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[00:00:00] <rue_house> I'll take a pic, 1 min
[00:06:31] <rue_house> !assist images/p1040723-u2prog.jpg
[00:06:32] <tobbor> Possibly
http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/images/p1040723-u2prog.jpg
[00:07:18] <rue_house> Tom_itx, ^^ thanks
[00:19:09] <inflex> hremm... need a humidity tracker/logger
[00:33:12] <rue_house> I saw a sensor on ebay from china for $2
[00:33:15] <rue_house> free shipping
[00:34:05] <rue_house> ok I think I just spent $100 on stuff from china
[00:34:10] <rue_house> no more blitzing for me
[00:34:43] <Casper> rue_house: do you know something about building smps?
[00:36:03] <rue_house> nope, wonder if I should buy more
[00:36:07] <rue_house> I'm only at $87
[00:36:13] <rue_house> Casper, everything
[00:36:19] <rue_house> or I did anyhow
[00:36:21] <rue_house> try me
[00:37:19] <Casper> ok, I'm trying to make a smps, forward converter... the efficiency isn't as good as I'ld like it to be, Fet heat more than what it should and output inductor also heat...
[00:37:29] <Casper> do you have an idea why that could happend?
[00:37:34] <rue_house> inductor is saturating
[00:37:39] <rue_house> get a bigger one
[00:37:55] <Casper> the math say it should handle 10A, I drive at 1A and I reached the calculated heat for 10A
[00:38:00] <rue_house> math is wrong
[00:38:26] <rue_house> put a really huge inductor in there and a current sense resistor (0.01R) and watch whats going on
[00:38:30] <rue_house> on a scope..
[00:38:32] <Casper> the inductor I think is big enought, it's from an atx psu...
[00:38:33] <rue_house> if you have one
[00:38:36] <rue_house> its not
[00:38:43] <rue_house> or its not wound right :)
[00:38:55] <rue_house> inductor saturation is trickey
[00:39:09] <rue_house> they can saturate from too much flux or too much dv/dt
[00:39:10] <rue_house> iirc
[00:39:23] <Casper> I didn't rewinded it as basically the signal it get is the same as the original transormer
[00:39:50] <rue_house> I'm going by the symptoms you gave me
[00:40:02] <rue_house> I'm telling you, larger inductor
[00:40:06] <Casper> same frequency, same config on the secondary side, same volt/turn and same secondary turns...
[00:40:26] <rue_house> look, you dont have to beleive me
[00:40:32] <rue_house> whats the Ron of the fet?
[00:40:42] <Casper> 14mohms
[00:40:46] <rue_house> it could be your duty
[00:41:16] <Casper> duty is per calculated, or close to it (didn't run the math, but visually on the scope it was about right)
[00:41:21] <Casper> but I do have some turn off ringing
[00:41:27] <rue_house> and your not running the inducotr pushpull, so it may not be resetting properly
[00:41:32] <rue_house> oh wait
[00:41:39] <rue_house> you said forward converter?
[00:41:47] <Casper> forward with reset winding
[00:41:50] <rue_house> and your using a PC power supply indictor?
[00:41:58] <Casper> yes
[00:42:10] <rue_house> PC power supplies are pushpull, the inductor isn't gapped
[00:42:34] <rue_house> iirc, forward and flyback cores are gapped
[00:42:36] <Casper> rewround the transformer, transformer stay cold
[00:42:48] <rue_house> just now?
[00:43:02] <Casper> output inductor should see the same thing, and that's the part that heat
[00:43:05] <Casper> no
[00:43:26] <rue_house> hu?
[00:43:41] <rue_house> the converter inductor is heating up or a filter inductor
[00:43:47] <rue_house> damnit! supper!
[00:44:33] <rue_house> I think I fried my refried beans
[00:44:57] <Casper> the output inductor, not the transfo
[00:45:11] <rue_house> ? a filter inductor
[00:45:28] <rue_house> did you use the origional pcb?
[00:45:43] <Casper> rue_house:
http://imageshack.us/a/img38/9854/img5675s.jpg
[00:45:47] <Casper> sorry about hand draw :D
[00:45:53] <Casper> the 45uH inductor
[00:46:12] <rue_house> then the wire is too small
[00:46:45] <rue_house> if it was saturating, you would see the controller flipping out
[00:47:12] <Casper> the mosfet current, using a 0.1 ohms, looked fine
[00:47:24] <rue_house> and its heating up?
[00:47:50] <Casper> yes, the fet heat up too, but I wonder... if it could be the ringing
[00:47:52] <rue_house> I suggest a 10R on the fet base, but thats no biggie
[00:48:05] <rue_house> fets heat up like that from flyback
[00:48:16] <Casper> fet gate?
[00:48:17] <rue_house> whats the flyback voltage on it?
[00:48:24] <Casper> 12V in
[00:48:35] <rue_house> yea, 10R or so on the fet gate supresses overshoot
[00:48:55] <rue_house> http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/circuits/fetdrive.gif
[00:49:04] <rue_house> er spikes, sorry
[00:49:20] <Casper> dosen't that 10 ohms also turn it on/off slower?
[00:49:34] <rue_house> nothing measurable
[00:49:39] <rue_house> oddly enough
[00:49:52] <rue_house> that circuit has less that 1ns switching time
[00:50:45] <Casper> would your circuit be suited to switch 40A peak at 100kHz without too much heat?
[00:51:08] <Casper> I have the exact same fet now
[00:52:27] <rue_house> I woulnd't expect any heat from that under those conditions
[00:53:47] <Casper> hmm
[00:53:58] <Casper> I'll try your circuit, I'll also try to lower my frequency
[00:54:01] <Casper> oh
[00:54:02] <Casper> btw
[00:54:05] <Casper> I'm on breadboard
[01:03:36] <Casper> rue_house: do you also know something about HF transformer winding?
[01:04:00] <rue_house> yes,
[01:04:10] <rue_house> use lots of small wire in parallel
[01:05:05] <Casper> I used copper foil
[01:05:21] <Casper> but what about split primary winding? is it worth the trouble?
[01:06:54] <rue_house> I dont think so
[01:06:59] <rue_house> I'm not good with hf
[01:07:50] <Casper> ok
[01:08:38] <Casper> since I use copper foil, I was thinking to do 2 turns, bend 45 degree, wind secondary, bend back the primary on top, and do the 2 other turns...
[01:08:48] <Casper> but I'm worried about the width of the foil
[01:08:57] <rue_house> high capacitance
[01:08:59] <Casper> it's 0.8" wide, which is about as wide as the bobin
[01:09:20] <Casper> so I'm unsure if that wouln't partially short the transfo
[01:09:42] <rue_house> na its perpendicular
[01:10:00] <rue_house> but just solder a pin straight down the foil
[01:10:08] <rue_house> out of the bobbin
[01:10:25] <Casper> yeah, that was plan A actually
[01:10:28] <rue_house> I'm imagining youve taken apart a few PC smps transformers by now
[01:10:33] <Casper> plan B was the bend
[01:10:38] <Casper> yup
[01:10:51] <rue_house> have you seen the winding guide?
[01:11:50] <Casper> 40 turns primary, 1 turn copper foil connected to the primary power ground, secondary (5 + 7 turns, some have extra windings), some have another 1 turn copper foil, 40 primary turns
[01:11:55] <Casper> what winding guide?
