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[04:37:50] -monyet:#avr- Im removing my panties
http://freecam5.goodluckwith.us/
[04:37:50] <monyet> wanna see my boobs?
http://freecam5.goodluckwith.us/
[05:02:44] <RokLobsta> Oh yeah, boobs and AVR. Sweet!
[05:05:25] <Landon> an avr boob controller? I'm interested
[06:12:13] <pingec> Is it safe to power one ds18B20 sensor directly via PORTB on my avr?
[06:14:56] <RokLobsta> there is only one way to find out...
[06:16:42] <RokLobsta> i'd say so.
http://pdfserv.maxim-ic.com/en/pg/1_WIRE_PRODUCTS.pdf
[06:22:21] <pingec> thanks
[06:33:12] <Tom_itx> how much current does it draw?
[06:38:18] <RokLobsta> hmmm, i am having a wee moment with "warning: initialization from incompatible pointer type"
[06:39:13] <RokLobsta> i am initialising an array of structs with strings in them much like page 119 on K&R C burt get this error with avrgcc.
[06:42:52] <Kevin`> be specific
[06:42:58] <specing> very specific.
[06:43:52] <Kevin`> also, strings are pointers/arrays
[06:44:27] <keenerd> Probably need to use pointers to strings instead of allocating inside the struct.
[06:44:31] <RokLobsta> i am having a look at .lst output and it seem the data is being allocated right.
[06:45:06] <RokLobsta> like the string is stored at .LC4 and in the struct array the pointer has the .LC4 macro in it.
[06:45:43] <RokLobsta> it got worse if I didn't use a const for the string pointer.
[06:46:04] <keenerd> Show us the C.
[06:46:07] <RokLobsta> i am just wondering if there is a gcc flag that isn't set.
[06:46:09] <RokLobsta> okok
[06:47:44] * specing readies his trout
[06:47:56] <RokLobsta> http://pastebin.com/CxjWQYZZ
[06:48:47] * RokLobsta puts his asbestos jacket on.
[06:50:38] <RokLobsta> Modem3G.c:39:2: warning: initialization from incompatible pointer type x 3
[06:52:37] <RokLobsta> it's untested but the compiled output in the .lst looks ok
[06:53:41] <specing> Because we know what is on line 39...
[06:54:33] <RokLobsta> it's the 3 initialisations lines in the pastebin
[06:56:09] <RokLobsta> i'll persist with getting it built. the assembly looks ok. i'll press on to the point I can test it.
[06:56:16] <RokLobsta> i just don't want no warnings.
[06:57:56] <RokLobsta> any takers?
[07:01:50] <Tom_itx> you could ask in #c but they would rip you a new a hole and stick their nose up at you
[07:02:37] <RokLobsta> i have enough new holes, thanks.
[07:02:57] <RokLobsta> a friend got flamed by Bjarne once.
[07:03:08] <RokLobsta> same friend also got flipped the bird by Linus.
[07:03:18] <RokLobsta> he has a way with the greats.
[07:03:57] <RokLobsta> tom_itx: do you have any suggestions?
[07:04:04] <Tom_itx> nope
[07:04:09] <Tom_itx> i'm not that c proficient
[07:04:18] <RokLobsta> i think it's a pedantic compiler thing.
[07:23:24] <RokLobsta> tom_itx: are you a bit banger?
[07:32:24] <CapnKernel> Is that like asking if someone's a bit crazy?
[07:32:49] <RokLobsta> perhaps. and with regards to my code problem... PEBKAC.
[07:32:52] <RokLobsta> i found it
[07:33:52] <RokLobsta> no i mean is tom a hard core assembly guy?
[07:34:09] <CapnKernel> You're putting your strings in progmem right?
[07:34:31] <CapnKernel> http://www.nongnu.org/avr-libc/user-manual/FAQ.html#faq_rom_array
[07:35:25] <RokLobsta> nono i am refactoring. it was my function pointer. i buggered it up and forgot an extra argument.
[07:35:46] <RokLobsta> i have strings from ROM licked.
[07:36:03] <RokLobsta> use them in a big way for ASCII art.
[07:36:43] <RokLobsta> the old forgotten art of VT100.
[07:40:12] <RokLobsta> the old forgotten art of VT100.
[07:40:16] <RokLobsta> sorry
[07:48:50] <RokLobsta> capnkernel: what's the speed penalty of retreiveing consts from rom vs ram?
