#avr | Logs for 2012-05-17

Back
[00:15:10] <Essobi> Sgt_Lemming: I got like 9 328p's in a tube, gearing up to make some shit. :D
[00:15:30] <Sgt_Lemming> Essobi, I might be ordering 200 of them in the near future :-P
[00:15:38] <Essobi> Niiceee
[00:15:50] <Essobi> Anything exotic?
[00:15:56] <Sgt_Lemming> http://www.hsbne.org/projects/SNARC <--- SMD version of this
[00:16:05] <Sgt_Lemming> doing a batch for machine assembly
[00:16:17] <Essobi> Ah.
[00:16:46] <Essobi> I've worked on a bunch of HID VertX's. Heh.
[00:17:02] <Sgt_Lemming> yeah, this is a bit cheaper to implement than the HID systems
[00:17:13] <Essobi> haha, try alot
[00:17:17] <Sgt_Lemming> <$100 per door
[00:17:19] <Essobi> And you have to give them a kidney for the SDK
[00:17:26] <Sgt_Lemming> and that's fully implemented
[00:17:36] <Essobi> RS-485?
[00:17:59] <Sgt_Lemming> ethernet
[00:18:05] <Essobi> <100 for strikes or mags?
[00:18:11] <Sgt_Lemming> strikes
[00:18:17] <Essobi> right
[00:18:41] <Sgt_Lemming> also has the advantage of you can plug sensors into the board
[00:18:48] <Sgt_Lemming> things like light or temp sensors
[00:18:49] <Essobi> I personally don't like strikes cause they can be picked but that's just me.
[00:18:57] <Essobi> Interesting.
[00:19:01] <Sgt_Lemming> so you can do environmental monitoring as well
[00:19:54] <Essobi> Right.. I'm in the midst of planning an RS-485 network for environmental/occupation/automation.. I'll take a look.
[00:20:31] <Essobi> Heh, yea, that's pretty bare bones.
[00:22:08] <Essobi> I don't suppose there's as much blowback on those strikes then mags thou huh?
[00:22:30] * Sgt_Lemming nods
[00:22:40] <Essobi> Yea, you don't need much.
[00:22:56] <Sgt_Lemming> blowback is one of my concerns with this board, hence the big chunky diode right behind the mosfet.
[00:23:20] <Essobi> I've got an ARM920T I'm wiring up as a RS-485 master, and I'm going to slave a bunch of 328s off a powered bus I'm thinking.
[00:23:29] <Sgt_Lemming> cool
[00:24:04] <Essobi> I want to zone my house with it.
[00:24:39] <Essobi> Been playing around with environmental sensors mostly.
[00:24:56] <Essobi> speaking of, I need to order some new ones.
[00:25:07] <Essobi> Since my prototype has gone poof.
[00:25:12] <Sgt_Lemming> you could do bodge PoE with these boards :-P
[00:25:16] <Essobi> Hmm.. where to order from these days?
[00:25:20] <Sgt_Lemming> effectively bus powered
[00:25:24] <Essobi> Sgt_Lemming: Ooh, yea.
[00:25:33] <Sgt_Lemming> digikey is my normal source
[00:25:40] <Essobi> Sgt_Lemming: Still.. I don't need that much bandwidth.
[00:26:13] <Essobi> RS-485 is cheap and fast enough for me, and one-wire runs of those 328ps, I should be able to do about anything.
[00:26:19] <Sgt_Lemming> heh
[00:26:26] <Essobi> Hmm.. what's digi's turn around these fays?
[00:26:28] <Essobi> days?
[00:26:46] <Sgt_Lemming> pretty decent, us one ships me parts here in australia in about a week
[00:26:56] <Essobi> nice
[00:27:08] <Essobi> I havn't ordered from them in years
[00:27:26] <CapnKernel> Me neither! :-D :-D :-D
[00:29:16] <Essobi> What about futurlec?
[00:31:10] <Essobi> lulz.. reviews are awful
[01:02:28] <drgreenthumb> is there a standard pinout for a TPI programmer header? I've got Tom_itx's programmer here with a TPI header but no info on site about it.
[01:05:41] <drgreenthumb> aha! nevermind. it's in http://www.atmel.com/Images/doc8373.pdf "AVR Hardware Design Considerations"
[07:02:24] <inflex> yeah, probably the 10pin one?
[07:02:57] <inflex> my standard came about because I followed the Mega8 PDIP pins... now it's all set in my designs... but it works on the mega TQFPs as well reasonably well
[07:03:01] <inflex> RST is always a pain to route though
[07:13:55] <Tom_itx> if it's TPI it's 6 pin
[07:14:03] <Tom_itx> and there's a pinout on my site
[07:35:29] <mitsakos> hello, i had shown you before my new iv-11 vfd tube clock. today i finished a wooden case for it if you want check my photo strema ;) http://www.flickr.com/photos/developthefuture/sets/72157629759768326/
[07:35:47] <OndraSter_> niceee
[07:36:25] <OndraSter_> it needs night photos :)
[07:36:52] <mitsakos> if i take night photos i think that they will be not that clear with my camera
[07:37:18] <mitsakos> it will have noise
[07:38:45] <mitsakos> has anybody used ebay for selling new things? i'm thinking to sell some of these clocks
[07:41:31] <da78> mitsakos: nice!
[07:43:04] <mitsakos> thnx
[07:59:58] <inflex> oooh, silly me... TPI... not ISP
[08:27:22] <OndraSter_> omg atmel studio 6 keeps freezing every 4th launch :(
[08:27:25] <OndraSter_> and avrdbg with it
[08:53:20] <razec> Hi folks
[09:01:28] <CapnKernel> razec: Hi! Like totally tell us about your project!
[09:03:15] <OndraSter> :)
[09:03:29] <specing> hahah
[09:03:34] <CapnKernel> OndraSter: 8 more days before I'm back in SZ!
[09:03:42] <CapnKernel> I'm getting pumped now.
[09:03:49] <specing> rue_mohr: We have found a replacement for your bot
[09:04:00] <razec> CapnKernel: my project?.. I am working in the w5100 webserver, only it so far.. =)
[09:04:18] <CapnKernel> specing: Hi! Like totally tell us about the bot replacement! :-)
[09:04:24] <OndraSter> CapnKernel, cg
[09:04:25] <razec> ahhaha
[09:04:29] <razec> nice BOT
[09:05:02] <CapnKernel> (razec: We have a bot who when someone says "hi", usually says "tell us about the project". Seems the bot's not online now, so I thought I'd do it instead)
[09:05:09] <CapnKernel> !seen tobbor
[09:05:09] <tobbor> tobbor is here
[09:05:18] <specing> CANUCK is that right
[09:05:18] <tobbor> YANKIE!!!!
