#avr | Logs for 2015-05-28

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[00:35:57] <DO9XE> Hey guys :)
[00:37:35] <DO9XE> I have an avr isp mkii with avr dude on orch linux and it returns an unknown connection status. Does anyone know some steps how to debug the problem? I am sure that the target is working, because I tried different boards, non of them works.
[00:39:00] <Casper> first, the usual "don't do it but do"... have you tried to do it as root?
[00:39:47] <DO9XE> i allways do it as root ;)
[00:40:33] <Casper> is your board actually... powered?
[00:41:40] <DO9XE> jipp, I tried on self powerd and one programmer-powered board
[00:44:11] <Casper> man I can'T beleive how good she is...
[00:44:58] <Casper> ok... let's see..
[00:45:01] <DO9XE> http://pastebin.com/yKGj2E5D
[00:45:18] <DO9XE> this ist the avrdude -vvvv output
[00:46:07] <Casper> avrdude -c avrispmkII -P usb -p $(MCU_TARGET) -e -U flash:w:$(PRG).hex <=== that's my line in the makefile
[00:46:35] <Casper> I suspect you forgot the -P
[00:47:17] <DO9XE> avrdude -p m32u4 -P usb -c avrispmkii -U flash:w:Sgen-Firmware.hex -vvvv
[00:47:38] <DO9XE> nope, it was running, but the state of my programmer seems instable.
[00:50:06] <Casper> it should work... hmmm no idea...
[00:50:18] <DO9XE> thefuck O.o
[00:50:18] <Casper> is it tom's programmer? or another clone?
[00:50:50] <DO9XE> its working :o but, what, i didn't change anything O.o
[00:51:23] <DO9XE> I use the olimex version :)
[00:51:43] <Casper> Tom_itx: is it them that stole your design?
[00:51:58] <xrlk_> who stole it
[00:55:19] <Casper> iirc, someone did... been a while, my memory is not clear on that...
[06:48:47] <zmo> hi!
[06:51:08] <zmo> I'm trying to debug a marlin-based firmware with a jtagice3 tool, avarice and cgdb running avr-gdb… I've compiled my code using -gstabs, I removed -Os for most of my symbols (a couple of stupid arduino libs - Print and Wire - failed to compile without -Os), flashed it, launched avarice, connected cgdb using avr-gdb v7.6…
[06:52:16] <zmo> but when I'm stepping through the code, I'm getting `Single stepping until exit from function _Z19my_functionf", which has no line information`
[06:52:56] <zmo> (BTW, I loaded the .elf in gdb after connecting to the remote, and setup the dir correcly)
[06:53:07] <zmo> so it looks like I'm still doing something wrong, but I cannot figure what
[07:01:21] <zmo> N.B.: the couple of libraries I couldn't compile without `-Os` were failing with `undefined reference to `__cxa_pure_virtual'`
[07:01:40] <zmo> if anybody can help, I'd be really grateful :-D
[08:05:56] <zmo> ok, -gdwarf works
[08:06:15] <zmo> and defining `void __cxa_pure_virtual() {};` works as well
[13:29:39] <hypermagic> hi
[19:17:51] <Jartza> heh
[19:17:54] <Jartza> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2dTzW9TMeBxeV94M3M1Z0VLTkU/view
[19:17:58] <Jartza> not sure how useful that is
[19:18:07] <Jartza> but anyway, I just had to test if one tagsu can talk to other too :)
[20:12:15] <[w_w]> Is there an attiny with three individual 16bit timers?
[20:13:32] <[w_w]> Is there an avr with three individual 16bit timers?
[20:13:35] <Lambda-Aurigae> I'm guessing you haven't looked at the table of all the avr chips?
[20:13:56] <[w_w]> I can has link?
[20:14:14] <Lambda-Aurigae> can you use google? or even go to atmel.com and look?
