#avr | Logs for 2013-04-11

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[01:14:44] <xrosnight> hello guys
[03:13:58] <langoliers> h
[04:55:23] <megal0maniac> Tom_itx: I think "ardweenie" can be a good starting point. The UNO is the first AVR board I had, and I found myself asking "but why?" a lot. Now I often use the libraries as code examples for how to do things
[06:04:16] <langoliers> bored? :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKWoPlL2B8I
[06:08:25] <megal0maniac> Yeah, I've done the majority of those things
[06:12:07] <megal0maniac> Ooh, I actually have done one of them. Kind of
[06:15:05] <Horologium> I hit a golf ball with a golf club once!
[06:16:02] <megal0maniac> I drove a ford cobra once
[06:16:10] <megal0maniac> But not indoors around a pillar
[06:16:35] <theBear> heh
[06:16:58] <theBear> someone gives me a go in a car, first thing i do is go around a pillar indoors :)
[06:25:29] <Steffanx> Sure you can do that theBear ? :)
[06:27:36] <Horologium> I only made it to the golfing bit in the vide.
[06:34:05] <theBear> not really, noone willing to give me a go in their car :)
[06:51:40] * megal0maniac waves at nekuro
[07:26:34] <langoliers> would you try this? Jeb Corliss - Wingsuit BEST http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_OCJyhaJA8
[08:16:35] <langoliers> megal0maniac_afk<= btw that is called drifting
[08:18:46] <langoliers> they say it is more difficult than hovering a harrier
[08:55:18] <microchip_sac> does anyone know a good way to communicate between avr devices
[08:55:22] <microchip_sac> using ir?
[08:57:04] <langoliers> use a microchip ic
[08:57:39] <tzanger> lol
[08:58:26] <Malinuss> microchip_sac, IR receiver and remote on both, and then just manchester code..?
[08:58:29] <tzanger> microchip_sac: it's the same as any micro. SPI is good for high speed, full duplex. UART probably next in line, followed by I2C
[08:58:42] <Malinuss> tzanger, I thought he wanted to use IR
[08:58:46] <tzanger> if you want some wireless tech hook a uart up to an IR transciever
[08:58:58] <langoliers> SUPER SWEET 16 *SPOOF*! lold hahaha http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLCRCAimdcU
[08:59:21] <tzanger> or drive the SPI lines with LEDs/phototransistors (there are tricks to making LEDs very fast) but now you have alignment issues
[09:01:17] <jadew> if the receiver and the transmitter are going to be really close, you can use any protocol
[09:01:40] <Malinuss> I think what tzanger sugested with uart + IR trasciever is propably the easiest... any reason you specifaclly want to use IR microchip_sac ? There are many easier (and easily as cheap/cheaper) ways to do wirelles comunication
[09:02:34] <microchip_sac> i want to implement the easiest wireless communication
[09:02:36] <jadew> what cheapper ways?
[09:02:47] <microchip_sac> short distance s fine
[09:04:02] <microchip_sac> are ir tranceivers available separately?
[09:04:14] <microchip_sac> can i implement them inside an avr?
[09:06:59] <Malinuss> jadew, the 433mhz/316mhz modules are sometimes sold for 2$ for a 2xset, with shipping
[09:07:41] <jadew> I'm sure an ir led + ir sensor is cheapper than that :P
[09:08:16] <Malinuss> microchip_sac, just buy two of these if you want reliable, pretty long distance and pretty cheap (3$) http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arduino-NRF24L01-2-4GHz-Wireless-Transceiver-Module-New-/170819062996?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c59c0cd4
[09:09:04] <Malinuss> not super fast though, iirc about 4Mbit/s max
[09:12:41] <tzanger> the demodulating rx modules are cheap enough but you'll need a matching transmitter if you use them (and you should)
[09:13:53] <DagoRed> Malinuss: That's REALLY fast, I would be careful to make sure there is a proper library for those chips.
[09:14:15] <microchip_sac> i just want simple, short distance communication
[09:14:30] <microchip_sac> possibly done with code inside the avr
[09:14:50] <Malinuss> DagoRed, there is, and even if there weren't the chips are really easy to work with, and it will take 10 minutes to make your own "library" for simple communication
[09:15:00] <microchip_sac> like programmaticaly transmitting/receiving ir signals
[09:15:17] <Malinuss> well if that's what you want, then do that
[09:15:20] <Malinuss> lol
[09:15:23] <microchip_sac> how?
[09:15:44] <DagoRed> Malinuss: Depends, if you need to write a library for FSK or something, it may take more of an effort than you expected.
[09:16:25] <microchip_sac> can i use pwm for ir transmission, using some standard protocol?
[09:17:28] <microchip_sac> and then, how do i demodulate the signal at the other end?
[09:17:36] <Malinuss> DagoRed, I know from practice that it does (made my own library for the 433mhz modules, using "my own" encoding, packages, handshakes etc.), but I'm telling you, the NRF modules already have all that onboard, you just SPI to it with some basic set up, and then just send whatever you want to send, everything else is done automagic, very nice
[09:18:50] <jadew> how do you deal with multiple modules?
[09:19:01] <jadew> is there collision detection and stuff like that?
[09:19:31] <DagoRed> Malinuss: In that case I just ordered 6.
[09:20:48] <DagoRed> Malinuss: Thank you for answering my question. I think these key parts will be great for my class I'm building.
[09:20:58] <Malinuss> DagoRed, lol look for some better deal then, offen there are cheaper deals when you buy like 5x NRF for 7$ or something like that.... Also I would still take a look in the datasheet if I were you to be sure that's what you need
[09:21:19] <Malinuss> jadew, yes
[09:22:28] <microchip_sac> do i need these modules for very simple, single-channel applications?
[09:23:57] <Malinuss> jadew, electromagnetic waves don't collide ;D... But yes you can have up to 20 iirc, you set the adress of each module, you can also configure a lot of things, like having one "main" that sends out to others that "listen".. great for home automatition etc.
[09:24:06] <DagoRed> Malinuss: I'm building a course to teach basic electronics and programming to kids and k-12 educator. I am finishing a course now that will be adapted to this new one.
