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[00:29:28] <theBear> yeah, i got my icecream :)
[00:51:34] <tandoori> hey im trying to merge bits into a byte but im not sure how to do that
[00:51:51] <tandoori> ive never dealt with data this small before
[00:52:25] <tandoori> can anyone shine a bit of light onto the situation?
[01:18:59] <rue_house> :)
[01:19:09] <rue_house> you use a struct
[01:19:32] <rue_house> or a union...
[01:20:15] <rue_house> tandoori, you even still here?
[01:21:14] <rue_house> http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/macxhelp/v6v81/index.jsp?topic=%2Fcom.ibm.vacpp6m.doc%2Flanguage%2Fref%2Fclrc03defbitf.htm
[03:07:13] <evil_dan2wik> is it possible to damage the atmel chip using software?
[03:14:38] <RikusW> yes, eg by setting a grounded io pin high....
[03:14:48] <Xark> evil_dan2wik: It has limited flash amd EEPROM write cycles. There are probably some other "evil" things you could do depending on the circuit.
[03:14:57] <RikusW> it would be a combination of hw + sw
[03:33:20] <Richard_Cavell> RikusW: So you're saying there's no internal current limiter?
[03:33:38] <evil_dan2wik> i though the chip reset when that happened
[03:35:11] <RikusW> not entirely sure
[03:35:19] <RikusW> but I won't try doing that...
[03:36:01] <RikusW> it might actually reset..
[04:04:58] <grummund> yes there is an internal current limiter...
[04:05:16] <Richard_Cavell> grummund: so is it possible to burn out the chip?
[04:05:17] <grummund> ...but it is a one shot affair :D
[04:05:32] <Richard_Cavell> Also I would have thought most +5V power supplies would have some sort of current limitation
[04:05:39] <OndraSter> those sure
[04:05:47] <OndraSter> but the short current on atmega is not that big
[04:06:01] <OndraSter> the regs are always in the terms of 1A (unless it is special reg)
[04:06:21] <OndraSter> mega is in the order of hundred of mA
[04:06:23] <OndraSter> for a short time
[04:07:32] <grummund> mega is rated at 40mA per pin, 200mA total.
[04:07:44] <Richard_Cavell> And 100mA per port, right?
[04:07:47] <grummund> exceed that and you risk losing it.
[04:08:13] <grummund> i'm not aware of a per-port limititation.
[04:08:27] <grummund> *limitation, even.
[04:08:39] <OndraSter> grummund, but what is short circuit rating?
[04:08:44] <OndraSter> I am expecting 100mA-ish tbh
[04:08:55] <grummund> what do you mean short circuit rating?
[04:09:05] <OndraSter> if you tie it to +5V but set it to LOW output
[04:09:25] <grummund> then it will pass as much current as the power supply allows...
[04:09:32] <OndraSter> doubt it
[04:09:50] <grummund> ...until the 40mA is reached, at which point the pin bonding will fuse out.
[04:09:58] <grummund> s/will/may/
[04:11:49] <evil_dan2wik> I wonder what happens if you connect a 6v battery between gnd and a digital pin
[04:12:45] <OndraSter> it will clamp to the power pin
[04:12:48] <grummund> depends which polarity you connect, and if the pin is configured as input, output-high, or output-low.
[04:12:48] <OndraSter> unless it is RESET pin
[04:23:10] <Malinuss> anyone ever tried to use one of those cheap 315mhz/433mhz transmitter and receiver kits?
[04:34:37] <hackvana> Malinuss: Yes
[04:39:25] <Malinuss> hackvana, you think this would work: 1) have the receiver board running with a input interrupt on change, and each time it gets high, count the time until it gets slow 2) start transmission with a "handshake" that would be a (not real numbers) 1.5sec high signal 3) adress data (1 = 0.5sec high signal 0 = 0.25sec high signal) 4) the data itself 5) some kind of "goodbye" signal (1 sec high or whatever)
[04:41:04] <Malinuss> one more thing.. before the goodbye I would send some kind of checksum
[04:48:29] <Malinuss> hackvana, tl;dr ;D?
[05:23:02] <hackvana> Malinuss: I don't know if your particular scheme would work. There's a library out there which is *excellent* for these kinds of radios, let me see if I can find it for you.
[05:25:18] <Malinuss> hackvana, I just think it would be cool yo make your own wireless protocol. Also most of the libraries I found so far use usart for the communication, which I don't have
[05:25:31] <hackvana> Malinuss:
http://www.open.com.au/mikem/arduino/VirtualWire/
[05:25:53] <hackvana> "ASK receivers require a burst of training pulses to synchronize the transmitter and receiver, and also requires good balance between 0s and 1s in the message stream in order to maintain the DC balance of the message."
[05:27:13] <Horologium> do like the old lego mindstorms IR did...send the data forward then backward.
[05:27:42] <hackvana> That doesn't ensure DC balance. Sending again inverted would.
[05:27:49] <hackvana> But you don't need to balance IR
[05:28:17] <Malinuss> hmm I didn't know these kind of things could be an issue...
[05:28:24] <Malinuss> thought it woulbe be more streight forward
[05:28:31] <Malinuss> thanks for the link btw.
[05:29:23] <Horologium> well, not exactly backwards and forwards...but,,,they balance it..
[05:29:24] <Horologium> here..
[05:29:29] <Horologium> http://www.crynwr.com/lego-robotics/
[05:29:33] <Horologium> search for ir protocol.
[05:29:52] <Malinuss> hackvana, still I'm pretty sure the library won't work with ATtiny
[05:34:10] <Horologium> Malinuss, it could be modified to work. It is just written for the arduino is all which means it probably relies on some arduino libs.
[05:34:23] <Horologium> one could use the core of it to rewrite one for an attiny.
[05:34:37] <Malinuss> I propably gonna have to do that
[05:34:49] <Malinuss> sounds like my method might not work
[05:34:53] <Malinuss> because of some balance thing
[05:37:41] <Horologium> looking at the source, it shouldn't be too hard.
[05:37:51] <Horologium> it is written for arduino and msp430 both.
[05:39:53] <Horologium> well documented...and shouldn't require too much rewrite...I would think just the timer section.
[05:40:54] <Horologium> they do use a lot of static variables which are going to fill an attiny sram pretty quick.
[05:44:21] <Horologium> and only uses _crc_ccitt_update from the crc16.h so you could strip everything else not needed out of there to save some space.
[05:47:41] <Malinuss> yeah it could be a problem
[05:48:57] <OndraSter> you could do something like
[05:49:02] <OndraSter> logic 0: _-
[05:49:05] <OndraSter> logic 1: -_
[05:52:17] <OndraSter> so 11001010 would be -_-__-_--__--__-
[05:52:44] <OndraSter> aka two transmitted bits per actual data bit
[05:53:01] <OndraSter> I am not sure if something does not use it actually
[05:53:05] <OndraSter> I am pretty sure it does
[05:53:14] <OndraSter> maybe some flavour of ethernet or tokenring or something
[05:55:26] <Steffanx> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchester_code looks like that OndraSter :P
[05:55:40] <Steffanx> Except for it going negative
[05:55:41] <OndraSter> yes
[05:55:44] <OndraSter> yes
[05:56:17] <OndraSter> I know that there are Manchester, Manchester 3 and one more for ethernet, I was just not sure which one was the one I said :)
[05:57:04] <Steffanx> Everyone should just go lazy and get modues that do everything for them :P
[05:57:09] <hackvana> How do you know the alignment? In other words for any given bit, how do you know whether it's the first bit of the symbol or the second? And what if you have a long run of 1s or 0s in the input?
[05:57:11] <Horologium> what's the fun in that?
[05:57:34] <hackvana> This is why that module (and others like it) exist.
[05:58:20] <hackvana> /module/library/
[05:58:25] <hackvana> night
[05:58:42] <OndraSter> alignment? Just do a burst of -_-_-_-_ on the beginning to synchronize :)
[05:58:46] <Horologium> manchester encoding is just an encoding scheme but needs some framework around it still.
[05:58:51] <OndraSter> yep
[05:58:56] <Malinuss> OndraSter, sounds like a good idea
[05:59:08] <Malinuss> OndraSter, but how would I know where the "start" is?
[05:59:08] <OndraSter> of course
[05:59:10] <OndraSter> USB does it too!
[05:59:14] <OndraSter> huh?
[05:59:52] <Malinuss> OndraSter, well 11001010 is -_-__-_--__--__- but If I turn it on at _-__-_--__--__- ???