[20:14:48] <Lambda-Aurigae> http://www.atmel.com/v2PFResults.aspx#%28actives:!%288238,8394,8362,8282,8431,8300,8358,8392,8378,8445,8236,8449,8474,8248,8264,8447,8256,8254,8286,8462,8429,8458,8466,8400,8302,8278%29,data:%28area:%27%27,category:%2734864[33180]%27,pm:!%28%28i:8238,v:!%281,16%29%29,%28i:8394,v:!%280,17%29%29,%28i:8362,v:!%282,28%29%29,%28i:8282,v:!%285,6%29%29,%28i:8431,v:!%281,33%29%29,%28i:8300,v:!%281,8%29%29,%28i:8358,v:!%281,67%29%29,%28i:8392,v:!%280,1%29%29
[20:14:48] <Lambda-Aurigae> ,%28i:8378,v:!n%29,%28i:8445,v:!%281,4,5,6,7,9%29%29,%28i:8236,v:!%280,24%29%29,%28i:8449,v:!%281,10%29%29,%28i:8474,v:!%280%29%29,%28i:8248,v:!%280,1%29%29,%28i:8264,v:!%281,5%29%29,%28i:8447,v:!%280,1%29%29,%28i:8256,v:!%281,2,4%29%29,%28i:8254,v:!%283,16%29%29,%28i:8286,v:!%280,3%29%29,%28i:8462,v:!%280,8%29%29,%28i:8429,v:!%281,10%29%29,%28i:8458,v:!%280,4%29%29,%28i:8466,v:!%281,2,4%29%29,%28i:8400,v:!%280,20%29%29,%28i:8302,v:!%280,1%29%29,%28
[20:14:50] <Lambda-Aurigae> i:8278,v:!%280,1,2%29%29%29,view:list%29,sc:1%29
[20:14:55] <Lambda-Aurigae> there's the link to the table.
[20:15:00] <Lambda-Aurigae> it doesn't paste well.
[20:15:30] <Tom_itx> damn dude
[20:15:31] <Lambda-Aurigae> http://www.atmel.com/products/microcontrollers/avr/default.aspx
[20:15:40] <Lambda-Aurigae> click on product search.
[20:18:09] <Lambda-Aurigae> hmm...seems it doesn't break it down to 8 and 16 bit..
[20:18:41] <Lambda-Aurigae> sorry bout the giant link there Tom_itx ...
[20:20:29] <Tom_itx> not like i was blubbering about anything important...
[20:20:38] <Lambda-Aurigae> looks like attiny maxes out at 3 timers total so likely not that many 16bit ones in there.
[20:21:06] <[w_w]> yea. the 644 has two 8s and one 16
[20:23:46] <Lambda-Aurigae> atmega640 series has lots
[20:23:51] <Lambda-Aurigae> 2 8bit and 4 16bit
[20:24:25] <Tom_itx> why the hell would you need so many separate timers on one chip?
[20:24:27] <Lambda-Aurigae> xmega series has more yet.
[20:24:40] <Lambda-Aurigae> multiple PWM thingies for one guess.
[20:27:11] <Lambda-Aurigae> just start narrowing down your requirements on that table and sort by timers to find ones with 4 or more timers.
[20:40:54] <[w_w]> atmega640 also costs like 10 euros... lol.
[20:41:42] <Lambda-Aurigae> you want the toys, you gotta pay for them.
[20:41:48] <Casper> atmel should make another mega with more counters on each timer
[20:43:27] <Lambda-Aurigae> I like the 5 16bit timers on the pic32mx270f256b myself..
[20:43:42] <Lambda-Aurigae> can pair some of them up to make 2 32bit timers too.
[20:43:44] <hypermagic> hi
[20:44:24] <Lambda-Aurigae> anyhow,,,off to bed..
[20:44:58] <hypermagic> Tom_itx, i could think of a few apps for it
[20:46:58] <[w_w]> yea. but pic is not so fun to program
[20:47:18] <hypermagic> it cn be in C maybe...
[20:47:54] <hypermagic> c should b the same right ?
[20:50:23] <Tom_itx> do they still do bank select?
[20:50:28] <Tom_itx> c should take care of that
[20:50:37] <hypermagic> [w_w], i think you should check out atsam3s2c ?
[20:51:19] <[w_w]> well. You have to get a compiler, and its not so linux friendly.
[20:51:27] <hypermagic> oh it is
[20:51:39] <hypermagic> gcc can compile for arm cortex-m3
[20:52:14] <hypermagic> the programming is another thing
[20:52:25] <hypermagic> atmel likes to give you the finger on linux
[20:53:25] <osteri> arm is not so hobbyist-friendly and it doesn't have hobbyist community around it
[20:53:36] <hypermagic> until some cool dude comes and hacks ther shit
[20:53:46] <osteri> + IP shit
[20:53:55] <hypermagic> ip ?
