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[04:00:14] <megal0maniac> Hey. Quick question for anyone in the know. When buying a dev board, should one go for the A10 or A20? A20 is obviously more powerful and only increases price by USD8 or 9, but the A10 seems better supported and has more documentation
[04:00:49] <megal0maniac> I'm looking at marsboard or cubieboard specifically. Both of them have identical A10 and A20 versions
[04:02:32] <megal0maniac> I'm happy to spend the extra $ if it's worth it, don't want to regret my decision later on, but it doesn't make sense if the A20 lacks software support
[04:42:27] <Gumboot> megal0maniac: There's #cubieboard if you want to check that.
[04:43:25] <Gumboot> Someone was saying the interrupt controller had gone to something generic (which would be good) but that means all the hardware interrupt numbers have to be re-discovered or somesuch.
[04:43:54] <Gumboot> That might actually be beneficial for the ethernet once it's sorted out.
[04:52:13] <megal0maniac> Gumboot: Everything I'm hearing is making me think that I should get one of each :)
[04:53:41] <megal0maniac> specing: Have you gotten a cubieboard yet?
[05:02:01] <Gumboot> megal0maniac: Twice the sales!
[05:02:59] <megal0maniac> I'm a student. I'm on holiday for another week, at which point I'll be unemployed until the next holidays. I don't have money to waste :P
[05:04:39] <Gumboot> Well, I've an A10 cubieboard and it seems to work just fine. I've ordered a couple of A20s but they're slow to arrive.
[05:05:10] <Gumboot> I don't think it should be all that hard to get A20 up and running. People are already putting kernel images online.
[05:05:25] <Gumboot> Neither one of them runs mainline Linux, yet.
[05:09:32] <specing> megal0maniac: no
[05:15:01] <megal0maniac> specing: But.. how?
[05:17:28] <specing> I have enough semi-to-non working ARM boards as it is
[05:18:12] <specing> I think the next embedded board I'll buy will be an atom one
[05:18:15] <megal0maniac> I guess
[05:18:23] <specing> It surely will be
[05:18:38] <specing> fuck ARM and their custom shit that noone maintains
[05:18:43] <megal0maniac> What's the appeal of atom?
[05:18:57] <specing> IT WORKS, BITCH
[05:19:02] <megal0maniac> Fair point
[05:19:23] <megal0maniac> My dockstar is an armv5te, but it's solid as a rock
[05:20:07] <specing> I computed that it is far better to spend 50$ more for x86 and additional 20$ more / year on electricity than to lose weeks trying to get ARM to work
[05:20:28] <twnqx> yeah
[05:20:38] <twnqx> i'd go for stuff with large enough community like rpi only
[05:21:55] <megal0maniac> That's why I'm struggling to make up my mind about these A10 boards
[05:22:44] <megal0maniac> The community is growing, but is it big enough for me to not get completely stuck at some point?
[05:22:56] <twnqx> for rpi? yes
[05:23:01] <megal0maniac> Of course
[05:23:25] <megal0maniac> But's it's slower and lacks SATA
[05:23:43] <megal0maniac> And internal NAND and has half the RAM
[05:27:32] <l9> what program should i use too draw schematics and pcb's in ubuntu
[05:28:19] <specing> l9: gEDA
[05:28:28] <specing> or kicad
[05:28:56] <megal0maniac> Maybe I should just suck it up and get a rpi.
[05:29:32] <l9> specing: thanks :)
[05:30:53] <twnqx> eagle!
[05:32:16] <l9> twnqx: eagle is HUGE and you need a license but yeah i have looked at it
[05:32:27] <twnqx> umm
[05:32:27] <Roklobsta> a piraited copy of Protel 98.
[05:32:30] <twnqx> it has a free license
[05:32:48] * Roklobsta remembers the dark days of Protel for DOS
[05:32:51] <twnqx> which is goof enough for most hobby projects
[05:33:23] <Roklobsta> what, eagle?
[05:33:33] <twnqx> yes
[05:33:49] <twnqx> i wish altium would work on linux :/
[05:34:12] <twnqx> but since i just upgraded my eagle pro license to 6.x, i'll stick with it somewhat longer
[05:34:20] <RikusW> twnqx: it does, just install XP in VirtualBox ;)
[05:34:38] <twnqx> none of the emulators properly support multiple screens
[05:34:46] <twnqx> at least none of those i tried
[05:35:07] <RikusW> well Linux in one and XP on the other screen ?
[05:35:13] <twnqx> and i would not be interested to to pcb layout without multiple screens to work on schematic and layout in parallel
[05:35:31] <RikusW> tabs ?
[05:35:34] <twnqx> no
[05:35:46] <twnqx> i do not want to change windows, i want to see both in parallel
[05:35:49] <RikusW> guess I haven't been spoiled yet :-P
[05:36:13] <RikusW> got a HD 21.5" screen recently, makes quite a difference :)
[05:36:20] <twnqx> heh
[05:36:28] <twnqx> my first set of 24" displays is burning out
[05:36:42] <Roklobsta> lcd?
