#avr | Logs for 2012-12-03

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[02:30:18] <rue_bed> its a class that has so much overhead, there will be a 2 second delay between the first function being called to change the state of the pin and the pin acutally changing state
[02:30:38] <rue_bed> its acutally been said that there is a java class for avr that works faster
[02:31:12] <rue_bed> by all means, dont do it with C, which would turn into 4 instrucitons or less and be extecuted more of less immediatly
[02:31:38] <rue_bed> this is the age of HIGH TECH its SO tech we dont even ever say TECHNOLOGY
[02:32:14] <rue_bed> we value thruput WAY more than latency
[02:33:03] <rue_bed> after all, if you can process 5 trillion foating point operations per microsecond, what does it matter if it takes 4 days to get the result of the first operation you performed?
[02:33:26] <rue_bed> </rant>
[02:34:33] <irseeyou> Anyone interested in a programming job? Wouldn't pay a heck of a lot, but it should be relatively simple. I'm looking for a UI build for a flashlight driver.
[02:34:39] <rue_bed> <rant> the java class can only do one type of output without crashing, but nobodys worked out what it is yet </rant>
[02:35:02] <rue_bed> flashlight driver?
[02:35:07] <irseeyou> rue_bed: Yes sir
[02:35:27] <rue_bed> like "hold on my flashlight is booting..." flashlight?
[02:35:53] <irseeyou> rue_bed: UI Driver. To set modes/brightness
[02:36:08] <rue_bed> for windows?
[02:36:14] <irseeyou> rue_bed: for AVR
[02:36:30] <rue_bed> ah
[02:36:41] <rue_bed> screen or buttons?
[02:36:48] <irseeyou> rue_bed: buttons
[02:36:54] <irseeyou> id like it to be on an ATTINY10
[02:37:05] <rue_bed> ok
[02:37:14] <irseeyou> In the head of the light. Would pay something around $60-80 is my guess
[02:37:42] <rue_bed> what paramiters need to be set?
[02:37:57] <rue_bed> brightness, colour, flashing pattern?
[02:38:04] <rue_bed> morse code message?
[02:38:54] <irseeyou> rue_bed: Brightness is the major one. The others really don't need to be there but it does need to remember the mode. There can be no extra control button so it has to use the power button as the input control too.
[02:39:06] <rue_bed> ok
[02:39:24] <irseeyou> rue_bed: Terms would be a $2 per unit sold royalty to the dev
[02:39:28] <rue_bed> do you want it to just cycle thru modes when the button is pressed?
[02:40:00] <irseeyou> rue_bed: That would be fantastic.
[02:40:20] <rue_bed> what type of circuit is driving the led? voltage or current control?
[02:40:40] <irseeyou> Current control. The driver I'm looking at using has a PWM input
[02:40:44] <rue_bed> ok
[02:40:57] <rue_bed> how many brightness levels?
[02:40:57] <irseeyou> rue_bed: Are you interested in the job?
[02:41:16] <irseeyou> rue_bed: "infinite" if possible so you can select any level of brightness
[02:41:17] <rue_bed> so far it sounds pretty easy, I think alot of people here could beat me to the punch
[02:41:31] <rue_bed> how about one of 1024 brightnesses
[02:41:34] <irseeyou> rue_bed: mind if I pm you?
[02:41:42] <rue_bed> dont mind at all
[02:41:54] <rue_bed> mind you, I AM in my pajamas
[02:42:30] <rue_bed> irseeyou, one button then eh?
[02:42:51] <rue_bed> dunno if anyone here WOULD beat me to the punch
[02:42:53] <rue_bed> but they could
[04:04:30] <Vutral> hmhm
[04:04:37] <Vutral> how do i find my crystals frequency ?
[04:20:06] <discorpia> Vutral: what information do you have?
[04:26:49] <volbus> hello everybody, I'm new with ubuntu and need help in installing things...
[04:28:04] <yunta> hi volbus
[04:28:50] <volbus> hi yunta
[04:30:21] <volbus> I'm really a beginner, no experience with linux but really tired and fucked up of windows
[04:30:44] <yunta> ok
[04:32:18] <yunta> any questions yet?
[04:32:26] <volbus> I need to install avr8-gnu-toolchain-linux, it comes in a compressed *.tar.gz archive
[04:32:36] <volbus> I run ubuntu 12.04
[04:33:16] <volbus> I found some guidelines on google but don't understand much...
[04:33:22] <yunta> isn't avr-gcc enough for you?
[04:33:39] <volbus> the '/.configure' command don't seem to run
[04:34:04] <volbus> yes, it would be enough
[04:34:17] <yunta> sudo apt-cache search avr\
[04:34:19] <yunta> sudo apt-cache search avr
[04:35:07] <yunta> that should show you what avr-related packages are available for your ubuntu
[04:35:13] <yunta> run it in terminal
[04:36:11] <volbus> i don't have to point for an address? where the unpacked directory is located?
[04:37:25] <volbus> wow! it has already found things...
[04:38:21] <volbus> now what?
[04:39:03] <yunta> is there anything interesting there?
[04:39:15] <volbus> yeap!
[04:39:16] <yunta> I don't have ubuntu here, so it's hard to guess :)
[04:39:46] <yunta> volbus: you can copy-paste this list of packages here: http://pastebin.com/
[04:39:49] <yunta> to show it to me
[04:39:49] <volbus> i guess it has found the unpacked directory
[04:40:49] <yunta> most linux distributions (like ubuntu, fedora, etc) keep a list of all "packages" <- installable content
[04:40:54] <yunta> programs etc.
[04:41:07] <yunta> so, most of the time you don't have to download anything from web pages
[04:42:30] <yunta> so, in that list, did you get something like avr-gcc ?
[04:42:55] <volbus> I've just pasted in the link
[04:43:51] <volbus> can you see the paste?
[04:44:14] <volbus> 'gcc-avr - The GNU C compiler (cross compiler for avr)', this is in the list
[04:48:04] <yunta> volbus: did you click "submit" after pasting?
[04:48:49] <yunta> anyways, "gcc-avr" seems to be the name of the package you need
[04:49:11] <volbus> ok, what can i do now?
[04:49:17] <yunta> to get it installed you do;
[04:49:27] <yunta> sudo apt-get install gcc-avr
[04:50:09] <volbus> ok, I'll try it right now...
[04:52:19] <volbus> it has done smth..., it asks me if I want to continue or no, but where will it be installed?
[04:52:46] <volbus> 'cause Atmel says it shoul be in a certain directory
[04:53:55] <yunta> volbus: it's going to be installed in the right place for ubuntu
[04:54:26] <volbus> right! that's fine with me! I hit it
[04:55:19] <volbus> it has finished installing
[04:55:51] <yunta> try: gcc-avr --version
[04:56:44] <volbus> it doesn't find the command
[04:57:06] <yunta> hm...
[04:58:39] <yunta> dpkg -l |grep avr
[04:59:29] <yunta> did it show you gcc-avr ?
[04:59:44] <volbus> in /usr/bin/ have appeared some new files with ...*avr*
[05:00:26] <volbus> some executables and a script in shell
[05:00:56] <yunta> ah, sht
[05:01:00] <yunta> it's supposed to be:
[05:01:03] <yunta> avr-gcc --version
[05:01:05] <yunta> I guess
[05:01:17] <volbus> yes, ... this was the last line from install: Configurando gcc-avr (1:4.5.3-3) ...
[05:01:23] <volbus> ok, i try
[05:01:58] <volbus> YEAP!!! avr-gcc (GCC) 4.5.3
[05:02:06] <volbus> HAHA!!
[05:02:26] <volbus> how can I run it?
[05:02:30] <yunta> you just did
[05:02:42] <yunta> it doesn't have any user interface
[05:02:57] <volbus> no sheat! ufffffff
[05:03:29] <yunta> if you want to develop for avr you'll also need:
[05:04:37] <yunta> text editor, avr libc, "make" program, programmer (like avrdude), ...
[05:05:32] <volbus> I have my own programmer, I just need the hex files, can I use it?
[05:06:01] <yunta> you wrote your own?