[20:54:42] <osteri> cannot burn arm to FPGA
[20:54:55] <hypermagic> i lost you
[20:55:18] <osteri> you have to buy licence for it
[20:55:21] <[w_w]> yea, well I don't even have a windows box so its got to be linux.
[20:55:37] <hypermagic> oh you have to pay license for breathing
[20:55:48] <hypermagic> no surpsise there
[20:56:24] <hypermagic> btw you cannot burn any fpga free
[20:56:36] <Tom_itx> some you can
[20:56:37] <hypermagic> it costs your soul
[20:56:54] <Tom_itx> xilinx has free tools
[20:56:58] <[w_w]> well I do have one windows, but only to flash the bootloader on my uc3s.
[20:56:59] <hypermagic> "free"
[20:57:01] <hypermagic> ;)
[20:57:22] <Tom_itx> in fact i used them last evening
[20:58:06] <osteri> http://opencores.com/project,avr_core
[20:58:21] <hypermagic> why would you avr an fpga ?
[20:59:25] <hypermagic> you have too much computing power and it confuses you ?
[20:59:30] <osteri> if you want to do digital filtering for eg in the same silicon?
[21:00:49] <hypermagic> then i do digital filtering, not avr core
[21:01:57] <osteri> VHDL as a language is not very fun when it comes to complex stuff
[21:02:12] <hypermagic> i like maccros
[21:02:44] <hypermagic> it becones "simpler"
[21:02:49] <hypermagic> m
[21:03:30] <hypermagic> not every transistor is placed there by an engineer in your cpu cache
[21:03:53] <hypermagic> it would take a little more time
[21:46:48] <Jymmm> osteri: Um, what's the purpose/usage of OpenCores?
[21:50:56] <Xark> Jymmm: Why are you asking here? But it is a repository of open FPGA designs (kind of like Sourceforge for FPGA code).
[21:51:08] <osteri> high scalability, you can even have linux running in them... or just burn avr core
[21:51:20] <osteri> i think it's very cool
[21:51:52] * Xark notes you are use ARM2 core (there are 2 on OpenCores IIRC).
[21:52:01] <Xark> you can use*
[21:52:04] <Jymmm> osteri: Well, I mena why would one want RS-232 on FPGA instead of getting MAX232? http://opencores.com/project,rs232_interface
[21:52:54] <osteri> because other is a hw component and other is sw component
[21:52:58] <Xark> Jymmm: If your design runs inside a FPGA that is like asking why would you want to write software when you can just add additional hardware. :)
[21:53:09] <osteri> the high scalability...
[21:54:09] <Xark> Jymmm: Think of an FPGA as a "breadboard" the size of a house with trash cans full of TTL chips. You can "configure" the FPGA to be whatever digital circuit (CPU, UART, Bitcoin miner, etc.)
[21:54:57] <Jymmm> So, a SoC started as a FPGA somewhere, then eventually silicon?
[21:55:10] <Jymmm> sorta kinda
[21:55:12] <Xark> Jymmm: Most likely.
[21:55:36] <Xark> Jymmm: However, FPGA will not run as fast as dedicated silicon (ASIC).
[21:55:43] <Jymmm> IS that common practice? FPGA to growing the silicon?
[21:55:58] <Xark> Great for a lower speed prototype so the software people can get started (e.g.)
[21:57:00] <Jymmm> Oh, so MAX232 is ASIC?
[21:57:25] <Xark> Jymmm: My understanding is ASIC designs are typically in VHDL or Verilog as well, so common to target FPGA prototype (in addition to mind numbing amounts of software simulation of the circuit [slow]).
[21:57:38] <Xark> Jymmm: Yep. Application Specific IC.
[21:57:56] <Jymmm> and AVR's to I'd imagine
[21:58:00] <Jymmm> too*
[21:58:10] <Xark> I will mention MAX232 isn't entirely digital though (charge pumo etc.)
[21:58:16] <Xark> pump*
[21:58:24] <osteri> and the FPGA's are getting cheaper and cheaper every day
[21:58:30] <Jymmm> IT wa the first chip that came to mind =)
[21:58:47] <Tom_itx> who let him in here?