[07:49:26] <CapnKernel> I could be wrong, but on the RISCy AVR, I suspect it's the same
[07:50:28] <CapnKernel> One stores stuff in ROM simply to preserve precious RAM
[07:51:18] <Kevin`> you have to copy them to ram, so there's some extra instructions. normally it's not an issue though
[07:51:55] <CapnKernel> Kevin`: What's this "have to"?
[07:52:29] <Kevin`> CapnKernel: well, unless you are going to use them as instructions... how do you plan to use them directly from program space?
[07:54:00] <CapnKernel> There's no requirement at all to copy stuff to RAM before using. You think printf copies strings to RAM before emitting them?
[07:54:20] <CapnKernel> You can load from ROM into registers
[08:01:29] <RokLobsta> well, in the past on other arches I have placed constant strings and other data into ROM rather than it be in ROM then copied to RAM. It seems redundant to copy RO stuff to RAM.
[08:02:01] <RokLobsta> by default all constant data is copied to ram for reading.
[08:02:36] <RokLobsta> i suspect that is because of the bias compilers have for the expectation that all code and data lies in ram.
[08:03:37] <RokLobsta> depending on the tool kit and memory model you might have to use a libc type library built for strings-in-rom vs the usual strings-in-ram
[08:03:56] <RokLobsta> and it can be very difficult to mix the two.
[08:03:59] <RokLobsta> if at all.
[08:05:35] <RokLobsta> for instance the 8051 had the MOVC instruction to read from ROM space.
[08:06:54] <RokLobsta> of course, pratfalls and laughs are many for those who think "const" will mean their stuff stays and is referred to in rom.
[08:08:23] <CapnKernel> Curiously enough, the 8051 and AVR are both Harvard architecture machines, where code and data are separate. Putting data into the code space is an exception.
[08:14:00] <RokLobsta> right, but i think the issue lies with the flexibility of things like the strings functions or memcpy where pointers to things are usually writable.
[08:15:22] <CapnKernel> Look at the prototypes for those strings, if there's no changing, they're all already const.
[08:16:16] <CapnKernel> Const doesn't mean it won't change. Const is just a hint to the compiler that it can make assumptions about the data that it can't usually do.
[08:16:20] <RokLobsta> the subtle thing is making sure the compiler knows when to use MOV for RAM or MOVC for ROM.
[08:17:03] <RokLobsta> in the case of the 8051 and a quick scan of the AVR ISA leads me to think the story is the same.
[08:17:53] <RokLobsta> because of harvard arch you need to generate the correct instructions for the appropriate memory space.
[08:20:20] <RokLobsta> 1am bugger.
[08:20:22] <RokLobsta> nite
[08:20:45] <CapnKernel> nite
[08:46:34] <amee2k> is there any point to selling used video games these days?
[08:53:21] <keenerd> Because you can? All the major publishers are trying to eliminate the used game market.
[08:53:54] <amee2k> well, manufacturers have an interrest in suppressing the used market by design
[08:54:08] <keenerd> Yeah, but they have the technology to do it this time.
[08:54:37] <amee2k> a lot of manufacturers for physical goods have it on a de-facto basis now anyway
[08:54:54] <keenerd> If they don't like it, it must be beneficial for you ;-)
[08:55:04] <amee2k> lol
[08:56:03] <amee2k> thats what i'm trying to find out. i've got a stack of like 10-15 DVDs with movies and video games... some popular stuff like C&C Generals but most of it is rather cheap i think
[08:56:22] <keenerd> Buying used games makes a lot more sense than selling them.
[08:56:49] <amee2k> going through it trying to decide what to keep because either i've got a better-than-dvd version on the computer or i didn't like it anyway so no real re-watch potential
[08:57:30] <specing> Hmm
[08:57:32] <amee2k> and i think i can count how many hours i spent gaming in the last 2 years on my fingers... i'm totally into shows and movies now
[08:58:08] <keenerd> The one benefit to physical copies is that the DRM can't steal the product from you. Except for bluray, I think that can be updated to break old disks.
[08:58:54] <amee2k> get some cheap stand-alone player to keep as backup in case newer ones don't like the old disks anymore
[08:59:15] <amee2k> same as people used to have stacks of cheap DVD players to get around region codes
[09:00:01] <amee2k> well, bottom line... if there is still a useful used market i'll try sort out what has a chance to sell for a good price and put that up individually
[09:00:24] <amee2k> if not, i'll make everything one big position
[09:00:58] <keenerd> Meh, I'd just give them all to the local equiv of Goodwill. I am cheap, but too lazy to hawk them off one at a time.