[05:07:20] <volbus> yes, but not on pc, it is a standalone piece, i send it the file on serial port
[05:07:42] <yunta> ok
[05:07:43] <yunta> nice
[05:08:05] <volbus> I can load several hex-files and the configuration, lock-bits, from it
[05:08:17] <yunta> nice
[05:08:31] <volbus> but in linux - boahhhhh...., it's hard now at the begining
[05:08:50] <yunta> it's not that difficult
[05:08:54] <yunta> there is UI for package installation
[05:09:04] <yunta> it was just easier to tell you terminal commands over IRC
[05:09:10] <yunta> than to explain where to find the right icon
[05:09:35] <yunta> so, you now have your gcc compiler
[05:09:40] <yunta> you can use it to compile your stuff
[05:09:44] <Sefid_par> Who can give me a sample of avr assembly for example for atmega32. I want to know what are the minimum of headers. and includes
[05:09:46] <volbus> UI from ubuntu, or the package has it?
[05:09:54] <yunta> and then avr-objdump to generate hex out of compiled fies
[05:09:56] <yunta> files
[05:10:20] <yunta> volbus: ubuntu has a program with UI for installing packages
[05:10:51] <yunta> gcc itself doesn't have graphical user interface. neither on windows nor linux.
[05:11:22] <volbus> Ieap, I used AVRStudio on windows
[05:12:27] <yunta> I think it uses gcc internally
[05:12:34] <yunta> not sure though
[05:12:42] <volbus> how can I find this software in ubuntu for installing packages? I have a 'Centro de software'
[05:12:51] <yunta> that may be it
[05:13:01] <yunta> I don't use ubuntu -> no idea
[05:13:35] <volbus> may I ask why? is ubuntu not so good? Are there better choices?
[05:14:05] <volbus> 'cause I just googled a bit and then decided for ubuntu
[05:14:10] <yunta> it's not bad
[05:14:27] <yunta> default window manager in ubuntu imho sucks
[05:14:34] <volbus> what do you run?
[05:14:39] <yunta> Fedora
[05:14:50] <yunta> it's more "experimental"
[05:14:53] <yunta> less stable
[05:14:57] <yunta> but also has newer packages
[05:15:01] <yunta> usually
[05:15:07] <volbus> aha
[05:15:26] <yunta> and it uses Gnome 3 instead of Unity as default window manager
[05:16:16] <volbus> are you from sweden?
[05:16:20] <yunta> also, I work for company that uses fedora-type (RPM) packages in their product
[05:16:39] <yunta> no :)
[05:16:53] <yunta> why?
[05:17:59] <volbus> just so, 'cause it seems a nordic chat.... :)
[05:18:17] <yunta> I live in Finland
[05:18:43] <volbus> ok, thanks for everything, now it's time to practice some linux...
[05:20:03] <volbus> is it always so quiet around here?
[05:20:21] <yunta> no
[05:20:44] <yunta> probably europeans are at work, and us is sleeping
[05:47:45] <Malinuss> would I be the first human to o rotating 3d wireframe on a nokia display, using the a 8-bit uC?
[05:47:49] <Malinuss> *do
[05:51:29] <OndraSter> no
[05:51:43] <OndraSter> there are many 3D libraries and many display libraries so I am sure somebody has done it
[05:51:46] <OndraSter> and not just once
[05:52:52] <OndraSter> ffs no matter what download speed I do on Torrent the internet is still unusable. I can set limit to 500kB/s and the ping is the same as when on 1MB/s. And the internet does not work in either case.
[05:57:16] <yunta> OndraSter: did you limit sending speed too?
[05:57:34] <OndraSter> 0 upload
[05:57:46] <OndraSter> actually the internet barely runs even with torrent off :D
[05:57:50] <yunta> lol
[05:58:27] <Malinuss> OndraSter, are there many 3D libraries for the nokia 3310 display controller? You wut m8?
[05:58:36] <OndraSter> no
[05:58:43] <OndraSter> there are many 3D libraries
[05:58:48] <OndraSter> and there are many nokia 3310 libs
[05:59:18] <Malinuss> OndraSter, none of which do software 3D
[05:59:25] <OndraSter> huh?
[05:59:38] <OndraSter> there is no other 3D on megas :D
[05:59:41] <Malinuss> OndraSter, what do you mean "3D libraries"?
[06:00:03] <OndraSter> libraries that generate 3D images?
[06:00:29] <Malinuss> OndraSter, so they just do the 3D math for you?
[06:00:35] <OndraSter> yes
[06:01:05] <Malinuss> OndraSter, well yeah, there might be, but would you really use that for the rotating 3d wireframe cube?
[06:01:16] <OndraSter> yes
[06:01:42] <Malinuss> b-b-but that's cheating!
[06:01:48] <OndraSter> lol
[06:01:51] <Malinuss> ;D
[06:02:21] <OndraSter> sparkfun or adafruit have got their own 3D library I think
[06:02:31] <theBear> you don't use a lib, you just use that simplealgebraic formula i used to use in basic... all you wanna do is convert 3d coordinates into 2d
[06:02:44] <OndraSter> haha
[06:02:44] <Malinuss> theBear, yeah exactly
[06:02:51] <Malinuss> more or less
[06:02:57] <OndraSter> what about Quake3D?
[06:03:00] <theBear> i mean, for complex stuff a vector 3d lib might be handy, but damn, we just talking simple stuff, not doom3
[06:03:01] <Malinuss> the transformation could be a bitch
[06:03:15] <theBear> OndraSter, hehe, you went a couple steps past where i was willing to go with that :)
[06:03:19] <Malinuss> but yeah using a libarary for that would be a overkill
[06:04:01] <Malinuss> Like, there are also display libararies, but why would I want to use those? It's not fun. Sure it's easier but not fun ;D
[06:04:05] <theBear> what ? the transformation could be a bitch ? no no no, 3d -> 2d transformation is so simple it's not funny, seriously, it's a maybe 2 or 3 bracket one liner algebra with i guess 5 variables, maybe a couple more for angle
[06:04:17] <OndraSter> OMG algebra :P
[06:04:33] <theBear> i mean, i did AND understood this probably just before i was a teenager, it's not hard
[06:04:39] <Malinuss> theBear, yeah but you also need the 3D rotation
[06:05:12] <Malinuss> theBear, yeah you learned calculus at the age of 11, we get it ;)
[06:05:34] <theBear> it's not even calculus, it's BASIC ALGEBRA
[06:05:45] <Malinuss> theBear, I didn't know what a matrix was before I had calculus in uni at age 20
[06:06:41] <Malinuss> rotating a point in 3D space around a other point, is not basic algebra
[06:06:42] <OndraSter> we had simple 2x2 and 3x3 matrixes at middle (high) school
[06:06:49] <yunta> you don't need matrix to rotate shit
[06:06:52] <theBear> i still can't do matrix maths without referring to stuff, but this is SIMPLE, i'm not fucking around here, seriously, 3d -> 2d on a point by point basis is EASY
[06:06:53] <yunta> it's all sin / cos
[06:07:08] <theBear> oh, and rotating a cube, that's easy too, yeah, what yunta said
[06:07:33] <Malinuss> maybe I should just open my old calculus books and look myself hehe...
[06:07:47] <Malinuss> but still - I don't think anyone have done it ;P
[06:07:48] <theBear> for a cube there's a few ways, you can still do your maths in 3d-space, you can base it all off of a single rotating 'plate' if you want , no need to involve cubes
[06:08:48] <yunta> I did 3d wireframe in qbasic in 4th grade of elementary school, with just a bit higher level math than is thought at that age..
[06:09:01] <theBear> what ? i just said i did this as a kid ! i didnt' make it up, i used to love doing graphics in quickbasic and turbobasic, heck, even on the bbc b's at school, walk into a classroom, chat while you idly fiddle the keyboard, and watch people lose their shit when you walk away with a rotating cube or a fancy colour shifting rainbox on the screen
[06:09:03] <OndraSter> I was genius when I was born too
[06:09:09] <OndraSter> no idea where it disappeared to..
[06:09:28] <theBear> what the fuck is wrong with you people ? this shit isn't genius or boasting, we're just saying how very very VERY VERY elementary it is
[06:09:36] <OndraSter> :D
[06:09:40] <yunta> yes :)
[06:10:01] <OndraSter> nowadays school is simple
[06:11:13] <Malinuss> Idk. when I finished elementary school I could + % / and -... that's *all* I could do
[06:11:39] <Malinuss> that's all the teached
[06:11:49] <OndraSter> hehe I knew solving simple equations and such
[06:12:06] <theBear> seriously ? by end of year 7 ('elementary school') we were doing multi brackets algebra daily, even the 'normal' kids
[06:12:08] <Malinuss> I didn't
[06:12:24] <Malinuss> theBear, did you go to some special school?