[09:24:23] <Malinuss> DagoRed, what do you want to show?
[09:25:17] <Malinuss> or propably you can have up to 254 now I think about it ;D
[09:25:21] <Malinuss> would make more sense too
[09:25:37] <DagoRed> I'm calling it "scrap bots". Basically allowing people to build little robots like battle bots, but limit the materials to card board and popsickle sticks so 1) great destruction can be expected 2) hopefully the materials will be so weak that an insurance waiver won't have to be signed.
[09:25:48] <DagoRed> I just need point to point controllers.
[09:26:05] <DagoRed> 1 for the controller to transmit and 1 receiver.
[09:26:52] <Malinuss> DagoRed, hmm I see.. those would definetly work that way but as a minimalist I would feel their potential would be wasted :)
[09:28:39] <microchip_sac> like DagoRed's requirement, i also need one-way (possibly two-way) communication
[09:29:52] <Malinuss> like I said, the NRF would work with no problem for that, but I would personally feel like it would be overkill... for you (no other modules near to interfere with, I would just go with the cheap 315/433mhz ASK modules
[09:30:09] <Malinuss> and just buy a receiver/transmmiter kit for 1.5$
[09:31:04] <microchip_sac> so i must have modules for ir communication?
[09:32:27] <Malinuss> for IR? no
[09:32:56] <Malinuss> just buy a IR LED, and a receiver... DONE
[09:33:02] <Malinuss> microchip_sac, ^
[09:34:08] <microchip_sac> what about the receiving end?
[09:34:23] <microchip_sac> i can take care of the transmission programmatically
[09:34:51] <DagoRed> Wow.... that was a weird netsplit
[09:46:15] <Malinuss> microchip_sac, IR reicever on receiver end, IR LED on transmitter end... done
[09:47:50] <DagoRed> One can make their life easier by getting the ones that modulated and badpassed at whatever frequency they use (I think 38 kHz
[09:54:38] <Malinuss> DagoRed, yep
[09:55:06] <Malinuss> I would sugest that (37khz or 38khz iirc), don't expect fast data transter then though :)
[09:55:32] <DagoRed> Naturally.
[09:57:48] <microchip_sac> thank you, guys!
[10:24:35] <langoliers> Message to Microsoft (by military men) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYpiQvkfBnU Man robs BP station, former Marine fights back ^^ oh no not the chips rack http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcvOhmFPxEg
[11:12:34] <langoliers> How to Deal with Stupid Drivers !!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQ71Aa-qCR8
[11:12:35] <langoliers> :)
[11:47:13] <megal0maniac> 'lo RikusW!
[11:48:21] <RikusW> hi megal0maniac :)
[11:48:35] <RikusW> you can dropbox your arduino stuff now :)
[11:48:39] * RikusW is on ADSL
[11:48:44] <RikusW> 4MBit
[11:48:44] <megal0maniac> You already there??
[11:48:47] <RikusW> yep
[11:49:03] <megal0maniac> No fibre to the farm? :P
[11:49:14] <RikusW> no :(
[11:49:20] <RikusW> http://www.matrixusa.us/microdrilling.htm
[11:49:24] <RikusW> interesting site
[11:50:07] * RikusW wishes there were fibre everywhere ;)
[11:50:18] <RikusW> gigabit internet for us all
[11:51:03] <megal0maniac> Heck, I'd be very happy with 4mbit
[11:51:29] <RikusW> shared with my brother and someone else
[11:51:36] <megal0maniac> Can't even say I have a problem with 1mbit. Big files, I just wget on the router
[11:51:42] <RikusW> what do you have now ?
[11:51:44] <megal0maniac> Then go to sleep :P
[11:51:48] <megal0maniac> 1mbit
[11:52:02] * RikusW got uncapped for R900 / m
[11:52:23] <RikusW> /3 ofcourse :)
[11:53:00] <megal0maniac> Ours is uncapped too. Last month was our first full month with it, and Telkom sent us an email calling me a "Power user" and saying our speed will be dropped for a month if I don't slow down
[11:53:45] <RikusW> heh :)
[11:53:52] <RikusW> we use Afrihost
[11:54:02] <megal0maniac> Main problem is that Transmission runs on my router with a 2.5" drive connected, so downloading 24/7. And I set up QoS so that it didn't interfere with browsing
[11:55:51] <megal0maniac> RikusW: Get hold of the latest arduino .zip in the meanwhile
[11:55:59] <RikusW> ok
[11:56:06] <megal0maniac> (This is a Windows only mod. For now...)
[11:56:06] <RikusW> which version did you use ?
[11:56:27] <megal0maniac> Anything 1.0 up will work. I used latest
[11:57:13] <RikusW> seems pcb drills can go up to 150000rpm !
[11:57:26] <megal0maniac> Good grief
[11:57:39] <megal0maniac> That's the same speed as a Seagate Cheetah drive
[11:57:54] <inkjetunito> 10x
[11:57:54] <megal0maniac> Oh wait
[11:58:05] <megal0maniac> inkjetunito: Too many 000000s :)
[11:58:08] <inkjetunito> evenigns
[11:58:12] <megal0maniac> 'lo
[11:58:14] <RikusW> 150krpm
[11:58:18] <RikusW> hi
[11:59:26] <megal0maniac> RikusW: I "borrowed" code modifications from http://www.mattairtech.com/index.php/development-boards/atmega32u2-usb-development-board-arduino-compatible.html
[12:00:09] <megal0maniac> Didn't take out his name, though. Just added mine underneath :) It's all GPL anyway
[12:01:04] <RikusW> ok
[12:01:22] <RikusW> so you do use my bootloader to get it working ?
[12:01:40] <megal0maniac> Yip. stk500pp
[12:02:01] <RikusW> did you use mode 8F ?
[12:02:03] <megal0maniac> Should be able to use programmer mode as well, but I haven't tested
[12:02:07] <RikusW> the one with the timeout ?
