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[03:56:58] <Jartza> 'allo
[07:00:49] <darsie> How susceptible are avrs to ionizing radiation, specifically uranium ore, which has alpha, beta and gamma?
[07:01:26] <darsie> Alpha won't get far enough inside, not sure about beta, and gamma probably doesn't have much effect.
[07:04:29] <Tom_itx> depends if they're in a lead box or not
[07:08:29] <darsie> No, I'd put the ore right on top of the avr.
[07:09:43] <Tom_itx> you may have to ask atmel for their radiation data on their chips
[07:12:24] <darsie> Maybe I will.
[07:12:49] <Tom_itx> i wouldnt' know where to find it on their site
[07:12:59] <darsie> Hmm, it might actually be a little relevant with a geiger counter.
[07:13:29] <Tom_itx> you could enclose the board in protection too
[07:13:45] <Tom_itx> (that was the lead comment)
[07:28:31] <MarkX> hey all
[07:28:46] <MarkX> maybe i'm misunderstanding, but lipo boosters don't increase the output voltage right?
[07:29:04] <LeoNerd> What's a lipo booster?
[07:29:26] <LeoNerd> There are things called boost regulators, which use a switchmode-like technique across an inductor to output a higher voltage than the input
[07:29:59] <MarkX> hmm i think the one i looked up is more for recovering old lipo batteries that don't work anymore
[07:32:06] <MarkX> but what i was looking for was a way to take a 3.7v lipo up to say 7.4V
[07:32:53] <LeoNerd> So, yeah.. you want a boost reg.
[07:33:17] <MarkX> ah okay
[07:33:20] <MarkX> i'll look it up no
[07:33:22] <MarkX> now
[07:33:23] <MarkX> thanks!
[07:33:37] <LeoNerd> http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/electronic-components/voltage-regulators/voltage-regulator-adj/pololu-stepup-down-regulator e.g. here is one
[07:33:47] <LeoNerd> Pololu tend to make some good ones
[07:36:32] <MarkX> lol
[07:36:41] <MarkX> i think i have a supreme misunderstanding of electronics
[07:36:41] <MarkX> XD
[07:39:53] <LeoNerd> Well, here's a good place to ask questions :)
[07:40:01] <MarkX> hehe
[07:41:08] <MarkX> well i wanted to power a couple of simple hobby dc motors using >>
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/339 <<. now that is rated at 2C but is 1000mAh. That means that the battery can discharge 1amp for one hour continuous. At 2C, 2Amps at 30 minutes.
[07:41:12] <MarkX> is that correct?
[07:45:03] <LeoNerd> What's "2C" mean here?
[08:02:36] <darsie> LeoNerd: Charge=current*time Q=I*t. 2C refers to 2*Q/h.
[08:02:51] <darsie> or so
[08:04:03] <darsie> so, for a 5 Ah battery this would mean 10 A.
[08:04:23] <darsie> 2* 5 Ah/h=10 A.
[08:08:54] <darsie> 2C is a misnomer, as C usually means capacity, but here it's a charge, but actually refers to a current.
[08:20:59] <MarkX> LeoNerd: sorry about that. got called to do some work
[08:21:13] <twnqx> yuck, work
[08:21:29] <LeoNerd> It happens
[08:21:46] <MarkX> https://www.commonsenserc.com/page.php?page=c_ratings_explained.html
[08:22:08] <MarkX> twnqx: i love it. sitting around 12 hours a day 7 days a week, doing my own stuff... until something breaks down and they cant fix it
[08:23:02] <twnqx> i kinda did that at 8/5. was okish.
[08:23:08] <MarkX> that website is actually a bad example because it does not mention the time
[08:23:49] <MarkX> basically a lipo battery has an amperage (say 1000mAh) and a C rating (say 2C). the 1000mAh means it can output 1amp for 1 hour straight
[08:24:05] <MarkX> the 2C means it can output 2Amps for 0.5 hours
[08:24:35] <MarkX> without damaging the battery
[08:24:57] <MarkX> a 1000mAh battery at 5C can output 5amps straight for 12 minutes
[08:25:01] <LeoNerd> Right... so it's technically a unit measured in /hours
[08:25:29] <MarkX> i don't know how to answer that
[08:25:43] <LeoNerd> That wasn't a question, so it doesn't need an answer :)
[08:25:46] <MarkX> and if i've said something wrong, someone please correct me cause i'm just going on it based on my understanding
[08:25:51] <MarkX> ah hehe
[08:27:01] <MarkX> but my question is, is it my motors that dictate how much current will be drawn from the batteries?