[06:12:26] <theBear> heck, we had mastered the four basic signs by maybe year 4, even the normal kids
[06:12:30] <Malinuss> like for gifted kids
[06:12:51] <Malinuss> I'm not sure I could talk yet at age 3
[06:12:53] <Malinuss> *4
[06:12:55] <theBear> no, it was a VERY shitty public school, i didn't know where the 5 states in this country were when i left
[06:13:06] <theBear> not age 4, year 4, umm, about age 9/10
[06:13:26] <Malinuss> theBear, explain this then - why are americans (the averge) so stupid then ;P?
[06:13:49] <theBear> i did get into a few programs, like for a couple years i got to go for an afternoon every week with other smart kids and do interesting stuff, but that's not where i learned math
[06:13:55] <theBear> Malinuss, umm, 'cos they live in america ?
[06:13:56] <Malinuss> maybe the education is too hard in primary schools, and many falls off very early (expecet the few kids that makes it)
[06:14:12] <OndraSter> <Malinuss> theBear, explain this then - why are americans (the averge) so stupid then ;P?
[06:14:14] <OndraSter> not just in the US
[06:14:17] <theBear> i hope you're not implying that i'm american or ever lived there, i would have to take offence at that
[06:14:20] <OndraSter> here it gets more and more stupid too
[06:14:25] <OndraSter> :D :D
[06:14:46] <theBear> and i do tend to agree, intelligence isn't rewarded anymore, in many ways (in society) stupidity is rewarded and/or encouraged
[06:14:51] <OndraSter> seriously, 20% of all the students from middle (high) school (age 18-19) failed on simple tasks!
[06:14:53] <OndraSter> when graduating
[06:14:58] <Malinuss> I think the primary school is to teach you basic writing/reading/+- and how to behave, not fucking algebray and shit
[06:15:00] <OndraSter> I tried it, had it done in 15 minutes and had single stupid mistake.
[06:15:02] <theBear> look at oh+s laws (rohs kinda thing) and litigation and crap these days
[06:15:39] <theBear> Malinuss, basic reading and writing and addition and subtraction don't take 7 years of 8:30-3:30 5 days a week for maybe 48 weeks a year, think about it
[06:15:54] <OndraSter> I was bored at primary school
[06:15:56] <OndraSter> and middle school :D
[06:16:00] <OndraSter> now I have got issues at university
[06:16:15] <OndraSter> the speed is much, much different
[06:16:21] <Malinuss> theBear, you missed "how to behave in social context", bit
[06:16:47] <theBear> when my bro used to build BIG playgrounds, i occasionally helped on big jobs if i wasn't busy... one day we had to replace a 'clear' plastic dome/bubble (like you see on the side of mcdonalds playgrounds,) not because a kid had hurt themselves, but because a PARENT had walked into it and KNOCKED THEMSELVES UNCONSCIOUS !
[06:17:02] <theBear> Malinuss, don't even get me started on social rules and manners !
[06:17:07] <Malinuss> theBear, also 8.30-3.30 wut? I never had such a long schoolday, not even in highschool
[06:17:10] <theBear> is it that fucking hard to say please and thankyou ?
[06:17:25] <Malinuss> some never learne it
[06:17:27] <theBear> Malinuss, pretty sure that was what we did primary school, bit longer in highschool
[06:17:36] <Malinuss> lol wut
[06:17:37] <OndraSter> theBear, take it that you are on #avr and here are people that play with micros. That is already way above average person :D
[06:17:52] <Malinuss> OndraSter, <3
[06:18:00] <OndraSter> huh I had primary school maybe 0800 - 1300, few times maybe upto 1500...
[06:18:07] <Malinuss> inb4 not you malinuss
[06:18:09] <Malinuss> o-okay
[06:18:18] <OndraSter> middle school the same
[06:18:25] <theBear> OndraSter, heh, well, at least those that don't call an avr an arduino <biggrin>
[06:18:29] <OndraSter> and well, on university I am... once in a ... long time :D
[06:18:34] <OndraSter> theBear, :D
[06:19:01] <theBear> holy crap ! you finished at 1 in the afternoon !?!?!?!?! you bastard ! AND, that musta been tough on parents... not much option for mum to get a job for example, not many hours to even go shopping and clean the house
[06:20:34] <OndraSter> :D
[06:20:43] <OndraSter> when I was on primary school my mum was at home with my sister
[06:20:43] <Malinuss> okay lets get back to #avr - so why in the world use HEX notation instead of binary? It's like the thing that doesn't show you what the bits are set like, and it's (kinda) harder to read the nomrla decimal...
[06:20:59] <Malinuss> is it because it's shorter?
[06:21:20] <OndraSter> shorter?
[06:21:22] <Malinuss> not even shorter for a byte then decimal.. really, why use HEX?
[06:21:29] <theBear> depends, sometimes hex is easier, sometimes bin is easier, when you program regularly (not like me these days) they're all the same
[06:21:59] <theBear> hex makes a lot of sense if yer doing things in 4 bit chunks, like bcd or just driving a port for whatever reasons
[06:22:18] <Malinuss> theBear, it's all in 8bit chunks
[06:22:37] <theBear> decimal only makes sense when yer wanna drive a value out of the whole port, treating it as a byte
[06:22:43] <theBear> Malinuss, what is ?
[06:24:21] <yunta> Malinuss: after some amount of work with hex you immediately see it as binary, as it's precisely 4bits<->1digit. you can't do that with decimal easily.
[06:24:30] <theBear> and 'cos i'm impatient, imagine you had two bcd -> 8seg chips hanging off a 8bit port... lotta thinking to get two 4 bit values out in decimal, and a little thinking in bin, in hex, whatever value you write, is exactly what the bcd decoder sees
[06:25:20] <Malinuss> theBear, sending data to a controller that takes a byte at a time... Like, to set the Y position you have to write (0 1 0 0 0 Y2 Y1 Y0) so thats 0-5+64.... and they notate that as 0x40 | y..... idk. I would just have used decimals instead
[06:25:34] <OndraSter> oh
[06:25:40] <OndraSter> I thought you ment the output from the avr-objcopy
[06:25:46] <OndraSter> why all tools take Intel .hex files
[06:25:54] <Malinuss> hehe
[06:26:22] <OndraSter> I am used to seeing binary images of flash rather intel hex files myself
[06:26:29] <OndraSter> and in code - I use whatever is appropriate
[06:26:33] <OndraSter> (usually hex or binary)
[06:26:54] <theBear> Malinuss, erm, you talking serial ?
[06:27:04] <Malinuss> theBear, yeah, SPI
[06:27:40] <theBear> well that's kinda different, personally i'd use bin-logic (and/or kinda things) to do that on a bit by bit basis
[06:30:04] <theBear> and i'd probably have some kinda simple function handling it, if i was going for 'hard' timing and steady/fairly constant output, i'd probably try to involve a timer, maybe buffer things and just do the bit flip on interrupt
[06:36:12] <Malinuss> theBear, yeah it's gonna update on interrupts
[06:36:21] <Malinuss> theBear, at least in my finished device
[06:36:27] <Malinuss> right now I'm just doing some testing
[06:37:07] <theBear> use the number system that makes the most sense for that part of the program.... compilers are good like that, you can mix notations as you please
[08:05:23] <vanquish> so i'm programming an atmel chip. I write to it, but when i read back what I wrote, it fails randomly on a different byte each time (fail = read back wrong value than what was programmed there)
[08:05:29] <vanquish> the odd thing is, it runs just fine....
[08:05:58] <vanquish> so....any idea what's going on here? I've checked the spi clock, voltages, reset line...
[08:08:29] <jadew> use a lower clock
[08:08:38] <jadew> and make sure the connection is fine
[08:08:43] <vanquish> chip clock is 6.6mhz or so
[08:08:49] <vanquish> i'm using a 100khz isp clock
[08:08:50] <jadew> maybe the read wire is not properly connected
[08:09:00] <vanquish> chip seems to program just fine
[08:09:00] <jadew> go for a smaller isp clock
[08:09:17] <vanquish> smaller? faster or slower?