[01:12:53] <rue_house> :/ I seem to have lost the link
[01:13:39] <rue_house> damn, its the only good one
[01:13:54] <rue_house> I think its from a university
[01:14:08] <Casper> try to find it please :D
[01:14:35] <rue_house> I'm trying to think of keyword/phrases
[01:15:13] <rue_house> aha
[01:15:20] <rue_house> http://info.ee.surrey.ac.uk/Workshop/advice/coils/index.html
[01:15:33] <rue_house> it used to be in one page, the good stuff is a bit hard to dig out
[01:15:47] <Casper> yes
[01:15:51] <Casper> specially for smps
[01:16:06] <Casper> everything is too simplistic or way too advanced
[01:16:20] <Casper> thanks
[01:16:23] <Casper> will read tomorrow
[01:16:27] <rue_house> core design is just as complex as the design for the rest of the smps
[01:16:27] <Casper> now I need to sleep
[01:16:44] <Casper> yes, but there is some stuff that should be easier
[01:16:54] <rue_house> I should photograph pages from the book I made
[01:17:08] <rue_house> I worked out all the REAL formulas with the realworld losses
[01:17:12] <Casper> like... why don't they explain where they take their numbers!
[01:17:18] <rue_house> I have that
[01:17:23] <rue_house> in my book
[01:17:33] <rue_house> I sat down and put all the apples and oranges togethor
[01:17:42] <Casper> I have yet to see a smps datasheet that the formula don't have an error in them
[01:17:46] <rue_house> almost every inductor formula assumes 50% duty
[01:18:07] <rue_house> which you dont notice till you start running the numbers
[01:18:29] <rue_house> throw out any inductor formula that has freq in it
[01:19:07] <Casper> I crunched some numbers for ltc3789, but man... one formula I still hasn't been able to get to the number they get in the datasheet
[01:19:22] <Casper> actually 2
[01:19:25] <rue_house> is that a tl494 ripoff?
[01:19:30] <Casper> no
[01:19:34] <rue_house> ok
[01:19:42] <rue_house> one of the 7 pin dpacks?
[01:19:51] <Casper> the tl3789 is a buck boost 28 pins ssop
[01:19:57] <rue_house> oh
[01:20:02] <rue_house> not familier
[01:20:06] <Casper> that drive 4 external nchan fet
[01:20:09] <rue_house> wonder what 28 pins are for
[01:20:18] <rue_house> a synchronous?
[01:20:40] <Casper> current mode, synchronous, with fet driver build in, so a few pins for the boost cap
[01:20:48] <rue_house> ah
[01:20:57] <Casper> it look very nice on paper
[01:21:01] <rue_house> :)
[01:21:07] <Casper> like, really
[01:21:47] <Casper> on/off pin, soft start, input or output current limiting, per pulse current limiting (since it's current mode)
[01:21:51] <rue_house> I would say that nothing cant be fixed with a good filter, but my tolerances usually aren't high
[01:21:56] <Casper> power good signal
[01:22:11] <rue_house> lm555 :)
[01:22:21] <Casper> :D
[01:22:41] <rue_house> hard to get 50% out of it tho
[01:22:56] <rue_house> extra parts
[01:23:09] <rue_house> I have come to really like the TL494
[01:23:17] <Casper> btw
[01:23:25] <rue_house> I have a board to make it a sip with lower pin count
[01:23:25] <Casper> forward converter, what shall be the efficiency?
[01:23:46] <rue_house> I'v had about 89 tops from my smps'
[01:24:08] <rue_house> all buck
[01:24:15] <rue_house> with std diodes
[01:24:23] <rue_house> and bipolar switches
[01:24:38] <rue_house> beats linear :)
[01:24:53] <Casper> I got 65% or so, I guestimate that I lose 15% in the fet and inductor...
[01:25:01] <rue_house> ouch
[01:25:05] <Casper> yup
[01:25:10] <rue_house> somethings definitly wrong
[01:25:28] <rue_house> shorted turn in the filter?
[01:25:45] <Casper> basically, at 12Vin 12.5V 1A out, I had to heatsink both the fet and the diode pack
[01:25:49] <rue_house> but you would see mean ripple on the filter cap
[01:25:59] <rue_house> no, not right
[01:26:02] <Casper> the inductor, which is big, get quite warm
[01:26:19] <rue_house> its either resistive or saturating
[01:26:21] <rue_house> have a scope?
[01:26:24] <Casper> yes
[01:26:39] <rue_house> whats the voltage across the filter ind?
[01:26:49] <rue_house> is it spiking to like 120V?
[01:27:08] <rue_house> I presume your shottkey diodes thru
[01:27:12] <Casper> good question....
[01:27:19] <Casper> but I'll check tomorrow
[01:27:22] <rue_house> mm
[01:27:24] <Casper> I'm burned out
[01:27:27] <rue_house> yea
[01:27:30] <Casper> will bug you out tomorrow
[01:27:40] <rue_house> I once destroyed a breadboard making an smps
[01:27:59] <rue_house> fire... bad...
[01:28:10] <rue_house> after that I put current limiting resistors in
[01:28:14] <Casper> I once vaporised a power rail by accidentally dropping my aligator clip from a SLA :D
[01:28:20] <rue_house> :)
[01:28:34] <Casper> surprisingly, it did almost nothing
[01:28:42] <Casper> I barelly saw anything
[01:29:05] <rue_house> the links would prolly open before too much current
[01:29:13] <rue_house> between the sets of holes
[01:29:25] <rue_house> ~15A or so
[01:30:26] <Casper> ... it was a 18AH batt
[01:30:36] <Casper> and those can deliver "safelly" 275A for 5 seconds
[01:34:50] <Casper> nitew
[01:39:08] <rue_house> :)
[01:39:10] <rue_house> gnight
[01:56:32] <Nedlinpopo> help! I can't get this brand new AVRDragon to program under ubuntu12.04 AMD64
[01:57:05] <Nedlinpopo> my trusty AVRISP does fine, but the freaking dragon keeps failing with RSP_FAILED
[01:57:16] <Nedlinpopo> anyone here have a simialr setup and success?
[01:57:52] <Nedlinpopo> there was a bug a long time ago (2 years) that was fixed, and i'm pretty sure this version has the fixes incorporated
[02:00:05] <Nedlinpopo> oh shit. nevermind. it was all becuase the board was underpowered
[02:00:48] <Nedlinpopo> i am surprised though. I thought the Ddragon could source plenty of current (this board should take less than 10mA)
[02:22:45] <rue_house> are yo9u gonna stick around for an answer?
[02:23:18] <rue_house> ah you gonna provide your own
[02:23:18] <rue_house> ok
[03:19:52] <OndraSter_> Nedlinpopo, were you using those vcc and gnd pins?
[03:19:57] <OndraSter_> next to the ISP header
[03:20:06] <Nedlinpopo> no, like a fool
[03:20:17] <OndraSter_> dragon does not source any current
[03:20:21] <OndraSter_> on the ISP/JTAG headers
[03:20:27] <OndraSter_> programmer should not source any.
[03:20:29] <Nedlinpopo> i had forgotten that the ISP header doesn't supply any current
[03:20:45] <Nedlinpopo> i was fooled since the power light on my board did turn on
[03:20:56] <OndraSter_> clamping on input lines :)
[03:21:03] <Nedlinpopo> but it was a little dim, compared to when it was properly supplied
[03:21:13] <Nedlinpopo> it was sure a head scratcher
[03:21:39] <Nedlinpopo> I'm used to the stk500, and my avrisp with my custom power cable
[03:21:50] <Nedlinpopo> the dragon is a new toy
[03:22:06] <OndraSter_> dragon rocks
[03:22:17] <OndraSter_> for $50 o nom nom
[03:22:55] <Nedlinpopo> i just wish is had a jumper to connect it's vtarget lines and the ISP header, like the STK500
[03:23:17] <Nedlinpopo> then i wouldn't hav eto put batteries in each of these stupid things before i program them. :/
[03:25:03] <Nedlinpopo> thanks for the help though
[03:25:16] <Nedlinpopo> i'm done programming all 20 of these
[03:25:20] <Nedlinpopo> goodnight!