[08:27:55] <LeoNerd> Ah, in that case yes, pretty much
[08:28:52] <Shavik|Work> Any thoughts as to why my Atmel studio can no longer connect to my avr isp mk2?
[08:29:07] <Shavik|Work> It just stopped being able to connect to either programmer yesterday
[08:29:15] <Shavik|Work> I've tried restarting. different programmers, etc
[08:29:53] <Shavik|Work> The internal usb status light slowly blinks
[08:29:59] <Shavik|Work> only after I try to connect
[08:30:01] <twnqx> yes.
[08:30:07] <MarkX> ugh
[08:30:12] <MarkX> looks like i have to join a hackerspace
[08:30:14] <twnqx> downgrade from latest 6.2
[08:30:27] <twnqx> they changed how it runs avrispd.
[08:30:30] <twnqx> avrisps*
[08:30:35] <LeoNerd> I'm pondering on that too.. I have a growing collection of "interesting" equipment, but far omre that I don't have
[08:30:38] <Shavik|Work> Nothing changed. I was programming boards all week
[08:30:42] <Shavik|Work> just stopped working out of hte blue
[08:30:47] <Shavik|Work> wasn't even connected to a board at the time it stopped
[08:30:50] <twnqx> oh
[08:31:01] <Shavik|Work> I've even tried different usb ports
[08:31:03] <MarkX> i lack all basic tools :(
[08:31:33] <Shavik|Work> yea, twnqx. so its not like a driver issue or something
[08:31:53] <MarkX> looks like i'll need an oscope, power supply, volt meter that isn't crap, and maybe a signal gen...
[08:32:01] <Shavik|Work> MarkX, I learned one thing
[08:32:03] <twnqx> well, i only heard on more than one occasionm that the protocol changed
[08:32:13] <Shavik|Work> My townhome Im renting, has a floating ground
[08:32:22] <twnqx> heh
[08:32:22] <Shavik|Work> I had a benchtop power supply hooked up. and then used my rigol oscope
[08:32:27] <Shavik|Work> The power cable on the rigol
[08:32:29] <Shavik|Work> started to MELT
[08:32:32] <Shavik|Work> and caught fire
[08:32:34] <MarkX> meaning its not actually hooked to ground?
[08:32:35] <twnqx> reminds me of the surprise how i got 220V in saudi arabia
[08:32:36] <Shavik|Work> while the oscope was still running
[08:32:51] <Shavik|Work> Best I can tell there was a huge voltage differential between earth grounds
[08:32:53] <twnqx> they used 2x 110V phases, 180° phase shit, apparently
[08:32:59] <twnqx> and no ground or return.
[08:32:59] <Shavik|Work> that too
[08:33:07] <LeoNerd> Silly USians and their 2-phase
[08:33:12] <Shavik|Work> I have never known 100% what went wrong
[08:33:12] <twnqx> i WTFed massively
[08:33:21] <twnqx> on the current i could feel on my PC case
[08:33:46] <twnqx> and the fact that those test screwdrivers with lamp would light up on the chassis
[08:34:00] <twnqx> so i changed to a 110V setup.
[08:34:37] <Shavik|Work> So also in the device programming screen. it shows the programmers.. And that they are *not* disconnected
[08:34:48] <Shavik|Work> but when I hit apply, TCF (TCF command: Tool:connect failed.)
[08:34:56] <Shavik|Work> Target not detected
[08:35:12] <Shavik|Work> wait
[08:35:13] <Shavik|Work> ....................
[08:35:19] <Shavik|Work> brb, coffee
[08:35:43] <Shavik|Work> Just facepalmed so hard, I think my palm broke out the wall behind my desk
[08:36:17] <Shavik|Work> Anyway, thanks for the ideas twnqx. quite embarrassing...
[08:36:34] <MarkX> wait what did it end up being?
[08:37:00] <Shavik|Work> smh.. I dont even know why I thought it was doing it right. I was hitting apply when it wasn't connected. so of course it wouldn't load..