[08:09:29] <jadew> slower, sorry
[08:09:32] <jadew> just woke up
[08:55:57] <Tom_itx> lower clock or delay
[08:56:08] <Tom_itx> -B32 for example
[08:57:33] <AR_> for what
[08:58:27] <Tom_itx> the last thing someone asked about
[09:04:36] <rue_mohr> 7 segment
[09:04:43] <rue_mohr> unsigned char CG[] = {
[09:04:43] <rue_mohr> (1<<A|1<<B|1<<C|1<<D|1<<E|1<<F), /* 0 */
[09:04:43] <rue_mohr> (1<<B|1<<C), /* 1 */
[09:04:43] <rue_mohr> (1<<A|1<<B|1<<D|1<<E|1<<G), /* 2 */
[09:04:43] <rue_mohr> (1<<A|1<<B|1<<C|1<<D|1<<G), /* 3 */
[09:04:44] <rue_mohr> (1<<B|1<<C|1<<F|1<<G), /* 4 */
[09:04:46] <rue_mohr> (1<<A|1<<C|1<<D|1<<F|1<<G), /* 5 */
[09:04:48] <rue_mohr> (1<<A|1<<C|1<<D|1<<E|1<<F|1<<G), /* 6 */
[09:04:50] <rue_mohr> (1<<A|1<<B|1<<C), /* 7 */
[09:04:52] <rue_mohr> (1<<A|1<<B|1<<C|1<<D|1<<E|1<<F|1<<G),/* 8 */
[09:04:54] <rue_mohr> (1<<A|1<<B|1<<C|1<<D|1<<F|1<<G) /* 9 */
[09:04:56] <rue_mohr> };
[09:05:00] <rue_mohr> define your bit positions, stay on same port
[09:05:11] <asteve> rue_mohr: http://www.pastie.org
[09:07:07] <asteve> that's an interesting technique to get the shifts correct though
[09:07:21] <rue_mohr> DDRA = (INPUT << PA0 | INPUT << PA1 |INPUT << PA2 |INPUT << PA3 |INPUT << PA4 |INPUT << PA5 |INPUT << PA6 |INPUT << PA7);
[09:07:24] <asteve> you only have to define what A-G are; although I've never seen a G on a 7 seg
[09:07:25] <rue_mohr> it works for a lot of thigns
[09:07:49] <rue_mohr> G is the -
[09:08:16] <rue_mohr> you can only make a few numbers without it
[09:08:39] <asteve> well, I would have set the bits for 1 -> F
[09:08:42] <rue_mohr> 0 and 1 are good examples 7 is another
[09:09:34] <AR_> i've only ever just defined them with combinational logic
[09:09:41] <asteve> it's been 2 years since I've written this stuff; maybe I used to do it and have lost that memory
[09:10:16] <rue_mohr> would you trust your files to an organic drive?
[09:10:31] <Tom_itx> they might grow
[09:10:43] <asteve> from what I've read about dna, maybe
[09:10:49] <rue_mohr> indeed
[09:11:38] <asteve> flash is far more susceptible to degradation now, 10,000 writes and erases?
[09:12:20] <AR_> asteve, not for much longer
[09:12:21] <asteve> if you believe this article http://phys.org/news/2012-12-taiwan-defeat-limits-memory.html
[09:12:27] <AR_> ^
[09:12:29] <asteve> :)
[09:16:15] <rue_mohr> hmm wonder what unknown attribute 170 is on the SSD
[09:20:16] <megal0maniac> OndraSter!
[09:20:30] <OndraSter> megal0maniac, !
[09:20:36] <megal0maniac> Hello everyone
[09:20:41] <OndraSter> hello megal0maniac
[09:21:54] <theBear> 10,000 ? that's old avr spec, i haven't exactly looked for i dunno, 5 years, but last i checked all the current ones were 100,000
[09:22:19] <theBear> or was it 1000 and 10,000 ? hmm, can't trust my memory so much anymore
[09:22:43] <megal0maniac> I've been away. Do xboard minis exist yet?
[09:22:51] <OndraSter> I am waiting for 22uF caps
[09:22:53] <OndraSter> should be here tomorrow
[09:23:01] <megal0maniac> And the rest?
[09:23:08] <OndraSter> I am not soldering them without it
[09:23:11] <OndraSter> but it seems to work
[09:23:29] <megal0maniac> So Wednesday you ship ;)
[09:23:46] <OndraSter> :D
[09:23:51] <OndraSter> we'll see
[09:24:00] <megal0maniac> What do you use to keep the stuff in place when you bake it?
[09:24:07] <megal0maniac> Special glue?
[09:24:32] <OndraSter> in place?
[09:24:32] <OndraSter> there is no air flowing
[09:24:32] <OndraSter> if I would bake it
[09:30:50] <OndraSter> let's say that I need to actually build my bakery first :)
[09:30:55] <OndraSter> I was using just my hotair gun right now
[09:32:59] <megal0maniac> That is true. Well, caps first anyway
[09:34:58] <OndraSter> aand school
[09:35:26] <megal0maniac> Eh. For what?
[09:35:36] <megal0maniac> Remember ages ago when i ordered something from DX?
[09:35:59] <megal0maniac> Tweezers and such
[09:36:58] <OndraSter> no
[09:37:14] <megal0maniac> Well that's how long ago it was. Nothing has arrived :(
[09:37:19] <OndraSter> heh
[09:37:21] <OndraSter> did they hip it?
[09:37:22] <OndraSter> ship
[09:37:38] <megal0maniac> 2 days after the order was placed
[09:37:45] <OndraSter> huh
[09:37:46] <OndraSter> ask them maybe?
[09:40:35] <megal0maniac> I asked about 2 weeks ago, after 38 days. They said be patient
[09:40:42] <OndraSter> ask again
[09:40:45] <OndraSter> demand life's manager
[09:40:49] <OndraSter> WHEN LIFE GIVES YOU LEMONS
[09:40:53] <OndraSter> DO NOT MAKE A LEMONADE
[09:43:04] <megal0maniac> 62 days
[09:52:34] <Malinuss> just making sure: a SPI running at 1MHz will yeld 1000000bit/s or 1Mb/s? right?
[10:11:06] <OndraSter> Malinuss, if you get 0 delay between transfers, yes
[10:14:02] <Malinuss> OndraSter, because the clock define how long it takes from bit to bit, not the whole thing?
[10:15:45] <Vutral> eh
[10:15:49] <Vutral> rwh a
[10:15:53] <Vutral> the spi peripherial doesnt rturn of
[10:19:31] <megal0maniac> OndraSter: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Arduino-compatiable-xmega-based-atxmega128A3U-/180922744611
[10:19:33] <OndraSter> well, it will be 1Mbit/s SPI alright, but if you do bursts of 8bits and then wait for the same amount, you are degraded to 0.5Mbit/s
[10:19:44] <OndraSter> $45
[10:20:19] <OndraSter> why the ft232 lol
[10:20:35] <Malinuss> OndraSter, yeah that's what I meant..
[10:23:44] <OndraSter> megal0maniac, he hasn't got ICSP header :)
[10:23:58] <OndraSter> nor the extra SCL/SDA pins on the left of the AREF!
[10:24:13] <megal0maniac> But, he has the Arduino software working with an xmega
[10:24:22] <OndraSter> I doubt they rewrote all the libs
[10:24:30] <megal0maniac> No idea how well, though, since you don't seem to be able to download it
[10:24:42] <megal0maniac> I wanted to get it and bash it around to work with the coco
[10:24:46] <OndraSter> I like the arduino's version though
[10:24:49] <OndraSter> Arduino $(version)
[10:25:06] <OndraSter> and he has got serial resistors on the pins to provide 5V compatibility
[10:25:17] <OndraSter> which means that he cannot drive proper signals :)
[10:25:43] <OndraSter> err
[10:25:47] <OndraSter> >x mA
[10:26:00] <megal0maniac> Also FTDI
[10:26:07] <megal0maniac> No access to USB
[10:26:09] <OndraSter> nope
[10:26:45] <megal0maniac> Still, the main attraction is the software for me
[10:27:03] <OndraSter> feel free to ask him about the software :D
[10:29:29] <Malinuss> OndraSter, wtf 45$
[10:29:50] <Malinuss> OndraSter, your is like 25$ with shipping
[10:31:00] <Malinuss> well 32$
[10:44:46] <OndraSter> no, without shipping
[10:45:19] <OndraSter> well, 20+5 eur
[10:49:11] <Tom_itx> OndraSter you have a toaster oven yet?