[12:02:07] <megal0maniac> No, 81
[12:02:28] <RikusW> iirc Arduino use DTR to enter bootloader mode
[12:02:37] <RikusW> then you jump to mode 8F
[12:02:42] <megal0maniac> Mmm... I think so
[12:02:49] <RikusW> and after a timeout it will go to the sketch
[12:02:50] <megal0maniac> Might have been DTR
[12:02:55] <RikusW> timeout is about 1s
[12:03:10] <megal0maniac> Just wasn't sure how to switch to 8F
[12:03:22] <RikusW> err, use the leds off bit with 8F :-P
[12:04:04] <RikusW> 0xAF
[12:04:27] <megal0maniac> Now I'm confused
[12:04:51] <RikusW> 0x20 prevents the led from flashing when you change modes
[12:04:59] <RikusW> so 20 | 8F = AF
[12:05:22] <megal0maniac> And I set that where?..
[12:05:47] <RikusW> how do you switch to bootloader mode ?
[12:05:51] <RikusW> using the buttons ?
[12:05:58] <megal0maniac> No man
[12:06:04] <megal0maniac> The "leds off bit"
[12:06:13] <RikusW> as part of the mode
[12:06:31] <RikusW> instead of 81 you can send A1 and the led wont flash
[12:06:50] <megal0maniac> I'll let you refine it when you get it :P
[12:06:54] <RikusW> ok
[12:07:20] <RikusW> I might switch it over to using my builtin CDC if that isn't too much effort
[12:07:39] <megal0maniac> Sent you the link
[12:07:55] <megal0maniac> Yeah, it's LUFA based at the moment. It works bit I think it's quite big
[12:08:35] <megal0maniac> Especially given that there's LUFA and your modules. Gets quite big
[12:09:16] <RikusW> seems like there are 0.02mm (20um) drill bits available !?..
[12:09:32] <RikusW> how big ?
[12:09:35] <RikusW> 15k ?
[12:09:50] <megal0maniac> Not sure...
[12:10:19] <megal0maniac> One sec
[12:11:39] <megal0maniac> Difference between bitlash on Uno and on U2S is like 2kb
[12:11:48] <RikusW> seems those thin 20um bits spin at 350krpm !
[12:12:41] <RikusW> downloading at 100KB/s :)
[12:12:56] <RikusW> 4 minutes remaining
[12:13:01] <RikusW> 3
[12:13:37] <megal0maniac> 100kb/s is the speed I get on my 1mbit line
[12:14:00] <megal0maniac> 28kbps of crappy exchanges and overhead
[12:15:00] <megal0maniac> Are the u2 and u4 pin compatible?
[12:15:09] <RikusW> not quite
[12:15:22] <RikusW> and u4 got some differences in registers
[12:15:29] <RikusW> most notably the regulator enable register
[12:15:34] <RikusW> and its got more usb ram
[12:15:48] <megal0maniac> 2.5x RAM in genera
[12:15:48] <RikusW> but u4 got a weird messy pinout
[12:15:56] <megal0maniac> And ADC and I2C
[12:15:58] <RikusW> I got one
[12:16:06] <RikusW> but no pcb for it yet
[12:16:11] <megal0maniac> Me too. It's called a Teensy :P
[12:16:21] <RikusW> will probably make a pcb sometime
[12:16:28] <RikusW> since I only need one
[12:19:19] * megal0maniac is looking at mbed stuff
[12:19:21] <RikusW> megal0maniac: how will I know which files you changed ?
[12:19:41] <RikusW> and it seems my 7z thinks you used unsupported compression algos
[12:19:44] <megal0maniac> Not much really
[12:19:51] <megal0maniac> LZMA2 ?
[12:20:06] <megal0maniac> Gave the best compression. And I think it's default
[12:20:27] <RikusW> my 7z version is 4.42
[12:21:01] <megal0maniac> I replaced WinAVR with the latest (2010) version. Updated power.h and used the avrdude binary which comes with Arduino (as it's been modified)
[12:21:12] <megal0maniac> Arduino still comes with a 2008 version :/
[12:21:50] <RikusW> I've noticed...
[12:22:14] <megal0maniac> So that provides core support for the u2. Then in the hardware folder, that's from mattairtech's board but modified for U2S pinout and VID/PID and some strings
[12:23:07] <megal0maniac> Digital pin 0 is D0, 8 is B0 and 16 is C4, 20 is LED
[12:23:29] <RikusW> thats exactly how I did it :)
[12:23:32] <megal0maniac> Timers are mapped correctly. ADC support is disabled
[12:23:42] <RikusW> did you look at the patch I sent you ?
[12:24:40] <megal0maniac> Yes, got it open
[12:25:17] <RikusW> so you got the pinout numbering idea there ?
[12:25:37] <megal0maniac> No. Just modified what was already done :P
[12:25:47] <megal0maniac> Actually forgot about this patch
[12:26:04] <megal0maniac> Re-ordered it, at least
[12:26:29] <megal0maniac> I didn't have to do a heck of a lot. I just hacked at mattairtech's modification and said thank you very much :P
[12:26:40] <RikusW> I added a print for using flash instead of ram
[12:26:49] <RikusW> changing the arduino api a bit :-P
[12:26:58] <langoliers> RikusW<= bearing usually don't like above 60k RPM
[12:27:11] <RikusW> langoliers: air bearing ?
[12:27:25] <langoliers> you mean magnetic
[12:27:32] <langoliers> or maybe ceramic.
[12:27:45] * megal0maniac loves magnets
[12:28:06] * langoliers impressed Inside the Cockpit: First Solo Flight http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9aNfiRUOvA < young lady flies plane
[12:28:28] * megal0maniac has a neodynium collection under his bed and coasters made out of platters :D
[12:28:39] * megal0maniac is now eating supper
[12:29:15] <RikusW> langoliers: some bearing use compressed air
[12:29:20] <RikusW> *sleeve rather
[12:36:42] <Casper> abcminiuser: do you know how to identify a smd fuse rating? I have one that blew up...
[12:37:08] <abcminiuser> Replace it with successively larger rating ones until it stops catching fire?
[12:37:12] <abcminiuser> (no idea)
[12:38:06] <Casper> if it was bigger I'ld check the current... but... it's those tiny one...