[05:36:44] <twnqx> barely 8 years
[05:36:45] <twnqx> yes
[05:36:56] <twnqx> one is already replaced, it just was too cloudy to use
[05:37:02] <Roklobsta> my screens are LED so we'll see how long they las
[05:37:12] <twnqx> second one is terribly cloudy and has burn-in effects after mere hours
[05:37:23] <twnqx> like, have a shell open for one h
[05:37:33] <twnqx> play a video, read the text from the shell in whatever you play
[05:38:09] <Roklobsta> the old lcd's had some silly burning crap going on
[05:38:40] <twnqx> these are from 2004/2005
[05:38:43] <twnqx> maybe 2003
[05:44:13] <RikusW> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrG98HJ3Z6w
[05:45:01] <RikusW> a real breadboard
[05:46:52] <Roklobsta> i did something like that last year for a toy for my kid
[06:03:25] <megal0maniac> "This is a sodderless breadboard"
[06:05:32] * Roklobsta looks around for the 'L' missing from sodder.
[07:23:07] <megal0maniac> Perhaps it's time for raspberry pi...
[07:24:41] <RikusW> how about beaglebone black ?
[07:30:19] <megal0maniac> RikusW: Any suggestions for a source? My main concern is support. I know my way around, but I'm not exactly an advanced user
[07:30:47] <RikusW> my brother got some, I can find out where he got them
[07:31:09] <RikusW> was $45 iirc
[07:31:35] <megal0maniac> There's also the marsboard
[07:31:47] <megal0maniac> Which has SATA
[07:33:23] <megal0maniac> And a faster CPU and double the ram and double the flash
[07:34:25] <Gumboot> megal0maniac: I wouldn't recommend the pi. Once you get a kernel for cubie you can use any Linux distro you like. For pi you'll need specific legacy builds of everything.
[07:35:28] <megal0maniac> Gumboot: What about the Beaglebone black? It runs off a TI ARM chip, not the A10 as I previously thought
[07:35:47] <megal0maniac> I can live without the other stuff if it's better supported
[07:35:50] <Amadiro> Gumboot, uh, that doesn't seem to make any sense to me
[07:35:57] <Amadiro> they are both ARM, so either way, your distro needs to support it
[07:36:03] <Amadiro> many distros don't support ARM, or require special builds
[07:36:24] <Amadiro> you'll also need one that has hardfp support, if you want reasonable performance
[07:36:27] <megal0maniac> The Dockstar only has 128mb RAM, but it makes good use of swap
[07:36:45] <Amadiro> so regardless whether you use a cubie, beagle or pi, you can't just use "any linux distro you like"
[07:37:28] <megal0maniac> Amadiro: The Debian installs I do for my dockstar are done on another machine with debootstrap. uBoot sorts out the rest. "arch=armel" is as specific as it gets
[07:37:45] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, armel is softfp, though.
[07:37:49] <Amadiro> That's a bit of a waste to use
[07:38:20] <megal0maniac> Oh? How would I go about doing it with hardfp?
[07:38:37] <Amadiro> http://wiki.debian.org/ArmHardFloatPort for debian
[07:38:54] <megal0maniac> (I assume that you're talking about floating point calculations being done by software, or by a built-in FPU)
[07:39:01] <Amadiro> yes
[07:39:04] <Amadiro> well, ARM calls them vfps
[07:39:10] <megal0maniac> Good. I'm catching on :)
[07:39:17] <Amadiro> but if you do anything fp-related, armel can make your performance tank 100x or so
[07:39:30] <megal0maniac> Owie
[07:39:35] <megal0maniac> Common examples?
[07:40:01] <Amadiro> eh... dunno... floats are used in a lot of things
[07:40:02] * megal0maniac bookmarks
[07:40:07] <Amadiro> computer graphics, physics simulations and whatnot
[07:40:28] <Amadiro> but then there's the other issue of being able to exploit your specific hardware
[07:40:38] <Amadiro> such as the videocore on the raspberry pi, for h264 and opengl es 2.0 acceleration
[07:40:45] <Amadiro> which is the main reason you need "custom distributions" for the pi
[07:40:52] <Amadiro> because they require drivers and firmware and such
[07:41:16] <Amadiro> and I don't think you'd get around that with the A10 on the cubieboard either (I think it uses a MALI400
[07:41:23] <megal0maniac> It does
[07:41:25] <Amadiro> unless you use the FOSS LIMA driver
[07:41:31] <Amadiro> which I have never tried
[07:42:13] <megal0maniac> So the reason that the Dockstar is so straightforward is because I only really use USB and ethernet, which is probably supported by the kernel already?
[07:42:26] <Amadiro> haven't used the dockstar, but presumably
[07:43:06] <megal0maniac> Amadiro: It flies with OpenWRT. Chugs along well enough with Debian
[07:43:19] <Amadiro> I'd assume the cubieboard is the least problematic in these respects, because TI tends to be very open about their chips
[07:43:28] <Amadiro> so I'd assume that there are probably FOSS drivers etc available for everything
[07:43:33] <Amadiro> and no proprietary bootloader etc
[07:43:37] <Amadiro> er
[07:43:39] <Amadiro> the beagleboard, I mean
[07:43:58] <Amadiro> but then, I don't think the beagleboard has any graphical capabilities anyway?
[07:44:07] <megal0maniac> It does
[07:44:36] <megal0maniac> There's a micro hdmi port hidden on the bottom of the board
[07:44:38] <Amadiro> what GPU does it have?