[05:59:54] <Horologium> Malinuss, every packet would have a predefined start sequence,,and stop sequence for that matter....
[06:00:00] <Malinuss> ah okay
[06:00:18] <Horologium> did you look at the lego-robotics link I posted?
[06:02:39] <Horologium> 55 ff 00 as a header...then the data is sent regular byte and inverted byte...like,,, 55 ff 00 f7 08 12 ed 09 f6
[06:02:55] <Horologium> fixed packet length with the last two bytes being the CRC/-CRC
[06:03:12] <Horologium> the data in that packet is F7 12
[06:03:42] <Horologium> all the rest is framing, redundancy, and crc.
[06:07:27] <Horologium> 55 ff 00 gives you a nice timing sequence of 010101011111111100000000 which should be sufficient to sync up the receiving end even if you miss the first few bits.
[06:08:13] <Jan-> hihi
[06:08:19] <Horologium> hello Jan-
[06:09:16] <Horologium> hows the weather in the UK this morning?
[06:09:57] <Jan-> Coolish, but hey, it's february
[06:10:01] <Jan-> what about you?
[06:10:08] <Horologium> warmer than yesterday.
[06:10:15] <Jan-> where's that
[06:10:52] <Horologium> was -21C here yesterday morning...this morning it is way up to -6C
[06:10:58] <Horologium> Iowa, USA, Earth
[06:11:08] <Jan-> ah, one of our colonial cousins!
[06:11:40] <Horologium> naaa...the colonies are out east.
[06:11:48] <Horologium> we are the runaways.
[06:11:48] <Jan-> aw c'mon
[06:11:59] <Jan-> I visited a friend of mine all the way out west in California a few months ago
[06:12:11] <Jan-> and she had electricity hot running water and everything
[06:12:16] <Horologium> aahh, california
[06:12:27] <Horologium> land of fruits, nuts, and flakes...and they grow food there too.
[06:13:10] <Jan-> I take it all back, anyway
[06:13:14] <Jan-> my mom was born in Iowa
[06:13:25] <Horologium> we gots runnin water out here in da sticks too! Gotta run from the well to the house ta keep da bucket from freezin!
[06:14:00] <Jan-> When you say house, d'you mean "log cabin"?
[06:14:06] <Horologium> logs...bah..
[06:14:09] * Jan- strums the first few bars of "dueling banjos"
[06:14:14] <Horologium> who needs logs? We got sod!
[06:14:39] <Horologium> actually, my house is over 100 years old...
[06:14:53] <Horologium> it was moved up here on the hill from a little town 6 miles away about 85 years ago..
[06:15:10] <Jan-> the pub where we drink was first built in 1670
[06:15:18] <Horologium> guy who lived in the house got fed up with his neighbors and moved the house with some wagon parts and a bunch of mules.
[06:15:20] * Jan- tallies one point scored :)
[06:15:37] <Horologium> least you got a pub!
[06:16:03] <Horologium> all we have in this town is 9 houses, a church, and Crop production services where they sell chemicals and seed.
[06:16:12] <Jan-> well, it is Iowa.
[06:16:30] <Jan-> 375,000 square light years of waving corn
[06:16:32] <Horologium> I gotta go 10 miles for a pub and that's not even a real pub but a bar.
[06:16:34] <Jan-> and one worried-looking sow
[06:17:04] <Horologium> at least our sheep haven't learned to fear the sound of zippers...which is why Scottsmen wear kilts after all.
[06:17:13] <Jan-> snrk
[06:17:15] <Jan-> I've never been to Iowa but I have been to Kansas, which I understand is sort of similar
[06:17:26] <Horologium> kansas is flatter.
[06:17:35] <Horologium> Iowa people are nicer.
[06:17:39] <Jan-> Well yes
[06:17:44] <Horologium> bout the friendliest place I've ever found.
[06:17:47] <Jan-> as one of my favey authors says, Iowa at least has *a* hill.
[06:17:56] <Horologium> and I've been around the world a couple of times, rather literally.
[06:18:04] <Horologium> we have two hills!
[06:18:11] <Horologium> and they both have ski slopes on them in the winter.
[06:18:32] <Horologium> takes all of 3 minutes to hike up either of them too!
[06:18:43] <Jan-> It has to be at least this high to count
[06:18:48] * Jan- indicates a pretty small distance with her hands
[06:19:40] <Horologium> I kinda miss the NC mountains
[06:19:58] <Horologium> but the people out there are a bit more standoffish
[06:20:00] <Horologium> so it works out.
[06:20:19] <Horologium> and I got my wifley person here with me so that makes wherever I am home.
[06:20:24] <Jan-> My buddy in LA is originally from a big farm in Montana with horses and mountains
[06:20:33] <Jan-> it couldn't be more different to LA but I liked it when I visited.
[06:21:02] <Horologium> I couldn't handle LA last time I went out there.
[06:21:08] <Jan-> in what way couldn't handle?
[06:21:10] <Horologium> spent a week of pure hell.
[06:21:31] <Horologium> too many unfriendly people in too small a space and me without my guns.
[06:21:52] * Jan- facepalms
[06:22:01] <Jan-> Oh dear, a proper gun-toting colonial
[06:22:06] <Horologium> Des Moines is about the biggest city I can handle and I can only take that in small doses.
[06:22:16] <Horologium> actually, I don't own any guns.
[06:22:16] * Jan- dons bullet proof vest
[06:22:20] <Horologium> just a bow and crossbow.
[06:22:45] <Jan-> reusable ammo!
[06:22:50] <Horologium> but a good repeating rifle and single action revolver would be required for me to return to LA voluntarily.
[06:23:49] * Jan- field-strips her M-47, or is that AK-16
[06:24:01] <Jan-> *clink* *snikt*
[06:24:06] <Horologium> and versi vesa
[06:24:26] <Horologium> can field strip either the ak-47 or m-16 myself actually.
[06:24:42] <Horologium> used to be able to do it blindfolded but my hands shake too much these days.
[06:25:43] <specing> Jan-: Why do you have weapons if you can't aim?
[06:25:45] <Jan-> well I'm blind anyway so I guess I'm twice as impressive :D
[06:25:51] <Jan-> specing: I don't.
[06:26:05] <Horologium> don't need to see to shoot a fully automatic weapon.
[06:26:10] <Jan-> No :D
[06:26:15] <Horologium> just point it in the general direction of the sound and pull trigger.
[06:26:22] <MrMobius> hey guys can you think of any microcontrollers in dip format not on this list? MSP430, 8051, ARM LPC1114, AVR, PIC, and Propeller
[06:26:28] * Jan- pulls the tarp off her M-134 minigun
[06:26:34] <Jan-> gnehehehe
[06:26:43] <Horologium> MrMobius, yes..
[06:26:52] <Horologium> but can't think of the name...working on it.
[06:27:00] <Horologium> have one in my mame box.
[06:27:09] <Jan-> specing: Mainly though I don't have weapons because I live in the UK :(
[06:27:23] * Jan- should totally be allowed to own fully-automatic firearms
[06:28:08] <Horologium> MrMobius, cypress PSoC
[06:30:04] <Horologium> at least, they used to have dip package.
[06:30:13] <MrMobius> Horologium, cool. ill google it. TI wont ship MSP430s to my address so Im looking for a replacement.
[06:30:31] <Horologium> http://www.cypress.com/?id=179&source=productshome
[06:31:10] <Horologium> http://www.cypress.com/?mpn=CY7C63813-PXC oooo..dip package USB controller!
[06:31:19] <OndraSter> :)
[06:31:24] <OndraSter> PIC does USB in DIP too
[06:34:22] <Jan-> how do you get the frosted flakes and the wheaties to school?
[06:34:25] <Jan-> on the universal cereal bus!
[06:34:29] * Jan- takes bow
[06:36:04] <Horologium> OndraSter, yup...and 32bit processor with usb in dip as well.
[06:36:17] <MrMobius> i read that as "Jan- takes blow"
[06:36:23] <OndraSter> lol
[06:36:34] <MrMobius> now to see if i can get it in DIP from China :P
[06:36:46] <Horologium> MrMobius, that would be "gives" if that were this kind of channel but it isn\'t
[06:37:07] <MrMobius> if Jan- were a drug dealer i suppose
[06:37:12] <Amadiro> MrMobius, the inevitable next step for a stand-up comedian
[06:37:33] <Horologium> Jan-, what is the favorite cereal of Mobsters?
[06:37:56] <MrMobius> smacks?