[12:38:07] <RikusW> measure the current drawn ?
[12:38:13] <Casper> 1x2mm or so
[12:38:25] <Casper> with other parts very close
[12:38:58] <Casper> I'll put a 2A...
[12:44:08] <Casper> it will be a pita to replace
[12:44:16] <Casper> 0.8x1.6mm...
[12:45:52] <RikusW> use two soldering irons to lift it ?
[12:46:10] <RikusW> or solder the new one on top ?
[12:53:16] <Casper> wow..... that bios software upgrade utility from toshiba is shit
[12:53:38] <megal0maniac> Casper: I find proprietary software to write to flash devices usually is :)
[12:53:49] <Casper> click click... woops that must be the updater... oh yeah it is.... FUCK it automatically update!
[12:54:08] <Casper> at the end of the update, it also automatically reboot
[12:54:13] <Casper> zero confirmation
[12:54:28] <Casper> not even the windows vista user privilege junk
[12:57:22] <RikusW> thats bad behaviour :S
[13:04:40] <megal0maniac> Windows Vista is bad behaviour
[13:05:56] <megal0maniac> Is it common to use a resistor ladder on an ADC pin to have multiple predictable input states on a single pin?
[13:06:05] <Casper> but this is not a vista fault...
[13:07:01] <megal0maniac> Casper: No. Vista is your fault :P
[13:12:12] <RikusW> http://ca.isohunt.com/download/114771037/Printed+Circuits+Handbook.torrent
[13:12:51] <RikusW> megal0maniac: like connecting multiple buttons on the same adc pin ?
[13:12:56] <RikusW> I've seen that done before
[13:13:04] <RikusW> megal0maniac: http://www.loot.co.za/search?cat=b&terms=Printed+Circuits+Handbook
[13:14:20] <RikusW> megal0maniac: buy Soldering Handbook for Printed Circuits and Surface Mounting :-P
[13:14:27] <RikusW> only $400
[13:14:46] <megal0maniac> Red pill or blue pill?
[13:14:52] <megal0maniac> Torrent or loot.co.za?
[13:15:16] <RikusW> loot
[13:15:29] <RikusW> I'd rather take the 31MB torrent ;)
[13:16:04] <RikusW> I've ordered my 1TB 2.5" hdd from them
[13:16:14] <RikusW> and previously some books
[13:16:30] <RikusW> They're in CT so you can even collect
[13:22:56] <megal0maniac> Heh. I'm on the phone, on hold, listening to cheesy music. Just heard the Windows XP "ding"
[13:25:04] * RikusW don't like being put on hold...
[13:25:22] * megal0maniac just hung up
[13:27:41] <Casper> "your call is important for us. Please stay on the line. An agent will soon be available to answer your request"
[13:28:02] <megal0maniac> Casper: You've done this before, eh? :)
[13:28:02] <Casper> "we currently are experiencing an higher than normal call volume"
[13:28:47] <Casper> "Sorry, our office is currently closed. Please call later"
[13:31:38] <Casper> megal0maniac: I'm tempted to do that on my phone...
[13:31:41] <Casper> I have voip
[13:31:48] <Casper> I can do about anything I want
[13:36:22] <megal0maniac> I was tempted to set up voip, but the conversion is too pricey for an experiment
[13:37:02] <megal0maniac> RikusW: I'm making a patch for Arduino to update winavr to the latest version. Single executable
[13:38:24] <RikusW> sounds good
[13:40:36] <megal0maniac> Stripped out the avr32 stuff
[13:42:28] <RikusW> megal0maniac: there is the newest atmel toolchains too ;)
[13:42:45] <RikusW> arduino did modify avrdude to support the DTR line stuff...
[13:42:47] * megal0maniac considered that...
[13:47:10] <megal0maniac> Cool. Patch works. But it's bloody slow :/
[13:51:00] <langoliers> what you do if you see this in your mirror? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtbbbXDNxl0
[14:16:30] <RikusW> langoliers: I let it pass ;)
[14:17:06] <RikusW> imagine cops trying to catch that..
[14:17:17] <RikusW> new definition for high speed chase
[14:20:53] <megal0maniac> I've always wanted the cops to chase me
[14:20:56] <megal0maniac> In a car
[14:21:06] <DagoRed> Sick
[14:21:11] <jadew> you can make that to happen anytime
[14:21:22] <megal0maniac> I'm on a bike :)
[14:21:46] <megal0maniac> jadew: The reality is, I'd pull over. Because I just do that kind of stuff :P
[14:22:57] <jadew> cops in here don't usually chase people, they just jump out of the car and pull you over, if you don't stop you usually get a ticket and your license suspended
[14:23:02] <jadew> but there's no chasing involved
[14:24:08] <megal0maniac> Only in america it seems
[14:24:08] <jadew> I think you also think it's considered a crime so you might have to answer for that in front of a judge too
[14:24:58] <jadew> *I also think
[14:25:15] <megal0maniac> Evading arrest
[14:26:31] <jadew> well, they don't pull you over to arrest you
[14:26:38] <megal0maniac> This is really nice http://adamwhitcroft.com/apaxy/
[14:26:40] <jadew> they pull you over to give you the ticket :P
[14:27:07] <jadew> what's that?
[14:27:21] <megal0maniac> It's to make directory listings look nice
[14:27:23] <langoliers> why don't f1 use force controlled steering wheel?
[14:27:38] <megal0maniac> Because the typical apache generated one is horrible
[14:27:57] <jadew> meh, I don't mind it
[14:28:01] <megal0maniac> And the "Fancy Indexing" just means you can sort
[14:28:42] <megal0maniac> jadew: Yeah, but this is like a minute to copy over, and the result is so... nice. Not '90s like it usually is
[14:30:14] <jadew> I rarely allow indexing anyway
[14:30:26] <megal0maniac> I specifically wanted to
[14:31:05] <megal0maniac> The communication at my university is horrible. So I've made a directory for useful course content for myself and my classmates.