[09:05:34] <specing> That's how you test for its presence
[09:05:37] <CapnKernel> tobbor you lazy son of a gun, the dude said hi and you slept through it!
[09:06:02] <specing> That's because he hasn't joined like 3s ago
[09:06:16] <CapnKernel> Oh I see.
[09:06:20] <CapnKernel> hi
[09:06:21] <specing> Hi!
[09:06:28] <specing> Hi
[09:06:28] <CapnKernel> not you, tobbor!
[09:06:31] <specing> Hello
[09:06:40] * CapnKernel laughs. People are staring...
[09:06:58] <specing> WHERE IS EVERYONE?!?!111oneoneone
[09:07:29] <Casper> specing: hiding from you, or running away, see ya later!
[09:07:32] <Casper> (job time)
[09:07:38] <CapnKernel> You are in a spacious chamber, with a high dome ceiling. There are exits to the north and west. There's a carpet on the floor.
[09:07:42] <specing> tobbor is CANUCKED
[09:07:42] <tobbor> SOMEONE MAKE HIM SHUT UP! or I'll cry.
[09:07:57] <specing> LOL
[09:13:32] <OndraSter> http://clip2net.com/s/1VIGg
[09:13:39] <OndraSter> something I always wanted to try out =)
[09:13:43] <OndraSter> DRAM @ atmega
[09:17:58] <specing> you mean SPAGHETTI @ atmega?
[09:18:08] <OndraSter> why spaghetti? Too much wires eh?
[09:18:12] <OndraSter> it is 30 pins after all :)
[09:18:28] <specing> Dude, that's not how you wire up a DRAM to your mega
[09:19:16] <OndraSter> ?
[09:19:23] <OndraSter> this is regular old 30pin SIMM momdule
[09:19:24] <OndraSter> module
[09:21:16] <specing> I know
[09:21:21] <specing> I have tons of those here
[09:21:49] <OndraSter> so do I
[09:22:59] <OndraSter> how do you wire it up then?
[09:44:43] <DarkSector> Hello folks
[09:44:52] <OndraSter> hello
[09:44:52] <tobbor> Hello OndraSter
[09:45:02] <OndraSter> tobbor, are you a bot or a retard?
[09:45:03] <OndraSter> or both?
[09:45:08] <DarkSector> what's cracking?
[09:45:12] <DarkSector> or cooking
[09:45:15] <DarkSector> either way is fine
[09:45:37] <OndraSter> DarkSector, specing has some better way of connecting 30pin SIMM module to AVR other than... with wires. But he refuses to say how :P
[09:45:52] <DarkSector> specing: c'mon be a sport man
[09:45:54] <DarkSector> tell us
[09:46:24] <DarkSector> Has anyone used the ISP MKII with Mac OS X?
[09:48:59] <specing> DarkSector: Simple, buy SPI ram
[09:49:04] <OndraSter> oh
[09:49:06] <DarkSector> oh
[09:49:08] <DarkSector> heh
[09:49:09] <OndraSter> ..
[09:49:23] <DarkSector> also DanFrederiksen I thought you just idled on ##electronics
[09:49:26] <specing> I have a 32K SPI ram chip here
[09:49:27] <CapnKernel> Can someone show me some SPI RAM?
[09:49:34] <OndraSter> SPI SRAMs are fairly common
[09:49:40] <OndraSter> but they won't go to much high sizes
[09:49:44] <CapnKernel> Would be useful for doing things like FAT FS and sound processing
[09:49:52] <DanFrederiksen> DarkSector ?
[09:49:59] <DarkSector> DanFrederiksen: supp
[09:50:07] <OndraSter> plus they are goddamn slow to access - even with 32MHz SPI you need 8 peripheral clocks for it to receive data!
[09:50:11] <DanFrederiksen> extraterrestrial vehicles
[09:50:14] <OndraSter> not to count the amount you need for sending address :)
[09:50:14] <specing> OndraSter: I don't think you will find 30 pin SIMM modules going to much high sizes either...
[09:50:19] <DarkSector> nice
[09:50:22] <specing> OndraSter: unless you mean literal size
[09:50:25] <OndraSter> upto 16MB, specing
[09:50:30] <DanFrederiksen> still unclear if it is nice
[09:50:56] <OndraSter> this is half megabyte I have got here
[10:49:19] <OndraSter> hmm how do PCs with SIMM memories find out how much memory does it contain? It is hard because they must actually try it out :)
[10:49:26] <OndraSter> rather know it by reading something like I2C
[11:05:48] <OndraSter> hah
[11:05:50] <OndraSter> it WORKS! :)
[11:05:57] <Steffanx> it
[11:06:00] <OndraSter> when I single step through the programm and the memory doesn't refresh, it reads 0xFF
[11:06:07] <OndraSter> but when I let it run and refresh, it returns the value I put there! :P
[11:06:30] <OndraSter> now why is UART on PortD which I need :(
[11:07:55] <OndraSter> oh well, arduino will make good UART-SPI bridge :)
[11:10:45] <OndraSter> screw that, I will rather free up the tx and rx pins! lol
[13:30:38] <RikusW> specing: so are you from slovenia ? ;)
[13:44:27] <seba-> lol
[13:57:35] <specing> RikusW: Ah, freenode went CANUCKED :)
[13:57:35] <tobbor> SOMEONE MAKE HIM SHUT UP! or I'll cry.
[13:58:21] <specing> tobbor: Cry me a river
[13:58:33] <Steffanx> CANUCK
[13:59:27] <specing> Ha
[14:08:09] <RikusW> what is the netsplits anyways ?
[14:08:37] <dehuman> huh?
[14:08:44] <dehuman> whats with?
[14:08:48] <dehuman> or what is a netsplit?
[14:09:02] * specing splits dehuman in half with a net
[14:09:08] <mimcpher> RikusW: Freenode is hosted on many servers. A netsplit is when some of the servers lose contact with each other
[14:09:24] <mimcpher> RikusW: Usually that happens because of an internet failure, or a "hub server" failing.
[14:09:59] <specing> Or a drunk op sleeping on his keyboard
[14:11:04] <RikusW> unlikely :-P
[14:11:30] <RikusW> mimcpher: guessed something like that
[14:12:18] <mimcpher> So you see half the channel leave, but those people see the other half leave
[14:12:26] <mimcpher> so for a while, the channel is split into two.