[06:38:06] <MrMobius> nvm
[06:38:08] <Horologium> Frosted Flakes....After all, Tony the Tiger says so....(said in fake italian accent)
[06:42:15] <Horologium> MrMobius, thing with cypress is, they aren't your average run of the mill microcontrollers...they are Programmable System on Chip controllers...almost an fpga kind of design where you rearrange internal modules to do what you want along with programming....rather complicated devices...and the software for them is windows only which kills it for me.
[06:47:58] <MrMobius> Horologium, its probably not what i want then. windows is fine. i just need something standard i can program in C to do little projects with that I can get shipped from china.
[06:49:17] <Horologium> PIC works for that.
[06:49:36] <Horologium> check out the ds89c450 chip from maxim
[06:50:02] <Horologium> 40pin 8052 microcontroller with a high speed core and 64k of flash.
[06:52:41] <MrMobius> that sounds really nice other than its 8 bit. its looking like its down to pic or 8051. do you know offhand if that chip can be programmed on a breadboard and if it needs an external xtal?
[07:01:32] <Horologium> 8052 is 8051 extended
[07:01:49] <Horologium> external crystal needed and has built in serial bootloader.
[07:02:48] <MrMobius> thats not too bad i guess. im reading the datasheet and it looks like it can use external memory too which is really a plus
[07:05:06] <MrMobius> Horologium, where would you buy from in china? ebay doesnt seem to have any at the moment
[07:05:54] <Horologium> no clue.
[07:06:01] <Horologium> I get mine from maxim directly.
[07:07:26] <MrMobius> cool
[07:12:14] <Horologium> free samples rock.
[07:12:34] <GuShh3> sample whore
[07:12:44] <MrMobius> yeah, i cant bring myself to lie about it though :/
[07:17:29] <Horologium> GuShh3, damned right!
[07:17:50] <MrMobius> Horologium, do you use your work details?
[07:18:13] <Horologium> I fix copiers for a living...nobody is gonna send me samples for that.
[07:36:20] <MrMobius> Horologium, what do you put on the form then?
[07:52:28] <Tom_itx> 'will work for free chips'
[08:00:22] <GuShh3> Horologium: don't be proud of it...
[09:13:15] <RikusW> http://www.cstelectronics.co.za/downloads/sensolute/Sensolute_MVS-Application%20Note%20Rev1_5.pdf
[09:13:35] <RikusW> http://www.cstelectronics.co.za/downloads/sensolute/Sensolute_MVS0608_02-Datasheet%20Rev2_4.pdf
[09:40:31] <tandoori> hey im trying to merge bits into a byte but im not sure how to do that
[09:40:46] <Tom_itx> what do you mean by merge?
[09:41:11] <Tom_itx> byte |= 1 <<bitvalue
[09:42:26] <tandoori> i saw some xamples of shifting but that doesnt seem to do what i want
[09:42:35] <tandoori> or maybe it does i dont know
[09:43:03] <Tom_itx> read
[09:43:05] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/avr/c_bits/bits_index.php
[09:44:08] <Tom_itx> These operators work on bits and not logical values. Take two 8 bit bytes, combine with any of these operators, and you will get another 8 bit byte according to the operator's function. These operators work on the individual bits inside the byte.
[09:45:46] <Tom_itx> note the macros at the bottom
[09:53:23] <tandoori> hmm
[09:53:43] <tandoori> i almost have it, let me check something
[09:55:26] <tandoori> looks like i need to OR the bit mask to merge the data
[09:56:31] <tandoori> actually, theres no shifting required, i just ue OR, heh
[09:56:42] <Tom_itx> if either is set the result will be set
[09:56:50] <Tom_itx> if that's what you're after
[09:56:57] <tandoori> yeah
[09:56:58] <Tom_itx> yup
[09:57:15] <tandoori> thanks for your help, that link was quite useful
[09:57:29] <Tom_itx> PORTB |= 0xFF; will set them all high
[09:57:54] <Tom_itx> PORTB |= 0x01; will set the first bit high
[10:01:09] <tandoori> to turn it off i use PORTB ~= 0x01; //?
[10:03:09] <Tom_itx> #define bit_clear(p,m) ((p) &= ~(m))
[10:03:09] <Steffanx> No, PORTB &= ~0x01
[10:04:59] <tandoori> oh thats right, it also requires an AND
[10:05:05] <tandoori> i remember reading that somewhere
[10:05:38] <Tom_itx> read the macros at the bottom of the page
[10:05:56] <tandoori> okay okay, im going to read them now :-P
[10:06:09] <Tom_itx> it's all there
[10:42:32] <krphop> anyone use eclipse for avr programming? i'm having an issue where eclipse reports no MCU types under target hardware
[10:45:46] <Tom_itx> i tried it for something and didn't like it
[10:45:58] <Tom_itx> arm i think
[10:46:58] <yunta> I worked with it for Java development, and didn't like it.
[10:47:39] <krphop> i've used it in the past with good luck, but not so much anymore
[10:48:03] <krphop> i'm on OSX, so options of ides are limited, i may just have to go to cli
[10:54:25] <Malinuss> Horologium, you still here :)?
[10:55:43] <Horologium> no
[10:55:46] <Horologium> I'm back though.
[10:56:32] <Horologium> went to town and acquired groceries..50 mile round trip plus acquisition time.
[10:57:37] <Malinuss> Horologium, I've been thinking about what you said about how I should do logic... with the: "logic 0: _-
[10:57:38] <Malinuss> logic 1: -_
[10:57:38] <Malinuss> " I think that might be a bad idea, because If I loose a single bite, everything can get shifted...
[10:57:51] <Horologium> I didn't say that.
[10:58:02] <Horologium> I think OndraSter_ did.
[10:58:18] <Horologium> I said you should send everything twice, once positive and once negative.
[10:58:19] <Malinuss> you are right, it was OndraSter_ ;D
[10:58:35] <Malinuss> I can't do that, because it wouldn't be balanced
[10:58:57] <Horologium> data is sent regular byte and inverted byte...like,,, 55 ff 00 f7 08 12 ed 09 f6....fixed packet length with the last two bytes being the CRC/-CRC....the data in that packet is F7 12
[10:59:09] <Horologium> that is balanced..
[10:59:43] <Horologium> FF/00 is balanced...f7/08...12/ed...09/f6
[11:00:08] <Malinuss> What about just doing something even simpler. Like - for 1 sec and _ for 1 sec to get logic 1. And -for 0,5 sec and _ for 0,5sec to get logic 0?
[11:00:35] <Horologium> nice and slow data...but that works.
[11:01:14] <Horologium> is there a reason not to use the USART or USI on the chips?
[11:01:46] <Malinuss> Horologium, well the 1sec/0,5sec is jusat an example (could be 10msec and 5msec). I don't use usi or usart because the two chips don't have those peripherals (attiny's)
[11:02:00] <Horologium> they don't have a USI?
[11:02:04] <Horologium> which chips are you using?
[11:02:17] <Malinuss> attiny13 :)
[11:05:18] <Horologium> http://www.atmel.com/Images/AVR274.pdf
[11:06:07] <Horologium> single ended software uart on attiny
[11:06:24] <Malinuss> sounds interesting. thanks
[11:06:34] <Horologium> http://www.atmel.com/Images/AVR274.zip
[11:06:39] <Horologium> there's the source.
[11:06:48] <Horologium> right off the attiny13 webpage
[11:07:44] <Malinuss> oh sometimes you get suprised how much different stuff atmel actually makes guides about
[11:08:30] <Horologium> just read through the appnotes.
[11:08:37] <Horologium> there's LOTS of stuff there.
[11:13:44] <Malinuss> Horologium, I even found a guide how to make a brushless motor controller, heh
[11:14:01] <Horologium> they also have software USB appnote
[11:14:08] <Horologium> http://www.atmel.com/Images/doc2556.pdf
[11:14:22] <Horologium> AVR309
[11:15:33] <Malinuss> Horologium, what's wrong with LUFA ;D?
[11:15:48] <Horologium> LUFA requires hardware USB on the chip.
[11:16:04] <Horologium> AVR309 is similar to VUSB
[11:16:09] <Malinuss> I was pretty sure there were a software version
[11:16:15] <Malinuss> maybe I was thinking about Vusb
[11:16:19] <Horologium> yeah.
[11:16:21] <Malinuss> Tom_itx, just wonder, will I get the Rev 1.1C
[11:16:28] <Horologium> VUSB is a second software USB for avr..
[11:16:41] <Horologium> the AVR309 is one developed by another guy before VUSB.
[11:17:09] <Malinuss> I se
[11:17:10] <Malinuss> see
[11:19:45] <Horologium> Igor Cesko
[11:20:00] <Horologium> yup..that's the one....I guess atmel liked it and asked if they could use his work.