[14:47:58] <Malinuss> In our country the cops stops chasing you if you drive fater then 200km/h, becuase it becomes a risk for others (bigger risk then letting someone go)
[14:48:24] <Malinuss> I think it's a good tactic, when you watch the american cops crashing into innocent people in the crazy ass car chases
[14:51:06] <megal0maniac> Malinuss: But it makes for good TV ;)
[14:52:19] <Malinuss> megal0maniac, and that's all that matters ;D
[14:53:12] <Malinuss> Tom_itx, do you actually have a avr-based weather station?
[14:53:59] <jadew> I have one, but it's not fully finished :D
[14:55:08] <megal0maniac> He did
[14:56:30] <langoliers> the cop breakes the law when speeding.
[14:56:55] <jadew> they're not breaking the law when they're in a mission
[14:57:07] <jadew> mission = the lights and the siren are on
[14:57:13] <langoliers> :)
[14:57:30] <langoliers> makes you wonder what if you put up those too
[14:57:55] <jadew> if you're putting them with out a permit, you're going to jail :P
[14:58:01] <langoliers> one condition, you must wear this http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/FBI-Female-Body-Inspector-Classic-Vintage-80s-Mens-Black-T-Shirt-Fancy-Dress-NEW-/390351335071?pt=UK_Men_s_T_Shirts&var&hash=item5ae2c0ae9f&_uhb=1#ht_3765wt_789
[14:58:15] <jadew> heh
[14:58:22] <jadew> I want one
[14:58:25] <langoliers> ^^
[14:58:28] <langoliers> mee too
[14:59:57] <jadew> http://dumb.ro/files/sensbox.jpg
[15:00:13] <jadew> that's my weather station
[15:00:52] <jadew> it can do a lot of talking (to different sensors :P )
[15:01:32] <langoliers> switches are only cool in sw
[15:01:50] <jadew> sw?
[15:01:52] <jadew> software?
[15:01:56] <langoliers> +
[15:02:09] <jadew> that's what the bottom chip is for :P
[15:02:15] <jadew> it has software switches too
[15:02:44] <langoliers> btw your xtal has a thick via under it ;/
[15:02:51] <langoliers> under one leg that is
[15:02:56] <jadew> it's not under it
[15:03:02] <jadew> it's just close to it
[15:04:14] <jadew> the blue switches are there to control some pullups, depending on how much stuff is on the bus
[15:36:58] <OndraSter_> yay, I will get two old MACs. They should be running MAC OS 5 or similar stuff, late 80s/early 90s :)
[15:36:59] <megal0maniac> .htaccess is pretty damn powerful
[15:37:08] <megal0maniac> OndraSter_: For what?
[15:37:11] <megal0maniac> Don't say fun
[15:37:46] <jadew> nice OndraSter_
[15:39:44] <jadew> megal0maniac, it just gives you the chance to config some stuff for that folder with out writting that config in the main httpd.conf
[15:39:44] <OndraSter_> megal0maniac, ... fun
[15:40:15] <OndraSter_> old machines are fun
[15:40:34] <jadew> yeah, especially apple
[15:40:46] <OndraSter_> yep
[15:41:03] <jadew> you not only get a piece of hardware history, but a piece of software history as well :)
[15:41:12] <OndraSter_> yep
[15:41:14] <OndraSter_> apple nowadays is meh
[15:41:18] <OndraSter_> back in the day it was different
[15:41:23] <jadew> s/meh/gay/
[15:41:30] <OndraSter_> lol
[15:41:35] <OndraSter_> don't use sed on me!
[15:41:37] <megal0maniac> For designers and sound engineers
[15:41:50] * Tom_itx thinks OndraSter_ sounds like an ole timer
[15:41:56] <OndraSter_> ole timer?
[15:41:58] <OndraSter_> OLE OLE OLE
[15:42:01] * megal0maniac was thinking the same thing
[15:43:13] <Tom_itx> anybody ever put a bootloader in a tiny?
[15:43:29] <megal0maniac> nearly
[15:43:47] <OndraSter_> well, tiny85...
[15:43:48] <OndraSter_> :)
[15:43:54] <OndraSter_> not so tiny tiny!
[15:43:57] <jadew> now that's not so tiny
[15:44:13] <OndraSter_> I *think* I remember seeing in the basement something like this
[15:44:14] <OndraSter_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macintosh_IIx
[15:44:19] <OndraSter_> it might be running system 6
[15:44:21] <OndraSter_> not 5
[15:44:23] <OndraSter_> but there are two
[15:44:46] <OndraSter_> I had that one running ages ago
[15:44:51] <OndraSter_> and it booted just fine
[15:44:54] <OndraSter_> so it should be still working
[15:45:31] <Malinuss> yeah the tiny85 has load of stuff. I think it's the "biggest" of the tinys?
[15:45:47] <RikusW> there is tiny1634 16k
[15:45:56] <RikusW> and two uarts
[15:46:10] <Tom_itx> what state is HI. ?
[15:46:32] * Tom_itx is at a loss on that one
[15:46:49] <Tom_itx> Hawaii?
[15:47:26] <OndraSter_> could be
[15:47:41] <Tom_itx> it is
[15:47:51] <jadew> I have one of these: https://www.flickr.com/photos/31231773@N02/sets/72157623685213618/
[15:48:14] <jadew> still in working condition
[15:48:21] <OndraSter_> I have got here one big ass 286
[15:48:28] <megal0maniac> RikusW: Didn't you have some old stuff?
[15:48:35] <OndraSter_> it has got some nonVGA video output
[15:48:36] <jadew> this one is a 486sx
[15:48:37] <megal0maniac> Or was it just VT100 stuff?
[15:48:50] <OndraSter_> but you can change switches to use external graphics card
[15:48:55] <OndraSter_> so I stuck there some ISA card I had
[15:48:56] <OndraSter_> and it booted
[15:49:00] <OndraSter_> but I didn't know any info about the HDD
[15:49:03] <OndraSter_> so I put it back to the shelf
[15:49:09] <OndraSter_> (it weighs like 10kg)
[15:49:14] <RikusW> megal0maniac: I do have an 8088 :)
[15:49:15] <megal0maniac> OndraSter_: Is it like a big DIN plug for video?
