#avr | Logs for 2012-12-10

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[00:05:12] <inflex> oh WTF... 5000 3.5mm sockets in my workshop -somewhere-.... cannot find a single one!
[00:25:01] <megal0maniac> OndraSter_: Tell me you have a correctly etched board
[00:25:06] <megal0maniac> And mean it ;)
[00:49:59] <inflex> Yaaaaaay. Did my first electronics build in a while... and pretty much didn't enjoy it. Stinks like hell!
[00:53:11] <rue_mohr> do we get to see?
[00:54:22] <inflex> *shrug* nothing extraordinary - just another pair of BAC-ESJ units
[00:56:36] <inflex> http://dxp.me/i/esjpair.jpg
[01:08:57] <OndraSter_> megal0maniac, I was making an app to solve crosswords
[01:09:01] <OndraSter_> as a homework
[01:09:25] <megal0maniac> That sounds like it could potentially be fun
[01:09:50] <OndraSter_> not really
[01:09:59] <megal0maniac> Searching a String[][]
[01:10:01] <OndraSter_> haha
[01:10:03] <OndraSter_> not so easy
[01:10:05] <OndraSter_> it needs to be fast
[01:10:11] <OndraSter_> if it gives you crossword 60x60...
[01:10:19] <OndraSter_> with some longer and some shorter words
[01:10:25] <OndraSter_> how fast will it be? :P
[01:11:31] <megal0maniac> Fast enough. Scan through the whole thing for the first letter, each time the letter is found, it checks the 8 surrounding letters and continues in that direction if the 2nd letter is found and so on
[01:11:41] <megal0maniac> Computers are fast, yo
[01:11:46] <OndraSter_> not this crossword
[01:11:49] <OndraSter_> I have already done that
[01:11:54] <OndraSter_> and it was rididculously slow :P
[01:12:04] <OndraSter_> for 60x60 crosswords
[01:12:07] <megal0maniac> You need a faster machine :P
[01:12:07] <megal0maniac> What's the alternative?
[01:12:11] <OndraSter_> it didn't pass the extended tests (4 seconds)
[01:12:33] <OndraSter_> the option how to make it fast was to "cache" each letter's positions :)
[01:14:27] <OndraSter_> http://styl.finance.cz/newsimg/Michal/krizovka1.gif
[01:14:30] <OndraSter_> now we have got stuff like this
[01:14:42] <OndraSter_> with list of words you have to enter rather
[01:14:57] <OndraSter_> I am going to add the word that is the only/has the least available options for its length
[01:15:08] <OndraSter_> anyway
[01:15:10] <OndraSter_> I am off
[01:15:11] <OndraSter_> bb
[01:15:14] <OndraSter_> to the school!
[01:18:14] <megal0maniac> Oh wait. I was thinking of word search :)
[01:18:37] <megal0maniac> Never mind then, no idea how to solve a crossword other than brute-force :P
[01:18:41] <megal0maniac> Enjoy school
[01:40:47] <slidercrank> I have a "/RES" pin (hardware reset pin). should it be connected to the uC's pin of the same name?
[01:41:02] <slidercrank> I mean I have a /RES pin on my LCD
[01:47:05] <inflex> no
[01:47:35] <inflex> usually if you have to, yu control the LCD RST/EN line with a normal digital I/O pin on the AVR
[01:56:51] <slidercrank> inflex, so if I don't want to use it, how should it be connected? to ground or to Vcc via a register (as is the case with AVR)?
[02:01:51] <inflex> if you're in the design phase, I suggest assigning it to an AVR I/O pin... often in the past I've been burned by thinking "Naaah, I'll just tie that RST line to Vcc, cause I don't need it", then BLEERRRRK, wrong, it's needed for some init process or something and then you have to wire-wrap a fix.
[02:03:23] <slidercrank> inflex, I'm just a noob trying to study electronics. I currently managed to blink a led. Now I want to connect an lcd display. I'm short of pins. but I can try to connect it. And if rst is not required I can disconnect it
[02:03:57] <slidercrank> or rewire
[02:04:11] <inflex> use 4-bit data mode on the LCD, or get a serial-LCD
[02:04:21] <inflex> is it a 16x2 text LCD or similar?
[02:04:30] <slidercrank> it's a graphics display with 20 pins
[02:04:43] <slidercrank> 128*64 dots
[02:04:47] <inflex> Fun, going from blinking LED to bitmapped LCD
[02:04:50] <inflex> O_o
[02:05:14] <slidercrank> well, I'm good at programming and a n00b at electronics:) But I'm reading books.
[02:05:20] <inflex> with those, I would most -certainly- suggest ensuring that your RST line on the LCD is accessible
[02:06:03] <inflex> thre might be a 4-bit mode for the gfx LCD which will save you 4 lines
[02:07:30] <slidercrank> it's not supported
[02:08:24] <inflex> Unfortunate. I do like the I2C/SPI bitmapped LCDs
[02:09:15] <inflex> well, if you have to use 8-bit mode, then one suggestion I also put forward is make sure you align it with a full port, else the firmware will blow out to an annoying size
[02:09:32] <inflex> (and slow right down, because if the whole byte is aligned with the port, then it's a single operation to load the pins)
[02:09:49] <slidercrank> yes, splitting it across two ports sucks) inconvenient
[02:10:17] * inflex ponders building another two LOMs, no buyers yet... but I spent $$$ on the panels :\
[02:16:21] <jet> Grievre: I have a Arduino mega 2560 : http://privatepaste.com/0d4eb906ee
[02:17:16] <jet> so it seems that atmega2560 is the right one? Plus it works on the mac with mmcu=atmega2560
[02:21:54] <RikusW> so it seems my southbridge is a goner...
[02:22:11] * RikusW contemplates soldering a bga :-P
[02:23:07] <inflex> 4x4's or so aren't too bad
[02:23:24] <RikusW> I'm talking southbridge size :-P
[02:23:32] <inflex> heh, now that's just no fun at all
[02:23:52] <RikusW> seems I got a transient on the usb 5v into the pc
[02:24:04] <inflex> more caps :D
[02:24:35] <RikusW> and the SB is connected to 5vsb via a mosfet to drop to 3v3, the usb is also connected to 5vsb
[02:24:50] <RikusW> so is the kbd and mouse, which seems to be fine
[02:25:19] <RikusW> I know, I'm typing on it right now, using another pc
[02:26:40] <RikusW> inflex: it all happened while connecting my external 1TB drive to the mains, the 1TB is fine though (luckily ! phew !!)
[02:27:29] <RikusW> inflex: how about 4x4 with 0.5 pitch ?