[11:21:17] <Malinuss> hehe
[11:24:44] <Tom_itx> Malinuss, yes
[11:36:17] <NullMoogleCable> hi
[11:37:18] <NullMoogleCable> im trying to find the smallest cheepest avr chip with usb and i2c
[11:42:20] <Horologium> NullMoogleCable, look at the parametric table at the atmel website.
[11:42:23] <Tom_itx> NullMoogleCable,
http://www.atmel.com/v2PFResults.aspx#%28actives:!%288238,8394,8362,8282,8431,8300,8358,8392,8378,8445,8236,8449,8474,8248,8264,8447,8256,8254,8286,8462,8429,8458,8466,8400,8302,8278%29,data:%28area:%27%27,category:%2734864[34282]%27,pm:!%28%28i:8238,v:!%283,12%29%29,%28i:8362,v:!%285,16%29%29,%28i:8282,v:!%282,3%29%29,%28i:8431,v:!%284,21%29%29,%28i:8300,v:!%281,9%29%29,%28i:8358,v:!%283,27%29%29,%28i:8378,v:!n%29,%28i:8449,v:!%282,4%
[11:42:26] <Tom_itx> wow
[11:42:47] <darknite> hehe
[11:43:13] <darknite> atmel is like "fuck you, real engineers know how to find stuff they don't share links"
[11:43:50] <Horologium> do you need device or device+otg?
[11:44:17] <NullMoogleCable> just device
[11:44:36] <Horologium> looks like atmega8u2 is your best bet.
[11:44:59] <Horologium> http://www.atmel.com/devices/ATMEGA8U2.aspx
[11:47:13] <NullMoogleCable> TWI (I2C): 0 for 8u2
[11:48:28] <Tom_itx> U4 has twi
[11:48:33] <Tom_itx> atmega32U4
[11:48:56] <Tom_itx> 16U4 would be smaller/cheaper?
[11:49:23] <Tom_itx> also, xmega are cheap
[11:49:34] <Tom_itx> plenty of those are U capable
[13:46:57] <OndraSter_> it's so quiet today!
[13:48:16] <specing> Everyone is at FOSDEM
[13:48:49] <specing> And I just booted an ARMv5 system on an amd64 kernel, fml.
[13:51:59] <OndraSter_> huh?
[13:56:17] <specing> Yeah I know, you can't do that on windoze, can you?
[13:56:33] <OndraSter_> I have got no idea how you can boot ARMv5 system on amd64 kernel
[13:56:33] <specing> s/on/with/
[13:56:41] <OndraSter_> qemu in kernel?
[13:56:44] <specing> Nope
[13:57:01] <specing> Qemu-assisted kernel execs
[13:57:14] <OndraSter_> ah
[14:01:37] <creep> [201511] <GeDaMo> "Reflow Skillet"
http://www.sparkfun.com/tutorials/59
[14:01:46] <creep> [202546] <creep> GeDaMo<< lol @ cooking hotplate reflow ;>>
[14:03:15] <creep> Tom_itx<< that link contains your ip address, creditcard number, your dog's name...
[14:03:20] <creep> :)
[14:03:28] <creep> like the google search redirector junk
[14:13:49] <specing> ?
[14:14:29] <Steffanx> uh?
[14:18:07] <specing> OndraSter_:
http://sprunge.us/XTHG
[14:19:41] <OndraSter_> :)
[14:20:43] <specing> Hello lightweight servers :D
[14:24:44] * tzanger is learning about NAND flash today
[14:27:02] <OndraSter_> has anyone tried running linux kernel on avr32?
[14:27:05] <OndraSter_> it exists and works
[14:27:10] <OndraSter_> but.. has anybody done it?
[14:27:14] <specing> its even mainlined afaik
[14:27:18] <OndraSter_> yes it is
[14:27:32] <Horologium> never gotten an avr32 that can handle it yet...bit pricy for the board.
[14:27:42] <specing> Heh
[14:27:57] <specing> Rather get a $50 cortex-a8 devboard
[14:29:30] <Horologium> bah..I need to go clean the kitchen after my chemistry experiment.
[14:29:40] <tzanger> Horologium: what did you make?
[14:29:48] <Horologium> spaghetti and meatballs
[14:30:02] <Horologium> homemade sauce and meatballs.
[14:30:35] <tzanger> ah
[14:30:59] <tzanger> I make a pretty decent homemade spaghetti... I only cheat by using crushed tomatoes instead of crushing them myself
[14:31:00] <Horologium> cooking is just organic chemistry.
[14:31:40] <Horologium> made sketty sauce this past fall from tomatoes from our garden.
[14:32:29] <tzanger> that would rock
[14:35:43] <Horologium> we have a nice big garden every year and can lots of stuff.
[15:49:38] <creep> Horologium<< don't do it manually, program an atmel ;)
[16:05:27] <Horologium> the programming isn't the problem.
[16:05:42] <Horologium> it's the mechanicals that give me fits.
[16:05:59] <creep> i feel the same :(
[16:06:29] <creep> but if ultraprecision is not needed then you can just hack some bearings from ptfe
[16:07:07] <creep> sliders, hinges, sleeve bearings ...
[16:08:42] <creep> and you can cut cakes using ultrasonic cutter
[16:08:44] <creep> ^^
[16:09:05] <creep> not that i eat cake...
[16:09:47] <Horologium> I want to build devices like they did in the movie Chitty Chitty Bang Bang
[16:14:46] <creep> i haven't seen that ;/
[16:14:48] <creep> but go on
[16:15:09] <creep> haha that is a cheat code in gta3
[16:15:17] <creep> chittychittybb
[16:18:49] <Horologium> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBJGpNTP_lY
[16:18:56] <Horologium> starts about 1:34
[16:21:01] <creep> haha
[16:21:02] <creep> hahaha
[16:21:20] <creep> currently my chrome won't play the flash crap
[16:21:36] <creep> updated, restarted ....
[16:21:50] <Horologium> it's awesome do-nothing type machines.
[16:21:53] <creep> the html5 videos are ok
[16:21:53] <Horologium> that do something.
[16:22:27] <Horologium> that's one of my mostest favoritest movies of all time.
[16:22:45] <Horologium> I have a 3 way tie with chitty, willie wonka, and sound of music.
[16:22:55] <creep> is it a good film?
[16:23:01] <Horologium> the original willie wonka.
[16:23:11] <creep> isit about nothing?
[16:23:14] <Grievre> how fast can you run the hardware UART on atmega328?
[16:23:18] <Horologium> it's good clean disney fun movie, yeah...and a musical...old fashioned disney musical.
[16:23:29] <Horologium> it's about imagination..
[16:23:43] <Horologium> Grievre, umm...look at the datasheet?
[16:25:15] <creep> nah, frying some bacon
[16:25:20] <Horologium> atmega324 at 20MHz can run 2.5Mb/s
[16:25:39] <Horologium> guessing 328 will be similar.
[16:26:05] <creep> do you think 160C is ok, or should i go higher?
[16:26:25] <Horologium> dunno.
[16:26:30] <Horologium> I just turn the burner on high and cook.
[16:26:34] <creep> ;>
[16:27:06] <Horologium> think in my portable electric skillet I cook bacon at 350F
[16:27:10] <creep> i'm frying bacon, no water, and it makes itself fat
[16:27:24] <Horologium> so, 175C
[16:27:45] <creep> most frying stuff works between 150C and 240C i think
[16:27:53] <Horologium> of course no water...that would be,,,ewww.
[16:28:07] <creep> above 240C, even PTFE starts releasing hazardous stuff
[16:29:21] <creep> how would you sense the temperature inside an IR oven? ;/
[16:29:37] <Horologium> an IR sensor?
[16:29:45] <Horologium> or a K type thermocouple maybe?
[16:29:51] <creep> it is not really straight forward to sense a sausage, or sandwitch surface temperatures
[16:30:06] <creep> i have platinum RTD's , but can't decide what to measure
[16:30:32] <creep> the top thin metal's temperature above the IR lamp?
[16:31:07] <creep> it would be even nicer if i could control the air exchange rate
[16:31:26] <creep> and maybe measure the outflow temperature then?
[16:31:59] * Horologium shrugs.
[16:32:23] <creep> ;/
[16:33:15] <creep> my hotplate temp control was very simple hack, measure the heating element temperature
[16:33:51] <Horologium> had to talk my wife out of buying a fancy "IR" heater today.
