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[08:44:56] <l9> morning abcminiuser :)
[08:45:09] <abcminiuser> Heyo
[08:51:22] <l9> how do i wire a attiny for isp programming?
[09:01:57] <Tom_itx> which one?
[09:02:09] <abcminiuser> MISO, MOSI, SCK, REST, VTARGET and GND
[09:02:19] <abcminiuser> VTARGET of programmer to VCC of target
[09:02:20] <abcminiuser> GND to GND
[09:02:35] <abcminiuser> The others should match, RESET to RESET, etc
[09:06:47] <l9> cool :) thnx :)
[09:07:18] <l9> fumbling around with Tom_itx mini programmer... :)
[09:08:37] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/USBTiny_Mkii_User_manual_index.php
[09:08:45] <Tom_itx> isp pinout partway down the page
[09:40:03] <DrLuke> Hi, what voltage is the internal bandgap reference?
[09:40:22] <DrLuke> Either I'm stupid or I can't find it in the analog comperator section of the datasheet (where it is mentioned)
[09:42:22] <twnqx> "depends"
[09:42:38] <twnqx> and i think you'd find it in the A/D converter section
[10:16:03] <braincracker> DrLuke<= i used to press control f, and enter bandgap, then hit enter, and click a few next
[10:16:44] <braincracker> the search function is a nice feature searching multi-megabyte documents
[10:54:39] <px12> Could someone help me understand SPF records? and what settings should I setup in the SPF records for my domain to send authenticated emails?
[10:55:25] <twnqx> lol
[10:55:33] <twnqx> now this is a great place to ask for it :D
[10:56:36] <twnqx> anyway, SPF lists which machines on the internet may legitimately send machines with a From: containing your domain
[10:57:16] <px12> okay :D
[10:57:22] <px12> hawk, okay so, I have bought hosting on this x10premium website, and its currently hosting my website www.example.com, what settings should I set up in the cPanel's 'email authentication' section where it states 'SPF Records' to send authenticated emails from example.com?
[10:57:34] <px12> [wrong name. :P twnqx :P]
[10:58:15] <twnqx> that will depend how you send your emails
[10:58:35] <twnqx> basically, you need to figure your mail relay
[10:59:32] <twnqx> i don't thnk SPF is much used though
[12:31:41] <mrsun> hmm
[12:32:13] <mrsun> aight ... what is the slowest i can run an interrupt "driven" adc conversion? i just need to do it a couple of times per second but want it to run free from the other code executing :P
[12:32:21] <mrsun> i could make a timer i guess :P
[12:39:16] <Amadiro> mrsun, what do you mean? You can run it as slow as you want
[12:40:01] <mrsun> a timer yes, but when the ADC is setup as free running, that is it does an interrupt when its done, can i set that period to whatever i want? :)
[12:40:56] <mrsun> as far as i can tell i only got prescalers up to 128 to select from ?
[12:41:04] <mrsun> using a timer i guess i can set whatever period i want :P
[13:04:32] <braincracker> mrsun<= no, you can even increment your own variable after dividing by 128, this way you can have years of delay
[13:05:12] <braincracker> using the timer overflow interrupt
[13:26:48] <mrsun> braincracker, yes but then the calls to the interrupt and interruption of the code is useless eating alot of cpu cycles
[13:27:13] <braincracker> i disagree in case div 128
[13:27:22] <braincracker> otherwise yes
[13:28:04] <mrsun> even with 128 division at 16MHz that is 125khz
[13:28:04] <braincracker> use a 32768Hz xtal, div 128 is slow.
[13:28:23] <mrsun> well, i want the cpu at as high a frequency i can :P
[13:28:37] <braincracker> div128, and 8 bit counter will give 1s interrupt rate.
[13:29:33] <braincracker> timer overflow int on 8 bt timer divides the prescaled clock by 256 addtitionally
[17:00:06] <Left_Turn> the avrbeginners uses asm not C?
[17:03:38] <Casper> it's good to do a bit of asm to understand how stuff work
[17:03:43] <Casper> but them move to C
[17:04:36] <Left_Turn> oh ok i don't mind. my arduino i recieved today was a fake, im returning it. im wondering if avr is a better choice or are guides limited in how far they go in detail.. im a total beginner
[17:04:58] <Casper> how do you know it was a fake?
[17:05:38] <Left_Turn> well it may not be fake but it doesnt work.. it showed uno in the picture of the board, mine doesnt have uno
[17:05:51] <Left_Turn> some of the stuff supposed to come with it didnt etc
[17:06:07] <Casper> ok
[17:06:18] <Left_Turn> might not be fake but it was from china.. i think its fake
[17:06:52] <Casper> or sold as arduino, but is an arduino compatible one
[17:07:09] <Left_Turn> yes something like that
[17:07:44] <Left_Turn> would it be better to buy another arduino? its harder searching for avrs
[17:08:19] <Casper> avr is the chip on the board
[17:08:33] <Casper> arduino is a board and a stupid C library
[17:08:40] <Left_Turn> oh
[17:08:54] <Casper> and a bootloader
[17:09:10] <Left_Turn> can u give me a good avr board to look out for
[17:09:29] <Casper> personally, I use breadboard and DIP avr
[17:09:33] <Casper> bbs
[17:10:38] <Left_Turn> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Simple-ATMEL-AVR-ISP-programmer-AVR-DIP-board-module-/350485152906
[17:10:43] <Left_Turn> this any good?
