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[03:36:49] <megal0maniac> rue_house: Bring that bot back
[03:37:04] <megal0maniac> I can't even remember its name
[03:37:16] <megal0maniac> But it was clever
[03:41:31] <Tom_itx> tobbor
[03:41:59] <Tom_itx> easy to remember it was robbot spelled backwards
[03:42:16] <Tom_itx> canucks just can't spell
[04:31:02] <NicoHood> any idea how to solve this?
https://gist.github.com/NicoHood/5c11e4ed6c5281579880
[04:34:08] <specing> grep pcintwhatever -R /path/to/avr/install/include
[04:35:08] <DO9XE_> no, sorry, :/ got isp problems by myself :P if i set the /SS pin high and low only it goes high and low. but if there ist a SPI function between pulling low and high nothing works :P not even the spi-clock is visible on the oszilloscope :P Im using LUFA-SPI, the code is here:
https://github.com/LabConnect/Signalgenerator/tree/master/firmware
[04:42:45] <specing> forgot to set DDR regs?
[04:51:55] <DO9XE_> no, its all done by lufa ;)
[04:52:24] <DO9XE_> see "LUFA/Peripheral/AVR8/..SPI...h" or so :)
[04:52:28] <DO9XE_> in my github
[09:23:42] <rue_house> hmmm
[10:01:53] <woodyj21> quiet morning here... everyone must be working
[10:04:39] <woodyj21> I've been banging my head on the OpenMoCo AVR libraries, trying to get it to play nice with Arduino UNO... making progress
[12:23:25] <woodyj21> and it LIVES!!!
[12:31:51] <N1njaneer> The reports of its death are greatly exaggerated? Whatever "it" is? :)
[12:33:32] <woodyj21> I've been trying to get the Open MoCo menu manager library working on my Arduino... and now it is :)
[12:41:35] <Jartza> yay
[12:43:29] <woodyj21> i can't get too excited, because I'm still figuring it all out, but it's a great start
[12:46:58] <hypermagic> hello my friends
[12:48:09] <N1njaneer> Progress is always great! :D
[12:48:14] <N1njaneer> Hey hypermagic!
[12:48:23] <hypermagic> so from the 100 pins, 1 is wasted for the useless thing called "erase"
[12:49:42] <N1njaneer> No, Erase is necessary in order to initiate a complete wire operation for a locked chip.
[12:50:00] <N1njaneer> +wipe
[12:50:14] <hypermagic> what are you creating N1njaneer ? ;)
[12:51:55] <N1njaneer> I use the SAM parts on a lot of control boards for entertainment lighting products.
[12:53:24] <hypermagic> which device ?
[12:54:01] <hypermagic> i picked the ATSAM3S1C now because it's cheap and has dac, and looks useful
[12:54:06] <N1njaneer> Usually SAMD20/21 and SAM4E16 from the Atmel-specific side of things.
[12:55:11] <hypermagic> and you just flash leds using series resistor and a tiny fet?
[12:57:08] <N1njaneer> No, this is all extremely high-end product design that uses Ethernet for reception of sACN/ArtNet/DMX control data to pass on to either dedicated chains of constant-current drivers (think video display applications) or other types of data processing. It's... pretty specific. :)
[12:57:18] <LeoNerd> Mmmmm ArtNet
[12:58:58] <N1njaneer> I actually have 0x1337 for both our ESTA and ArtNet manufacturer ID, because it was avaliable and I asked.
[12:59:29] <LeoNerd> :)
[12:59:43] <N1njaneer> Unfortunatly USBSIG won't assign requested VID numbers, so I would up with a randomly assigned one for that. :(
[13:00:19] <N1njaneer> Tried to get them all to match. :)
[13:01:21] <hypermagic> nobody cares
[13:01:41] <N1njaneer> I do, because I payed for it. :)
[13:01:45] <woodyj21> :)
[13:02:15] <hypermagic> you can pay for nothing
[13:02:20] <woodyj21> I would have thought a "ninja" engineer would have more.... intesting ways of getting things :)
[13:02:22] <N1njaneer> hmm?
