#avr | Logs for 2013-01-23

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[00:00:15] <GuShH> blocky: windows lost contact with reality.
[00:00:17] <blocky> im going to try to power everything from the programmer, from usb
[00:00:27] <blocky> GuShH yes
[00:00:46] <GuShH> windows 8, for kids.
[00:01:15] <blocky> Currently, this hardware device is not connected to the computer. (Code 45)
[00:01:17] <Casper> GuShH: the worse is that some say that win8 is the best windows ever made...
[00:01:17] <blocky> bah
[00:01:49] <GuShH> Casper: then they have deals like upgrade your win 7 for $14.99 which is ok, but then you realize there's a page worth of small print
[00:01:53] <blocky> Casper well everyone at microsoft says that
[00:01:58] <GuShH> and it's just a limited time offer that only applies in some cases.
[00:02:13] <GuShH> win8 seems like a hipster version of win7
[00:02:33] <GuShH> and there's no way it can possibly increase productivity, if anything it makes people waste more time.
[00:02:43] <blocky> windows has stopped 3 of my usb host controllers in device manager
[00:03:03] <GuShH> blocky: they have to say it's the best
[00:03:17] <blocky> this device isn't using any resources because it has a problem
[00:03:23] <blocky> ^ not a particularly helpful error message
[00:03:58] <GuShH> keyboard error, type "c" to continue
[00:04:17] <blocky> aha, green light on programmer
[00:04:52] <Casper> GuShH: win8 was made for tablet... and pushed to pc... and that's the issue
[00:04:54] <Casper> mind you
[00:05:03] <Casper> you can't even buy a win7 laptop anymore
[00:05:11] <Casper> and I suspect it will be the same with pc
[00:05:26] <GuShH> Casper: you can always buy a laptop with linux or freedos
[00:05:36] <Casper> GuShH: "can"
[00:05:44] <GuShH> well if you don't want to that's another thing
[00:05:47] <GuShH> in theory they are cheaper
[00:05:57] <blocky> so i want reset to vcc through a resistor... does that mean back to the programmer vcc... through a resistor?
[00:06:01] <GuShH> Casper: I can't get over one thing though
[00:06:06] <GuShH> the pre-installed bunch of CRAP the vendors put
[00:06:15] <GuShH> and they're just trials of things
[00:06:41] <blocky> my lenovo laptop was not bad for bloatware
[00:06:52] <blocky> ... tho its had other issues
[00:07:04] <GuShH> lenovo, preloaded applications
[00:07:12] <GuShH> norton internet security
[00:07:15] <GuShH> adobe reader
[00:07:17] <GuShH> skype
[00:07:24] <GuShH> microsoft office 2010 "preloaded"
[00:07:36] <GuShH> corel windvd, corel burn, corel movie factory, ...
[00:07:38] <Casper> GuShH: they get paid...
[00:07:41] <Casper> that'S the thing
[00:07:52] <Casper> but they are less worse than 10 years ago
[00:08:08] <GuShH> windows live "essentials" (wtf)
[00:08:16] <Casper> where the os/junk size ratio was about 50:50
[00:08:25] <GuShH> oh plus all the lenovo software...
[00:08:26] <Casper> 5G os and 5G junk
[00:08:32] <GuShH> some of which will never work if you don't buy the extras
[00:08:33] <blocky> i didn't get any of that
[00:08:45] <GuShH> blocky: it depends on the series and year
[00:08:54] <GuShH> T420, T430 in this case
[00:09:04] <blocky> you got corel on your t430?
[00:09:05] <GuShH> thinkpads
[00:09:18] <blocky> i have a t420, thought it was relatively free of bloatware
[00:09:28] <GuShH> blocky: with the good screen?
[00:09:38] <blocky> yeah
[00:09:41] <GuShH> oh
[00:09:44] <GuShH> how is it in general
[00:09:49] <blocky> i think i got a lemon
[00:09:55] <GuShH> o.O
[00:10:02] <blocky> either that or something in my apartment is causing all the power-related devices to fail
[00:10:06] <GuShH> refurb! refurb!
[00:10:17] <blocky> battery, ac adapter and lcd (or inverter) have all gone within 18 months
[00:10:17] <GuShH> not on warranty anymore?
[00:10:19] <GuShH> US gets 1 year
[00:10:21] <GuShH> we get 3
[00:10:29] <Casper> I saw some machine with basically only 1 junk: norton AV... the rest of the preinstalled junk was basically nothing... but office trial...
[00:10:34] <blocky> canada gets 1 year, they replaced the screen and the battery
[00:10:45] <GuShH> Casper: the lenovo stuff is usually not very helpful
[00:10:46] <Casper> I was quite surprised to see such an empty windows...
[00:11:05] <blocky> also the thinkpad utilities are pretty innocuous
[00:11:13] <GuShH> rescue and recovery, access connections, fingerprint software, password manager, thinkvantage system update, thinkvantage power manager, thinkvantage toolbox, lenovo simple tap, etc.
[00:11:18] <Casper> no manufacturer crap, no trial beside mso... and the av was a 1 year
[00:11:22] <blocky> okay so im going to stick a 2.7k resistor between vcc and reset
[00:11:28] <Casper> now... they tend to even install trial version of the av
[00:11:59] <GuShH> blocky: other than that how much ram did you put on it?
[00:12:14] <GuShH> got the msata ssd?
[00:12:18] <blocky> i think its at 6gb now, bought it with 2
[00:12:18] <GuShH> or the 3g card
[00:12:25] <GuShH> o.O
[00:12:36] <blocky> their prices for ram/drive are bs
[00:12:46] <Casper> lol
[00:12:46] <blocky> i bought the smallest hdd and swapped it for an intel ssd
[00:12:49] <Casper> bestbuy fail...
[00:12:53] <Casper> Sigma 70-300mm f/4-5.6 DG Macro Lens For Canon - Online Only
[00:12:53] <Casper> Model:AF70300DGC | Web Code:10095758
[00:12:53] <Casper> Not Available Online
[00:12:53] <Casper>
[00:12:54] <blocky> i bought it through lenovo
[00:12:54] <Casper> lol
[00:13:02] <blocky> lol
[00:13:21] <GuShH> blocky: looking at one with 8GB, it's possible to upgrade to 16 but that's going to get expensive because it's only got two slots
[00:13:38] <Casper> actually... I found out why: out of stock
[00:14:05] <GuShH> 500GB 7200RPM, not hybrid though
[00:14:08] <blocky> gush i upgraded the wifi to the 6300 ultimate with 3 antennas
[00:14:20] <GuShH> if I get a card it'll be the 3g one with gps
[00:14:29] <GuShH> dx.com actually sells it, how bad can it be? lol
[00:14:37] <blocky> okay im going to try to communicate with the avr
[00:14:47] <GuShH> try not to use smoke signals
[00:15:16] <blocky> hmm nope
[00:15:24] <blocky> maybe i should try board power...?
[00:15:29] <blocky> or is my resistor wrong
[00:15:49] <GuShH> I don't even know what you're doing
[00:16:05] <blocky> lol
[00:16:17] <blocky> im wiring up an isp programming to an attiny2313
[00:16:18] <GuShH> it's hard to believe you've got a lemon thinkpad
[00:16:19] <GuShH> that's new for me
[00:16:21] <blocky> and ive never done it before
[00:16:34] <GuShH> my cat is just going nuts at a moth
[00:16:42] <blocky> GuShH i don't think the power in this building is the greatest, the lights flicker a lot and the building is 40 years old
[00:16:45] <GuShH> almost took the router and the modem just then
[00:16:52] <blocky> so maybe plugging the laptop straight into the wall was not a good idea
[00:16:54] <GuShH> blocky: no battery?
[00:17:01] <blocky> battery?
[00:17:11] <GuShH> connected directly without a battery?
[00:17:25] <blocky> no, i usually left it plugged in with the battery in
[00:17:34] <GuShH> your power brick should work on a broad range of voltages
[00:17:50] <GuShH> 90-240, maybe even better than that.
[00:18:10] <blocky> well, 3 things have failed in 18 months, and all power related
[00:18:40] <GuShH> power-brick failures are common with all brands but that's another story
[00:18:45] <GuShH> it often involves abuse.
[00:18:59] <GuShH> I got a couple here that are in perfect condition except for a shorted cable :p
[00:19:44] <blocky> well, apart from all the failures the laptop has been great :P
[00:19:55] <blocky> i like the red nub, i like the keyboard, i like the metal hinges
[00:20:06] <GuShH> nub? NUB? we call it nipple!
[00:20:26] <GuShH> blocky: multi-point touchpad right?
[00:20:33] <GuShH> although I wonder who supports that on PC
[00:20:51] <blocky> GuShH yeah you can install a synaptics driver and do gestures
[00:21:03] <blocky> i have two fnger scroll, works decently well
[00:21:33] <GuShH> can the reader be used for "gestures" also? (one finger fires one app, etc)
[00:22:12] <blocky> never tried
[00:23:10] <blocky> i have been hearing the next thinkpad T is going to lose a lot of nice features
[00:23:25] <GuShH> they already have lost them
[00:23:32] <GuShH> no more magnesium behind the screen for instance
[00:23:40] <blocky> no hardware buttons on touchpad, no external hinges
[00:23:46] <blocky> pretty sure mine has magnesium all around
[00:23:49] <GuShH> lenovotization
[00:23:54] <GuShH> blocky: one of the last yes
[00:24:05] <GuShH> 420 is gone though no more.