[14:14:01] <specing> Parallel universe!
[14:14:47] <RikusW> specing: so at last your cloak lifted for a split second :-P whois did the rest...
[14:17:03] <specing> I imagine you've been waiting for a long time to see where I'm from
[14:17:24] <RikusW> yeah ;)
[14:17:47] <RikusW> since you're so secretive about your location...
[14:17:57] <RikusW> having us all guessing..
[14:22:22] <seba-> lol
[14:54:34] <other019> hi eveyone
[14:55:05] <other019> anybody's here?
[14:55:07] <Tom_itx> you're just other 19
[14:55:13] <Tom_itx> how many are there?
[14:55:27] <other019> nope
[14:55:53] <other019> can U answer me to an easy uestion?
[14:55:59] <Tom_itx> maybe
[14:56:09] <Tom_itx> got any money?
[14:56:27] <other019> nope i'm just student :P
[14:56:34] <Tom_itx> ok, i'll try anyway
[14:57:31] <other019> DDRB=0xFF;
[14:57:31] <other019> DDRD=0x00;
[14:57:41] <other019> PORTB = 0xFF;
[14:57:41] <other019> PORTD = 0x00;
[14:58:17] <other019> im trying to connect LED to atmega8 PORTD minuses PORTB pluse
[14:58:25] <other019> PORTB longer leg
[14:58:39] <Tom_itx> why?
[14:58:48] <Tom_itx> ground one leg or tie it to 5v
[14:58:48] <RikusW> you set portd as input...
[14:58:49] <other019> LED MATRIX
[14:58:54] <Tom_itx> then switch the other pin
[14:58:59] <Tom_itx> oh
[14:59:05] <RikusW> and do remember a resistor in series with the led...
[14:59:11] <Tom_itx> charlieplex?
[14:59:14] <OndraSter> for LED matrices I suggest using external drivers for +
[14:59:21] <OndraSter> if we are talking 8x8 etc
[14:59:31] <other019> ofcourse 8x8
[14:59:36] <OndraSter> well, FETs
[14:59:49] <OndraSter> I'm running 32x48 dual-color (thus 32x96 pixels) myself :)
[14:59:56] <OndraSter> made out of 8x8
[15:00:00] <other019> wow
[15:00:08] <RikusW> nice
[15:00:22] <other019> but for now (nearest electronic shop 20km) how to do it?
[15:00:25] <OndraSter> https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=40BF7833586103AB!499&authkey=!AM9BlG3lYBLJUqs
[15:00:48] <OndraSter> just quickly switching them off and on
[15:00:52] <OndraSter> refreshing row by row
[15:01:07] <specing> OndraSter: Man, get a decent image hoster
[15:01:13] <Steffanx> At least it's not facebook!
[15:01:15] <specing> Or setup yourself a server
[15:01:15] <OndraSter> what's wrong on skydrive?
[15:01:16] <OndraSter> :P
[15:01:20] <Steffanx> So be happy specing
[15:01:26] <specing> It doesen't even load for me
[15:01:27] <other019> i know about multiplexing i was using it with 7 segments LED
[15:01:38] <OndraSter> specing, fix your interwebz then :P
[15:01:40] <specing> Isn't live.com microshit?
[15:01:44] <OndraSter> it is
[15:01:46] <OndraSter> well not
[15:01:47] <Steffanx> Microsoft yes
[15:01:48] <OndraSter> it is MicroSOFT
[15:01:48] <RikusW> DDRB = DDRD = 0;
[15:01:48] <RikusW> PORTB = PORTD = 0xFF;
[15:01:49] <RikusW> then you can turn on one led at a time by setting the appropriate DDR bits
[15:01:50] <Steffanx> but it's not facebook, so it's ok
[15:01:59] <specing> No shit it doesen't work
[15:02:01] <OndraSter> my phone automatically uploads to skydrive.
[15:02:09] <OndraSter> specing, it works for everybody else :P
[15:02:34] <OndraSter> it also works in IE6... :P
[15:02:50] <RikusW> other019: avr pins can only give 20mA and 40mA MAX
[15:02:56] * specing finds a cable
[15:03:04] * specing strangles OndraSter
[15:03:16] <OndraSter> RikusW, that's fine, if he limits the current to few mAs
[15:03:25] <OndraSter> even with 2 - 5mA average current it shines a lot
[15:03:32] * specing hooks the other end of the cable to his car and drives by microsoft HQ
[15:03:38] <OndraSter> I am pumping 70mA through the LEDs for really short amount of time
[15:04:16] <other019> that's right because i will turn on only one at the same time
[15:05:12] <RikusW> other019: err one port need to be high the other low... then set one bit in DDRD and one in DDRB
[15:05:14] <OndraSter> why not turn on whole row at once? :)
[15:05:36] <other019> is to smal voltage i think
[15:05:44] <RikusW> if it uses only a few mA per led it should work
[15:06:14] <other019> or I'd better i don't thinking because i do it better
[15:07:03] <OndraSter> btw, how come that capacitors do weird sounds when there is high current being switched?
[15:07:11] <OndraSter> it is low esr, 2200uF I think
[15:08:47] <mrfrenzy_> they act as speakers, moving at the same frequency as your current
[15:08:56] <OndraSter> capacitors move?
[15:09:00] <OndraSter> I have soldered then :P
[15:10:19] <OndraSter> coils - sure
[15:10:21] <OndraSter> but capacitor..
[15:13:09] <other019> fuck yeah
[15:13:15] <other019> it's working hah
[15:13:27] <other019> so next question
[15:14:28] <other019> is posible to have 3dimensions table in flash [THANK YOU VERY MUTCH]
[15:14:32] <other019> *MUCH
[15:15:48] <RikusW> you can probably put any const array in flash...
[15:18:41] <other019> if i want to make animations it il be tab[x][y][frame], maybe bools
[15:19:13] <other019> or tab[y][frame]; y=0x05
[15:20:06] <other019> OndraSter: have U more photos of this display
[15:20:12] <OndraSter> like?
[15:20:13] <other019> ?? is so cool
[15:20:19] <other019> or any movie
[15:20:58] <OndraSter> there should be other photos on that skydrive link
[15:21:07] <other019> do U make animations on it?