[07:45:58] <megal0maniac> SGX530 3D, 20M Polygons/S
[07:46:01] <megal0maniac> Never heard of it
[07:46:30] <megal0maniac> 1440x900 max resolution though
[07:46:37] <twnqx> lol.
[07:46:47] <Amadiro> ah, yeah, the SGX530 GPUs are mostly decent
[07:46:57] <Amadiro> I've come across them a few times while developing OpenGL ES2.0 applications for androids
[07:47:07] <Amadiro> but you'll probably still need proprietary drivers...
[07:48:19] <megal0maniac> I need to flip a coin or something :/
[07:48:45] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, well, what do you want to do with the thing?
[07:52:51] <megal0maniac> Well I have the dockstar for web server, torrent client, samba server, dlna server. I want to leave it alone and play with another board. I'd like something that I can stick behind my TV (powered from USB and connected to HDMI to monitor) and as software-extensible as possible. Stable build of Debian and Android would be great.
[07:53:05] <Amadiro> hm, looks like the beagleboards 530 is actually a much older generation than I thought, the 540 is the newer one -- it can't play 1080p video etc
[07:53:27] <megal0maniac> 1080p would be nice, since my TV sucks at upscaling
[07:53:35] <megal0maniac> But not essential..
[07:53:38] <Amadiro> so you mainly care about playing HD video?
[07:53:49] <twnqx> megal0maniac: justget some nice haswell
[07:55:34] <megal0maniac> twnqx: Price is important
[07:56:12] <megal0maniac> Amadiro: Not actually video so much, I don't want cli text to be unclear
[07:56:32] <megal0maniac> I.e I want it to be sharp, not upscaled. WM maybe
[07:56:36] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, well, if you want to run android, I don't think the raspberry pi can do that (to a reasonable degree), so I'd probably go with the cubie
[07:57:06] <Amadiro> the cubie is also a bit more powerful and has the sata port, which I think is pretty important
[07:57:17] <Amadiro> since SD cards can get really expensive if you want good ones
[07:57:23] <Amadiro> and it's always a bit of a gamble
[07:58:31] <Amadiro> both can do what you want GPU-wise, I'd think (OpenGL ES 2.0, OpenVG 1.1, h264 accell at 1080p, neither can do OpenCL), the mali-400 is probably a little more powerful than the VideoCore IV
[07:58:49] <Amadiro> the cubieboard probably requires you to use a little less proprietary bullshit
[07:58:57] <Amadiro> but the raspberry pi has a bigger community
[07:59:22] <Amadiro> the cubieboard also has much faster networking, if you care about that
[07:59:34] <twnqx> does it have PoE?
[07:59:55] <Amadiro> don't know, probably not
[08:00:03] <Amadiro> PoE is not exactly something a lot of consumer switches have
[08:00:09] <Amadiro> and it requires a lot of extra power circuitry
[08:00:28] <antto> is there a way to tell the size of an eeprom?
[08:00:39] <twnqx> count the pins? :P
[08:00:44] <Amadiro> antto, from what?
[08:00:49] <antto> i mean from within the firmware
[08:01:02] <antto> also wether it's actually plugged into the socket
[08:01:12] <Amadiro> how are you talking to your eeprom?
[08:01:25] <antto> lemme see
[08:01:42] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, it also seems the cubieboard2 is about to come out, so maybe look at that.
[08:01:51] <antto> "spi"
[08:01:56] <antto> if that makes sense
[08:02:03] <twnqx> i know that SPI NOR flash have some form of ID
[08:02:10] <twnqx> so then you need a lookup table
[08:02:17] <Amadiro> antto, have you had a look at the protocol in the datasheet?
[08:02:18] <twnqx> not sure about eeperoms
[08:02:22] <Amadiro> maybe the protocol allows you to query such things
[08:02:45] <twnqx> but i use the ID approach for runtime detection of SPI flash memory
[08:05:56] <antto> should i be looking at this "instruction table" in the datasheet?
[08:07:37] <antto> cuz there are only 6 instructions there: enable/disable write operations, read/write status register, and read/write data
[08:08:47] <Amadiro> antto, maybe there is a status register that tells you.
[08:08:49] <twnqx> yeah, i seemed to remember that eeproms don't have an ID facility
[08:09:04] <twnqx> no, the status register only has write enable and sector protection
[08:09:39] <twnqx> and write in progress, i think
[08:09:51] <Amadiro> antto, I assume you're only interested in one family of spi eeproms by one vendor, where the protocol is the same, and the only difference is the storage size?
[08:10:20] <antto> for the status register it says: WPEN 0 0 0 BP1 BP0 WEL RDY
[08:10:48] <antto> to be honest, i don't know about vendors
[08:11:52] <antto> this device is supposed to have a 4kB eeprom by design, the original BOM lists that 2 different EEPROMs can be used (whichever is more obtainable) so i'd guess they work identically
[08:12:10] <antto> the chip is supposed to be 8-leg, that's for sure
[08:12:22] <antto> no idea if it can be of different size and still 8-leg
[08:12:28] <twnqx> yes.