[15:49:18] <jadew> yeah, this one is pretty heavy too
[15:49:19] <OndraSter_> I took it out few months ago. Powered up -- nothing happened
[15:49:23] <RikusW> and terminals based on that too
[15:49:32] <OndraSter_> took it apart, cleaned, plugged back in, powered, nothing. And then the fuse blew :/
[15:49:37] <OndraSter_> megal0maniac, :P no
[15:49:47] <Malinuss> RikusW, 20 pins? How is that even in the tiny family?
[15:49:48] <OndraSter_> it is 25pin
[15:50:08] <jadew> now I feel like booting up my 486
[15:50:14] <RikusW> Malinuss: ask atmel ;)
[15:50:19] <Malinuss> tiny=small, small != 25 pins
[15:50:21] <jadew> it's the PC on which I really learned how to code
[15:50:32] <Malinuss> the idea of tinys is, that they are small, hehe
[15:50:45] <OndraSter_> Malinuss, 25 pin video connector, different discussion mate
[15:51:22] <megal0maniac> I dig it: http://www.welook4things.com/8088_wb_flip_images/8088_10_xt_wb_10.jpg
[15:51:26] <Malinuss> OndraSter_, I was refering to the attiny1634 that RikusW named earlier in our tiny discussion (which one that was "biggest" - in peripherals/memory)
[15:51:34] <Tom_itx> http://www.electronicproducts.com/Electromechanical_Components/Motors_and_Controllers/Electric_power_steering_is_taking_control.aspx
[15:51:37] <OndraSter_> that one is 20 pin, yes
[15:51:42] <Tom_itx> fly by wire has made it to auto
[15:51:45] <OndraSter_> but even some smaller and older tinies are 20pin
[15:51:49] <OndraSter_> tiny2313 ;)
[15:51:57] <megal0maniac> You don't get megas <28 pin though, do you?
[15:52:07] <OndraSter_> nice megal0maniac
[15:52:15] <OndraSter_> 24pin megas maybe?
[15:52:17] <OndraSter_> not sure
[15:52:24] <megal0maniac> Don't think so
[15:52:37] <Malinuss> OndraSter_, I thought the idea of "tinys" was that they were ~8 pins
[15:52:47] <OndraSter_> well there are 8pin tinies
[15:52:49] <Malinuss> therby the name "tiny"
[15:52:50] <OndraSter_> just as 6pin one
[15:52:51] <OndraSter_> s
[15:52:57] <megal0maniac> DIP package is 28 pin, tqfp etc is 32, and everything else is bigger
[15:52:59] <Malinuss> yeah, that's why I say ~8
[15:53:11] <OndraSter_> yay Tom_itx
[15:53:11] <jadew> the biggest tiny I know of is 20 pins
[15:53:12] <OndraSter_> another computer
[15:53:14] <jadew> the t2313
[15:53:16] <OndraSter_> another thing that will be broken!
[15:53:34] <OndraSter_> now that you have got automatic car guidance (it checks the lines and what not)
[15:53:36] <OndraSter_> automatic parking
[15:53:40] <OndraSter_> automatic everything
[15:53:55] <jadew> automatic parking?
[15:53:57] <OndraSter_> yes
[15:54:03] <jadew> how does that work?
[15:54:10] <OndraSter_> you press a button, it checks if it fits there. If it does, it parks there
[15:54:11] <OndraSter_> no idea
[15:54:11] <megal0maniac> I had an idea years ago for the road lines to have their lengths based on the speed limit of the road
[15:54:15] <OndraSter_> check topgear, jadew
[15:54:18] <OndraSter_> they had it there
[15:54:28] <jadew> cool
[15:54:31] <OndraSter_> well
[15:54:38] <OndraSter_> I am now driving '97 Mitsubishi Colt :P
[15:54:41] <OndraSter_> power steering is all I need
[15:54:47] <OndraSter_> oh and fluid gearbox
[15:54:51] <megal0maniac> Wowzers
[15:55:15] <jadew> I don't have a car anymore
[15:55:19] <OndraSter_> not like Skoda Felicia's terrible gearbox where you have to weigh lifts every night to get some muscle in order to be able to operate the gearbox.
[15:55:42] <jadew> my car was a pleasure to drive
[15:56:13] <megal0maniac> OndraSter_: Skoda Fabia? :)
[15:57:08] <OndraSter_> Skoda Fabia... well, 1.3 engine at least
[15:57:19] <megal0maniac> http://autojunction.co.za.s3.amazonaws.com/AutoJunction/autos/0/4/0/9/7/b/d/e/04097bde-70ee-11e2-9238-9fc852afc031/image/fullview/74f6dbba0dff34bf_fullview.jpg
[15:57:38] <OndraSter_> the Colt has got 1.3 50kW? 55kW?
[15:57:39] <jadew> is that a golf 1?
[15:57:57] <megal0maniac> jadew: It's a "Citi Golf"
[15:58:05] <OndraSter_> the Felicia has got 1.3 50kW and compared to the Colt's 50kW it is completely different story
[15:58:17] <megal0maniac> Based on the Golf one, but re-introduced. Mine is a 2005 model
[15:58:18] <OndraSter_> when you push the gas pedal in Colt on 3rd gear you go from 50 to 80 very, very fast
[15:58:41] <OndraSter_> even when trying to quickly accelerate, you do not go more than half the pedal
[15:58:58] <OndraSter_> in felicia you use half the pedal just to keep the speed on 4th gear in the city
[15:59:07] <OndraSter_> in the colt you barely press the pedal on 4th gear :P
[15:59:31] <jadew> I never used more than the 3rd gear in the city
[15:59:45] <jadew> (my last car was bmw 320d)
[15:59:49] <megal0maniac> I end up in 5th all the time
[15:59:55] <megal0maniac> TRACTOR!
[16:00:09] <jadew> it used to go up to 100+ in the 3rd gear
[16:00:22] <megal0maniac> My 125cc bike does that :P
[16:00:23] <Malinuss> jadew, you rich?