[17:35:20] <Left_Turn> is this a board or just an add on:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Board-Ext-Can-ADD-ON-STK500-1-ATADAPCAN01-/350714444330?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item51a835ba2a
[17:35:44] <Tom_itx> if it's got an avr on it, you can still program it
[17:36:18] <Left_Turn> oh
[17:36:45] <Tom_itx> is that a CAN avr?
[17:37:06] <Tom_itx> doesn't look like any arduino i've seen
[17:37:24] <Left_Turn> no im not getting an arduino
[17:37:34] <Left_Turn> im looking for an avr board
[17:37:45] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/USBTiny_Mkii_index.php
[17:37:48] <Tom_itx> this is a good programmer
[17:38:17] <Left_Turn> oh i have to get the programmer myself?
[17:38:20] <Tom_itx> cheaper than the one you linked too
[17:39:02] <Left_Turn> im confused:( is a programmer part of the board/chip or is it bought separately?
[17:39:12] <Tom_itx> generally separate
[17:39:17] <Left_Turn> oh
[17:39:42] <Left_Turn> maybe an arduino is a better choice.. i wont know the parts i need:(
[17:39:48] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/how_to/atmega168/mega168_howto_main_index.php
[17:39:52] <Tom_itx> read that over
[17:40:19] <Left_Turn> ah thanks this is what i needed
[17:45:56] <Left_Turn> Tom_itx "Place an electrolytic capacitor on each side" <-- a capacitor isn't listed in the pictures of "things i will need." .. it sort of assumes i know what it is:(
[17:46:18] <Tom_itx> A couple 10 - 100uf electrolytic caps
[17:46:22] <Tom_itx> tis so
[17:47:11] <Left_Turn> oh youre right:)
[17:47:59] <Tom_itx> if you get bare avrs get a couple so you have a spare
[17:48:03] <Tom_itx> they're cheap
[17:49:16] <Left_Turn> do they destroy easily or something? :)
[17:50:06] <Left_Turn> it looks a lot more like what i want to do than the arduino from the link in the topic.. but it does look like a hassle getting started
[18:35:05] <Tom_itx> Left_Turn, alot of noobs get the fuses mis set and sometimes have trouble recovering from them
[18:36:27] <Tom_itx> if you set the fuse for an external clock source and the clock source isn't there, you can't communicate with the chip
[18:43:17] <Left_Turn> Tom_itx im a bigger noob than u think.. i dont know anything about chips/fuses, hardware, embedded stuff etc so its hard to understand what u said.. i just know some theory like logic gates, high low, or the job of a clock/timer etc.
[18:43:38] <Left_Turn> hopefully buying 1 will help me understand the hardware more
[18:44:26] <Tom_itx> i'd get 2
[18:44:34] <Roklobsta> left turn: good, it's not like programming a pc, totally different
[18:44:39] <Roklobsta> you have to do all the work
[18:44:59] <Left_Turn> yes im finding out Roklobsta
[18:45:10] <Roklobsta> and think about and manage resources most programmers take for granted are in ample suplpy on a PC
[18:45:18] <Tom_itx> my tutorial is supposed to be for a total noob
[18:45:19] <Left_Turn> Tom_itx i didnt realise that was your site.. very nice:)
[18:45:21] <Roklobsta> by ample supply i mean ram, speed etc
[18:45:47] <Left_Turn> yes Roklobsta i saw a bit about that
[18:46:13] <Tom_itx> the programmer is good as well
[18:46:24] <Left_Turn> you only have the resources hardware offers
[18:46:30] <Tom_itx> has a recovery clock in case you set the clock fuse wrong
[18:46:34] <Roklobsta> Left_Turn: i have written/am still working on a preemptive/cooperative little OS for the AVR and it's woken me up to various issues (which is a good thing and was the point of doing it).
[18:46:56] <Left_Turn> oh sounds good Roklobsta
[18:47:06] <Left_Turn> ill try doing the same hopefully
[18:47:26] <Tom_itx> get past a blinking led first
[18:47:36] <Left_Turn> yes
[18:47:41] <Roklobsta> the last time i did anything like it was at uni a long time ago on a 68000. the principles still apply and the avr runs at a higher clock rate than my Amiga ever did.
[18:47:48] <Left_Turn> the thing about the avr is having to buy all this kit
[18:47:57] <Roklobsta> er, it's a cheap hobby.