[03:51:14] <Schupp> How to compile this Files for Atmega32 ?
http://tiny.cc/91s8mw
[05:31:00] <OndraSter_> I am happy
[05:31:09] <OndraSter_> my XIDE compiles the .cpp even on linux just fine now :)
[05:34:43] <OndraSter_> damn
[05:34:44] <OndraSter_> http://clip2net.com/s/2sYTa
[05:34:47] <OndraSter_> line numbers do not show
[05:57:24] <Xark> OndraSter_: You got one at least. :)
[05:59:18] <OndraSter_> well I fixed those numbers
[05:59:25] <OndraSter_> setting AutoSize before changing the size
[05:59:29] <OndraSter_> AutoSize = false*
[05:59:37] <OndraSter_> but the font size does not match ?!
[05:59:39] <OndraSter_> although they are the same
[05:59:40] <OndraSter_> wtf :D
[07:46:49] <Brittany> Hey everyone. I'm trying to apply a clock signal to an m644p chip using a 555 timer after I messed up the fuses on m644p and need to reset it. Does anyone know the frequency I'll need to get it functioning at?
[07:53:31] <Brittany> Actually, I'll be using an Arduino now, that'd be easier. Does anyone know the frequency I'd have to run it at.
[07:53:36] <Brittany> ?*
[07:56:19] <Blecha> What fuses did you mess up?
[07:57:02] <Brittany> low fuse
[07:57:11] <Blecha> http://www.avrfreaks.net/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=106325
[07:57:14] <Brittany> trying to select an external clock.
[07:57:29] <Blecha> avrfreaks is generally helpful
[07:58:06] <specing> doesen't matter
[07:58:11] <specing> try until it works
[07:58:31] <specing> It really boils down to what you messed up and how
[07:58:37] <specing> there is your answer
[07:59:24] <Brittany> Thanks.
[08:00:15] <Brittany> Basically though
[08:00:19] <OndraSter_> jadew, you liked C(++) right?
[08:00:20] <OndraSter_> well
[08:00:20] <OndraSter_> http://clip2net.com/s/2sZUG
[08:00:22] <Brittany> on trying this, I messed up quite a lot of other stuff.
[08:00:30] <OndraSter_> under what input can that code crash?
[08:00:31] <Brittany> And now when I try to communicate with the board, I just get an initializing error (1)
[08:00:34] <Brittany> -1, sorry.
[08:01:44] <specing> OndraSter_: WTF IS THAT ABOMINATION?
[08:01:55] <specing> that is like the worst coding style I've ever saw
[08:02:05] <OndraSter_> dunno
[08:02:10] <OndraSter_> it is one of many questions
[08:02:11] <OndraSter_> in the test
[08:02:13] <specing> omg
[08:02:23] <OndraSter_> and it is not the last test this semester!
[08:03:29] <specing> refer them to /usr/src/linux/Documentation/CodingStyle
[08:03:46] <Brittany> Actually, it's very similar to the style my university uses.
[08:03:54] <Horologium> Brittany, I know this won't help for now but in the future, have an AVR-Dragon onhand..it can do high voltage programming for the AVR and can reset the fuses even if they are really messed up.
[08:04:10] <Brittany> Thanks Horologium, I'll look into that. :)
[08:04:27] <OndraSter_> Dragon does everything
[08:04:35] <OndraSter_> for AVR cores
[08:04:35] <Horologium> there are a couple of other high voltage reset devices out there too, open source even.
[08:04:46] <Horologium> you just need another AVR to build them around.
[08:05:27] <Horologium> OndraSter_, dragon is a good tool. got mine some time back when atmel had a sale, avrdragon plus stk500 for like 50 dollars.
[08:05:34] <OndraSter_> wow
[08:05:45] <OndraSter_> I am too young for thatk, I got Dragon about 9 months ago
[08:05:47] <Horologium> yeah. less than the cost of either.
[08:05:48] <OndraSter_> *that
[08:06:03] <Horologium> was something like 6 years back when they did that.
[08:06:05] <OndraSter_> specing, actually they are using those abomined Sun servers
[08:06:10] <OndraSter_> I doubt there are linux sources :P
[08:06:21] <OndraSter_> maybe on computers with gentoo it could be there :D
[08:07:24] <Horologium> OndraSter_, that code looks like standard sun code to me.
[08:07:34] <Horologium> sun is what I learned unix on way back when.
[08:08:19] <OndraSter_> :D
[08:09:02] <Horologium> old style C back when C was the shiznit!
[08:09:29] <jadew> OndraSter_, that's C, not C++ and I can't easily follow the logic of that thing
[08:09:32] <Horologium> and back when you used short variable names so as not to fill your harddrive with excess sized source files.
[08:09:47] <jadew> and it can crash due to buffer overflows for one
[08:09:54] <Horologium> only if you allow it to.
[08:10:11] <OndraSter_> jadew, that's why I said C(++)
[08:10:11] <Horologium> C++ can crash due to buffer overflows too unless you specifically limit.
[08:10:30] <jadew> I was talking about the code in question
[08:10:31] <OndraSter_> C++ can crush just when you look bad at the compiler
[08:10:33] <OndraSter_> yes
[08:11:03] <Horologium> if you don't do bounds limiting and checking, C++ is no better than C...and you can do limiting and checking in either one.
[08:11:34] <OndraSter_> or just use more mature language
[08:11:35] <jadew> OndraSter_, if it's an assignment, tell your teacher that in real life you wouldn't have to struggle to understand junk code like that
[08:11:45] <jadew> if someone would write that piece of shit, he'd get fired
[08:11:48] <OndraSter_> jadew, 5 questions in the test
[08:12:11] <OndraSter_> I will write him an email asking "what is this code supposed to be used for? Anybody, who would write such code, should be fired. Immediatily. From an airplane."
[08:12:52] <Horologium> never had to go back on old code and make it work on new systems jadew ?
[08:13:08] <jadew> Horologium, old code doesn't mean junk code
[08:13:20] <jadew> that thing looks like... mindfuck
[08:13:24] <Horologium> more often than not it does.
[08:13:29] <Horologium> in my experience anyhow.
[08:13:32] <Brittany> OndraSter_ sorry but the way that code looks, I could only imagine it was made by one guy. Do you attend the University of Southampton?
[08:13:33] <Horologium> I've seen much worse.
[08:14:01] <OndraSter_> Brittany, it was made by one guy, yes
[08:14:03] <OndraSter_> and no, I am not from the UK
[08:14:06] <Brittany> Bugger.
[08:14:22] <Brittany> And I was saying I could only imagine it was made by one guy that I know of.
[08:14:28] <OndraSter_> (just the question's language :D)
[08:14:29] <Brittany> Because he uses the same style.
