I go with the "it was meant to be a joke" theroy
05:14 AM antto: >:(
05:15 AM antto: you don't have to go crazy with C++
05:19 AM rue_shop3: no, making a mess is easy
05:20 AM Emil: I mean
05:20 AM Emil: you can write good code with brainfuck
05:20 AM Emil: but should you?
05:20 AM rue_shop3: hmmmm
05:20 AM rue_shop3: you present a good point
05:20 AM rue_shop3: how many k is an object in BF
05:31 AM _ami_: xentrac: agree!
05:43 AM julius: is it a unwritten rule that cameras have to have a flex cable that looks like it breaks every second and can not be solderd?
05:43 AM rue_shop3: 3am, might be a good idea to go to bed
05:44 AM rue_shop3: julius, no, it applies to more than just cameras
05:44 AM rue_shop3: laptop touchpads/keybaords lots of lcd's
05:44 AM rue_shop3: etc
05:46 AM julius: yes ive seen lcds too with that kind of cable
05:46 AM xentrac: I tried soldering to a flex cable once
05:46 AM xentrac: it's probably possible but I didn't achieve it
05:46 AM julius: just attached a cheap camera to a pi lite.....lets see how that goes
05:46 AM julius: i tried that too with a old keyboard...no luck
05:47 AM julius: but in general there is copper inside those, right?
05:47 AM xentrac: I think the copper is deposited as a thin foil or plating on the surface of the plastic, if we're talking about the kind of "flex cable" I'm thinking of
05:48 AM xentrac: that might actually be easier than composite video
05:48 AM xentrac: oops
05:48 AM xentrac: I misspoke
05:48 AM xentrac: I meant:
05:48 AM xentrac: there's the older kind of ribbon cable that is actually made of wires, which is pretty easy to solder actually
05:48 AM julius: this ones so thin...
05:49 AM xentrac: but doesn't withstand nearly as much flexing as the ones that are just flat traces
05:49 AM xentrac: I tried to solder to it and just melted a hole in it
05:50 AM Emil: flex cables are extremely useful
05:50 AM julius: just not so practical for the home user
05:51 AM xentrac: I will be careful to saw the connector out of its FR4 circuit board next time
05:52 AM xentrac: there is probably a better way involving clips and spring contacts
05:56 AM xentrac: or maybe some kind of conductive epoxy or something. like something full of silver or carbon particles?
06:05 AM _ami_: https://hackaday.io/project/21189-fastusbasp-programmer-for-avr
06:05 AM _ami_: https://github.com/amitesh-singh/FASTUSBasp
06:05 AM _ami_: fastest usbasp programmer for AVR MCUs
06:06 AM Emil: nice
06:08 AM _ami_: Emil: thanks
06:08 AM _ami_: i plan to make an adapter board for this.
06:09 AM _ami_: a PCB with socket for the stm32 and an ISP socket for AVR
06:26 AM julius: nice one
06:27 AM rue_shop3: waiting 2 seconds to flash an avr is too much?
07:00 AM _ami_: rue_shop3: well.. that is not the main motive behind it. i wanted to have one more AVR programmer and luckily its FASTER than usbasp :)
07:07 AM _ami_: btw, i got flash Write speed is 15KBps and Read speed is 52.5 KBps in my testing.
07:07 AM _ami_: and for USBasp, its way lower.
07:07 AM _ami_: Write speed: 1KBps Read speed: 2 KBps
07:17 AM Emil: _ami_: with what settings?
07:18 AM Emil: And how well do you adhere to the standard?
08:22 AM Lambda_Aurigae: _ami_, much anything is faster than usbasp...it doesn't really buffer well and it uses v-usb which isn't exactly fast to start.
08:24 AM Lambda_Aurigae: well, traditional usbasp does...that link earlier on the usbasp-clone built on stm32 is rather different.
09:44 AM l9_ is now known as l9
10:29 AM JanC_ is now known as JanC
10:45 AM _ami_: Lambda_Aurigae: yeah, we should not compare those since usbasp uses V-USB which has software usb stack
10:46 AM _ami_: Emil: At 3MHz SPI clock speed, that stm32 usbasp-clone gives 15 KBps Write and 52.5 KBps Read flash speed.
