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[03:30:35] <Sgt_Lemming> http://pastebin.com/kzjC7C2e
[03:30:52] <learningc> is there something like snap to grid in eagle?
[03:33:31] <raek> learningc: hold CTRL while you click (with the move tool), I think
[03:34:01] <raek> assuming you have set up the grid the way you want
[03:38:56] <CapnKernel> Sgt_Lemming: LOL
[04:04:13] <Landon> Sgt_Lemming: that's awesome
[04:13:20] <Roklobsta> Is Sue a douchebag/
[04:13:22] <Roklobsta> ?
[04:54:02] <Tom_itx> learningc, yes
[04:54:11] <Tom_itx> look under the grid settings dialog
[04:55:06] <CapnKernel> The hardest thing about being a douchebag, is finding the doucheshoes to match.
[05:03:28] <theBear> hehe
[05:05:49] <Metalsutton> anyone here that could help me?
[05:10:02] <ziph> Metalsutton: What's your question?
[05:13:25] <Metalsutton> Oh hi
[05:14:15] <Metalsutton> I have a downloaded hex file (proven to work) that is a db9 to usb convertor. I have programmed the chip and hooked everything up (atmega8)
[05:16:00] <Metalsutton> I have the device reconizing in windows. However when i goto use the controller (mega drive / genesis), when i press just the "left" button it triggers EVERY button press. all other buttons do not do anything :/
[05:16:46] <Metalsutton> I have a feeling the signal from the controller isnt being read correctly and therefore the chip may be operating at an unusual freqency?
[05:17:02] <Metalsutton> (I have checked all connections)
[07:10:41] <mitsakos> hello, i have a question about C language and functions. If there is a function function_name(uint8_t variable_name) also there is a uint8_t table_name[10][1] is it correct to call the function_name(table_name[2][0]) ? will it take as argument the container of table_name[2][0]?
[07:15:49] <raek> mitsakos: function_name(table_name[2][0]) is correct and means "look up the value at (2, 0) in the matrix and call function_name with it"
[07:16:18] <raek> function_name receives the value at that place, not the "container"
[07:19:54] <mitsakos> receives the value that is stored in table_name[2][0]
[07:19:56] <mitsakos> write?
[07:20:03] <raek> yes
[07:20:07] <mitsakos> ok thank you
[08:06:05] <dirty_d> got a big box-o-goodies from hong kong
[08:10:29] <CapnKernel> oh?
[08:11:01] <dirty_d> yup
[08:11:11] <dirty_d> motors, batteries and ESCs
[08:11:13] <dirty_d> good news
[08:11:22] <dirty_d> the ESCs run on a mega8
[08:11:37] <dirty_d> so if the response is too slow i can always reprogram them
[08:11:46] <dirty_d> i got a really nice charger too for like $20
[08:11:57] <dirty_d> charges like every kind of battery with all kinda of options
[08:12:03] <dirty_d> and a power analyzer
[08:12:28] <CapnKernel> Niiice
[08:12:31] <CapnKernel> Toys!
[08:12:41] <dirty_d> yea
[08:13:14] <dirty_d> hopefully my boards come today
[09:06:21] <cyanide> AAAAAAA f1 is back
[09:06:40] <Steffanx> F1 as in formula one?
[09:14:23] <cyanide> yea
[09:14:34] <cyanide> free practice sessions today
[09:53:26] <CapnKernel> cyanide: Cool, where do we sign up?
[10:04:02] <Steffanx> Somewhere is Australia this time CapnKernel
[10:04:45] <CapnKernel> In my city:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_Grand_Prix
[10:05:00] <CapnKernel> The race is around a lake.
[10:05:11] <CapnKernel> I'm a member of a sailing club on that lake :-)
[10:07:11] <asteve> i'm a fan of philip island, i would like to turn a wheel in anger there before i die
[10:07:56] <CapnKernel> That place is heaven for bike lovers
[10:08:05] <asteve> it is
[10:08:18] <asteve> long sweeping corners, beautiful views
[10:09:47] <asteve> http://i.imgur.com/iv1VU.jpg me at our local track
[10:11:00] <CapnKernel> asteve: From the Oz F1 article: "it is generally accepted that the Australian Grand Prix began [...] at the original Phillip Island road circuit in 1928"
[10:11:30] <CapnKernel> Sweet
[10:13:42] <asteve> the daytona 200 superbike qualifying is going on right now
[10:14:02] <asteve> terrible american television won't air it; so i'm stuck looking at live scoring
[10:21:31] <CapnKernel> asteve: Not a lot of ground clearance in that pic :-)
[10:24:29] <Steffanx> amee2k what's wrong?
[10:24:38] <asteve> nope, and the suspension wasn't set up properly for my….uh….fascination with beer :)
[10:33:51] <cyanide> asteve, thats a lovely bike
[10:33:57] <cyanide> which one is it?
[10:34:20] <asteve> Suzuki SV650 with an Yamaha R1 front end
[10:34:31] <asteve> s/an/a/g
[10:35:25] <cyanide> i bought my first bike about 3 months ago
[10:35:38] <cyanide> a honda cbr250r
[10:36:18] <asteve> nice
[10:36:20] <cyanide> CapnKernel, what city are you from?
[10:36:39] <cyanide> f1 used to be in adelaide before melbourne
[10:36:47] <asteve> always remember to look where you want to go :)
[10:36:47] <CapnKernel> Melbourne
[10:37:01] <CapnKernel> Otherwise you may make a puddle on the floor
[10:37:25] <cyanide> haha, it takes a while to trust the bike completely
[10:38:02] <cyanide> i was riding mine at about 45 kph, tried some fancy leaning for a turn. the road was built using tiles
[10:38:22] <cyanide> ended up scratching the footpeg and my toe on the road because the rear wheel slipped
[10:38:35] <cyanide> would've lowsided if i wasnt lucky :)
[10:39:07] <cyanide> is that a scratched up helmet asteve?
