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[09:09:03] <Getty> somehere already did something with RS485? probably more specific with the MAX34xx series?
[09:09:40] <LeoNerd> I've done some but only as DMX512
[09:10:06] <Getty> i am totally confused about what i have todo
[09:10:35] <Getty> i got the "set" in front of me, 2 machines connected via MAX3490E
[09:10:52] <Getty> and if i put both sides on the same baudrate then i get the same garbage back in both direction ;)
[09:10:55] <Getty> so i see there is "a link"
[09:11:12] <Getty> but i feel like i must do something specific so that its not garbage (if i make them differnet baudrate the garbage gets random to both sides somehow)
[13:08:04] <tpw_rules> stupid questions incoming that i could research but i'm too lazy: ISRs start with interrupts disabled right
[13:11:24] <Kev> interuppts are disabled by default if that's your question
[13:11:31] <Kev> interrupts *
[13:12:16] <LeoNerd> Though avr-gcc+avr_libc has a way to request them be reënabled in the prologue
[14:00:25] <nn7> I have a PCB which is a microcontroller and 10 LEDs. I only have two of the LEDs soldered up. I wrote a program to blink the LEDs on and off but it doesn't do anything.
[14:00:28] <nn7> Here's the code:
http://pastebin.com/B39JmPkR
[14:00:44] <nn7> I've probed the pins with a scope and they're not toggling.
[14:01:14] <nn7> but I did accidentally try to program the system while the power was disconnected from the microcontroller.
[14:01:50] <nn7> The programming didn't work, as expected, but when I turned the power on, the LEDs were on!
[14:02:32] <nn7> the pins were toggling.
[14:03:14] <nn7> it seems a power reset is required before the program starts.
[14:05:30] <nn7> If I disconnect the programmer (AVRISP MKII), I get pulses every 68ms. If I reconnect the programmer, I get pulses every 12 us.
[15:46:36] <blocky> are the letters after attiny88 in attiny88-au and attiny88-pu just the packaging? why do some have 32 pins and some 28? does the PDIP have less pins?
[15:57:02] <Tom_itx> pu is dip iirc
[15:57:41] <nn7> lol
[16:03:26] <blocky> Tom_itx: yeah i was just wondering why the dip gets 4 less pins
[16:03:39] <blocky> 4 gpio pins from the datasheet, apparently
[16:03:51] <Tom_itx> just packaging
[16:04:23] <Tom_itx> just what happens when you're a dip
[16:05:35] <Jartza> http://blogs.canoe.ca/canoetech/in-the-news/new-digital-wondertag-started-as-a-joke/
[16:05:41] <Jartza> hi ;)
[16:14:56] <LeoNerd> Oops. Just dropped an 0603 on the floor. I suspect I'm unlikely to get that back
[16:15:50] <Jartza> :D
[16:15:56] <Jartza> that might be a tricky thing to find
[16:16:02] <Jartza> I lost one into my macbooks air vents
[16:16:11] <Jartza> I'm hoping nothing bad comes out of it
[16:23:06] * LeoNerd turns the iron up to 380
[16:26:00] <malinus> Jartza: oh, gratz
[16:28:16] <malinus> Jartza: I like the communication
[16:29:09] <Tom_itx> LeoNerd did you get it from china?
[16:29:17] <Tom_itx> you could use a geiger counter if you did
[16:29:38] <malinus> Jartza: good luck with the gogo
[16:29:50] <LeoNerd> Tom_itx: Hah... It's a resistor, I don't care.. costs like, 2p
[16:34:00] <blocky> so if i want to use an attiny88 in diptrace, what is the easiest part to modify? atmega88? it seems quite a few pins have different names
[16:35:36] <LeoNerd> If diptrace is anything like Eagle, personally I'd just make a new one
[16:36:04] <LeoNerd> (in Eagle at least it's easy enough - drop $N-pin symbol, drop $N-pin package shape, click "connect" button to wire up logical signals to physical pins)
[16:37:22] <blocky> well then i have to name all the pins too though
[16:37:34] <blocky> looks like roughly half have the same names as atmega88
[16:38:05] <Jartza> malinus: thanks, although to be realistic, I don't expect much ;)
[16:38:11] <Jartza> but our marketing wanted to try it out
[16:39:53] <malinus> Jartza: it's somehow intersting that the inventor doesn't seem to be the person in the center of the video, but some marketing guy ;P
[16:41:02] <Jartza> there's no marketing guy
[16:41:06] <Jartza> it's our ceo and me
[16:41:31] <malinus> I see
[16:42:02] <LeoNerd> Crapsticks.. now I've dropped a SOT-23, and I kinda want that back. I don't have many spare
[16:42:08] <Jartza> we actually only have one marketing person, that's Jennifer, not on video :)
[16:42:19] <Jartza> and she's not even fulltime, but basically a "marketing consultant"
[16:42:34] <blocky> wow diptrace doesn't even seem to have a 28qfp
[16:42:49] <Jartza> LeoNerd: ouch. better pliers for you?