[16:34:03] <creep> why? it is just cool
[16:34:17] <Horologium> how do you explain to someone that electric heat is electric heat..whether it uses light bulbs or a coil of wire.
[16:34:24] <creep> IR heats food inside
[16:34:38] <Horologium> since when?
[16:34:45] <Horologium> it is just radiated heat.
[16:34:47] <creep> since the beginning of time
[16:34:48] <creep> :(
[16:35:06] <creep> well, a wire radiates IR too
[16:35:23] <creep> mine uses quartz IR heaters
[16:35:31] <Horologium> but they sell this "IR" heater for 200 dollars.
[16:35:43] <Horologium> supposedly heats better than the cheap 20 dollar electric heater.
[16:35:49] <creep> there are ones $400+
[16:35:57] <Xark> creep: Microwave coking perhaps, but IR is just low-energy light "color" that we perceive as heat on.
[16:36:05] <Horologium> 1500 watts of heat is 1500 watts of heat.
[16:36:07] <creep> Xark<< you are wrong
[16:36:28] <creep> Horologium<< sure, but there is conventional heating, and there is heating via IR radiation
[16:36:34] <Xark> creep: One of us is...
[16:36:51] <Xark> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared
[16:36:55] <creep> if the heating element is not RED-hot then it is not radiating much IR
[16:37:04] <Horologium> electricity converted to heat...whether it is an IR light bulb or a red hot bare wire....is the same.
[16:37:26] <creep> Xark<< Infrared light is emitted or absorbed by molecules when they change their rotational-vibrational movements
[16:37:34] <Xark> creep: I don't think that is correct. An electric blanket emits IR.
[16:37:34] <tzanger> you're mistaking power consumption with effeciency
[16:37:39] <creep> it also penetrates water for example a few cm-s
[16:37:52] <creep> that is a different thing...
[16:37:54] <tzanger> you can consume 1500W but how effectively is that 1500W being absorbed by the recipient of the heat
[16:38:07] <Xark> creep: I think it is all electromagnetic energy (photons).
[16:38:12] <creep> yes
[16:38:28] <creep> but i wouldn't put food in a microwave oven
[16:38:59] <Horologium> microwave is better for food than for reflow soldering.
[16:39:13] <creep> that will create random "hot-spots" where the electromagnetic energy gets so high it breaks up intermolecular bonds creating random chemicals
[16:39:14] <Horologium> but is best for boiling water....and killing yippy dogs.
[16:39:59] <creep> also as a side effect, if you microwave a food in a plastic container, plastic will dissolve in your food
[16:40:09] <Horologium> of course it does!
[16:40:12] <Horologium> that's half the flavor!
[16:40:26] <Horologium> and why young girls are maturing physically much earlier than they used to.
[16:40:29] <creep> that is not so healthy, creates >10M times allowed carcinogen content
[16:40:48] * Xark avoids those plastic trays "safe" for conventional ovens too. :)
[16:40:48] <creep> Horologium<< that is just evolution
[16:41:25] <Horologium> some plastics contain chemicals similar to estrogen....one theory is that is what is causing early female maturation.
[16:41:39] <creep> hm, and that is just creepy
[16:41:43] <Horologium> yup.\
[16:42:19] <Horologium> is also why mice love to chew on certain kinds of plastic,,specially the kind used for wire insulation in cars in the 80s.
[16:42:25] <creep> whyt if it's responsible for some amount of gayness too?
[16:42:33] <Horologium> possibly.
[16:44:05] <creep> Xark<< i have no problem with IR radiation being electromagnetic radiation, my point is, it penetrates food to a few cm depth, causing internal heating, so better than putting the stuff in a pan and heating conventionally on a hotplate
[16:44:50] <creep> you can verify this by studying some potatoes cooked conventionally, and using IR
[16:45:02] <Xark> creep: OK, maybe because it is hotter or more intense or something, but the IR photons are the same as from a stove element AFAIK.
[16:46:05] <creep> Xark<< IR heaters radiate much more IR than a hotplate, or a heated pan i think
[16:48:01] <Xark> creep: I believe that. I have an IR cooker on my propane BBQ. Kind of a tube shaped elements that has internal flame to make it get hot and emit IR.
[16:49:01] <creep> [231909] <tzanger> you're mistaking power consumption with effeciency <<< the efficiency of heating is 100% :P
[16:49:59] <creep> but heat distribution matters, whether you just cook that potato from the outside, while the inside is still cold, or heating the inside more too
[16:50:38] <creep> when outside is crispy, and inside is still uncooked, that is crap.
[16:51:01] <Horologium> then you are cooking it too fast.
[16:51:16] <creep> yeah i was impatient
[16:53:47] <creep> Horologium<< if the IR oven does not use halogen lights then it is probably worth it
[16:54:04] <creep> (and it has air exchange, and real temperature control)
[16:54:42] <creep> otherwise, just get the cheapest and build the temperature control for it, you'll get more for less
[16:55:39] <creep> cheap chinese hotplates/toasters use some bimetal crap that does +200-50C precision
[16:56:29] <creep> that will burn food, and even ptfe from the inside of the pan even with water in it lol
[16:57:02] <Horologium> won't burn my pans.
[16:57:05] <Horologium> I use cast iron.
[16:57:17] <creep> yes i bought that too ;/
[16:57:31] <Horologium> good old fashioned cast iron..not those new fangled lighter weight ones.
[16:57:37] <creep> but i could use ptfe with my "new" temp control
[16:58:08] <creep> ofc... thickness is needed to conduct heat
[16:59:26] <creep> the thin pans only heat from the bottom, thicker wall pans conduct up heat and heat from sides too
[17:05:46] <tandoori> ugh okay i have a problem here, i a trying to read in 8 bits from a pin and put them together to form a byte, but I do not think i am doing this right
[17:06:35] <tandoori> basically i am checking to see whether or not the bit is not equal to zero and then i am shifting the bit in via a mask
[17:07:14] <Malinuss> tandoori, why not just use a uart?
[17:07:17] <tandoori> in my head and on paper it seems to be the proper way to do it. especially since the starting byte i am using has a value of 0.
[17:07:52] <Malinuss> so you send 8 of 0 as a start value?
[17:08:03] <tandoori> huh
[17:08:04] <tandoori> no
[17:08:52] <tandoori> ok lets say foo = 0x00. I just change the bits that are equal to 1 to form the proper byte and ignore anything that is a 0
[17:09:39] <tandoori> (in the stream of 8 bits that I am readin)
[17:09:50] <tandoori> does that make sense?
[17:11:15] <Amadiro> tandoori, you are reading 8 bits from 8 different pins?
[17:11:24] <tandoori> Amadiro: nope, just one pin
[17:11:35] <Amadiro> tandoori, from an ADC?
[17:11:39] <tandoori> so i am using a tidy for-loop
[17:11:42] <tandoori> Amadiro: nope
[17:11:56] <tandoori> a shift register
[17:13:17] <Amadiro> okay, then you can do something like "byte the_byte = (first) + (second << 1) + (third << 2) + ... + (eigth << 7)"
[17:13:39] <tandoori> right thats what i am doing
[17:13:43] <tandoori> ah so i am doing it right
[17:13:45] <tandoori> :-D
[17:14:03] <tandoori> i know c, but i am just not used to working with data this tiny :-P
[17:30:29] <Casper> tandoori: shift, OR the bit
[17:30:42] <tandoori> huh
[17:30:47] <tandoori> casper, oh, i am
[17:32:04] <Casper> remember to OR at the right position, and shift in the right direction
[17:32:51] <tandoori> oh wait, you are right, no need to check wither the but is 0 or 1, lol
[17:33:32] <tandoori> oh no thats not right
[17:34:03] <Casper> data |= PINA & 0x04 ? 1 : 0;
[17:34:04] <Casper> :D
[17:34:07] <tandoori> because i am using foo |= (1<<i) (where i is the step in the for-next loop)
[17:34:16] <OndraSter> OR
[17:34:20] <OndraSter> u8 foo = 0;
[17:34:39] <OndraSter> for(int i = 0; i < 8; i++) { if (PINA & 0x01) foo |= 1; foo <<= 1; }
[17:34:40] <tandoori> whats that quesion mark doing there
[17:34:41] <OndraSter> :P
[17:35:25] <OndraSter> that is a "quick if" -- no idea how they call them
[17:35:31] <tandoori> i dont know how to check pins on a port that way, so i use a macro
[17:35:50] <tandoori> i wish they would just do away with ports, would make it a lot easier
[17:35:56] <OndraSter> huh?!
[17:35:59] <OndraSter> stop being arduino!