[02:27:48] <RikusW> it seems such insane sizes do exist
[02:51:54] <Grievre> jet: hmmmm
[02:52:29] <Grievre> jet: So one thing is, sometimes if you have avr-gcc installed somewhere else in addition to in the arduino directory, arduino IDE will use that one
[02:52:34] <Grievre> instead of the one that came with it
[02:52:40] <Grievre> jet: so you might need to fix your paths
[04:47:07] <jet> I'm a bit surprised to see my code in the output of avr-objdump. I don't know much about compiler and disassembler, but is this a bug : http://privatepaste.com/42cea9db5f
[04:48:26] <jet> Grievre: To compile my project, I only use my script, which only uses the freebsd avr tools. the only thing I use from the arduino IDE is the libraries sources (.h and .cpp)
[04:51:10] <jet> in fact, I copied the mac version into my freebsd computer, so there is no way that I could use any binary from the IDE on freebsd
[04:58:21] <Grievre> jet: ah
[04:58:52] <Grievre> jet: did you compile with -g?
[04:59:04] <jet> no
[04:59:12] <jet> I can try
[05:00:15] <jet> ah, yes, I have -g when I compile
[05:00:19] <jet> but not for the link
[05:04:17] <Grievre> yeah -g adds debug information. Shouldn't really matter
[05:04:18] <Grievre> but try removing it
[05:05:59] <jet> the arduino still doesn't boot
[05:34:17] <Grievre> does the ATMega328's native SPI deal alright with irregular clocks?
[05:34:55] <Grievre> i.e. does the time between edges matter at all as long as it's greater than some minimum, and the data line is stable in the neighborhood of the edge?
[06:04:06] <Malinuss> Grievre, I don't know much, but as far as I understand, the slave SPI device have normally a max frequency (or max data/s, same thing), as long as you stay under that, you should be fine
[07:10:58] <OndraSter_> specing, how do you track the DHL?
[07:11:00] <OndraSter_> from TI
[07:11:08] <OndraSter_> they gave me some number which does not work anywhere :D
[07:15:43] <Malinuss> OndraSter_, haha they just told me "We couldn't find any info on your company MalinusWare, and we had to cancel your order" haha
[07:15:55] <OndraSter_> lolo
[07:16:02] <OndraSter_> samples?
[07:17:41] <Malinuss> yeah
[07:17:45] <OndraSter_> heh
[07:17:49] <OndraSter_> I used student :)
[07:17:52] <OndraSter_> and put here my school
[07:17:53] <OndraSter_> there*
[07:18:10] <Malinuss> OndraSter_, If I fill in my univeristy name, can they actually background check that too? Like, send a email and ask them etc.?
[07:19:39] <OndraSter_> why couldn't they?
[07:25:03] <Tom_itx> they'll send the black coats to get you if you lie
[07:25:43] <Malinuss> Tom_itx, nah but I rather not get a email from uni asking me "oh we didn't know about your project" etc..
[07:26:09] <Tom_itx> from the dean of students?
[07:26:30] <Malinuss> yah
[07:26:33] <theBear> oooh, that dean !
[07:27:11] <OndraSter_> :P
[07:27:23] <Malinuss> I just didn't expect them to do any bg check at all
[07:27:23] <Malinuss> so I was suprised
[07:27:26] <OndraSter_> I wrote it even on my middle (for the US "high school") school just fine
[07:27:38] <OndraSter_> I grabbed samples from TI only once
[07:27:46] <OndraSter_> and the stellaris' I grabbed on myxboard.net :)
[07:29:44] <Tom_itx> it's 11f out today
[07:29:56] <Tom_itx> freezing is 32 for you aussies
[07:30:14] <Tom_itx> enjoy your summer
[07:35:24] <OndraSter_> it was -10C yesterday
[07:35:31] <OndraSter_> now it is 2C
[07:35:39] <OndraSter_> yesterday some heavy snow fell
[07:35:52] <OndraSter_> now all the snow is slowly warming up
[07:39:33] <ja2> I got a LCD which supposedly should have backlight. I dont get it to light up. There are some open solder jumpers. BZL GND and FRM GND. Im guessing FRM is "frame", but that could be wrong. What is BZL?
[07:40:34] <ja2> There are also four jumpers for powering the leds, but I got those sorted out. Still no music, seem like I have to chose one GND.
[07:43:47] <Malinuss> ja2, link to LCD?
[07:46:10] <ja2> Malinuss: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11122?
[07:48:29] <OndraSter_> bzl = bezel
[07:48:46] <Malinuss> ja2, 10$ for a 8x2? I payed like 3 or 4$ for a 84x48 ;P... hehe
[07:48:59] <ja2> Good for you!
[07:49:24] <Malinuss> ja2, also , the datasheet says A = LED+ K=LED-
[07:49:57] <ja2> So is that K = -5V?
[07:50:09] <OndraSter_> A=something
[07:50:11] <OndraSter_> K=0V
[07:50:24] <ja2> A=5V
[07:50:41] <OndraSter_> you should not feed there full 5V
[07:50:45] <OndraSter_> since those are still poor LEDs :)
[07:50:50] <ja2> Resistor, datasheet says max 40 mA or something
[07:50:57] <OndraSter_> yep
[07:51:33] <ja2> 1k sufficient or 6k will be better? (No music with 6k, so I tried 1k)
[07:51:49] <OndraSter_> 1kis still a lot
[07:51:56] <OndraSter_> what voltage at 40mA says datasheet?
[07:52:45] <ja2> Supply current max 1.5 mA (not 40 mA!)
[07:52:57] <ja2> Doesnt say anything specific for the leds.
[07:52:58] <OndraSter_> make up your mind already :D
[07:53:06] <ja2> Sorry, 1.5 mA.
[07:53:40] <OndraSter_> I see Vf as Max 5V
[08:06:29] <ja2> Doh, it lights up, but I needed a darker room. :/ Thanks for the help!
[08:08:03] <ja2> Malinuss: You said $3-4 and 84x48 in the same sentence. Do you mind to direct me to your dealer?
[08:09:24] <Malinuss> ja2, http://www.ebay.com/itm/84-48-LCD-Module-White-backlight-adapter-pcb-for-Nokia-5110-/271117761246?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f1fe0bade
[08:10:09] <ja2> Thanks. Looks huge.
[08:10:15] <Malinuss> lol
[08:10:53] <Malinuss> ja2, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPuxeqBrus4&feature=g-crec-u
[08:11:02] <Malinuss> ja2, it's like 5x5cm
[08:11:03] <ja2> It is only code size for the font that will be bigger.
[08:11:32] <Malinuss> wut?
[08:11:40] <ja2> I though it was a character display. So, lol.
[08:13:31] <Malinuss> ja2, well it isn't. it can display anything you want
[08:36:26] <_abc_> Can someone tell if internal storage in gcc programmed atmegas has 32 bit numbers in LSB first order? I.e. LSB0 LSB1 LSB2 LSB3 in successive memory locations? If not, how? Thanks.
[08:36:55] <Grievre> _abc_: that seems easy to determine experimentally
[08:37:22] <_abc_> If it would be, I would not bother to ask.
[08:37:53] <_abc_> reading asm level output from the compiler would be a good start
[08:38:03] <_abc_> Asking a pertinent question here, another.