[08:37:48] <twnqx> **it happens
[08:42:41] <MarkX_> damn internet
[09:25:08] <nurple> hi
[09:26:07] <nurple> With the arduino dip package (atmega328p) on a breadboard, must its sketch be flashed via an ISP? Or can I keep taking the dip on and off the uno shield and back onto the breadboard.
[09:28:19] <LeoNerd> You -can- keep moving it around if you want, but the entire point of ISP is that you don't need to
[09:28:34] <LeoNerd> All that moving back and forward will stress the pins, and at some point one will snap off
[09:29:08] <nurple> I understand. I was asking if both procedures yeild the same results.
[09:29:20] <LeoNerd> Should be identical, yup
[09:29:56] <nurple> Can a logic analyzer tell me if the clock crystal is really 16Mhz ?
[09:30:21] <jadew> nurple, not really
[09:30:29] <LeoNerd> Only by exciting it and measuring the frequency, presuming it has an input that cna cope
[09:30:32] <jadew> actually, it should
[09:30:35] <nurple> or if my data is oscilating at the rate?
[09:30:55] <jadew> you can see how many clocks you had in x time and figure out the clock
[09:32:31] <jadew> what's a sketch? I remember I asked this before but I forgot
[09:33:08] <LeoNerd> "program"
[09:33:12] <LeoNerd> Weird Arduino terminology for it
[09:33:21] <jadew> LeoNerd, like the code or the compiled binary?
[09:33:35] <LeoNerd> Er.. not sure. It's a bit vague
[09:33:46] <LeoNerd> The general idea of the program, really...
[09:33:59] <jadew> so stupid...
[09:34:04] <LeoNerd> The Arduino IDE UI tries to hide that sort of thing from users, to avoid scaring them
[09:34:14] <jadew> why would anyone come up with a new name for program?
[09:34:27] <LeoNerd> You write the code and it refers to that as the "sketch", and then you press the Upload button, and it tells you it's uploading the "sketch" to the board
[09:34:50] <LeoNerd> I suppose it's there to appease the PHP and Javascript developers who are used to just writing text files and dropping them on some server and expecting that will be that
[09:35:01] <LeoNerd> Don't want to upset their fragile little mindes ;)
[09:35:05] <jadew> they still don't call them sketches
[09:35:35] <nurple> Yeah its sad.
[09:35:36] <LeoNerd> Hmm.. true
[09:36:09] <theBear> if it's a proper modern storage/computerated kinda analyzer, you'd kinda hope it can see a bit faster than 16mhz reliably methinks
[09:36:26] <nurple> I don't like how you have to use a setup() and loop() also
[09:36:26] <nurple> int main(int argc, char** argv)
[09:36:26] <nurple> well there are no args but main()
[09:36:43] <LeoNerd> Heh... *shrug* my cheap £20 Saleae clone has trouble going past 8MHz
[09:36:54] <LeoNerd> I doubt I could read 16 out of it
[09:37:10] <LeoNerd> You get what you pay for, I suppose ;)
[09:37:43] <jadew> nurple, what about main?
[09:38:22] <jadew> setup() probably sets up a bunch of stuff you don't need
[09:38:38] <jadew> and loop() -- is that a function you have to define?
[09:38:50] <jadew> are they actually doing while (1) loop(); ?
[09:40:39] <jadew> ah, so setup() is also user defined
[09:41:05] <LeoNerd> It's just to stop people getting upset if their main function returns
[09:41:22] <jadew> kinda stupid tho
[09:41:23] <LeoNerd> If you fall off the end of a real main() on AVR, the CPU just spinlocks
[09:41:39] <LeoNerd> It's a large amount of safety scissors, indeed
[09:41:57] <LeoNerd> Safety scissors are good for teaching people how first to cut out pieces of paper, but once they're OK with the general concept they can move on to a real tool
[09:41:57] <jadew> what if you want to break from the loop?
[09:42:32] <nurple> you mean loop() ?