[17:36:23] * tandoori shrugs. it just seems like they have no use, really
[17:36:43] <tandoori> besides logically grouping the pins together
[17:37:23] <tandoori> i mean, if they serve an actual purpose, broaden my horizons because im just not seeing it
[17:37:36] <OndraSter> <tandoori> besides logically grouping the pins together
[17:37:36] <OndraSter> that
[17:38:20] <tandoori> maybe it has something to do with the way the chips are designed, i dunno
[17:38:55] <tandoori> well anyway, i just created well named macros that point to the port and pin
[17:39:22] <tandoori> to make my code much more readable
[17:39:36] <tandoori> *legible
[17:39:46] <tandoori> readable is not a word :-P
[18:11:22] <Malinuss> well you can't really have more then 8 pins in one register - so obviously you need more "groups" of pins.. thefor - different ports-
[18:11:51] <Malinuss> hope that makes more sense tandoori
[18:12:11] <Malinuss> I would sugest to not renaming the ports, because it will be more confusing in the end anyway
[18:12:22] <tandoori> i do not agree
[18:12:33] <tandoori> i named the port connections based on what they are supposed to do
[18:13:16] <Tom_itx> have it your way but... no
[18:13:34] <tandoori> for example: #define Serial_Input_595 PORTB, 7
[18:13:39] <Malinuss> it's a better practice to simply have a comment at the start, stating which pins goes to which hardware, rather then renaming the ports/pins etc... It might get confusing when reading the datasheet etc.
[18:13:44] <tandoori> Tom_itx: whatever, this is my program not yours
[18:14:00] <Tom_itx> hope i don't have to read thru it
[18:14:09] <Malinuss> ^
[18:14:27] <tandoori> Tom_itx: oh you wont, my code is not open source
[18:14:34] <Malinuss> l3l
[18:14:55] <Tom_itx> i ran across a guy once that made his whole library using __ underscore as variables... different lengths
[18:15:05] <Tom_itx> what an asshole
[18:15:15] <Malinuss> haha
[18:15:18] <Malinuss> oh wow
[18:15:29] <Malinuss> there are standards for a reason
[18:15:32] <OndraSter> haha
[18:15:41] <OndraSter> lpszMagyar? :P
[18:16:01] <Tom_itx> peter straley
[18:16:05] <Malinuss> int this_integer_counts_how_many_times_this_while_loop_has_looped = 0
[18:16:17] <Malinuss> now that is proper variable naming
[18:16:41] <OndraSter> this_CTRL+SPACEBAR :)
[18:16:51] <OndraSter> to finish the varibable's name
[18:16:53] <OndraSter> variable*
[18:17:02] <tandoori> Tom_itx: and its not nice insulting someone's methods just because you don't agree with them. I could say your methods are bullshit too, but I won't because I understand that everyone has their own coding practices. and if you can't read #defines, thats your problem
[18:17:18] <Tom_itx> i didn't insult you
[18:17:19] <Malinuss> OndraSter, at least in visual based IDE ;P
[18:17:24] <Tom_itx> i merely said no
[18:17:24] <OndraSter> of course
[18:17:35] <Tom_itx> and hoped that i wouldn't have to read it
[18:17:43] <tandoori> my code is heavily commented, just about every line has a comment, i don't really think its possible to get lost
[18:17:53] <OndraSter> ugh
[18:17:59] <OndraSter> too much comments = you are doing something wrong
[18:18:00] <Malinuss> tandoori, you just have to understand that there are good and bad programming practice. that would propably be bad practice...
[18:18:13] <OndraSter> I, for one, barely use comments. My code is self-explanatory :)
[18:18:27] <OndraSter> either that or I was too lazy and the code was a draft that is not supposed to make it into the retail build :P
[18:18:30] <Malinuss> hehe when I started asm I was commening every line xD
[18:18:33] <OndraSter> heh
[18:18:49] <tandoori> ok lets say that you are cooking cabbage with onions today and you tell me, and i respond with 'phew, glad i won't have to step in your house'. thats an insult
[18:18:55] <Malinuss> /this *moves* the register x to y //this is a if that checks etc.
[18:19:36] <tandoori> lord, why i am i even trying to defend myself, this is MY code :-P
[18:19:43] <Tom_itx> don't try to
[18:19:46] <tandoori> carry on
[18:19:51] <Tom_itx> accept that we view things differently
[18:19:53] <Tom_itx> i have
[18:20:10] <Tom_itx> i wasn't criticising you for your methods
[18:20:16] <Tom_itx> merely said no
[18:20:20] <OndraSter> http://pastebin.com/sJkeHwvP
[18:20:21] <OndraSter> my draft code
[18:20:30] <Malinuss> tandoori, what if you worked together in a team - or need help at some point? There is a reason for standards....
[18:21:00] <tandoori> Malinuss: i see no problem with that, because I just happen to know how to read #define statements
[18:21:52] <tandoori> and there is no team if everyone isnt on the same page. as long as everyone understood that there are #define statements present, theres no problem
[18:23:17] <Tom_itx> i will still help you :)
[18:25:12] <Malinuss> OndraSter, "draft code"?
[18:25:27] <OndraSter> yes
[18:25:34] <OndraSter> code that is supposed to check if it is doable at all :)
[18:25:44] <OndraSter> no matter how shitty it will look and perfore
[18:25:44] <Malinuss> ah I see
[18:26:11] <OndraSter> this is simple syntax highlighting :)
[18:27:07] <OndraSter> argh, debugging stuff has got one issue - requires 3 bloody USB ports :)
[18:27:22] <OndraSter> one for your board, one for your debugging UART - USB and one for your JTAG debugger :D
[18:29:01] <Malinuss> are you still working on USB stacks ?
[18:36:29] <inflex> lo folks, hi Tom_itx
[18:36:55] <Malinuss> hjello
[18:36:57] <Tom_itx> hey inflex
[18:37:06] <OndraSter> Malinuss, no! it works :)
[18:37:12] <OndraSter> now I am doing the actual bootloader
[18:37:13] <Malinuss> nice
[18:37:14] <OndraSter> and the PC side to it
[18:37:35] <Malinuss> the PC side? oh yeah right, you were doing your own "arduino thingie"
[18:37:51] <OndraSter> Malinuss,
http://clip2net.com/page/m12051/41123520
[18:37:52] <OndraSter> yes
[18:38:41] <Malinuss> urgh USB is so complicated. but I think it's the only peripheral on my atmega32u4 I haven't touched yet (at least not directly by doing my own code)
[18:38:54] <OndraSter> haha
[18:38:54] <OndraSter> LUFA
[18:38:57] <OndraSter> I suggest
[18:39:01] <OndraSter> don't do it yourself :)
[18:39:09] <OndraSter> if you enjoy having hair :D
[18:39:12] <OndraSter> which is not white
[18:39:39] <OndraSter> USB is not that complicated, it is just very strict
[18:39:52] <OndraSter> (at least with some smart MCU like (x)mega it is not that complicated)
[18:40:29] <Malinuss> I couldn't even make lufa work. When lufa comes in the gallery I will give it a go again.... Right now I found some code that makes it a HID and I am abel to send strings/integers trough it (after some modifications)..
[18:40:50] <Malinuss> so I can at leat use it for "debugging"
[18:40:55] <OndraSter> :)
[18:41:05] <OndraSter> on the other hand - if you write your own USB stack you can do ANYTHING
[18:41:17] <OndraSter> you have got no brain cells, no hair, anything else left
[18:41:21] <OndraSter> nothing else*
[18:41:35] <Malinuss> well at least what windows allows I guess?
[18:42:34] <OndraSter> ?
[18:42:39] <OndraSter> the MCU side
[18:43:46] <tzanger> OndraSter: hm maybe that's what happened to me
[18:44:15] <tzanger> that and the 6 kids, ex wife and wife 2.0...
[18:44:23] <Malinuss> hah
[18:44:52] <Malinuss> OndraSter, have you tried mcu + some ethernet chip (ENC28J60 or the wiz)
[18:45:15] <OndraSter> Malinuss, not yet, but I have got my ENC424j600 :)
[18:45:17] <OndraSter> boards
[18:45:20] <OndraSter> one soldered up
[18:45:40] <Malinuss> hehe cool
[18:45:47] <Malinuss> wonder what you could actually do
[18:46:27] <Malinuss> guess something like uploading some data to a server...
[18:46:33] <OndraSter> or running a server :)
[18:46:36] <OndraSter> data stored on SD card
[18:46:37] <OndraSter> why not!