[13:02:48] <N1njaneer> Not when you make your living doing it and have the be able to demonstrate compliance with standards. :)
[13:03:09] <woodyj21> i hate spending money on stuff, it alwys feels good to make "junk" work :)
[13:03:18] <N1njaneer> There are times to be clever, and there are times to be correct. :)
[13:03:26] <hypermagic> but junk will fall apart
[13:03:27] <woodyj21> yup, when dealing with standards for sure
[13:03:56] <hypermagic> a solid stainless steel plate is stable
[13:04:24] <N1njaneer> woodyj21: If you aren't commercializing products there's a lot more you can do to not have to pay money. There's lots of options for temporary or clandestine options for obtaining things like usable VID/PIDs and MAC addresses
[13:05:09] <woodyj21> N1njaneer: yeah, i feel ya ;)
[13:05:21] <woodyj21> i'm a non-comercial guy. just hacking/making for fun
[13:05:59] <hypermagic> so what is your opinion about storing data on sams and avrs ? eeprom/flash
[13:06:15] <hypermagic> why is there eeprom if there is flash?
[13:06:22] <N1njaneer> woodyj21: Then by all means save money where possible :)
[13:06:33] <hypermagic> can't just i use flash then ? like the last few bytes of my device ?
[13:07:07] <N1njaneer> hypermagic: Flash is program memory and can only be page-erased, and has a much lower number of rewrites possible. eeprom is byte-rewritable with a much higher number of rewrites possible.
[13:07:17] <Guma> Hello I got Atmel-ICE setup With Studio One 6.2 under windows 8.1. Under Tools -> Device Programming I can read voltage and signature. But when I want to debug it states that I can only program and not debug. So I did check DWEN fuse I can't read it any more. This is my first attempt. I am assuming that I can't use the 6 pin ISP cable and I have to rewire to debuging? Am I correct? And do I have to switch each time if I need to
[13:07:18] <Guma> pprogram and debug?
[13:07:34] <hypermagic> n0ok how about i use my last page ?
[13:07:44] <hypermagic> N1njaneer
[13:09:16] <N1njaneer> Use the eeprom to store any data that needs rewriting.
[13:10:37] <woodyj21> i'm using a menu sketch on my ardunio, each of the menu displays is a STRING, and so they would clog up my flash mem. the sketch loads those strings in EEPROM and grabs them when it needs them
[13:11:17] <N1njaneer> woodyj21: You want those in program flash memory -- eeprom is extremely tiny and a lot slower.
[13:11:25] <hypermagic> N1njaneer, i think the ATSAM3S1C does not have eeprom
[13:11:42] <hypermagic> and maybe eeprom does not work properly at 1.8V
[13:11:53] <LeoNerd> 1.8 sounds quite low for eeprom
[13:12:56] <hypermagic> the device is rated 1.65V+ core voltage
[13:12:57] <woodyj21> yeah, the lib gives you the option.... i have't got quite that far in the coding yet
[13:13:19] <N1njaneer> hypermagic: Yes, it looks like ATSAM3S1C does not have on-board eeprom, so you can either possibly use a flash memory page like you had suggested, or use an external SPI memory flash chip which can give you as much room as you need.
[13:13:51] <hypermagic> i only want to store some rarely changed options
[13:14:07] <hypermagic> and maybe remember the last option used ?
[13:14:34] <hypermagic> even saving at uvlo is fine to me, and i store them in ram
[13:14:34] <N1njaneer> woodyj21: eeprom is generally very scarce and very slow. Program flash is abundant. You just need to be aware that when storing strings which are not every going to be modified that you need to use the PROGMEM keyword, which forces them to ONLY go in to flash. Else if you don't, they'll automatically be copied to RAM at the start of your code and eat up valuable space in a hurry. Then you're
[13:14:34] <N1njaneer> suddenly out of RAM and don't know why :)
[13:14:54] <N1njaneer> +ever going
[13:15:25] <N1njaneer> Alas, the downsides of Harvard architecture
[13:15:29] <woodyj21> N1njaneer: k. I'm still sorting out exactly how it works. what you said makes sence.
[13:15:44] <woodyj21> i think i was getting SRAM / EEPROM confused in this case
[13:16:04] <woodyj21> PROGMEM = only in flash, don't put into SRAM
[13:16:13] <N1njaneer> Yeah, Program Flash, SRAM, and EEPROM are all seperate elements :)
[13:16:18] <woodyj21> gotcha
[13:16:19] <N1njaneer> Correct
[13:16:54] <N1njaneer> Any anything in PROGMEM you need to resolve using a pointer and the convenience functions that will dereference the pointer out of flash, instead of dereferencing straight out of RAM
[13:16:56] <hypermagic> and 1 address.... sooo lame
[13:16:57] <hypermagic> :)
[13:17:43] <hypermagic> how could possibly one think about using one linear address for more different storage devices
[13:17:49] <N1njaneer> For tiny applcations, though, you can always just throw stuff in RAM, see if it all fits. If it does, you're done, and you don't have to complicate things :)
[13:18:51] <N1njaneer> hypermagic: The joys of flat-mapped memory spaces and IO in devices large enough to support doing so. Makes things REALLY easy.