[10:52:15] <megal0maniac> He doesn't
[10:52:38] <OndraSter> Tom_itx, I have got oven, parts
[10:52:48] <Tom_itx> i kinda thought you did
[10:52:58] <Tom_itx> so git busy and make one!
[10:53:03] <OndraSter> not together though
[10:53:26] <OndraSter> this weekend
[10:54:17] <Tom_itx> what avr are you gonna use to control it?
[10:54:32] <OndraSter> xmega32d4
[10:55:34] <megal0maniac> http://www.humblebundle.com/
[10:55:44] <megal0maniac> But do I really want to deal with Steam?
[10:55:52] <Tom_itx> no
[10:56:46] <megal0maniac> I didn't think so either. But the games look so good... OndraSter / Tom_itx, what "control" needs to happen? Or is it just a microwave-like timer?
[10:57:07] <Tom_itx> reflow profile
[10:57:31] <Tom_itx> bake off at a lower temperature to bake out the humidity then ramp up to melt the solder and cool down quickly
[10:57:42] <Vutral> OndraSter: ?
[10:57:55] <Vutral> how do i get sck off between transfers
[10:58:00] <Vutral> i have cpol 1
[10:58:01] <Malinuss> Tom_itx, damn does your oven do all that?
[10:58:18] <Tom_itx> http://www.ecliptek.com/oscillators/EB72F72/reflow.html
[10:58:20] <Tom_itx> sure does
[10:58:28] <megal0maniac> So temperature control, essentially? Just with a wide range of control
[10:59:07] <megal0maniac> And specific timing etc
[10:59:34] <OndraSter> yes
[10:59:35] <Tom_itx> you don't want to be in the 'hot' zone too long
[10:59:35] <OndraSter> megal0maniac, I hlebundel :D
[10:59:35] <OndraSter> playing saints Row right now
[11:00:02] <OndraSter> I have humble bundle*
[11:00:12] <OndraSter> and another 80 games
[11:00:13] <Tom_itx> OndraSter has money to burn
[11:00:18] <OndraSter> :D
[11:00:28] <megal0maniac> I was just trying to figure what the hell you were trying to say
[11:01:05] <megal0maniac> Stuff it. I have 1mbps internet with 10gig cap. Not worth it
[11:01:16] <Vutral> mhm
[11:01:30] <megal0maniac> I shall get a dragon instead :)
[11:01:38] <Vutral> :(
[11:01:52] <Tom_itx> a pet dragon?
[11:02:30] <Tom_itx> you will need cables for it as well. keep that in mind when ordering
[11:02:40] <megal0maniac> What kind of cables?
[11:02:48] <Tom_itx> it comes as a board
[11:02:49] <megal0maniac> I've got two 2x5 blocks
[11:02:54] <Tom_itx> you get to make the cables
[11:03:01] <Tom_itx> i made a 6pin isp one
[11:03:04] <megal0maniac> with bare wires on the other end
[11:03:08] <Tom_itx> and a 10 pin jtag one
[11:03:35] <megal0maniac> Then I should be fine, the 2x5 will work as 2x10 and I already have ISP
[11:03:42] <Tom_itx> but i seldom use it
[11:03:45] <megal0maniac> Thanks for the heads-up though
[11:03:49] <Tom_itx> np
[11:03:59] <Tom_itx> you get a cool little box with it
[11:04:02] <Vutral> gna
[11:04:04] <Vutral> SPIEN
[11:04:05] <megal0maniac> Tom_itx: Maybe I'll buy yours then :P
[11:04:19] <megal0maniac> Vutral: Are you a bot?
[11:04:22] <Vutral> nope
[11:04:26] <Vutral> megal0maniac: i just annoyed
[11:04:28] <Vutral> ynd dizziy
[11:04:36] <Vutral> it keep ssending sclock out
[11:04:39] <megal0maniac> Tourettes?
[11:04:40] <Vutral> even though i write nothing
[11:04:44] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/avr/dragon/dragon.htm
[11:05:23] <megal0maniac> Tom_itx: What's the 25pin D-type for?
[11:05:47] <Tom_itx> which one?
[11:06:08] <Tom_itx> oh
[11:06:14] <Tom_itx> that's an old parport programmer
[11:06:43] <Tom_itx> also ignore the twisted wires on the ribbon, that was for a special board
[11:07:26] <Tom_itx> and the breadboard header was also before i made my little adapters
[11:08:29] <Tom_itx> gotta run
[11:14:07] <r00t|home> Vutral: THE Vutral?
[11:15:29] <Vutral> lol
[11:15:29] <Vutral> yes
[11:15:31] <Vutral> the vutral
[11:15:34] <Vutral> hi WormFood
[11:15:36] <Vutral> nice ubbrr site
[11:15:49] <WormFood> hi Vutral
[11:15:54] <WormFood> thanks ;)
[11:15:56] <root> :)
[11:16:10] <Vutral> now someone can accidently help me fixing my spi ?
[11:16:32] <Vutral> clock keeps running all the time
[11:16:37] <WormFood> you never know...you could try, and get lucky ;)
[11:16:56] <WormFood> it is after 1 am here, and I'm heading off to bed soon (after I wash dishes)
[11:17:07] <Vutral> i am so fuking tired
[11:17:11] <Malinuss> Yay I've made the SPI peripheral work, actually I was just so retarded that I forgot to make the "SPI_setup" jump in the setup function ;P
[11:17:11] <Vutral> much more tired than you an imagine
[11:17:24] <Vutral> i can scratch my skin off
[11:17:31] <Vutral> in thick layers
[11:17:31] <Vutral> lo
[11:17:32] <WormFood> yesterday I was literally fucking tired....I must have fucked for at least 2 hours
[11:17:46] <Vutral> lhours
[11:18:03] <megal0maniac> Vutral has tired tourettes
[11:18:08] <Vutral> spi_setup jump ?
[11:18:10] <Malinuss> I'm not even sure if using the SPI periheral is faster, then just turning the clock on/off, and turning the data on/off. Is it?
[11:18:39] <megal0maniac> Malinuss: It might not be, but it's far less work to program
[11:18:51] <jadew> and it frees clock cycles
[11:19:07] <Vutral> ah
[11:19:10] <Vutral> so much dry skin
[11:19:37] <Malinuss> jadew, well that's what I'm not sure about, because you wait for it to finish each time?
[11:19:58] <Vutral> // Enable SPI, Master Mode 0, set the clock rate fck/2
[11:19:59] <Vutral> //SPSR |= (1<<SPI2X);
[11:19:59] <Vutral> SPCR = (1<<SPE)|(1<<MSTR)|(1<<CPOL)|(1<<SPR1)|(1<<SPR0);
[11:19:59] <Vutral> //SPSR |= (1<<SPR0);
[11:19:59] <Vutral> //SPSR |= (1<<SPI2X);
[11:20:04] <Vutral> ^^
[11:20:08] <jadew> Malinuss, well, when you send it yourself, you have to actually send it yourself, bit by bit
[11:20:30] <jadew> when you're using the hardware peripheral you tell it what byte to send and while it's sending you can do something else
[11:20:45] <Vutral> it shoudl stop clocking out stuff when the byte is out
[11:23:06] <Malinuss> jadew, well the SPI example tells you to while(!(SPSR & (1<<SPIF))){} which bascially keeps checking if all the bytes are out. But wouldn't it give more sense to check that *before* sending new data?
[11:23:48] <jadew> Malinuss, it would work just as fine
[11:24:02] <jadew> it depends on what you want to do
[11:24:05] <Malinuss> jadew, the point being - that way you don't waste cycles waiting
[11:24:17] <Malinuss> Vutral, what is the problem?
[11:24:40] <jadew> well, you could even check if you can send, if you can, do the send, if you can't go on with other stuff and check again later
[11:25:43] <Malinuss> jadew, but even when waiting for the sending to complete, you think it's faster then doing it yourself?
[11:26:14] <jadew> Malinuss, if you're waiting for it, it's probably the same..
[11:26:31] <jadew> still, more comfy to do it by hardware
[11:26:35] <Malinuss> jadew, assuming the clock is the same, of course :).
[11:26:42] <jadew> yeah
[11:27:03] <Malinuss> jadew, yeah, of course, and like you said, you could just wait till later with the sending if it's still sending the old data
[11:27:46] <jadew> Vutral, what mcu are you using? maybe you enabled SPI USART by mistake?