[10:39:29] <asteve> uh….probably the son but it had been down before
[10:39:33] <asteve> sun*
[10:39:36] <cyanide> ok
[10:39:50] <asteve> it's been retired
[10:39:59] <cyanide> CapnKernel, you should make it to the next f1 race in melbourne next year
[10:40:09] <CapnKernel> I went once before, never again
[10:40:15] <CapnKernel> Unbelievably noisy
[10:40:16] <cyanide> deaf?
[10:40:18] <cyanide> haha
[10:40:48] <CapnKernel> I have been to airshows with B-52s, F-117s, F-15s etc, and I think the Gran Prix was louder.
[10:40:57] <cyanide> even we have to wear earplugs, and our engines only rev upto 10k rpm
[10:41:00] <CapnKernel> Yes I'm somewhat deaf
[10:41:06] <cyanide> they're further away from you though, the planes
[10:41:12] <CapnKernel> Almost completely deaf in the left ear, somewhat in the right.
[10:41:18] <CapnKernel> Caught a virus about 10 years ago
[10:41:22] <cyanide> ouch
[10:41:24] <asteve> electric bikes/cars are the future of racing, it's sad to think people will never hear and feel combustion engines revving up to 17k
[10:41:40] <cyanide> i doubt that
[10:41:55] <cyanide> methanol will rise
[10:42:02] <asteve> methanol is already in racing
[10:42:42] <asteve> there will still be a series including combustion engines but the premier classes will eventually turn to electric motors
[10:42:54] <asteve> powered by batteries, super caps, whatever
[10:43:40] <CapnKernel> Not going to happen
[10:44:07] <CapnKernel> Predicated on the notion of perpetual just-as-it's-always-been lifestyle
[10:44:14] <Steffanx> No, races are going to be forbidden
[10:44:15] <cyanide> depends on the economics, honestly
[10:44:16] <CapnKernel> Our luxurious first-world way of living has a use-by date, and it's coming near.
[10:44:34] <cyanide> as long as the petrolheads have money, it won't stop
[10:44:42] <cyanide> though the price will go up
[10:44:52] <asteve> the TT Zero is an electric only race series for bikes
[10:45:14] <asteve> when they start getting as fast as the current combustion crop they will infect like a virus
[10:45:15] <cyanide> ive got a friend who has built an electric bike
[10:45:22] <cyanide> races it on the laguna seca track
[10:45:31] <asteve> probably for TT Zero
[10:45:41] <asteve> i've wanted to build one for awhile
[10:45:54] <cyanide> probably not
[10:45:59] <cyanide> he's even got pedals on it lol
[10:46:32] <cyanide> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX-ki3pP8YU
[10:47:04] <cyanide> it's a cycle with a motor on it
[10:47:14] <asteve> awesome
[10:47:49] <CapnKernel> Yay I can *actually watch* youtube videos at the moment!
[10:48:25] <Steffanx> how so?
[10:49:43] <CapnKernel> Because I'm in HK, no net censorship
[10:51:54] <CapnKernel> What an awesome sound...
[10:52:23] <cyanide> the fun starts after 6:00
[11:01:49] <CapnKernel> Had you done that circuit before in video games?
[11:02:06] <cyanide> laguna seca?
[11:02:12] <cyanide> thousands of times
[11:02:54] <CapnKernel> How did it compare in real-life to the games?
[11:03:09] <cyanide> oh, i havent been there in real life
[11:03:13] <CapnKernel> Did your leet gaming experience help you better understand the track? Or it just can't compare, nothing can compare you?
[11:03:18] <CapnKernel> So who is on that bike?
[11:03:31] <cyanide> my friend, liveforphysics
[11:03:33] <cyanide> luke
[11:03:42] <cyanide> he's the one into electric bikes and all
[11:04:02] <CapnKernel> Maybe it's fairer to say it's a motor with a bike attached
[11:04:06] <cyanide> i wouldn't touch electric stuff until the last drop of petrol is used up. lol
[11:04:24] <cyanide> i designed our local tracks in rfactor and had a go
[11:04:26] <dirty_d> cyanide, you know that guy?
[11:04:36] <dirty_d> he was on a forum i used to go on
[11:04:41] <dirty_d> when i was building my electric bike
[11:04:43] <CapnKernel> Ok, so have you been in the situation where you've played a circuit in games, then done it for real?
[11:04:52] <cyanide> yes and yes
[11:05:01] <CapnKernel> And how did it compare?
[11:05:11] <cyanide> dirty_d, he was/still is partially into hondas. that's how i came across him
[11:05:12] <dirty_d> cyanide, have you seen kilacycle?
[11:05:38] <cyanide> CapnKernel, eerily similar. but you dont have the feedback from the car apart from what you get via the force feedback on the steering wheel
[11:05:42] <CapnKernel> Lol, this is like saying "well I simulated it in spice, but it wasn't until the hot smell of pine resin was wafting past my nostrils that I realised ..."
[11:06:01] <cyanide> its really nice to know the entry and exit speeds and gears before you get to the track
[11:06:23] <cyanide> the final setup still requires actual seat time and practice on the actual track
[11:06:31] <cyanide> dirty_d, nope
[11:06:43] <inflex> CapnKernel: burning violins again?
[11:07:35] <CapnKernel> inflex: Asking that is like the infamous "are you still beating your wife?" question. And regarding the first time, you weren't supposed to tell!
[11:08:00] <dirty_d> cyanide,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbi1RhgRrxk
[11:09:05] <dirty_d> id love to build an electric drag car
[11:09:17] <cyanide> holy crap
[11:09:21] <dirty_d> yea lol
[11:10:00] <cyanide> you have the advantage of less weight. as long as it just has to do 400m plus the trip back to the pits
[11:10:29] <Kevin`> perfectly controlled accelleration too
[11:10:35] <dirty_d> yea
[11:10:39] <Kevin`> none of that messy clutch stuff
[11:10:59] <dirty_d> and its just cool too, lol
[11:11:43] <dirty_d> i wonder how big of a supercapscitor youd need for a 1/4 mile
[11:15:36] <dirty_d> well say it puts out 500hp for 10 seconds
[11:15:59] <dirty_d> lets see
[11:16:32] <CapnKernel> Oh I spoke to that guy!