[08:39:49] <_abc_> gtg
[08:39:58] <Grievre> _abc_: objdump
[08:40:02] <Grievre> will probably be able to help you
[08:40:09] <Grievre> maybe you can write some test code and run it in the simulator
[08:40:15] <Grievre> although I dunno if gcc-generated code can run in the simulator
[08:44:16] <OndraSter_> _ab
[08:44:17] <OndraSter_> he is gone.
[08:44:25] <OndraSter_> FYI, they are in little endian format
[08:44:35] <OndraSter_> aka MSB LSB+2 LSB+1 LSB
[08:46:13] <karlp> I try not to answer those questions until they can come up with a _realllly_ compelling reason as to why they care.
[08:46:58] <slidercrank> I have a CS pin on my display. Should I strobe it in every read/write cycle is it okay to connect it to Vcc?
[08:48:10] <slidercrank> CS=chip select. If I set it to be always 1, I think, I should be able to read/write from/to the display at any time
[08:48:22] <OndraSter_> check datasheet
[08:48:31] <OndraSter_> hehe karlp
[08:50:37] <Malinuss> slidercrank, connect it to the Vcc and you propably see magic smoke
[08:51:41] <slidercrank> Malinuss, why smoke? I've a lot when people connect pins to Vcc to make them "logical 1" and to GND to make them "logical 0"
[08:51:44] <slidercrank> *seen
[08:52:31] <Malinuss> I always though logical pins were very sentitive about the current, since they don't really draw any. Maybe you are right
[08:54:32] <slidercrank> I have this display: BL12864GEPNH$ Could anybody look at it's spec http://www.es.co.th/schemetic/pdf/BL12864GEPNH.pdf (specifically at page 7 (pinouts)) and explain to me how it should be connected? If it doesn't bother you much
[08:56:47] <jadew> slidercrank, vdd to 3.3v :)
[08:57:46] <slidercrank> my whole board is powered with 3.3V
[08:58:27] <jadew> the WR, DISP and CS pins are non-standard, everything else is the same as one of those Hwhatever compatible LCDs
[08:58:36] <OndraSter_> 44780
[08:59:10] <jadew> so you have to figure out first if it's compatible or not, that CS line would suggest it understands SPI or it's using some other protocol
[08:59:18] <jadew> so maybe it can talk several protocols
[08:59:45] <OndraSter_> SPI ftw
[09:01:03] <slidercrank> the datasheet is not clear. Below the page they write "SPI interface is option". How is it option enabled? Or is a display prewired to be one type or the other and I can't choose the mode?
[09:01:24] <jadew> CS could be used to select the LCD you're writting to, so you can use the same data lines
[09:02:20] <rue_mohr> slidercrank, if you turn on the spi system, the pins are used for it
[09:03:14] <jadew> it says (6800 series MPU interface is option) (SPI interface is option)
[09:03:20] <jadew> at the bottom of the pinout table
[09:03:45] <jadew> you could try the regular way
[09:05:27] <jadew> ah, I figured it
[09:05:30] <jadew> WR is E
[09:06:17] <jadew> so I don't know what you do with the other pins, but you could use d4-d7 + rs, rw, e
[09:06:28] <slidercrank> but for SPI to work, one pin should be SCK, right?
[09:07:10] <slidercrank> can I just set WR,WD,CS to be always 1?
[09:07:22] <slidercrank> so that I would not care setting and clearing them all the time.
[09:08:29] <slidercrank> I assume it should make the LCD always enabled (Chip Select=1), accessible for reading (RD=1) and for writing (RW=1)
[09:09:11] <rue_mohr> you trying to do a mcs80 bus or spi?
[09:10:43] <slidercrank> I didn't get whether SPI is supported (what does "SPI is option" mean? Does it mean I can choose the display's mode myself (and all LCD's of this model support spi) or I can order this LCD with SPI support)?) If I can use SPI on this model, then I should use it
[09:11:19] <slidercrank> so could you explain to me how to enable the SPI mode?
[09:12:27] <slidercrank> which LCD pin should be connected to SCK of AVR?
[09:13:31] <slidercrank> It's hard to figure out on my own. As I'm not experienced with it
[09:17:28] <Malinuss> slidercrank, do you have any SR?
[09:18:21] <Malinuss> slidercrank, I would sugest you read a little about SPI in general, and maybe try and use a shift register. it will give you the idea
[09:18:35] <slidercrank> Malinuss, SR?
[09:18:38] <slidercrank> what is SR?
[09:18:41] <Malinuss> shift register
[09:19:18] <slidercrank> I'll reread about SPI.
[09:20:57] <OndraSter_> slidercrank, is that the 128x64 OLED off ebay?
[09:22:20] <slidercrank> OndraSter_, I don't know. I was gifted it
[09:22:34] <OndraSter_> well does it look like an OLED?
[09:22:58] <slidercrank> OndraSter_, http://www.jnutthailand.com/ETODAY/OLED/DSC01840.JPG this is how it looks
[09:23:28] <OndraSter_> I'd say grab any other OLED board off ebay and see if they have got there different datasheet
[09:23:39] <OndraSter_> these controllers have got the same serial/parallel commands
[09:23:48] <slidercrank> yes, it's OLED/YELLOW according to the datasheet
[09:24:38] <slidercrank> okay. I'll do that
[09:28:37] <slidercrank> Thanks for answering me, guys
[09:35:04] <vicatcu> is there a way to determine static stack usage by function with binutils?
[09:37:03] <OndraSter_> hmm
[10:02:52] <_abc_> Can someone tell if internal storage in gcc programmed atmegas has 32 bit numbers in LSB first order? I.e. LSB0 LSB1 LSB2 LSB3 in successive memory locations? If not, how? Thanks.
[10:03:51] <OndraSter_> we did
[10:03:54] <OndraSter_> but you were gone
[10:03:58] <OndraSter_> why do you ask?
[10:04:47] <jadew> probably so he can go over the number with a byte pointer
[10:04:58] <jadew> he needs to know where he should start
[10:05:18] <jadew> I think it's LSB first, but I'm not 100% sure, which way is it?
[10:05:26] <OndraSter_> it is little endian
[10:10:22] <megal0maniac> Fixing another damn USB connector
[10:11:15] <_abc_> OndraSter_: I would like to shift out parts of a large number through a spi port. I left and I said bbl. That later is now... can you please repost the answer?
[10:11:27] <OndraSter_> I did
[10:11:29] <OndraSter_> it is little endian
[10:11:58] <_abc_> 100% little endian?
[10:12:02] <OndraSter_> yes
[10:12:06] <_abc_> lsb0 lsb1 lsb2 lsb3 ?
[10:12:06] <OndraSter_> from what I know, yes
[10:12:10] <_abc_> ok, thanks
[10:12:11] <OndraSter_> I said little endia
[10:12:16] <_abc_> oh
[10:12:19] <OndraSter_> msb lsb+2 lsb+1 lsb
[10:12:22] <_abc_> ok
[10:12:44] <_abc_> I got it backwards the first time :)
[10:13:01] <specing> Bus 005 Device 004: ID 1cbe:00fd Luminary Micro Inc.