[16:43:56] <LeoNerd> Jartza: I have some nice good tweezers here.. it pinged off them
[16:44:31] <Jartza> know that feeling too
[16:44:56] <Jartza> I spent some money to german wiha tweezers which should be esd safe and antistatic
[16:45:06] <Jartza> and the parts always get stuck to them
[16:45:07] <Jartza> :(
[16:47:20] <LeoNerd> Give thme a good rubbing with IPA
[16:47:50] <Jartza> tried that too
[16:47:59] <Jartza> I have no idea why parts stuck to them
[16:48:26] <Jartza> it's like there's a supertiny sucktion cup there or something :D
[16:50:52] <malinus> Jartza: do everything stick to them? (small enough)?
[16:51:04] <Jartza> yes
[16:51:19] <Jartza> especially parts smaller than 1016
[16:52:41] <Jartza> good thing is, parts almost never fly off of them
[16:53:00] <malinus> haha, but that renders them useless
[16:53:03] <Jartza> bad thing is, parts placed on top of solder paste won't stick to the paste, but the pliers
[16:53:26] <Jartza> yes. instead I use some cheap'n'crappy chinese ones :D
[16:53:43] <Jartza> just annoying spending money to something that should be good and isn't
[16:55:47] <tpw_rules> on power on, is any hardware state guaranteed? like all hw regs are zeros or something
[16:55:54] <tpw_rules> or interrupts are disabled
[16:58:12] <Jartza> on what chip?
[16:58:37] <tpw_rules> atmega328p right now
[16:58:43] <tpw_rules> but i'll be doing it on an attiny eventually
[17:03:09] <Jartza> well, all the registers are set to their "initial values", which can be found from datasheet
[17:03:42] <Jartza> for example attiny85:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8m5e83btaa23cw8/Screenshot%202014-11-27%2000.43.38.png?dl=0
[17:03:59] <Jartza> PORTB and DDRB bits are all set to 0
[17:04:11] <Jartza> same should be found from atmega datasheet too
[17:04:45] <Jartza> I'm not aware of any "all avrs guaranteed state", it's better to check the datasheet always
[17:04:57] <Jartza> but the "initial value" is what you're looking for
[17:38:47] <Guest26779> curious is there a universal chip programming protocal that most of the programmable chips support the 99% of them
[17:38:56] <Guest26779> for flashing the chip
[17:39:02] <Guest26779> would it be like SCP 50% , UAURT 40% ,...
[17:39:16] <malinus> JTAG
[17:40:54] <Guest26779> that is support for any programmable chip so if one built a programmer one could make it universal to program a whole bunch of chips provide you get the voltage/current/power ratings correct
[17:41:51] <Guest26779> or is JTAG as standard power,voltage/current ratings as well or just the protocal of the data transmission of the program i.e timing , modulation ,...etc
[17:42:26] <malinus> Guest26779: what is your question though? What do you want to do?
[17:43:29] <Guest26779> does JTAG specify only the communication,modulation , and data transmission format or also the amount of volt,current, and power one should uses for the chip?