[08:12:49] <antto> but at least i'd like to know if there's a way to tell if it's actually plugged in it's socket or not
[08:12:59] <antto> and i could "assume" that it's 4kB
[08:13:01] <twnqx> since it's a serial protocol, the pin count won't change
[08:13:34] <twnqx> for the first part, simplay read the status reg
[08:13:43] <twnqx> if you get all-ones back, there's no eeprom
[08:13:53] <twnqx> (spi uses a pullup)
[08:13:53] <antto> oh? kewl
[08:14:20] <twnqx> if you don't trust the pullup, enable write, and checkif the flag in the status reg changes
[08:14:35] <twnqx> (or turn on the pullup on your chip)
[08:15:38] <antto> i have code which checks the status register to see if it's "ready" to write more
[08:15:52] <antto> i should check if the status is 0xFF then?
[08:15:58] <twnqx> yes
[08:16:06] <antto> nice
[08:16:21] <twnqx> since there are three bits that are guaranteed 0, if they are set, your lines are in pullup mode
[08:17:00] <antto> thanks, that's gonna be good enough then
[08:17:35] <antto> now if i can unplug the eeprom without breaking it's legs :/
[08:22:32] <megal0maniac> Amadiro: The cubieboard2 is the same thing, but based on the A20 which is basically dual core everything at a slightly lower clock. But the support is very limited for it at the moment. Doesn't look like an option right now
[08:23:02] <antto> yey, got it out ;]
[08:24:21] <megal0maniac> Why would the cubieboard have faster networking?
[08:25:53] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, ah. I thought it may be more powerful, but whatever, I guess
[08:27:01] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, the raspberry pi has a very slow SMSC network chip that sits on the USB bus, which effectively limits your cabled throughput to ~2-3MiB/s (up to 4-5MiB/s on a good day with a gigabit router, maybe), and clutters your USB bus as well. If you want to go faster, you have to attach a better network card.
[08:31:20] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, I haven't measured this myself, but people report they get 11MiB/s read/write with samba on the cubieboard, whereas I get around 1.5-2MiB/s on the raspberry pi (writing to an external USB HDD), so yeah, the cubieboard presumably gives you the full 100Mb/s
[08:33:05] <RikusW> megal0maniac:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHlImwDKYl0
[08:33:07] <RikusW> :-D
[08:53:42] <theBear> i ain't saying any conclusions are wrong here, but for the love of god, don't use samba as a benchmark or test for any kind of file or network transfer performance !
[08:54:31] <Amadiro> theBear, but it is what I want to use for network transfer
[08:54:37] <Amadiro> so to me, that's the thing that matters
[08:55:16] <Amadiro> but even with ftp or a plain TCP socket, the rpi can't exceed around 5-6MiB/s, when connected to a gigabit switch.
[09:07:03] <megal0maniac> I get pretty good performance with samba. USB is the bottleneck
[09:07:46] <megal0maniac> Amadiro: I forgot about that. They use a 3 port hub and a USB to ethernet thingy. No MAC built in
[09:07:53] <megal0maniac> So that makes perfect sense
[09:11:21] <megal0maniac> Amadiro: This looks like the winner so far:
http://www.marsboard.com/
[09:11:32] <megal0maniac> I shall sleep on it
[09:15:05] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, looks good
[09:15:16] <Amadiro> well, looks a lot like the cubieboard
[09:15:22] <megal0maniac> It essentially is
[09:15:29] <megal0maniac> Same hardware
[09:15:47] <megal0maniac> They also have an A20 version
[09:16:00] <Amadiro> megal0maniac, then I'd probably go with the one that is better supported/has a bigger community
[09:16:22] <megal0maniac> But if they're hardware compatible, then they're one in the same
[09:21:20] <twnqx> megal0maniac: do they have A20 gates?
[09:21:35] <megal0maniac> A20 gates? I don't follow..
[09:24:01] <twnqx> you don't know much about PCs, do you? :P
[09:24:22] <megal0maniac> twnqx: There are gaps in my knowledge ;)
[09:24:38] <twnqx> i remember, you're pretty young :P
[09:24:42] <vectory> i think he does, or i know little, too
[09:24:48] <megal0maniac> one and twenty years
[09:24:53] <twnqx> kiddo :P
[09:24:56] <megal0maniac> :D
[09:25:01] <twnqx> guess you did never run DOS
[09:25:08] <twnqx> on something in the 286 range
[09:25:51] <vectory> win 3.1 on 486, commander keen ftw
[09:26:03] <Amadiro> twnqx, DOS is not that old. I'm 24, and I have run DOS. In fact, I ran across DOS applications last time around 2006, where it was still used with rbase or so, in a lab for data logging
[09:26:31] <twnqx> well
[09:26:35] <twnqx> to sum it u
[09:26:36] <twnqx> p
[09:27:07] <twnqx> the 8086/8088 had 1MB of addressable ram, but since it was a 16bit cpu, it has do use 64kB "segments"
[09:27:23] <twnqx> the way that could be used managed to make it wrap around the 1MB mark
[09:27:45] <twnqx> for downwards compatibility in the chips that could address more, the A20 address line was gated.
[09:29:39] <twnqx> dunno if it still exists, but it was slowing down memory access far into the Intel Core CPU days.
[09:29:55] <vectory> back on topic, theres an allwinner 20? cool beans
[09:39:04] <theBear> gate a20
[09:39:28] <theBear> heh, cascaded interrupt controllers (8259?) golden days !