[21:59:04] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: you left the door open biotch!
[21:59:15] <Xark> Jymmm: Have you heard of the Propeller MCU? 8-core design. They recently released the design for that chip in Verilog that can be synthesized on FPGA (and runs faster than real one I believe).
[22:00:13] <Xark> Jymmm: There is also an AVR core on opencores (and I thnk it is pretty zippy).
[22:00:22] <Jymmm> Xark: No, I remember the Transsomething (software) cpu from eons ago
[22:00:42] <Xark> Jymmm: Yeah, Transputer. Quite different.
[22:01:05] <Jymmm> Transmeta
[22:01:26] <Jymmm> http://www.notebookcheck.net/Transmeta-Crusoe-TM-5800-Notebook-Processor.24832.0.html
[22:01:26] <Xark> Ahh, that one too. Not as ancient. :) VLIW that emulated x86.
[22:02:02] <Jymmm> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transmeta
[22:02:09] <Xark> Nowadays x86 chips are a RISC engine that "emulates" x86 anyways. :)
[22:02:51] <Jymmm> Hey now, leave my 486SX out of this!
[22:03:15] <Jymmm> MASM
[22:05:01] <Jymmm> Ok, so, how would one even begin to clone a core of something? Electron microscope?
[22:05:30] <Tom_itx> ask china
[22:05:36] * Xark is currently playing around with a custom CPU architecture on an FPGA (this one -> http://opencores.org/project,sweet32_cpu but OC version way out of date).
[22:05:42] <Jymmm> heh, no shit huh
[22:05:42] <hypermagic> Jymmm, one would not use rs232 i think
[22:06:00] <DanFrederiksen> Jymmm, sounds about right. maybe laser shaving to look into layers
[22:06:08] <hypermagic> fpgas used to have LVDS that can go 500Mbps or more
[22:06:11] <Jymmm> DanFrederiksen: k
[22:06:37] <DanFrederiksen> also laser shaving to free the chip from the package
[22:06:38] <Tom_itx> http://www.xess.com/projects/
[22:06:42] <hypermagic> and it is nice to add some error checking code
[22:06:44] <Xark> hypermagic: Depends on the FPGA. This cheap one (MachXO2) is doing 125MHz LDVS (for HDMI).
[22:06:47] <Jymmm> I remember they used to do that to sat chips
[22:06:49] <hypermagic> even correcting
[22:07:02] <hypermagic> Xark, sounds nice
[22:07:37] <hypermagic> Xark, btw can you bitbang LVDS ?
[22:08:15] <Xark> hypermagic: Hmm. On an FPGA everything is bit-banged... :) For a MCU, I would think you need some transistors to help or something (not sure).
[22:08:20] <Jymmm> Ok you have your FPGA project, how do you get an ASIC from it? Have it grown for you?
[22:08:48] <Xark> Jymmm: First, start with a few hundred thousand dollars...
[22:08:58] <Jymmm> got it, next?
[22:09:02] <Xark> Jymmm: That is as far as I've ever gotten. :)
[22:09:10] <Jymmm> lol
[22:09:47] <Tom_itx> i bet abcminiuser knows
[22:09:53] <Jymmm> Xark: We used to grow our own lasers, but they were in gold plated packaging.
[22:09:57] <Tom_itx> he's been thru their factory i'm sure
[22:10:05] <hypermagic> Jymmm, simple, just sign a cash out for $1M-$1000M and let some factory make it for you
[22:10:20] <hypermagic> you can have your own Jymmtium pro cpu
[22:10:55] <Xark> GenuineJymmm(TM) :)
[22:11:17] <Jymmm> hypermagic: It'll never exist, I've always wanted a 10GHz cpu
[22:11:22] <hypermagic> :)
[22:11:29] <hypermagic> i'd say make a parallel one instead!
[22:11:32] <Tom_itx> Jymmm, http://chipdesignmag.com/display.php?articleId=797
[22:11:34] <Jymmm> Nooooooooooooooo
[22:11:42] <hypermagic> unless it will be a quantum cpu/ optical cpu
[22:11:50] <Jymmm> Single core, 256bit @ 10GHz
[22:11:55] <hypermagic> but the price will be higher than
[22:12:14] <hypermagic> btw you can go higher then, 350GHz+
[22:12:21] <Xark> Jymmm: Liquid Nitrogen setup will cost extra. :)
[22:12:35] <Jymmm> Xark: I like LOX
[22:12:56] <hypermagic> Jymmm, maybe you want to m8 up with darpa and ask them if you can peek their 350GHz cpu tech ?