[00:24:10] <GuShH> at least the T
[00:24:27] <blocky> lenovo is spinning thinkpad into its own brand though, so i haven't given up hope
[00:24:44] <blocky> it's just a really solid feeling computer all around
[00:24:52] <GuShH> hinges are nice, but do you ever put the screen fully flat?
[00:25:05] <blocky> no, but i think they're stronger this way
[00:25:12] <GuShH> they are
[00:25:16] <blocky> its losing another row of keys too
[00:25:21] <GuShH> but they always seemed to market that feature
[00:25:29] <GuShH> and I can't figure out why that's a good thing
[00:25:44] <GuShH> blocky: if they mess with the keyboard they're going to lose everyone's attention.
[00:25:57] <GuShH> you do not mess with a thinkpad's keyboard.
[00:25:59] <blocky> what about the chiclet keys on the 430?
[00:26:10] <GuShH> that's like taking a shit on the pope's robe if you are religious
[00:26:31] <blocky> i agree
[00:26:47] <blocky> half the engineering students at my school use them, and the profs too
[00:27:02] <GuShH> it's a laptop for doing actual work
[00:27:16] <GuShH> which is what a friend can't seem to understand, he says "they're ugly"
[00:27:24] <blocky> utilitarian :)
[00:27:29] <GuShH> go play games on your mom's plastic laptop fool.
[00:28:04] <Casper> which gpu balls break
[00:28:25] <GuShH> break balls gpu does not
[00:28:31] <blocky> im still holding out hope that somebody at lenovo ruined the thinkpad without checking with his higher ups, and its too late for them to fix the T431 but that they've decided they can't kill the golden goose and that's why they're spinning thinkpad into its own company
[00:28:59] <GuShH> meh I won't be getting any new models any time soon.
[00:29:24] <blocky> i was looking forward to getting a new computer when intel releases haswell
[00:29:27] <GuShH> too bad this 420 I'm looking at has an i5 only
[00:29:49] <GuShH> meh I want to upgrade the desktop... but it won't be intel.
[00:29:50] <blocky> mine's an i5, with an ssd it's plenty fast
[00:29:58] <blocky> how could it not be intel
[00:30:09] <GuShH> too expensive for what it is.
[00:31:08] <blocky> hmm i can't get this chip to program and i need to go to bed
[00:32:29] <blocky> wow and the battery is non removable
[00:33:10] <GuShH> ????
[00:33:15] <GuShH> on which one
[00:33:24] <GuShH> Casper: am I the only one who thinks win8 looks unfinished?
[00:33:38] <Casper> it does look unfinished
[00:33:41] <GuShH> one of the first GUIs I wrote looked like that because I didn't want to spend time dealing with graphics
[00:33:52] <Casper> like a 5yo that tried to copy apple
[00:34:09] <GuShH> they wanted to go "zen"
[00:34:12] <Casper> emphasis on "tried"
[00:34:19] <GuShH> but you can't polish a turd (ok you can but you get what I mean)
[00:34:19] <Casper> and no start menu? c'mon
[00:34:44] <GuShH> underneath what seems to be a lightweight system lies a bunch of .net bloat that is about ready to explode in your face
[00:35:00] <Casper> I wonder if those win8 upgrade licences if they deactivate the previous os...
[00:35:10] <GuShH> hrm.
[00:35:13] <GuShH> that's a good question
[00:35:17] <GuShH> now I'm worried.
[00:35:27] <GuShH> win 7 pro 64 is not half bad by comparison
[00:35:41] <Casper> I know the refurbished one does desactivate the other license
[00:35:54] <GuShH> that's bull
[00:38:22] <blocky> how could an upgrade deactivate your old license
[00:38:58] <GuShH> It's Microsoft
[00:39:01] <GuShH> logic does not apply.
[00:39:02] <GuShH> (tm)
[00:39:15] <GuShH> brb
[00:40:21] <blocky> anybody have suggestions as to why my chip wont program
[00:40:49] <Casper> blocky: buffered programmer?
[00:41:43] <blocky> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/usbtiny_programmer/testing_index.php
[00:41:49] <blocky> i might have wired it wrong.. 1 sec
[00:41:52] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, how are you programming it?
[00:42:25] <blocky> avrdude -c usbtiny -p m128
[00:43:07] <blocky> no pretty sure its wired correctly
[00:43:38] <evil_dan2wik> damaged chip?
[00:43:49] <blocky> :|
[00:44:03] <blocky> i waited almost a month, never ordering from sparkfun again
[00:44:07] <blocky> and i only got one lol
[00:44:13] <evil_dan2wik> what chip is it?
[00:44:15] <Casper> oh mega128?
[00:44:20] <evil_dan2wik> oh
[00:44:21] <Casper> there is a catch on that one
[00:44:32] <evil_dan2wik> Just request some samples from atmel
[00:44:37] <Casper> you need to use rx0 and tx0 instead of mosi and miso
[00:44:41] <blocky> attiny2313-20
[00:44:54] <Casper> ah
[00:45:38] <Casper> is your avr powered?
[00:45:51] <evil_dan2wik> lol
[00:46:50] <blocky> ive tried it with breadboard power and programmer power
[00:46:59] <soul-d> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=SxHVhxbtrhY
[00:47:25] <Casper> soul-d: you're a day late :D
[00:47:29] <soul-d> :(
[00:47:32] <soul-d> just woke up
[00:47:33] <blocky> i put a 2.7k resistor between reset and vcc
[00:47:37] <blocky> is that right?
[00:47:42] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, yes
[00:48:05] <Casper> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeMKmQ2gStg ← :D
[00:48:11] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, did you put a stablisation capacitor between gnd and vcc?
[00:48:26] <Casper> blocky: you need anything between like 1-10k
[00:48:39] <blocky> i have them on my power supply on my breadboard, but not on the chip itself, so not on programmer power
[00:49:43] <evil_dan2wik> the programmer's gnd should connect to the gnd of the breadboard. Then leave the programmer's vcc disconnected
[00:49:48] <blocky> breadboard power is just a 9v wall wart into a 7805 with some caps
[00:50:08] <blocky> is it better to use breadboard power?
[00:50:29] <evil_dan2wik> depends what the voltage is
[00:50:43] <blocky> 5 plus or minus
[00:50:55] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, use breadboard power
[00:50:57] <blocky> i don't have a scope here
[00:51:12] <blocky> programmer ground to board ground, programmer vcc disconnected
[00:51:31] <evil_dan2wik> yes
[00:52:00] <blocky> negative
[00:52:29] <blocky> multimeter says 5.08V
[00:52:41] <evil_dan2wik> I have a chip here that wont work without a 2200uf stablisation capacitor.
[00:53:16] <blocky> although reset is only at 4V
[00:53:24] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, thats fine
[00:53:35] <evil_dan2wik> As long as it doesnt go low enough to reset the chip
[00:53:48] <evil_dan2wik> when its not meant to*
[00:54:14] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, are you able to take pics?
[00:54:24] <blocky> lol yeah but its an ugly ugly setup
[00:54:24] <RifRaf> need some direction please, am able to recieve one letter at a time from uart and return it or display on lcd,, but no idea how to turn the letters into a word or phase. using webbotlibs, this is current code http://pastebin.com/njXngU3C
[00:54:37] <blocky> ill try, hold on
[00:55:16] <RifRaf> InstreamData only seems to be 1 letter, cannot code so need some kind of example to look at
[01:03:35] <blocky> evil_dan2wik im not sure if these photos will even help
[01:03:46] <evil_dan2wik> they might
[01:04:05] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, whats the error returned when you program it btw?
[01:05:08] <blocky> initialization failed, rc=-1
[01:06:37] <blocky> http://imgur.com/a/cs0SW
[01:07:40] <RifRaf> is the programmer header the right way around? i get that when the connections are wrong
[01:07:52] <evil_dan2wik> lol
[01:08:25] <blocky> if its right and i reverse it, will i fry anything?
[01:09:01] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, whats the micro controller your programming now?
[01:09:28] <blocky> attiny2313-20
[01:11:54] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, is the pull-up resistor connected to the 5v+ line and the reset pin on the chip?
[01:12:05] <blocky> yeah
[01:12:21] <blocky> its a 1/2 W resistor
[01:13:35] <blocky> 2.7l
[01:13:37] <blocky> 2.7k
[01:14:05] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, re-check your wiring
[01:14:58] <evil_dan2wik> also, your chip is set to use the internal clock right?
[01:15:45] <blocky> i just got it
[01:15:56] <blocky> haven't set anything
[01:16:17] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, your looking at http://www.atmel.com/Images/doc2543S.pdf arent you?
[01:17:15] <blocky> http://www.atmel.com/Images/doc2543.pdf
[01:17:41] <blocky> same pinout
[01:18:32] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, im just looking and the chip on the breadboard isnt wired correctly
[01:18:59] <blocky> hmm?
[01:19:00] <evil_dan2wik> the reset pin is grounded and has no pullup resistor connected
[01:19:13] <evil_dan2wik> it doesnt even have the pin from the programmer
[01:19:40] <blocky> i was working off this http://www.timteatro.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/ISP_6pin_pinout1.png
[01:20:08] <evil_dan2wik> ...
[01:20:11] <blocky> isn't reset pin where ive got the resistor?
[01:20:15] <evil_dan2wik> no
[01:20:24] <blocky> lol
[01:20:29] <blocky> can you show me where ive gone wrong
[01:20:30] <evil_dan2wik> The resistor is meant to connect to the reset pin of the chip
[01:20:34] <blocky> oh
[01:20:39] <blocky> lol
[01:20:45] <evil_dan2wik> And the reset from the header is wired to the chip's reset
[01:20:55] <blocky> and both of them to the pullup?
