Back
[05:34:16] <Guest88677> hi does someone use arm cortex a9 processors?
[05:44:35] <OndraSter> Guest88677, in phones.
[05:44:37] <OndraSter> :P
[05:44:40] <OndraSter> you better try #arm
[05:44:44] <OndraSter> instead of #avr
[05:47:35] <Guest88677> OndraSter, there are not many people in arm :D
[06:11:59] <Horologium> probably because not as many people using arm microcontrollers.
[07:58:38] <theBear> depends what yer wanna do, LOTS of people use arms for linux based stuff, literally 10s of thousands of them
[10:18:52] <DagoRed> Why can't com sci majors use micro controllers? Simple, they try and use regular expressions on AVR's....
[10:22:29] <theBear> pfft ! real languages don't have regexp :)
[10:22:45] <DagoRed> theBear: that's what I said.... but I really like python.
[10:23:08] <theBear> python is cool, i like it too, but ya gotta admit, it's really just basic for grownups
[10:23:59] <DagoRed> No... it's basic for all ages that isn't nearly as restrictive as basic.
[10:24:15] <DagoRed> If I can teach elementary kids python in a few hours, it's for everyone.
[10:24:31] <theBear> i wouldn't know, python wasn't around till i was grownup
[10:24:46] <DagoRed> Strange thing though.... school teachers are essentially python retarded yet I can teach them enough C++ to use an arduino (write functions and classes even!)
[10:25:06] <DagoRed> Python fell in my lap during my internship at LSI in college.
[10:25:38] <theBear> yeah, i worked with a LOT of schoolteachers the last 10 years... i don't have much faith in 'em
[10:25:55] <DagoRed> I had failed my Java programming class before, needless to say Python taught me so much about programming. In the end, it's my go to language for anything however I rarely do anything with it that I would say is worthy of "production"
[10:26:28] <DagoRed> I have arduino course ware you may steal. The first half of it is done and taught. The second half should be done in about 2 weeks.
[10:27:07] <DagoRed> This summer there will a youtube video of me giving the seminar to school teachers if you wish to copy everything.
[10:27:26] <theBear> lol, that's cool, i'd rather cutoff my own balls with a rusty butter knife :)
[10:28:34] <DagoRed> lol
[10:29:10] <theBear> i know a little java and c++ from the distant past... i prefer real languages... might change if i write stuff with ui's one day, but not for now
[10:29:39] <DagoRed> C++ is nice on embedded but not necessary.
[10:30:50] <theBear> maybe, just doesn't suit the way i've always programmed... plus it feels, abstract on something as simple as a micro... at least c is easily compiled in your head the same way the compiler does it, everything makes sense, does what you expect
[10:32:43] <DagoRed> So does C++, but I'm apart of the OOP generation.
[10:33:47] <theBear> i dunno, c -> asm in micro land is almost command X = asm Y, it's just so damned direct, even with optimisations
[10:34:03] * RikusW use C++ in a C like fashion :-P
[10:34:09] <theBear> hehe naughty naught
[10:34:12] <theBear> y
[10:34:30] <DagoRed> RikusW: That's they way C++ should be used to be honest.
[10:34:46] <RikusW> I use classes and even virtual functions, not used templates yet, (and ofcourse not on AVR)
[10:35:25] <theBear> heh, oo zealots would argue that's exactly the way NOT to use oo :)
[10:35:54] <RikusW> C way of requiring struct ss var; instead of ss var; annoys me, catches me every time I write C code...
[10:36:27] <RikusW> and variable declerations inside code...
[10:36:53] <RikusW> I've not quite seen the need for classes on AVR yet..
[10:36:57] <theBear> i was taught from the very beginning always to declare/init variables outside of actual code, even in basic
[10:37:48] <RikusW> how about the use of gotos ? :)
[10:38:12] <RikusW> I use them on occasion
[10:38:12] <theBear> heh, not sure gosubs existed when i started either, if they did i sure didn't know about them for years
[10:38:44] <theBear> i used to see reasons for them, but over the years i adapted to a point where gosubs and loops always seem to make sense
[10:39:22] <RikusW> I still have a copy of GW-BASIC around somewhere..
[10:40:30] <RikusW> theBear: remember a game named Monty's ? (Montezuma's Revenge)
[10:40:30] <theBear> heh yeah, and the first err, eliza ?