[16:00:23] <OndraSter_> heh
[16:00:31] * OndraSter_ does not like bikes
[16:00:32] <jadew> Malinuss, no :P
[16:00:33] <megal0maniac> (Assuming we're talking about km/h)
[16:01:07] <megal0maniac> Well OndraSter_ can sit in traffic then. I'm going to sleep in :)
[16:01:30] <megal0maniac> Bike gets me an hour extra sleep every day
[16:02:04] <OndraSter_> heh
[16:02:29] <jadew> I agree, traffic is a bitch in here too
[16:02:38] <jadew> which is why I didn't get another car
[16:02:43] <jadew> I just don't leave the house anymore
[16:03:48] <OndraSter_> heh...
[16:04:26] <megal0maniac> Bicycle?
[16:04:36] <jadew> it's collecting dust
[16:04:48] <megal0maniac> That's my next project. Trip computer for bicycle
[16:04:53] <jadew> used it like 10 times since I bought it, 4 years ago
[16:05:16] <dunz0r> With a tripcomputer, you'll have a good reason to take a bike ride, debugging etc :)
[16:05:29] <jadew> hmm, maybe I'd use the bike more if I had a project related to it :)
[16:05:34] <megal0maniac> :)
[16:05:36] <jadew> yeah
[16:05:58] <megal0maniac> I'll make my own lights, controllable from the front
[16:06:13] <jadew> I'd install a really low camera, pointing up
[16:06:20] <jadew> then you can stop next to hot chicks in skirts
[16:06:27] <jadew> have a snapshot button next to the break
[16:06:32] <dunz0r> I'm considering building an electric bike.
[16:06:47] <dunz0r> With a brushless motor and an AVR for controlling
[16:07:15] <dunz0r> Haven't seen that many high power BLDC-controllers that are cheap/well documented.
[16:07:30] <RikusW> jadew: there is easier ways than a lowly camera :-P
[16:07:44] <jadew> RikusW, please tell :)
[16:07:52] <dunz0r> RikusW: Mirror?:P
[16:07:58] <RikusW> metart
[16:08:00] <dunz0r> Mirror on your shoe etc.
[16:08:09] <dunz0r> Not very nice though. And really creepy.
[16:08:10] <jadew> lol
[16:08:27] <dunz0r> Sure way to get arrested for something
[16:09:10] <jadew> "I was checking my hair!"
[16:09:23] <dunz0r> "You mean her hair..."
[16:09:27] <dunz0r> *badum-tisch*
[16:09:32] <jadew> "She doesn't have any"
[16:12:54] <megal0maniac> Goodnight!
[16:13:01] <jadew> night
[16:14:32] <OndraSter_> nn
[16:15:26] <jadew> so what are you guys working on lately?
[16:16:20] <jadew> I finished my project and I find myself with nothing to do once again
[16:18:08] <dunz0r> jadew: A small robot. Atmega328 for the controller.
[16:18:11] <dunz0r> It's quite fast :D
[16:18:31] <dunz0r> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f11fKuj7024
[16:19:08] <jadew> lol
[16:19:17] <jadew> that's a crazy robot
[16:19:43] <dunz0r> Yup. It's going to compete agains other robots the 27th :)
[16:19:59] <jadew> nice
[16:20:01] <dunz0r> Have to do some filtering on the sensors before I deem it ready.
[16:21:12] <jadew> I like it a lot
[16:21:33] <dunz0r> I'm quite pleased with it as well. By far the best robot I've built so far
[16:21:37] <jadew> so the idea is to take the paper out?
[16:22:44] <jadew> I keep watching that video, very angry robot
[16:23:08] <dunz0r> jadew: The paper would in a real fight be another robot.
[16:23:17] <jadew> I see
[16:23:19] <jadew> pretty cool
[16:23:24] <dunz0r> Thanks :)
[16:23:40] <jadew> I'd like to compete in this contest
[16:23:49] <dunz0r> Code here: http://git.hax0r.se/?p=AVR/.git;a=tree;f=Minisumo2013
[16:24:14] <dunz0r> jadew: It's in sweden. But there's loads of them in europe and the US as well.
[16:24:45] <jadew> that's a bit far from me, I'm in romania
[16:24:50] <jadew> know of any contests in here?
[16:25:12] <dunz0r> jadew: I do actually!
[16:25:24] <dunz0r> jadew: This is closer at least: http://www.balticrobotsumo.org/
[16:25:33] <dunz0r> And I think there are some romanian competitions as well
[16:25:45] <jadew> nice, gonna look into it
[16:25:54] <jadew> I'd love to compete in something like this
[16:26:15] <dunz0r> There's this also: http://www.robotchallenge.org/
[16:26:23] <dunz0r> Sort of the european championship
[16:26:46] <jadew> oh man... this is awesome
[16:26:54] <jadew> I want in
[16:27:41] <jadew> gonna wait, I have to be a student?
[16:27:50] <dunz0r> jadew: Nope.
[16:27:56] <jadew> ah, nice
[16:28:04] <jadew> I'm looking for the rules
[16:28:25] <dunz0r> Here's the rules: http://www.robotchallenge.org/competition/
[16:28:25] <jadew> it would make a for a cool vacation for next year
[16:29:02] <dunz0r> jadew: If you decide to partake in a competition, let me know. We can get a beer or something :)
[16:29:28] <jadew> yeah, I'll look into it, I always wanted to make robots, but I really didn't have a purpose for them
[16:29:40] <jadew> this is a good purpose :D
[16:30:35] <dunz0r> Yeah. It's "easier" when you have restraints, a deadline and a goal instead of "make a cool robot that is awesome"
[16:31:45] <jadew> yeah
[16:32:21] <jadew> so what class is your robot?
[16:32:27] <jadew> mini sumo?
[16:32:29] <dunz0r> jadew: Mine's a minisumo.
[16:33:00] <jadew> can you compete at more categories?
[16:33:03] <jadew> with different robots?
[16:34:59] <dunz0r> jadew: Yep. I think you can even participate with more than one per category, depending on the competition.