[01:22:02] <evil_dan2wik> connect the header's reset to the chip's reset. Then connect the chip's reset to the pull-up
[01:23:56] <evil_dan2wik> also, miso and mosi are connected to the wrong pins on the chip. mosi looks like its currently pin 16 instead of 17. And miso should be connected to 18
[01:25:34] <blocky> no those ones are right
[01:25:38] <inflex> heh
[01:25:41] <blocky> but the reset pin was the problem
[01:25:47] <blocky> thanks so much, i never would have spotted it
[01:25:48] <evil_dan2wik> ok
[01:26:08] <evil_dan2wik> the miso and mosi must just be how you took the picture
[01:26:20] <blocky> yeah, and how i wired it
[01:26:21] <blocky> lol
[01:26:33] <blocky> i need male-male header
[01:26:57] <blocky> okay, now time to blink some god damn LEDs
[01:28:55] <blocky> um, what does int main look like
[01:29:22] <inflex> O_o
[01:29:55] <inflex> int main( void ) { while (1) { PINB = 0xFF; delay_ms(500); }
[01:30:06] <inflex> }
[01:30:29] <inflex> oops, forgot a DDR in there
[01:30:54] <inflex> DDRB = 0xFF;
[01:31:26] <blocky> would I have to specify PB1 or can i write to PINB all at once
[01:31:30] <Roklobsta> still in Qld?
[01:32:16] <Roklobsta> you must be the most northern AVR hacker in the southern hemisphere.
[01:34:49] <blocky> is there anything i shouldn't do that can brick the micro?
[01:35:49] <soul-d> hammer . boiling acid come to mind
[01:36:11] <blocky> lol i can't reassign vcc pin to pullup resistor or anything
[01:36:45] <evil_dan2wik> blocky, micro controllers just love high voltage. I do not suggest it though
[01:36:50] <soul-d> ofcourse vcc is vcc check data sheet for pin's that are multiplexed
[01:37:22] <blocky> is there any sort of library or should I just define my own macros for PINB and what not
[01:38:24] <blocky> ah found the .h files
[02:01:37] <evil_dan2wik> http://gushh.net/tmp/arduinoshield.png
[02:02:18] <GuShH> evil_dan2wik: that's so evil
[02:05:44] <evil_dan2wik> I should make that but add a small transformer and sell it for $1 on ebay :P
[02:06:30] <evil_dan2wik> "The perfect thing to power your arduino projects"
[02:07:45] <evil_dan2wik> "(and a little bit more)"
[02:10:16] <theBear> hehehe i like it
[02:19:41] <blocky> so I'm getting a compile warning "device type not defined" even though im passing -mmcu=avr25 to avr-gcc
[02:21:18] <theBear> err, avr25 ?
[02:21:49] <theBear> where you get that from ?
[02:24:47] <blocky> http://www.nongnu.org/avrdude/user-manual/avrdude_4.html
[02:25:34] <RifRaf> cannot see avr25 on that page
[02:25:56] <theBear> me too, and didn't you say you had a tiny2313 ?
[02:26:18] <theBear> and that is avrdude, not avr-gcc
[02:26:41] <blocky> oh
[02:27:11] <theBear> tho the chip/family numbers do look right from memory, just that avr25 isn't one of them
[02:27:51] <blocky> i have no idea where i got that from..
[02:27:55] <theBear> heh
[02:29:10] <blocky> http://www.nongnu.org/avr-libc/user-manual/using_tools.html
[02:30:00] <blocky> set it to attiny2313 fixed that error
[02:30:07] <blocky> been a while since ive been programming lol
[02:46:59] <blocky> so, after i compile it, can i flash the chip with a.out?
[02:48:51] <theBear> been a while, but you wanna convert that to a err, intel format flash file methinks
[02:49:09] <theBear> i used to just have a generic makefile that handled all that build stuff, much easier
[02:50:06] <RifRaf> the mfile util in winavr does the job pretty well too to make a makefile
[02:50:32] <blocky> yeah i found that but not sure how to execute tcl script
[02:50:41] <blocky> i found a generic makefile that seems to work, tho my LED is not blinking
[02:50:45] <blocky> gonna call it a night
[02:50:48] <blocky> thanks for all the hlp
[02:50:51] <blocky> help even
[05:16:51] <Malinuss> so a register like the ICR1 has a low and high part. So actually there are two registers. I am just wondering how the macros avr made works, so the integer get splitted into the two registers. How does the _SFR_MEM16(0x86)/_SFR_MEM8(0x86) thing actually work?
[05:18:33] <specing> gcc -E and you'll see
[05:19:37] <Malinuss> I'm in atmel studio. I can only into automagic
[05:20:09] <OndraSter_> you can enable it in the project settings
[05:20:11] <specing> Malinuss: can't help you then
[05:20:14] <OndraSter_> "Preprocess only (-E)"
[05:20:24] <OndraSter_> no wait
[05:20:26] <OndraSter_> that won't do it
[05:20:30] <OndraSter_> but you can do objdump
[05:20:43] <OndraSter_> into the .lss
[05:20:47] <OndraSter_> that is autogenerated by atmel studio
[05:21:20] <Malinuss> hmm still not sure how that would explain it to me. but how would I do that?
[05:21:27] <OndraSter_> just open the .lss
[05:21:31] <OndraSter_> and find the line where you are reading it
[05:21:35] <OndraSter_> and it shows C and asm below it
[05:21:41] <specing> (*(volatile uint8_t *)((PORT) + 0x20))
[05:21:41] <OndraSter_> for each C line
[05:21:44] <specing> (*(volatile uint16_t *)((PORT) + 0x20))
[05:23:42] <Malinuss> hmm I'm not eanough into C to understand it, thanks though
[05:29:07] <jacekowski> that's very basic C
[05:30:33] <specing> you mean C is very basic in itself? :D
[05:40:18] <evil_dan2wik> http://static.neatorama.com/images/2013-01/i-can-typing.gif
[05:41:24] <amee2woof> that one would be hilarious if it wasn't true
[05:42:01] <evil_dan2wik> lol
[05:43:29] <amee2woof> we need to RMA the internet, it is ruining way too many punchlines lately
[05:45:11] <evil_dan2wik> we need to remove access for the idiots and trolls on the internet
[05:46:18] <jacekowski> there would be no one left
[05:47:06] <evil_dan2wik> you just called everyone an idiot/troll
[05:50:58] <jacekowski> it looks like i did
[05:53:41] <GuShH_> speaking of idiots, what was Yamaha thinking when they came up with the FZ-16?
[05:53:52] * GuShH_ slaps amee2woof
[05:54:11] * amee2woof barks at GuShH_
[05:59:07] * GuShH_ throws a copy of Django at amee2woof
[05:59:43] * amee2woof sells it on ebay and orders pizza :D
[06:00:09] <GuShH_> :/
[06:00:20] <specing> dont you get all furry in here!
[06:00:28] <GuShH_> wait isn't that like selling slaves?
[06:01:10] <GuShH_> 1 Django, barely shot at. $99,99
[06:01:42] <GuShH_> (wears cool glasses from the future, sold as-is)
[06:02:31] <amee2woof> lol
[06:02:55] <GuShH_> specing: Don't worry, no furballs on my watch.
[06:03:48] <amee2woof> http://www.furaffinity.net/view/6689334/ doggy haz pizza! :D
[06:04:54] <GuShH_> oh no #wikifur is on freenode
[06:05:36] <GuShH_> amee2woof: that's a dog?
[06:06:13] <amee2woof> looks like one
[06:06:19] <amee2woof> and the metadata says canid
[06:06:58] <amee2woof> lemme see if i can find any character info
[06:08:44] <amee2woof> yup, character is a shiba inu
[06:08:57] <amee2woof> says so on his profile
[06:09:20] <amee2woof> damn, now i'm hungry >_<
[06:11:21] <GuShH_> http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l0xe3uHsP41qzmowao1_500.jpg
[06:12:23] <OndraSter_> GuShH_, omg
[06:12:24] <amee2woof> there is a funny video of Kage and a husky picking up pizza
[06:12:37] <GuShH_> OndraSter_: what are they?
[06:12:43] <OndraSter_> I have no idea
[06:12:44] <amee2woof> thats what GuShH_ does in his spare time
[06:12:58] <GuShH_> that's how most people see furries though
[06:13:06] <OndraSter_> and what do they do?
[06:13:08] <amee2woof> yes :P
[06:13:14] <amee2woof> CSI rejects
[06:13:27] <GuShH_> amee2woof: no, I would never let linux anywhere near my arse.
[06:13:29] <amee2woof> thats about the worst costumes i've seen evr lol
[06:13:42] <GuShH_> (notice the penguin)
[06:14:11] <OndraSter_> GuShH_, http://d24w6bsrhbeh9d.cloudfront.net/photo/5205275_700b.jpg
[06:14:12] <amee2woof> look at some random convention photos... even the cheap costumes are better made than these
[06:14:21] <creep> [202326] <OndraSter__> it is not a fire alarm
[06:14:22] <creep> [202330] <OndraSter__> it is a temperature alarm
[06:14:32] <OndraSter_> creep, THAT WAS FEW DAYS AGO!
[06:14:34] <OndraSter_> lol
[06:14:39] <creep> place it on the ceiling, and there you have fire heat alarm
[06:14:52] <OndraSter_> it does not detect smok
[06:14:52] <OndraSter_> e
[06:14:53] <jacekowski> what if sun has gone supernova
[06:14:54] <OndraSter_> but temperature.