10:47 AM Lambda_Aurigae: my stk200 clone does just fine for me.
10:50 AM Emil: _ami_: yeah I read the github
10:50 AM Emil: I meant with what settings on usbasp
10:52 AM _ami_: Emil: the default settings on usbasp which is auto.. so it should be 1.5MHz SPI clock speed.
11:21 AM specing: 15KB/s is fast enough for most people
11:22 AM _ami_: specing: yeah, its based on dirt cheap stm32 board. :)
11:22 AM _ami_: 1.81$ if you buy from ali.
11:23 AM specing: holysheeeeeet
11:23 AM specing: thats cheap
11:23 AM _ami_: specing: and it has tons of features.
11:24 AM _ami_: specing: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Arm-cortex-m3-stm32f103c8t6-stm32-core-board-development-board/1539984258.html
11:24 AM Emil: you didnt kno?
11:24 AM _ami_: specing: http://amitesh-singh.github.io/stm32/2017/04/09/setting-stm32-dev-environment-arch-linux.html check the key features list.
11:24 AM Emil: stm32s are dirt cheap and way better than avrs
11:24 AM Emil: _ami_: what's your toolchain=
11:25 AM _ami_: arm-none-eabi-gcc and arm-none-eabi-newlib
11:25 AM Emil: cli?
11:25 AM Emil: Using only commandline?
11:25 AM _ami_: yeah. vim/vscode/cmake/make
11:25 AM Emil: _ami_: write an arm version like this: https://emil.fi/avr
11:26 AM Emil: /similar
11:26 AM Emil: I'll buy you a beer
11:26 AM _ami_: :)
11:26 AM specing: Emil: yeah, but $1.8 for a mcu board is still a bit low if you are used to Farnell pricing
11:26 AM Emil: /no bamboozled
11:26 AM Emil: specing: oh yeah that's true
11:26 AM Emil: specing: but that's production level
11:27 AM Emil: for hobbyist fucking around, Chinkstores are just fine
11:27 AM _ami_: Emil: i am using libopencm3 which is quite nice library for ARM Cortex M3
11:27 AM Emil: _ami_: just the software side
11:27 AM Emil: hrrrrrrr
11:27 AM Emil: well I can live with that if it gets me started
11:29 AM Emil: I have my two stm32l4kc nucleos and bluepills doing absolutely fucking nothing :D
11:29 AM Emil: And daydreaming about migrating to arms for a year now
11:29 AM _ami_: avr 8 bits are FAR easier to write bare C code like you did and we all did when we wrote AVR code.. ARM is not that easy. although i get the idea thats most important.
11:29 AM specing: Emil: yeah, same
11:29 AM _ami_: Emil: start with libopencm3
11:30 AM _ami_: its the best library out there for ARMs
11:30 AM Emil: _ami_: no the most important parts are that 1. no gui shit 2. only easy to get started with software
11:30 AM Emil: The actual code can be harder
11:30 AM Emil: as long is a good first example
11:31 AM _ami_: libopencm3 is no GUI shit! its perfectly linux way of working
11:31 AM _ami_: one ide and make
11:31 AM _ami_: thats it.
11:31 AM Emil: _ami_: then annoying part is that arms are no different to avrs, really, they just have more registers to shout at but that is easy to do. The abstraction layers and hals are just foooookken stupid
11:31 AM Emil: _ami_: I know
11:31 AM Emil: _ami_: but please write an example like that :D
11:32 AM Emil: I'll seriously buy you a beer
11:32 AM Emil: like through paypal.me or something
11:32 AM _ami_: Emil: ok. will do it soon if you insist :)
11:32 AM Emil: aaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesssooooooooooooooooooooommeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
11:35 AM _ami_: \o/ :)
11:35 AM Emil: third important factor: 3. only open source
11:35 AM Emil: no closed source shit
11:35 AM _ami_: yeah, indeed.
11:35 AM _ami_: no closed shit!
11:36 AM _ami_: stm32cube is a closed library.