[11:16:47] <CapnKernel> He had his bike on display in Wellington New Zealand
[11:16:49] <dirty_d> 3.7 million joules
[11:17:08] <asteve> you benefit greatly from constant full torque
[11:17:26] <asteve> racers spend a bajillion hours to limit the amount of time between shifts and to generate the most amount of torque
[11:17:37] <asteve> electric motors solve that problem
[11:18:55] <dirty_d> hmm
[11:19:04] <dirty_d> 30 farads at 500V
[11:19:13] <dirty_d> would give you 3.7 million joules
[11:19:37] <dirty_d> youd probably want double that
[11:20:07] <Kevin`> that's a pretty doable number
[11:20:11] <dirty_d> yea i know
[11:20:23] <dirty_d> those maxwell supercaps are 3000 farads and 2.7v
[11:21:25] <dirty_d> it would take 340 of them for 3.7 million joules
[11:21:25] <dirty_d> lol
[11:23:44] <dirty_d> tahts 382 pounds
[11:24:01] <dirty_d> i guess lithium ion would be a lot better
[11:24:59] <OndraSter> duh, soldering on school-made board withotu silkscreen and 1000 years old copper is not as easy as one would think
[11:25:07] <OndraSter> and all is through hole
[11:25:46] <dirty_d> sand it
[11:27:21] <chupas> yay just got my AVR one
[11:27:26] <chupas> and this thing is HEAVY
[11:27:26] <Steffanx> Yay
[11:27:30] <Steffanx> You ordered it
[11:27:31] <cyanide> avr one?
[11:27:40] <Steffanx> Yeah, only 200$ nowadays
[11:27:43] <chupas> was just delievered
[11:27:45] <cyanide> nice
[11:28:06] <Steffanx> 200$ + 40$ shipping chupas ?
[11:28:11] <chupas> yup
[11:28:19] <dirty_d> jeez
[11:28:28] <dirty_d> is it made out of pure gold?
[11:28:33] <Steffanx> uh?
[11:28:36] <dirty_d> whats it do
[11:28:50] <Steffanx> programming/debugging avrs
[11:28:58] <chupas> ISP, debug the whole avr line
[11:29:12] <Steffanx> Can it do Atmels ARM's too?
[11:29:40] <chupas> im not sure, but i thought i read a post saying that if it cant now, its in the works to do in the future
[11:32:20] <OndraSter> dirty_d, sandpapering requires copper layer
[11:32:26] <OndraSter> these are CCCP boards LOL
[11:32:57] <dirty_d> soviet?
[11:32:58] <dirty_d> lol
[11:34:39] <amee2k> Steffanx: dunno, you tell me? :)
[11:36:20] <OndraSter> yeah, soviet lol
[11:36:29] <OndraSter> with original photoresist layer!
[11:36:54] <OndraSter> and those bollocks at the store forgot to put the NPN transistor inside the bag...
[11:37:01] <OndraSter> I didn't check it ofc
[11:37:09] <OndraSter> now I need to go around the hosue and find some NPN
[11:37:51] <OndraSter> old TV has many of them... but soldered! :P
[11:38:12] <dirty_d> what store?
[11:38:25] <dirty_d> ive never in my life been to a store that sold transistors besides radioshack
[11:38:26] <OndraSter> local
[11:38:34] <dirty_d> where are you from?
[11:38:38] <OndraSter> Prague
[11:38:41] <dirty_d> ahh
[11:39:09] <OndraSter> hmm old power supply is gonna be better choice.. they have long legs uncut :P
[11:40:18] <Steffanx> You are so quiet amee2k :P
[11:41:50] <CapnKernel> In Soviet Russia, old circuit board resists YOU!
[11:42:53] <OndraSter> haha
[11:51:09] <amee2k> Steffanx: is that a problem?
[11:51:10] <amee2k> :)
[12:32:26] <Steffanx> Who knows amee2k ?
[12:32:51] <CapnKernel> Personally, or on #avr?
[12:33:07] <Steffanx> I meant "Who knows, amee2k"
[12:33:32] <CapnKernel> LOL
[12:36:44] <amee2k> >_>
[12:37:15] <amee2k> Addy_: because my irc client shows the realname in join lines :)
[12:43:37] <OndraSter> WTF
[12:43:42] <OndraSter> wassup with C945 transistor
[12:43:47] <OndraSter> it is like... in every power supply
[12:47:15] <amee2k> must be cheap then :)
[12:47:28] <OndraSter> yeah
[12:47:30] <OndraSter> super cheap
[12:47:42] <OndraSter> I managed to find BC337 in some main board from some VCR
[12:47:47] <CapnKernel> So cheap I'll pay you to take them :-)
[12:48:10] <CapnKernel> Plus free worldwide shipping, and bonus mother-in-law.
[12:48:36] <CapnKernel> A newb must have designed that board.
[12:49:17] <amee2k> lol
[12:49:22] <amee2k> whats wrong with 337s?
[12:49:50] <CapnKernel> They're "hello world" transistors.
[12:50:12] <OndraSter> 337 <3
[12:50:19] <OndraSter> they have regular CBE pinout
[12:50:26] <OndraSter> rather that CEB or ECB or w/e was it
[12:50:28] <OndraSter> on the C945
[12:50:42] <OndraSter> because that bollock in the shop FORGOT TO PUT THE ONE I ORDERED IN
[12:51:03] <CapnKernel> The problem is not the transistor, they work fine. Just that they are so associated with teaching, and college tutorial reference designs, that if you see a '337, you know it's not far from something like that.
[12:51:37] <CapnKernel> Someone's homework project, or something someone scraped off the lecturer's whiteboard and slavishly re-used.
[12:51:50] <OndraSter> if it works, why not use it :P
[12:52:05] <amee2k> yeah
[12:52:06] <OndraSter> if you learn somewhere transistors and someone mentions it, you remember the name and number :)
[12:52:18] <CapnKernel> Be my guest, they are acceptable transistors.
[12:52:21] <amee2k> i've got a baggy with 50 leaded 337s for cheap some time ago and i like them
[12:52:35] <CapnKernel> It's the transistor equivalent of the '741.