[09:42:32] <nurple> it's a funciton. return;
[09:42:42] <jadew> nurple, that function is ran in a loop
[09:42:46] <jadew> while (1) loop();
[09:42:54] <jadew> you can't break the while() from the loop();
[09:43:08] <nurple> oh you can't
[09:43:36] <theBear> LeoNerd, i'm tired of my form-rant on why arduino (software side) is stupid, but they hide things that don't need hiding, almost encouraging the users not to get ANY grasp on how things happen... i mean, wrapping a pwm setup is not-crazy, but wrapping a write to a port, basically a portBLAH == somebytevar in a function that is something like write_to_port(BLAH, byte, needless other something) is just criminal
[09:43:54] <theBear> re: your comment about a page ago on a similar note
[09:43:54] <LeoNerd> Hah.. Yes, definitely
[09:43:59] <LeoNerd> Things like digiitalread/write are silly
[09:44:07] <LeoNerd> Doubly so, the completely pointless port renumbering
[09:44:22] <LeoNerd> As apparently people are quite happy to have pin 12, but if they had pin RB2 they'd get all upset and freak out
[09:45:10] <LeoNerd> It annoys me more, because so much of the world thinks that the only time you'd -ever- be using an AVR chip is via Arduino, so people start giving circuit diagrams only quoting the arduino pin numbers, meaning I have to back-translate it back into the real pin name
[09:45:55] <theBear> and sure, people with zero electronic OR programming skills can make an led flash in the first 5 mins, but then they try to do something that there isn't a verbatim example of somewhere, and we're the ones stuck not only trying to help them do something in a land they have NO comprehension of, but having to lookup all these stupid arduino functions wrapping stuff that couldn't possibly need wrapping less, wasting our time and patience that could otherwise
[09:45:56] <theBear> be helping and teaching the poor fools
[09:46:48] <theBear> also i'm not a big OO guy, and even moreso feel it's a bit reckless in such a VERY constrained and simple and easy to comprehend environment as an avr is
[09:47:00] <nurple> Who uses arduino and have no programming or electronic skillz?
[09:47:07] <LeoNerd> Loads of people
[09:47:11] <LeoNerd> That's how they start
[09:47:26] <LeoNerd> In fact there'll be a big workshop at LPW tomorrow, dedicated to that idea
[09:47:40] <nurple> ubuntu users.
[09:47:51] <LeoNerd> Arduino; the PHP of the microcontroller world
[09:48:04] <theBear> back in the day kids programmed lego and turtle graphics and crap in basic and logo languages just fine, LITTLE KIDS ! and they loved the learning and feeling of accomplishment that comes with a few mins of learning some of the most basic programming or algebra/variable handling skills ! and arduinos are for big people, not single-digit-age kiddies !
[09:48:21] <nurple> if AVR is to PHP, then how would you file beagle bone black?
[09:48:32] <LeoNerd> No idea, haven't seen it
[09:48:44] <theBear> nurple, hehe, but sadly it's also the horrible reality, but happily i like dark humour
[09:50:06] <theBear> aww, i don't like these super-abstract word games... i'm more of a if Cartaradon Carcarius is to Morey Eel, then Loligo Giganticus is to ....
[09:50:45] <jadew> beagle black bonner?
[09:51:01] <theBear> "ARE YOU READY TO GRIEVE !?!?! <twitch twitch>" "uuuh, i'm cartilaganeous . . . <pfft, sif you gotta ask>"
[09:51:12] <theBear> black beagle riding a bonneville ?
[09:51:24] <theBear> did i do the english language right ?
[09:51:42] <jadew> what's a beagle?
[09:52:07] <jadew> ah, it's a breed of dogs
[09:52:41] <theBear> i also don't approve of "cryptic crosswords" ... i like the concept, but the asses that write the things have no concept of consistancy or syntax... they don't just go cryptic, they go any which way they feel like to draw the most abstractly and remotely relatable stupid word
[09:53:10] <theBear> yeah, i think it's those little kinda short leg sausage dogs but with a extra droopey tummy and some kinda floppy head
[09:53:22] * LeoNerd feels we may have strayed from the original point somewhat ;)
[09:53:34] <jadew> yeah, they're cute
[09:53:43] <theBear> i only learned to love dogs when i was grown up, never got the hang of all the names, and yes, i agree with LeoNerd
[09:53:56] <theBear> but at least we got away from failing the game i don't like :)
[09:54:09] <theBear> avr is to php ? wtf
[09:54:33] <LeoNerd> I said Arduino, not AVR
[09:54:49] <theBear> beagle is jquery and a gaming machine running only a browser ? it jsut, pfft
[09:55:11] <theBear> LeoNerd, i don't mind what you said, it's the question/challenge nurple then posed
[09:56:17] <theBear> i gotta admit, i DO like php, as far as webpage writing goes, with php and css finally i can write somewhat sensible pages and normalize across a site and neatly store content and crap in dbs, rather than the mess writing an html page, even a static one, used to be
[09:57:13] <jadew> I don't like it, but what am I to use?