[06:15:02] <jacekowski> it will get pretty warm as well
[06:15:10] <GuShH_> OndraSter_: I'd yiff that
[06:15:15] <OndraSter_> GuShH_, I would those two too
[06:15:21] <amee2woof> yup :3
[06:15:26] <OndraSter_> jacekowski, or what about Australia!
[06:15:53] <amee2woof> anyway, imma run off get some food
[06:16:39] <creep> yeah next thing would be to add a smoke detector
[06:17:00] <creep> a white led and a light dependent resistor
[06:17:53] <OndraSter_> or you know
[06:17:55] <OndraSter_> just buy off the shelf fire alarm
[06:17:59] <OndraSter_> $10 maybe?
[06:18:01] <OndraSter_> $20?
[06:18:07] <OndraSter_> it will be even certified
[06:18:11] <GuShH_> 5
[06:18:22] <creep> hahaha jacekowski actually, diode reverse current senses radioactivity too, so its a bonus, if the smoke alarm fires prey you see fire somewhere
[06:19:23] <evil_dan2wik> lol
[06:19:28] <creep> OndraSter_<< i think i can certify a temperature sensor and a smoke detector
[06:19:30] <GuShH_> creep: only pin diodes
[06:19:31] <Malinuss> jacekowski, hahaha are you the same guy that were all like "I knew this in 3rd grade" when I asked some 3d transformation questions?
[06:19:58] <GuShH_> I doubt you could use a pn diode for that
[06:19:58] <creep> GuShH_<< no, Silicium diodes sense it too
[06:20:05] <GuShH_> pin is silicon also
[06:20:25] <GuShH_> the I is just an extra layer in between the P and N regions
[06:20:48] <creep> ok, not only those sense radiation
[06:21:03] <GuShH_> it's not "sensing" it
[06:21:05] <creep> radiation can be measured using geiger tubes btw.
[06:21:23] <creep> or more accurately using an ion chamber
[06:21:35] <GuShH_> just about everything reacts to one type of radiation or the other.
[06:21:55] <GuShH_> use squirrels in a box as a radiation detector if you want to.
[06:23:23] <evil_dan2wik> use plutonium as a radiation detector, i think you will find it is very accurate
[06:23:24] <creep> GuShH_<< just go forward and tell if you "sense" radiation
[06:23:58] <OndraSter_> .. sniff sniff.... hmm, about 0.5 sn
[06:24:07] <creep> ;)
[06:24:27] <GuShH_> I can't compete with the squirrels.
[06:25:42] <creep> next will be turtles, if they start to change shape and turn into ninjas then you have radioactivity...
[06:26:15] <GuShH_> when they begin to eat my pizza and talk like druggies I'll make sure to shoot their heads off
[06:39:04] * amee2woof returns
[06:43:13] <amee2woof> GuShH_: you know, furry porn exists and eveyone knows it. its like last decade's news and even then it was old. so if you HAVE to go there, at least find something that is well made. not the last stereotypical crap that you found on TV
[06:43:39] <amee2woof> but then, it is porn. some people like it, some don't. whatever makes your dick hard. noone said you have to look at it
[06:44:22] <specing> s/hard/caugh furr//
[06:45:18] <GuShH_> did it take you so long to come up with a response on the matter?
[06:46:09] <amee2woof> GuShH_: no, it took me that long to eat my sandwhiches, drink my cola and come back to the lab room where the terminal is that i'm IRCing from
[06:46:16] <amee2woof> i wasn't exactly in a hurry.
[06:46:31] <amee2woof> i said i was going to get some lunch when i left
[06:48:37] <GuShH_> pfft
[06:49:39] <amee2woof> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1Amh2MfJ4U at least find something that looks good :P
[10:14:37] <Access_Control> Hi to all. I write an AVR Project using AVRStudio 4 partly in C (Winavr gcc) and partly in Assembly (gnu assembler which is part of winavr gcc). The building is successful but debugging (simulation) is not satisfactory: I can step through the C code but not through the parts written in Assembly. How can I do it? Thank you in advance.
[10:16:43] <OndraSter_> that is a good question
[10:16:49] <OndraSter_> I have never worked that out either
[12:23:53] <RoyOnWheels> ping CapnKernel
[12:53:01] <RikusW> 2W lead are BRIGHT :)
[12:53:06] <RikusW> *LEDs
[12:53:34] <RikusW> about 3v3 at 670mA
[12:57:33] <OndraSter_> jadew, http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/528828_478586492201417_157617303_n.jpg
[13:17:57] <Jaywalker> Afternoon gents, especially abcminiuser :P
[13:18:20] <specing> All hail abcminiuser!
[13:18:42] <inkjetunito> o/
[13:19:30] <Jaywalker> I'm trying to make an easy way to port libusb projects to Host-mode AVR devices with LUFA. Is there anything that does this already? or maybe a different (hopefully as well developed as LUFA) avr usb library that's cross architecture?
[13:20:26] <Jaywalker> it's for a framework i'm developing, not a one-off kind of thing, so "just port it" is less desirable
[13:36:21] <abcminiuser> Heyo all
[13:36:27] * abcminiuser is watching the new Dredd movie
[13:36:36] <abcminiuser> Jesus tapdancing christ
[13:36:42] <Jaywalker> Hey abcminiuser. It's not that great story-wise imo
[13:36:50] <Jaywalker> lots of guns and future shit though
[13:37:05] <abcminiuser> Wait, there's a plot?
[13:37:22] <abcminiuser> ^^ Not that I know of, sadly - USB stacks are usually vendor specific
[13:37:23] <Steffanx> [spoileralert!]
[13:37:29] <abcminiuser> It
[13:37:36] <abcminiuser> It's goddam awesome so far tho
[13:39:43] <Jaywalker> abcminiuser: that's a shame. i'm working on an exploitation framework for usb devices. My goal is for exploits (like Usb_control_msg(0x21, 2)/(0xA1, 1) and limera1n) to be easily used on avr with one code base
[13:40:28] <abcminiuser> Aww crap, tell me you didn't email me about that last week
[13:40:38] <Jaywalker> I did. lol
[13:40:51] <abcminiuser> Goddamit, my email backlog is huge, sorry
[13:40:58] <Jaywalker> lol, no worries
[13:41:02] <Jaywalker> well i think it was on twitter
[13:41:07] <Jaywalker> i don't know if I emailed too or not
[13:41:11] <Jaywalker> i probably did though haha
[13:41:14] <abcminiuser> I'm not ignoring you for a reason, I've been completely buggered this last week, urgent work at work :P
[13:41:24] <abcminiuser> Yeah, found it
[13:41:47] <Jaywalker> Oh i totally understand. I've not been sitting on the edge of my seat or anything... I've been booked for the last 4 weeks on a security audit... :S
[13:42:00] <Jaywalker> custom code and protocol review heh
[13:42:03] <abcminiuser> Long story short, no I'm not aware of any premade frameworks for it. but you can certainly use LUFA to do some crazy things
[13:42:16] <abcminiuser> Someone exploited Gnome with it via a bad string descriptor
[13:42:34] <Jaywalker> oh really? Link?? I'd love to implement that into my framework too
[13:43:39] <RikusW> viruses via usb hw/fw ? :-D whats next ? ;)
[13:43:43] <abcminiuser> http://www.outflux.net/blog/archives/2012/05/16/usb-avr-fun/
[13:43:52] <abcminiuser> I think it's patched now
[13:43:58] <Jaywalker> My goal is for this framework to be like metasploit but for usb devices. It's ready to go live if all I care about is supporting host->device exploits, but I want device (operating as host)->device and device->host (PSGroove, bad string descriptors, etc) exploits too
[13:44:32] <Jaywalker> patched or not, it's good to have more examples in my framework :P. I'm going to be working with Travis Goodspeed and his facedancer project too to try and link the projectsish
[13:44:33] <abcminiuser> I've bluescreened Windows' storage drivers many times before, so there's probably some SCSI holes you could exploit
[13:45:07] <Jaywalker> Nice! I'll have to look into those
[13:45:47] <Jaywalker> I'm currently implementing the CVE-2012-1667 for old versions of OS X
[13:46:39] <Jaywalker> ahem, CVE-2012-3723
[13:48:45] <Jaywalker> Well I was hoping for better news, but I guess this means I'll just have to get my ass in gear and write this. I'll probably end up using a preprocessor thing to call the right usb lib function or something. I'd hate for devs to have to write their code twice haha
[13:49:48] <Tom_itx> abcminiuser do any of the avr32 chips work under flip?
[13:52:20] <abcminiuser> Tom_itx, all of them, but only via command line
[13:52:27] <Tom_itx> oh
[13:52:32] <Tom_itx> why is that?
[13:52:42] <abcminiuser> Jaywalker, sorry I don't have better news :P
[13:52:56] <abcminiuser> Tom_itx, I guess because they couldn't work out how to fit them into the existing UI
[13:53:04] <abcminiuser> Since they have much more advanced capabilities
[13:53:12] <abcminiuser> For programming user pages and stuff
[13:53:22] <Tom_itx> someone was asking about it here the other day
[13:53:38] <Tom_itx> i wasn't aware the cmd line was any different that the gui
[13:58:23] * RikusW found out 3a3 only works on commandline...
[14:00:52] <Jaywalker> abcminiuser: Oh no worries. LUFA is a great library and I can still make this work.. it'll just require me writing base code for host, hub, and device and then making a wrapper around the usb calls in the actual exploit() function.