[08:14:31] <OndraSter_> lol
[08:14:52] <jadew> the style is not the only thing wrong with it
[08:14:58] <OndraSter_> haha
[08:15:06] <OndraSter_> you are supposed to guess "what's wrong with it"
[08:15:20] <jadew> OndraSter_, aside from that
[08:15:36] <OndraSter_> well, not guess
[08:15:40] <OndraSter_> but figure correctly out
[08:15:40] <jadew> 1) d tmp x i <- shitty variable names for a code that looks like a pile of shit
[08:15:49] <OndraSter_> 2) no comments
[08:15:52] <jadew> 2) no comments about what the code is supposed to do
[08:15:55] <jadew> exactly
[08:16:14] <OndraSter_> http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/24592364.jpg
[08:16:15] <OndraSter_> this sums it up
[08:17:10] <OndraSter_> another question:
http://clip2net.com/s/2t0E4
[08:17:11] <jadew> you can obviously take a good look and add your own comments while trying to understand it, but why give a rat's ass?
[08:17:23] <jadew> if I was supposed to fix this code for work:
[08:17:49] <jadew> 1) I would have said "no, let the guy who wrote it to fix it"
[08:17:52] <OndraSter_> correct answer: "it might probably crash"
[08:18:02] <OndraSter_> (the second question)
[08:18:10] <jadew> 2) if he wasn't with us anymore, I would have said: "This app is junk, we need to make a new one"
[08:18:24] <OndraSter_> hehe
[08:18:43] <jadew> I'm not kidding
[08:19:17] <jadew> trying to work with junk code usually ends up eating more time than it saves you, by not writting the whole thing from scratch
[08:19:37] <Brittany> so may I ask
[08:19:44] <Brittany> if I want the programmer running at a certain frequency
[08:19:48] <Brittany> what command would I throw at avrdude?
[08:19:56] <Horologium> depends on the programmer
[08:20:14] <Brittany> it's a c232hm usb cable.
[08:20:45] <OndraSter_> are you fucking kidding me
[08:20:50] <OndraSter_> there are like 5 versions of this code
[08:20:53] <OndraSter_> that differ in single line
[08:20:54] <OndraSter_> or single number
[08:21:07] <OndraSter_> one crashes, one returns nonexisting fiel
[08:21:08] <OndraSter_> d
[08:21:09] <OndraSter_> and what not
[08:21:11] <OndraSter_> fucking
[08:21:12] <OndraSter_> piece
[08:21:13] <OndraSter_> of
[08:21:15] <OndraSter_> teacher
[08:21:15] <jadew> OndraSter_, then it's time to start adding comments and trying to understand what it does
[08:21:29] <OndraSter_> it is time to get rid of this "teacher"
[08:21:47] <Horologium> Brittany, what programmer do you select in avrdude?
[08:22:35] <Brittany> Horologium: You'll have to excuse me if I may get this wrong, Ir un the line avrdude -c c232hm, so I'd assume ta's the programmer
[08:22:36] <Brittany> that's*
[08:23:41] <Horologium> so, not one of avrdude's standard programmers.
[08:23:50] <Horologium> as it's not listed in my avrdude.conf file.
[08:25:10] <Horologium> so no way for us to know if it is a bitbang programmer or rs232..
[08:25:19] <Horologium> though, from the name, I would guess rs232.
[08:25:22] <jadew> any idea what package the big transistor is using?
http://dumb.ro/files/IMG_0060_.jpg
[08:25:30] <Horologium> based on ftdi chip probably.
[08:26:16] <Horologium> http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/171302/FAIRCHILD/J13009.html
[08:26:30] <jadew> it's not to220
[08:26:40] <Horologium> oh, package.
[08:26:41] <Horologium> umm.
[08:27:15] <Horologium> to264 maybe?
[08:27:21] <Horologium> http://www.siliconfareast.com/to-types.htm
[08:27:23] <jadew> let me check
[08:27:28] <Brittany> what the fuck.
[08:27:41] <Brittany> A clock has been connected
[08:27:44] <Horologium> 26x20 mm
[08:27:52] <Brittany> never mind.
[08:28:23] <Brittany> My hubby connected to the wrong pin
[08:28:48] <Horologium> Brittany,
http://www.nongnu.org/avrdude/user-manual/avrdude_4.html#Option-Descriptions
[08:28:55] <Horologium> the -i option.
[08:29:04] <Horologium> will pause between transitions.
[08:29:11] <Horologium> slowing down the effective rate.
[08:29:19] <Brittany> oh I've been using -B
[08:29:48] <Brittany> what is the delay calculated in?
[08:29:49] <Horologium> if it is an rs232 type programmer then -b
[08:29:52] <Horologium> -B is for jtag
[08:29:54] <Brittany> so what integer value am I passing to it?
[08:30:01] <Horologium> read the page girl!
[08:30:04] <Horologium> it's all right there.
[08:30:14] <Brittany> microsecnds.
[08:30:17] <Brittany> Sorry, my head's in a state.
[08:30:54] <Brittany> so if I want this running at 200khz, then it should be a 5 us delay.
[08:31:14] <Brittany> so avrdude -c c232hm -p m644p -i 5
[08:32:03] <jadew> Horologium, I think you're right, it's probably TO264
[08:32:23] <Horologium> that's close anyhow jadew
[08:32:30] <jadew> yeah
[08:32:36] <jadew> 5.xmm pitch
[08:32:53] <Horologium> some companies do make their own at times too but they are usually close to one of the standards.
[08:33:05] <Brittany> This is really odd.
[08:33:27] <Horologium> Brittany, looks right but may or may not work on your programmer as I have no clue what it is other than that name which means nothing to me.
[08:33:30] <Brittany> I've set the clock up over pin 13 and pin 31.. XTAL1 and GND
[08:33:39] <Brittany> it's functioning at 1MHz
[08:33:53] <Brittany> and it's still an initialization failure.
[08:34:12] <Brittany> initialization failed, rc=-1 ...
[08:34:18] <Brittany> the same issue I've had all along
[08:34:20] <Horologium> and you have power to the chip, yes?
[08:34:48] <Horologium> nothing else connected to the programming lines?
[08:34:58] <Brittany> IT FUCKING WORKS
[08:34:59] <Horologium> nothing else connected to the xtal lines?
[08:35:02] <Brittany> FUCK YOU AVR YOU PIECE OF SHIT YOU FUCKING DO
[08:35:11] <Horologium> ??
[08:35:24] <Brittany> It works.
[08:35:24] <Brittany> :D
[08:35:38] <Horologium> oh..thought you said it was still not working up there.
[08:36:28] <Brittany> it wasn't
[08:36:33] <Brittany> then I forced it to override the check
[08:36:37] <Brittany> whilst writing to the lfuse
[08:36:40] <Brittany> then tahdah, all working
[08:42:12] <Brittany> so currently this thing has an internal RC Oscillator with start up time 6 CK + 65 ms
[08:42:28] <Brittany> However, I have an external oscillator and a couple of capacitors I want to use as a high precision external device.
[08:42:35] <Brittany> Would this be 'External Clock'
[08:42:43] <Brittany> or External Crystal Osc?
[08:52:50] <Brittany> tried and failed.
[08:53:22] <Brittany> now repeating the exact same steps to get this thing doing as it's told, and no go. The thing refuses to initialize and now trying to reset the clock is not working.
[08:54:22] <Horologium> Brittany, you have an external oscillator or crystal?
[08:54:26] <Horologium> there is a big difference.
[08:54:27] <Brittany> crystal.
[08:54:35] <Horologium> so external crystal.
[08:54:38] <Brittany> biggest problem I have is finding the correct start up time.
[08:54:51] <Horologium> I use the longest startup time.