[16:35:14] <jadew> that's super awesome
[16:35:47] <jadew> wish I knew more people in my city interrested in this, it would be great to have monthly competitions or things like that
[16:36:24] <dunz0r> I'd love that too. Apart from the guys hosting the competition on the 27th(which takes place on the other side of the country) I don't know anyone building robots :|
[16:36:40] <dunz0r> My brother too though, but that's my doing.
[16:36:55] <dunz0r> And he's just built one really crappy one :D
[16:37:04] <jadew> hehe
[16:39:47] <jadew> lmfao, these robots are dumb: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4z40cw8_xQ
[16:39:47] <jadew> YouTube: Robot-SM 2012, super sumo
[16:40:08] <dunz0r> jadew: Mine's the one with the red back :)
[16:40:14] <dunz0r> The one that lost all the matches :D
[16:40:47] <jadew> I'll look for it :P
[16:41:33] <langoliers> jadew<= cd4066
[16:42:16] <jadew> what about it?
[16:43:06] <jadew> I have a 4066 on that board, but it wasn't needed for the pullups
[16:43:13] <jadew> it was easier to use a real switch for that
[16:44:04] <jadew> that robot from 4:30 is really bad ass
[16:44:30] <langoliers> i was thinking about replacing the dipswitch with that
[16:45:01] <dunz0r> jadew: It's even scarier in real life. The sound when it goes across the metal surface at full speed is awesome.
[16:45:08] <langoliers> though unclear why would you do that anyway
[16:45:09] <jadew> langoliers, the problem with that is that it would occupy some IO ports, which were not really free
[16:45:14] <dunz0r> WeeeeeeBAMweeeeeeBAM
[16:45:37] <jadew> and since the sensors aren't going to change too often, you usually set the pullups once and that's it
[16:46:36] <langoliers> OndraSter_<= ok, now compare a 2kW electric to a 10hp fuel burner engine
[16:47:11] <langoliers> cold starts in -30C with spinning wheels, has efficiency 98% easily
[16:48:18] <jadew> dunz0r, what's that surface made of?
[16:48:28] <jadew> I mean how do you detect you're inside the circle?
[16:48:41] <jadew> the white line?
[16:50:02] <jadew> lol some robots are so funny
[16:59:19] <dunz0r> jadew: The surface for the mini-class is usually MDF or something like that. Steel in the "standard" sumo class.
[16:59:44] <dunz0r> jadew: And yes, the lines. I've got CNY70 reflectance sensors for detecting it.
[17:00:17] <jadew> I see, I have some similar sensors too
[17:01:04] <jadew> I think I might have issues with the mechanical part since I don't have the tools to work with metal
[17:08:55] <OndraSter_> langoliers, why me?
[17:09:31] <langoliers> just read back above
[17:11:26] <dunz0r> jadew: You don't necessarly need to use metal.
[17:11:43] <dunz0r> And you don't need much tools. I use a drill and a hacksaw + some files.
[17:11:45] <jadew> I do, if I want to win
[17:12:24] <jadew> I guess I'll start with a small robot that has to stay inside a ring and work my up way up from there, see where it goes
[17:12:51] <dunz0r> jadew: Get good motors and good tires. It's a pretty important part of a good robot.
[17:13:03] <dunz0r> Pololu 50:1 HP motors are quite popular.
[17:13:04] <jadew> yeah, I figured
[17:13:17] <jadew> will check them out, thanks
[17:13:22] <dunz0r> I use Fingertech Goldspark 35:1 one's on mine :)
[17:16:51] <dunz0r> The Fingertechs are stronger, but a lot bigger, it's a very tight fit, about ~1mm to spare between the motors :D
[17:17:10] <jadew> you have 4 of them or 2?
[17:21:52] <dunz0r> jadew: 2 of them. I think I'll build a minisumo for next year with four of the 50:1 motors and power them with a 4 cell LiPo(~15V) :)
[17:22:26] <jadew> you'd get more push power with 4 and greater mobility
[17:23:48] <dunz0r> Yeah. But my current motorcontroller can't handle four motors at 11V.
[17:23:51] <dunz0r> Too much current.
[17:24:23] <dunz0r> But I've got some incredibly beefy H-bridges at home that I'll use on the next one. That one will certainly have 4 motors
[17:25:37] <dunz0r> VNH3SP30 H-bridges. Iirc they can handle up to 30A in bursts
[17:29:13] <jadew> are you allowed any offensive weapons?
[17:37:53] <dunz0r> jadew: You're not allowed to purposely harm the other robot. So no :)
[17:38:03] <dunz0r> Not spikes, "weapons" and such.
[17:38:11] <dunz0r> But shovels and flippers are ok I guess.
[17:38:35] <jadew> I was thinking more in the lines of electric shocks :D
[17:39:13] <dunz0r> jadew: Haha, that's specifically disallowed in the rules :D
[17:39:27] <jadew> hehe
[21:32:23] <cluelessperson> hey, in ASM, what's the difference between .SET and .DEF ?
[21:38:32] <R0b0t1> I am pretty sure they are synonymous.
[22:52:44] <cluelessperson> R0b0t1, thanks
[22:52:53] <R0b0t1> *shrug*
[22:52:57] <cluelessperson> How do you use ASM inline in AVR programming?
[22:53:00] <R0b0t1> Hope you got your answer one way or the other.
[22:53:20] <R0b0t1> http://www.nongnu.org/avr-libc/user-manual/inline_asm.html
[22:54:23] <cluelessperson> ah. I've actually used that already
[22:54:29] <cluelessperson> but with arduino
[22:54:33] <cluelessperson> looks like I can move it over.
[22:56:56] <Tom_itx> ardweenie _is_ after all just an avr
[23:09:03] <dunz0r> My current projects board is even sort arduino compatible.
[23:09:27] <dunz0r> As in you can use an FTDI-adapter to upload code to it since it uses the arduinos bootloader.
[23:09:32] <dunz0r> *sort of
[23:21:08] <R0b0t1> I use the Arduino bootloader
[23:21:13] <R0b0t1> No reason not to, really.
[23:52:28] <dunz0r> R0b0t1: Yeah, uses less pins than an ISP-connector :)