[15:21:17] <OndraSter> nah
[15:21:30] <OndraSter> I'd need to always transfer whole animation first and then launch it
[15:21:36] <OndraSter> the refreshing is taking huge amount of CPU time
[15:21:47] <OndraSter> and the UART doesn't receive and process data fast enough
[15:21:47] <other019> nope there is only one
[15:21:52] <OndraSter> oh
[15:22:02] <OndraSter> this is the only photo where I used multiple shades of each color
[15:22:12] <other019> PWM?
[15:22:19] <OndraSter> nope
[15:22:23] <OndraSter> just don't blink it sometimes :)
[15:22:29] <OndraSter> skipping theb eat
[15:22:32] <OndraSter> skipping the beat
[15:22:43] <other019> i was thinking about flash or eeprom
[15:22:56] <other019> ant timer0 overflow
[15:23:03] <other019> to go to next frame
[15:23:35] <OndraSter> :)
[15:23:52] <OndraSter> my interrupt that shows new line runs... let me count it
[15:24:05] <other019> U are from Hungary? i from poland
[15:24:09] <OndraSter> no
[15:24:10] <OndraSter> I am from CZE
[15:24:34] <other019> so it's quite close
[15:24:45] <other019> i'm from sulech�w near Zielona g�ra
[15:25:18] <OndraSter> so, each line gets around 330 refreshes per second (!!)
[15:25:27] <other019> wow
[15:25:30] <OndraSter> 5273 times per second runs the refreshing interrupt
[15:25:44] <other019> what's CPU
[15:25:46] <OndraSter> it takes almost 50% of whole CPU load
[15:25:47] <other019> ?
[15:25:51] <OndraSter> atmega128a only
[15:25:56] <OndraSter> I wish I saw that xmega256a3u sooner
[15:26:01] <OndraSter> it is cheaper and way more powerful
[15:26:14] <other019> why not arm?
[15:26:39] <OndraSter> because AVR :)
[15:27:45] <other019> ok it's Ur choise? so have U any video or more photos? Because it's just awesome
[15:28:15] <OndraSter> I don't want to do much with it untill I present it at school since it is my final exams project :P
[15:28:18] <OndraSter> I have one older vid
[15:28:36] <OndraSter> https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=40BF7833586103AB!467&authkey=!APjNBy-jqZqssLQ
[15:28:44] <OndraSter> back from when I had only one shade of color
[15:28:53] <OndraSter> and was testing brightness settings
[15:29:00] <OndraSter> (you can control the brightness on this thing as well)
[15:29:09] <other019> How old R U? I'm just 15.
[15:29:13] <OndraSter> 19
[15:29:29] <OndraSter> some photos from build:
[15:29:30] <OndraSter> https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=40BF7833586103AB!455&authkey=!AOTU0vShzt4G1Qg
[15:29:41] <OndraSter> https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=40BF7833586103AB!451&authkey=!AK5xR4DMvjTdxVs
[15:29:45] <OndraSter> (testing shift registers)
[15:29:59] <OndraSter> https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=40BF7833586103AB!448&authkey=!AGuB16eO19kc7sk big mess o' wires :)
[15:30:14] <OndraSter> http://sdrv.ms/J16DqN
[15:30:14] <other019> I love wires
[15:30:16] <OndraSter> this is better
[15:30:31] <OndraSter> testing mainboard: http://sdrv.ms/JzBPDp
[15:31:04] <OndraSter> shift boards: http://sdrv.ms/J16Dao
[15:31:25] <other019> PCB is termotransfe?
[15:31:26] <OndraSter> power boards: http://sdrv.ms/JjEzUT (later stripped the SMPS and used just one 3.7V battery instead)
[15:31:29] <OndraSter> no
[15:31:31] <OndraSter> professionaly made
[15:31:51] <OndraSter> "sockets" soldered and waiting for LED matrices: http://sdrv.ms/J16JPc
[15:31:51] <other019> awesome
[15:32:15] <OndraSter> mainboard in closeup (missing decoupling caps and headers): http://sdrv.ms/JjEQah
[15:32:16] <drgreenthumb> heh that looks expensive =)
[15:32:19] <OndraSter> note the 16MHz xtal
[15:32:32] <OndraSter> no idea what's wrong with it - they made the chassis of the xtal already this bad lol
[15:32:36] <OndraSter> I didn't notice it till I soldered it
[15:32:38] <drgreenthumb> how much are those little LED matricies these days?
[15:32:45] <OndraSter> $35 for 25 modules
[15:32:52] <drgreenthumb> last I saw they were riduclous at sparkfun
[15:32:54] <drgreenthumb> ah nice noe
[15:32:55] <drgreenthumb> one
[15:33:00] <OndraSter> that's pretty much all photos I've got
[15:33:02] <rue_mohr> specing, is it written in C?
[15:33:17] <other019> thank you very much
[15:33:20] <OndraSter> on another note, I was playing with nixies, I have a big load of them:
[15:33:20] <OndraSter> http://sdrv.ms/J16PGw
[15:33:29] <OndraSter> http://sdrv.ms/J16Rya
[15:33:39] <other019> nixies ae cool too
[15:33:40] <OndraSter> :)
[15:33:49] <OndraSter> I have got two types, the first one is bigger
[15:33:50] <OndraSter> much bigger
[15:33:56] <OndraSter> I have 8 or 9 of those
[15:34:01] <OndraSter> the second ones I have about 6
[15:34:13] <other019> what's Ur programming language?
[15:34:17] <rue_mohr> ah, heh
[15:34:22] <OndraSter> depends on the target, other019
[15:34:30] <OndraSter> the LED matrix = completely in assembler
[15:34:36] <OndraSter> some test projects are in C
[15:34:43] <OndraSter> the DDS I am working on will be in C++ even
[15:34:44] <other019> wow Ur awesome
[15:34:53] <OndraSter> that's what she said lol
[15:34:58] <drgreenthumb> heh
[15:35:27] <OndraSter> now I am combining asm with C
[15:35:28] <other019> so i want to know how U started with asm from AVR or x86?
[15:35:30] <OndraSter> as a test
[15:35:49] <OndraSter> well, loooong time ago when I was 14? 13? friend tought me basics of x86 asm
[15:35:58] <OndraSter> jumps, branching, ...
[15:36:06] <Tom_itx> OndraSter is a led wiz
[15:36:11] <OndraSter> then I went on to AVR
[15:36:22] <OndraSter> well, before that I disassembled some drivers for Windows Mobile phones, that was ARM
[15:36:38] <OndraSter> and build the only project which made me onto engadget front page :P
[15:39:09] <other019> what was that because i can not find it?