[08:54:52] <Brittany> it'sa 12MHz device, so 8+ MHz
[08:55:00] <Horologium> probably not best practice but it works for me
[08:55:04] <Horologium> yes.
[08:55:26] <Brittany> I don't understand this ' num k ck + num ms' notation
[08:55:36] <Brittany> the default is 6k ck + 65 ms
[08:56:01] <Brittany> so maybe I should go for 16k ck + 65 ms
[08:56:29] <Horologium> if you are worried about short startup time, like, time critical application, then you cut those down.
[08:56:36] <Horologium> otherwise there is no reason to set them to max.
[09:00:15] <Tom_itx> -B32
[09:02:03] <Tom_itx> Brittany, so the external clock fixed it ehh?
[09:02:42] <Tom_itx> those numbers are startup delay for the crystal to stabalize
[09:03:18] <Brittany> Thanks for all your help last night Tom_itx :)
[09:03:38] <Tom_itx> so
[09:03:41] <Tom_itx> what did we learn?
[09:03:42] <Brittany> to be honest I'm just not sure what the numbers mean. ^^
[09:03:54] <Brittany> I learnt that if you fuck shit up, you at least know what you're trying to do.
[09:04:27] <Brittany> See all last night I was of the assumption that I was supply a clock signal to some data input that would default the fuses for some reason.
[09:04:29] <Brittany> I was sleep deprived.
[09:04:43] <Brittany> Then I realized this was just that it lacked a clock, that's why it buggered up
[09:04:51] <Brittany> so applying a clock signal across.. the clock input.. meant I have a clock.
[09:04:59] <Brittany> Now I'm just trying to figure out these numbers
[09:05:50] <Brittany> I think I want the clock to not be divided by 8.
[09:06:05] <Brittany> pretty sure no clock output on PB1
[09:06:17] <Brittany> and pretty sure ext crystal osc @ f 8MHz
[09:06:18] <Tom_itx> default fuses are LF:0x62 HF:0x99 EF:0xFF
[09:06:28] <Brittany> mhm, that's what I wrote it back in as.
[09:06:34] <Brittany> So now the only part that's of confusion to me:
[09:06:38] <Brittany> What to do about that start up time.
[09:06:38] <Tom_itx> and you don't want ckdiv8?
[09:07:19] <Brittany> In my worksheet "Additionally, you will also need to disable the Divide Clock by 8 fuse."
[09:08:18] <Tom_itx> so change LF:0xF7 or LF:0xFF
[09:08:22] <Tom_itx> one of those should work
[09:08:32] <Brittany> alrighty.
[09:08:34] <Tom_itx> what frequency is the crystal you have?
[09:08:37] <Brittany> 12mhz
[09:08:42] <Tom_itx> yeah
[09:08:46] <Tom_itx> those should work
[09:08:56] <Tom_itx> most crystals require caps on them too
[09:09:04] <Tom_itx> like 22pf
[09:09:20] <Tom_itx> we determined you had a crystal right?
[09:09:32] <Tom_itx> not an oscillator
[09:10:06] <Brittany> yep, 22pf
[09:10:12] <Brittany> a crystal oscillator...
[09:10:24] <Brittany> and yeah, on writing 0xFF and F7
[09:10:24] <Tom_itx> do you know where to put them?
[09:10:33] <Tom_itx> across each leg of the crystal to GND
[09:10:37] <Brittany> well it's all on a dev board so it shuoldn't be hard
[09:10:47] <Brittany> yep.
[09:10:52] <Brittany> Still getting an init error
[09:11:40] <Brittany> yeah, in both cases, an init error.
[09:11:55] <Tom_itx> try -B32
[09:11:59] <Brittany> alrighty.
[09:12:03] <Brittany> I've been using -B250
[09:12:16] <Brittany> back in one moment.
[09:12:51] <Tom_itx> SPI clock frequency in KHz = 1000/(1.5+B) where B is the delay value
[09:13:33] <Tom_itx> You can use the -B option to specify the ISP speed. By default the value is 10 which means 100KHz clock, this is good for target clock speeds > 500KHz. If you want the high speed clockrate (400KHz) for target frequencies > 4MHz you can use "-B 1" to speed up programming
[09:14:16] <Tom_itx> In general, the clock frequency should be at least 4 times larger than the target clock frequency. Try "-B 32" if you're having clocking issues, that should handle even 128khz clocks.
[09:15:24] <Brittany> right.
[09:15:26] <Brittany> let's give that a go.
[09:17:08] <Tom_itx> and you put the crystal across BOTH xtal1 and xtal2 pins
[09:19:24] <Brittany> yep.
[09:19:41] <Brittany> Unfortunately every time I set it to use 0xFF with -B32
[09:19:46] <Brittany> or anything, 0xF7 is the same
[09:19:50] <Brittany> I get the same init error.
[09:20:03] <Tom_itx> maybe your crystal isn't working
[09:20:13] <Brittany> any way to test that with a voltmeter?
[09:20:21] <Tom_itx> no
[09:20:29] <Brittany> any way to test that? lol.
[09:20:59] <Tom_itx> the full swing oscillator should make it work
[09:21:06] <Tom_itx> it gives it a bit more voltage
[09:21:10] <Tom_itx> than the other one
[09:23:22] <Brittany> hm
[09:23:26] <Brittany> so 16 ck + 65 ms?
[09:23:28] <Brittany> or something else?
[09:23:43] <Brittany> dont know why I had to disable clock division.
[09:27:36] <Brittany> Tom_itx: attempting to get this thing running but it doesn't seem that any change I make is helping it work.
[09:28:15] <Brittany> there are 2 22pf caps across the crystal legs, leading into both pins.
[09:28:26] <Brittany> and this crystal is brand new, I have no idea why it'd be borked.
[09:28:35] <Brittany> maybe I could resolder.
[09:28:44] <Brittany> but it looks like it makes a fine connection.
[09:42:29] <Tom_itx> P.32 shows the connections
[09:44:02] <Tom_itx> also explains between the 2 different crystal settings
[09:44:17] <Tom_itx> 7.3 .74
[09:44:20] <Tom_itx> 7.4
[09:44:40] <Brittany> hm
[09:45:28] <Tom_itx> the one shown in figure 7-3 is a watch crystal
[09:45:38] <Tom_itx> not for driving the whole chip
[09:45:45] <Tom_itx> rather one specific timer
[09:45:59] <Tom_itx> 32.768 khz
[09:46:24] <Tom_itx> and no caps are used on it, they are internal
[09:46:45] <Tom_itx> don't worry about that one for now
[09:50:57] <Brittany> been looking through this , tom_itx
[09:51:06] <Brittany> I'm afraid it's all mundane information to me. I can't really get my head around it.
[09:53:26] <Brittany> There seem to be two versions of the m644p chip
[09:53:31] <Brittany> would it specify on the chip if it were m644pa?
[09:53:48] <Brittany> would it specify on the chip if it were m644pa?
[09:53:53] <Brittany> oop. sorry.
[09:54:51] <Tom_itx> just variations of the same thing
[09:55:24] <Brittany> aye.
[09:55:30] <Brittany> But I wonder, because the interface for the fuses is so different for the m644p
[09:55:33] <Brittany> and m644pa
[09:56:00] <Tom_itx> shouldn't be much different
[09:56:42] <Tom_itx> the p is probably a later chip
[09:57:05] <Tom_itx> it's to do with operating voltage and frequency
[09:57:20] <Brittany> regardless
[09:57:26] <Brittany> whatever I'm throwing at this chip, it's rejecting.