[18:48:06] <Tom_itx> oh hell yeah
[18:48:14] <Tom_itx> some hobbies aren't so much
[18:48:20] <Roklobsta> money cheap, time expensive
[18:48:23] <Left_Turn> heh yep but i don't want to forget anything
[18:49:21] <Left_Turn> Roklobsta do u find arduinos any use at all?
[18:49:44] <Roklobsta> i bought an arduino mega (clone) but never used the arduino ide as it's AWFUL
[18:49:50] <Roklobsta> and it hides many things from you too
[18:50:20] <Left_Turn> oh.. but it provides many things included... for a newbs point of view
[18:50:22] <Roklobsta> which for you is not what tiy want. get any arduino, get a Dragon or JTAG-ICE-3 debugger.
[18:50:43] <Left_Turn> oh
[18:50:47] <Roklobsta> honestly, using jtag helps a lot to see whats going on as your code runs. using just isp and printfs on the serial port isn't so helpful
[18:51:03] <Left_Turn> oh i see
[18:51:10] <Roklobsta> I bought a mk-IICN debugger a while back and still use it now with AVRS6.1SP1
[18:51:41] <Left_Turn> jtag is something i can get online.. free?
[18:51:47] <TechIsCool> variable 'timer_to_tc0_PGM' must be const in order to be put into read-only section by means of '__attribute__((progmem))' so I know why this error is called but how do I fix it. I can't seem to figure out how to modify to something that compiles correctly extern const TC1_t* PROGMEM timer_to_tc1_PGM[];
[18:52:00] <Roklobsta> doing the rtos having the jtag to step through the code and catch logical errors in action has been invaluable.
[18:52:24] <Left_Turn> i see.. is this C or embedded C?
[18:52:40] <Tom_itx> you don't need jtag debugging right off, if ever
[18:52:40] <Roklobsta> C with a little inline assembly
[18:52:50] <Tom_itx> unless your code is rather complex
[18:52:58] <Left_Turn> oh ok
[18:53:05] <Tom_itx> most hobbyists will never need one
[18:53:10] <Left_Turn> inline asm sounds good.. never done any asm
[18:53:11] <Roklobsta> i have always used jtag at work and home on DSP's, 8051's and so on, *i* think they are excellent.
[18:53:17] <Tom_itx> you can debug just fine with a serial port or an led
[18:53:28] <Tom_itx> and you are spoiled
[18:53:29] <Roklobsta> compared to just reflashing and burning UV eproms.
[18:53:45] <Roklobsta> buy an ISP or spend 2x the money and get a dragon
[18:54:06] <Left_Turn> isp is a programmer?
[18:54:31] <Tom_itx> yes
[18:54:52] <Tom_itx> mine does ISP PDI and TPI which are just different protocols for various avrs
[18:54:56] <Left_Turn> so how many items would i need to buy right away
[18:55:05] <Left_Turn> oh i see
[18:55:09] <Tom_itx> what you see on my page would get you started
[18:55:20] <Tom_itx> alot of that you can pull from an old vcr etc
[18:55:29] <Left_Turn> oh true
[18:55:31] <Tom_itx> old printers are good source for parts
[18:56:01] <Left_Turn> would a noob be able to know which parts of a printer he needs?
[18:56:16] <Roklobsta> yeah, old hardware with cpus have components that are easy to salvage
[18:56:23] <Tom_itx> with a bit of help probably
[18:56:31] <Tom_itx> depends how easy you give up
[18:56:32] <Left_Turn> oh ok
[18:56:44] <Left_Turn> heh i wont give up
[18:56:45] <Roklobsta> you just need an iron, sucker, and a multimeter
[18:56:54] <Left_Turn> more stuff?
[18:57:05] <Roklobsta> depends how adventurous you want to get.
[18:57:13] <Tom_itx> well you're gonna need a soldering iron eventually
[18:57:19] <Left_Turn> oh ok... i did shortlist a multi meter
[18:57:23] <Roklobsta> i think you shoudl set ever expanding goals and achieve them
[18:57:23] <Tom_itx> get a decent one or you will regret it
[18:57:33] <Left_Turn> ok:)
[18:57:40] <Roklobsta> I would say get a CRO too.
