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[03:00:28] <rootB> Is rue around here?
[10:21:13] <apo_> Hmm, I can make this whole thing daisy chainable pretty easily
[10:22:16] <apo_> use i2c, just connect those together, and when the n-th client has enumerated with the master it enables the (n+1)-th client's VCC :)
[10:22:42] <LeoNerd> Hah
[10:22:46] <LeoNerd> I had never considered that
[10:23:02] <apo_> Needs four wires (SDA, SCL, VCC, GND)
[10:23:38] <apo_> each client just needs some attiny, a decoupling cap, and a cheap FET
[10:23:47] <apo_> and whatever sensor I want to attach
[10:23:59] <LeoNerd> VCCin, VCCout surely?
[10:24:24] <apo_> I'll have two sockets
[10:25:57] <LeoNerd> In practice, I doubt this would work for too long a chain.. the voltage drop across all those FETs will have a detremental effect on VCC by the end
[10:26:25] <LeoNerd> You might be better off with a 2-wire I²C bus + 1-in-1-out serial configuration chain bus, for setting device IDs
[10:27:08] <apo_> Why another bus for IDs?
[10:27:38] <apo_> If this is just about the dropping voltage, it's easier to use one extra wire to connect to the next device's RESET
[10:28:09] <apo_> In practice I won't be able to use too many devices anyway, since I only have two feet :D
[10:32:09] <apo_> Heck, for now I'll only build one
[10:32:23] <apo_> but it's nice to build a bit more generic stuff
[10:32:58] <LeoNerd> I think it's a cute idea; the auto-configuration of bus IDs has often struck me as a weak point in I²C's design
[10:33:58] <apo_> yeah
[10:34:03] <apo_> took me forever to come up with a solution
[10:35:15] <LeoNerd> Most interesting chips dedicate a couple of pins to setting address bits. I think if everyone had a CONF_IN / CONF_OUT pair, and did that special one-shot configuration message, that would solve it
[10:35:42] <LeoNerd> on CONF_IN low->hi, wait for a special I²C message giving your own address, then raise your own CONF_OUT.
[10:36:03] <LeoNerd> System configuration then becomes MCU raises its own CONF_OUT pin, then writes a sequence of addresses to set them in daisy-chain order
[10:36:46] <LeoNerd> If you wanted to use only a single pin, provide CONF_OUT and have the previous chip control your own VCC
[10:44:24] <apo_> that sounds nice too
[10:45:13] * twnqx looks at apo_
[10:45:18] <twnqx> you look familiar.
[10:46:46] <apo_> twnqx: Nope
[10:50:44] <twnqx> leonerd: kind of like the new 2821 LED drivers from world semi? :>
[10:51:02] <LeoNerd> Where do you suppose I got the idea? ;)
[11:08:04] * LeoNerd sends email to Atmel asking for a download of just the AVR "part info" XML files...
[11:08:12] <LeoNerd> I'm fully expecting them to say "No", but hey.. at least I asked
[11:09:05] <LeoNerd> http://pastie.org/private/fa7eyvmaq86e9phutkv3q <== if anyone cares
[11:10:31] <LeoNerd> (also I fail at email address redaction. oops)
[11:28:25] <twnqx> better than me
[11:28:40] <twnqx> i once posted a screenshot with full credit card info, including cvv and address etc
[11:28:51] <LeoNerd> Ooooops
[11:29:06] <twnqx> but i had redacted out the email address
[11:29:34] <LeoNerd> Hah
[11:51:59] <Jartza> this is crazy
[11:52:05] <Jartza> 3000 blog post readers in 2 days
[11:52:10] <Jartza> for a single post :D
[12:06:12] <twnqx> be lucky your blog isn't slashdotted :P
[12:06:45] <Jartza> twnqx: fortunately it's not, but it's 2nd on reddit /r/programming
[12:06:51] <Jartza> http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/
[12:06:59] <Jartza> that still generates quite a lot of traffic
[12:16:22] <apo_> LeoNerd: (hobbyist)
[12:17:02] <LeoNerd> apo_: Yes, thanks for being about the 20th person to point that out ;)
[12:17:28] <apo_> LeoNerd: Yow.
[14:37:35] <hetii> Hi
[14:37:36] <hetii> :)
[14:40:43] <LeoNerd> Hello
[14:46:11] <Jartza> 'all
[14:46:16] <Jartza> oops.
[14:46:21] <Jartza> hello, all :)
[18:13:23] <apo_> LeoNerd:
http://wiki.fablab-bayreuth.de/projekte:usb-midi-controller did a little initial writeup :)
[18:15:19] <LeoNerd> Anthoer 32U4
[18:15:23] <LeoNerd> *Another
[18:15:43] <apo_> It's what I've got lying around :p
[18:16:00] <LeoNerd> Ooh, cute
[18:16:25] <apo_> Hmm?