12:07 PM NoHitWonder: Emil what's wrong with this one ? http://amitesh-singh.github.io/stm32/2017/04/09/setting-stm32-dev-environment-arch-linux.html
12:07 PM NoHitWonder: someone posted it few days ago
12:07 PM NoHitWonder: and it uses libopencm3
12:08 PM Emil: NoHitWonder: that seems pretty good
12:16 PM _ami_: NoHitWonder: thats me! :D
12:16 PM _ami_: thats my blog!
12:16 PM NoHitWonder: nice
12:17 PM _ami_: Emil wants bare C programming for ARM through registers. no APIs
12:18 PM Emil: _ami_: that's the target!
12:26 PM Casper: some are masochist
12:26 PM _ami_: Casper: lol :)
12:28 PM Emil: Casper: hehe
12:29 PM Emil: I mean, for all I know I might say that "hey, perhaps it is better to use some hal afterall" but I can't say that before I've tried it. And I'm a firm believer in learning a bit more
12:29 PM Emil: Also, arms can't be that hard
12:36 PM specing: they aren't
12:36 PM specing: its just those DAMN clocks
12:37 PM _ami_: specing: Emil: Casper: NoHitWonder: this blue-pill board has one surprise ;). officially the size of flash is 64KB but in reality, the size is 128 KB :D
12:37 PM Emil: Yeah I've heard of that also
12:37 PM Emil: But one shouldn't use that extra size
12:38 PM Emil: The way manufacturers handle yield is that they run tests on the chips and depending on the test they pass they are given labels to whatever series
12:38 PM Emil: So those chips probably didn't pass the required tests
12:38 PM _ami_: Emil: why? i did not use yet since i did not write that big firmware code yet.
12:38 PM _ami_: Emil: hmm..
12:39 PM _ami_: ok
12:39 PM Emil: _ami_: it's highly likely that that memory isn't stable
12:39 PM specing: _ami_: is the remainder disabled somehow?
12:39 PM Emil: do a write test
12:39 PM Emil: and a read test
12:39 PM Emil: specing: no
12:39 PM Emil: specing: it's just marked as 64kB but it happily accepts up to 128kB
12:40 PM Emil: The competition and yields are such that you have to sell everything you produce
12:40 PM Emil: you know why we have so much cheap low capacity memory sticks?
12:40 PM Emil: It's because most of them are probably higher capacity but didn't pass the qc
12:40 PM Emil: and the problematic sectors were just marked offlimits by the integrated controller, a lower capacity marking is slapped on the chip and off they go
12:41 PM _ami_: Emil: that extra size might be great for hobbyist but not good for commercial purpose for sure. :)
12:41 PM Emil: Yeah
12:41 PM Emil: like, some part of it might work fine
12:41 PM Emil: but some might be corrupted
12:41 PM Emil: Also level wear is a real thing with flash
12:41 PM Emil: you need extra space for that to have long lasting read/write
12:42 PM _ami_: http://www.stm32duino.com/viewtopic.php?t=110
12:42 PM Emil: What some resellers do is that they buy chips, disable level layering and sell chips as higher capacity which initally work but fail after a few uses
12:43 PM specing: Emil: I don't suppose flash on MCUs is supposed to be written to all the time
12:43 PM specing: yeah but that is 5-10% more capacity
12:43 PM Emil: specing: no, but you still have to test it
12:43 PM specing: not much
12:43 PM _ami_: Emil: may be STM forgot to disable flash size limit for 64KB part?
12:43 PM _ami_: somone in that discussion is claiming that.
01:03 PM hetii: Hello :)
01:04 PM rue_bed: typically a 100k rewrite cycle life isn't it?
01:04 PM Emil: hetii: ello
01:05 PM specing: rue_bed: I seem to remember 1k
01:05 PM hetii: Any clue why I get undefined reference to `uart_delay' when compile such C code: http://paste.ubuntu.com/24388479/
01:06 PM hetii: full errlog: https://pastebin.com/FkCQK3PL
01:06 PM Emil: hetii: the error is quite clear
01:06 PM Emil: either you use a function before you have defined it (or defined a prototype for it)
01:06 PM hetii: not for me: its still the same compile unit file
01:06 PM Emil: or it is not there
01:06 PM Emil: Or your syntax is wrong
01:07 PM hetii: the function is declared like: void uart_delay() __attribute__ ((naked));
01:07 PM hetii: and declaration as well as definition is before asm syntax
01:07 PM Emil: Why naked?