[18:57:42] <Tom_itx> temp controlled
[18:57:47] <Roklobsta> it can save a lot of time
[18:58:11] <Tom_itx> i think your short list is a santa clause christmas list
[18:58:16] <Left_Turn> ok but i have to start with less items or it will scare my mum
[18:58:20] <Left_Turn> :)
[18:58:27] <Roklobsta> just keep an eye out for a second hand CRO on ebay. even a 20MHz analogue one will be very helpful)
[18:58:37] <Tom_itx> start slow and you will grow your inventory of parts as you go
[18:58:46] <Roklobsta> well, all up you'll spend less money than on a game for the XBOX
[18:58:51] <Tom_itx> what you see on my page will get you introduced to the chips
[18:58:52] <Roklobsta> ok, an XBOX
[18:59:10] <Roklobsta> i think avr is more fun and rewarding than xbox too
[18:59:11] <Left_Turn> ok thats a good idea
[18:59:22] <Tom_itx> then you can expand your goals as you learn
[18:59:34] <Left_Turn> heh i agree.. ever since i started learning programming i dont play my xbox anymore
[18:59:35] <Roklobsta> start with an led
[18:59:38] <Tom_itx> don't just go buy a bunch of crap just because somebody told you to
[18:59:40] <Roklobsta> then move onto serial comms
[18:59:42] <inflex> indeed
[18:59:53] <Left_Turn> ok ill start slow
[18:59:54] * inflex wonders what to do with all his parts now
[19:00:03] <Roklobsta> Left_Turn: and read up a bit on computer achitecture so you know what's going on
[19:00:08] <inflex> probably $5k worth of stock, in 5 years time it'll be worthless
[19:00:15] <Roklobsta> avr is a simple but very effective core
[19:00:28] <Roklobsta> write it off
[19:00:33] <Left_Turn> Roklobsta thats computer hardware?
[19:01:16] <Roklobsta> i mean ciomputer architecture ,what an ALU is, what an ISA is, read up on what the assembly instructions do. with avr, don't just hide behind the C
[19:01:21] <inflex> Roklobsta: yeah, might have to :\
[19:01:25] <Roklobsta> AVR is EASY
[19:01:32] <inflex> AVRs are very nice cores
[19:01:32] <Roklobsta> i say easy as it's easy once yo uget it.
[19:01:41] <inflex> unlike PIC
[19:02:32] <Left_Turn> ok i see
[19:02:49] <Left_Turn> yeah i want to go deep into whts going on
[19:03:24] <Left_Turn> im pretty good with boolean logic
[19:03:36] <Roklobsta> karnaugh maps?
[19:03:58] <Roklobsta> boolean algebra?
[19:04:01] <Left_Turn> yes
[19:04:05] <Tom_itx> i can read a road map
[19:04:23] <Left_Turn> i have an understanding of those Roklobsta
[19:04:31] <Roklobsta> ok good. alu should be easy
[19:04:42] <Left_Turn> karnaugh not so much.. but so so:)
[19:05:27] <Roklobsta> really, all an ALU/CPU does is move data around and some maths operations.
[19:05:29] <Roklobsta> that's it
[19:05:44] <Left_Turn> oh ok sounds easy:)
[19:06:12] <Roklobsta> start with
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arithmetic_logic_unit
[19:06:14] <Left_Turn> is the data moved from input output etc
[19:06:41] <Left_Turn> thanks
[19:08:25] <Roklobsta> go to atmels site and get the data sheet for the avr model you will use and the AVR ISA (instruction set architecture) manual.
[19:08:54] <Left_Turn> avr model is the model of the programmer?
[19:09:15] <Roklobsta> the avr chip
[19:09:18] <Roklobsta> so many
[19:09:22] <Roklobsta> all very similar
[19:09:31] <Roklobsta> i would say maybe go with the 1280
[19:09:47] <Left_Turn> oh this is where it gets confusing:)
[19:09:47] <Roklobsta> i say that as that's the only avr i have ever used. ;)
[19:09:55] <Left_Turn> oh i see
[19:10:15] <Roklobsta> it's on the arduino mega. the mega's now use the 2560 which is the same but has 2x the flash
[19:10:42] <Roklobsta> but DON'T use the arduino IDE. it's, as the american's say "offal".
[19:11:08] <Left_Turn> youre saying buy the arduino mega?
[19:11:17] <Roklobsta> if it's in your budget.
[19:11:29] <Roklobsta> i think the 328 is similar but doesn't have as much ram, rom and pins.
[19:11:48] <Left_Turn> sure i spent £36 on the fake arduino.. when its returned i can add some more
[19:11:53] <Roklobsta> ask the others for advice on other chips/boards. i like the 1280/mega
[19:12:01] <Roklobsta> wow
[19:12:02] <Roklobsta> fake?
[19:12:08] <Left_Turn> yeah:)
[19:12:13] <Left_Turn> came today in the post
[19:12:16] <Roklobsta> i am astounded
[19:12:26] <Tom_itx> the 48 88 168 328 are all the same basic chip just with more flash/ram
[19:12:27] <Left_Turn> i was sad:(
[19:12:31] <Roklobsta> i bought a fake one and it's a perfect copy of the real one
[19:12:43] <Tom_itx> the 2560 has more io and more... stuff
[19:12:48] <Left_Turn> oh.. why do they sell fakes ones
[19:12:58] <Roklobsta> ask them
[19:13:01] <Tom_itx> i've got an arduino 2560 as well
[19:13:04] <Left_Turn> lol
[19:13:08] <Tom_itx> cause they can
[19:13:08] <Roklobsta> the arduino is allowed to be copied
[19:13:20] <Roklobsta> so saying fake is a bit of an untruth
[19:13:28] <Tom_itx> china doesn't care if it's allowed or not
[19:13:28] <Left_Turn> its not the 1st time ive recieved fake goods from china.. sigh
[19:13:39] <Roklobsta> what was faje about it?