[10:13:04] <specing> :)
[10:13:09] <OndraSter_> congrats
[10:13:14] <OndraSter_> specing, my tracking does not work :D
[10:13:18] <OndraSter_> I got some 5KV1100 number
[10:13:24] <OndraSter_> I have got no idea where to track it
[10:13:25] <specing> the rgb led is psychadelic
[10:13:29] <OndraSter_> *anywhere* on the DHL website does not work
[10:13:31] <OndraSter_> it*
[10:13:32] <specing> OndraSter_: me neither
[10:14:08] <specing> OndraSter_: ask in ##stellaris
[10:14:11] <megal0maniac> Another USB connector bites the dust
[10:14:25] <OndraSter_> specing, I am not sure I want to join ARM/Linux/.. channel :)
[10:14:47] <specing> there is no Linux on them
[10:15:54] <OndraSter_> not even uclinux?
[10:16:06] <jadew> _abc_, you might think it's more efficient that way, but there are chances it's faster to do it by actually shifting
[10:17:05] <_abc_> jadew: say again? I am not programming it in C, it has to be compatible with asm I write heh.
[10:17:14] <_abc_> jadew: It's harder to undo this later ;)
[10:17:15] <jadew> _abc_, that's fine
[10:18:08] <specing> OndraSter_: 32k ram
[10:18:19] <jadew> _abc_, what device are you working on?
[10:18:26] <jadew> is it an 8bit device?
[10:18:27] <OndraSter_> no external interface specing ?
[10:19:05] <_abc_> What's the smallest atmega which can talk to a sd card?
[10:19:14] <jadew> atmega8
[10:19:16] <_abc_> You need 512 bytes to hold a sector, no?
[10:19:16] <OndraSter_> smallest as flash or size?
[10:19:20] <_abc_> ram size
[10:19:49] <_abc_> if the card is formatted with 512 byte sectors (the smallest), then one sector takes 512 bytes of ram, no?
[10:19:56] <_abc_> There is no easy way around it on read
[10:20:16] <jadew> well, I guess you could process the bytes and draw your conclusions while reading the sector
[10:20:22] <jadew> cuz it doesn't come in all at once
[10:20:28] <_abc_> On write one can cheat and write it sequentially I think. But then, manipulating directories will become a hair rising experience
[10:21:01] <_abc_> jadew: sure, but if you want to read a fat table and update it and write it back on a non multi session capable device then you need the 512 bytes
[10:21:21] <jadew> well, atmega8 has 1k
[10:21:34] <_abc_> So 512 bytes of ram for a sector and more for the other tasks, it gets tight like that, no?
[10:21:39] <_abc_> Assuming C programming
[10:21:39] <jadew> so you can store a sector and you're left with some space for the program
[10:21:59] <jadew> 512 is decent really
[10:22:33] <_abc_> Depends on how many vars you have and on your parameter passing habits.
[10:22:36] <jadew> plenty of ram, since most of the code won't use up the memory
[10:22:46] <jadew> it will try to stick to registers (that's when compiling c)
[10:22:54] <_abc_> Stack eats ram for lunch if you pass anything but one or two 8 bit parameters as args.
[10:23:12] <jadew> yeah, but I don't think you need to worry about that
[10:23:19] <jadew> really 512 is ok
[10:23:46] <jadew> you can upgrade at any time, to a atmega328p
[10:23:49] <_abc_> I don't know if you looked at recent gcc assembler output with -Osize, it uses ram access with abandon.
[10:23:49] <jadew> same pinout
[10:23:59] <_abc_> Yes, the question was, how small does it have to be.
[10:24:04] <_abc_> Anyway, you answered, thanks.
[10:24:09] <OndraSter_> well how much are these atmega88/168?
[10:24:26] <OndraSter_> I am just asking because even xmega32d4 costs like $2.5/1off making it cheaper than atmega328..
[10:24:37] <OndraSter_> (yeah, me and xmegas)
[10:24:50] <_abc_> OndraSter_: xmega32d4 is what core?
[10:24:57] <jadew> avr
[10:24:57] <_abc_> also how is gcc support?
[10:25:01] <jadew> same
[10:25:05] <_abc_> ok
[10:25:21] <jadew> but they don't come in DIP packages, if that matters for the project
[10:25:31] <_abc_> Well I get atmega8 in ones for about $1.5 or so each including 24% tax and so on
[10:25:49] <OndraSter_> ah
[10:32:27] <_abc_> OndraSter_: xmega32d4 is $2.5 where? And with what tax?
[10:32:39] <jadew> _abc_, why do you have to do it in asm tho?
[10:32:42] <OndraSter_> without tax... on digikey/mouser :)
[10:32:51] <OndraSter_> where the hell do you have 24% tax?
[10:33:19] <OndraSter_> and it is 2.86
[10:33:44] <jadew> 2.86 + $80 customs, for 24 items :P
[10:33:56] <_abc_> OndraSter_: The neosocialist republic of romania
[10:34:03] <OndraSter_> ah
[10:34:04] <_abc_> OndraSter_: the prices are for tme.eu
[10:34:16] <_abc_> jadew: 80$ customs?!
[10:34:19] <jadew> haha, I was about to say the great republic of romania, but I wasn't sure you still live here
[10:34:20] <jadew> hehe
[10:34:23] <_abc_> jadew: where do you live? Argentina?
[10:34:34] <_abc_> jadew: heh
[10:34:35] <megal0maniac> Are there netsplits happening?
[10:34:40] <jadew> _abc_, he bought some stuff and they charged him for each item on the list :P
[10:34:43] <_abc_> megal0maniac: yes, but you can ignore them
[10:34:51] <_abc_> jadew: who and where?
[10:34:56] <megal0maniac> Difficult when I keep getting connected :)
[10:35:02] <megal0maniac> *disconnected
[10:35:09] <megal0maniac> But subsequently connected
[10:35:14] <jadew> czech republic
[10:35:16] <_abc_> megal0maniac: try another server
[10:35:36] <_abc_> megal0maniac: or irc.freenode.org should connect you to a round robin selected "best" server
[10:35:49] <jadew> OndraSter_ had to pay the taxes, he's from there
[10:35:54] <LoRez> s/"best" //
[10:35:55] <jadew> in here you might get away with it
[10:36:03] <_abc_> LoRez: ouch
[10:36:27] <jadew> I haven't paid customs since I started buying crap off of the internet
[10:36:29] <_abc_> jadew: how the heck did they compute that tax?
[10:36:39] <_abc_> jadew: what post office do you use? >:)
[10:36:46] <OndraSter_> I went to tax it through myself
[10:36:48] <OndraSter_> and paid only the VAT
[10:36:52] <OndraSter_> + some fee for some taxing paper
[10:37:05] <jadew> _abc_, nr. 3, the one on pantelimon :)
[10:37:13] <_abc_> Noted
[10:37:19] <jadew> they are way too pissed off and in a hurry to even care I think
[10:37:33] <tld> Yay, got LCR-meter in mail today. Shipped from China 2012.10.02.20, whatever that means (last digit is hour?).