01:07 PM hetii: I grab it from optiboot and was naked there
01:08 PM hetii: don`t bother why...
01:08 PM Emil: You need to have it the same for definition and prototype
01:08 PM hetii: Emil, still the same result
01:10 PM hetii: I suppose the function name is change by compiler to some random name and as in asm code I use human readable name its not visible by linker
01:23 PM hetii: Emil, -nostartfiles switch for linker flags make it work.
02:02 PM Ashlee is now known as Ashleee
02:03 PM rue_house: hetii, where is the definition of uart_delay that you are trying to use?
02:10 PM hetii: rue_house, in the same file: http://paste.ubuntu.com/24388479/
02:18 PM rue_house: I dont see anything called uart_delay
02:19 PM rue_house: now I see it
02:19 PM rue_house: but its wrapped in an #ifdef
02:19 PM rue_house: so the definitions are probably at fault
02:19 PM rue_house: either from the command line, or in the code, you would need to define SOFT_UART
02:20 PM rue_house: #ifdef is EVIL
02:20 PM rue_house: its the start of code that people have tried to make work on everything
02:20 PM rue_house: there is no such thing as universal code, stop trying
02:21 PM rue_house: #ifdef leads to unreadable code
02:21 PM rue_house: which quickly leads to it being unmaintainable
02:22 PM rue_house: evil must always exist, so a bit of #ifdef is ok, but really, not peppered all thru the code
02:30 PM Emil: >2017-04-15 21:51:15 +0300 <@rue_house> #ifdef leads to unreadable code
02:30 PM Emil: FUCKIN THIS
02:31 PM specing: fyi Ada has no preprocessor
02:34 PM Emil: Always :DD
02:34 PM Emil: Every thread
02:34 PM specing: :D
02:34 PM Emil: specing: I award you the unofficial recognitiong for best pushing of agenda
02:35 PM * specing humbly accepts the award
02:35 PM Emil: For your continued Ada Shilling
02:35 PM Emil: may it continue and keep on strong still
02:36 PM specing: Emil: why do you have such a long date-time stamp?
02:36 PM Emil: specing: I prefer knowing when
02:36 PM specing: but why no nanoseconds? You are missing out!
02:36 PM Emil: It also allows for easier referencing
02:36 PM hetii: well.. I check my preprocessor directives and are ok
02:37 PM Emil: because of the Tz others can also easily understand the time
02:37 PM Emil: specing: because seconds are enough
02:37 PM Emil: for human level interaction
02:37 PM Emil: I mean, I could add a monotonic counter, too :D
02:37 PM Emil: But that's just silly
02:37 PM hetii: moreover as I wrote before when I add -nostartfiles my code was compiled, but in testing face I discover that my attiny85 was not able even blink leds
02:38 PM hetii: so I dig it more why the hex result is corrupted..
02:39 PM Emil: Hmm
02:39 PM Emil: I think I'll order a bunch of these
02:39 PM Emil: http://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts/en/ATSAMD21E18
02:39 PM Emil: hetii: do you use the soft serial?
02:40 PM hetii: Emil, yes, but as I said now I cannot even blink single led
02:41 PM hetii: so something is wrong with my linker flags
02:41 PM hetii: If I use -nostartfiles then my uart code is compile, but my attiny don`t boot
02:42 PM hetii: when I rid it then have issue with uart code but at least my led blink...
02:42 PM Emil: hetii: warnings don't usually prevent compilation
02:43 PM NoHitWonder: "Supported by Microchip Studio" wtf
02:48 PM Emil: Awww yeah
02:48 PM Emil: I found the old atmel datasheet version
02:49 PM Emil: I mean
02:49 PM Emil: fucking compare these two
02:49 PM Emil: http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/40001882A.pdf
02:49 PM Emil: https://cdn.sparkfun.com/datasheets/Dev/Arduino/Boards/Atmel-42181-SAM-D21_Datasheet.pdf
02:49 PM Emil: Oh Atmel oh Atmel, why did you sell your soul
02:54 PM specing: for money ofc
02:54 PM Emil: https://emil.fi/jako/tekstit/uclyef.txt
02:55 PM hetii: Seams that my compile flag "-flto" is responsible for the issue with uart_delay
02:56 PM Emil: holyshit
02:56 PM hetii: nowmy led and uart work fine...