[09:45:07] <twnqx> :ยท)
[10:05:03] <megal0maniac> I understand :)
[10:05:32] <megal0maniac> My first machine was an 800mhz P3
[10:05:48] <megal0maniac> Downgraded to a 166mhz P1 and then worked my way up again
[10:20:50] <Casper> damn siri is stupid...
[10:23:12] <Casper> it can't understand anything!
[11:01:02] <BJfreeman> ah yes the days of z80 and 8080, rom basic, CPM
[11:02:03] <twnqx> CPM on the z80... been there done that.
[11:02:08] <twnqx> on a commodore 128 :D
[11:02:13] <BJfreeman> and olimex has an A20 board
[11:03:35] <BJfreeman> actually my first z80 was wirewrapped s100 dual ported ram with multiipe z80 as perhipherials
[11:04:17] <BJfreeman> loaded the monitor loader (tape) thought switches
[11:14:13] <braincracker> h
[11:14:26] * twnqx uses 5.25" floppies
[11:14:56] <braincracker> i don't ;/ would need to machine bells for the corcodile motor
[11:15:06] <braincracker> stock one is crap
[11:15:23] <Tom_itx> w
[11:16:36] <Tom_itx> casette tape readers were the shizzle
[11:17:31] <Xark> BJfreeman: What did you do with SMP Z-80s? Custom stuff?
[11:23:31] <Casper> hmmmm
[11:23:47] <braincracker> who has the most complex button handling ?
[11:23:47] <Casper> "load *play* *enter*"
[11:24:33] <Casper> "Loading error! *rewind* *load* *play with volume and tone* *play* *enter"
[11:24:47] <braincracker> Casper <= select from list, hit enter, play ;>>
[11:25:23] <Casper> that was on my romar II, an apple II clone
[11:26:25] <Casper> it was weird... it could load fine 10 times in a row, and all of a suddent it wouln't load anymore, had to play with the 2 knobs, which ends up at about the same place...
[11:29:04] <braincracker> just curious, how a user usually handle keys on an mcu ?
[11:29:13] <braincracker> some library?
[11:29:53] <braincracker> or the good old blocking if pressed, then loop while pressed way?
[11:30:16] <braincracker> though this does not include debounce then
[11:31:51] <theBear> dirty pots... you just didn't notice cos you weren't "listening" to them
[11:33:17] <twnqx> sample on interrupts
[11:33:54] <braincracker> and countdown for debounce ? or that is difficult?
[11:35:17] <braincracker> i just did pcint, make with debounce, brake = cycle
[11:37:16] <braincracker> then added a compose key feature
[11:38:19] <Casper> braincracker: some connect the key to an interrupt pin, and use the timer to debounce... other just use a busy loop, some just debounce in hardware and the lazy one use a key debouncer IC
[11:38:47] <braincracker> hmm
[11:39:36] <braincracker> there are benefints using a 10-100nf cap across a buton, that does not replace software signal-processing, but like it prevents interrupt causing glitch in computing
[11:39:44] <braincracker> tt
[11:40:35] <braincracker> it *works* without one... but high rate interrupting may cause the code to temporarily stop executing
[11:41:12] <braincracker> drawback of limitless rate pcint...
[11:45:29] <Xark> I prefer to just poll buttons with a ~50hz interrupt (on a timer).
[11:46:20] <braincracker> advantage of pcint is it do not require polling
[11:47:23] <Xark> Yes, but it is slower (and unpredictable overhead with multiple bounce interrupts) and generally your mainline code will be polling the data from the interrupt anyways (depending on application).
[11:47:55] <Xark> Also makes it "trivial" if you want auto-repeat etc.
[11:48:08] <braincracker> i prefer storing in variables that can be read by the functions
[11:49:17] <Xark> braincracker: Exactly, and the periodic interrupt can set these variables.
[11:50:13] <braincracker> if you have a clock running
[11:50:47] <Xark> braincracker: Most software schemes use some kind of timer anyways.
[11:51:03] <braincracker> yes, but some use wake-up interrupts from sleep
[11:51:18] <braincracker> like your bicycle lights maybe, or the odometer
[11:52:22] <Xark> braincracker: Right, if you want the app to sleep until a button hit (with no background tasks), then PCINT (or similar) may make sense.
[11:53:26] <Xark> braincracker: However, you can still save a lot of power "sleeping" until a periodic interrupt 50 times a second (and often you have other things to check besides sleeping for button).
[11:53:29] <braincracker> or if you don't have a slow enough, or fast enough clock at the moment ?
[11:54:17] <Xark> braincracker: Well, obviously the fully correct answer is "it depends". :)
[11:54:29] <braincracker> when you only run a divided 32768Hz clock ticking at 1Hz rate using interrupt
[11:55:05] <braincracker> i didn't do that now because i made a POV display now that needed 128Hz+
[11:55:23] <braincracker> at 256Hz refresh, 5 digits look nice
[11:56:15] <braincracker> but still, i think i will prefer just usong 5 595's and just statically displaying, that takes less cpu power
[12:32:31] <BJfreeman> Xark still in storage with Exidy and Commador 1000
[12:36:53] <Xark> BJfreeman: No, I meant originally what did you use it for? Running CP/M (with a spare Z-80)?