[13:19:16] <hypermagic> N1njaneer, if only a few bytes to be written in config then it can be stored in sram and if powersupply voltage is sensed and is going down it may be stored to flash or eeprom, what do you think ?
[13:29:12] <N1njaneer> That's an unreliable way to do it. Just store in flash/eeprom outright.
[13:29:23] <hypermagic> why unreliable ?
[13:29:29] <hypermagic> i have storage capacitor
[13:29:52] <hypermagic> it will power the device if you pull the plug for x time
[13:30:49] <N1njaneer> Because when power is going down, you will eventually get undefined behaviour. Unless you can guarantee it will ALWAYS finish the writes in the correct amount of time, irrespective of interrupts, timing, tasks, as well as changing RC time constants due to aging of components, temperature variance, etc. It's just not a reccomended way to do things if there's an alternative method.
[17:05:04] <vulu> orfix: lebes. Fin sakn?
[17:05:57] <vulu> orfix: you should use tor. I live in an islamic country too. Some things said here are illegal.
[17:07:24] <vulu> orfix: we've had bloggers killed here. You should consider using tor.
[17:08:11] <vulu> orfix: also warning, there might exist sources or references to actual knowledge in this network. Education and death are closely related in our world.
[17:08:14] <vulu> u there bro?
[17:08:48] <Tom_itx> maybe somebody got him already
[17:08:59] <vulu> Pull one joke about the dog mohammed and you're dead orfix. Use tor.
[17:09:12] <vulu> would actually not surprise me
[17:10:28] <Tom_itx> conversations in this channel are usually pretty safe and on topic
[17:10:33] <vulu> I really can't express my hate hard enough for the world I live in. It's off topic, but still, screw the harry potter quran and the medieval values we have here.
[17:11:02] <Tom_itx> buy a one way ticket somewhere else
[17:11:09] <vulu> the ignorance is so hard here that my brain is melting. I love the internet
[17:11:21] <vulu> I will, when I'm done with my education
[17:11:43] <Tom_itx> try russia
[17:11:58] <vulu> I'll dump a bunch of Richard Dawkins books somewhere and never come back.
[17:12:10] <vulu> Russia is far greater than the place I live in.
[17:12:52] <vulu> it's so crappy that you don't even hear about it in the news, because it's so low in its standards.
[17:13:22] <vulu> from birth do death, all you hear about is god this and god that.
[17:13:31] <vulu> Who made the apples? God did
[17:14:30] <vulu> Evolution theory, one of the best things I've learned in my whole life. Can you believe that its actually illegal to talk about it here? Game over I say... this country lack brain cells.
[17:14:51] <vulu> God bless my parent for being rich enough to have internet.
[17:15:04] <spybert> most of the world is like that
[17:15:07] <vulu> and god bless the tor guys :3
[17:15:14] <vulu> also, screw god :p
[17:16:00] <vulu> spybert: yeah, but we have death penalty on it. They will easily sentence you for blasphemy
[17:16:52] <vulu> needless to say that they ban books here. I have to encrypt them
[17:17:35] <spybert> sounds pretty bad. unfortunate that so many abuse religion.
[17:17:37] <vulu> I get a daily headache because of this country. One day.. I don't care to where.. I'll be gone.
[17:18:02] <vulu> spybert: not much to expect from some medieval man made religion
[17:18:32] <spybert> The really funny thing about it though is that they cripple their efforts to fight the west by suppressing technology
[17:18:57] <vulu> LOL yes. I've thought about that. Oh the hubris
[17:19:15] <vulu> and everything that goes wrong is the wests fault
[17:19:25] <vulu> I just can't stand it
[17:20:35] <vulu> I can't for my life see how the west prevents the government here from doing such a simple thing as putting up litter bins. They can't even do that.
[17:20:44] <vulu> people throw trash on the ground
[17:20:55] <vulu> meanwhile it's illegal to spit on the ground in japan
[17:21:23] <spybert> I wondered for a long time why they did so poorly as terrorists, failing to utilize the only weapons that might make them successful
[17:22:14] <vulu> I really can't understand the narcissism in this country. It's the religion I think. People here think that they're "clean". I'm talking about the more conservative people.
[17:22:23] <vulu> spybert: what weapons?