[09:57:15] <theBear> and every webpage written by a programmer rather than a stupid graphic and/or web designer is a win for society, stupid graphics rich flash heavy java laden crazy ass "designer" made sites, pfft
[09:57:56] <LeoNerd> Yes, but it does similar things to Arduino... it totally reshapes everything about how the world works, badly, in some vague and misguided attempt to appease some small subset of users
[09:58:08] <jadew> LeoNerd, not really
[09:58:09] <theBear> you don't like php ? pfft, what, you gonna use ruby or perl, or just compile stuff and jam it in cgi-bin like some kinda caveman working with a club on a hairy-elephant-carcass ?
[09:58:24] <LeoNerd> No, because it isn't 1995 any more ;) cgi-bin is long-dead
[09:58:46] <theBear> nah, php is like basic for webservers, and way less got-carried-away-with-itself-years-ago than python
[09:59:00] <jadew> theBear, funny you mentioned that, a few years ago I actually had the idea of making c++ based sites :D
[09:59:20] <jadew> started writing something, don't know where it went
[09:59:31] <jadew> I think that was before the qil thing
[10:00:17] <theBear> heh, according to my laziness and some odd accesses i spotted in my background tail -f serverylogs thismorning, cgi-bin still works just fine, but fortunately so do ancient htaccess logins and hardcoded compiled stuff stays pointing at non-existant long-dead machines <grin>
[10:01:33] <theBear> and apparently ancient java codebits basically JUST refreshing and insert-ing said cgibin output into an element on an ancient page can even bring a modern pc to it's knees... stupid java :)
[10:02:09] <theBear> jadew, asshat ! hajuu had crazy ideas, but at least a php shell terminal was kinda cool, c++ serverside ? no no no
[10:02:42] <theBear> then again, i heard since v5 or so that php has taken a big turn for the OO approach itself, i'm so outta touch, wtf am i in charge of the #php channel ? <grin>
[10:02:42] <jadew> theBear, I still think it's a good idea
[10:40:08] <nurple> What's the C++ of mcu's ?
[10:41:37] <LoRez> C++ typically.
[10:57:38] <N1njAway> All the C++
[10:57:40] <N1njAway> All the time
[10:59:12] <jadew> best language ever!
[11:00:24] <N1njAway> Best language ever for the purposes I need it anyways :)
[11:01:10] <jadew> well, aside from the fact that some languages are better for a specific job, it's still the best language I've ever worked with it
[11:01:14] <jadew> properly designed
[11:02:03] <N1njAway> It affords extremely good OOP and splits the difference in allowing both high-level abstraction while remaining close to the metal.
[11:02:15] <jadew> yep
[11:03:33] <jadew> you kinda expect a difference in the design quality when revisions of the language are done across several years by world class programmers
[11:05:06] <jadew> I'm still a bit bummed that they don't want to add properties with getters and setters tho
[11:05:50] <N1njAway> Hard to ensure everything is 100% compliant moving forward with new compilers, though, I suppose.
[11:06:16] <N1njAway> There are still a handful of annoying aspects even with normal C++ that sometimes need fiddling with compiler options. :)
[11:08:48] <Jartza> N1njAway:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Tagsu/322266777962066 ;)
[11:09:01] <Jartza> oops
[11:09:04] <Jartza> wrong url
[11:09:23] <Jartza> https://slack-files.com/files-pub/T02FEAMUS-F02U7JCCF-1459ea/20141107_010.jpg
[11:09:25] <Jartza> there
[11:09:28] <Jartza> now with case
[11:09:48] <jadew> is that porn on the sides?
[11:10:12] <N1njAway> Jartza: Looks good!