[10:37:51] <_abc_> jadew: I need it in asm because it needs to be fast
[10:38:03] <_abc_> tld: packing convict number
[10:38:07] <jadew> however, if you buy from the US it will probably come to another one (I didn't pay customs for stuff that went there either)
[10:38:24] <_abc_> tld: what LCR meter did you buy?
[10:38:27] <tld> _abc_: could be. I'd expect there to be more though.
[10:38:29] <jadew> _abc_, that's what you're worried about... come on :)
[10:38:35] <jadew> it's gonna be fast
[10:38:39] <tld> _abc_: the cheap one.
[10:38:41] <jadew> first of all, think about this:
[10:38:48] <_abc_> tld: of course, WHICH one?
[10:38:59] <tld> _abc_: looking for link
[10:39:02] <megal0maniac> I'm on irc.freenode.org, but it seems to have calmed down now :D
[10:39:14] <jadew> when you send data over SPI, you have to wait for it to be sent out
[10:39:22] <tld> _abc_: One like this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/LCR-INDUCTANCE-CAPACITANCE-RESISTANCE-METER-TESTER-T86-/370173511353?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item56300f86b9
[10:39:22] <jadew> that means that in the meantime you can prepare the next byte
[10:39:25] <_abc_> megal0maniac: you can do /whois megal0maniac and see exactly what server you are on
[10:39:30] <tld> _abc_: don't know if that was the seller, but same meter.
[10:39:39] <jadew> so you can easilly achieve max performance with C
[10:39:40] <_abc_> megal0maniac: resist the temptation to hard wire it unless it is directly next to you and very reliable
[10:40:02] <megal0maniac> _abc_: I never do, usually netsplits don't affect me. Just got unlucky today
[10:41:30] <_abc_> jadew: I have to use SPI on non SPI pins. The SPI pins are already very busy
[10:42:04] <jadew> _abc_, if they are that busy then you'll have a problem
[10:42:23] <_abc_> tld: neat. For about that price?
[10:42:28] <_abc_> tld: the LCR?
[10:42:33] <tld> _abc_: yeah, somewhere around there.
[10:42:50] <_abc_> jadew: no, since I can pause that operation and handle this SPI and then continue that one
[10:42:58] <tld> due to the shipping-delay, I got a full refund, but I'll pay again now that it's here.
[10:43:13] <jadew> _abc_, ah ha, so it's not that busy
[10:43:22] <jadew> is it a trace routing issues?
[10:43:23] <_abc_> jadew: it is very busy, but in master mode
[10:43:37] <tld> (I'm guessing $17 is a lot more to some random chinese guy, than it is to some random Norwegian guy)
[10:43:44] <_abc_> jadew: pin loading, pcb clutter, and those pins drive a display which must not flicker
[10:45:27] <jadew> since it's taking data by SPI, wouldn't it have an internal memory?
[10:45:40] <_abc_> tld: maybe. Depends where. I just read an article about Hong Kong poor paying $200/month rent for a cubicle about 6 meters square with no windows and no amenities.
[10:45:52] <jadew> if you only have a LCD on the SPI bus, I'd deffinitely use the same one for the sd card too
[10:46:05] <_abc_> jadew: the spi attached things are dumb shift registers. They have 'memory' but only in a perverse sense.
[10:46:21] <jadew> ah, got it, thought you're connected directly to the LCD
[10:46:27] <_abc_> no lcd
[10:46:30] <_abc_> led
[10:46:32] <tld> _abc_: Not sure if that changes anything. If you're paying $200 for that, you probably need money. ;)
[10:46:35] <jadew> oh
[10:47:03] <_abc_> tld: yes but your $17 will be like what they probably pay for food for a day or something, when the original equipment price is deduced
[10:47:15] <_abc_> tld: per day or so
[10:47:29] <tld> could be, but there's still the whole "I'm a man of my words" thing, so repay is still good.
[10:48:07] <megal0maniac> I'm about to fight with DX
[10:48:15] <tld> megal0maniac: good luck!
[10:48:41] <tld> I'm now only ordering from DX if I know it's at least 3-6 months until I'll need (or want) the stuff I order there.
[10:48:46] <jadew> now I saw what you guys are talking about
[10:48:52] <jadew> that's a cheap ass LCR meter
[10:48:55] <Casper> done
[10:48:58] <jadew> didn't even know you can find something like that
[10:49:08] <tld> really cheap ass, just hopeing it'll be 1/4 of half decent.
[10:49:17] <tld> hopeing*
[10:49:29] <_abc_> yes, 200uF top of scale and 20mH smallest scale are nothing to write home about
[10:49:54] <_abc_> 20mH you can barely see 100uH on, you need to see 1,2 and 5uH for today's SMPSU's
[10:50:01] <tld> I'd like a better one, but that's not going to happen at that price. ;)
[10:50:31] <_abc_> Build a bridge or build a LC meter from the web, with mcu and lcd display
[10:51:03] <_abc_> I am about to build a decent Maxwell bridge for myself, I am fed up of digital things lying to me and blowing up SMPSUs due to improper inductors as a result.
[10:51:15] <tld> _abc_: Actually, that's part of the reason I got this. I don't trust it, but for basic "is my own even in the ballpark?"-type measurements, it'll be nice to have.
[10:51:25] <_abc_> If you say so.
[10:51:48] <tld> Could be I should rather have gotten quality inductors from a reliable source, and test with those.
[10:52:23] <tld> but the price was just leading me into temptation.
[10:52:48] <_abc_> You need a bridge to calibrate a bridge :)
[10:53:32] <tld> I probably do.
[10:53:45] <tld> That, or someone to calibrate it for me, which I assume wouldn't be cheap
[10:54:00] <_abc_> Yes, calibration services can cost quite a lot
[10:54:23] <_abc_> I know no privately working person whose instruments were calibrated since they were last touched by metrology in the factory.
[10:54:50] <_abc_> It's upwards of $100 per unit to get calibration from an official place.
[10:55:11] <tld> there are 3% inductors in the lower ranges, 0.1% in the higher, so doing a basic test and simple calibration off of those would at least get me part of the way.
[10:55:25] <_abc_> Do you think so?
[10:55:39] <_abc_> 3% of 20,000 uH is 600uH
[10:55:44] <_abc_> +/-
[10:56:38] <_abc_> http://issuu.com/radu9990/docs/7606 try here for 'punte rlc'
[10:56:49] <_abc_> Ignore the Romanian, look at the pics :)
[10:57:10] <tld> 3% of 0.1uH is a lot less though. for 20mH, there's better available.
[10:57:24] <_abc_> tld: that bridge's lowest scale is 20mH
[10:57:29] <tld> not saying it's perfect, not saying it'd give me accurate calibration, but for checking if my circuit even works, it's a startingpoint.