02:56 PM Emil: this will be gold for the radioshow I'll be having
02:56 PM Emil: Avatar but reworded for uc lyef
02:56 PM Emil: Now what's a good replacement for Avatar
02:57 PM Emil: I used market above but that's not a good overall replacement
03:08 PM Emil: check it out now :D
03:09 PM Emil: https://emil.fi/jako/tekstit/UC_Market_The_Last_Atmel_Design.txt
03:11 PM Emil: https://emil.fi/jako/tekstit/Market_The_Last_Atmel_Design.txt
03:58 PM Emil: I just got cancer
03:58 PM Emil: Apparently #elektroniikka@IRCNet is actually no better than ##stm32
03:58 PM Emil: Holy shit the shilling
03:59 PM julius: elektroniikka is a real channel name?
03:59 PM julius: maybe they are related to #idlerz
03:59 PM Emil: 2017-04-15 23:24:54 +0300 <@Wyrm> Emil: ai kannustaisi kääntämään komentorivillä jne? miksi kukaan ammattilainen tekisi niin
03:59 PM Emil: Roughly translated
03:59 PM Emil: :
04:00 PM Emil: "Oh you mean to encourage compiling from the commandline? why would any professional do that
04:00 PM Emil: "
04:00 PM Emil: CANCER
04:00 PM Emil: REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
04:00 PM specing: ITS TERMINAL
04:00 PM Emil: And that guy is a fucking lead hardware designer at SiLabs/BlueGiga
04:01 PM Emil: The whole discussion there
04:01 PM xentrac: I kind of feel guilty when I compile from the command line
04:01 PM Emil: how the fuck are those people so up their asses
04:01 PM xentrac: I try to record my compilations in a Makefile so I can reproduce and debug them later
04:01 PM Lambda_Aurigae: they have been infected by mickysoft.
04:02 PM xentrac: on the other hand once I edited a binary with Emacs before shipping it to our customers
04:02 PM Emil: Lambda_Aurigae: they even ramble about how open source is shit, produces bad results and everything _good_ comes out of poropietari development and code
04:02 PM Lambda_Aurigae: yup.
04:02 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I got that in ##stm32 on this network.
04:03 PM Emil: Fortunately the change is coming
04:03 PM xentrac: so compiling on the command-line is far from the worst sin
04:03 PM Lambda_Aurigae: one can hope.
04:03 PM Emil: I'll teach people in uni and we'll only use open source software and tools
04:03 PM Emil: And commandline if possible
04:03 PM xentrac: <specing> AND THE CHANGE IS ADA
04:03 PM * Lambda_Aurigae slaps xentrac around with the unix manual, unabridged, all 38000 pages.
04:03 PM Emil: xentrac: no no no, it's his job, don't take it away from him
04:03 PM specing: word.
04:04 PM Lambda_Aurigae: what word?
04:04 PM specing: < xentrac> <specing> AND THE CHANGE IS ADA
04:04 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I never have understood that expression.
04:04 PM xentrac: that means "what you have said is indeed true", Lambda_Aurigae
04:04 PM Lambda_Aurigae: that's a sentence, more or less, not a word.
04:04 PM xentrac: thus is the paradox and the miracle of human language
04:05 PM Lambda_Aurigae: or the laziness of inner city kids who can't learn the language.
04:05 PM Lambda_Aurigae: can't/won't
04:05 PM Emil: specing: they are just teasing you
04:05 PM * xentrac hugs specing
04:05 PM Lambda_Aurigae: back when it was illegal to teach certain minorities to read and write they went out of their way to learn it
04:05 PM Emil: Don't take it too hard
04:06 PM Lambda_Aurigae: now that it's allowed, they go out of their way not to learn it.