[19:13:40] <Left_Turn> true
[19:13:57] <Roklobsta> if it had an avr on it it should have been fine
[19:14:09] <Roklobsta> even if it didn't have the stupid arduino bootloader on it.
[19:14:10] <Left_Turn> the stuff advertised in the kit isnt what i recieved. the board had UNO in big writing in the picture
[19:14:13] <Left_Turn> mine didnt
[19:14:20] <Roklobsta> first thing i did was blow the arduino bootloader away
[19:14:26] <Left_Turn> :)
[19:14:31] <inflex> So long as the AVR itself was legit, *shrug*
[19:14:52] * inflex has more problems when you get your hands on fake AVRs which are just dead slugs
[19:15:25] <Left_Turn> so if an arduino can i do everything in your guide Tom_itx
[19:16:35] <Tom_itx> i'd say so
[19:16:49] <Left_Turn> oh i see
[19:16:51] <Tom_itx> it's just an avr
[19:16:56] <Tom_itx> with their bootloader in it
[19:16:58] <inflex> exactly
[19:17:03] <Tom_itx> you can dump that really easy :)
[19:17:08] <Roklobsta> yeah arduino is avr with a special bootlaoder to accept arduido code over the serial port
[19:17:15] <Left_Turn> so i wont need an isp programmer?
[19:17:36] <Tom_itx> if you screw up their bootloader you will
[19:17:45] <Left_Turn> heh ok
[19:19:56] <braincracker> h
[19:23:11] <braincracker> motherboard warning lold
[19:23:13] <braincracker> WARNING : Handling any of the non- RoHS compliant products will expose you to lead, a chemical known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm. Wash hands after handling.
[19:24:11] <Casper> the real question is: what in the state of california isn't known to cause cancer?
[19:24:15] <braincracker> lead nanoparticles can stick to your hand and you may eat it...
[19:24:42] <braincracker> ok let's say lead causes cancer, how will the motherboard cause you cancer?
[19:24:50] <braincracker> by touching it
[19:25:13] <braincracker> not chewing on the solder joints
[19:25:59] <Casper> long term exposure to all that lead
[19:26:16] <braincracker> you mean i'm at risk because the motherboard works in the same room as me?
[19:26:18] <Casper> hint: your water pipe at home is soldered with lead, nobody got cancer due to that
[19:26:23] <Casper> no
[19:26:48] <Casper> if you handle the board, you will touch the solder, which will cause some of the lead oxide to move to your finger
[19:27:05] <Casper> which then you will put your finger in your mouth or on your food that you eat
[19:27:11] <braincracker> but i wash hands before eating chips with bare hands
[19:27:12] <braincracker> ;<
[19:27:35] <Casper> but you need lots of lead to cause issue
[19:27:38] <braincracker> and usually not use the motherboard for cutting meat, bread, and serving them
[19:27:43] <Casper> so don't worry about it
[19:28:15] <braincracker> btw i've been using lead solder since 1998
[19:28:16] <Casper> but since it contain an element that can cause issue, they are required by law to put a warning... yeah, it's stupid
[19:28:28] <braincracker> been holding the solder wire with bare hads
[19:28:30] <braincracker> hands
[19:29:33] <Casper> soon, they will put a warning: "Warning, going out of the house can cause death by trafic accident. Be carefull when you go out" with another warning: "Warning, staying inside may cause mental illness. Go out every day"
[19:29:49] <braincracker> ^^
[19:29:50] <braincracker> hahaha
[19:30:17] <braincracker> solution: go out every day to the mall, tesco for a few hours and buy useless crap
[19:32:00] <Casper> you know....
[19:32:18] <Casper> I actually have an hard time buying stuff!
[19:32:34] <Casper> extremelly unlucky
[19:33:19] <Casper> what I want is... back order, discontinued, out of stock, not avail anymore at that location or DEFECTIVE
[19:33:32] <Casper> last week, I bought a pressure washer
[19:33:36] <braincracker> try from china
[19:33:39] <Casper> worked 30 seconds correctly
[19:33:43] <Tom_itx> dpm
[19:33:44] <braincracker> haha yes
[19:33:46] <Tom_itx> baah
[19:33:48] <Casper> then the motor started cycling
[19:33:52] <Tom_itx> don't eat motherboards
[19:33:52] <braincracker> so you are s atisfied customer
[19:34:16] <Casper> then after 5 minutes the motor wasn't stopping when I was releasing the handle, so the safety pressure valve kicked in
[19:34:25] <Casper> which got worn out after a few minutes
[19:34:35] <Casper> and lost most of the pressure
[19:34:37] <braincracker> it is fine then, it didn't explode
[19:35:24] <Casper> before that, I went to buy a thing to put my phone on my belt... the ONLY model avail don't work with any case
[19:36:02] <Casper> yesterday I bought some earphones and a bluetooth-rca adapter...