[11:28:05] <jadew> that will continously transmit a clock signal, since it's clocked
[11:29:24] <jadew> Malinuss: one more important thing
[11:29:42] <jadew> if you have interrupts, the software version might stretch clock cycles
[11:30:03] <jadew> and in that case it will be slower than the hardware one, which will work regardless
[11:30:15] <Malinuss> jadew, oh that's true, especially with longer interrupts, or many of them!
[11:30:24] <jadew> yep
[11:31:21] <Malinuss> jadew, also now thinking about it, I don't know how you do SPI by yourself, but I check every single bit, so there are at least ~4 cycle operation for each bit, so 32 cycles for each byte...
[11:31:43] <Malinuss> so it's propably slower yeah
[11:31:58] <jadew> are you sure it's 4 cycles?
[11:32:57] <jadew> let me check the instruction set
[11:33:27] <Malinuss> jadew, haven't looked up the asm, but: turn the clock on/off + branching (checking if 0 or 1 for that bit) + turn the data pin on/off
[11:33:38] <Malinuss> jadew, only do it if you want to :)
[11:33:55] <jadew> yeah, that's true
[11:34:00] <jadew> forgot about the branching
[11:34:20] <jadew> outputting on the port = 1 cycle
[11:34:54] <jadew> wait
[11:34:58] <jadew> you don't have to do branching
[11:35:05] <jadew> you can have 8 instructions instead
[11:35:08] <jadew> 8 sets
[11:35:40] <Malinuss> oh okay, well havent thought about that :)
[11:35:48] <Malinuss> how would that work?
[11:36:02] <jadew> well, you'd have to set the clock bit
[11:36:09] <jadew> copy the current bit
[11:36:12] <jadew> outputting on the port
[11:36:15] <jadew> that's 3 clocks
[11:36:16] <Malinuss> oh
[11:36:23] <Malinuss> thats more clever then what I did
[11:36:29] <Malinuss> but you still need to do it 8 times
[11:36:32] <jadew> if you can merge the first 2 instructions, you'd probably get 2
[11:36:43] <Malinuss> so it's still 16 cycles
[11:36:52] <jadew> yeah
[11:36:58] <jadew> but it's fsk/2 :)
[11:37:04] <Malinuss> + the loop if you do it that way
[11:37:09] <Malinuss> fsk/2?
[11:37:10] <jadew> no loop
[11:37:12] <jadew> you just copy paste
[11:37:16] <Malinuss> oh okay
[11:37:18] <jadew> frequency / 2
[11:37:35] <Malinuss> I can see there are more effecient ways of doing this then I did ;D
[11:37:37] <Malinuss> nice to learn
[11:37:42] <Bustamove> im 70% dolomite baby
[11:38:15] <jadew> Malinuss, it's deffinitely more efficient to do it with hardware :)
[11:39:15] <Malinuss> jadew, looks that way :). Now that I have your attention, another question :):
[11:40:28] <Malinuss> so I'm SPI out to this device and it says "Input for the clock signal: 0.0 to 4.0 Mbits/s". So, if I have the SPI to run at prescalar F_CPU/16MHz, I'm running at 1Mbits/s right?
[11:40:37] <Malinuss> at least while trasmitting
[11:40:44] <Malinuss> so I can easliy crack it up
[11:41:05] <jadew> F_CPU/16 with a clock of 16Mhz?
[11:41:17] <Malinuss> yeah
[11:41:27] <jadew> yeah, I think that would be 1mbit/s
[11:41:42] <Malinuss> okay good, just making sure I understand it
[11:42:59] <Malinuss> thanks btw :)
[11:46:20] <jadew> np
[11:47:23] <jadew> usbtiny uses soft spi: http://dumb.ro/files/stretched_clock.png
[11:47:56] <jadew> that's probably the result of an interrupt right there
[11:50:34] <jadew> perfectly fine tho, but it will happen
[11:52:33] <Malinuss> jadew, ohhh cool. is that yours?
[11:53:03] <jadew> the answer is most likely yes, but what what are you referring to? :)
[11:53:24] <Malinuss> jadew, the analyze tool. How does it work :O?
[11:53:33] <jadew> yeah, it's mine
[11:53:45] <jadew> it's a client for the open bench logic sniffer
[11:53:50] <Malinuss> jadew, also have you hardware?
[11:54:10] <Malinuss> jacekowski, oh so it's just plugged into a COM port?
[11:54:15] <jadew> this is the hardware for it: http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Open_Bench_Logic_Sniffer
[11:54:23] <Malinuss> aahh
[11:54:43] <Malinuss> thats so awsome
[11:55:04] <jadew> heh, yeah, it's a good debugging tool
[11:55:12] <Malinuss> would you mind trying out hardware and see how it looks?
[11:55:26] <jadew> what do you mean?
[11:56:01] <jadew> what hardware?
[11:56:25] <Malinuss> jadew, well if that is soft spi, then see if the hardware spi would look better. Because you can tell this is not perfect, right? Or am I not making any sense :)?
[11:56:36] <jadew> ah
[11:56:50] <jadew> yeah, I have a capture of hardware SPI as well
[11:59:29] <jadew> heh, found a streched clock in hardware SPI as well
[12:00:36] <discorpia> is there any linux dist especially suited for setting up avr development?
[12:01:32] <LoRez> debian/ubuntu makes it pretty easy to install the tools
[12:01:45] <Malinuss> jadew, guess this kind of stuff is never 100%..
[12:01:56] <LoRez> I doubt there's one dedicated to supporting avr dev
[12:02:21] <Bustamove> ubuntu.. install 2 packages and you're set :p
[12:02:23] <jadew> Malinuss, http://dumb.ro/files/stretched_clock2.png
[12:02:28] <jadew> there are 2 streches there
[12:02:50] <jadew> durring the mosi 0 and mosi 9
[12:02:58] <discorpia> cool, thanks
[12:03:39] <Malinuss> jadew, yeah I can see that, interesting.. I expected it to be nearly perfect. Are you powering your uC via USB?
[12:03:54] <jadew> yeah
[12:04:13] <Malinuss> jadew, because that might explain it, the usb could give like 100-150mV inaccuracy..
[12:04:23] <Malinuss> jadew, I know nothing about it, so you tell me ;P
[12:04:32] <jadew> shouldn't matter much
[12:04:51] <jadew> it's deffinitely something that has to do with the way this MCU is built
[12:05:01] <jadew> it's a atmega328p
[12:05:15] <darknite> hmm.. speaking of linux, do you think it would be possible to get linux kernel+avr toolchain to run on a HP620LX ("jornada", palmtop)? i have one sitting i've been meaning to do something with. since it has rs232 it might make a nice portable compiler/isp/debugger(?) or similar
[12:05:34] <jadew> Malinuss, one more thing you might notice, with the hardware SPI
[12:06:10] <jadew> is that it's putting the data line in high impedance state between clocks
[12:06:13] <jadew> probably to save power
[12:07:38] <megal0maniac> Hey Richard_Cavell
[12:07:43] <jadew> anyway, have to get back to work ttyl
[12:07:47] <megal0maniac> Meh. Meant RikusW :)
[12:07:54] <Malinuss> have fun with that, I guess :)
[12:07:55] <megal0maniac> But hi Richard anyway
[12:08:04] <Malinuss> also, thanks again jadew
[12:08:09] <jadew> :) thanks and np
[12:08:27] <megal0maniac> RikusW: Have you seen that RS no longer provides free delivery for orders < R1000 ?
[12:11:08] <Bustamove> What is RS?
[12:11:28] <RikusW> megal0maniac: what ? ! argh :(
[12:11:38] <RikusW> za.rs-online.com
[12:11:47] <RikusW> or uk.rs-online.com
[12:12:05] <RikusW> iirc rs-online.com go to the right country
[12:13:21] <RikusW> megal0maniac: I don't know how it was feasible for them to deliver for free, especially like delivering 5 or 6 parcels for a single order!! (probably due their BEE status :-P )
[12:18:37] <RikusW> megal0maniac: how much are they charging ?
[12:20:37] <Steffanx> I don't understand how the chinese can send stuff to here for free, RikusW ..
[12:21:13] <RikusW> me neither
[12:21:34] <RikusW> gov policy to boost the export economy ?
[12:21:34] <Steffanx> Even a 'in land' package is [Division by zero] times more expensive than that :)
[12:21:39] <Steffanx> *an
[12:22:08] <Steffanx> Or just a single postcard..