[22:13:50] <Tom_itx> http://semiengineering.com/the-fpga-alternative/
[22:13:52] <Jymmm> hypermagic: Nuh uh, I had a friend that worked at SDSC, they kicked his ass out of the country!
[22:14:09] <Jymmm> Smart, Smart, man
[22:14:22] <Jymmm> and nicer than hell too.
[22:16:01] <Jymmm> But I think he did alright, head of Peru LUG, got hitched, has a kid, and spread the gospel of linux everywhere he goes =)
[22:16:08] <hypermagic> why you need that clock speed ?
[22:16:19] <Jymmm> hypermagic: PONG
[22:16:26] <hypermagic> for computing you do not need high frequency.
[22:17:21] <hypermagic> 1000x 500MHz is more than 1x 10GHz .
[22:17:39] <Jymmm> hypermagic: Oh you mean for some actual practial purpose... brute force passwords
[22:17:55] <hypermagic> no i mean for whatever
[22:18:41] <hypermagic> let's see, if the highest frequency thing to do with your computer is to generate 48kHz audio samples, then 48Khz speed would be enough for the whole system
[22:19:11] <Jymmm> WEll, if I can brute force 10M/s, faster is better, no?
[22:19:50] <hypermagic> i have no idea what you want to do with it but have fun
[22:19:56] <Jymmm> (I do realize distrubte would be a better method, but I'm speaking brute power/strength here)
[22:20:36] <[w_w]> some things cannot be easily parallelized.
[22:20:38] <hypermagic> if you have an array of logic gates that can encode a full frame of h264 video in 1 clock tick then you need 60 Hz clock to encode your h264 video at 60Fps.
[22:21:15] <Jymmm> hypermagic: I was serious, brute force your password... AAA, AAB, AAC, etc
[22:22:01] <hypermagic> my password would take a little longer with your system because it would need more than 34 characters
[22:22:07] <[w_w]> decode HF signals realtime. High definition digital filters in realtime.
[22:22:16] <Jymmm> [w_w]: Especially when you (me) has NFC on distributed processing =)
[22:22:48] <Jymmm> [w_w]: NUMBER Stations!!!
[22:23:18] <hypermagic> Jymmm, anyway, some tasks are easily parallelable
[22:23:40] <Jymmm> hypermagic: "hypermagicisubercoolkidandcanhazkats"
[22:24:09] <hypermagic> noidontwantcatz
[22:24:11] <hypermagic> :/
[22:24:21] <Jymmm> hypermagic: I know, but like I said, I was talking brute power/speed.
[22:24:52] <hypermagic> and if you partition your data, you can compute them in parallel.
[22:25:14] <Jymmm> hypermagic: 2015-05-28.19:57:54 Jymmm: (I do realize distrubte would be a better method, but I'm speaking brute power/strength here)
[22:26:39] <Jymmm> hypermagic: Yes, there better/faster ways to bbq, but nothign like brute power... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjPxDOEdsX8
[22:28:57] <Jymmm> [w_w]: Can't most (high end) SDR's decode HF realtime now?
[22:29:13] <hypermagic> http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/
[22:29:16] <hypermagic> :)
[22:29:22] <hypermagic> you want to reinvent this ?
[22:30:42] <hypermagic> http://scitech.blogs.cnn.com/2009/12/09/military-purchases-2200-ps3s/
[22:30:47] <hypermagic> hahha what a topic
[22:31:03] <hypermagic> military wants to play too
[22:31:34] <Jymmm> hypermagic: s/military/NSA/
[22:33:15] <Jymmm> Thanks for the OpenCores info/lesson btw, much appreciated.
[22:39:53] <hypermagic> How PS3 Can Be Used As A Super Computer (Hi-Res) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1G6HP6bH1w
[22:39:56] * Xark notes the PS3 SPU units are pretty interesting. Probably most exotic CPU he has developed for with each core having 128 128-bit registers (and wicked fast). :)
[22:54:05] <Xark> Jymmm: If you want a nice example of a simple 8-bit CPU core in both Verilog and VHDL check out http://opencores.org/websvn,filedetails?repname=mcpu&path=%2Fmcpu%2Fweb_uploads%2Fmcpu.pdf
[22:54:31] <Xark> (code fits on one page)
[23:12:02] <Jymmm> Xark: I can haz cpu?