[12:37:02] <twnqx> braincracker: the timer wakes up the chip perfectly
[12:37:22] <twnqx> in fact i run 1khz timer interrupts
[12:37:36] <twnqx> and main is just around while (1) sleep();
[12:37:44] <braincracker> and it is worth it in terms of power consumption ?
[12:38:31] <braincracker> compared to a 32768Hz xtal ?
[12:38:40] <twnqx> i need 16mhz anyway
[12:38:53] <braincracker> i use async watch crystal now
[12:50:04] <BJfreeman> Xark it was a proof of concept for an executive running many z80 slaves through dual ported ram
[12:50:54] <Xark> BJfreeman: I see, cool. I used M/PM (with one Z-80 and 16K OS RAM bank and multiple 48K user memory banks).
[12:51:38] <BJfreeman> ah M/PM have not heard that for a long time
[12:52:34] <Xark> BJfreeman: Got pretty slow at times with multiple programmers running Wordstar as an editor (all with 9600 baud serial terminals). :)
[12:52:49] <BJfreeman> LOL
[12:53:09] <BJfreeman> even Unix of that day got slow
[12:54:02] <Xark> BJfreeman: When that machine was retired the company got a Z8000 based Zeus Unix system. We upped terminal speed to 19.2Kbaud and switched to vi (it was a huge upgrade and I have loved Unix ever since). :)
[12:54:04] <braincracker> twnqx<= what are you building ?
[12:54:13] <twnqx> me?
[12:54:16] <twnqx> nothing
[12:54:17] <braincracker> BJfreeman<= what are you building ?
[12:54:23] <braincracker> Xark<= what are you building ?
[12:54:27] <twnqx> i am just watching top gear
[12:55:02] <Xark> braincracker: Lately working on a little FPGA system (but feeling under the weather today).
[12:55:03] <BJfreeman> braincracker the main focus is a johnny 5 look a like
[12:55:19] <BJfreeman> right now working on the LIDAR
[12:55:24] <braincracker> ;>
[12:55:41] <braincracker> BJfreeman <= with some beaglebone ?
[12:56:22] <BJfreeman> mostly STM32F4 from olimex
[12:56:45] <braincracker> Xark <= weather is not of concern underground
[12:57:12] <braincracker> BJfreeman <= oh i remember you like open hardware ;)
[12:57:40] <BJfreeman> yup
[12:58:16] <braincracker> how does the stuff performcompared to a beaglebone black or pandaboard ?
[12:58:19] <BJfreeman> have a few STM43F4 discovery boards as well
[13:04:03] <braincracker> server reused older tcp connections to satisfly ddos requests
[13:07:34] <braincracker> server reused older tcp connections to satisfly ddos requests
[13:07:40] <braincracker> ;>
[13:14:26] <BJfreeman> braincracker i have not compared but here is the links b\
https://www.olimex.com/Products/ARM/ST/STM32-E407/ http://www.st.com/web/catalog/mmc/FM141/SC1169/SS1577/LN11/PF252133
[13:15:55] <braincracker> https://www.olimex.com/Products/ARM/ST/STM32-E407/ < oh this is not a pc type thing, industrial control
[13:16:26] <braincracker> beaglebone and pandaboard has ddr ram and runs linux too
[13:16:40] <BJfreeman> yes I am a system integrator focus is SCADA
[13:17:12] <braincracker> so this will be the brain of some quadcopter-drone-swarm with weapons ?
[13:19:29] <BJfreeman> braincracker I use the A13 and A20 for SOC with Android and Linux
[13:56:39] <Gumboot> Amadiro: Pi is ARMv6, but most distros build for ARMv7 and up.
[13:57:23] <Gumboot> Once you have a kernel, you can use whatever distro you like, provided you have an ARMv7 processor.
[13:57:52] <Gumboot> Most of the remaining "legacy" build disros use soft-float, which is terrible also.
[14:06:12] <Gumboot> megal0maniac_afk: Also, I noticed the marsboard a while back, and while it's probably fine, colleagues started making fun of some of the other products on the same site.
[14:06:32] <Gumboot> Being obvious cheap knockoffs of very expensive hardware sold as if they were the real thing.
[14:07:04] <Gumboot> Stuff I'd never heard of, so I wouldn't have known either way.
[15:01:09] <cart_man> http://imgur.com/gallery/HkVpxsp
[15:02:44] <RikusW> heh
[15:43:42] <megal0maniac> Gumboot: I'm pretty sure it is a knock-off. But given that I'm trying to spend as little as possible, it makes sense for me to get it over the cubie
[15:44:13] * megal0maniac wonders if armhf will work on armv5te
[15:46:02] <specing> it won't
[15:46:14] <megal0maniac> Because it doesn't have a FPU
[15:46:17] <megal0maniac> I see this now
[15:46:36] <megal0maniac> armel it is!
[15:46:52] <megal0maniac> specing: Isn't your router x86?
[15:46:56] <specing> yes it is
[15:47:04] * specing hugs his router
[15:48:25] <megal0maniac> Which model alix was it again?