[12:22:41] <RikusW> I won't complain if its free :)
[12:22:41] <megal0maniac> RikusW R75
[12:23:01] <RikusW> about the same as Mantech
[12:23:13] <megal0maniac> But their prices are higher
[12:23:19] <RikusW> whose ?
[12:23:30] <megal0maniac> I don't understand how they're surviving when they're so expensive
[12:23:32] <megal0maniac> RS
[12:23:51] <Steffanx> They are not there for you and RikusW, megal0maniac
[12:23:54] <RikusW> hmm RS got good prices and nice range of AVRs
[12:24:13] <megal0maniac> Steffanx: Even so, they're expensive with everything they sell
[12:24:24] <Steffanx> True, true
[12:24:35] <RikusW> megal0maniac: RS is a BEE company, they'll survive :-P
[12:24:46] <Steffanx> BEE ..
[12:25:01] <RikusW> black economic empowerment....
[12:25:06] <RikusW> the new parasitism
[12:25:17] <Steffanx> Swart Ekonomiese Bemagtiging :P
[12:25:24] <RikusW> net so :)
[12:25:53] <megal0maniac> RikusW: Hoe lyk it met die GPS kooi ding?
[12:26:05] <Steffanx> Goed
[12:26:17] <RikusW> from the looks of it BEE is only to the advantage of a minority...
[12:26:37] <RikusW> megal0maniac: not worked on it too much
[12:26:40] <Steffanx> Now it's even cheaper for you to order from mouser of digikey directly RikusW ?
[12:26:59] <Steffanx> That that R75 is THAT bad
[12:27:01] <RikusW> got my bug though, used unsigned instead of signed variables for calculating coordinates....
[12:27:03] <Steffanx> *Not that
[12:27:22] <RikusW> about 7 Euro
[12:27:24] <Steffanx> hHmpf, i shouldn't try to correct my sentences
[12:27:32] <Steffanx> 6.48
[12:27:55] <RikusW> Steffanx: you got a currency calculator handy ?
[12:27:59] <Steffanx> Google
[12:28:03] <RikusW> ah
[12:28:10] <Steffanx> 1ZAR to euro and done :)
[12:28:27] <Steffanx> Or just 75ZAR of course
[12:28:38] <RikusW> very nice of them :)
[12:29:17] <Steffanx> Yeah, google knows al kinds of nice stuff
[12:29:21] <Steffanx> all
[12:29:39] <megal0maniac> Where you live, what you do, who you know...
[12:29:57] <Steffanx> And that (50 volts) / (500 milliohms) = 100 amperes :)
[12:30:32] <Steffanx> or just: ((50 volt) / (500 milliohm)) * the speed of light = 29 979 245 800 m A / s :P
[12:31:40] <RikusW> seems like you want to weld something ? :-P
[12:33:12] <RikusW> megal0maniac: My brother downloaded the software for compiling apps directly onto the SIM900 modem
[12:33:23] <RikusW> hopefully the compiler is included, its about 100MB
[12:33:43] <RikusW> seems like there is an ARM926 on that module
[12:34:05] <RikusW> they have an EmbeddedAT api for custom fw
[12:34:23] <RikusW> and some gpios too
[12:36:01] <RikusW> I might actually have a use for a tiny5 / 10 now, as a watchdog for the sim900, and maybe monitoring battery charging
[13:52:58] <hetii> Hello:) I found such project: http://scanlime.org/2008/09/using-an-avr-as-an-rfid-tag The sources are in http://svn.navi.cx/misc/trunk/avrfid/avrfid.S The question is is it possible to use atmega8 instead ? if yes then what need to be change?
[13:53:04] <hetii> btw the make file is here: http://svn.navi.cx/misc/trunk/avrfid/Makefile
[13:53:20] <chaoshax> Anyone have a link to avrdude wind32 patched for c232 hm?
[13:53:55] <RikusW> hetii: it should be possible to port it
[13:54:41] <RikusW> register names might need a bit of changing around
[13:55:07] <hetii> hmm
[13:55:09] <RikusW> and the mcu type in the makefile
[13:56:00] <hetii> sure, and what about fuses ?
[13:56:11] <hetii> i suppose they alos need to be corrected.
[13:56:27] <RikusW> yes
[13:56:36] <jacekowski> hetii: small AVRs use less power
[13:56:49] <hetii> thats true
[13:56:59] <jacekowski> but software wise it won't be a problem
[14:00:40] <hetii> General it can use external power as well.. i just need to find a way to test my reader that was delivered to me today....
[14:01:13] <jacekowski> what sort of reader is it?
[14:02:10] <jacekowski> hetii: Very low voltage operation. This particular ATtiny85 chip is specified for operation at voltages as low as 2.5v. The extended voltage range version (I didn’t have any of these handy) is specified down to 1.8v. But I’m running these AVRs at barely over 1 volt. At these voltages, the normal AVR clock oscillators don’t work- but I can get away with this because of the next hack…
[14:02:22] <jacekowski> hetii: i don't think atmega8 will work
[14:02:49] <hetii> TowiTek Nr. 191553 it works with EM410x card with 64/40bit and operating at 125Khz
[14:04:20] <hetii> ok then suppose will need order some rfid tag...
[14:13:02] <chaoshax> Anyone have the avrdude build that allows c232hm?
[14:13:15] <chaoshax> It's on some forum but the forum is down
[14:14:05] <RikusW> c232hm ? whats that ?
[14:14:15] <chaoshax> A programmer
[14:14:52] <RikusW> bitbang serial ?
[14:15:11] <RikusW> you should be able to edit avrdude.conf yourself to add it
[14:15:34] <chaoshax> I should but it's beyond my capabilities.
[14:15:44] <chaoshax> There is a build out there but the site is down
[14:16:02] <RikusW> if you know the pinout its very easy actually
[14:16:28] <RikusW> have a look at the dasa programming inside avrdude.conf
[14:16:37] <RikusW> use a text editor
[14:16:42] <RikusW> no programming required
[14:17:06] <chaoshax> I will just wait, they have it in labs.
[14:17:16] <chaoshax> I am going to labs tomorrow anyway.
[14:43:36] <Essobi> Sup
[14:46:15] <Malinuss> hello sir
[15:41:26] <sjokkis> hi. in atmel studio 6, i just started my first project, based on an example project. included the same dependencies in the ASF Wizard, and wrote up the necessary init code. when i try to compile, it says ccp.h is missing, and shows me where it's included. it's included by src/asf/common/services/clock/xmega/sysclk.h. when i select ccp.h in that file and ask to see the implementation, the file opens right up, and it's in ...
[15:41:32] <sjokkis> ... src/asf/xmega/drivers/cpu/ccp.h. am i missing something here? should i be doing something i haven't mentioned?
[18:03:32] <Malinuss> nobody doing anything interesting?
[18:08:15] <Horologium> "If we knew what we were doing it wouldn't be RESEARCH!"
[18:08:43] <Horologium> I'm building an automated chicken door.
[18:09:15] <jadew> that sounds funny
[18:09:40] <Casper> Horologium: don'T forget the razor blade under it
[18:09:47] <Horologium> will open the door just after sunup and close it a while after sundown.
[18:09:53] <Horologium> chickens are up at sunup, sometimes earlier.
[18:09:57] <Horologium> and they are in bed about sundown.
[18:10:06] <Horologium> so setting it up with an RTC chip that has 2 alarms.
[18:10:23] <Horologium> will add a few buttons and a 16x2 LCD display.
[18:10:28] <damjan> Horologium: how do you know they'll be inside ? :)
[18:10:28] <jadew> Horologium, you could use a light sensor instead
[18:10:34] <Horologium> so can set time and change things.
[18:10:56] <Horologium> I could use a light sensor but with storms here things get kinda dicey with light sensors sometimes.
[18:11:05] <Horologium> damjan, give it enough time after sundown and they will be inside.
[18:11:06] <jadew> ah, I see
[18:11:28] <Horologium> this time of year, 5:30PM and they are definitely in bed.
[18:11:33] <jadew> Horologium, you live at a farm?
[18:11:43] <Horologium> jadew, we sometimes get snowstorms that make it dark an hour early.
[18:11:50] <Horologium> and, yes, the chickens live in our yard.
[18:11:57] <jadew> that's so awesome
[18:11:57] <Horologium> live in rural Iowa
[18:12:04] <Horologium> they run free during the day
[18:12:14] <Horologium> but we lock them up at night so other animals don't get to them.