[19:36:25] <braincracker> you buy too many things
[19:36:44] <Casper> the adapter work too well at transfering the audio from my phone to the ampli: as soon as I'm in the house I lose all sound on the iphone... need to disable bluetooth manually each time... gonna return it
[19:36:46] <braincracker> sup Roklobsta
[19:37:16] <Roklobsta> braincracker: my LiNi AVR32UC beats your i7.
[19:37:21] <braincracker> get some beaglebone, and a small tft
[19:37:24] <braincracker> all your problems solved
[19:37:32] <braincracker> Roklobsta<= lold
[19:37:40] <braincracker> 12800 DMIPS ?
[19:37:47] <braincracker> 2GB/s mem speed?
[19:38:54] <braincracker> ok, sram is faster than dram, but you don't have GB's of them
[19:40:16] <braincracker> Roklobsta <= not i7 btw :) only a 3500+ amd 64 bit with dual ch ddr400
[19:41:04] <Roklobsta> bugger beaglbone. get this in a few months.
http://utilite-computer.com/web/home
[19:41:17] <Roklobsta> i have just that amd in my mythtv box
[19:42:18] <braincracker> hah interesting little nes
[19:43:14] <braincracker> i like this opensource mini PC too, but more expensive
https://www.olimex.com/Products/OLinuXino/A20/A20-OLinuXino-MICRO-4GB/
[19:43:20] <Roklobsta> my hat's off to companies like Freescale making a super duper SoC so cheap.
[19:43:52] <braincracker> Power Supply Unregulated 10 to 16 volt input
[19:43:59] <braincracker> ^^ hook it up to 12V batt
[19:45:07] <braincracker> http://utilite-computer.com/web/home < nie, but with a rendered photo and no pricing and availability information i don't believe in it
[19:45:12] <braincracker> *nice
[19:46:24] <inflex> braincracker: they're the people who make the FitPC series, so they're legit... but yes, I'm interested to see if this ARM "pc" makes it to market
[19:47:11] <Roklobsta> it will, they are not flybynighetrs
[19:47:17] <braincracker> btw i7 with ddr3 1333MHz+ does >14GB+ mem speed
[19:47:52] <braincracker> also in s2011 they can do quad channel with around 50GB/s
[19:48:01] <Roklobsta> a snail compared to UC3 at -170C.
[19:48:52] <Roklobsta> alas fitpc by vendors in .au is way overpriced. i gagged on my wheeties when i saw how much yawarra is charging
[19:49:09] <inflex> Roklobsta: yep, likewise :(
[19:49:13] <Roklobsta> the owner must be counting on sales of 1 a month to keep the payments up on the mercedes.
[19:49:15] <inflex> Roklobsta: I really wanted one, many times
[19:49:16] <braincracker> i'd be into 16GB L1 cache
[19:49:29] <inflex> Roklobsta: in the end I went with the Asus eeebox 1-litre machines
[19:49:34] <Roklobsta> inflex: all he did was pay for .au EMC testing.
[19:49:49] <braincracker> http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/E350M1/index.asp?cat=&os=&c=
[19:49:54] <braincracker> what do you think of this?
[19:49:59] <braincracker> ~17W pd
[19:50:02] <inflex> the E350's are a decent combo
[19:50:04] <braincracker> <11W idle
[19:50:14] <Roklobsta> which is silly, i wrote to compulab suggesting they pay the $500 to get the .au report done as it uses the same test data and mostly the same pass criteria as FCC and CE.
[19:50:51] <Roklobsta> instead, yawarra have to spend up $5000 to get each device retested.
[19:51:04] <inflex> braincracker: nice thing is that one has DVI/HDMI/VGA all on one
[19:52:40] <Roklobsta> inflex: i really wanted the fitpc3 for a client's dusty factory, but the low end dell was 3x cheaper.
[19:52:58] <Roklobsta> so we went with the dell
[19:53:10] <inflex> yep
[19:53:29] * inflex prepares to toss this toshiba in the bin
[19:53:37] <Roklobsta> whats wrong
[19:53:38] <inflex> can't find a replacement SATA connector :
[19:53:55] <Roklobsta> speical moel for toshba
[19:55:35] <inflex> well, they're just all rather specific, such is the nature of these beasts.
[19:56:07] <inflex> 1mm difference in the positioning and the HDD won't slide in for a fit. I do like that HP/Compaq often use the short cable method, though it does have its own issues at times.
[19:57:17] <braincracker> inflex <= yeah this is why i chose it
[19:57:49] <inflex> But HP has their own demented issues... like they still don't understand the concept of "cooling"
[19:57:54] <Roklobsta> hahaha
[19:58:01] <braincracker> the performance could be a bit better though, they say 10 000 dmips nt clear if it is 2x5000 or 2x10000
[19:58:12] <Roklobsta> yes, i looked at a hp laptop the other week, the CAPS lock LED flash was "CPU BUGGERED"
[19:58:20] <braincracker> but the DDR 1066's are mostly fine
[19:58:23] <Roklobsta> i suspect something is overheating/heated.