[11:10:24] <jadew> mp3 player?
[11:11:04] <Jartza> jadew: :D
[11:11:06] <Jartza> nope
[11:11:09] <Jartza> http://tagsu.io/
[11:11:59] <jadew> I thought that thing on the side is an audio jack
[11:12:08] <N1njAway> It's my birthday today, but I need to reschedule it to start on Sunday when vacation starts. :D
[11:12:19] <jadew> happy birthday
[11:12:46] <N1njAway> Thanks!
[11:12:59] <jadew> what did you get yourself?
[11:13:15] <jadew> (they're usually the best presents)
[11:13:59] <N1njAway> Hmm, nothing yet. Unless you count the mill earlier in the year. :D
[11:14:47] <jadew> depends how early :P I usually can't wait until my birthday and I buy something ~1 month earlier
[11:15:13] <jadew> I find it to be a good reason to get something expensive
[11:15:19] <jadew> and forgive myself for doing it
[11:15:29] <N1njAway> Hee!
[11:21:53] <Jartza> jadew: it is audio jack :)
[11:22:03] <Jartza> the texts are updated using audio
[11:22:14] <Jartza> so it works from your phone/tablet/laptop/desktop etc.
[11:22:14] <jadew> ah, cool
[11:22:27] <Jartza> basically anything that has a browser and a headphone-jack
[11:22:33] <Jartza> cable included
[11:22:52] <Jartza> http://tagsu.io/edit/
[15:31:10] <hetii> Hi :)
[15:31:36] <hetii> Anybody try port ncurses to some avr/lpc mcu ?
[15:40:11] <vkhvjfhfh> how do i resolve a assembly level io register address to a pin? for instance, p15 or 0x15 corresponds to pin pb5
[15:43:10] <Tom_itx> with an include file for the chip
[15:43:32] <vkhvjfhfh> thanks
[15:44:25] <Tom_itx> what chip?
[15:44:55] <vkhvjfhfh> atmel 328
[15:45:07] <vkhvjfhfh> *atmega 328
[15:47:40] <Tom_itx> are you using studio?
[15:48:02] <vkhvjfhfh> na im just using reavr/ida on a .hex from an arduino
[15:48:31] <Tom_itx> you can get the .inc file from the studio install
[15:49:00] <vkhvjfhfh> i was hoping i could find it somewhere in this arduino ide
[15:49:15] <Tom_itx> or i could post it
[15:50:12] <vkhvjfhfh> that would be incredibly kind of you, but i have to say... that doesnt sound like an "internet" thing to do - it might weaken your cred
[15:50:27] <Tom_itx> i don't care :)
[15:51:01] <vkhvjfhfh> ...a bit of an outlier
[15:51:29] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/avr/studio/
[15:51:34] <Tom_itx> it's in there
[15:51:42] <Tom_itx> the regular one and the 'p' suffix
[15:52:48] <vkhvjfhfh> not working -
http://imgur.com/wuTiSLP
[15:53:06] <Tom_itx> does your firewall block port 81?
[15:53:12] <vkhvjfhfh> yea let me see
[15:54:29] <Tom_itx> no... not that button
[15:56:36] <hetii> Is there some project that allow build some GUI (menu structure) over serial port ?
[15:57:12] <Tom_itx> you pushed the kill switch
[15:57:15] <vdf23111f> thanks tom, got it
[15:57:16] <vdf23111f> :)
[16:00:02] <Tom_itx> i've been here too long for my cred to get any weaker :)
[16:00:54] <vdf23111f> lol
[17:01:01] <vsjlkjkdskl> man, the universe doesnt want me to be online right now
[17:01:03] <vsjlkjkdskl> am i understanding this correctly - port b,c, and d, are registers that represent groups of physical i/o pins on the atmega328p, by writing a value to the register with the appropriate bitmask, you can set a particular pin high or low
[17:25:50] <specing> vsjlkjkdskl: read the port section
[17:29:03] <vsjlkjkdskl> thanks specing
[17:29:55] <vsjlkjkdskl> http://www.atmel.com/Images/doc8161.pdf - im familiar with page 75 and 92
[17:30:11] <vsjlkjkdskl> any other page numbers you'd recommend for this specific topic
[20:13:45] <Getty> FY!!!!!!!!!!