[14:04:01] <abcminiuser> You poor bastard :(
[14:04:18] <abcminiuser> RikusW, indeed, they should put it lound and clear in the release notes
[14:04:30] <abcminiuser> Actually even better would be to add DFU to the Studio backend
[14:05:10] <RikusW> yep
[14:05:24] <RikusW> I wondered why there is no DFU in the programmer dialog
[14:05:49] <RikusW> I do have a dragon to program it with too :)
[14:06:03] <RikusW> Actually I haven't even used it yet
[14:06:15] <RikusW> apart from loading your better version of its fw
[14:06:22] <RikusW> with flip
[14:07:13] <Jaywalker> In case anyone was interested, here's an old screenshot of the project i'm working on. this, of course, is the desktop side of it exploiting an iPhone https://dl.dropbox.com/u/8454625/obelisk.png
[14:09:15] <wakko> Jaywalker: did you see the talk about "writing a thumb drive from scratch" on 29C3 ?
[14:10:39] <wakko> it's something like "drivers should not trust usb devices that much" :)
[14:10:47] <Jaywalker> yeah, I've been researching various USB exploitation techniques for several months now. Travis is one of the go-to guys in this area :P
[14:11:02] <wakko> it was a super talk indeed
[14:11:16] <Jaywalker> His facedancer project is even more awesome. he's finding bugs in drivers left over from the 90's and shit
[14:11:25] <wakko> but i also like the one about tamagochi reversing :)
[14:11:35] <Jaywalker> like lsusb had a double free that he found before he even finished the facedancer "hello world" lol
[14:11:42] <wakko> haha
[14:12:07] <Jaywalker> Yeah.. And a lot of these drivers have like 80 bytes for a string descriptor haha
[14:12:26] <wakko> it's obvious some years ago developers were not thinking too much, what will happend if the device does not...
[14:12:45] <Jaywalker> manufactures said "we'll never call our product `perl -e 'print "A"x400'`" so 80 should be fine
[14:13:06] <wakko> ahah
[14:13:55] <Jaywalker> That's why I'm building this framework, largely. I want these bugs to be found and fixed. Right now, imo, USB and proximity are a recipe for everything from data loss to corporate espionage
[14:14:36] <Jaywalker> so i figure, make it easy for researchers to find them, make it easy for devs to write them, and make it easy for people to exploit them... that'll force manufactures to fix them :D
[14:15:11] <wakko> that's what people call full disclosure :)
[14:16:21] <Jaywalker> Haha, well I'm not releasing any 0-day's with it myself (I've got a couple that are in queue for patching by Apple), but yeah... I imagine a lot of 0-day's will be dropped with obelisk
[14:16:44] <Jaywalker> That's my hope anyway
[14:17:33] <Jaywalker> abcminiuser: Would it be smarter, do you think, to just write class drivers into LUFA for libirecovery and libadb?
[14:21:44] <wakko> Jaywalker: do you have a github or something ?
[14:24:39] <abcminiuser> Jaywalker, might be a good idea - easier to interface with on the user side
[14:24:47] <abcminiuser> (the person writing the exploits)
[14:25:16] * abcminiuser just finished Dredd
[14:25:20] <abcminiuser> Again, jesus christ
[14:49:46] <Jaywalker> I guess my connection timed out.. Did i miss anything since my last message?
[14:51:08] <abetusk_w> is anyone in China?
[14:51:52] <Jaywalker> Generally speaking or anyone in here? :P
[14:51:55] <OndraSter_> jadew, http://sphotos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/487134_478618785531521_992785035_n.jpg
[14:52:07] <OndraSter_> abetusk_w, I think that few milions of people are there :)
[14:53:10] <abetusk_w> I'm lusting after the TM-220A (or STM32s?) that have been making the rounds on the internets. Does anyone have access to those for cheap?.
[14:55:38] <RikusW> Jaywalker: zlog
[14:55:44] <RikusW> zlog
[14:56:14] <RikusW> abetusk_w: hackvana is
[14:56:23] <abetusk_w> is he around?
[14:56:24] <RikusW> or was and will be again
[14:56:37] <RikusW> WormFood: also is afaik
[14:56:47] <RikusW> abetusk_w: probably asleep
[14:57:14] <abetusk_w> ah, right, about 12 hours out of phase from where I am. I'll try back later
[14:57:22] <RikusW> abetusk_w: hackvana is more into the pcb business
[14:57:31] <RikusW> for now anyways
[14:57:32] <abetusk_w> this is closely related
[14:57:38] <RikusW> but you can ask him
[14:58:03] <RikusW> abetusk_w: he might be in Australia
[14:58:23] <RikusW> but same general timezone
[15:03:19] <Jaywalker> wakko: my github is github.com/Jaywalker
[15:03:45] <Jaywalker> obelisk will be open source'd on there relatively soon
[15:04:01] <Jaywalker> thanks RikusW
[15:12:03] <Guest22892> hi to synchronize shared data across different threads/interrupts the interrupts are usually disabled?
[15:12:46] <specing> yeah
[15:13:18] <Guest22892> is there no better way?
[15:13:28] <Guest22892> how can you ensure real time performance?
[15:26:35] <RikusW> Guest22892: how much data ?
[15:27:03] <Guest22892> a few bytes
[15:28:04] <jacekowski> Guest22892: you want to copy data from one place to the other
[15:28:06] <jacekowski> in atomic manner?
[15:28:07] <RikusW> if its hard realtime polling might be better than interrupts...
[15:28:48] <RikusW> Guest22892: if the bytes are independent just write it
[15:29:16] <RikusW> if you're using multibyte variables, you'll need syncing
[15:37:45] <Guest22892> jacekowski, atomic?
[15:45:34] <RikusW> Guest22892: in one uninterupted operation
[15:46:04] <Guest22892> but the atomic operation should be small...right?
[15:46:58] <creep> linear technology is a dissapoint ;< :)
[15:47:10] <creep> thy have soo lame ics
[15:48:49] <RikusW> for your purposes yes
[15:49:03] <RikusW> TiO2 got Er = 100 :)
[15:49:27] <RikusW> BaTiO3 got Er = 600 :-D
[15:49:49] <RikusW> pure water 76
[15:50:02] <creep> check this out http://cds.linear.com/docs/en/datasheet/1731f.pdf one cell lithium charger...
[15:50:05] <RikusW> and FR4 only 4.6
[15:50:17] * RikusW is toying around with AppCAD
[15:51:43] <GuShH_> creep: If you don't like them, don't buy them.
[15:54:45] <Guest43271> re
[15:55:06] <Guest43271> RikusW ?
[16:06:58] <jadew> OndraSter_, nice link :P
[16:11:41] <creep> LTC2950CTS8-1 Push Button On/Off Control --- $5 :)
[16:30:02] <Malinuss> sensorless BLDC control - anyone ever tried that?
[16:30:09] <Malinuss> or am I on deep water here
[16:33:08] <creep> its deep, but certainly possible
[16:33:37] <creep> a 20MHz atmel is good for it in asm upto >30k rpm
[16:36:27] <creep> they just used to blind start the motor then commutate
[16:36:45] <creep> and pwm the output
[17:14:01] <Malinuss> creep, you ever tried it? What about a atmega32 running 16MHz?
[17:15:07] <creep> well i saw some with atmega8
[17:15:17] <creep> and the pwm type
[17:16:55] <Malinuss> but never tried it yourself? just saw it on the internets? It's pretty hard to find anyone doing it DIY, but there are some AVR-made articles about it...
[17:17:09] <dirty_d> Malinuss, what is it?
[17:17:42] <creep> Malinuss<< saw it on rcgroups
[17:18:02] <creep> assuming you want it radio controlled
[17:18:43] <Malinuss> dirty_d, what is what? A sensorless BLDC control? Just a way to controling a brushless motor without any sensors (no hall effect sensors). So directly from your uc - brushless motor
[17:19:01] <dirty_d> Malinuss, i didnt know what you were talking about, just joined
[17:19:10] <Malinuss> ah okay, well now you do :)
[17:19:11] <dirty_d> i made a bruishless motor controller with an avr
[17:19:19] <dirty_d> but it was sensored
[17:19:21] <Malinuss> dirty_d, with no hall sensors?
[17:19:22] <Malinuss> oh
[17:19:41] <dirty_d> yea i added hall sensors to a big RC motor
[17:19:56] <Malinuss> dirty_d, the motors I have are very small (trying to make a mini-quad I think)... so it's a no-go I'm afraid
[17:20:00] <dirty_d> i think sensorless control is more trouble than its worth
[17:20:06] <Malinuss> propably
[17:20:12] <Malinuss> but it's the only way for me
[17:20:17] <dirty_d> just use ESCs
[17:20:34] <Malinuss> buying 4 ESCs is like 20+$
[17:20:55] <dirty_d> i got 4 80A ones for my quad for $16 each
[17:21:05] <dirty_d> so mini ones should be really cheap
[17:21:18] <dirty_d> i doubt you can make them yourself any cheaper
[17:21:39] <creep> you can't :)
[17:21:41] <Malinuss> well doing it all from your uc would be cheaper :D
[17:22:10] <dirty_d> you still need all the power components and stuff
[17:22:38] <dirty_d> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__18002__HobbyKing_Red_Brick_10A_ESC.html
[17:22:40] <dirty_d> $6
[17:23:21] <dirty_d> i think those use atmega8s
[17:23:27] <dirty_d> you can reflash them with your own firmware
[17:24:00] <dirty_d> they usually have an IIR filter on the servo input which isnt good in a PID loop
[17:25:01] <dirty_d> heh, if you stay on the page a few minues the price lowers to $5.74 lol
[17:37:59] <Tom_itx> i bet it would be easy on an xmega
[17:38:45] <dirty_d> a lot easier
[17:38:55] <Tom_itx> http://www.gaw.ru/pdf/Atmel/app/avr/AVR444.pdf
[17:40:06] <creep> Tom_itx<< why ?