[23:13:58] <Jymmm> It's kinda RPN'ish
[23:14:38] <Xark> Jymmm: Sure. That is just a toy one though. It can be expanded though -> http://members.optushome.com.au/jekent/FPGA.htm#Section5.3
[23:14:51] <Xark> Jymmm: Hmm, what is RPN? I don't recall that...
[23:15:11] <Jymmm> Reverse Polish Notation, early HP Calculators, etc
[23:15:39] <Xark> Yes, but Verilog is C-ish and VHDL is Ada-like (and MCPU is fairly standard load/store accumulator design).
[23:15:46] <Jymmm> 3,4,+
[23:15:48] <Jymmm> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_Polish_notation
[23:16:14] <Xark> Yes, but what are you saying is like RPN (I am quite familiar with it)?
[23:16:23] <Jymmm> Xark: YEah, it looked like a lot of bit sifting was going on.
[23:17:00] <Xark> It is a PITA to code for MCPU. :)
[23:17:30] <Xark> Four total opcodes is pretty damn minimal (but not quite minimal -> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_instruction_set_computer )
[23:18:33] <Jymmm> Xark: Gotta realize I don't do any of this. It's been man moons since I've even touched ANSI C for that matter =)
[23:18:38] <Jymmm> many*
[23:18:48] <Xark> Jymmm: Okay.
[23:19:14] <Jymmm> 10 LPRINT CHR$(12) 20 GOTO 10 m'kay ;)
[23:19:43] <Xark> Jymmm: Gotcha.
[23:20:20] <Xark> Well, if you *really* want, there is a BASIC compiler available for AVR (but I don't recommend it). :)
[23:21:02] <Jymmm> Yeah, no. I'd either go python or c these days.
[23:21:09] <Jymmm> maybe java
[23:22:01] <Jymmm> Though python sucks pasting in irc =)
[23:22:55] <Xark> C or C++ is best for AVR, but Python is good for any PC side chores.
[23:23:26] <Jymmm> I always wanted to make a mechanical CPU though, that might be interesting
[23:23:33] <Xark> (or asm...but guessing that is not your first choice) :)
[23:23:54] <Jymmm> Well ASM would be fine, if I knew any instruction set =)
[23:24:36] <Xark> Jymmm: Got any tinker toys? http://museum.mit.edu/nom150/entries/1215 ?
[23:25:25] <Jymmm> I could make a few I suppose, but I was thinking relay logic cpu
[23:26:08] <Xark> Like http://hackaday.com/2012/01/16/the-tim-8-is-the-smallest-8-bit-relay-computer-ever/
[23:26:39] <Jymmm> Oh gawd no...
[23:27:23] <Jymmm> When I was doing environmental testing, there was a three cabinet amp
[23:28:21] <Jymmm> The cable harnesses were self supporting, and you could visually trace each wire from end to end.
[23:28:37] <Jymmm> It was the most beauitful thing i had ever seen
[23:28:50] <Jymmm> all hand done, all wax string
[23:29:24] <Jymmm> the hoses for the water cooling had no clamps
[23:29:40] <Jymmm> it was a work of art imo
[23:30:03] <Jymmm> I would love to hand wrap my own coils for the relay, make my own contacts, etc.
[23:30:42] <Jymmm> Then kids could literally SEE logic being done
[23:31:06] <Jymmm> or numbers being added together,
[23:32:16] <Jymmm> Xark: Not as mechanical as this, but along the same line... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1i-dnAH9Y4
[23:45:29] <hypermagic> Jymmm, what would you do with a large processing power supercomputer? (other than bruteforcing hashed passwords)
[23:49:19] <hypermagic> btw they say this is computer http://hackaday.com/2012/01/16/the-tim-8-is-the-smallest-8-bit-relay-computer-ever/
[23:54:40] <Xark> You can also get a cheap "supercomputer" + decent FPGA (with ARM CPU) -> http://www.adapteva.com/parallella/
[23:55:11] * Xark is tempted but not sure what I would compute with it...