[17:44:19] <malinus> Why are you asking those questions though? You might have a goal. And telling it, might avoid an A->B problem
[17:44:51] <Guest26779> I would imagine JTAG is only the format and modulation not the amount actually power,voltage,and current rates ... so if you are trying to build a universal programmer you would also have to have a variable power supply to incorporate all the voltages,current,power ratings
[17:45:01] <Guest26779> correct me if i am wrong
[17:50:49] <Guest26779> so what would the general chip programming voltages be i would imagine 3.3 , 5 , 9 , 12 v, maybe 24volt dc
[17:51:48] <Guest26779> provide you have a power supply that supports up to 10 amps and can adjust to these different voltages it should support most of any current rattings a chip would need
[17:51:49] <malinus> you want to make a "general chip programmer"?
[17:51:51] <Guest26779> correct
[17:52:13] <Guest26779> YES for as much chips that can out and are coming out
[17:52:37] <Guest26779> and I am assuming you are correct and JTAG is the most univeral i,e used on the 99% of chips
[17:53:46] <tpw_rules> Jartza: ahh, i didn't know that was a thing. most things i work with the initial state is completely arbitrary
[17:54:07] <Guest26779> in your case what protocal do you uses
[17:56:03] <Guest26779> would i be correct an saying a power supply that supports 3.3 , 5 , 9 , 12 v, maybe 24volt dc and up to 10 amps could power or send signals to pretty much any chip on the market
[17:56:09] <Guest26779> at least that much
[17:56:28] <tpw_rules> some require negative voltage
[17:56:49] <malinus> Guest26779: if I were you, I would get as many mcu's as possible, and read the datashsheets for each and every one of them
[17:56:59] <Guest26779> yes but on can produce the negative equivalents with this as well
[17:57:11] <Guest26779> on = one
[17:57:21] <Guest26779> using a circuit
[17:58:29] <Guest26779> what i am curious of is there a min and max voltage range and amp range for for all chips that one power supply can support
[17:59:01] <tpw_rules> why don't you have like three power supplies that can be set to arbitrary voltages?
[18:00:03] <Guest26779> ok can you tell me or do you know what typically all the chips voltage,power ratings,current ratings are 2 of the 3 ranges is enough for me
[18:11:15] <Guest26779> I would imagine a 10 amp 24 volt power supply can be used with enough resistors to program any chip
[18:12:52] <Guest26779> provide you have the correct programming protocal which i am assuming JTAG is the one
[18:49:25] <nn7> how do I figure out what the ISR names are for the attiny20?
[18:53:03] <Xark> nn7: How about
http://www.nongnu.org/avr-libc/user-manual/group__avr__interrupts.html
[18:56:14] <nn7> Xark, not listed in there
[18:56:39] <Xark> nn7: Then you will have to scrape through the linker files to know for sure.
[18:56:57] <Xark> (assuming supported)
[18:57:02] <nn7> how do I do that?
[18:57:16] <Xark> ...one sec
[18:57:43] <Xark> Crap...I don't have avr toolchain on this PC. :/
[18:58:23] <Xark> But basically you look at the .a (IIRC) files under the avr tools dir (don't remember exact dir)
[18:58:33] <Xark> No, .s (asm source)
[19:00:41] <nn7> ok, thanks
[19:02:40] * Xark installs AVR stuff. :)
[19:08:50] <Xark> nn7: Ok, I was close. It looks like you want avr/include/avr and there are a bunch of *.h files for each chip (with funny names not sure which is attiny20).
[20:59:22] <tpw_rules> can an attiny85 run at 16mhz off the rc oscillator?
[21:01:59] <tpw_rules> ah yes
[21:22:44] <Xark> tpw_rules: 20Mhz even. Or more ->
http://hackaday.com/2012/01/26/sprite_tms-three-component-fm-transmitter/
[21:22:57] <tpw_rules> hah that's cool
[21:29:21] <tpw_rules> what ranges? do you know?
[21:32:57] <Xark> What do you mean?
[21:33:03] <tpw_rules> of clock frequencies
[21:33:13] <Xark> IIRC, it is spec'd up to 20Mhz on RC using PLL
[21:33:23] <Xark> However, you can overclock.
[21:33:39] <tpw_rules> and their steps too. presumably i can't have 17.3333333. i want something fairly miserly on power because the peripherals will require large quantities of current
[21:34:20] <Xark> tpw_rules: It has a fair bit of granularity, but it is RC, so not precision (and very non-linear at end of scale).