[09:01:33] <amee2k> mmh whats Goodwill do?
[09:02:14] <amee2k> individually is better for the buyer too... someone who wants just one or two can just buy these
[09:02:31] <amee2k> instead of competing with others who potentially have more interrest in other stuff
[09:02:36] <keenerd> People give them used stuff, the sell it. The proceeds go to paying the wages of the people who work there.
[09:02:47] <amee2k> the DVD cases in that stack would cost like 15$ new already >_>
[09:03:27] <amee2k> hmm i see
[09:04:02] <amee2k> libraries around here have used books/dvds/games sales on a somewhat irregular basis
[09:04:52] <amee2k> if something like that exists here, i sure haven't seen it
[09:05:48] <amee2k> i only know a single used games store here either, but i heard what they pay for games is ridiculously low
[09:09:51] <amee2k> keenerd: well if i can get some money i won't refuse it but i think the problem is more that i have this thing that i can't throw away stuff that is good :/
[09:10:37] <amee2k> so like once a year when i think its getting too much, i go on ebay spree to sell all kinds of junk that has collected over time and that is still functional
[09:10:57] <amee2k> but that i don't see myself using anytime soon and isn't worth the rack space to keep just in case
[09:12:16] <amee2k> i don't care if it sells for 3$. shipping is always extra on ebay so i don't risk paying for getting rid of it
[09:37:56] <Sgt_Lemming> evening all
[09:39:18] <amee2k> evening Sgt_Lemming :)
[09:39:33] <amee2k> hmm is there a used market for Valve games at all?
[09:39:43] <Sgt_Lemming> yes
[09:39:54] <Sgt_Lemming> considering the games are "giftable"
[09:40:10] <amee2k> last time i played any of this, the Steam thing made them impossible to use a second time
[09:40:15] <amee2k> "giftable"?
[09:41:16] <amee2k> i've got the counter strike source pack (says it includes halflife2 and day of defeat source, but i only ever played counterstrike with it)
[09:42:30] <amee2k> and the "halflife generation" pack (classic halflife GOTY edition + Opposing Forces + coutner-strike + blue shift)
[09:42:56] <Sgt_Lemming> you can gift games to frinds on steam
[09:43:12] <amee2k> but that was so many years ago and even if the Steam account still exists i have no idea about the login credentials anymore
[09:43:18] <Sgt_Lemming> not sure if you can gift games from a pack seperately though
[09:44:36] <amee2k> hmm if they have the package and CD, can't they call the support and have it registered to their account anyway?
[09:45:07] <amee2k> i mean, if you have the box you own it. at least from the PoV of most normal people
[09:45:28] <amee2k> (well, unless you snatched the box, but lets assume you got the box legally for the sake of the argument)
[09:50:43] <amee2k> Sgt_Lemming: hmm. its not in my little "code book" anymore so there is a 90% chance i don't have the steam password anymore :/
[09:50:56] <Sgt_Lemming> bugger
[09:51:09] <Sgt_Lemming> try the "forgot password" thing on their site perhaps?
[09:55:35] <amee2k> Sgt_Lemming: hmm thats just the FAQ entry... i'd need a box with steam installed to actually do it
[09:56:59] <amee2k> "Select an item of information, preferably the account's contact email address." << back in school i was using like half a dozen spam infested freebie email accounts that don't exist anymore
[09:57:46] <Sgt_Lemming> rofl
[09:57:56] <amee2k> like pretty much everyone i knew back then did
[09:58:33] <CapnKernel> Sgt_Lemming: Your boards will be in my hands by the end of the week :-)
[09:58:41] <Sgt_Lemming> cool
[09:58:48] <amee2k> mmh, boards?
[09:58:53] <amee2k> did i miss any interresting projects?
[10:00:03] <Sgt_Lemming> teh RFID board I have been working on
[10:00:59] <amee2k> oh
[10:01:21] <CapnKernel> They are being run through a board house I'm trying out.
[10:01:35] <CapnKernel> I tried this company before last year, they did a good job.
[10:01:46] <CapnKernel> I mean "before, last year"
[10:02:36] <amee2k> nice
[10:03:53] <CapnKernel> Arbitrary board size, 100% e-test, any number of pieces, and instant quoting.
[10:04:17] <CapnKernel> The other hobbyist operators aren't doing that.
[10:05:26] <CapnKernel> cyanide: Hi there
[10:07:23] <amee2k> wow, that sounds pretty cool
[10:07:53] <amee2k> do they only charge per area, or with setup cost extra?