[18:48:15] <Malinuss> running a server? really?
[18:48:53] <tzanger> a small slow one sure
[18:49:44] <Malinuss> and hopefully not to many people will connect at once ;D
[18:52:20] <OndraSter> :)
[18:52:24] <OndraSter> I don't have public IP :D
[18:55:55] <Tom_itx> OndraSter, so use dynamic
[18:57:20] <OndraSter> how would that help?
[18:57:24] <OndraSter> if it would not still be public
[18:59:26] <OndraSter> Malinuss, btw those enc424j600 > enc28j60: they have got three times as much internal SRAM for buffers and they are 100Mbit :)
[18:59:43] <OndraSter> they cost more though
[19:01:21] <Malinuss> OndraSter, I guess with the library it wouldn't be to hard to get them going?
[19:03:06] <Malinuss> Or would you write the ip stacks etc. yourself OndraSter ;D?
[19:04:06] <OndraSter> no
[19:04:10] <OndraSter> IwIP or uIP
[19:04:16] <OndraSter> but I will write the enc424 driver itself
[19:04:28] <OndraSter> just bring packets between MCU and the chip
[19:04:36] <OndraSter> using DMA! :P
[19:04:47] <Malinuss> DMA?
[19:05:00] <Tom_itx> OndraSter, use dyndns
[19:05:29] <OndraSter> but dyndns still requires public IP
[19:05:32] <OndraSter> yes, DMA Malinuss
[19:05:40] <OndraSter> dyndns = dynamic IP
[19:05:45] <OndraSter> which is something unrelated to public IP
[19:05:50] <Tom_itx> mmm
[19:06:15] <OndraSter> I would need a VPN with packet forwarding on the server :)
[19:06:26] <OndraSter> through the VPN
[19:06:29] <OndraSter> which of course is possible
[19:06:38] <OndraSter> but I don't have a VPS with a VPN :D
[19:09:29] <Malinuss> hehe
[19:13:23] <jadew`> holly fuck... power went down and my file just got filled with NULLs :/
[19:13:37] <jadew`> my freaking main cpp file, the one I wrote the most code in
[19:13:43] <jadew`> and the project was not in the SVN yet
[19:13:53] <jadew`> 3 fucking days of work
[19:15:26] <Tom_itx> check your backup?
[19:15:35] <jadew`> there's no backup for this
[19:15:40] <jadew`> it wasn't in the SVN :(
[19:15:48] <Tom_itx> that sucks
[19:16:00] <jadew`> it's for that editor I was writting, it was basically the main shit :(
[19:16:02] <jadew`> FUCK
[19:16:25] <Tom_itx> next time pastebin parts as you go
[19:16:36] <jadew`> :(
[19:16:41] <jadew`> this is so fucked up
[19:16:47] <Tom_itx> if no other way to backup
[19:16:55] <jadew`> I have lots of ways to backup
[19:16:57] <Tom_itx> but you know what you wrote :)
[19:17:00] <jadew`> I just didn't think this shit would happen
[19:17:05] <Tom_itx> you never do
[19:17:08] <jadew`> Tom_itx, yeah, but it's a lot of code
[19:17:23] <Tom_itx> sry dude
[19:17:30] <jadew`> gonna restart and unplug one of the HDDs, (it's a raid 1
[19:17:41] <jadew`> mabye only one is screwed up
[19:17:41] <jadew`> brb
[19:40:05] <jadew> they're both fucked
[19:42:19] <tandoori> jadew: what was that comment in reference to?
[19:42:44] <jadew> I was working on a text editor, the power went down for a bit
[19:42:58] <tandoori> oh hehe
[19:42:59] <jadew> when the PC rebooted, istead of code I had NULL in the most important file
[19:43:12] <tandoori> oh wow
[19:43:19] <tandoori> didnt save your work?
[19:43:22] <jadew> the working drive is a raid 1 device, I hoped at least this didn't happen on one of them
[19:43:28] <jadew> well, it was saved
[19:43:32] <tandoori> oh nice
[19:43:35] <jadew> but it got filled with NULL somehow
[19:43:42] <jadew> and it happened on both devices
[19:43:50] <tandoori> hmm
[19:43:52] <jadew> if just got truncated it would have been different
[19:43:55] <tandoori> odd
[19:44:00] <jadew> but instead the file got filled with fucking nulls
[19:44:20] <tandoori> i need to get a ups too
[19:59:05] <jadew> tandoori, thing is I do have an UPS
[19:59:21] <jadew> but sometimes the power surge is so weird that it still manages to shut down my pc
[20:00:10] <Tom_itx> i bet it doesn't happen again soon
[20:00:48] <jadew> it's the first time this has happened to me
[20:01:04] <jadew> I hate my electricity company
[20:01:07] <jadew> they suck
[20:01:20] <Tom_itx> i've never lost anything major but i have had crashes
[20:02:21] <jadew> I installed a recovery software, looking on the HDD for a snippet of code :/
[20:02:35] <jadew> I don't think I have the strength to start it over
[20:05:40] <tandoori> google docs?
[20:05:53] <tandoori> saved copy to cloud?
[20:06:16] <jadew> dude... I have a really bad ass backup system in place
[20:06:26] <jadew> I just didn't add the project to svn yet
[20:11:04] <jadew> I guess it was doing the save when the power surge occured and the buffer got corrupted
[20:11:12] <jadew> however it still went ahead with the write
[20:11:31] <jadew> which basically means the code got overwritten by garbage
[20:11:44] <jadew> I'm willing to bet this hasn't happened to many people
[20:12:07] <jadew> you have to be really unlucky to hit ctrl + s at the right time
[20:17:44] <Xark> jadew: Timing of ^S means little these days of OS and HD buffering. UPS is the answer. :)
[20:18:05] <jadew> Xark, I do have an UPS :(
[20:18:25] <jadew> the power surge was probably too weird and it still reseted my pc
[20:18:43] <Xark> jadew: I see. I guess a *better* UPS. :)
[20:18:56] <jadew> Xark, yeah, I think I'm gonna invest in that
[20:19:36] <Xark> jadew: Is it old or something? Also I think some designs are better than others (WRT what they can survive).
[20:19:51] <jadew> Xark, it's about a year old
[20:20:27] <Xark> jadew: I would hope for better. But who knows, perhaps your computer would be in flames now if you had nothing. :)
[20:20:39] <jadew> :)
[20:21:11] <jadew> I'm doing a deep scan now for a string that was in the file
[20:21:24] <jadew> maybe I'll get some luck and the contents it's still somewhere on the disk
[20:21:34] <Xark> jadew: Good idea. Hopefully some other copy somewhere...
[20:21:36] <jadew> at least part of it and I'd still be happy
[20:21:55] * Xark remembers scanning floppies sector by sector to recover code...
[20:23:20] <jadew> the shitty part is that the autorecover feature in VS 2010 failed
[20:23:27] <jadew> the backup folder is freaking empty
[20:25:29] <Xark> jadew: Too bad. That has recovered files for me a few times (especially project/solution settings).
[20:26:10] <jadew> appears to not be working
[20:28:42] <jadew> fucking computer, ruined my day
[20:30:02] <jadew> can't believe it didn't have enough power to hold the buffer but it had enough to remember what it was doing and to write the garbage to the disk
[20:46:30] <jadew> ok.. it's gone
[21:31:22] <inflex> Oh very nice, nice to see they now have the open-Symbol (or device) in Eagle.
[21:33:46] <Tom_itx> huh?
[21:34:11] <inflex> Tom_itx: if you right click on a part in the schem, you can edit the layout/part directly
[21:34:25] <inflex> likewise the layout
[21:34:57] <Tom_itx> ahh
[21:35:17] <Tom_itx> what ver?
[21:35:41] <inflex> 6.4.0
[21:37:14] <rue_mohr> the mega8535 and the 90s8535 ARE different aren't they?
[21:37:34] <Tom_itx> probably so
[21:37:47] <Tom_itx> both rather old i think
[21:38:05] <rue_mohr> yea, the two 90s8535 I have were PULLED!
[21:38:12] <rue_mohr> almost NEVER see avrs in products
[21:38:48] <rue_mohr> tom, you have an avr datasheet repository dont you?
[21:39:00] <rue_mohr> http://ruemohr.org
[21:39:05] <Tom_itx> not so much
[21:39:08] <Tom_itx> just a few i use
[21:39:53] <rue_mohr> http://ruemohr.org/docs/avrs.html
[21:39:55] <Tom_itx> you may not find a data sheet for some of those
[21:40:02] <Tom_itx> not there
[21:41:18] <Tom_itx> is the 8535 a 40 dip?