[09:58:37] <Brittany> would 'external clock' not owrk?
[09:58:38] <Brittany> work*
[10:01:01] <Casper> messed up the fuses? try external clock, if it all fail use a very slow programming speed...
[10:01:24] <Brittany> Casper I've got an external clock going
[10:01:30] <Brittany> and managed to get the fuses back to normal.
[10:01:36] <Brittany> My issue is setting the fuse to use a built in external crystal oscillator.
[10:01:42] <Brittany> Which just doesn't seem to be going odwn.
[10:01:44] <Brittany> down*
[10:02:32] <Tom_itx> you want it back to the original fuse settings?
[10:04:22] <Brittany> no no.
[10:04:27] <Brittany> I have it back to the original fuse settings.
[10:04:31] <Brittany> I just want it to use the external oscillator.
[10:04:35] <Brittany> Perhaps this may help with my explanation.
[10:04:35] <Brittany> http://i.imgur.com/RiOdr.jpg
[10:05:03] <Brittany> the two wires are connected to an arduino board that allows me to switch between using an external oscillator.
[10:05:07] <Brittany> so I use that when I fuck up the fuses.
[10:05:21] <Brittany> I use that to reset to default values
[10:05:28] <Brittany> then remove the arduino power and it functions as expected.
[10:05:33] <Tom_itx> but you don't want both connected at the same time
[10:05:44] <Brittany> I know
[10:05:49] <Brittany> that's why I remove it when I try to set up something new.
[10:06:04] <Brittany> so I remove that
[10:06:14] <Brittany> and then ,through ISP, try and specifyfor it to use that crystal osc you see
[10:06:49] <Tom_itx> you didn't get it too hot when you soldered it in did you?
[10:07:00] <Brittany> Actually my hubby soldered that one in.
[10:07:03] <Brittany> But I doubt it.. :/
[10:07:08] <Tom_itx> k
[10:07:13] <Brittany> he was complaining a little though
[10:07:20] <Tom_itx> we do that
[10:07:22] <Brittany> solderng iron at 300 c.
[10:08:28] <Tom_itx> LF:0x77
[10:08:34] <Tom_itx> leaves ckdiv8 set
[10:09:19] <Tom_itx> LF:0xF7 changes it and sets to full swing xtal osc with max delay
[10:09:33] <Brittany> so I should use 0x77 ?
[10:09:35] <Tom_itx> that should work when others won't
[10:09:44] <Tom_itx> one of those 2
[10:09:47] <Brittany> right o.
[10:09:50] <Brittany> well.. let's give it a go.
[10:09:55] <Tom_itx> the first will give you 1/8 of what you expect
[10:10:06] <Brittany> but it's a good safezone.
[10:10:09] <Brittany> so just
[10:10:33] <Brittany> avrdude -c c232hm -p m644p -U lfuse:w:0x77:m
[10:10:36] <Brittany> or should that include -B something
[10:11:57] <Tom_itx> if any, -B32
[10:12:20] <Tom_itx> is c232hm defined in your avrdude config file?
[10:13:00] <Brittany> initialization failed.
[10:13:13] <Brittany> well.. I'm not sure but I think it would be since I use that to reprogram it and it works..
[10:13:59] <Tom_itx> doesn't seem to be working :D
[10:14:49] <Brittany> This is so unfair. lol
[10:14:55] <Brittany> It does work when I reset the fuse.
[10:16:11] <Brittany> This device is literally Hitler
[10:21:56] <Tom_itx> then i would suspect the crystal
[10:22:06] <Tom_itx> A) defaults work
[10:22:13] <Tom_itx> B) external clock works
[10:22:22] <Tom_itx> C) crystal oscillator does not
[10:22:27] <Brittany> ayeup.
[10:22:41] <Tom_itx> D) you are able to change settings ( programmer works)
[10:22:52] <Tom_itx> or a bad cap
[10:22:58] <Tom_itx> or short in a trace
[10:23:00] <Brittany> you know whta then
[10:23:09] <Brittany> I might as well have a postgraduate student look over this Tuseday evening.
[10:23:11] <Tom_itx> or a borked crystal
[10:23:14] <Brittany> there's no point causing myself this much pressure.
[10:23:25] <Tom_itx> no pressure
[10:23:32] <Tom_itx> it's a good exercise in diagnostics
[10:23:42] <Brittany> good point.
[10:23:47] <Brittany> It's hard to analyze when you have such generic errors.
[10:23:52] <Tom_itx> believe me, you won't forget it
[10:24:03] <Brittany> yeah.
[10:24:06] <Brittany> heh.
[10:24:25] <Brittany> my tutor told me that the greatest key to success is through grinding failure.
[10:24:49] <Brittany> If you can't get through by luck and have to grind out every step, then you've probably been one of the few who understand the material.
[10:25:09] <specing> Heh I know the feeling
[10:25:17] <Brittany> although it is a little frustrating.
[10:25:23] <Brittany> I have other work I'd love to be focusing on.
[10:25:29] <specing> I've spend an hour debugging non-working ethernet bridges yesterday
[10:25:44] <Brittany> sounds like a happy existence. lol
[10:25:48] <specing> turned out one of the interfaces still had an IPv6 address associated, ... lol
[10:26:08] <Tom_itx> wax on... wax off...
[10:26:18] <Brittany> lol.
[10:27:03] <Tom_itx> everyone want's to jump in and do a fabulous project right off without having the fundamentals down
[10:27:11] <Tom_itx> it's my pet pieve with arduino
[10:27:20] <Tom_itx> they don't need to know anything
[10:27:38] <Tom_itx> until they fuck up then they show up here
[10:28:18] <Horologium> abstract abstract abstract.
[10:28:34] <Horologium> abstract everything so you don't have to know the underlying hardware.
[10:30:55] <Brittany> well I've learnt enough this time around.
[10:31:15] <Brittany> sod it. I've worked at least 22 hours on this in the last 2 days.
[10:31:21] <Brittany> I think I deserve a Minecraft break.
[10:32:40] <Tom_itx> that's all?
[10:32:50] <specing> Minecraft?
[10:33:06] <specing> I though people got bored of that pixelated crap already
[10:33:34] <Brittany> what do you mean that's all?
[10:33:37] <Brittany> I only woke up 4 hours ago!
[10:33:38] <Brittany> lol
[10:33:42] <specing> Graphics like we are in the eatly 2000
[10:33:47] <specing> early*
[10:34:02] <Brittany> well specing
[10:34:11] <Brittany> some of us have fun with things that don't need crazy graphics
[10:34:16] <Brittany> I find board games fun.
[10:35:09] <Tom_itx> dev board?
[10:35:15] <specing> :)
[10:37:05] <Brittany> don't give me flashbacks.
[10:41:55] <Horologium> bored games
[10:44:01] <Horologium> playing runecraft myself.
[10:44:08] <Horologium> err
[10:44:10] <Horologium> runescape
[11:00:24] <specing> Horologium: isn't runescape that 1995 flash web game?
[11:00:47] <Horologium> updated
[11:00:49] <Horologium> still flash
[11:01:05] <Horologium> I run it as a local app actually.
[11:01:12] <Horologium> standalone non-browser
[11:01:22] <specing> you do realize 5 of 10 top security vulnerabilities are in flash?
[11:01:42] <Horologium> oh well.
[11:01:49] <Horologium> not like I have it on in my web browsers.
[11:01:54] <Horologium> nor is this machine anything special.
[11:02:15] <Horologium> nothing that needs security on here...it's just a web browser and minimal game machine.