[10:58:11] <tld> _abc_: Not only is the lowest 20mH, but it's 20mH that I don't trust, so I know it's of limited value.
[10:58:59] <_abc_> Wait, I have a neat schematic for a rlc bridge from the 1970s 80s
[11:02:29] <tld> interesting
[11:03:09] <_abc_> http://ompldr.org/vZ240cw tld
[11:03:39] <tld> ideally btw, I'd love to be able to get a curve over frequency, make saturation-curves etc, but not going to happen on - or anywhere near - my budget, at least from a commercial source, so looking into making seems the way to go
[11:03:41] <tld> thanks. :)
[11:04:01] <_abc_> tld: sure you can do that, there are sound card based ones now, for that
[11:04:17] <_abc_> tld: look for rlc bridge windows free software and also vector voltmeter same
[11:04:22] <tld> that circuit looks surprisingly makeable
[11:04:30] <tld> thanks. :)
[11:04:36] <_abc_> yes, except 2000 ohm phones are hard to get now
[11:04:41] <_abc_> you can connect a small audio amp there
[11:05:17] <_abc_> note that the bridge is separate from the battery groun due to the transformer. You need to ground on 'phones' end on the battery and power the amp from it
[11:05:32] <tld> could I simply put a 2kOhm resistor, then treat it as a signal? (toward soundcard or high-impedance amp input?)
[11:05:38] <_abc_> yes
[11:05:48] <_abc_> as long as the bridge supply is floating (battery)
[11:06:01] <_abc_> but you do not need a sound card with that
[11:06:06] <_abc_> just an ac signal detector.
[11:06:10] <_abc_> LEDs work fine for that
[11:06:28] <_abc_> with an opamp before them
[11:07:02] <tld> frequency-detector with wideband input, output driving a LED?
[11:09:46] <_abc_> amplitude detector, possibly phase sensitive
[11:10:34] <_abc_> tld: you can try a small mains transformer and headphones from your walkman first.
[11:10:42] <_abc_> If it works well, you can improve it.
[11:11:29] <tld> thanks. :)
[11:12:10] <_abc_> you can actually replace that funny old oscillator with any sine oscillator for audio band, even with a 555.
[11:13:27] <tld> ad9850? :)
[11:14:45] <_abc_> overkill
[11:18:08] <OndraSter> 9850 is quite... a high frequency :D
[11:23:27] <tld> yeah, probably.
[11:24:07] <tld> many thanks for the ideas and diagram. :)
[11:44:00] <jadew> _abc_, if you go for the xmega, you have two spi peripherals, in hardware
[11:46:13] <jadew> or was that already said?
[11:46:53] <jadew> you would get way more sram as well, enough to load several sectors at once
[11:47:14] <_abc_> jadew: I know
[11:47:27] <_abc_> not an option right now, next time, I will look hard
[11:49:13] <jadew> IIRC, software spi speed was discussed before in here and I think we came to the conclusion that it can't be faster than CLOCK/4 or something like that
[11:50:22] <jadew> you have to 1) switch sck (1 clock), output bit (2 clocks), switch sck again
[11:53:07] <jadew> and I think you can get CLOCK / 2 in hardware
[11:54:46] <OndraSter> on what chip?
[11:54:54] <jadew> on atmega
[11:55:06] <OndraSter> with Xmega you can even use DMA
[11:55:11] <OndraSter> oh
[11:55:24] <OndraSter> on xmega you can do 16Mbit UART
[11:55:28] <OndraSter> or SPI
[11:55:28] <OndraSter> with DMA
[11:55:41] <jadew> at what clock?
[11:55:49] <OndraSter> 32MHz
[11:56:01] <OndraSter> no more clock fuses crap :)
[11:56:07] <jadew> well, you can do that with atmega too, if it ran at 32 :P
[11:56:18] <jadew> oh, it only runs at 32?
[11:56:28] <jadew> or it takes in any clock?
[11:56:31] <OndraSter> officially 32
[11:56:41] <OndraSter> I ran it at 80MHz :P
[11:56:41] <OndraSter> haven't tried any peripheral other than GPIO
[11:56:46] <OndraSter> 48MHz should do any
[11:56:52] <jadew> awesome
[11:56:58] <OndraSter> if you want to use USB and do not have external oscillators you can do only 62MHz
[11:57:04] <OndraSter> which is plenty enough :)
[11:57:32] <jadew> did you have to increase the voltage to overclock it?
[11:57:46] <OndraSter> no
[11:57:52] <OndraSter> it runs on 32MHz from 2.7V even
[11:57:57] <OndraSter> I am running it on 3.3V
[11:58:08] <OndraSter> 1.8V/12MHz
[11:58:09] <OndraSter> officially
[11:58:20] <jadew> (btw, I realized a few days ago that I'm running some chips at 16Mhz when they are specified for 8
[11:59:38] <jadew> most of my atmega8's are atmega8L which are specified for 8Mhz max
[12:11:46] <jadew> hey, any idea if projects like the ones from dangerousprototypes are hand assembled or if they are using an assembly line?
[12:11:57] <jadew> I mean... when does it get cheap to use the assembly line?
[12:14:28] <jadew> they seem to sell them on seeedstudio, which sends them from china (and they have the cheappest prices) so I was wondering if they get assembled in there and then delivered to other countries or if they get assembled by some poor sob in some other country than china and then sent back to china and to the other countries
[12:18:38] <hackvana> jadew: I have visited Seeed's operation several times
[12:19:07] <hackvana> Most of your questions are answered on Seeed's website
[12:19:21] <jadew> hah, I should check that out then
[12:19:42] <hackvana> http://www.seeedstudio.com/propagate/
[12:20:20] <jadew> I see, so they handle everything
[12:20:27] <hackvana> But to directly answer your question, the stuff that Seeed sells is made in Seeed's factory
[12:21:02] <hackvana> It is a well-run operation with very smart, reasonably well-paid people. It is not a sweat-shop.
[12:21:28] <jadew> nice
[12:21:56] <jadew> they basically build and sell your stuff, that's pretty awesome
[12:22:43] <hackvana> There's no shortage of contract manufacturers here.
[12:23:01] <hackvana> The difference with Seeed is that they are very friendly towards hobbyists
[12:23:14] <hackvana> The maker movement is very important to them
[12:23:44] <jadew> pretty cool
[12:23:57] <hackvana> In fact, yesterday I went to the reopening of the makerspace that Seeed has built for Shenzhen hackers.
[12:25:27] <jadew> who are they?
[12:27:20] <hackvana> Who is who?
[12:28:39] <jadew> Shenzhen hackers
[12:28:59] <jadew> or is that an event?
[12:29:10] <hackvana> Shenzhen is a city in China, on the border with Hong Kong. 40% of the world's electronics manufacturing is done there.