[18:12:34] <Horologium> right now we need to be home a little after sundown to lock them up so the coons don't get to them.
[18:12:50] <Horologium> coons won't come out till an hour or two after sundown usually...
[18:13:00] <Horologium> at least, we don't see them till then anyhow.
[18:13:28] <Horologium> with the automated door we don't have to worry about getting home late or having someone else come over to lock them up.
[18:13:49] <jadew> yeah, deffintely cool and useful
[18:14:32] <jadew> my last project was a complete dissapointment, I can't get the PCB done
[18:15:14] <jadew> it's too big, so it's expensive to have it outsourced, tried to do it myself, but the paper I have on that size, will leave plastic on the PCB, that I can't remove
[18:15:32] <jadew> it kinda got me down, cuz I've been planning for this thing for a few months already
[18:16:25] <Horologium> break the board down into a couple of smaller ones maybe?
[18:16:42] <Horologium> will be using an old atmega8 I have here for it.
[18:16:57] <Horologium> and a ds1306+ RTC chip.
[18:17:13] <Horologium> built the door yesterday..
[18:17:19] <Horologium> vertical slider with a gravity lock.
[18:17:39] <jadew> hope the door is not too heavy
[18:17:58] <Horologium> pull rope upwards and it pulls a wedge out from between two swinging latches on either side then lifts the door..
[18:18:33] <Horologium> on lowering, once the door is down the wedge settles between the latches, pushing them outward to lock the door closed.
[18:18:40] <Horologium> so it can't be lifted without lifting by the rope.
[18:18:46] <Horologium> it weighs several pounds.
[18:19:00] <Horologium> but will use a worm drive assembly to lift it.
[18:19:03] <jadew> hope it doesn't land on some late chicken
[18:19:10] <Horologium> it will go slow..
[18:19:14] <jadew> ah
[18:19:25] <Horologium> will likely take 20 or more seconds to fully open or close.
[18:19:34] <jadew> got it
[18:19:40] <jadew> sounds really cool
[18:19:46] <jadew> should take a video of the door in action
[18:19:49] <Horologium> next weekend, or maybe this week in the evening, I'll make the motor assembly and electronics.
[18:19:53] <Horologium> I plan to.
[19:51:08] <Bustamove> i bought 2 3,6v batteries and removed the circuit on them.. is there a proper way to charge them becouse now they dont seem to hold their 3000mAh
[19:51:41] <Bustamove> theyre not cheap ones i picked them from a forum which tested most bang for buck
[19:52:39] <theBear> yeah, attach a proper charging ciruit to them.. wtf did you remove it ?
[19:53:45] <Bustamove> hmm i got like a charger which i can i pick amount of cels (seems to regulate voltage) and i can regulate mah
[19:53:57] <Bustamove> dont remember actually
[19:54:12] <Bustamove> chould i charge them with 2 volt or 4?
[19:54:52] <Bustamove> 2,8v for 2 cels, 5,6v for 4 cels..
[19:55:12] <Casper> many chargers also do not fully charge them
[19:55:24] <Casper> and you should have kept the protection circuit on it
[19:55:39] <Bustamove> yeah i know but i shouldnt affect charging right
[19:55:48] <Casper> no
[19:55:55] <Casper> but you might have over discharged it
[19:56:07] <Casper> causing it to instantly lose lots of capacity
[19:56:20] <Casper> or you ain't fully charging it
[19:56:28] <Casper> what's the charge algo?
[19:56:30] <Bustamove> i tried to charge them batteries at the same time. one died until i discarged it and i came back to life
[19:56:40] <Bustamove> err
[19:56:49] <Casper> you discharged them down to what voltage?
[19:56:56] <Bustamove> ni-cd / ni-Mh charger
[19:57:15] <theBear> and what kinda batteries are these ?
[19:57:26] <Bustamove> hmm its just a discharge button. maybe "for 1.2V battery packs"
[19:57:28] <Bustamove> so 1,2v?
[19:57:34] <Bustamove> ill check..
[19:57:39] <Casper> you killed it
[19:57:46] <theBear> \you ran a 3.6v cell to 1.2v ? yeah, it's beyond dead
[19:58:06] <Casper> your "good" battery is also unsafe to use
[19:58:35] <Casper> and you could have killed your charger too
[19:58:37] <Bustamove> it works still?
[19:58:40] <Bustamove> but bad
[19:58:43] <Bustamove> cant i rescue it
[19:58:51] <Bustamove> them*
[19:58:52] <Casper> and may catch fire at the next charge cycle too
[19:59:05] <Casper> you permanently killed the battery and make them a possible fire starter
[19:59:14] <Casper> don't mess with lithium
[19:59:21] <Bustamove> 18650
[19:59:27] <Bustamove> 3000mah something
[19:59:35] <Bustamove> seriously?
[19:59:40] <Casper> also, NiMH/NiCD charger is unsuited for lithium battery
[19:59:55] <Casper> at best it will damage them
[20:00:03] <Casper> at worse the battery will catch fire
[20:00:38] <Casper> a lithium battery shouln't be discharged bellow 3V
[20:00:42] <Bustamove> alright what would an ideal voltage be when charging them
[20:00:50] <Casper> bellow 2.8V permanant damage occur
[20:01:10] <Bustamove> http://www.intl-outdoor.com/2-pcs-panasonic-ncr18650a-3100mah-protected-battery-p-333.html
[20:01:12] <Bustamove> here we go
[20:02:14] <Bustamove> alright thanks casper
[20:02:21] <Casper> constant current charge to 4.1V, constant voltage charge until the current drop bellow 2% of it's capacity. Immediatelly stop charging. Going higher than 4.1V may make the battery catch fire. Also, monitor the battery for temperature raise, if it start to heat up, stop charge
[20:02:27] <Casper> remember
[20:02:34] <Casper> lithium do NOT handle any abuse
[20:02:51] <Casper> if you abuse of them, it may catch fire, and you can NOT extinguish it
[20:03:21] <Bustamove> and shortcutting them isnt good either?
[20:03:25] <Bustamove> without protection
[20:03:35] <Bustamove> i feel like ive done it thousands of times now
[20:03:37] <Bustamove> LOL
[20:03:43] <Casper> even with protection... you should never do it
[20:04:08] <Casper> lithium battery fire is: fuel, chemical, electrical AND metalic fire
[20:04:16] <Casper> it generate it's own oxigen
[20:04:19] <Casper> react with water
[20:04:32] <Bustamove> so. do i throw them out or in water
[20:04:40] <Bustamove> err
[20:04:44] <Bustamove> maybe in the furnance
[20:04:54] <Bustamove> if they catch on fire i mean
[20:05:12] <Casper> and heat accelerate the reaction, so covering it in any substance (baking soda and sand for example) make it react even more violently
[20:05:27] <Casper> if it catch on fire, back off and do damage control
[20:06:01] <Casper> expect flame to shoot out atleast 6ft high
[20:06:13] <Casper> yes, extremelly violent reaction
[20:06:16] <Bustamove> wow
[20:07:09] <Bustamove> but they aint like caps. if i charge them with 5,6v they output 3,6 still?
[20:07:13] <Bustamove> right
[20:07:23] <Casper> 5.6 = fire
[20:07:29] <Bustamove> in theory
[20:07:35] <Casper> in practice
[20:07:41] <Casper> 4.2V already start to damage them
[20:07:50] <Bustamove> but they output 3,6+
[20:07:53] <Casper> 4.1V is the normal charge voltage
[20:08:01] <Casper> 3.6-3.7V when fully charged
[20:08:06] <Bustamove> okok
[20:08:14] <Casper> like every other battery
[20:08:28] <Casper> the charge voltage is higher than it's max discharge voltage
[20:09:19] <Bustamove> baking soda and sand you say
[20:09:20] <Casper> 12V battery are 12.7V when full, 10.7V when empty, and charged at 14.4V (for flooded, SLA are float charged at 13.8)
[20:09:44] <Casper> baking soda is often used in the kitchen for kitchen fire
[20:09:55] <Bustamove> i see
[20:10:32] <Casper> but really, be carefull around lithium batts
[20:11:18] <Bustamove> alrighty then
[20:18:04] <Vutral> molol
[20:18:07] <Vutral> 20kb
[20:18:11] <Vutral> on an 32kb avr
[20:18:12] <Vutral> ^^
[20:21:07] <irseeyou> rue_bed: You around? :)
[22:00:56] <nn7> anyone here played with the rfm12lib?