[11:02:22] <Horologium> easy enough to blow it away if it gets fucked.
[11:03:25] <specing> It is still a security threat to the local network
[11:03:44] <specing> unless you have it on a seperate VLAN to your router
[11:03:48] <specing> which I doubt
[11:06:07] <Horologium> the computer I use for doing anything banking wise or whatnot isn't even turned on.
[11:06:42] <Horologium> and if someone wants to hack my irc accounts, good for them...have at it.
[13:16:43] <OndraSter> http://clip2net.com/s/2t4Eo
[13:16:46] <OndraSter> compiles both on win and lin
[13:16:50] <OndraSter> and line numbers are fixed on lin
[13:16:54] <OndraSter> bloody thing
[13:16:55] <OndraSter> same font
[13:16:56] <OndraSter> same font size
[13:17:00] <OndraSter> different line size .
[13:17:04] <Steffanx> And it works on os x too? :)
[13:17:12] <OndraSter> OS X does not support UNITY in vmware :D
[13:17:25] <Steffanx> I'm willing to give it a try
[13:17:38] <OndraSter> I don't have os x compiler by hand
[13:17:46] <OndraSter> os x avr-gcc*
[13:18:33] <Steffanx> Why you need UNITY?
[13:18:49] <OndraSter> so I can drag & drop the .exe from my VS2012 folder
[13:18:56] <OndraSter> and don't have to keep switching to VM etc
[13:19:34] <Steffanx> Oh, THAT unity :)
[13:19:36] <OndraSter> well considering that Mono should be the same on all systems, I am pretty sure it will work on os x too
[13:19:36] <OndraSter> yes
[13:19:37] <OndraSter> THAT unity
[13:19:39] <OndraSter> in VMWare.
[13:19:48] <OndraSter> which else vmware did you mean?
[13:19:50] <OndraSter> err
[13:19:52] <OndraSter> which else unity
[13:19:59] <Steffanx> The .net-ish game engine :P
[13:21:55] <Steffanx> And folder sharing doesn't work either OndraSter ?
[13:23:43] <OndraSter> no idea
[13:23:58] <OndraSter> I don't have working vm with os x :D
[13:24:03] <OndraSter> it stops booting after a week
[13:24:04] <OndraSter> no idea why
[13:24:11] <OndraSter> tried differet images, everything
[13:24:13] <OndraSter> different, even
[13:24:14] <OndraSter> afk
[13:25:29] <Steffanx> bok
[14:59:18] * RikusW just ran a little test, current vs V in excess of Vcc on IO pin
[14:59:30] <RikusW> Vcc = 4v97
[14:59:36] <RikusW> IO pin
[14:59:50] <RikusW> <5v2 0nA
[14:59:58] <RikusW> 5v33 100nA
[15:00:05] <RikusW> 5v4 1uA
[15:00:11] <RikusW> 5v5 10uA
[15:00:35] * RikusW didn't dare push it further :-P
[15:02:59] <jadew> 10uA doesn't sound that bad
[15:03:22] <RikusW> not at all
[15:03:37] <RikusW> my diode tester pass 800uA
[15:03:56] <RikusW> then bottom diode is 646mV and top diode 709mv
[15:04:22] <RikusW> so in theory 5v7 800uA
[15:06:10] <RikusW> so in theory a 2v8 and 3v3 AVR could be connected without level translation
[15:07:57] <OndraSter_> to what
[15:07:57] <OndraSter_> ?
[15:08:18] <jadew> to eachother
[15:08:23] <OndraSter_> to 5V one?
[15:08:25] <RikusW> IO pins on two AVRs running at different Vcc
[15:08:34] <OndraSter_> you could not..?!
[15:08:39] <OndraSter_> 3v3 + 0.6V = 3.9V
[15:08:45] <RikusW> 2v8 and 3v3 should be fine
[15:08:48] <OndraSter_> oh
[15:08:50] <OndraSter_> those yes
[15:09:09] <RikusW> 500mV is fine
[15:09:25] <OndraSter_> yay xmega runs at 32MHz from 2.7V
[15:09:31] <OndraSter_> and upto 12MHz with 1.6V
[15:09:39] <RikusW> nice
[15:09:40] <OndraSter_> I am pretty sure it could do 20MHz on 1.6V just fine :P
[15:10:03] <RikusW> don't undervolt AVRs :-P
[15:10:09] <OndraSter_> :D
[15:11:12] <OndraSter_> yay with 3V it does 0.1uA in sleep :P
[15:11:42] <RikusW> very nice
[15:12:07] * RikusW is still waiting for the coco....
[15:12:07] <OndraSter_> 20mA source/sink
[15:12:13] <OndraSter_> damnit, it hasn't arrived yet?
[15:12:14] <RikusW> slow PO...
[15:12:30] <RikusW> hopefully this week
[15:12:39] <OndraSter_> the week has just ended :P
[15:12:57] <RikusW> and the nano isn't here either...
[15:13:05] <RikusW> maybe it ended up in file13....
[15:14:00] <OndraSter_> wow
[15:14:04] <OndraSter_> DAC can output 10mA
[15:14:05] <RikusW> the week just started today... ;)
[15:14:26] <RikusW> quite enough I'd say
[15:14:32] <OndraSter_> I was expecting nA range :)
[15:14:34] <OndraSter_> maybe uA
[15:14:49] <RikusW> nA is way to low
[15:15:15] <OndraSter_> haha one of my friends told me that their teacher (he is now doing ing. at some uni) told them that flash and eeprom are in 100s of overwrites
[15:15:21] <OndraSter_> so I pointed him to (x)mega datasheet
[15:15:28] <OndraSter_> flash 10k cycles, eeprom 80k cycles
[15:15:29] <OndraSter_> MINIMUM
[15:15:58] <RikusW> what did the teacher say about that ? :-P
[15:16:03] <OndraSter_> no idea
[15:16:06] <OndraSter_> nothing probably yet
[15:16:09] <OndraSter_> it was on friday afternoon :)
[15:16:27] <RikusW> some teachers don't like being corrected :-P
[15:16:32] <OndraSter_> aye
[15:16:37] <OndraSter_> and some are just ... idiots
[15:17:40] <OndraSter_> btw what is up with single ended measurement in unsigned mode?
[15:17:57] <OndraSter_> you have to manually add the ofset?
[15:17:58] <OndraSter_> offset
[15:18:01] <OndraSter_> to the signal
[15:19:01] <RikusW> not read that part of the ds yet...
[15:19:16] <OndraSter_> I can't figure it out from the text :)
[15:19:52] * RikusW is compiling a BOM for the GPS/GPRS pcb
[15:21:12] <OndraSter_> btw RikusW if you haven't seen -
http://clip2net.com/s/2t4Eo
[15:21:30] <RikusW> the docs for the sim900 is in chinese english :-P
[15:21:45] <OndraSter_> :D
[15:21:46] <OndraSter_> chinglish
[15:21:55] <RikusW> :-D
[15:25:05] <RikusW> what tools did you use to make that ?
[15:25:12] <OndraSter_> Visual Studio 2012 :)
[15:25:19] <OndraSter_> using Mono on linux
[15:26:10] <RikusW> I assume the lefthand one is win7 ?