[15:53:34] <megal0maniac> Gumboot: Wow this is actually bad:
http://www.hotmcu.com/arduino-leonardo-r3-with-headers-p-37.html
[16:00:52] <megal0maniac> My moral compass is pointing me towards the cubieboard
[16:05:14] <specing> megal0maniac: 2d13
[16:48:48] <braincracker> http://beagleboard.org/Products/BeagleBone%20Black similar with 1G ram, and 1.2GHz dualcore ARM
http://pandaboard.org/node/300/#specs
[16:49:10] <braincracker> Gumboot
[17:08:32] <Roklobsta> hmmm, does it do mythtvfrontend or xbmc?
[17:09:24] <Roklobsta> funny how it costs as much as an arduino mega
[17:10:30] <braincracker> :)
[17:10:36] <braincracker> this is not a toy
[17:11:53] <braincracker> these can run quake 3 too
[17:12:22] <BJfreeman> https://www.olimex.com/Products/OLinuXino/A20/
[17:12:39] <braincracker> oh sorry forgot BJfreeman 's favorite ;>> the all open hardware
[17:13:45] <BJfreeman> :D
[17:13:50] <braincracker> can this do 1280x1024 too?
https://www.olimex.com/Products/OLinuXino/A20/A20-OLinuXino-MICRO-4GB/
[17:13:57] <jadew> hey, has anyone else noticed if dusty wet cables have a bad smell?
[17:14:06] <jadew> I'm not sure if I should continue washing them or just throw them out
[17:14:48] <braincracker> looks nice, but i'd like it more if it would say "already loaded with linux" instead of Android already loaded on the NAND
[17:14:52] <braincracker> <;
[17:15:48] <braincracker> jadew<= that is normal, chemical decomposition, and leaking out BHA and BHT and various other stuff
[17:16:07] <BJfreeman> just plugn in SD and load Linux in ~10 sec
[17:16:41] <jadew> braincracker, ah ha, that's good to know
[17:16:47] <braincracker> i'd look into it, but i only see pi and beaglebone black around locally
[17:16:48] <braincracker> ;/
[17:16:56] <jadew> thanks
[17:17:10] <BJfreeman> I have a debian and unbutu version
[17:17:15] <Roklobsta> if these beagles had SATA they'd be perfect
[17:17:19] <braincracker> hehe
[17:17:23] <braincracker> you can add it i think
[17:17:25] <Roklobsta> and pcie
[17:17:38] <braincracker> does the sata require 500ppm clock like the lame usb?
[17:18:06] <BJfreeman> A20 had SATA
[17:18:10] <BJfreeman> has
[17:18:16] <braincracker> 1.5Gbps is a bit fast to bitbang otherwise
[17:18:23] <Roklobsta> heh
[17:18:57] <braincracker> btw, if you are missing ports, just use 2 ios for a ps2 keyboard ;>>
[17:19:02] <Roklobsta> beagle with a 64GB SSD would be great
[17:19:23] <braincracker> well, you could use the usb for an usb ssd
[17:19:30] <braincracker> and add ps2 mouse and keyboard to ios
[17:19:44] <braincracker> and no usb hub required
[17:22:32] <Roklobsta> hmmm A20 looks nice too
[17:22:37] <Roklobsta> too many thing, too little time
[17:22:54] <braincracker> yeah but i guess $100 thing would cost $200-$300 imported
[17:24:20] <braincracker> i like the sata in the olimex too ;>
[17:24:22] <Roklobsta> well, maybe if you live in a place where they have stupid import duty
[17:24:29] <Roklobsta> and crappy shipping arrangements
[17:24:30] <braincracker> just plug in your favorite hdd
[17:25:00] <braincracker> it is ... open-hardware, has everything you want
[17:25:24] <braincracker> HDMI ... probably because its smaller connector
[17:25:27] <braincracker> dvi is larger
[17:25:57] <BJfreeman> olimex is Bulgaria
[17:26:01] <braincracker> Composite TV-output on 6-pin 0.01'' step connector
[17:26:08] <braincracker> hacker's friend too
[17:26:15] <braincracker> Bulgaria is in eu ?
[17:26:36] <BJfreeman> yes
[17:26:57] <braincracker> hmm, then maybe i could order it within EU without insane taxes?
[17:27:18] <OndraSter> I should leave the chat for a while. I can't hear about taxes anymore this year
[17:27:22] <OndraSter> import taxes
[17:28:16] <braincracker> oh yea, bad memories eh?
[17:28:33] <OndraSter> NOOOO
[17:28:39] <OndraSter> I will be having nightmarse now
[17:28:42] <OndraSter> nightmares*
[17:28:43] <OndraSter> thanks!
[17:28:45] <OndraSter> lol
[17:28:59] <OndraSter> do you know that here you have to pay taxes even from shipping? ><
[17:29:08] <OndraSter> even when the shipping was free?