[21:41:28] <Tom_itx> iirc i had one of those around here somewhere
[22:34:22] <jadew> gonna upgrade my ups
[22:34:35] <Casper> jadew: that's something I need to do for my network gear
[22:34:54] <Casper> but I debate between an openups and modding my old inneficiant backups...
[22:34:59] <jadew> found one that puts out 360kW :D
[22:35:07] <jadew> $45k lol
[22:35:24] <Casper> :)
[22:35:27] <jadew> Casper, what's openups?
[22:35:37] <Casper> dc ups
[22:35:43] <jadew> ah
[22:36:00] <jadew> I need about 1kW output, AC
[22:36:10] <Casper> http://www.mini-box.com/OpenUPS
[22:36:26] <jadew> yeah, doesn't looks like what I need
[22:36:33] <Casper> 6-34Vin 6A continuous, 10A peak
[22:36:42] <Casper> 6-24Vout, 6A continuous 10A peak
[22:36:51] <jadew> not bad
[22:37:41] <Casper> 6-30V battery charge, Li-Ion, Li-Po, LIFEPO4, Lead Acid (and I'm pretty sure it also do NiCD and NiMH but it's not listed in the web page)
[22:37:51] <jadew> damn.. I didn't know you can buy hardware that expensive in here, I made the mistake of ordering them by price, higher first
[22:37:56] <Casper> with build in 6S balancer
[22:38:02] <jadew> and several pages later I'm still in the $20k+ range
[22:38:06] <Casper> :)
[22:38:16] <Casper> yeah, there is some really expensive stuff
[22:38:44] <jadew> Casper, that one seems a bit more specialized
[22:38:59] <Casper> yeah
[22:39:03] <jadew> like, you'd have to skip the device's power supply
[22:39:07] <Casper> yup
[22:39:14] <Casper> and that was the initial goal
[22:39:21] <Casper> most of my stuff is 12V
[22:39:36] <jadew> I see
[22:41:31] <Casper> modem, 12V 0.75A..... router, 12V 1.25A... phone ATA is 5V 2A (12-5V smps do the trick, and is like 6$), phone base is 6.3V 350mA... network switch is 12V too...
[22:42:16] <jadew> tbh, I don't care much if my network goes down
[22:42:34] <Casper> if my network goes down, I have no phone
[22:42:34] <jadew> I just want to avoid losing my files while working on them
[22:42:49] <jadew> I keep my phone unplugged :P
[22:43:11] <jadew> when people want to talk to me over the phone they have to tell me some other way :P
[22:43:20] <jadew> (the voip phone)
[22:44:02] <Casper> currently, I still have a landline, so it's not a major issue yet
[22:44:17] <Casper> but I'ld say within a year I might be fully voip
[22:45:04] <jadew> I only use that for work
[22:45:19] <jadew> but I don't have a landline since forever
[22:45:29] <jadew> everyone uses mobile phones around here
[22:46:07] <jadew> I just switched to a nice plan the other ady
[22:46:10] <jadew> *day
[22:46:23] <jadew> 4500 minutes / month for $5
[22:48:27] <Casper> wow
[22:48:29] <Casper> don't have that here
[22:48:45] <jadew> yeah, data & conmunication is pretty cheap in here
[22:49:19] <jadew> I also have a sim card from my internet provider, free calls within the networks and unlimited internet connection :)
[22:49:31] <jadew> the sim card was also free
[22:49:32] <Casper> O.O
[22:49:49] <jadew> I actually have two, the other one came with a free usb dongle :)
[22:51:08] <jadew> I thought it might be some tactic to get all the customers and then up the prices, but its been going like this for years and they already have all the customers
[22:53:13] <jadew> I don't know what UPS to get, there are so many
[22:53:25] <Tom_itx> i got one that needs batteries
[22:53:32] <Tom_itx> it's over there on the shelf ->
[22:53:35] <jadew> lol
[22:53:42] <Tom_itx> 750 iirc
[22:53:47] <jadew> what kind of batteries?
[22:54:01] <Tom_itx> 12v 7.5 ah iirc
[22:54:06] <Tom_itx> x2
[22:54:22] <jadew> what can that power?
[22:54:27] <Tom_itx> i don't remember their size
[22:54:31] <Casper> my previous ups required 4x 12V 7AH batts...
[22:54:39] <Casper> my new one need 2x 12V 18AH
[22:55:07] <jadew> I guess that would be ok for the emergency light, eh? :D
[22:55:20] <Casper> about 45 mins for the pc
[22:55:26] <jadew> really?
[22:55:30] <jadew> hmm
[22:55:39] <jadew> doesn't sound like enough power
[22:55:43] <Casper> but I want 8 hours for the network gear
[22:56:59] <jadew> the ones I find are both expensive and crappy
[22:57:11] <jadew> 8 minutes backup time at maximum charge
[22:57:26] <jadew> granted, it's enough to save your files and shut down
[22:57:34] <Tom_itx> so put some deep cycle marine batteries on it
[22:57:44] <jadew> but I know how that goes, 6 months after you buy it, those 8 minutes will be 30 seconds
[22:58:26] <jadew> also... the price range is huge
[22:58:34] <Casper> jadew: get an used apc smartups 1400VA or so, install an huuuuuge SLA batt on it :D
[22:59:13] <jadew> Casper, I might actually check the used market
[23:00:06] <Casper> and you might want to hack the smartups if the charge voltage is too high...
[23:00:10] <Casper> mine I did a nice hack
[23:00:22] <Casper> I added a temperature compensation to the charge voltage :D
[23:00:24] <rue_shop2> I have a programming definition for a atmega324a in my avrdude.conf if anyone ever wants
[23:01:03] <jadew> Casper, what do you mean if the charge voltage is too high?
[23:01:12] <Casper> the hack was really simple: replaced a 100k resistor by a 100k multi-turn trimpot in series with a (10k resistor in parallel with a 10k ntc)
[23:01:25] <Casper> jadew: the charge voltage on mine was 13.9V/batt
[23:01:31] <jadew> ah, I see
[23:01:39] <Casper> it's higher than the 13.5-13.8V recommanded
[23:02:05] <Casper> now it sit at 13.65@25C with proper compensation good for about -40C to +60C
[23:02:38] <jadew> does it have AVR?
[23:02:57] <jadew> (voltage regulation)
[23:03:02] <Casper> AVR as atmel microcontroller? or Automatic Voltage Regulation?
[23:03:06] <Casper> then yes
[23:03:13] <jadew> and how much did you pay for it?
[23:03:21] <Casper> I forgot, got it used
[23:03:32] <jadew> I'm wondering what budget I should allocate, it's hard to decide since there are so many models available
[23:03:37] <Casper> yes
[23:03:48] <Casper> so many models... and each one have their pro and cons
[23:04:13] <jadew> pro and cons that I don't know :)
[23:05:12] <Casper> yeah
[23:05:29] <Casper> I wish online ups was way cheaper
[23:09:53] <jadew> any idea if APC is a famous UPS brand?
[23:12:11] <john_f> yes, top seller
[23:12:17] <jadew> thanks
[23:15:22] <Casper> top of the line
[23:15:31] <Casper> you will rarelly see another brand in a datacenter
[23:17:11] <Tom_itx> ahh that's what i have
[23:17:14] <Tom_itx> i forgot the brand
[23:17:22] <Tom_itx> and was too lazy to get up and look
[23:17:27] <Casper> mine is APC too
[23:20:11] <jadew> good to know
[23:23:51] <jadew> I think I'll go for BR1500G-GR
[23:24:30] <jadew> 1500VA
[23:24:59] <Casper> I think I'll bake some cookies
[23:26:59] <Casper> brown sugar... margarine... sugar... egg... milk...vanilla...flour... salt... baking soda... oat... chocolate...
[23:27:08] <Casper> yup cookie time!
[23:27:25] <jadew> enjoy
[23:27:49] <Tom_itx> mine was old enough it had a serial interface for network control
[23:27:58] <Tom_itx> and came with novell software drivers
[23:30:59] <Casper> mine also have a serial port
[23:31:02] <Casper> but I don't use it
[23:31:08] <Casper> this one came with a network card
[23:31:24] <Casper> snmp is nice
[23:31:30] <Casper> and it also have a web interface
[23:51:54] <jadew> I don't see a this one has a usb port
[23:52:00] <jadew> *this one has a usb port
[23:52:05] <jadew> (didn't see it at first)
[23:52:23] <jadew> actually, I don't see it now either, but it says so in the specs