[15:39:24] <OndraSter> pinch to zoom for resistive displays
[15:41:25] <OndraSter> and the goddamn AVR ASM within C project just doesn't like me
[15:41:32] <OndraSter> I am doing it _exactly_ like in this tutorial
[15:41:33] <OndraSter> http://www.nongnu.org/avr-libc/examples/asmdemo/isrs.S
[15:41:36] <OndraSter> in this file
[15:41:43] <OndraSter> Error 1 expected identifier or '(' before '.' token c:\users\ondra\documents\atmel studio\DRAMc\DRAMc\DRAM.s 28 1 DRAMc
[15:41:48] <OndraSter> the interwebz doesn't help
[15:41:57] <OndraSter> the line?
[15:41:58] <OndraSter> .global OVF0ADDR_vect
[15:41:58] <OndraSter> OVF0ADDR_VECT:
[15:42:01] <OndraSter> the .global
[15:42:51] <OndraSter> (note that fixing it to both say _vect doesn't help
[15:51:48] <OndraSter> ignore me
[15:51:50] <OndraSter> my fault
[16:06:23] <OndraSter> FINE
[16:06:24] <OndraSter> finally
[16:06:54] <OndraSter> appearantly macro lo8 exists and LO8 doesn't
[16:08:48] <OndraSter> now just why SEI instruction doesn't set I flag
[16:12:15] <OndraSter> hell even C call to sei(); doesn't work!
[16:14:51] <OndraSter> real device works just fine.
[16:15:44] <specing> OndraSter: ASM dump or GTFO
[16:15:53] <OndraSter> ?
[16:16:17] * specing slaps OndraSter with the AVR instruction set reference
[16:16:25] <OndraSter> sure
[16:16:35] <OndraSter> but it doesn't explain why SEI instruction works on mega itself
[16:16:36] <OndraSter> but not in emulator
[16:17:43] <specing> OndraSter: lol emu
[16:18:55] <RikusW> which emulator ?
[16:19:03] <OndraSter> the stock one in Atmel Studio 6
[16:19:08] <OndraSter> for mega32
[16:19:11] <RikusW> hmm odd
[16:19:18] <OndraSter> yeah.
[16:19:47] <OndraSter> http://clip2net.com/s/1VPBl
[16:19:52] <OndraSter> step after SEI and I is not set
[16:19:57] <RikusW> I noticed the timers not working right in AS5 simv1 but it works in v2
[16:20:21] <OndraSter> the interrupt fires up when I manually set the I flag
[16:20:28] <OndraSter> should I report that to abcmu? :)
[16:20:34] <OndraSter> or at least ask him when he comes around
[16:20:41] <RikusW> good idea
[16:21:43] <OndraSter> eh
[16:21:44] <OndraSter> actually
[16:21:47] <OndraSter> #include <avr/io.h>
[16:21:48] <OndraSter> #include <avr/interrupt.h>
[16:21:48] <OndraSter> int main(void)
[16:21:48] <OndraSter> {
[16:21:48] <OndraSter> sei();
[16:21:49] <OndraSter> while(1)
[16:21:51] <OndraSter> {
[16:21:52] <OndraSter> asm volatile("nop\r\n");
[16:21:55] <OndraSter> }
[16:21:56] <OndraSter> }
[16:21:59] <OndraSter> this does not set the I flag either
[16:22:11] <OndraSter> the bug is obvious
[16:22:15] <OndraSter> Y U NO INTERRUPTS!
[16:22:17] <OndraSter> :P
[16:22:58] <OndraSter> the same when I replace sei(); with direct asm instruction
[16:22:58] <OndraSter> asm volatile("sei\r\n");
[16:23:09] <OndraSter> anybody can pls try it in older avr studio?
[16:23:14] <OndraSter> I have already uninstalled it all
[16:29:48] <OndraSter> Tom_itx, can you please try it out too? The problem with Dragon firmware upgrade seems that happened only to me
[16:30:29] <RikusW> OndraSter: did you set the timer or whatever elses interrupt bit too ?
[16:30:37] <OndraSter> in my project - yes
[16:30:38] <RikusW> I is the global bit
[16:30:41] <OndraSter> yes
[16:30:57] <RikusW> other irqs need a bit in some register somewhere
[16:31:02] <OndraSter> when you set the I bit and then check processor view
[16:31:04] <OndraSter> and the I bit is NOT set
[16:31:09] <OndraSter> there IS something fishy going on
[16:31:27] <RikusW> sounds like it
[16:31:37] <RikusW> I could check in AS4
[16:31:49] <RikusW> but I'm running debian right now....
[16:34:52] <Xata> Hi
[16:35:05] <OndraSter> hi
[16:35:05] <tobbor> Hello OndraSter
[16:35:09] <OndraSter> Xata, you on windows?
[16:35:15] <OndraSter> KILL TOBBOR'S WELCOMING omg
[16:35:23] <OndraSter> Xata, are you on windows?*
[16:35:45] <OndraSter> I need one bug confirmed in avr/atmel studio whether it happens to you too :)
[16:36:25] <Xata> Xata: i am on windows. om irssi. in cygwin. in urxvt
[16:36:38] <OndraSter> (duh)
[16:36:45] <OndraSter> do you have avr/atmel studio by your hand?
[16:36:50] <Xata> yup
[16:36:54] <OndraSter> okay
[16:36:58] <OndraSter> let me send you one project
[16:37:02] <OndraSter> do you have as6?
[16:37:13] <Xata> what is as6?
[16:37:16] <Xata> maybe i do
[16:37:18] <OndraSter> atmel studio 6
[16:37:25] <Xata> 5.1
[16:37:36] <OndraSter> ah ok
[16:37:41] <OndraSter> then you will have to create new project :)
[16:37:55] <OndraSter> http://pastebin.com/kyk5TiXQ
[16:38:02] <OndraSter> create pls new project and put there this code
[16:38:14] <Xata> studio 6 is there? got to get it. meanwhile gibe that sourcecode. for which avr i have to compile?
[16:38:23] <OndraSter> I am trying it on mega32
[16:38:33] <OndraSter> then launch it in emulator and step to the asm volatile("nop")
[16:38:48] <OndraSter> then open processor view -> CPU
[16:38:51] <OndraSter> and tell me, if I flag is set
[16:38:56] <OndraSter> thanks :)
[16:39:50] <OndraSter> yep, tried now on tiny13 - doesn't set the I flag either
[16:40:40] <OndraSter> same for xmega128b1
[16:40:42] <OndraSter> simulator
[16:41:55] <Xata> OndraSter: it is set
[16:42:02] <OndraSter> hmm it must be AS6 bug then
[16:42:09] <OndraSter> when you upgrade, tell me pls :)
[16:42:26] <OndraSter> hah I found AS5.1 actually here as well
[16:44:20] <Xata> OndraSter: i have a question about electronics. you know some?