[17:29:13] <braincracker> oh don't worry here too
[17:29:20] <OndraSter> I think this is EU law
[17:29:35] <OndraSter> I mean - I ordered from digikey for $205 or so
[17:29:38] <OndraSter> so I just got free shipping
[17:29:39] <braincracker> soon they will require you to pay tax using solar cells on your own house
[17:29:51] <OndraSter> they luckily effed up the papers otherwise I would pay for the papers and taxes over $110
[17:30:03] <braincracker> the sun is property of the state you know
[17:30:13] <OndraSter> not here - they "effed" up the law and the govt had to pay serious money to the people :P
[17:30:20] <OndraSter> "effed"
[17:30:21] <OndraSter> so
[17:30:33] <OndraSter> the ones who got big fields were of course friends with the politicians
[17:30:36] <OndraSter> HOW UNEXPECTED
[17:31:00] <BJfreeman> have tax write off on solar here
[17:31:36] <braincracker> oh not only buying solar cells, you have to pay when using them
[17:31:37] <braincracker> :)
[17:32:05] <OndraSter> actually here you have to pay when you don't have them
[17:32:06] <OndraSter> on taxes
[17:32:10] <braincracker> they will tell you the sun is property of the state
[17:32:11] <OndraSter> so the govt can pay the ones who have them
[17:32:31] <OndraSter> I am wondering - is it EVERYWHERE on the world so screwed up?
[17:32:32] <OndraSter> the laws
[17:32:33] <OndraSter> about everything
[17:32:46] <braincracker> no, the terrorists are all right for now
[17:32:48] <OndraSter> or is there at least one country where it is relatively okay?
[17:32:50] <braincracker> 3 states
[17:32:59] <braincracker> *countries
[17:33:12] <BJfreeman> have netmetering here so you build up you account while sunny and use up the credit when not
[17:38:48] <Roklobsta> solar panels in .au are welfare for the rich. you need some serious money to invest in them then you get handout for using them. people without solar cells end up paying bigger and bigger bills each year to help fund the richies.
[17:39:28] <twnqx> same in germany, if that's any consolatio
[17:39:29] <twnqx> n
[17:40:07] <Roklobsta> and we also have to pay extra money on the bills for smartmeters noone wanted
[17:40:12] <braincracker> :)
[17:41:07] <Roklobsta> so that the electric companies can one day start charging for timeofday use
[17:41:18] <Roklobsta> and sell your usage data on
[17:41:56] <BJfreeman> we have time of day use here
[17:42:02] <Roklobsta> where is here
[17:42:25] <BJfreeman> Nw Washington State USA
[17:52:53] <pWNAGE> o/ WA
[18:23:11] <BJfreeman> pWNAGE \o
[19:33:43] <ColdKeyboard> Why am I getting this error for function declaration -> "error: conflicting declarations for variable"
[19:33:47] <ColdKeyboard> :S
[19:37:14] <ColdKeyboard> Nevermind, compiler didn't see function prototype so he by default tought that function is int type but later in code I defined it as void
[19:37:28] <ColdKeyboard> I added prototype for this function on top of the main file and now it seems to work
[21:54:37] <timemage> ColdKeyboard, you may want to crank up the warning level.
[21:57:39] <ColdKeyboard> I should do that
[21:57:56] <ColdKeyboard> Does anyone have a "simple" USB dll for vb.net to recommend?
[21:58:14] <ColdKeyboard> I only need it to read 64bytes of data from the HID and maybe send same amount of data to HID
[21:58:19] <ColdKeyboard> any suggestions?\
[22:51:29] <MarkX> hey
[22:52:45] <MarkX> just to confirm, "UEINTX = ~(1<<TXINI);" first sets TXINI to 1 then inverts the entire register?
[22:56:03] <MarkX> so if we start with 0000 0000. go to 0000 1000 (assuming TXINI is bit 3), then go to 1111 0111?
[23:02:17] <Casper> that's about it
[23:02:19] <Casper> however
[23:03:05] <Casper> it actually store 1 in a register, bitshift by the bit number of TXINI, then invert it
[23:03:06] <Casper> but
[23:04:36] <MarkX> oh ok
[23:04:46] <Casper> since this can be optimised at compilation time, instead of doing (sorry, I'm not an asm coder) load immediate 1 in register x, shift x, shift x, shift x.... it will actually precalculate 1<<TXINI
[23:05:01] <MarkX> right right
[23:05:06] <MarkX> i get ya
[23:05:21] <Casper> so the code will be "load 4 into UEINTX"
[23:05:35] <MarkX> but in that command, why are we blindly inverting UEINTX?
[23:05:51] <Casper> I think your code is wrong
[23:06:13] <Casper> usually that would be UEINTX &= ~(1<<TXINI)
[23:06:16] <MarkX> before the command UEINTX was (just as an example) 0000 0000, and now suddenly its 1111 0111
[23:06:40] <Casper> for clear bit TXINI in UEINTX
[23:06:53] <Casper> double check that you do not have a missing &
[23:06:58] <MarkX> i do not
[23:07:19] <MarkX> this is someone else's code, i'm just trying to understand it
[23:07:30] <Casper> check for bug then, there is an high chance of a missing & there
[23:08:12] <MarkX> https://micropendous.googlecode.com/svn-history/r724/trunk/Micropendous/Firmware/Arduino1_Bootloader/src/USBCore.cpp
[23:08:19] <MarkX> err
[23:08:22] <MarkX> wait thats the cpp version
[23:08:25] <MarkX> i have the C version
[23:10:44] <MarkX> https://cnlohr.net/pubsvn/electrical/avr_gps_camera/usb.c
[23:10:51] <MarkX> usb_send_in function
[23:12:02] <Casper> too late to check, but I would say it's a bug
[23:13:39] <MarkX> it is too late
[23:13:52] <MarkX> thats why i'm having trouble wrapping my head around one line
[23:13:52] <MarkX> XD