[12:52:38] <amee2k> i also have 390x ones that are pretty neat
[12:53:00] <OndraSter> 741?
[12:53:04] <CapnKernel> op amp
[12:53:06] <OndraSter> ah
[12:53:08] <CapnKernel> There are lots of better op ams
[12:53:10] <OndraSter> I like TL8x :)
[12:53:14] <CapnKernel> amps
[12:53:16] <CapnKernel> yes, quite
[12:53:22] <CapnKernel> TL081/2/4
[12:54:09] <CapnKernel> 741 is the "hello world" op amp
[12:54:35] <CapnKernel> LM386 is the "hello world" amplifier chip
[12:54:48] <amee2k> i've got some 741s too but i rarely have high enough rails to put it to good use
[12:55:05] <CapnKernel> Yeah, there are better choices out there.
[12:55:07] * amee2k <3 LM324 though
[12:55:15] <CapnKernel> Yes also good
[12:55:50] <amee2k> the only real problem i've seen with 741s is that it doesn't like going anywhere near the rails *at all*
[12:56:00] <CapnKernel> The point is that when someone specs a 741, in spite of there being better choices, you know they're either regurgitating it from some 25-year old cookbook, or they're clueless
[12:56:06] <CapnKernel> It's a tell-tale, a marker.
[12:56:45] <amee2k> there is a psu design on ludens where he said in the text he specifically picked a 741 because it is dirt cheap and so slow that it won't need compensation >_>
[12:58:06] <amee2k> how about 3055!
[12:58:21] <amee2k> thats another big long time workhorse
[12:58:42] <amee2k> which i really have yet to find a replacement that can compete with the price in low quantities
[12:58:51] <amee2k> replacement for*
[13:15:50] <specing> Yo people
[13:15:58] <specing> yo CapnKernel
[13:16:45] <learningc> would you guys recommend lead free solder paste or just regular one will do?
[13:16:54] <CapnKernel> specing: hi
[13:16:59] <urief> learningc: the only real solder is 63/37
[13:17:05] <CapnKernel> learningc: Depends on why you'd want lead-free
[13:17:30] <learningc> CapnKernel: less chance of contamination?
[13:17:30] <CapnKernel> If you're doing things for commercial resale in Europe (and some other places such as California), then go lead-free.
[13:18:00] <CapnKernel> Lead-free is definitely harder to work with than (as urief says) real solder.
[13:19:03] <specing> CapnKernel: Can you not sell stuff in europe if it is not lead free?
[13:19:22] <specing> I've seen stuff on farnell that are not lead free
[13:20:01] <OndraSter> I am using 60/38/2
[13:20:06] <OndraSter> :)
[13:20:09] <CapnKernel> specing: There are some exceptions, such as solder panels.
[13:20:09] <OndraSter> and I <3 it
[13:20:19] <CapnKernel> Read the wikipedia article on RoHS
[13:20:43] <CapnKernel> I bought a huge reel of with-Pb solder the other day, it's so soft it droops, won't stay up in the air
[13:20:54] <CapnKernel> Makes gorgeous joins.
[13:22:01] <specing> :D
[13:23:35] <CapnKernel> "it's so shiny, makes me wanna lick it"
[13:26:00] <RikusW> here is something to lick :-P
http://dbaseserver.mistermail.nl/t/1150396/5051326/222040/0/
[13:27:57] <RikusW> maybe the wraith build their computers from this :-P
[13:31:48] <CapnKernel> "Got a moment? Sneeze on this"
[13:33:21] <dirty_d> very boring friday
[13:40:58] <Rikus1> http://arstechnica.com/business/news/2012/03/the-pwn-plug-is-a-little-white-box-that-can-hack-your-network.ars
[13:46:22] <Steffanx> " that makes the device look like an air freshener—so that people won't get suspicious." ..
[13:46:32] <Steffanx> Air freshener with a network cable … suuuure
[13:47:42] <OndraSter> :D
[13:48:48] <Rikus1> its a POE adapter ;)
[13:50:49] <specing> I'd be very happy if someone left a $750 device in my network :D
[13:50:59] <Steffanx> Yeah me too
[13:51:16] <Steffanx> No way it's worth that, though
[13:53:39] <CapnKernel> It gives your data that clean free feeling
[13:55:20] <Kevin`> specing: you could do the same thing with a far, far cheaper device. the person in the article used it because he knew he could recover it later
[13:59:00] <OndraSter> CapnKernel, ebay: "please look at our other items for discounted shipping combination"
[13:59:04] <OndraSter> I take a look at his shipping $$
[13:59:05] <specing> Kevin`: you could do the same thing with no cost whatsoever
[13:59:07] <OndraSter> and it is.. free :P
[13:59:14] <CapnKernel> :-)
[13:59:48] <specing> Whats up with chinese and their english?
[13:59:58] <Steffanx> Chinlish ftw
[14:01:20] <Kevin`> specing: no cost?
[14:03:12] <dirty_d> this hot solder rifle make efficient wind
[14:04:37] <Steffanx> hot solder rifle?
[14:04:49] <specing> Kevin`: j/k
[14:07:45] <asteve> is anyone in here living in china?
[14:10:39] <dirty_d> Steffanx, my hot air rework tool
[14:10:46] <dirty_d> had some rediculous translation
[14:12:42] <Tom_itx> asteve, wormfood is
[14:13:18] <asteve> what do they actively block? will ssh work at most hotels?
[14:13:32] <Tom_itx> wormfood is not me
[14:13:34] <Tom_itx> i have no clue
[14:13:57] <asteve> Tom_itx: i didn't direct the question to you, i assumed if he was here he would have been dinged and can read my question
[14:14:10] <asteve> i also figured that someone else may have this knowledge and addressed the entire chan
[14:14:37] <Tom_itx> ok
[14:16:22] <Rikus1> wormfood isn't even here...
[14:17:35] <asteve> Rikus1: massive plan failure on my part
[14:18:26] <grummund> of course #avr is full of chinese hackers, so the best place to ask such questions.