[19:58:55] <Roklobsta> and i know of 2 asus's that love to shut down at random, as is, power off immediately.
[19:59:42] <braincracker> surprise :)
[19:59:53] <braincracker> be prepared
[20:00:05] <Roklobsta> i do know acer laptops like mine can withstand 10kg kids standing on the kepboard
[20:00:50] <Roklobsta> i am impressed most laptops work at all after a little flexing in a case or being held only at the corner
[20:01:00] <braincracker> how many dark spots are on the tft?
[20:01:03] <Roklobsta> flexing in a carry case
[20:01:15] <Casper> acer laptop are now way better than they used to be
[20:01:33] <Roklobsta> heh, a clients asus has a big crack in the lcd the shape of a smkile, but all the pixels away from the crack still work
[20:02:15] <Roklobsta> but she stood on the laptop. 80+Kg = big crack
[20:02:30] * Roklobsta says innuendo not intended.
[20:02:54] <braincracker> i have seen laptop that was abused by stupid user, scissors thrown into tft display
[20:04:16] <Tom_itx> maybe there was a target displayed on the screen
[20:06:38] <braincracker> well never underestimate the stupid user's evil powers
[20:07:08] <braincracker> i have received one of my electronics that has 15V 1.5kW TVS protection inside abused
[20:07:21] <braincracker> input power cable melted off connector
[20:07:32] <braincracker> and it is reverse polarity protected too.
[20:07:57] <braincracker> i was thinking he might have hooked it up to some huge 24V battery
[20:11:43] <Roklobsta> any24v would have done
[20:12:14] <braincracker> this abuse required about 20-50A continuous current
[20:12:28] <Roklobsta> i once helped test car batteries with a carbon pile load. the leads took 400A and would fly apart when the current changed
[20:14:43] <braincracker> there is no protection agains everything ;/
[20:18:24] <Roklobsta> no. there is no protection against stupid.
[20:18:52] <braincracker> but i think i will add an atmega to monitor working conditions ;/
[20:19:04] <braincracker> it would be awesome to see how much abuse they can take
[20:19:16] <Roklobsta> one client gave their precious backup drive to their kid to plug into the xbox360. Upon inspection I found one hidden directory called "XBOX360".
[20:19:40] <braincracker> they didn't need the backup
[20:20:01] <Roklobsta> well, the kid apparently wanted to back some game stuff up and swore he wouldn't delete anything.
[20:20:39] <Roklobsta> and i have business customers who just won't rotate the backup drive offsite
[20:20:45] <Roklobsta> it's their choice
[20:21:11] <Roklobsta> they can pay me more money when it goes pear shaped
[20:22:02] <braincracker> oh cool thing is when user tries to "fix" some computer hardware, then it gets even more damage and it must be thrown out
[20:22:27] <Roklobsta> at the prices these days just get a new one anyway
[20:22:53] <Roklobsta> LCD is $250 to $300 to replace. a new laptop would be a better investment
[20:22:58] <braincracker> they do this with hdds with important data too lold
[20:23:01] <braincracker> :)
[20:23:29] <Roklobsta> smiley crack lady is going to buy an external LCD and have a nonmobile laptop
[20:23:46] <Roklobsta> i can't fix the shutdown probelm
[20:24:25] <braincracker> nonmobile laptop, hahaha
[20:24:40] <braincracker> like one of my junk s478 intel p4's
[20:25:44] <braincracker> or celeron
[20:25:55] <Roklobsta> inflex has a lot of nonmobile laptops
[20:26:52] * inflex is bak
[20:27:12] <inflex> Hmm.. yes, I use laptops more as an integrated PC with built in failover facilities ( key/mouse/screen/UPS )
[20:27:44] <braincracker> maybe an 350M1 or olimex ?
[20:27:58] <braincracker> 350M1 is better than a laptop
[20:28:01] <inflex> Speaking of which, I've got a client HDD churning away being reocvered atm... hope they're rich
[20:28:25] <inflex> 11" Netbooks are nice as compact/low-power workstations
[20:29:24] <braincracker> 7" display with olimex :)
[20:29:27] <braincracker> 3.5W ?
[20:30:56] <braincracker> works from cheap solar cell with car battery all day long free
[20:31:41] <braincracker> off-grid computing always rules
[20:41:20] <Roklobsta> inflex: they should come see me, i am cheaper
[20:43:33] <inflex> Roklobsta: hah, now why would you miss out on more money?
[20:43:57] * inflex never was/is keen on the idea of winning the market by undercutting, just a nasty race to the bottom of the barrel
[20:43:58] <Roklobsta> it's the gift of giving
[20:44:05] <Roklobsta> i am winning!
[20:44:07] <inflex> Awww, so sweet
[20:44:21] <Roklobsta> down here i am just under the comp.