[17:22:44] <spybert> But then I realized that they would need to think creatively and understand biology, chemistry, etc to manufacture effective weapons.
[17:23:42] <spybert> Chemical and biological weapons, used in creative ways, are obvious chooses for terrorists with limited resources. Everyone in the west has been wondering why such things havent appeared.
[17:24:35] <spybert> It`s obvious to me now that the religious mindset explains it. Reason and creativity are suppressed
[17:24:57] <vulu> that won't happen. Education, scary stuff. We're the inventors of algebra blah blah blah (which someone would figure out anyway some day), so we don't need think (I'm sarcastic).
[17:25:23] <vulu> spybert: yep
[17:28:47] <vulu> some guy in some country made some basic algebraic expressions long time ago and now every muslim takes credit for it. We're the best and western knowledge is just an atheistic world view because they want to sin or whatever.... my brain is melting. the ignorace
[17:29:03] <spybert> hehe
[17:29:38] <vulu> dunning kruger irony.
[17:29:43] <spybert> believe me when I tell you that there are some christian fundamentalists who are just as warped. The difference is that they dont run things
[17:30:12] <vulu> spybert: yeah, I've seen those on youtube :p. Trust me, you do not want them to rule
[17:30:47] <vulu> at least you've get past all the violence. Christianity, as it is now in most of the world is a lot calmer
[17:31:18] <vulu> I think there are some neighbour christian countries here that are a bit crazy though. They hunt witches and stuff
[17:31:33] <spybert> yes, old and stable in its dying days
[17:32:17] <vulu> they can keep praying to air here... I'm tired of it and won't waste my life on whatever it is they're doing. I want to do actual stuff.
[17:33:04] <vulu> that's nice. Most doesn't seem to take them seriously in the west.
[17:33:14] <spybert> Good luck on getting out. I met a lot of engineers in industry who fled from places like Iran to work in the US
[17:33:29] <vulu> lucky them
[17:33:34] <vulu> thanks
[17:58:06] <hypermagic> N1njan33r, i was thinking about measuring the input votlage with adc ;) also it is possible to measure before a diode so if input power feed is terminated, i immediatly know.
[18:02:43] <vsync> how low of a forward voltage can white leds go?
[18:02:56] <vsync> well, how low do they come
[18:04:47] <hypermagic> back
[18:08:49] <vulu> vsync: it depends on the component. Check the data sheet.
[18:08:59] <vulu> vsync: size of the component should matter for example.
[18:09:10] <vsync> vulu yeah, i was asking more of a ballpark figure
[18:09:24] <vsync> seems like >3V anyway
[18:11:23] <Lambda-Aurigae> vsync, around 3.5V usually, give or take depending on the LED.
[18:11:55] <Lambda-Aurigae> which is why many little flashlights use 3AAA batteries instead of 2AA
[18:12:16] <Lambda-Aurigae> those that use 2AA usually have a boost converter.
[18:14:11] <vsync> found a white led with min 2.55 Vf min.
[18:14:14] <vsync> hmmh
[18:14:22] <Lambda-Aurigae> there are lower ones.
[18:14:25] <vsync> driving this with 3v is still going to be dodgy af
[18:14:27] <Lambda-Aurigae> obviously.
[18:14:43] <Lambda-Aurigae> yeah..you put the current limit resistor in and it's gonna be iffy..
[18:14:57] <vsync> it would just have to be super accurate
[18:15:06] <vsync> but, a bad design
[18:16:31] <vsync> hhmmmmmm
[18:16:43] <vsync> i have an alternative way though
[18:19:04] <vsync> however the manufacturer has a 0.6V margin on Vf, makes this calculation even trickier
[18:19:26] <hypermagic> vsync, usually 3V is minium for usefulness, and it depends on temperature
[18:19:37] <hypermagic> more like 3.5-4V
[18:19:58] <hypermagic> a buck or boost converter is the best to drive them
[18:20:59] <vsync> i'm very aware of this
[18:21:49] <hypermagic> actually white leds are usually a blue led that excites phosphor
[18:22:12] <hypermagic> you can use red + green + blue led to mix white light
[18:22:38] <vsync> ...
[18:22:42] <Lambda-Aurigae> use a red LED and a dye converter!
[18:22:57] <hypermagic> haha that will be too inefficient
[18:23:10] <Lambda-Aurigae> only need a few hundred watts to get a decent flashlight!
[18:23:58] <hypermagic> green lazerpointer works like that
[18:24:10] <vsync> how do you think an rgb led helps?
[18:24:15] <hypermagic> it uses frequency doubler cavity
[18:24:23] <vsync> idiotic...