[15:26:29] <OndraSter_> yes
[15:26:31] <OndraSter_> right one is debian
[15:27:26] <RikusW> looks sort of like XP
[15:32:56] <OndraSter_> woot
[15:33:00] <OndraSter_> now it keeps the last indent
[15:33:02] <OndraSter_> of tabs
[15:33:12] <OndraSter_> now, add support for automatic indent for { and } :)
[15:39:25] <RikusW> add support for if() {
[15:39:26] <RikusW> } too ;)
[15:39:46] <OndraSter_> if last line ends with {
[15:39:51] <OndraSter_> next line will have bigger indent
[15:39:55] <RikusW> iirc thats called K&R style
[15:40:00] <OndraSter_> if last line ends with } the next line will have smaller indent
[15:40:01] <OndraSter_> K&R?
[15:40:20] <RikusW> Kernigan and Ritchie
[15:40:39] <OndraSter_> oh
[15:41:24] <RikusW> you got a nice and simple indenting solution :)
[15:41:38] <RikusW> simply counting { and }
[15:42:00] * RikusW likes nice and simple (and lazy :-P )
[15:49:52] <OndraSter_> I am counting \t on previous line :P
[15:49:59] <OndraSter_> { and } would be better solution though
[15:51:25] <OndraSter_> I need to clean up the avr-gcc itself though
[15:51:30] <OndraSter_> I don't need sources, I don't need patches in it
[15:51:33] <OndraSter_> nor documentation really
[15:51:41] <OndraSter_> it has got bloody 220MB or thereabouts :D
[15:51:49] <OndraSter_> comparessed about 17MB :D
[15:52:28] <OndraSter_> http://tempah.myxboard.net/XIDE.7z -- if anybody interested, windows avr-gcc supplied, on linux it won't compile but launch (via mono)
[16:28:56] <OndraSter_> yay, down to 11MB when packed without all the PDFs and man pages
[16:28:59] <OndraSter_> now remove cygwin..
[16:29:45] <OndraSter_> arduino is 88MB packed/240MB unpacked :P
[16:29:49] <OndraSter_> AND IT DOES NOT HAVE LINE NUMBERS!
[16:29:51] <OndraSter_> lol
[16:32:01] <kobsu_> what do you mean no line numbers?
[16:36:03] <Steffanx> It works terrible on os x OndraSter_ :D
[16:41:16] <Steffanx> You're a bad programmer OndraSter_ : System.ArgumentOutOfRangeException: Index and length must refer to a location within the string. :P
[16:41:41] <Tom_itx> :O
[16:47:12] <OndraSter_> Steffanx, doing what?
[16:47:24] <OndraSter_> could be the automatic indent
[16:47:28] <OndraSter_> I haven't tested it yet :P
[16:47:49] <Steffanx> Press enter/return a few times :)
[16:48:12] <OndraSter_> yes, then it is the indent :)
[16:48:15] <Steffanx> Looks like a buggy ident indeed
[16:48:49] <OndraSter_> I wrote it, tested that { and } do what they should and left for the bathtub
[16:49:01] <OndraSter_> there are occasions when it can underflow :P
[16:49:02] <Steffanx> yay
[16:49:05] <OndraSter_> about which I know
[16:49:10] <OndraSter_> like CurrentLine-1...
[16:54:44] <OndraSter_> Steffanx, ah I see, when you do enter on an empty line :P
[17:14:04] <OndraSter_> wtf
[17:14:14] <OndraSter_> why is e.modifiers empty on KeyPress event?
[17:14:17] <OndraSter_> in Mono
[17:16:20] <OndraSter_> WTF
[17:16:38] <OndraSter_> when I press alt-N or alt-O in Mono it wants to create new file or open file :P
[17:16:43] <OndraSter_> and I know that I have not set that
[17:20:41] <jadew> man... I wish double sided PCBs were easy to make
[17:22:04] <jadew> even simple projects with 2 chips and 2 sockets with a bit more pins, tend to be hard to make on single sided PCBs
[17:24:11] <OndraSter_> :P
[17:24:14] <OndraSter_> http://clip2net.com/s/2t7gk
[17:24:17] <OndraSter_> XIDE vs Arduino
[17:25:21] <jadew> how are you handling projects?
[17:25:27] <jadew> are you generating make files?
[17:25:55] <jadew> or just running everything?
[17:26:31] <specing> OndraSter_: Why are you copy-catting arduino?
[17:26:40] <specing> I thought you would make something better!
[17:26:49] <specing> Not some sluggish C++-ish thing
[17:27:05] <OndraSter_> jadew, I just run g++ and then objcopy
[17:27:18] <OndraSter_> specing, I am not copycatting, I AM BEING COMPATIBLE!
[17:27:25] <OndraSter_> I AM CHINA!
[17:30:15] <Casper> OndraSter_: how's the smog?
[17:30:31] <OndraSter_> smog?
[17:38:30] <Casper> no smog in china?
[17:38:46] <Casper> oh nm
[17:46:44] <OndraSter_> I am not in china :P
[17:48:18] <Casper> yeah I reread it... you are china, a cheap, product stealing one :D
[17:49:30] <OndraSter_> :D
[17:49:31] <OndraSter_> http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/546777_10151276166735605_1269804291_n.jpg
[17:49:33] <OndraSter_> hehe
[18:01:13] <OndraSter_> well
[18:01:21] <OndraSter_> embedded systems are ment for 4th semester at my uni
[18:01:25] <OndraSter_> I have subscribed to it for 2nd semester
[18:01:35] <OndraSter_> what is in it? stuff like watchdog, A/D, D/A, ..
[18:01:36] <OndraSter_> lol
[18:01:41] <OndraSter_> worth 5 credits!
[18:02:39] <OndraSter_> I should probably save it for laters maybe
[18:02:57] <OndraSter_> when I will be 5 credits short on some semester
[18:03:01] <ferdna> if you have a X Y Z graphic what would be your FRONT?
[18:03:03] <ferdna> X?
[18:03:08] <OndraSter_> front?
[18:03:14] <ferdna> fordware
[18:03:14] <OndraSter_> X = width
[18:03:24] <OndraSter_> Y = height
[18:03:26] <OndraSter_> Z = depth
[18:06:02] <ferdna> nope
[18:06:07] <ferdna> like in movement
[18:06:30] <ferdna> like in a 3d space
[18:08:52] <Casper> depend on your stuff
[18:09:03] <Casper> inverted axis and what not
[18:09:37] <OndraSter_> depends on how your chip is rotated
[18:09:40] <OndraSter_> and consult it with the datasheet
[18:09:43] <OndraSter_> but logic says "Z"
[18:11:13] <ferdna> cool thanks guys
[18:13:04] <OndraSter_> Casper, why is your nick the same length as ferdna and why did hexchat colour your nick the same colour as ferdna 's? :P
[18:13:20] <OndraSter_> anyway, I am off
[18:13:20] <OndraSter_> gn
[18:13:56] <Casper> because those nick colors are stupidly made
[18:14:02] <Casper> hence why I disabled it
[18:53:07] * Casper bugs rue_house rue_shop3
[19:26:24] <rue_house> whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat
[19:26:46] <rue_house> front
[19:27:14] <rue_house> the viewer looks sees a projection of the xy plane, and stands in -Z
[19:49:28] <Casper> debate: 3D monitor... asus 23" at 239$, polarised technology, so interlaced, but inexpensive glasses (5$, or free if you bring back those at the theater) and have height, tilt and swivel adjustement.... samsung 23" at 329$, active technology so full resolution, expensive replacement glasses (100$), tilt only adjustement...
[19:49:33] <Casper> which one shall I get?
[19:52:05] <Casper> forget the samsung, glossy screen = impossible to see whenever there is ambiant light
[20:19:54] <rue_house> can either of them be controlled by spi?