[10:40:30] <theBear> like err, the first eggdrop
[10:40:30] <RikusW> I have it on x86
[10:40:42] <RikusW> and slowed it down to work as is on XP
[10:40:52] <theBear> i was young back then... i played ALL the games
[10:40:52] <RikusW> hacked it a bit using debug.com
[10:41:08] <RikusW> its only 32kb !
[10:41:09] <theBear> heh, i always hated debug, one stupid typo and it all goes south :)
[10:41:20] <RikusW> now games take more like 32GB
[10:41:38] <Steffanx> No way RikusW
[10:41:42] <theBear> yeah, i lost interest when every game was just doom all over again
[10:41:51] <Steffanx> It's bad. not THAT bad RikusW :)
[10:42:01] <theBear> and i know doom was just wolf, but the graphics were SO much better, maybe 640 vs 320 :)
[10:42:07] <RikusW> maybe making an overstatement :-P
[10:42:31] <theBear> heh, doesn't matter, if i still got any windows installs anywhere they are 4gb partitions and no additional driveletters :)
[10:42:41] <OndraSter> 32GB games? why not!
[10:42:48] <OndraSter> two double layer DVDs...
[10:42:55] <theBear> cos i couldn't fit them on any hd i got !
[10:42:55] <Steffanx> You should write your own game enine with the same that can do the same graphics on your pc RikusW :)
[10:43:09] <Steffanx> -with teh same
[10:43:18] <theBear> engines are tiny, you just gotta be not silly with textures and backgrounds
[10:43:18] <OndraSter> :P
[10:43:33] <RikusW> Steffanx: my current PC is a bit old and slow for new games...
[10:43:37] <OndraSter> I don't mind 32GB games :P
[10:43:43] <theBear> and i learnt to program at a time that pcs didn't have much more ram than avrs, i can do it
[10:43:43] <OndraSter> hell, I could load most of it in RAM :D
[10:44:07] <theBear> half the machines i used had less than avr in any spec you could think of :)
[10:44:17] <Steffanx> Except for a hobby that is pretty pointless theBear :)
[10:44:29] <theBear> what ? programming avrs ?
[10:44:35] * theBear smiles
[10:44:42] <Steffanx> No "i can do it"
[10:45:33] <theBear> oh, i didn't say i WOULD do it, but it wouldn't be that much of a stretch :) i was doing gravity and collisions and stuff before i was 10 <grin>
[10:45:54] <Steffanx> me too. It started when i was 'made'
[10:46:02] <Steffanx> Damn gravity :)
[10:46:09] <Steffanx> *damned
[10:46:19] <theBear> lol, made eh? you wear a suit and talk like you need a throat lozenge eh ?
[10:46:57] <Steffanx> So how you would describe the process of you being 'made' by your parents?
[10:47:08] <OndraSter> sex
[10:47:13] <Steffanx> Yes, but that's not it
[10:47:18] <theBear> i would avoid describing it, really really avoid it a lot
[10:48:02] <Steffanx> Bad experience?
[10:48:28] <theBear> lol, ya never know, i'm cursed with near perfect memory, but maybe i did manage to wipe one out
[10:49:32] <theBear> i noticed earlier thisevening my mum is blessed ! she doesn't remember a month ago, she doesn't remember the name or face of the girl who has served us at the restaurant 20+ times over a few short years, and who she loves talking to
[10:49:49] <theBear> she doesn't remember that i like fried sheep brains !
[10:50:24] <theBear> and that's the kinda thing you remember
[10:50:33] <theBear> the brains weren't great tonight, last time we had them they were AWESOME !
[10:51:30] <Steffanx> Hmm 'blessed'?!
[10:51:51] <theBear> speaking of 32gb games, wtf is up with matroska ? this is a ht 2.8ghz 3rd or 4th gen p4, and it STILL can't play one, with framedropping and hardware scaling and skipping loops and all kindsa crap
[10:52:13] <Steffanx> 1080p?
[10:52:18] <theBear> blessed, she aint forgetful like my old crazy dad, but she aint cursed with the memory
[10:52:38] <RikusW> theBear: I played mkv just fine on a P4 2.4GHz
[10:52:52] <RikusW> but the HD ones didn't work so well...
[10:52:57] <Steffanx> :P
[10:53:16] <Steffanx> When RikusW considers something as HD?
[10:53:20] <theBear> 1280 widescreen, but still, apart from wmv i can play ANYTHING else on this without hitting one (fake)core pegged
[10:53:20] <RikusW> actually the i845 graphics driver crashed the PC any time I tried to play one... :S
[10:53:22] <Steffanx> >576p ?