[14:19:46] <Rikus1> http://www.magnetech.co.za/Choosing.html
[14:21:35] <specing> asteve: ask capnkernel when he comes back
[14:21:47] <specing> asteve: I think he mentioned running a VPN at home
[14:22:03] <asteve> grummund: i could try #china
[14:22:32] <grummund> asteve: i guess so, if that chan exists
[14:22:37] <grummund> you also try google
[14:22:39] <asteve> grummund: it doesn't
[14:22:43] <grummund> or wikipedia
[14:27:58] <testuser123> so rikusl for rikus laptop... rikusW for rikus work?
[14:30:14] <RikusW> testuser123: no, my connection failed, so I got logged in as Rikus1...
[14:30:29] <RikusW> W is for my surname
[14:30:38] <testuser123> cool
[14:32:34] <specing> RikusW: Why don't you get a bouncer?2
[14:34:01] <RikusW> it could use ghost, wat too lazy ;)
[14:34:05] <RikusW> *was
[14:35:41] <Metalsutton> Hello, can anybody please help me?
[14:35:55] <RikusW> with ?
[14:37:28] <specing> Metalsutton: Welcome to #avr, the definitive life counselling channel here on Freenode
[14:37:39] <specing> How can we be of assistance?
[14:38:57] <budwaa> I would like to know why my avr 645 pulses its digital pins when you set the data direction register.
[14:39:37] <RikusW> pulses or changes state ?
[14:40:01] <budwaa> I have a blank application and the only code is an empty while loop with DDRC |= (1<<PC6); before it. This generates two 5V pulses from the pin, one at application start (which could be pullups) and then one after a second has passed...
[14:40:12] <budwaa> pulses, I am uploading my scope capture
[14:40:33] <budwaa> Here is code:
http://pastebin.com/HZMNS1ZH
[14:41:28] <dirty_d> budwaa, looks like youre almost done
[14:41:43] <dirty_d> :)
[14:42:07] <budwaa> Lol, I worked hard to get this far ;P
[14:42:44] <dirty_d> pulses?
[14:43:06] <budwaa> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-UhXlzzospXQ/T2OVdKU34fI/AAAAAAAAD3s/RR3388IiTBs/s800/IMG_20120316_192412.jpg
[14:43:20] <budwaa> Channel 2 the lower plot shows what PC6 does at startup.
[14:43:59] <dirty_d> zoom in more
[14:44:02] <budwaa> 1st pulse is 4ms second is 12 ms
[14:44:52] <budwaa> The 1st pulse is quite malformed.
[14:45:35] <dirty_d> if you put PORTC = 0; before does it stilll do it?
[14:46:35] <learningc> anyone using kicad?
[14:46:42] <budwaa> yeah still does it
[14:47:00] <budwaa> I could understand the first pulse but the random second pulse is rather worrying.
[14:47:01] <testuser123> learningc, i do
[14:47:27] <learningc> testuser123: I'm new to it. How do you put a part in eeschema?
[14:47:34] <budwaa> It looks to me like a flaw with the chip...
[14:47:38] <testuser123> press a
[14:47:59] <learningc> ok, that cmponene selection
[14:48:02] <learningc> component
[14:48:05] <dirty_d> budwaa, the 2nd pulse is 12ms long?
[14:48:09] <budwaa> yeah
[14:48:15] <dirty_d> thats strange
[14:48:50] <learningc> testuser123: ok, got a part on schematics, thanks
[14:49:02] <testuser123> learningc, np.
[14:49:05] <budwaa> Is there anything in the fuses that might cause it?
[14:49:49] <learningc> testuser123: I was actually trying to get a part from library browser, but I don't know how to pick them from there
[14:50:11] <Metalsutton> Oh sorry for the delay, I know you guys are chatting away but I will post my problem at least:
[14:50:23] <testuser123> learningc, add the library then look for it in the component selector dialog
[14:50:43] <testuser123> i dont remember the menu... but look for it...
[14:52:13] <learningc> testuser123: ok, thanks
[14:52:13] <Metalsutton> I have a schematic that I followed off the net, it came supplied with a hex file and fuse settings. so it SHOULD work. I have programmed the ATmega8 and the fuses. Its basicaly a db9 to usb convertor. I have a sega genesis controller plugged in and it detects the controller in windows. the only problem is, no buttons except 1 works, and when I push that button, it triggers EVERY button press.
[14:52:43] <dirty_d> budwaa, im not sure
[14:54:25] <RikusW> Metalsutton: sounds like a wiring problem ?
[14:54:55] <budwaa> it seems by default the pins go to 5V on uc startup. Is this because the are configured as inputs with pullups as default? My outputs are also floating so maybe thats the problem?
[14:54:59] <RikusW> or maybe firmware...
[14:55:00] <testuser123> learningc, press w... to draw wire
[14:55:42] <Kevin`> budwaa: the pins are configures as inputs WITHOUT pullups. no driving at all
[14:55:47] <RikusW> budwaa: it is floating by defailt afaik
[14:56:08] <budwaa> I have a pin connected straight from AVR to a CD4050 buffer
[14:56:15] <Kevin`> budwaa: did you try a 10k pulldown while measuring as I suggested yesterday?
[14:57:00] <budwaa> No I don't have any resistors atm. I can't think of anything software wise that could be causing it so I'm going to give that a try.
[14:57:27] <testuser123> learningc, once you are done with your schema design you must generate a netlist.
[14:57:35] <budwaa> Thing is once you set the DDR to set the pin as an output the pins isn't floating any more, which makes the second pulse very strange
[14:57:40] <testuser123> once netlist is done... you can generate board traces...
[14:58:50] <RikusW> budwaa: maybe gcc startup code mess around ?
[14:59:11] <Kevin`> budwaa: try it without the buffer. you may have the buffer connected wrong
[14:59:17] <learningc> testuser123: ah ok, thanks
[15:00:08] <budwaa> The buffer works ok.
[15:00:34] <budwaa> Its a surface mount board so can't take it off without de-soldering either
[15:00:54] <Kevin`> 1 second thing could be due to having the watchdog timer enabled
[15:01:01] <learningc> testuser123: how do I generate a netlist?