[12:29:20] <hackvana> http://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=147
[12:29:23] <hackvana> It's also my home
[12:29:38] <jadew> I see
[12:29:58] <hackvana> This is me being interviewed by Ian of Dangerous Prototypes: http://dangerousprototypes.com/2012/12/06/workshop-video-interview-with-mitch-from-hackvana/
[12:31:14] <jadew> that city seems awesome
[12:31:24] <hackvana> Indeed it is!
[12:31:24] <Tom_itx> are they organized?
[12:31:28] <Tom_itx> or is it chaos
[12:31:31] <hackvana> Who is they?
[12:31:36] <Tom_itx> the markets
[12:31:56] <hackvana> It has all the order of a stock market
[12:32:08] <jadew> so chaos? :D
[12:32:33] <RikusW> http://www.adafruit.com/blog/2012/12/05/how-we-built-a-super-nintendo-out-of-a-wireless-keyboard-sifteo-sifteo/
[12:32:51] <hackvana> Chaotic order. It looks chaotic when you first see it, but there are patterns, rules, themes and business models
[12:33:06] <hackvana> My writeup: http://hackvana.blogspot.com/2011/09/suppliers-look-inside-component-markets.html
[12:33:54] <hackvana> You can be part of it: http://www.haxlr8r.com/
[12:42:58] <jadew> ince interview
[12:50:10] <tld> Anyone thought about DIY antistatic mats? I'm curious if you could do something weird, like use a rubber conveyor belt (thing grocery-store), add a conductive backing, and call it done? Rubber, so should be more durable than vinyl-mats, and good chance they're somewhat conductive, or they'd pick up a charge from all the movement? (unless offcourse I'm wrong, and any static is simply discharged at either end, through metal).
[12:52:28] <jadew> I think it's not worth it
[12:52:46] <jadew> the price/trouble is way too much for 1 screwed up chip every 10 years
[12:52:50] <jadew> if even that
[12:54:08] <tld> certainly not worth it in a commercial setting at least, just got a bit curious if it could be a way to go for poor DIYers.
[12:54:27] <tld> (in Norway, a proper mat would run me something like 1/4 the cost of a DSO)
[12:54:48] <OndraSter> of a kidney*
[12:55:03] <hackvana> lol
[12:55:40] <tld> naah, the DSO is the more expensive of the two. ;)
[12:56:07] <hackvana> Depends on what you've done to your kidneys.
[12:57:46] <tld> in Norway, we keep a supply of Swedes around for spare parts.
[12:58:12] <asteve> tld: have you seen Hell on Wheels?
[12:58:36] <tld> vaguely familiar with it, but haven't seen
[12:58:58] <asteve> it's an AMC tv series, one of the characters is named "The Swede" and he's actually Norwegian
[13:00:04] <tld> doesn't surprise me.
[13:00:12] <tld> I think we struck a deal with the Swedes a while back.
[13:00:19] <tld> They do the singing (ABBA etc), we do the acting.
[13:01:21] <asteve> well, you guys do the black metal too
[13:01:36] <asteve> emperor and such
[13:07:38] <tld> true.
[13:07:46] <tld> they sing, we make music? :-P
[13:50:02] <Tom_L> http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Hybrid_device_drives_IGBT_modules-article-pspo04_MPD_IGD1205W_jan2013-html.aspx
[14:32:40] <NoSu01001> yay Mitch! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlbC9GSv5jY
[14:34:02] <NoSu01001> good job CapnKernel! from TeknoJuce.
[14:34:29] <NoSu01001> I was watching that... and was like ... wait a min... I know that d00d!
[14:34:49] <hackvana> NoSu01001: I'm over here!
[14:34:52] <CapnKernel> (He's over there -->)
[14:35:00] <NoSu01001> haha
[14:35:05] <hackvana> NoSu01001: Thanks
[14:35:13] <hackvana> I think it turned out pretty well
[14:35:37] <NoSu01001> weird watching youtube and seeing someone you know haha
[14:36:06] <NoSu01001> your good at talking you should make a show I would sub
[14:36:19] <NoSu01001> was Ian a good guy?
[14:36:57] <NoSu01001> seems like he would be pretty Genuine
[14:39:34] <hackvana> Ian is a very cool dude, we had a great time together.
[14:39:47] <NoSu01001> did you take him out for some good eats?
[14:40:04] <hackvana> There's no such thing here, the food is terrible
[14:40:10] <NoSu01001> hahaha
[14:40:14] <hackvana> Pigswill
[14:40:44] <RikusW> sushi ? or is that only in Japan ?
[14:40:49] <hackvana> I live 400m from the border with Hong Kong, and over the other side, the food is entirely different, and amazing
[14:41:07] <NoSu01001> awww is it the quality>
[14:41:08] <NoSu01001> ?
[14:41:19] <hackvana> Chinese just don't get good food.
[14:41:37] <hackvana> As you heard, I miss my wife's cooking
[14:41:51] <hackvana> I like her Chinese food!
[14:42:02] <hackvana> But that's not surprising, she grew up in HK
[14:42:24] <NoSu01001> haha can you ship food from aussieland to there ?
[14:42:43] * RikusW is wary of Chinese food containing MSG....
[14:43:19] <specing> hackvana: do you have chinese citizenship now?
[14:43:53] <hackvana> Er no.
[14:43:59] <hackvana> Why would one want it?
[14:44:18] <specing> I don't know
[14:44:31] <hackvana> NoSu01001: I bring several kilograms of cheese, plus a big tub of Vegemite
[14:44:46] <specing> otherwise you have to constantly visa your way through
[14:44:55] <hackvana> specing: Been to China?
[14:44:57] <specing> no
[14:45:03] <hackvana> It's a fucking zoo.
[14:45:06] <specing> LOL
[14:45:19] <Steffanx> So is australia
[14:45:42] <hackvana> So the idea of getting citizenship is about as appealing as checking yourself in for a nice cage with the gophers.
[14:47:05] <specing> everything tries to kill you in australia
[14:50:17] <hackvana> specing: It does? My goodness. Lived my whole life there and no-one ever told me.
[15:00:58] <_abc_> specing: such as dropbears?
[15:01:07] * _abc_ drops a bear on specing
[15:01:11] <_abc_> I heard about those
[15:02:12] <_abc_> hackvana: Life in HK is really expensive, right?
[15:02:27] <_abc_> Rents and all. I was reading about it.
[15:02:55] <specing> he is not in HK ;) he is 400m away
[15:02:56] <specing> lol
[15:07:49] <hackvana> Rent in HK is very expensive. Finding something that doesn't involve the mortgaging of firstborn means being willing to accept living in 20-40m2. Other things (food, utilities) about the same as Australia, marginally cheaper than the US. Public transport is cheap
[15:07:55] <hackvana> And awesome
[15:11:24] <hackvana> In HK, enough people speak English that you can get away with not knowing Cantonese.
[15:12:06] <hackvana> Despite all the rhetoric China spews about how HK is really part of China, just with an unfortunate line across it, HK is culturally very very different to the mainland.