[17:40:10] <Tom_itx> http://www.mikrokopter.com/ucwiki/en/BrushlessCtrl
[17:40:15] <Tom_itx> why what?
[17:40:22] <creep> [002112] <Tom_itx> i bet it would be easy on an xmega
[17:40:35] <Tom_itx> more complex timers and events
[17:40:52] <Tom_itx> faster clock speeds
[17:40:54] <yunta> Malinuss: you may also consider building trivial optical encoder. did that myself, very easy.
[17:41:00] <creep> 20MHz is not enough ?
[17:41:17] <creep> ASM ?
[17:41:51] <dirty_d> creep, the xmega peripherals are better
[17:42:34] <creep> ok, i do not think it is much better than an atmega8 if you can code it
[17:42:51] <Tom_itx> mkay
[17:43:48] <creep> sensorless control is the same as hall control with bemf sensing
[17:44:23] <dirty_d> you dont have much time to work with on fast motors
[17:44:59] <creep> an atmega8 does 20MIPS at 20MHz
[17:45:25] <creep> for a few k rpm C might be enough, otherwise go asm
[17:49:50] <creep> i feel like telling fairy tales
[17:50:16] <dirty_d> lol
[17:50:56] <dirty_d> i think youd have about 250uS between commutation steps on a 14 pole 6000rpm motopr
[17:52:47] <creep> that's only 5000 instructions
[17:53:08] <dirty_d> am i right though?
[17:53:24] <dirty_d> 6 commutation steps per electrical rotation
[17:53:41] <dirty_d> one electrical rotation per pole pair per mechanical revolution
[17:54:24] <creep> yep thats 600hz for 3 phase single pole pair.
[17:55:07] <dirty_d> so (6000/60) * 6 * (14/2) steps per second
[17:55:14] <dirty_d> 4200
[17:55:45] <dirty_d> 238uS
[17:56:32] <dirty_d> you could use 3 analog comparators for the zero crossings right?
[17:56:37] <creep> yes
[17:56:47] <creep> and the timers for timing
[17:57:03] <dirty_d> im thingking about making a brushless controller with an stm32
[17:57:08] <dirty_d> but sensored
[17:57:17] <dirty_d> with per cycle current limiting
[17:58:29] <creep> i'm thinking about making a stargate for transporting stuff fast
[17:58:35] <Malinuss> I guess I would have to buy 4 ESC then :/
[17:58:58] <dirty_d> Malinuss, yea all the hard work is done for you, just reporgram it
[17:59:17] <Malinuss> dirty_d, why would I even bother with reporgramming it?
[17:59:22] <dirty_d> tehre are already existing quad frimwares out there, maybe open source
[17:59:28] <yunta> optical encoder .... :D
[17:59:31] <creep> ( then reverse trace the board and try to us it ) :)
[17:59:38] <dirty_d> Malinuss, because they have an IIR filter on the input
[17:59:46] <dirty_d> yunta, i was gonna do that
[17:59:59] <dirty_d> i saw a thread on it, seems to work real well
[18:00:06] <Malinuss> well all I want is to be abel to control 4 motors from my uc, didn't think it would be that hard, lol
[18:00:07] <yunta> worked nice for me
[18:00:09] <dirty_d> using osram optical switches i think
[18:00:41] <yunta> made of paper and 2 pairs of simple led/optoresistor pairs
[18:00:42] <creep> fibernet ?
[18:00:46] <dirty_d> Malinuss, thats too much work
[18:00:49] <dirty_d> for one uC
[18:00:51] <creep> optical switch?
[18:01:04] <dirty_d> creep, an IR transmitter/reciever
[18:01:18] <Malinuss> dirty_d, well not if it only had to control the speed.
[18:01:24] <dirty_d> Malinuss, right
[18:01:35] <Malinuss> dirty_d, therfor - ESC
[18:01:46] <dirty_d> one to control the speed of 4 motors, but 4 uCs to actually make the motors worlk
[18:01:59] <yunta> http://www.partco.biz/verkkokauppa/product_info.php?cPath=2075_11_1686_2018&products_id=6882
[18:02:04] <creep> simple escs does not control speed, they control pwm duty cycle
[18:02:34] <Malinuss> creep, okay well, pwm duty cycle would be the same as speed, right?
[18:02:39] <creep> no
[18:02:47] <creep> it controls power
[18:03:28] <creep> and rpm, but it varies slightly with load like +-30%
[18:03:33] <dirty_d> it will be the same as speed pretty much when its spinning a propeller
[18:03:40] <Malinuss> so a normal ESC won't simply work like a servo, where I would give it a signal of x width at y Hz. and longer signal = more rpm
[18:03:52] <dirty_d> it does work like a servo
[18:03:58] <dirty_d> same signal
[18:04:12] <creep> no, a normal esc uses the lame 1-2ms control signap
[18:04:22] <dirty_d> that is what a servo uses
[18:04:25] <Malinuss> well that's what I meant creep. well of course under load it won't be abel to control speed as such, but power.
[18:04:27] <creep> at rate 30-150hz
[18:04:36] <dirty_d> up to 400Hz actually
[18:04:47] <Malinuss> so it works like a servo or no? I'm confused
[18:04:49] <dirty_d> thats what i used on my quad
[18:05:00] <dirty_d> Malinuss, yes you give it the exact same signal as a servo
[18:05:34] <creep> Malinuss<< it may, but if it has reverse, or break, or wat, then 1.5ms is center
[18:05:36] <Malinuss> dirty_d, good. but you were saying something about some IIR filters. so most ESC's have some kind of filter?
[18:05:53] <dirty_d> 1ms is 0% power 2ms is 100%
[18:06:02] <Malinuss> creep, yeah but I meant like - in theory it works on the same principles
[18:06:12] <Malinuss> like, not SPI or I2C...
[18:06:17] <dirty_d> Malinuss, yes it has a digital IIR filter usually
[18:06:22] <creep> no, those are advanced stuff
[18:06:25] <dirty_d> so fast changes in the throttle are filtered out
[18:06:52] <dirty_d> if you send it pulses at 400Hz though the filter has less of an effect
[18:07:14] <Malinuss> haha I think the whole signal thing is more irritating then the SPI or I2C... those protocols are much more streight forward
[18:07:28] <creep> yes
[18:07:32] <creep> or just use pwm
[18:07:50] <Malinuss> well I do, and just time it to x frequency
[18:08:04] <dirty_d> its easy
[18:08:04] <creep> i like it when i can drive stuff using an 555 pwm generator
[18:08:08] <dirty_d> you can use PWM
[18:08:12] <dirty_d> but youd need a 16 bit timer
[18:08:31] <dirty_d> well, not really if youre going 400Hz
[18:08:33] <Malinuss> dirty_d, I know I've already used a servo. so about the IIR filter, is it something I should worry about or not+
[18:08:35] <Malinuss> ?
[18:08:44] <dirty_d> but at the normal 20ms interval, its a very low duty cycle and you lose precision
[18:08:52] <dirty_d> Malinuss, yes worry
[18:08:56] <dirty_d> especially on a small quad
[18:08:59] <creep> i use 30-70kHz pwm for dc motor and it is cool
[18:09:12] <dirty_d> the ESCs wont be able to react to PID output changes fast enough
[18:09:14] <Malinuss> creep, and you send it to a ESC?
[18:09:26] <dirty_d> creep, damn thats fast
[18:09:37] <dirty_d> ive never heard of using more than 24KHz
[18:09:51] <dirty_d> RC ESCs are 8-16KHZ
[18:10:03] <Malinuss> dirty_d, so what should I do instead? also the servo worked just fine with 50KHz but I'm guessing they don't have a filter?
[18:10:15] <dirty_d> they probably do
[18:10:18] <creep> Malinuss<< well, you can send any frequency pwm to the esc if the pwm is generated internally and the input is only a reference
[18:10:21] <dirty_d> but they would work fine anyway
[18:10:37] <creep> analog signal control is neat too.
[18:10:43] <dirty_d> Malinuss, you should reflash them with a quad firmware, or code them yourself
[18:10:45] <creep> use an adc input
[18:11:13] <creep> to drive with any frequency pwm, just use an rc lowpass filter and connect to the adc in
[18:11:45] <Malinuss> "rc lowpass filter", how is that different from a normal lowpass filter? also passive or active filter?
[18:11:45] <creep> or connect a potmeter and apply 0-5V and control a fan, drill or anything
[18:12:04] <creep> rc lopass is series resistor, capacitor to gnd
[18:12:56] <creep> i don't think an active filter is needed for this, unless you want something special
[18:14:42] <creep> btw they used to add a finger protector logic - that does not allow the motor to start until the control signal is decreased to zero then raised from there
[18:14:43] <dirty_d> for what
[18:14:47] <Malinuss> dirty_d, what about simply using brushed motors? they are cheap and much easier to use?
[18:15:08] <dirty_d> nah use brushless and existing ESCs
[18:15:13] <creep> i'm throwing out brushed motors btw
[18:15:14] <dirty_d> it should be easy to reflash them
[18:15:22] <creep> they are good for nothing
[18:15:35] <dirty_d> Malinuss, there is existing firmware, so its not like you really have to do anything
[18:16:13] <Malinuss> really? well in theory they are cheaper and easier to use (no need for ESCs). Yes they will get worn faster, but this is just a small project and I can always buy 8 insted of 4..
[18:16:35] <creep> not faster, they are junk and go bad fast.