[10:54:03] <RikusW> now that I'm on a 2.4GHz AMD with proper graphics card it doesn't seem to be a problem anymore :)
[10:54:19] <RikusW> (one a new pc because my old MB blew... )
[10:54:22] <theBear> it's been bugging me for a while, if you got ht/virtual dual core, and you use 50% cpu on a single processor intensive task, are you actually doing the same amount of processing as if you split the same load between 2 threads and used "100%" cpu ?
[10:54:45] <theBear> noting that cpu usage is normalized/scaled so 50% is one core pegged, and 100% is both
[10:54:56] <theBear> and noting that there is really only one core
[10:55:30] <RikusW> afaik the pipelining is used more efficiently in HT
[10:55:41] <RikusW> but that depends on the code being run
[10:55:56] <OndraSter> huh, over 2 years ago I upgraded FROM much faster computer than you have :o
[10:56:04] <OndraSter> which I had for... 2 years?
[10:56:04] <OndraSter> or more
[10:56:24] <RikusW> OndraSter: I'll buy a new pc soon
[10:56:29] <theBear> yeah, i understand it at a conceptual level too, but assuming either a single thread doing X repetitive calculation, vs two threads doing the same thing, assuming caches don't exist or always hit, is there ANY difference in the amount of 'work' that gets completed ?
[10:56:55] <RikusW> there might get more done than 100%
[10:56:56] <theBear> i got a faster one here, core2duo, i'll finish installing and finetuning the slightly too small to turn on reliably psu one day :)
[10:56:56] <OndraSter> I am happy with my i5-2500k :)
[10:57:04] <OndraSter> if I need power, I can overclock it to 4.5GHz :P
[10:57:26] <RikusW> I'll probably go for i3
[10:57:36] <OndraSter> http://clip2net.com/page/m12051/43835499
[10:57:36] <theBear> RikusW, mmm, i've been suspecting similar, if that wasn't a 'bad joke' <grin> which makes tuning dynamic cpufreq stuff based on cpu% VERY mind bending
[10:58:04] <theBear> sidenote: i haven't bought any computer parts this century, have only ever bough 1 new mobo, and two new cpus
[10:58:11] <OndraSter> :P
[10:58:22] <OndraSter> I bought new hardware 2 years ago, but RMAed motherboard and GPU - got on both money back
[10:58:23] <RikusW> OndraSter: I've used a 1GHz pc for a few days, switching a firefox tab took 5 seconds... :S
[10:58:25] <OndraSter> after 2 years :D
[10:58:30] <OndraSter> haha RikusW
[10:58:36] <theBear> the things are so damned fast now, so long as you stay away from windows, even a 14y.old machine is pretty decent
[10:58:44] <OndraSter> it is not
[10:58:55] <theBear> it does a fine job of serving from the next room
[10:58:55] <LoRez> where's our resident atmel employee?
[10:59:02] <OndraSter> I have got older laptop (2GHz AMD dualcore Turion X2, 4GB RAM) and it runs like crap even linux
[10:59:04] <theBear> authoritive ns and all :)
[10:59:35] <theBear> yeah, your linux aint my linux, but i'm special, and i waste WAY too much time on 'pointless' computering
[11:00:01] <RikusW> Ubuntu is very very slow on P3
[11:00:41] <OndraSter> theBear, gentoo? :D
[11:01:21] <RikusW> customized gentoo ;)
[11:01:26] <theBear> maybe, but gentoo alone isn't enough, you gotta really get overly familiar with hardware and cpu characteristics and bus characteristics and tuning all kinds of stuff inbetween :)
[11:01:30] <OndraSter> we have got some really cut gentoo at school
[11:01:36] <theBear> do as i say, not as i do :)
[11:01:36] <OndraSter> no nano
[11:01:37] <OndraSter> no pico
[11:01:40] <OndraSter> no links
[11:01:40] <theBear> lol, cut
[11:01:40] <OndraSter> no lynx
[11:01:50] <OndraSter> I mean, links + nano = basic stuff in every gentoo!