[10:08:03] <CapnKernel> No setup, you pay for what you use.
[10:08:21] <CapnKernel> And comparable in price to the others.
[10:08:29] <amee2k> just wondering because on low volume prototype runs the setup cost usually kills an otherwise decent price
[10:08:41] <CapnKernel> I'm here to change that.
[10:08:54] <amee2k> especially low volume / large board area cases
[10:09:37] <amee2k> which my boards fit like a fist on an eye >_<
[10:10:41] <CapnKernel> The sweet spot is around 10cm by 10cm, but you're not constrained to that.
[10:11:03] <CapnKernel> I'm writing my customer front end now.
[10:11:40] <amee2k> hmm sounds like ideal for "half-eurocard size" (8x10cm)
[10:12:19] <CapnKernel> amee2k: Just for the sake of the exercise, give me a number to make, and I'll get you a quote.
[10:12:50] <amee2k> hehe, okay
[10:14:04] <CapnKernel> ?
[10:14:15] <amee2k> 6x20cm, 2 copper layers, 35um or thicker plating, solder stop different on both sides, silkscreen only on top layer. if available at manageable price: 70um plating and solid copper slug vias
[10:14:30] <amee2k> 2-3 boards total for the prototype run
[10:14:45] <CapnKernel> Now you tell me where else you can get it done, and what price.
[10:15:34] <CapnKernel> Re "solder stop different on both sides", we're talking about having two different solder stops, like usual, right?
[10:15:53] <CapnKernel> 1.6mm board?
[10:16:21] <amee2k> yeah... solder stop on both sides, but different masks for each side. thats usual for SMT but some places i've looked at had an option to select so i thought i'd mention it
[10:17:04] <amee2k> 1.6mm FR4 should do, but if you have 1.0 or 1.2 too i'd consider it. depends on the price
[10:17:08] <CapnKernel> 2oz copper
[10:18:19] <amee2k> so far i'd expect something like 100-150EUR for a 3 board run. includes setup and production costs and cost for a credit card if needed. does not always include shipping, and does never include import tax or other cost not directly related to the order
[10:18:46] <amee2k> i didn't bother to remember where because that price range is definitely beyond what i'm willing to pay for it right now
[10:19:22] <amee2k> so i just closed the tab two seconds after the online price calculators gave me a figure
[10:20:56] <Kevin`> the first person to say a price loses
[10:21:16] <amee2k> Kevin`: in what way?
[10:22:40] <Kevin`> markup can be varied by individual, and using quotes makes customers a lot less likely to examine multiple companies or change there mind from a slightly higher price than expected
[10:23:40] <amee2k> (to define manageable price just for the record... for just the prototypes i'd say 10% extra for 70um and solid vias is good. really depends on the total price though)
[10:24:42] <amee2k> Kevin`: well, fortunately i don't have a deadline to keep so i can spend as much time looking for an acceptable price as is required
[10:25:09] <amee2k> if i can't find one, then there won't be an order at all. as simple as that
[10:25:38] <amee2k> because at some point i'll probably lose interrest and move on to new projects
[10:25:59] <CapnKernel> I just scraped this off the factory's quote page:
http://pastebin.com/W0smZmdp
[10:27:06] <amee2k> lol at "solder win" >_>
[10:27:07] <pingec> If I connect 2 IO pins with each other and set one as output and other as input, will that short circuit the avr or will it work fine?
[10:27:31] <CapnKernel> That's my words
[10:27:32] <amee2k> mmh wheres the price on that page?
[10:27:37] <CapnKernel> I'm working it out now
[10:27:40] <amee2k> >_>
[10:27:56] <CapnKernel> Give me a few mins
[10:28:00] <Kevin`> pingec: it will work fine
[10:28:47] <Kevin`> pingec: setting them both as outputs with one high and one low will of course cause excess power consumption, so be a bit careful
[10:28:54] <amee2k> no problem :)
[10:29:08] <amee2k> 10x8cm isn't my size though
[10:29:10] <pingec> ok
[10:29:54] <amee2k> i think i've killed a pin on a mega88 once by shorting it to ground for a while
[10:30:18] <amee2k> it was still pulling low, but the high side driver was very very weak
[10:30:26] <CapnKernel> amee2k: I can do just about any size, but still, 10cm x 8cm will be a useful comparison for the moment
[10:30:38] <amee2k> okay
[10:31:02] <amee2k> yeah... with no separate setup cost, the total price scales roughly with board area
[10:32:35] <pentths> hi all!