[18:16:39] <LeoNerd> The general setup. Looks nice
[18:16:44] <apo_> Thank you :)
[18:18:06] <apo_> I wouldn't even need to change the structure to also allow MIDI-OUT. That would just have the host change to master mode for a bit and send to address 0
[18:29:00] * LeoNerd idly ponders trying out KiCad
[18:29:06] <LeoNerd> Anyone know how it compares with Eagle?
[18:29:42] <Lambda_Aurigae> KiCad is good. Eagle is a bit more complete.
[18:29:51] <LeoNerd> Ah.. what's missing in KiCad?
[18:29:56] <Lambda_Aurigae> Eagle free is rather limited where KiCad doesn't have the limitations.
[18:30:05] <LeoNerd> I'm just trying to consider between buying Eagle, or switching to KiCad
[18:30:05] <aandrew> stable releases are really all that hold me back from tryign it out
[18:30:19] <aandrew> I've been an eagle user for over 10y
[18:30:19] <LeoNerd> I want to sell some boards, see.. so the free Eagle won't do any more
[18:30:21] <Lambda_Aurigae> hard to put a finger on as the interfaces are kinda different. I would say Eagle has more parts libs out there.
[18:30:35] <LeoNerd> Eh.. I've ended up mostly making parts library things anyway
[18:30:40] <Lambda_Aurigae> so install KiCad and try it...it is free after all.
[18:30:51] <LeoNerd> Yah.. I guess I could just play with it
[18:31:20] <Lambda_Aurigae> that's kinda one of the reasons eagle has the free version.
[18:31:35] <LeoNerd> Mmm.. true
[18:31:52] <Lambda_Aurigae> get you hooked on their product so you will buy it when you run into the freebie wall.
[18:32:06] <LeoNerd> hehe
[18:32:14] <Lambda_Aurigae> like the drug dealers.
[18:32:33] <Lambda_Aurigae> give you your first couple of hits free to get you hooked then sell to you once you can't live without it.
[18:32:41] <LeoNerd> Hah!
[18:35:40] <aandrew> Lambda_Aurigae: altium is trying that too
[18:35:43] <LeoNerd> That said... Eagle licence is GBP 50.. I can make that in... to be honest not -that- long an amount of time. Most likely less time it would take to learn KiCad to the saem degree
[18:36:11] <LeoNerd> So it's not -that- much of a concern
[18:36:40] <Lambda_Aurigae> so whatever works for you.
[18:36:41] <aandrew> there's also upverter, but I won't do cloud so I ahve no experience with it
[18:36:45] <aandrew> a friend of mine works for them
[18:36:47] <Lambda_Aurigae> if you know it and are comfortable with it, go for it.
[18:37:18] <Lambda_Aurigae> if I did commercial board development I would probably buy eagle.
[18:39:37] <LeoNerd> It's not -exactly- commerical. More a hobby, but I want to sell them as well, just to recover some of the cost of having to get boards created in threes
[18:39:45] <LeoNerd> I doubt I'll make much of a profit on it
[18:42:45] <Lambda_Aurigae> have you looked at dirt cheap pcbs?
[18:43:05] <Lambda_Aurigae> http://dirtypcbs.com/
[18:43:56] <LeoNerd> Ooooh, though KiCad can't export as Eagle .brd, which is what oshpark like taking as upload
[18:44:54] <Tom_itx> send the gerber files
[18:45:21] <Tom_itx> i never sent them .brd files
[18:45:45] <Lambda_Aurigae> I love dirtypcbs protopack...you get 10, give or take 2 or 3 boards...10x10cm for 25 dollars..5x5cm for 14 dollars.
[18:49:36] <twnqx> lol @ 1-8+ weeks.
[18:50:01] <twnqx> (shipping time)
[18:50:24] <twnqx> interesting
[18:50:34] <twnqx> shipping to china is 1-8 weeks via kong kong airmail.
[18:52:36] <Lambda_Aurigae> they strap the boards to random cormorants and send them your way.
[18:52:39] <Lambda_Aurigae> that's why you lose some.
[19:04:00] <aandrew> I use hackvana whenever possible. great quality and price, similar deals and a super helpful channel on irc
[19:22:16] <hackvana> Plus he's in here sometimes :-)
[19:23:25] <Lambda_Aurigae> naaa
[19:23:34] <Lambda_Aurigae> we never see that hackvana dude around here.
[19:24:16] <hackvana> I heard he smells funny.
[19:24:36] <Lambda_Aurigae> and he's ugly and his mother dresses him in girls clothes.
[19:24:49] <hackvana> He can almost do that himself now.
[19:25:09] <Lambda_Aurigae> woah....dressing himself in girls clothes all by himself.
[19:25:10] <hackvana> Good thing is he has his own IRC channel (#hackvana) and most of the horror is thankfully contained over there.
[19:25:15] <hackvana> I know right?
[19:26:11] <Lambda_Aurigae> then there is that other issue....oh man.
[19:26:47] <Lambda_Aurigae> me on the other hand...I'm just beyond help.