[11:01:56] <theBear> oh, i thought you meant like when people in movies refer to guys that go to the gym too often :)
[11:02:38] <OndraSter> and we also work on thin stations... powered by solaris box few km away from the room
[11:02:46] <OndraSter> even scrolling in firefox is pain :P
[11:02:50] <theBear> i've put gentoo on more than a few TINY installs, i used to use it for a desktop on a 486/dx2/66 laptop with 4mb ram, irc, mail,news, graphical browser (well, links2 with gui mode for images) :)
[11:03:10] <theBear> then again, i also been watching REALLY smart guys talk in the embedded channel for almost 10 years now
[11:03:22] <OndraSter> heh
[11:03:51] <OndraSter> I have got here IBM's thin station - it has got internal CF slot, boots either from the CF or downloads linux kernel from NFS mounted storage
[11:03:54] <OndraSter> funny thing - if I ran NFS server on linux it would not work
[11:04:03] <OndraSter> if I ran NFS server on windows server 2008 r2, it booted fine :P
[11:04:37] <OndraSter> (I could access nfs share from ws to the linux box and vice versa just fine)
[11:05:28] <theBear> i never seen a win server, or os, that modern, or a free win nfs server, so err, iwouldn't know
[11:05:51] <OndraSter> WS2008R2+ (and maybe even older) have got NFS server/client built-in
[11:06:12] <OndraSter> just enable the role :P
[11:08:17] <theBear> 2003 didn't, that was the last i had the misfortune of dealing with
[11:08:43] <theBear> reminds me, guy that sits across from that old server called me a few times while i was sleeping today... wonder what he could want from me
[11:12:58] <OndraSter> heh
[11:12:59] <OndraSter> I like Win server
[11:12:59] <OndraSter> on the other hand, I am in love with MS.
[11:13:20] <theBear> i like things that work
[11:13:27] <theBear> if you love it so much, why don't you just marry it ?!!?!
[11:13:49] * RikusW compiles OndraSter into an exe :-P
[11:14:29] * theBear chops the nearest d+d player in half with his broadexe, in traditional dos mud style
[11:14:42] <theBear> you read right ! one m, one u, one d ! old schoo' !
[11:17:01] <OndraSter> theBear, :P
[11:17:01] <OndraSter> theBear, you are a woman inside, aren't you?
[11:17:01] <OndraSter> that is exactly how women react :D
[11:17:03] <OndraSter> also the school gentoos are so awful..
[11:17:07] <OndraSter> they have got KDE
[11:17:29] * RikusW likes KDE
[11:17:44] <OndraSter> it looks and works terrible
[11:17:44] <OndraSter> if I delete file from some folder from uxterm, even going to some other folder in file browser (dolphin?) and going back it does not refresh the folder
[11:17:44] <OndraSter> the "start" menu in KDE barely works - half of the icons missing...
[11:18:21] <theBear> hehe, i'm a sensitive artist, but i'm also a psychotic sociopathic violent maniac, so err, you decide if i'm a woman inside, but if yer smart you wouldn't tell me what you decide :) but, i don't advocate gentoo, to ANYONE ! don't for a MOMENT think i do... it's just beyond perfect for me
[11:18:30] <RikusW> I don't really use the start menu, I use the konsole
[11:18:33] <OndraSter> I have got gentoo with gnome in my VM
[11:18:49] <theBear> i haven't even SEEN gnome in nearly a decade
[11:18:59] <theBear> actually, about the same for kde
[11:19:26] <RikusW> theBear: only using commandline ?
[11:19:51] <theBear> 99%, but i been using xfce
[11:20:03] <RikusW> I like to have a gui
[11:20:15] <RikusW> I'm on XP since my Linux PC's MB blew...
[11:20:21] <theBear> i'm quite fond of modern automounting usb and general 'desktop env' bonuses
[11:20:43] <RikusW> but the bash cli is nice :)
[11:20:43] <theBear> tho i would miss very little if i went back to maybe fluxbox and mc
[11:21:30] <theBear> and i'm still fond of gkrellm, but it isn't ageing gracefully
[11:21:53] <specing> Im on w7 since my laptop died -.-
[11:21:58] <theBear> or maybe it's slowly rotting, but either way..
[11:22:10] <RikusW> seems my wavecom modem is ok, have a problem of it disconnecting... turns out it was the psu
[11:22:46] <RikusW> currently have it hooked up to an old battery charger transformer
[11:22:58] <RikusW> (and bridge + caps ofcourse)
[11:23:06] <OndraSter> http://clip2net.com/s/4MZJZF
[11:23:07] <OndraSter> there
[11:32:15] <DagoRed> When in doubt, use Arch.