[18:24:40] <Lambda-Aurigae> vsync, nono...a red, a green, and a blue....
[18:24:43] * Lambda-Aurigae ducks and runs.
[18:24:51] <vsync> you oughta
[18:24:52] <hypermagic> ;>
[18:25:08] <hypermagic> i use a boost converter :P
[18:25:22] <vsync> yeah, i haven't got the luxury of using one
[18:25:26] <Lambda-Aurigae> we need mini carbon arc lamps for good white light.
[18:25:28] <hypermagic> my white led shines at 0.9V
[18:26:01] <hypermagic> Lambda-Aurigae, not that bad idea, let's take a carbon nanotube, and put it in vacuum
[18:26:21] <hypermagic> carbon arc lamp, or hot filament
[18:26:29] <Lambda-Aurigae> arc dangit...ARC!
[18:26:53] <Lambda-Aurigae> something you can use to do temporary(or not so temporary if used too long) spot sunburns.
[18:26:59] <hypermagic> it will however be dangerous without filtering
[18:27:17] <vsync> i could however make a charge pump
[18:27:25] <hypermagic> maybe.
[18:27:35] <hypermagic> or boost converter
[18:27:35] <Lambda-Aurigae> vsync, charge pump ~ boost converter..
[18:27:47] <hypermagic> one inductor, one diode, one capacitor, and one bs-170 n-fet
[18:28:00] <hypermagic> and maybe a resistor for sensing led current
[18:28:27] <vsync> Lambda-Aurigae: yeah, but without a separate ic
[18:28:30] <vsync> would save space
[18:28:47] <vsync> running out of pwm though
[18:29:29] <hypermagic> sqrt(-1) is cool
[18:30:13] <vsync> wouldn't even really need a fet
[18:30:18] <Lambda-Aurigae> I prefer sqrt(-1)/0
[18:30:41] <hypermagic> well io pin is quite weak, 4mA +- ?
[18:30:59] <vsync> 20
[18:31:04] <hypermagic> that is tops
[18:31:21] <vsync> well, led's specced at 10 anyway
[18:31:26] <vsync> max.
[18:31:28] <hypermagic> hm
[18:31:44] <hypermagic> though if you want more leds you may overheat or melt internal wiring in mcu
[18:32:01] <hypermagic> it will be something like 75-150mA total current
[18:32:44] <hypermagic> sounds too good to be able to use every single pin at 20mA
[18:33:34] <vsync> iirc, 200 mA max io current, 20 mA max per pin
[18:34:29] <vsync> where the hell are you pulling your 75-150
[18:34:53] <hypermagic> those are my design limits
[18:35:03] <hypermagic> from memory
[18:35:17] <hypermagic> but i usually consider using fets
[18:35:35] <vsync> it's amazing how you sidetrack
[18:35:58] <hypermagic> i prefer my currents sideflowing in external fets
[18:36:49] <hypermagic> i can also add current limit, and i do it if appropriate
[21:48:17] <hypermagic> Richard Stallman: We're heading for a total disaster
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFMMXRoSxnA
[21:48:18] <hypermagic> :)
[22:03:52] <Thrashbarg> hypermagic: the presenter is a twat
[22:24:52] <hypermagic> nice! waving bridge: Scary! Massive waves on huge road bridge send Volgograd drivers asphalt surfing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEQrt_w7gN4
[22:39:59] <timemage> Thrashbarg, he seems okay until around 14 minutes or so.
[22:40:06] <Thrashbarg> yea
[22:40:45] <hypermagic> but he was not trolling at least
[22:40:59] <hypermagic> idiot reporters are everywhere
[22:41:04] <timemage> nah, he's just being numb. it's like talking to a drunk.
[23:30:55] <vsync> i'd take stallman over dawkins any day of the week
[23:31:01] <vsync> without even being religious
[23:39:34] <anonnumberanon> Lost my freaking IMU today. $40 in the hole.
[23:41:08] <Thrashbarg> bah
[23:42:17] <anonnumberanon> No a teammate was supposed to do a demo with it next week. We got a hand me down one that is actually 2 boards, hard to identify (probably bad stuff).
[23:43:41] <anonnumberanon> We got this shield as a replacement/hand me down part.
[23:43:44] <anonnumberanon> http://www.aeroquadstore.com/AeroQuad_Shield_v1_9_p/aq1-119.htm
[23:44:58] <hypermagic> BREAKING NEWS Santa Captured By ISIS, no christmas this year!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9BZOMUht68