[19:28:42] <hackvana> Lambda_Aurigae: That other issue, well, we just don't talk about that one. Best we don't mention it eh?
[19:29:02] <hackvana> abcminiuser: You in Melbourne? Coming on Friday?
[19:29:04] <Lambda_Aurigae> yeah...no cure for it either so,,,
[19:29:23] <hackvana> Cure? That hackvana guys practices! In front of a mirror!
[19:29:37] <hackvana> Won't somebody think of the children.
[19:34:53] <abcminiuser> Hey hackvana, I have work Friday :*
[19:34:56] <abcminiuser> * :(
[19:35:15] <hackvana> abcminiuser: I'm sorry to hear that. The gang will miss you.
[19:35:30] <abcminiuser> Yeah :(
[19:35:41] <abcminiuser> Oh well, there will be future meetups
[19:35:56] <abcminiuser> Did you hear I scored a Fiancee last weekend?
[19:36:12] <Lambda_Aurigae> man, wish I could go to Melbourne!
[19:36:21] <Lambda_Aurigae> can't afford the 2000 dollar plane ticket though.
[19:45:58] <hackvana> abcminiuser: Congratulations!
[19:46:15] <hackvana> Fine lady! Anyone who will bake a cake for you is clearly a keeper.
[19:46:28] <abcminiuser> Yeah, that sold it for me...
[19:46:57] <Lambda_Aurigae> abcminiuser, my condolences....soon you will be married...then it will be all over...
[19:47:08] <Lambda_Aurigae> marriage is great.
[19:48:51] <abcminiuser> Hah, mixed opinions from everyone I'd told
[19:49:07] <Lambda_Aurigae> I've been married 3 times.
[19:49:16] <Lambda_Aurigae> It's fun.
[19:50:46] <abcminiuser> Oh :S
[19:50:47] <hackvana> Lambda_Aurigae's trying to collect the whole set.
[19:50:53] <abcminiuser> Third time's the charm?
[19:51:07] <Lambda_Aurigae> yeah..has been so far.
[19:51:11] <Lambda_Aurigae> 12+ years.
[19:51:14] <Lambda_Aurigae> no kids.
[19:51:23] <abcminiuser> Sounds perfect :P
[19:51:27] <hackvana> That's your secret?
[19:51:35] <Lambda_Aurigae> that's my secret.
[19:51:43] <Lambda_Aurigae> no kids, so I get to buy toys for myself.
[19:51:48] <Lambda_Aurigae> sometimes.
[19:51:51] <hackvana> Now I see where I went wrong.
[19:52:08] <Lambda_Aurigae> children are a sexually transmitted disease...and usually fatal.
[19:52:33] <hackvana> Insanity is hereditary.
[19:52:47] <abcminiuser> Bacon is tasty.
[19:52:54] <hackvana> You get it from your kids.
[19:53:03] <abcminiuser> Thus ends all pearls of wisdom from the human race.
[19:54:04] <hackvana> Everything else is derived?
[20:20:29] <reportingsjr> what would you guys recommend for an avr ISP programmer for <$20?
[20:21:09] <abcminiuser> That's always a worrying question - those seeking the super cheap ones usually don't know how to troubleshoot them when they don't work
[20:21:11] <N1njaneer> reportingsjr: Spend $35USD and get the ATMEL-ICE which does ISP, JTAG, SWD for both AVR and ARM devices :)
[20:22:45] <reportingsjr> N1njaneer: Any idea if that works well with linux?
[20:23:15] <N1njaneer> It probably won't work at all sicne I don't believe there are drivers for it outside of Windows, but abcminiuser could probably answer that better :)
[20:23:52] <abcminiuser> It's standard HID
[20:24:05] <abcminiuser> IIRC there's basic support in AVRDUDE, but don't quote me
[20:24:11] <abcminiuser> It's a CMSIS DAP compliant device
[20:25:23] <reportingsjr> abcminiuser: I can't really afford to pay more than that unfortunately.
[20:26:09] <N1njaneer> Get one from TomITX, then. I hear his are nice, and he's on here and can support them.
[20:26:43] <abcminiuser> Some idiot wrote the firmware for them tho
[20:45:05] <apo_> abcminiuser: Figured out a lot of the rest about my project today :)
[20:45:12] <apo_> abcminiuser:
http://wiki.fablab-bayreuth.de/projekte:usb-midi-controller :D
[20:50:45] <abcminiuser> apo neato!
[20:50:55] <abcminiuser> Congrats
[20:51:00] <apo_> thanks
[20:51:37] <apo_> Just missing the most important part still
[20:51:40] <apo_> the actual pedal
[20:51:41] <apo_> :D
[21:32:03] <apo_> pff
[21:33:02] <apo_> there you go feeling pretty good about yourself, and then you see that the guy who's written the complete USB framework for your microcontroller's just as old as you are \o/
[21:33:33] <N1njaneer> Everyone's gotta start somewhere :)
[22:32:19] * abcminiuser strokes gray beard