[11:32:39] <theBear> meh, arch gives up on arch's too quick from what little i seen
[13:34:11] <R0b0t1> Does anyone know the interrupt vector name for timer 0 compare match A?
[13:34:15] <R0b0t1> Or where to find it.
[13:34:26] <R0b0t1> I found TIMER0_CMPA_vect, which is wrong
[13:36:12] <R0b0t1> MISSING AN O
[13:36:16] <R0b0t1> Misremembered
[13:51:16] <Malinuss> R0b0t1, the datasheet is a great thing indeed :)
[13:51:37] <R0b0t1> Malinuss, I couldn't remember if it had them
[13:52:35] <Malinuss> R0b0t1, the datasheet? The datasheet has EVERYTHING, there is not one thing you couldn't find. In theory all you need is a compiler, the datasheet, programmer and the uC :)
[13:53:09] <Malinuss> In practice there will be some complicated cornercases where you will need read up on other resources (or irc ;)
[13:53:19] <timemage> R0b0t1, they're also well documented in the ioMCUHERE.h files. gcc has options (that i'm not remembering) to output a list of defined macros. you can run that on your source it it will dump them.
[13:53:42] <rlc> Malinuss: oh, you forget you also need a brain
[13:53:49] <theBear> timemage, oooh, that's good to know, maybe one day one of us will workout what the options are :)
[13:54:07] <timemage> theBear, -MD i think, but don't quote me on it. =)
[13:54:28] <theBear> "hey guys ! timemage said -MD makes gcc output a list of defined macros !"
[13:54:31] <theBear> woops ! sorry :)
[13:54:36] <timemage> theBear, heh, thanks.
[13:54:47] <Malinuss> rlc, welp pretty hard to even collect the other things without that!
[13:55:05] <theBear> Malinuss, lol, don't underestimate the power of the 'duino
[13:56:26] <R0b0t1> timemage, I usually used the switch that was "keep temporary preprocessed files"
[13:56:32] <OndraSter> just use the datasheet
[13:56:32] <OndraSter> instead trying to play with gcc
[13:56:35] <R0b0t1> and had to look through my ~100 main.c expanded to thousands of lines.
[13:56:39] <timemage> R0b0t1, yeah, it's just there's a cleaner way to do that.
[13:57:08] <R0b0t1> Is it bad form to include something from a parent directory?
[13:57:16] <R0b0t1> e.g. #include "../file.h"
[13:57:28] <theBear> suppose it depends how 'static' the parent directory is
[13:57:57] <R0b0t1> Well organizationally I was thinking you put something in a subdir because it itself forms some kind of logical unit
[13:57:59] <theBear> well, the parent in relation to the file.h dir
[13:58:43] <theBear> depends, usually for 'simple' projects (like most avr stuff) a single dir seems to make sense, but by the time you got make compiling multiple bits and pieces dirs start to make sense
[13:59:06] <theBear> on the flipside, dirs are kinda annoying when you are manually building or just got a 'simple' makefile that builds a single .c
[13:59:27] <R0b0t1> I've need to make menus, I was doing so by defining a menu struct inside its own include and had a directory of those
[13:59:31] <R0b0t1> but they need to include ../menu.h
[13:59:35] <R0b0t1> to get the struct def
[13:59:46] <theBear> if it's all part of the same project i think it's acceptable
[13:59:50] <R0b0t1> alright
[13:59:54] <OndraSter> since I have got folder drivers, in it global.h which contains basic typedefs, definitions, ... and then I have got folders drivers/usb, drivers/pmic, ... I sometimes have to include ../something/something.h
[13:59:54] <OndraSter> (for example from drivers/usb I include ../pmic/pmic.h)
[13:59:59] <R0b0t1> also, why can't I use NULL when not in a function?
[14:00:12] <theBear> 'real' BIG projects use all kinds of parent dir ../../.. kinda references
[14:00:32] <theBear> err, what would you want to use NULL for outside a function ?
[14:00:38] <timemage> R0b0t1, avr-cpp -dM -mmcu=attiny2313 avrtest.c | grep _vect <- something like that. in this case the avrtest.c file only contains an include of <avr/io.h>.
[14:00:55] <OndraSter> huh?
[14:01:06] <theBear> huh to who ?
[14:01:27] <OndraSter> why...
[14:01:27] <OndraSter> not just
[14:01:27] <OndraSter> open
[14:01:27] <R0b0t1> menu/splash.h:8:2: error: ‘NULL’ undeclared here (not in a function)
[14:01:36] <OndraSter> avr/iotiny2313
[14:02:00] <timemage> OndraSter, that was mentioned above.