[15:01:27] <budwaa> Watchdog is not enabled in the fuses, also not in software
[15:01:50] <testuser123> learningc, its the fourth button or so (from right to left) in the main toolbar
[15:02:07] <testuser123> the icon looks like its on fire...
[15:13:42] <learningc> testuser123: ok found it, the one with a wrench
[15:13:51] <learningc> thanks
[15:15:23] <OndraSter> ok, I have some serious problem I have no idea about why it happens. Let me explain it:
[15:15:47] <OndraSter> I have simple NPN transistor driving realy. The NPN is BC337. I have connected 4k7 series resistor to base and another 4k7 to emitter (ground)
[15:15:58] <OndraSter> but no matter what I do, there is STILL 0.62V on the Base pin
[15:16:29] <OndraSter> when I connect 9V (9V vcc) onto the input, the first 4k7 series drops the 8.38V... and there is 0.62V on the base pin
[15:16:40] <OndraSter> when I connect ground onto the input, there is.. 0.62V on the base pin
[15:16:41] <OndraSter> ?!
[15:16:42] <testuser123> learningc, dont think it has a wrench on it... i am not sure... i dont have it installed here in this computer...
[15:17:15] <testuser123> just hoover the mouse over it... and it should tellyou netlist or something
[15:17:31] <OndraSter> the transistor might be bad, that's the only option I can think of
[15:18:10] <OndraSter> I grabbed it from board from some VCR
[15:18:24] <OndraSter> that I got like... many years ago as borked (the plastic inside was cracked)
[15:18:32] <Landon> were you able to test it with a multimeter?
[15:18:38] <learningc> testuser123: is it the one with a big word ".net" on it?
[15:18:45] <dirty_d> OndraSter, 0.62V from where to where?
[15:18:48] <OndraSter> yeah, base -- emitter was about 700Ohms or w/e
[15:18:53] <OndraSter> dirty_d, base -- ground
[15:18:58] <OndraSter> aka base--emitor
[15:19:10] <dirty_d> thats what its supposed to be
[15:19:19] <OndraSter> even when you actually GROUND the base pin?
[15:19:23] <OndraSter> through 4k7 resistor
[15:19:26] <dirty_d> yea
[15:19:26] <testuser123> learningc, send me a screenshot... i think newer version changed icons...
[15:19:35] <OndraSter> wait... what
[15:19:44] <dirty_d> OndraSter, no
[15:19:45] <OndraSter> I think I have missed a lesson or two at school
[15:19:51] <dirty_d> not when you ground the base
[15:19:54] <OndraSter> ok
[15:20:03] <dirty_d> well, actually
[15:20:16] <OndraSter> it is like.. there is 0.62V reference on that pin :P
[15:20:29] <dirty_d> i think thats right
[15:20:40] <OndraSter> so how do I close the transistor
[15:20:45] <OndraSter> I HATE TRANSISTORS, MOSFETS FTW!
[15:20:51] <OndraSter> now, how do I close the transistor
[15:20:57] <dirty_d> OndraSter, make the base current 0
[15:21:02] <OndraSter> how?
[15:21:09] <dirty_d> ground it
[15:21:15] <OndraSter> directly?
[15:21:16] <dirty_d> to the emitter
[15:21:44] <dirty_d> wait
[15:21:47] <OndraSter> it is 4k7 tied to the emitter...
[15:21:48] <dirty_d> close as in turn on
[15:21:51] <dirty_d> ?
[15:22:06] <OndraSter> close as ... that there is no current through collector
[15:22:14] <OndraSter> open as there current flows
[15:22:14] <learningc> testuser123:
http://imagebin.org/203806
[15:22:20] <dirty_d> ok then ground base to emitter
[15:22:25] <OndraSter> directly?
[15:22:30] <dirty_d> doesnt have to be
[15:22:33] <testuser123> learningc, oh yeah new icons!!
[15:22:43] <dirty_d> just has be be less than 0.6v above the emitter
[15:22:46] <OndraSter> dirty_d, 4k7 "pulldown" is too much then?
[15:22:51] <cyanid3> pdi is just 2 wires, correct?
[15:22:52] <dirty_d> no should be fine
[15:22:56] <OndraSter> wait
[15:22:58] <cyanid3> reset and pdi-data
[15:23:10] <cyanid3> clk and data, rather
[15:23:13] <dirty_d> yea
[15:23:21] <testuser123> learningc, but i think is the one with the magic wand...
[15:23:24] <cyanid3> can you use the data pin for something else?
[15:23:28] <dirty_d> OndraSter, what are you trying to do?
[15:23:29] <OndraSter> http://www.rason.org/Projects/transwit/image2.gif
[15:23:30] <OndraSter> this
[15:23:36] <OndraSter> except r1 and R2 are 4k7
[15:23:37] <OndraSter> both
[15:23:39] <testuser123> learningc, click on each one and tell me what you see
[15:23:43] <OndraSter> and I have BC337
[15:23:48] <dirty_d> cyanid3, i think those pins are dedicated
[15:24:02] <cyanide> hmm
[15:25:10] <dirty_d> OndraSter, in that case youre going to need more than 0.6v at r1
[15:25:14] <dirty_d> since its divided by 2
[15:25:42] <OndraSter> sorry, gotta afk
[15:25:46] <OndraSter> will be back in an hour
[15:25:48] <OndraSter> to continue
[15:25:50] <dirty_d> OndraSter, what are you making
[15:25:51] <dirty_d> ok
[15:26:07] <RikusW> OndraSter: BE is 0v6
[15:26:14] <RikusW> and CE is smaller
[15:26:24] <RikusW> wierd, it just works that way
[15:28:08] <OndraSter> but I thought that base = input
[15:28:15] <OndraSter> now I gotta go really
[15:28:26] <dirty_d> it is
[15:29:20] <learningc> testuser123: the one with wand and amplifier symbol is annotate schematic, one with wrench is generate netlist (so it's this one) :)
[15:29:57] <testuser123> awesome
[15:30:08] <testuser123> so just generate the netlist and save it
[15:30:11] <testuser123> then open
[15:35:52] <learningc> ok
[15:38:49] <learningc> what does annotate schematics do?