[18:16:39] <Malinuss> so if someone could give me a really good reason to go with brushless and have to deal with ESCs instead pleas
[18:16:57] <creep> use whatever you want
[18:17:17] <Malinuss> well of course, but I don't want to waste my time either... so if it's hopeless it's good to know
[18:17:31] <creep> brushed is more noisy, and eats more power, like 50-60% efficient
[18:17:35] <Malinuss> it would just simplify the project greatly, and lower the budget
[18:17:48] <creep> it may work for some time
[18:17:51] <dirty_d> Malinuss, you still need to build the controller for them though
[18:18:01] <dirty_d> thats going to take some planning and design
[18:18:19] <dirty_d> much easier than brushless, but still
[18:18:45] <Malinuss> dirty_d, well of course, and that's what I want to focus on - the software that would make it fly. so it could give me a kickstart in the right direction
[18:18:52] <creep> a hacked cd-rom motor will replace a speed 400 motor
[18:19:11] <Malinuss> lol
[18:19:39] <dirty_d> Malinuss, controlling the quad is hard enough, you dont wanna worry about driving the motors too
[18:19:52] <creep> better efficiency, smaller size, lightweight.
[18:20:21] <creep> Malinuss<< will it fly ?
[18:20:37] <Malinuss> dirty_d, exactly. that's why I want to go with brushed mators. more power -higher duty cycle... so no worring about driving the motors
[18:20:48] <Malinuss> *motors
[18:20:59] <dirty_d> less power
[18:21:00] <Malinuss> creep, propably not, but it will be fun to try
[18:21:04] <Malinuss> lol yeah
[18:21:06] <Malinuss> haha
[18:21:23] <creep> in an aircraft, every gram counts.
[18:21:29] <dirty_d> the easiest way is just to use ECSs
[18:22:04] <Malinuss> really? would it actually be easier then just connection 4 brushed motors to the uc (with transformers ofc.)..?
[18:22:28] <creep> There is no easy way
[18:22:54] <Malinuss> nope. I just want to know if it would be hopeless to do it the brushed motors way
[18:23:18] <creep> it will work, and fly like 1 minutes instead of 3
[18:23:42] <dirty_d> Malinuss, transformers?
[18:24:13] <Malinuss> dirty_d, nvm. just so it won't drain directly from the uc pins heh
[18:24:13] <creep> brushed control needs 1 power fet and a schottky diode, and a fet driver
[18:24:31] <creep> now apply a PWM at 30kHz for example
[18:25:46] <creep> don't bother yourself with current limit, the brushes and the wires will limit current
[18:26:11] <Malinuss> I see
[18:26:47] <creep> also if you apply an increasing pwm duty the curernt will increase slower.
[18:27:01] <creep> ramp up
[18:27:40] <Malinuss> do I really need a diode in the circuit? can't really see why
[18:27:45] <OndraSter_> you do
[18:27:47] <dirty_d> absolutely
[18:27:47] <OndraSter_> protection
[18:27:52] <OndraSter_> it is coil
[18:27:52] <OndraSter_> afterall
[18:27:57] <Malinuss> ah
[18:28:00] <creep> because the BEMF of the motor will burn your fet and fet driver if you don't
[18:28:02] <Malinuss> so it could backfire
[18:28:03] <OndraSter_> and if you "charge" the coil with + .. -
[18:28:05] <OndraSter_> yes
[18:28:11] <Malinuss> ah
[18:28:16] <dirty_d> you need the diode for it to work right besides any protection
[18:28:34] <Malinuss> dirty_d, okay what about something like this http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-40A-ESC-Brushless-Motor-Speed-Controller-RC-UBEC-4A-50A-/261156684161?pt=US_Character_Radio_Control_Toys&hash=item3cce26c181 can I have any idea if I can use it or not ;D?
[18:28:37] <dirty_d> the diode lets the current flow in the off time, so its working as a buck converter
[18:28:42] <dirty_d> with the motor as the inductor
[18:28:46] <Malinuss> ah
[18:28:50] <creep> good news is you can harvest schottky diodes from thrown out pc power supplies
[18:28:58] <Malinuss> yay
[18:29:03] <Malinuss> I have two actually hehe
[18:29:06] <OndraSter_> unless they were the issue why it blew up :P
[18:29:07] <OndraSter_> only 2?
[18:29:11] <OndraSter_> I have got two rows :D
[18:29:16] <Malinuss> lol
[18:29:20] <OndraSter_> 6 or 8 bad/unknown PSUs
[18:29:25] <OndraSter_> all cheap crap though
[18:29:30] <OndraSter_> nonames
[18:29:49] <OndraSter_> then one I want to recap and see if it works, it is Antec, not the worst of all
[18:30:12] <Malinuss> you ever been shocked OndraSter_ ?
[18:30:22] <OndraSter_> by discharged caps from PSU? yes
[18:30:25] <OndraSter_> I touched even mains
[18:30:37] <creep> try 21" monitor HV, thats fun
[18:30:41] <OndraSter_> eh
[18:30:43] <OndraSter_> from the CCFL?
[18:30:45] <creep> no
[18:30:51] <creep> REAL monitor
[18:30:55] <OndraSter_> ohh
[18:30:57] <OndraSter_> lol nothx
[18:31:00] <creep> the 30-60kg type
[18:31:00] <OndraSter_> CRT
[18:31:18] <creep> it showcks you on ground
[18:31:21] <OndraSter_> I was once playing with those transformers and trying to find the primary and secondary pins
[18:31:30] <OndraSter_> so I grabbed my bench PSU
[18:31:37] <OndraSter_> current limit to 3A and 1V-ish
[18:31:46] <OndraSter_> and always tried some pins of there is the coil
[18:31:47] <OndraSter_> then I found it
[18:31:57] <OndraSter_> so I grabbed the transformer and grabbed it from the bottom..
[18:32:01] <OndraSter_> I forgot about the internal capacitor :D
[18:32:09] <creep> apply a sine, and measure voltages...
[18:32:11] <dirty_d> 500v camera capacitor is most unpleasant
[18:32:26] <OndraSter_> hehe
[18:32:29] <creep> scope
[18:32:39] <dirty_d> esoecially from hand to hand across the chest
[18:32:47] <OndraSter_> wow
[18:32:50] <dirty_d> did thay when i was like 13
[18:33:04] <Malinuss> dirty_d, did you mind taking a quick look at that link :)?
[18:33:38] <dirty_d> looks sketchy
[18:34:01] <creep> so, a pc power supply has 2 double schottky diodes in it usually, one beefy for 5V 25A, and another for 12V 10A
[18:34:22] <OndraSter_> 12V 10A?
[18:34:24] <OndraSter_> that is not much
[18:34:26] <Malinuss> sketchy? on ebay? noo ;D
[18:34:26] <creep> depends.
[18:34:45] <creep> and double schottky :)
[18:34:50] <creep> they can be paralleled
[18:35:18] <OndraSter_> sure
[18:35:23] <creep> one type i remember is MBR1645
[18:35:23] <OndraSter_> I have got so many things I would like to do...
[18:35:26] <OndraSter_> build a quadcopter
[18:35:31] <OndraSter_> disassemble a car to the last screw
[18:35:55] <creep> then put it all together in your room
[18:35:56] <creep> :)
[18:36:05] <OndraSter_> :D
[18:36:10] <OndraSter_> I would like to build a go kart
[18:36:14] <OndraSter_> either with electric engine
[18:36:24] <creep> go electric ;>
[18:36:27] <OndraSter_> or some small engine from a car (Daewoo Tico is a good thing for tha tpurpose)
[18:36:43] <OndraSter_> 0.8l engine, small, light
[18:36:55] <creep> fuck that shit, burning fuel
[18:36:55] <GuShH_> useless
[18:36:58] <OndraSter_> cheap car really, but needs to be delivered to your house
[18:36:59] <OndraSter_> haha
[18:37:17] <creep> check out A123 batteries
[18:37:21] <GuShH_> creep: oh and fuel is not burnt when your lovely electric motors are built and transported
[18:37:52] <OndraSter_> but batteries cost a lot and screw up unless you take a good care of them
[18:37:58] <OndraSter_> with engine - just get a new one cheaply
[18:37:58] <creep> ok well an initial cost is high, but it will last
[18:41:43] <creep> GuShH_<< hopefully they will run out of oil soon and you will have to think this over
[18:42:07] <OndraSter_> sure I would like a small nuclear power generator in it
[18:42:09] <OndraSter_> who wouldn't
[18:42:32] <creep> a little radioactivity for your dna? :)
[18:42:43] <OndraSter_> properly isolated and shielded of course
[18:42:48] <GuShH_> creep: me?
[18:42:58] <GuShH_> your elitism does not concern me.
[18:43:00] <creep> ah ok, only a few times higher dose than "normal" ?
[18:43:29] <GuShH_> OndraSter_: something like the curiosity uses?
[18:44:35] <GuShH_> for electric cars to work the pack would have to be fully modular and easy to take in and out, you'd then be able to get a fully charged pack at a "gas station" and move on with your life, while the discharged module gets charged up by them.
[18:45:11] <GuShH_> moving it around wouldn't be hard with an assisted arm or a loading bay
[18:45:34] <GuShH_> the way they're doing it right now is simply put, not ideal.
[18:46:14] <GuShH_> furthermore it doesn't have to be one huge pack, 2 or 4 smaller units would be best.
[18:46:17] <OndraSter_> yep
[18:46:19] <OndraSter_> my thoughts GuShH_
[18:46:58] <GuShH_> right now they're electric toy cars
[18:47:18] <OndraSter_> yep
[18:51:48] <RoyOnWheels> CapnKernel around?
[18:55:12] <Horologium> OndraSter_, geo metro 3 cylinder engine would make a killer gocart motor. 60ish HP.