[14:02:03] <theBear> but what would you want to use NULL for outside a function err, decleration or whatever you call it
[14:02:03] <R0b0t1> dafuq do I put for non-defined/default pointers in an initializer?
[14:02:12] <OndraSter> <R0b0t1> also, why can't I use NULL when not in a function?
[14:02:12] <OndraSter> <OndraSter> huh?
[14:02:12] <OndraSter> what are you trying to do?
[14:02:12] <OndraSter> my IRC lags a bit
[14:02:24] <R0b0t1> initialize struct
[14:02:32] <theBear> erm, default or non defined ? that doesn't sound right
[14:02:51] <R0b0t1> non-defined at compile time
[14:02:55] <R0b0t1> so it needs a default value
[14:03:03] <theBear> erm, don't think a pointer can be non-defined at compile time
[14:03:04] <R0b0t1> like 0, the pointer equivalent being null
[14:03:11] <OndraSter> if it is in .data section then it is automatically 00ed
[14:03:11] <OndraSter> err, .bss
[14:03:13] <R0b0t1> ... well
[14:03:22] <R0b0t1> okay fine
[14:03:43] <R0b0t1> However lets say I want to leave one pointer field blank and fill in some others
[14:03:44] <theBear> we talking C or C++ here ? (not sure it makes a difference, i haven't really done c++ this century)
[14:04:11] <theBear> erm, huh ? like a pointer array ?
[14:04:20] <theBear> i'm confused
[14:05:03] <theBear> can you even have a pointer array ?
[14:05:08] <R0b0t1> C
[14:05:16] <R0b0t1> Yeah
[14:05:25] <R0b0t1> char **banana;
[14:05:30] <R0b0t1> char *banana[];
[14:05:44] <R0b0t1> char (*banana)[];
[14:05:48] <theBear> yeah, that makes sense, i don't see what you would want to leave blank tho ...
[14:06:04] <R0b0t1> 'cause I'm bullshitting and don't have everything done yet
[14:07:26] <theBear> err, i think if you don't force a pointer address it'll be auto decided at compile time, i don't see where a null comes into it
[14:07:54] <theBear> and if it's only referred to when initialised, well, it should get compiled out or maybe error'd
[14:08:42] <R0b0t1> You can only have complete initializers
[14:08:48] <R0b0t1> if you want to assign part of a struct with multiple values, you must define every value
[14:10:03] <R0b0t1> .
[14:10:03] <theBear> sounds right, so what's the question ?
[14:10:13] <R0b0t1> Well nevermind I just cast a 0 to (char *)
[14:10:27] <R0b0t1> So um
[14:10:28] <R0b0t1> okay.
[14:10:31] <R0b0t1> New one.
[14:10:31] <theBear> that sounds like the right thing to do
[14:10:59] <R0b0t1> I need to define that list of menus like I said, see? I put all of them in their own .h files, and they have a struct defined
[14:11:15] <R0b0t1> but then I want to take those and list them in another struct
[14:11:17] <R0b0t1> of all of the menus
[14:11:25] <theBear> how d'yer mean a list of menus ? i don't get why you don't just have a simple case or something in a main program
[14:11:29] <R0b0t1> problem is the compiler says it is not a constant initializer even if I mark the menu initializers as const
[14:12:21] <R0b0t1> Every screen is of the same type theBear, and organizing it this way is simply elegant/easy as a way to store those variables in progmem
[14:12:49] <R0b0t1> Every screen has a title and a list of options to scroll through
[14:13:22] <theBear> hmmmmm.... this starts to sound like redundancy, maybe yer doing it wrong, you should be auto-generating from simple source/flat files or something
[14:13:29] <timemage> R0b0t1, theBear:
http://ideone.com/R3m37r probably a waste of time. but oh well.
[14:13:31] <theBear> ooh, or maybe tables, depending on the details
[14:14:13] <R0b0t1> Aw man
[14:14:27] <theBear> timemage, ooooh ! nice work !
[14:14:48] <R0b0t1> I can have one big one, with offsets into it
[14:15:22] <R0b0t1> Or just put the code to copy the pointers into the list
[14:15:23] <R0b0t1> ACTUALLY NO
[14:15:27] <R0b0t1> THERE IS NO REASON FOR THIS
[14:15:29] <theBear> hmm, have you done much other programming robot ? or is avr kinda your introduction ?