[16:44:25] <OndraSter> not much
[16:44:53] <OndraSter> yep, in AS 5.1 the flag gets set
[16:45:27] <Xata> OndraSter: anyway. i have a pot for 100k, that i manually control by hands, 1 and 2 are connected, 3 is not. how do i control it with voltage?
[16:45:42] <OndraSter> 1 and 2 and 3 what?
[16:46:43] <Xata> OndraSter: i mean legs one and two of pot are connected, so there is one output and one input on pot, not + - and out
[16:46:55] <OndraSter> oh
[16:47:05] <OndraSter> there will be three pins: low, high and the wiper
[16:47:15] <OndraSter> low goes to GND, high goes to Vcc, wiper goes to ADC
[16:48:29] <Xata> OndraSter: this is not what i am about, i am controlling op-amp, not adc. i want this op-amp to be controlled with generated osc from another atmega (LFO for WUBWUBWUB)
[16:49:00] <OndraSter> what is it supposed to be doing? controlling the amplification?
[16:49:15] <Xata> OndraSter: controlling the filter cutoff
[16:49:20] <OndraSter> oh
[16:49:25] <OndraSter> active filter?
[16:49:29] <Xata> yup
[16:49:40] <OndraSter> okay, I do not know anything about active filters, sorry
[16:50:17] <Xata> OndraSter: but i this is not main point. main point is how do i amplitude-modulate the signal?
[16:50:46] <OndraSter> ehhh.... you are asking the wrong guy :[
[16:51:03] <Jagged> use a mixer?
[16:53:37] <Xata> Jagged: but i need the modulation to be done by voltage. so carrier is output from one atmega and modulator is output from another. first one is high-frq osc, second is lfo
[16:57:59] <Xata> OndraSter: Jagged: here is the picture. instead of thousands of words. http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/66/needed2.jpg
[16:58:21] <Jagged> FLT?
[16:59:27] <Xata> Jagged: filter
[16:59:32] <Jagged> ok
[17:00:18] <Jagged> what are you trying to do?
[17:01:25] <Xata> Jagged: this is an active low-pass filter for my synth project. i am trying to controll the cutoff of this filter with atmega32
[17:01:40] <Jagged> ok
[17:02:13] <Jagged> assuming your filter is controlled through voltage
[17:02:44] <Jagged> you can use FETs to do what you need
[17:03:44] <Jagged> it would essentially be a voltage amplifier, with the gain control based on the ADC output
[17:04:10] <Xata> Jagged: it is typical sallen-key filter. but thru that pot as far as i understand goes not just voltage but the wave form of osc that is connected to this filter
[17:05:06] <Xata> Jagged: fet is for field-effect transistor?
[17:05:17] <OndraSter> ye
[17:05:32] <Jagged> yeah
[17:05:38] <Xata> i am jut trying to get it so i can translate to my native language
[17:06:17] <Xata> uh. but will it amplitude-modulate, not just cut the tops of incoming wave?
[17:06:33] <Jagged> I'm not sure what you want to do
[17:07:21] <Xata> second
[17:07:36] <Jagged> also, I'm more of an RF engineer than an audio engineer... so I'm not very well versed in opamp useage
[17:08:09] <Xata> Jagged: look at this picture http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3f/Sallen-Key_Lowpass_General.svg/400px-Sallen-Key_Lowpass_General.svg.png
[17:08:36] <Jagged> yeah
[17:08:58] <Jagged> so you have a LPF, and you're trying to dynamically change the cutoff frequency?
[17:09:19] <Xata> Jagged: R2 in adjustable design is pot that controll cut-off of lpf, and i want to replace it somehow
[17:09:28] <Jagged> oh
[17:09:31] <Jagged> just use a FET
[17:09:37] <Jagged> when biased properly
[17:10:00] <Jagged> they can be used to tune for a certain voltage drop
[17:10:00] <Jagged> but
[17:10:14] <Jagged> I don't think that would work too well if your input level varies greatly
[17:10:25] <Jagged> so scratch that suggestion
[17:11:19] <Xata> Jagged: it varies from 0 to 5v
[17:11:24] <Jagged> yeah
[17:11:28] <Jagged> so a simple FET won't work
[17:11:50] <Jagged> unless you want nonlinearity
[17:12:00] <Jagged> anywho
[17:12:14] <Jagged> dynamic filtering is the subject of a lot of current research
[17:12:22] <Jagged> there is no cheap way to make a dynamic filter
[17:12:39] <Steffanx> DSP :)
[17:13:06] <Jagged> Steffanx: and organizations tend to skimp on the DSP...
[17:13:18] <Jagged> engineer specifies 1GHz DSP... and gets a 100MHz instead >_>
[17:13:31] <Xata> Jagged: well, i alwaus can do steiner filter, but i want op-amps and no adjusting it from +/-12 to 0...+5
[17:14:02] <Xata> if someone some day need it i found this http://www.ka-electronics.com/images/pdf/Steiner_Filter.pdf
[17:14:46] <Jagged> and DSPs can't handle that much power
[17:15:04] * Jagged was working with some tunable hardware filters capable of dissipating 10W a few months ago
[17:16:31] <Jagged> Xata: you could also instead look at modifying C2 in the filter
[17:17:08] <Jagged> some type of varicap, or an air-core cap attached to a servo
[17:22:04] <Xata> Jagged: how about this? sane? http://www.instructables.com/id/Make-a-Voltage-Controlled-Resistor-and-Use-It/
[17:22:52] <Jagged> technically speaking...
[17:22:58] <Jagged> that is a current controlled resistor
[17:23:09] <Jagged> because an LEDs output is based on current
[17:23:26] <Jagged> but you're looking in the right direction
[17:24:03] <Xata> but nah. on 600hz tone with sometime up to 50khz sampling frq this led will do some bad trash
[17:38:17] <Sordna> OndraSter, microchip makes some nice spi sram chips... http://www.microchip.com/ParamChartSearch/chart.aspx?branchID=27012&mid=&lang=en 256Kbit or 32K*8bit serial sram.
[17:38:35] <OndraSter> 32k*8 is something absolutely different than 4M*8 :)
[17:39:03] <Sordna> true.