[18:56:40] <OndraSter_> wow
[18:56:49] <OndraSter_> I was looking at something 5 - 10 HPish lol
[18:56:59] <Horologium> bah.
[18:57:08] <OndraSter_> I don't need it to do 0-100 in 3 seconds
[18:57:15] <OndraSter_> mostly because it is not road allowed.
[18:57:20] <Horologium> used to race gocarts with honda 450 motorcycle engines.
[18:58:50] <Horologium> those were 45ish HP
[19:06:20] <hackvana> RoyOnWheels: Yes hackvana is around. How are you?
[19:06:50] <RoyOnWheels> ok...
[19:10:27] <CapnKernel> RoyOnWheels: I'm hackvana.
[19:10:39] <hackvana> Honest!
[19:10:43] <RoyOnWheels> ah ok
[19:11:02] <RoyOnWheels> Spartacus moment eh
[19:11:34] <hackvana> :-)
[20:08:14] <evil_dan2wik> How do i compile and upload this: http://www.obdev.at/products/vusb/index.html To an atmega1284P-PU?
[20:08:34] <evil_dan2wik> Ive been using the arduino ide so idk the command line stuff i need
[20:08:57] <r00t|home> evil_dan2wik: v-usb isn't trivial, you should better start with something smaller
[20:09:21] <evil_dan2wik> r00t|home, I know what im doing, i just havent compiled anything from the command line yet
[20:09:39] <evil_dan2wik> I dont know what programs i need or the arguments for them
[20:10:10] <r00t|home> if you knew what you were doing you would ask smarter questions
[20:10:33] <evil_dan2wik> r00t|home, just tell me please
[20:11:28] <r00t|home> how about you download their release and read it's documentation?
[20:11:37] <evil_dan2wik> r00t|home, i did
[20:11:50] <evil_dan2wik> There is nothing about what programs i need
[20:12:41] <r00t|home> https://github.com/obdev/v-usb/blob/master/Readme.txt
[20:12:52] <r00t|home> "PREREQUISITES
[20:12:52] <r00t|home> =============
[20:12:52] <r00t|home> The AVR code of V-USB is written in C and assembler. You need either
[20:12:52] <r00t|home> avr-gcc or IAR CC to compile the project. We recommend avr-gcc because it
[20:12:52] <r00t|home> is free and easily available."
[20:12:54] <evil_dan2wik> oh
[20:16:13] <Tom_itx> evil_dan2wik, are you using linux or windows?
[20:16:24] <r00t|home> windows, obviously
[20:16:36] <r00t|home> or ubuntu maybe
[20:17:26] <Tom_itx> avr-gcc also comes with an editor 'programmer's editor' which i use in windows
[20:17:36] <Tom_itx> then you should have a make file for your project
[20:17:49] <r00t|home> Tom_itx: his project is v-usb...
[20:17:55] <Tom_itx> 'PM' is set up to handle that so you can compile right from within it
[20:18:26] <Tom_itx> i know what it is but i've never used it
[20:24:33] <r00t|home> when loking at the v-usb repository, i found something rather interesting:
[20:24:38] <r00t|home> "The disadvantage is that some zener diodes have a lower voltage
[20:24:39] <r00t|home> than 3 V when powered through 1k5 and the choice of components becomes
[20:24:39] <r00t|home> relevant."
[20:25:14] <r00t|home> none of the projects that use that circuit warn about this... maybe that is why i never got any v-usb project to work -> the wrong z-diodes...
[20:25:33] <r00t|home> ( https://github.com/obdev/v-usb/blob/master/circuits/Readme.txt )
[20:25:34] <theBear> hmmm, around .00133a on 5v
[20:26:02] <r00t|home> theBear: i would assume that developers of v-usb know what they are talking about
[20:26:07] <r00t|home> *that the
[20:26:30] <theBear> oh i don't doubt it, was just interested to see how low your 'average' zener starts to be noticably down the knee
[20:26:45] <theBear> a datasheet graph would tell me, but this was easier :)
[20:27:06] <theBear> and that is small, err, 1mA ?>
[20:27:22] <theBear> yeah, 1000s is mA
[20:28:36] <r00t|home> this is about the circuit v-usb projects commonly use to drive the 3.3v usb signals from 5V avr outputs
[20:30:11] <theBear> yep, which is why i worked out (5-3.3)/1.5k
[20:30:24] <theBear> i know the circuit
[20:30:28] <r00t|home> k
[20:31:18] <evil_dan2wik> sorry ok, back
[20:31:26] <r00t|home> oh noes
[22:07:34] <blocky> So I'm setting DDRB = 0xFF and PINB = 0xFF and it appears to flash to the chip without error, but i don't see any voltage appearing on my output pins
[22:08:13] <Tom_itx> ddrb and portb
[22:08:16] <Tom_itx> not pinb
[22:13:37] <blocky> hmm, fixed that, still, all my output pins are reading either 0 or 0.02 V
[22:20:02] <blocky> now all reading .2V
[22:24:06] <blocky> i don't think the pins are being set to output correctly, cause the pins that I haven't set to output are also reading approx 0.2V
[22:26:22] <inflex> O_o
[22:26:24] <blocky> this may be a dumb question but do i need to unplug the programmer for the chip to run?
[22:26:26] <inflex> what are you trying to do?
[22:26:32] <inflex> blocky: yes and no.
[22:26:35] <blocky> trying to blink an LED
[22:26:37] <blocky> :)
[22:26:50] <inflex> blocky: depends on how you tell the programmer to terminate the session, some will pull RST back high, some don't
[22:26:58] <inflex> okay, how's your LED connected?
[22:27:14] <blocky> well i pulled it out, it was through a resistor to breadboard ground
[22:27:23] <blocky> throught pin PB0 i believe
[22:27:23] <inflex> 0.2V seems a bit like an internal bleed-diode voltage
[22:27:52] <inflex> okay, so you did.... DDRB |= (1<<PB0); PORTB |= (1<<PB0); ?
[22:28:12] <inflex> which AVR?
[22:28:20] <blocky> attiny2313
[22:28:35] <blocky> actually i assigned them both 0xFF
[22:28:40] <blocky> any reason to be more delicatE?
[22:28:51] <inflex> okay, so baically you set the whole port to output and all the pins to high
[22:29:10] <blocky> yeah
[22:29:29] <inflex> okay, and you have what value resistor in series with the LED?
[22:29:51] <inflex> I assume you have something like.... PB0---\/\/\/\----|>|-----GND.
[22:30:39] <blocky> i have PB0 -> LED -> R -> GND
[22:30:52] <inflex> okay that's fine - what value resistor?
[22:31:22] <tzanger> 1.21 jiggawatts
[22:31:24] <blocky> uh kinda hard to read :P
[22:31:28] <blocky> I think its 770k
[22:31:38] <blocky> but the led works with it just across the power rail
[22:31:39] <inflex> O_o
[22:31:41] <tzanger> that doesn't sound right. what ate the colors?
[22:31:56] <tzanger> are
[22:32:03] <inflex> I'd be using something more like 1K
[22:32:08] <inflex> even 470R
[22:32:10] <blocky> oh i think its yellow purple brown, 470 ohm
[22:32:20] <inflex> ( so long as you don't exceed 40mA on the pin )
[22:32:22] <blocky> its a blue resistor so the brown looked purple
[22:32:23] <tzanger> 770k is not standard, and it's way too high
[22:32:34] <inflex> yeah, 470 seems more like it :)
[22:32:36] <tzanger> 470 is great
[22:32:55] <blocky> does it matter that it's a blue led?
[22:33:00] <inflex> not overly
[22:33:10] <inflex> 5V rails I presume?
[22:33:17] <inflex> Does the 2313 program okay?
[22:33:24] <inflex> ( I quite like the 2313 )
[22:33:36] <inflex> ( surprisingly versatile, despite lacking an ADC )
[22:33:42] <blocky> er wait
[22:33:45] <tzanger> blue has a higher diode drop but as long as you're not trying to run from a low supply the AVR should be fine
[22:33:48] <blocky> i just assumed my makefile was flashing it
[22:34:01] <tzanger> heh
[22:34:13] <inflex> you in linux or win?
[22:34:17] <blocky> win7
[22:34:28] <blocky> i get some stuff about size after test1.elf and the size of .text and a bunch of .debug sections
[22:34:33] <inflex> well, I'm out... got to get back to work... fixing iPhones.
[22:34:44] <blocky> yeah its 5V rails
[22:34:44] <inflex> yeah, that's the compiling stage...
[22:34:47] <blocky> okay thanks for the help
[22:34:51] <blocky> lol i didn't flash it
[22:35:07] <tzanger> putting the image on the device is a good step
[22:35:14] <blocky> :x
[22:37:51] <blocky> oh my god
[22:37:57] <blocky> its working :)
[22:43:43] <tzanger> blocky: congrats
[22:44:13] <tzanger> getting hardware doing something it wasn't doing before is always awesome, even when it's just an led
[22:45:12] <blocky> hardware is somehow more satisfying
[22:45:26] <blocky> i guess to dim the LED i need to get a timer going
[23:27:31] <inflex> yes
[23:27:38] <inflex> what was the fault, seems I missed the conv
[23:36:26] <blocky> silly mistake
[23:36:39] <blocky> i thought the makefile was calling avrdude
[23:36:45] <blocky> i wasn't actually flashing the chip at all
[23:37:22] <blocky> ive got some leds blinking now, and im trying to figure out what i need to do to enable a timer and it's interrupt
[23:41:31] <blocky> thanks for the help inflex
[23:50:36] <inflex> that's great