[14:15:41] <R0b0t1> I did a bunch of CV programming
[14:15:45] <R0b0t1> with shitty AI
[14:15:47] <theBear> hehe, yeah, when people say "huh" that much, usually there's a better way :)
[14:16:01] <theBear> like opencv or raw c or ?
[14:16:24] <theBear> tho i suppose whatever approach, that kinda processing is VERY different to straight up old fashioned programs
[14:20:53] <R0b0t1> theBear, raw C
[14:20:55] <R0b0t1> It is
[14:21:00] <R0b0t1> A lot of it is dumb math
[14:21:04] <R0b0t1> or a lot of array processing
[14:22:40] <theBear> mmm, what little processing i did a long time ago (before cv was practical in a modern sense of what cv means) it was all arkward processing, repeated algorithms run through arrays, cross referencing/calculating arrays etc, the concept of program flow hardly existed
[14:27:17] <timemage> R0b0t1, something else that might work for your menus is an X-MACRO technique. it's difficult to tell without seeing the code.
[14:30:18] <R0b0t1> I think I've seen it.
[14:30:22] <R0b0t1> Kinda.
[14:31:37] <R0b0t1> Oh yeah I worked on some older code for a machine with have with a zilog processor on it
[14:32:19] <timemage> R0b0t1, yeah?
[14:32:35] <R0b0t1> Used to define settings
[14:33:20] <R0b0t1> It makes a vortex
[14:33:28] <R0b0t1> and screams like a banshee
[14:34:01] <timemage> R0b0t1, hopefully someone else knows what you're talking about, because i don't. =)
[14:34:31] <theBear> vortex, it's like a whirlpool :)
[14:34:48] <R0b0t1> It sucks in air at the top
[14:34:48] <theBear> and also possibly the coolest possible method of generating a hot/cold gradient 'mechanically'
[14:34:59] <theBear> but yeah, tbh i dunno what he's talking about :)
[14:35:11] <R0b0t1> and the vortex is in a specially made glass container
[14:35:11] <R0b0t1> with a slit on the side
[14:35:24] <R0b0t1> with a water injector
[14:35:26] <theBear> oh, you are talking about the 2nd one i just said
[14:35:30] <theBear> oh with water ? i dunno that
[14:35:59] <theBear> but without water a vortex tube with compressed air does a peltier-like trick which i find AMAZING theory wise
[14:36:06] <R0b0t1> interesting
[14:36:29] <R0b0t1> might actually be relevant to why some things that are happening are happening
[14:36:43] <R0b0t1> our unit has a 300cf/m blower on it
[14:36:47] <R0b0t1> ... pulling air through water
[14:36:58] <R0b0t1> you can ask yourself why one would want to do that.
[14:37:53] <theBear> air through water ? maybe that's to cool the hot side or keep the whole thing cooler... the vortex itself only generates a gradient
[14:38:04] <theBear> and i know why i pull 'air' through water :) but i got long hair
[14:38:44] <R0b0t1> whatever is floating in the air goes into the water
[14:39:11] <R0b0t1> Don't do it in a hospital. The water becomes a biohazard.
[14:39:57] <R0b0t1> In other news, this menu is till pissing me off. Not a good way to do it.
[14:40:10] <uninformed> hi
[14:40:36] <theBear> all water is a biohazard, but like my plastic surgeon said, we got antiseptic etc EVERYWHERE, yer pumped full of anti-tetanus and antibiotics and stuff already, sometimes when there's THAT much blood and crap, more water and pressure is just better
[14:40:36] <R0b0t1> theBear: OndraSter: Did one of you suggest something else?
[14:40:38] <R0b0t1> For menuing?
[14:41:10] <theBear> erm, not specifically, we're not exactly sure what kinda menus yer doing, or why it's complex enough for multiple files, but i thought you said 'eureka' and had some idea
[14:41:15] <OndraSter> I did not
[14:41:20] <R0b0t1> Dangit
[14:41:32] <R0b0t1> timemage: You?
[14:41:51] <timemage> R0b0t1, me what?
[14:41:55] <OndraSter> what about ncurses + menu library?
[14:41:55] <OndraSter> (kidding)
[14:46:08] <uninformed> Can a plastic snap case be repoened?
[14:46:30] <Tom_itx> sure
[14:46:37] <Tom_itx> will it be useable once you do?