[17:39:11] <specing> I have the 256k one
[17:39:25] <Sordna> and, I have done 1M*8bit SIPPS with an AVR in the past.
[17:39:27] <OndraSter> $1.44 for 1pcs on mouser
[17:39:29] <OndraSter> vs free @ home :)
[17:39:37] <Sordna> OndraSter, free on microchip.com samples.
[17:39:42] <OndraSter> hmm samples
[17:39:48] <Sordna> gotta love samples.
[17:39:51] <OndraSter> :D
[17:39:52] <Sordna> and microchip is great for them.
[17:39:58] <Sordna> one thing they do better than atmel.
[17:40:02] <OndraSter> ADI too
[17:40:24] <Steffanx> No, Atmel does it 'better' Sordna :P
[17:40:48] <Sordna> harder to get samples from atmel than from microchip....they are pickier...at least, some of their reps are.
[17:41:16] <Sordna> microchip does it mostly automated where atmel gets your local rep involved and my rep here is an a** about getting me samples.
[17:41:18] <Xata> bye
[17:41:30] <Steffanx> Yeah, afaik that sample service isn't meant for cheap ass hobbyists :P
[17:42:13] <Sordna> my rep out in new hampshire was great and got me some nice stuff...even got me stuff I didn't ask for.
[17:42:26] <Sordna> "Here, try this and tell me what you think."
[17:45:07] <drgreenthumb> just tell the rep you're raising AVR awareness. "I'll tell two people about AVR and .. they'll tell two people.. and that's like four people right there!" :P
[17:48:54] <OndraSter> :D
[17:57:49] <drgreenthumb> ok here's an idea. I've got 4x of http://search.digikey.com/us/en/products/MRF24J40MA-I%2FRM/MRF24J40MA-I%2FRM-ND/1867972 I'd gladly send someone two of them if anyone's interested in writing a truely free (and very small) network stack to run on top of it, mostly in C. might be fun for a bored student over summer. ferserious inquiries only :)
[17:59:46] <drgreenthumb> oh and I could send a BumbleB or two along with it, got a few laying around.
[18:01:26] <Jagged> drgreenthumb: you know microchip has an API for MiWi?
[18:01:28] <drgreenthumb> oh yeah and I'm not actually asking here for someone to do all the work. just be my wingman :)
[18:01:46] <drgreenthumb> Jagged, I'd prefer OSS. does that actually run on AVRs?
[18:01:50] <Jagged> no
[18:01:53] <drgreenthumb> heh
[18:02:00] <Jagged> but if you look at their PicdemZ code
[18:02:04] <Jagged> it doesn't use the API
[18:02:57] <drgreenthumb> doesn't use the PIC api you mean? so it's just generic C mostly, waiting to hook it up to SPI?
[18:03:05] * drgreenthumb could try that
[18:03:06] <Jagged> yep
[18:03:07] <Jagged> https://github.com/via/ece4534
[18:03:10] <drgreenthumb> interesting
[18:03:24] <Jagged> that's a project I worked on this past semester
[18:03:31] * Jagged digs up youtube video
[18:04:08] <Jagged> http://youtu.be/qxAOY3wMIyw
[18:13:22] <drgreenthumb> hmm video not loading for me. boo.
[18:14:05] <Steffanx> It didn't for me either, .. a reload fixed it
[18:14:16] <Jagged> ^^
[18:14:58] * Jagged is the narrator-dude
[18:15:09] <drgreenthumb> ah there it goes
[18:15:33] <Steffanx> Is it an uni project or .. what is it Jagged ?
[18:15:41] <Jagged> yeah
[18:15:56] <Jagged> that project was assigned to us
[18:16:19] <Jagged> I was a double-major between CpE and EE
[18:16:31] <Steffanx> You look quite old for a student :P
[18:16:35] * Jagged is 29
[18:17:08] <drgreenthumb> oh heh it's pronounced "mywi" I was saying "mewe"
[18:17:35] <Steffanx> So how you pronounce WIFI ?
[18:17:54] <drgreenthumb> heh I didn't give it much thought actually. only just recently found that stack on wiki :P
[18:18:36] <drgreenthumb> I like this Microchip module though, it's neat. even managed to get some header pins on it for breadboarding.
[18:18:54] <Jagged> my responsibilities in that project was management, pcb design, and the math
[18:19:35] <Jagged> when we made that video... we had received our pcbs and parts 10 days prior
[18:20:33] <Jagged> the git repo has my board design... some errors on it... but many features
[18:20:50] <Jagged> pwm leds to reduce power consumption
[18:21:02] <Jagged> two accessory/debug headers
[18:21:07] <Jagged> three vregs
[18:21:20] <Jagged> rf isolation for the miwi module
[18:22:22] <Jagged> i2c, spi, uart, and power all on the 10 pin header
[18:22:49] <Jagged> i had a logic analyzer that i could plug in and watch all the traffic on the board
[18:24:21] <Jagged> drgreenthumb: if you have questions about the MiWi stuff, I can get the guy who did all the PIC programming to pop in here
[18:24:54] <drgreenthumb> Jagged, cool I may hit you up later. for now, not writing a full stack, just interfacing with the module directly to see if I can do some point to point RF :)
[18:25:42] <drgreenthumb> seems simple enough. 10 or so init registers, then just push 802.15.4 packets out and fiddle a couple registers to get it to send. it's so simple, it'll never ever work :P
[18:26:03] <Jagged> the initialization is a PITA
[18:26:23] <drgreenthumb> I'll skip the beacon enable stuff and the security features
[18:26:28] <drgreenthumb> so that should simplify a bit
[18:26:47] <Jagged> we did broadcast packets
[18:27:19] <Jagged> and we utilized an unused data field to specify the originator address
[18:27:19] <Jagged> not the "correct" way to do it
[18:27:19] <Jagged> but it worked for our uses
[18:27:19] <drgreenthumb> heh nice hack :)
[18:37:00] <OndraSter> okay
[18:37:04] <OndraSter> I found another bug in Atmel Studio 6
[18:37:08] <OndraSter> which I have NO idea why it happens :(
[18:37:17] <OndraSter> anyway, it is when you change some value that you #define in .h
[18:37:22] <OndraSter> and include this .h into .s
[18:37:38] <OndraSter> the change won't be reflected till you clean the build folder (aka delete Debug folder)
[18:37:39] <OndraSter> oh well
[18:37:41] <OndraSter> :(
[18:37:44] <OndraSter> at least now I know it works
[18:38:00] <OndraSter> this is compiler problem appearantly
[18:38:06] <OndraSter> .. let me setup another test project lol
[18:39:19] <OndraSter> http://clip2net.com/s/1VQur
[18:39:22] <OndraSter> BUT IT WORKS!