[15:12:40] <hackvana> Although large numbers of HK folk can now speak Mandarin (because so much business opportunity is in China), they don't actually like speaking in it.
[15:12:58] <hackvana> In Shenzhen, if you don't know Mandarin Chinese, you are screwed.
[15:13:28] <hackvana> Most people will speak Mandarin, and a local language, which may be Cantonese, or something else.
[15:13:51] <hackvana> Shenzhen is an immigrant city: Few people were born here. Most of the population moved there from somewhere else in China.
[15:14:00] <hackvana> So Mandarin serves as the lingua franca.
[15:14:59] <hackvana> So although I can speak Mandarin, I generally don't speak it to HK people, because you might as well poke them in the eye. They like their own HK culture and have no great wish to step backwards and become part of the zoo.
[15:17:50] <RikusW> interesting
[15:18:38] <Xata> hello
[15:18:39] <tobbor> Hello Xata
[15:19:11] <Steffanx> Totally tell us about your project tobbor
[15:19:54] <Xata> i can't get one thing - can i fine change hardware pwm speed?
[15:21:11] <NoSu01001> hackvana how did ian find you there?
[15:21:17] <Xata> not width of pulse, but the speed of the pulses.
[15:21:45] <NoSu01001> did he just like bump into you on the street?
[15:22:32] <hackvana> I've been talking with Ian for a while. So seeing as Shenzhen was on his global geek tour list, it was natural we should meet up.
[15:23:44] <NoSu01001> ah very nice
[15:24:22] <hackvana> He was even cooler IRL than I'd hoped.
[15:24:57] <NoSu01001> well I am glad you did the vid it was mint!
[15:26:03] <NoSu01001> did you go out to the Inaugural China Masturbation contest held in Shenzhen?
[15:26:34] <NoSu01001> ( was on of the recommended youtube videos from your video haha)
[15:27:21] <NoSu01001> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2q0ozPxIG44
[15:50:51] <Essobi> Yay.. Got my AVR 328P programing from my RPI again last night.
[15:51:10] <hackvana> Well you don't see that every day!
[15:53:22] <NoSu01001> haha
[16:08:10] <RikusW> Xata: you can change the timer TOP value to change frequency, you could change the timer prescaler too
[16:13:36] <Xata> RikusW: but how do i? OCRn changes the pulse width, and how do i change TOP value?
[16:14:56] <RikusW> Xata: you change the timer mode bits
[16:16:08] <RikusW> the WGM bits in TCCR1A/B
[16:16:51] <RikusW> then you can use either ICR1 or OCR1A as the new top value
[16:17:04] <RikusW> Table 16-4. Waveform generation mode bit description(1)
[16:17:23] <RikusW> try the CTC mode
[16:19:42] <Xata> RikusW: i don't get it - i have to switch to CTC, set the top in OCRn and than switch back to PWM to set wodth?
[16:19:47] <Xata> *width
[16:20:26] <RikusW> no you leave it in CTC mode
[16:20:46] <RikusW> either mode 4 or 12
[16:24:14] <Xata> RikusW: but how will it get that it is in pwm mode?
[16:24:17] <Xata> meh
[16:32:22] <hetii> Hello :)
[16:35:31] <hetii> I have very strange issue with relay, the model is: NA4WK 2AG010 5v 120 ohm, its look like the polarity are mandatory
[17:00:29] <Malinuss> OndraSter_, do Xmegas into floats?
[17:04:08] <OndraSter_> in software, yes
[17:04:16] <OndraSter_> and there are even FMUL(S(U)) instructions
[17:04:20] <OndraSter_> for some 8bit floating stuff
[17:04:22] <OndraSter_> but gcc does not use that
[17:08:15] <Malinuss> OndraSter_, well in software I thnk all mcu's can use floats... It's more about the hardware, because I don't feel like spending 20$ on a FPU....
[17:08:56] <OndraSter_> no, xmegas don't have FPU
[17:09:01] <OndraSter_> I wish they did instead of the AES/DES
[17:21:52] <Malinuss> OndraSter, yeah and there is only one external FPU producent in the world. and they sell their chips for 20$ :(
[17:23:04] <OndraSter> what do you need FPU that much for?
[17:27:05] <Steffanx> To calculate fractals.. what else?
[17:27:49] <Malinuss> OndraSter, well I would like to make a very slow 3D console (instead of a extremely slow 3D console)
[17:28:02] <OndraSter> eh
[17:28:11] <OndraSter> overclock the xmega to 62MHz
[17:28:34] <Malinuss> even with 62MHz it would still be faster to do fractals on a FPU
[17:48:36] <OndraSter> Malinuss, one usually prefers to avoid floating point numbers
[17:52:21] <Malinuss> OndraSter, kinda hard in a 3d enviurment
[18:09:32] <OndraSter> I am off
[18:09:33] <OndraSter> gn
[18:09:45] <OndraSter> protip: use the numbers 1000 times higher
[18:09:46] <OndraSter> ..
[18:09:49] <OndraSter> gn
[18:10:26] <Tom_itx> gn
[20:56:54] <robotjosh> most avrs have SPH and SPL that must be set to RAMEND, cant seem to do this on the mega48
[21:01:12] <MrCurious> if i want to put a boot loader on an atmel8a would i use the same procedure i would on a 328?
[21:12:16] <Casper> yes
[21:12:27] <Casper> the procedure is the same on all atmega
[21:12:34] <Casper> and it's atmega, not atmel...
[21:12:43] <Casper> atmel is the brand
[21:12:49] <Casper> atmega is the series
[21:17:02] <MrCurious> ok, ty
[21:17:37] <MrCurious> any chance if you know off hand if atmega8u2 are usb-flashable direct out of the box? or tape as it were
[21:17:50] <Casper> I doubt so
[21:17:57] <MrCurious> ok, thanks :D
[21:18:10] <Richard_Cavell> Is Atmel working on anything "better" than the xmega?
[21:18:13] <Richard_Cavell> in 8-bit?
[21:18:17] <MrCurious> i got a tqfp clamping socket today
[21:24:28] <Essobi> I'm going to give that RS-485 bootloader a whirl.
[22:26:41] <TechIsCool> MrCurious: How much did you pay?
[22:28:29] <MrCurious> ~25, ebay
[22:28:38] <TechIsCool> that a 44 pin or some other size
[22:30:23] <Tom_itx> MrCurious, the 8u2 is a usb chip
[22:30:31] <Tom_itx> comes with a builtin bootloader i believe
[22:30:59] <Tom_itx> use FLIP or DFU programmer to program them without erasing the bootloader
[22:34:38] <MrCurious> thanks tom, i am still trying to work it out, 32 pin one
[22:38:08] <gpled> please take a look at this: http://www.stypi.com/gpled/test.c
[22:38:57] <gpled> pb3 is flashing like it should, but if i hook up an led to any other output pins, it lights
[22:39:58] <gpled> running my output pins like this. pin -> resistor -> led -> vcc