[21:34:37] <Xark> To save power, perhaps you can add sleep for interrupt?
[21:40:28] <tpw_rules> i'd be doing that
[21:40:38] <tpw_rules> but i probably don't need 16mhz fully. can i do 12 or such on RC?
[21:41:19] <Xark> I believe so. Check the data sheet for details. :)
[21:41:54] <tpw_rules> but i'm lazy. i suppose i can
[21:44:09] <Xark> I think you will have to "tune" it (like with scope or other freq measuring device).
[21:44:39] <Xark> (if you care about being close to a certain frequency - RC so it will drift too)
[21:46:00] <tpw_rules> bah i have a scope but no external reference
[21:46:27] <tpw_rules> i don't think it will matter much here though; final design will probably use an oscillator
[21:52:02] <Xark> Ok. I would think you could get it close with scope (and no reference - assume scope is not totally uncalibrated).
[21:52:08] <Xark> assuming*
[21:53:31] <tpw_rules> well the automatic program won't work i don't think then
[22:09:35] <N1njaneer> Wow, new RFID reader design actually worked first shot.
[22:09:47] <N1njaneer> When does that ever happen? O.o
[22:12:31] <Tom_L> you sure that wasn't a bug?
[22:12:39] <N1njaneer> Probably!
[22:12:42] <Valen> I freaked myself out added a whole bunch of fields to a php website thing
[22:12:46] <Valen> worked first go
[22:12:52] <Valen> not even a syntax error
[22:13:03] <N1njaneer> But it properly reads all of the different ISO band types properly :)
[22:13:12] <Valen> I felt bad for draining luck out of the world over something so trivial
[22:13:20] <N1njaneer> Valen: Awesome! Those moments are always nice to have.
[22:13:29] <N1njaneer> If only they occured when, you know, playing the lottery :D
[22:14:00] <Valen> lol yeah
[22:14:13] <Valen> or saying all the right things to the pretty girl ;->
[22:14:38] <N1njaneer> For my next trick, I need to verify that all of my LEDs work properly on these new lighting fixture boards. Atmel already identifies, time to load code and see what happens!
[22:15:09] <N1njaneer> Gotta run 120 of these on Monday, so would like to have a nice holiday weekend knowing these are 100% and ready for production.
[23:20:46] <Guest26779> curious does anybody know what the PCB boards are normally created with what material sometype of saw dust/plywood or plastic based molding
[23:20:53] <Guest26779> not talking about how they design the circuit on the board but the actual board itself
[23:20:58] <Guest26779> not the printed on com
[23:21:09] <Guest26779> ponents but the material of the board
[23:21:10] <Valen> FR4 fibreglass
[23:21:16] <Guest26779> or not the traces but the material of the board
[23:21:26] <Tom_L> FR4
[23:21:33] <Guest26779> really for all the layers
[23:24:29] <Guest26779> Is the FR4 fiberglass used to make all electronics and computer circuitboards in the industry currently for consumer electronics to industrial automation or do they uses different types of boards normally
[23:31:04] <Guest26779> what type of paint do they uses to give them the different color not the traces would any regular based spray paint do
[23:31:29] <Guest26779> provide the traces are covered up while spraying
[23:42:41] <Casper> Guest26779: FR4 is most common, but some el cheapo stuff used to be some kind of epoxied cardboard
[23:43:03] <Guest26779> Ok what about for the paint
[23:43:14] <Casper> and it's an enamel paint
[23:43:45] <Guest26779> so any enamel car paint would work
[23:45:21] <Valen> Guest26779: Try google
[23:45:22] <Casper> no
[23:46:18] <Casper> special blend that is thermally, UV and other stable, that is non-conductive, flameproof and a few other stuff
[23:47:13] <Guest26779> so one cann't get this type of paint at a sherman williams
[23:48:04] <Tom_L> someone linked some that was fairly cheap
[23:48:18] <Tom_L> no, it's UV cured
[23:55:01] <N1njaneer> Taiyo Yuden has the datasheets avaliable if you really want to see the properties :)