[18:39:23] <OndraSter> :)
[18:41:11] <OndraSter> Atmel should employ me as a bug seeker
[18:42:20] <OndraSter> btw, I took apart my 1st phone's battery because it has exactly 0V... and this is what I found :o http://clip2net.com/s/1VQv2
[18:56:44] <drgreenthumb> the lumps and corrosive acid make it work better.
[18:58:01] <OndraSter> yeah, fukushima with corrosive acid works great =)
[18:58:12] <drgreenthumb> teehee
[19:11:24] <OndraSter> btw, when I found out that there is no /OE pin on 30pin SIMMs, I was quite "wtf"
[19:11:36] <OndraSter> but reading up on the interwebz worked
[19:11:40] <OndraSter> TEH INTERWEBZ ROLZ
[19:38:17] <ferdna> dont know where else to ask...
[19:38:53] <ferdna> anyways i bought a 90 Amp Wire Welder
[19:38:55] <ferdna> http://www.harborfreight.com/welding/mig-flux-welders/90-amp-flux-wire-welder-68887.html
[19:39:00] <ferdna> ...
[19:39:10] <ferdna> i dont know how to start welding...
[19:39:54] <ferdna> oh wait
[19:39:55] <ferdna> Weldable materials: Mild, low alloy steel (not suitable for aluminum or stainless steel)
[19:56:02] <Sordna> drgreenthumb, you looking for a stack on the avr to run on that module?
[19:56:33] <drgreenthumb> Sordna, yeah possibly. or to write one.
[19:57:00] <drgreenthumb> the MiWi stuff Jagged posted looks intersting
[20:08:17] <drgreenthumb> oh but Sordna that's just a crazy idea with no practical applications in mind. I'm *also* making a remote for my TV with 2 of these, and I'll probably opt to just send raw packets.
[20:08:50] <Sordna> I like the nordic modules myself.
[20:08:58] <Sordna> from sparkfun.
[20:09:24] <drgreenthumb> bit expensive :)
[20:10:31] <Sordna> I bought a bunch of the first gen when they were being deprecated by the second gen chips and got them cheap, about 12 bucks each.
[20:22:19] <Sordna> MiWi looks interesting...wish I had more time to work on a stack for it for the avr.
[21:45:44] <mimcpher> Does anybody know where I can buy an empty Expresscard/34? I want to cram at Atmega in one
[21:47:41] <mimcpher> I might just buy an expresscard serial port adapter, since I assume it must not have much inside.
[22:14:49] <Tom_itx> ferdna, that's 20% duty at 90A
[22:15:20] <Tom_itx> for lighter metals (thinner gage)
[22:16:25] <Tom_itx> i'm told that flux wire splatters alot
[22:16:40] <Tom_itx> i've got some but have not used it yet, i generally use gas on mine
[22:17:21] <Casper> if those weren'T that expensive I'ld have got one
[22:17:42] <Tom_itx> that thing on harbor freight??
[22:17:48] <Casper> don'T know what I'ld have done with it, btu ow well
[22:17:49] <Casper> no
[22:17:51] <Tom_itx> i would get a heavier one
[22:17:53] <Casper> real one
[22:18:01] <Tom_itx> i got a small miller
[22:18:13] <Tom_itx> it's 220v though
[22:18:21] <Tom_itx> not 110 like the smaller ones
[22:18:47] <Casper> we need some with an huge supercap!
[22:18:50] <Landon> things that could probably weld if you get them to arc: http://www.siemens.com/innovation/pool/de/news_events/inno-2012/inno_fo_1204_1.jpg
[22:18:59] <Landon> :>
[22:19:17] <Casper> landon :D
[22:19:36] <Casper> but really, if "too much current" wouln't exist for welding... 2 SLA in series
[22:19:45] <Tom_itx> Casper, http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/intel_atom/miller.jpg
[22:20:08] <Casper> nice small unit
[22:20:59] <Tom_itx> yeah, it's big enough for the stuff i do
[22:21:14] <Casper> tomorrow I might do some car work
[22:21:22] <ferdna> Tom_itx, yeah, Harbor Freight....
[22:21:23] <Casper> suspension on 4 wheels
[22:22:11] <Tom_itx> ferdna, the other thing is how well the feed mechanism is made
[22:22:20] <Tom_itx> that's one reason i got the miller over a lincoln
[22:22:29] <Casper> oh?
[22:22:38] <Casper> lincoln isn't that great?
[22:23:07] <ferdna> i thought lincoln was the best...
[22:23:14] <ferdna> what was wrong with the feeding mechanism?
[22:23:27] <Tom_itx> Casper no, the feed mechanism is better on the miller
[22:23:40] <Tom_itx> more metal parts instead of plastic
[22:23:45] <Casper> ok
[22:24:41] <Tom_itx> it does pretty well
[22:24:59] <Tom_itx> i welded the pipes and I beam on my patio cover with it
[22:25:20] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/patio/patio_index.php
[22:29:35] <Casper> probably better than what I did
[22:31:28] <Tom_itx> it was some of the first welding i'd done with wire feed. it took a bit to get used to it over stick welding
[22:32:03] <Tom_itx> it's still standing if that counts
[22:33:06] <Tom_itx> one thing i had a bit of trouble with outdoors was the gas not shielding the metal pool that well
[22:33:38] <Tom_itx> since we nearly always have wind here
[22:39:22] <Casper> I really need to find a good place to host my pics
[22:39:28] <Casper> imageshack is just too slow
[22:39:55] <Casper> and picasa... I don't get a good feeling
[22:40:17] <Casper> Tom_itx: http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/2020/img2753y.jpg ← ok, not welding... but still not great
[22:40:50] <Casper> the torch was slightly too cold
[22:41:02] <Tom_itx> i'd say so
[22:41:15] <Casper> or too much thermal mass
[22:41:23] <Casper> or not enought...
[22:42:03] <Tom_itx> you almost need oxy for brazing
[22:42:25] <Tom_itx> you can do the good silversoldering with a torch
[22:43:13] <Casper> that was mapp
[22:43:24] <Tom_itx> i figured
[22:43:33] <Tom_itx> regular doesn't get hot enough
[22:44:14] <Casper> the important part is: the burners are now repaired
[22:44:43] <Casper> one of the 4 burners had only flame on the first 1/4 section!