[20:44:32] <Roklobsta> what can i do
[20:44:47] <inflex> I'll send my family over too, and all the people who start their queries with "I heard you were good, but I need also a cheap repair, it'll only take 5 minutes I'm sure for a person as smart as you"
[20:46:12] <Roklobsta> heh
[20:46:30] <Roklobsta> i just quote my prioces and 70% gulp and employ me
[20:50:22] <Roklobsta> i am trying to do some code in avrstudio but i don't have the drive today
[20:50:24] <Roklobsta> so sad
[20:51:46] <Roklobsta> instead making panoramas in hugin making i7 work hard
[20:52:30] <braincracker> human-animal hybrids are illegal
[20:54:12] <Roklobsta> depends where you live.
[20:54:20] <Roklobsta> 12miles off the coast you can do what you like
[20:55:36] <Roklobsta> lunchtime
[20:57:00] <braincracker> http://www.wanttoknow.info/humananimalhybrids
[20:57:07] <braincracker> manpigs? centaurs ?
[20:57:32] <inflex> What about temporary man-sheep hybrids?
[21:04:41] <braincracker> chinese human-pig
http://artiststeel.blogspot.hu/2011/07/secret-humananimal-hybrid-projects.html
[21:04:54] <braincracker> man-sheep is unnecessary
[21:07:20] <TechIsCool> variable 'timer_to_tc0_PGM' must be const in order to be put into read-only section by means of '__attribute__((progmem))' so I know why this error is called but how do I fix it. I can't seem to figure out how to modify to something that compiles correctly extern const TC1_t* PROGMEM timer_to_tc1_PGM[];
[21:11:41] <Daulity> TechIsCool: maybe you got to asign it something (don't know)
[21:12:12] <TechIsCool> Its a change in gcc compiler from 1.8 and above but I can't determine how to fix it.
[21:13:07] <Daulity> what happens when you don't make it a pointer or does it have to be a pointer to work ?
[21:13:22] <TechIsCool> it is using progmem so needs to pointer
[21:15:25] <braincracker> inflex<=
http://www.freewebs.com/humanimalsforbush/index.htm :)
[21:16:07] <Daulity> TechIsCool: have you done this before ? (just wondering if you did you might have the source from it see what changed ?
[21:16:19] <vectory_> TechIsCool: are you sure you need a pointer to a pointer (as in array)?
[21:17:54] <Daulity> what is the diffrence between [] and * ?
[21:18:02] <TechIsCool> vectory_: I am porting a library so I can't really tell what it does or why just that it needs to stay the same. I know that from when the code was created to when I am compiliing it the avr-gcc changed requiring the update.
http://www.nongnu.org/avr-libc/changes-1.8.html When I try the define it does the same thing
http://www.avrfreaks.net/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&p=871000
[21:18:05] <braincracker> array vs pointer
[21:18:27] <vectory_> Daulity: the allocation of memory
[21:18:45] <Daulity> so [] alocates memory and * doesn't ?
[21:18:54] <braincracker> yes
[21:18:56] <vectory_> TechIsCool: as far as i can see, you need to put the progmem behind everything elsel, but it's just a guess
[21:19:09] <Daulity> cool :) love learning :)
[21:19:20] <vectory_> from looking at this example const char FlashString[] PROGMEM = "This is a string held completely in flash memory.";
[21:19:38] <TechIsCool> tried it just now same error
[21:22:30] <Daulity> where is the extern keyword for?
[21:25:16] <vectory_> Daulity: means that the variable is declared in another file
[21:32:39] <Valen> anybody have any good examples for using data coming in via serial?
[21:33:01] <Valen> I mainly mean stuff like getting the data into some kind of buffer then putting it into multi byte variables
[21:36:08] <vectory_> Valen: maybe something in the asf?
[21:36:16] <Valen> asf?
[21:36:48] <vectory_> atmel softwre framework. some convenience libs with examples. i find it horribly convoluted with abstraction
[21:37:17] <Valen> yeah, I was looking for a "2nd level" example
[21:37:46] <Valen> everything seems to be either "this is a usart" or "super abstract specialised with eleventy .h files"
[21:41:53] <inflex> ja, you can't define the contents of the extern var, you have to declare that elsewhere.
[21:42:08] <inflex> oops, sorry, brain misread *erase*
[21:43:29] * Tom_itx gives inflex a brain eraser
[21:53:14] <Valen> brain eraser
http://www.beer-universe.com/beer-education-article/2010-02-02/The-Strongest-Beers-in-the-Universe/
[23:23:38] <TechIsCool> anyone overhear understand what changed with avr-libc 1.8 on pgmspace.h I am having a issue that says this Error 1 variable 'timer_to_tc0_PGM' must be const in order to be put into read-only section by means of '__attribute__((progmem))'
[23:50:58] <vectory_> TechIsCool: its also possible that a change in gcc is responsible
[23:51:52] <vectory_> which reminds me to wonder that open source packs rarely specify which versions of the toolchain they build against