04:07 PM julius: why is this adc code reading 0 all the time? https://bpaste.net/show/4c9b931e2a82
04:07 PM Emil: julius: mate
04:07 PM Emil: I've said it before
04:08 PM Emil: and I'll say it again :D
04:08 PM julius: relevant
04:08 PM Emil: Isolate the relevant code
04:08 PM julius: i know
04:08 PM Emil: But provide both
04:08 PM julius: i know that the uart part is working, somehow the readADC function does not read the right value. there are 0,21v at the adc0 pin of the atmega
04:09 PM Emil: julius: have you checked the registers?
04:09 PM julius: against the manual? yes
04:09 PM Lambda_Aurigae: and ADMUX is set to the proper pin?
04:09 PM Lambda_Aurigae: and your reference voltage is properly selected?
04:10 PM Lambda_Aurigae: I would set the reference voltage to AVCC, tie AVCC to VCC, and tie the ADC input pin to VCC...then try reading it.
04:11 PM julius: ok
04:13 PM Lambda_Aurigae: that way you know you have a valid input, valid reference, etc.
04:14 PM Emil: julius: check
04:15 PM Emil: don't be like the freshmen
04:15 PM Emil: or people who just say "yes" and nod their heads
04:15 PM Emil: while simultaniously not knowing anything that is happening
04:21 PM julius: im not, im testing
04:22 PM Emil: julius: anycase
04:22 PM Emil: the first read from adc is often wrong
04:22 PM julius: the code worked maybe a week ago, i dont know what i changed to make it not work anymore
04:22 PM Emil: You want to always read twice
04:22 PM Emil: throw the first one away and then read a second time
04:22 PM julius: ok, did that
04:23 PM julius: ah you mean, read two times before displaying
04:23 PM Emil: read and read again
04:23 PM Emil: So two conversions on the same channel
04:23 PM Emil: One after each other
04:24 PM julius: ok
04:24 PM julius: no change
04:24 PM Emil: There's no way you did that already ;)
04:24 PM julius: why?
04:24 PM julius: copy one line of code, flash
04:24 PM Emil: At least two lines
04:25 PM Emil: ADCSRA |= (1<<ADSC); while(ADCSRA & (1<<ADSC));
04:25 PM julius: code is in the next terminal, visual select in vim, y, esc, o, p, bash PROGRAM.sh <- does a make && rusn usbasp
04:25 PM julius: i just called readADC() a second time
04:26 PM Emil: That's not the same thing
04:27 PM Emil: Clearing ADMUX like you do in the beginning of readADC resets the source to ADC0
04:27 PM julius: changed it to yours
04:28 PM Emil: It's above
04:28 PM julius: youre right, my one did more than just remeasure
04:29 PM julius: i just remembered that i did run the original code on a arduino...so i should probably check my wiriing agin
04:30 PM Emil: Otherwise your code is fine
04:30 PM Emil: Check your channels
04:31 PM Emil: And that the voltage you are measuring has a ground reference
04:34 PM Emil: julius: your code has multiple problems
04:34 PM Emil: adc_value should be unsigned int, not int
04:35 PM julius: crap, had that before i posted
04:35 PM Emil: Also
04:35 PM Emil: that delay is unnecessary
04:35 PM Emil: on line 117
04:36 PM Emil: Don't use itoa :D
04:36 PM julius: changed unsigned to "not unsigned" because maybe itoa gets confused
04:36 PM Emil: If you want to use those buildins
04:36 PM Emil: use strtou for example
04:36 PM Emil: stdtoul*
04:37 PM julius: ok will look that up
04:37 PM Emil: Also, TXC is triggered when UDR0 is free iirc
04:38 PM Emil: (might have been when tx is complete but I doubt it)
04:38 PM julius: cant say either, for me its " when sending is done"
04:39 PM Emil: So unless you actually send something at the txi, don't enable it
04:41 PM julius: right
04:42 PM julius: now i broke it, no more bluetooth sending
04:42 PM julius: thanks for the input..need to catch some sleep
04:52 PM Emil: good night
05:09 PM NoHitWonder is now known as ^___^
07:48 PM daey_ is now known as daey
11:37 PM daey_ is now known as daey