[15:40:53] <Metalsutton> HOLY SHIT!
[15:41:08] <cyanide> WAT
[15:41:18] <Metalsutton> Turns out that wiring problem = I dont know the diffrence between an OPEN jumper and a CLOSED one
[15:41:35] <Metalsutton> (way old convosation on here, sorry)
[15:42:07] <testuser123> learningc, it will rename your components
[15:42:14] <testuser123> like R1, R2
[15:42:45] <learningc> testuser123: aren't they already named when I put then at first?
[15:43:06] <testuser123> yeah
[15:51:49] <OndraSter> ok
[15:51:50] <OndraSter> http://clip2net.com/s/1HNe5
[15:52:03] <OndraSter> when I connect here the SIGN to the +5V and then ground it
[15:52:12] <OndraSter> I can measure 0.62V on the R2
[15:52:17] <OndraSter> even when the R1 is tied to ground
[15:53:00] <OndraSter> err, missed diode
[15:53:08] <OndraSter> http://clip2net.com/s/1HNeX
[15:53:11] <OndraSter> this way it is connected
[17:14:47] <micahf> should it be possible to use the xmegaduino project on an xmega-a1 Xplained board?
[17:22:34] <OndraSter> duh
[17:22:41] <OndraSter> I used those probably-cheap c945
[17:22:46] <OndraSter> and.. it works
[17:22:48] <OndraSter> wtf lol
[17:22:58] <OndraSter> tried one bc337 and one bc547
[17:29:43] <OndraSter> the c945 are from old AT power supplies
[17:29:46] <OndraSter> the BCs were from VCR.
[17:33:07] <Kevin`> micahf: one of the nice things about xmega is it's source-level compatible between chips to a large degree, so probably
[17:40:34] <cyanide> who makes some cheap stencils?
[17:40:48] <cyanide> i have just discovered soldering by oven
[17:41:04] <Tom_itx> welcome to the cool world
[17:41:30] <OndraSter> haha
[17:41:37] <cyanide> where are the ladies?
[17:41:40] <Tom_itx> http://www.ohararp.com/Stencils.html
[17:41:41] <OndraSter> how many boards are you gonna sell?
[17:41:49] <Steffanx> 2.5
[17:42:02] <Tom_itx> you can get a page of em for $25
[17:42:04] <Tom_itx> 8 x 11
[17:42:09] <Tom_itx> multiple designs
[17:42:37] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/Stencils/stencils.jpg
[17:42:39] <Tom_itx> like those
[17:42:40] <cyanide> probably starting with 50 or so
[17:42:46] <Tom_itx> and he uses kapton
[17:43:29] <Steffanx> 100$ for 4 'pages' . whaoa
[17:43:59] <Steffanx> Oh, 5
[17:44:06] <Tom_itx> those were all one page iirc
[17:44:13] <cyanide> kapton can be reused right?
[17:44:17] <OndraSter> sure
[17:44:20] <Tom_itx> yup
[17:44:22] <Steffanx> 8 x 11 inch Tom_itx ?
[17:44:25] <Tom_itx> yes
[17:44:28] <Tom_itx> up to that
[17:44:30] <Steffanx> oh, i thought cm
[17:44:44] * Tom_itx stabs Steffanx in the eye with a sharp pencil
[17:44:59] <cyanide> why arent the chinese selling these for like 30c?
[17:45:00] <cyanide> lol
[17:45:10] <Steffanx> I'm already blind with two eyes ..
[17:45:32] <Steffanx> So i'd like to keep them
[17:45:35] <OndraSter> Steffanx, haha, I presume you live in the metric world :P
[17:45:42] <micahf> Kevin': it says you can on the xmegaduino github, i'm just trying to figure out where to start
[17:45:46] <Tom_itx> yeah and he knows i don't
[17:45:46] <OndraSter> yep
[17:45:54] <Kevin`> cyanide: they probably are, but most of those places are local-only, no web presence, no shipping
[17:46:02] <micahf> Kevin': I'm kind of a newbie
[17:46:03] <OndraSter> btw, xmegas are not 5V input tolerable.. I think
[17:46:08] <cyanide> yes
[17:46:11] <cyanide> 3.3v only
[17:46:17] <OndraSter> yeah.. so watch out for that :P
[17:46:18] <cyanide> rather 3.3v max
[17:47:34] <Tom_itx> cyanide, i would suggest if you're doing qfn though that you have him shrink the pad size down some
[17:47:44] <Tom_itx> as well as the center pad
[17:48:06] <Tom_itx> in fact i think i had him shrink the tqfp ones i did just a bit too
[17:48:36] <cyanide> shrink them?
[17:48:46] <cyanide> i only have tqfp for now
[17:48:52] <Tom_itx> it should be ok
[17:49:49] <Tom_itx> the laser melts the edge of the plastic back just slightly so they come out a tiny bit bigger than what you send but i think he knows to adjust for that
[17:50:05] <cyanide> ah
[17:50:12] <Tom_itx> he's good to deal with
[17:50:12] <cyanide> thanks for letting me know
[17:50:22] <Tom_itx> i actually screwed one up and he replaced it for me
[17:50:38] <Tom_itx> then he screwed it up so he sent me even a third one :)
[17:50:38] <cyanide> yup,
http://forum.sparkfun.com/viewtopic.php?p=93493&sid=257396502969755e7963d8a3198f605a#p93493
[17:50:58] <cyanide> good guy to work with
[17:51:29] <Tom_itx> that's what i just said
[17:52:04] <cyanide> just the tcream layer, correct?
[17:52:24] <cyanide> and bcream
[17:52:35] <Tom_itx> yeah that's the stencil layer
[17:52:43] <cyanide> cool
[17:53:08] <Tom_itx> he edited mine for me
[17:53:17] <Tom_itx> that's not to say he does that for everybody
[17:53:58] <cyanide> im using a regular oven. is it possible to do both sides or should i stick all my components on a single layer next time around?