[14:46:41] <Tom_itx> who knows
[14:46:44] <OndraSter> sure
[14:47:20] <uninformed> a tinyisp one
[14:47:32] <OndraSter> with hammer
[14:47:32] <OndraSter> anything can be done with a hammer
[14:48:12] <uninformed> man you dont realize it. credit cards do all
[14:48:22] <R0b0t1> Oh yeah
[14:48:25] <R0b0t1> you can get it open
[14:48:27] <R0b0t1> it'll go back together
[14:48:30] <R0b0t1> do it carefully
[14:48:38] <uninformed> its only 1 day snapped in
[14:48:52] <R0b0t1> Time isn't the issue
[14:48:55] <uninformed> and i somehow misaligned the pcb
[14:49:08] <Tom_itx> sure it is.. it has an expiration date
[14:49:46] <uninformed> question is what pushes the pcb out of alignment
[14:50:07] <Tom_itx> crappy injection molded plastic
[14:51:02] <uninformed> nah
[14:51:14] <uninformed> i think its some really bad joint
[14:58:59] <uninformed> any tips ?
[15:01:08] <R0b0t1> Are structs automatically put in progmem?
[15:01:27] <R0b0t1> B/c I am getting garbage from my print function, which I can only explain by starting the read in garbage memory
[15:14:29] <OndraSter> R0b0t1, structs?
[15:14:31] <OndraSter> structs are structs
[15:14:34] <OndraSter> you mean initialized structs?
[15:29:07] <R0b0t1> OndraSter, yeah
[16:04:17] <theBear> what does your print function print to ? usually garbage suggests a bodgy print function or wrong communication rate or something like that
[16:43:28] <uninformed> just the standard tools?
[18:29:49] <Tom_itx> abcminiuser,
[18:30:32] <Tom_itx> <metalliqaz> documentation is decent but some things are a mystery for someone just picking it up
[18:30:34] <Tom_itx> <metalliqaz> it isn't clear to me what the criteria are for a module to show up in the ASF Wizard
[18:30:47] <Tom_itx> <metalliqaz> anyone know why something would be hidden?
[18:31:14] <Tom_itx> <metalliqaz> well, i created a project by loading up a simple gpio example
[18:31:17] <Tom_itx> <metalliqaz> but when i use asf wizard, it's only got maybe 5 available modules
[18:32:09] * abcminiuser is tired
[18:32:16] <Tom_itx> me too
[18:32:27] <abcminiuser> It will show up if a) it is supported on the current device
[18:32:37] <abcminiuser> And b) if we haven't explicitly hidden it for some reason
[18:32:48] <abcminiuser> For example, internal meta-modules are hidden
[18:33:02] <abcminiuser> And some old, old, incredibly old modules that shouldn't be used
[18:33:21] <Tom_itx> friggin netsplit
[18:33:58] <Tom_itx> <metalliqaz> all the examples are for people with the various dev boards
[18:34:00] <Tom_itx> <metalliqaz> mine is a custom design
[18:34:27] <abcminiuser> ...
[18:34:29] <theBear> mmm, freenode and undernet been having a bad couple weeks for splits... i wonder if some script kiddies are being silly
[18:34:32] <Tom_itx> what is ASF wizzard?
[18:34:32] <abcminiuser> Then start a new user board template?
[18:34:38] <theBear> or even worse, script adulties, tut tut tut
[18:34:48] <theBear> Tom_itx, frontpage ? <grin>
[18:35:13] <theBear> dammit, that woulda been a bad joke if i didn't mix up asf and asp :(
[18:36:06] <Tom_itx> well he's gone anyway...
[18:37:43] <Tom_itx> that sounds like that silly lib RifRaf's been using
[18:38:28] <Tom_itx> http://webbot.org.uk/iPoint/30.page
[18:39:11] <Tom_itx> http://webbot.org.uk/iPoint/37.page
[19:47:21] <Vutral> hi
[19:51:25] <Horologium> iH
[19:55:50] <Tom_itx> oof
[22:24:16] <jadew> do you think a USB device will still work properly if the crystal heats up to 90 C?
[22:29:32] <Casper> jadew: depend on the crystal specs
[22:30:21] <jadew> I guess I'll find out :P
[22:30:32] <jadew> I have lots of room under a heatsink
[22:30:50] <jadew> figured it would be a good place for the usb connection
[22:30:55] <Casper> but the frequency might change
[22:31:05] <jadew> I know, that's why I was asking