[17:54:16] <cyanide> not sure if the bottom components will fall off or not
[17:56:07] <Tom_itx> inflex does both sides but i haven't tried that yet
[17:56:21] <Tom_itx> the capilary action should hold the parts on the bottom
[17:56:35] <Tom_itx> cook one side at a time i think
[17:56:39] <cyanide> ill try one tomorrow
[17:57:31] <Tom_itx> cool, got my boxes today
[17:57:41] <Tom_itx> maybe i'll mill this evening
[17:57:45] <Steffanx> boxes ..
[17:58:22] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/Boxes/milling2.jpg
[17:58:25] <Tom_itx> boxes
[18:00:29] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/Boxes/box_batch.jpg
[18:00:31] <Tom_itx> more boxes
[18:01:00] <Tom_itx> gawd that thing is slow today
[18:03:23] <Kevin`> worked fast for me
[18:03:27] <Steffanx> Here too
[18:23:20] <OndraSter> yay
[18:23:24] <OndraSter> I want milling machine @ home as well
[18:23:37] <OndraSter> controlled... from my PC
[18:23:41] <OndraSter> or have some slave that does it
[18:23:43] <OndraSter> for free
[18:23:46] <OndraSter> :D
[19:46:43] <micahf> can you program an xmega-a1 xplained board on linux over USB without a separate programmer?
[21:33:44] <Tom_itx> ok, another batch milled
[21:34:13] <Tom_itx> micahf yes
[21:34:27] <Tom_itx> dfu programmer
[21:35:12] <micahf> Tom_itx, awesome, and all i need to do is hold down the sw0 button when i plug it in?
[21:36:18] <Tom_itx> better ask abcminiuser about that one
[21:36:25] <Tom_itx> i've never done it that way
[21:36:37] <Tom_itx> i use studio and PDI
[21:36:58] <Tom_itx> you may need to jumper something to use the onboard USB, i don't recall
[21:37:18] <Tom_itx> but i know abcminiuser had done it
[21:37:21] <Tom_itx> has*
[21:37:49] <Tom_itx> it may also depend on what ver board you have as to what you need to do
[21:37:55] <Tom_itx> mine is an older one
[21:38:16] <Landon> dlul
[21:38:23] <Landon> o.O
[21:39:06] <micahf> Tom_itx, thanks so much! this is helpful. I'm a newb
[21:39:27] <Tom_itx> wait and ask dean before you screw it up though
[21:39:28] <micahf> i'll keep an eye open for abcminiuser
[21:39:38] <micahf> alright, dean is abcminiuser?
[21:39:42] <Tom_itx> yup
[21:39:55] <Valen> aka god
[21:40:00] <Tom_itx> or someone else here with an xplain
[21:40:08] <micahf> oh, he's responsible for LULA isn't he?
[21:40:15] <micahf> er, LUFA?
[21:40:15] <Tom_itx> sure is
[21:40:35] <micahf> yeah so he'll definitely know!
[21:41:26] <micahf> i'm trying to get xmegaduino working, i found these little MEMS ultrasonic microphones and want to make a bioacoustics recorder... i'm pretty excited about it!
[21:57:23] <Tom_itx> micahf, do you have the xplain user guide pdf?
[22:00:08] <Tom_itx> http://www.atmel.com/Images/doc8203.pdf
[22:05:51] <micahf> Tom_itx, ahh, thanks but i have the xmega-a1 "xplained" board, which is newer
[22:06:16] <micahf> and blue
[22:06:54] <Tom_itx> there were some threads about the JTAG PDI connections on that one i believe
[22:07:04] <Tom_itx> you may wanna search avrfreaks for those
[22:07:57] <Tom_itx> if you plan to program it via the JTAG header with PDI that is
[22:09:23] <Tom_itx> i think there may be at least 3 versions of that board so be careful what you're told about it not knowing the version discussed
[22:35:15] <inflex> lo there Tom_itx
[22:35:44] <Tom_itx> hi there inflex
[22:38:36] <Tom_itx> what's up today?
[22:39:55] <inflex> not a huge amount - a bit quiet; but that's because people generally don't get their computers serviced on weekends :)
[22:40:32] <Tom_itx> just finished milling another batch of boxes
[22:41:20] <Landon> hm, taking an electronics test online... the site was seeming kind of fishy
[22:41:28] <Landon> but now there's a decimal->hex conversion question
[22:41:38] <Landon> of the multiple choice answers, the correct one is : (10 C)
[22:42:39] <Landon> oh duh, nevermind, that's right, but just written super confusing
[22:43:36] <inflex> ugh, I hate how people think that websites shoudl only cost $100~$200 to do
[22:43:54] <inflex> "But it looks so simple - even I could do it!", sure, you go do it yourslf then.
[22:44:03] <Tom_itx> :)
[22:44:48] <CapnKernel> I've got one they can copy:
http://www.fbt-chinavisa.com.hk/
[22:46:00] <CapnKernel> It's got the animated spinning globe, it's got the blink tag, it's got the gratuitous iframes. But there's something missing, what can it be? I know, the scrolling marquee!
[22:46:33] <Tom_itx> so CapnKernel, how did your day go?
[22:46:57] <inflex> CapnKernel: nice nice, very nice... needs a #0000ff background though ;)
[22:47:03] <CapnKernel> yeah
[22:47:20] <CapnKernel> I'm stuck in HK. I can apply for a visa on Monday, and maybe get it back on Friday.
[22:47:40] <inflex> red lettering just doesn't standout without that blue background
[23:14:28] <Roklobsta> capn: go eat some good cheese and bread while you wait
[23:15:08] <Tom_itx> anybody know of an irc client for iPad?
[23:20:13] <CapnKernel> Roklobsta: Yeah absolutely
[23:32:36] <theBear> Tom_itx, nah, pretty sure my buddy on the other side of the coutnry has one tho if ya want me to ask
[23:33:13] <Tom_itx> meh, not that important
[23:39:18] <theBear> dunno about ishop land, but in little green robot land i find the trouble is sorting out the crap applications and finding the one or two good ones for a given purpose..
[23:57:47] <CapnKernel> Dunno about the quality, but you have to admit, there sure is a lot of quantity!