[10:43:51] <pingec> Hmm I am trying to power the DS18B20 through 2 IO pins. With the sensor disconnected I can measure a voltage of 4.3V on the gpios but when I connect to them the voltage drops to only 0.8V
[10:44:15] <pingec> Any ideas why is that
[10:45:50] <amee2k> does the sensor power up normally on its own on a proper power supply?
[10:47:07] <amee2k> any chance you got the sequence wrong somewhere and are trying to drive against the open collector output of the sensor?
[10:47:56] <Kevin`> pingec: it sounds stupid, but make sure you have the pins set as outputs and aren't just using pullups
[10:48:36] <pingec> I think I fried it
[10:48:57] <pingec> I tried another one and the voltage does nto drop
[10:49:05] <pingec> :/
[10:49:27] <CapnKernel> So, 5 boards, to the specs mentioned here:
http://pastebin.com/W0smZmdp
[10:49:42] <CapnKernel> Including free shipping (extra for courier or tracking)
[10:50:06] <CapnKernel> How much you think? (Invitation to all)
[10:50:42] <CapnKernel> emee2k said he's seen 100-150EUR, but I think that's a pretty horrific price
[10:51:04] <amee2k> no shit. why do you think i haven't ordered any boards already :P
[10:51:21] <CapnKernel> Well I'm just wondering what it would cost at Seeed and Itead
[10:51:32] <CapnKernel> They seem to be everyone's darling at the moment
[10:51:47] <amee2k> if you're in the US, sure
[10:52:06] <CapnKernel> Or Olimex too
[10:52:10] <amee2k> but if i add the price for a credit card i'm just where i was before
[10:53:45] <amee2k> plus that they usually bill graduated by absolute board size, like inside 5x5cm, inside 10x10cm and so on. so my 20x6 cm board usually gets me in the largest and most expensive size class
[10:54:01] <cyanide> hi
[10:54:03] <CapnKernel> As far as I can tell, the Seeed minimum is USD35, and that doesn't include shipping
[10:54:05] <amee2k> which is ridiculous considering the board area i actually use
[10:54:55] <keenerd> Seeed does not have a minumum for boards, at least in the US.
[10:54:57] <cyanide> ahahaha
http://www.zonaeuropa.com/200906c.brief.htm#012
[10:55:14] <CapnKernel> keenerd: Their website doesn't let me select less than 10.
[10:55:17] <cyanide> seeed min is 10 boards, 9.90 for 10 boards of 5x5
[10:55:28] <CapnKernel> Yep
[10:55:29] <cyanide> and shipping is about 6 usd i believe
[10:55:40] <keenerd> Right, a far cry from $35.
[10:55:47] <CapnKernel> Add 15 for 10x10, and add 10 for 100% e-test
[10:55:49] <cyanide> im getting my first batch delivered tomorrow, let's see the quality
[10:55:58] <amee2k> cyanide: 6USD for overseas shipping?
[10:56:09] <cyanide> thats what i paid from china to india
[10:56:13] <keenerd> CapnKernel: Well that a not a "minimum". That is just the price.
[10:56:16] <cyanide> not sure what it'd cost you
[10:56:35] <cyanide> im not too hopeful since i saw the eev jones guy's blog video about them messing with the board design
[10:57:04] <keenerd> cyanide: Link or title? I've had good luck with them.
[10:57:14] <amee2k> minimum price is still the minimum order ;)
[10:57:23] <cyanide> http://www.eevblog.com/2011/03/11/eevblog-155-itead-studio-pcb-prototype-goof/
[10:57:33] <amee2k> unless you can place an empty order and just pay shipping to get an empty box
[10:58:17] <keenerd> amee2k: So then seeed has a 50 cent minimum, or whatever they sell a resistor for.
[10:58:32] <cyanide> im in a completely different profession and i didnt even know what a voltage regulator was about a month ago
[10:58:47] <CapnKernel> Yeah but you know engines'n'stuff :-)
[10:59:00] <keenerd> cyanide: Thanks!
[10:59:03] <cyanide> yeah, so i let you handle my board manufacturing lol
[10:59:20] <CapnKernel> cyanide is also getting some boards through me :-)
[11:04:36] <CapnKernel> Good night all.
[11:04:59] <pentths> good night.
[11:06:08] <amee2k> wow. this is quite awesome fail. i just spent no less than 15 minutes trying to find a price list on the German Post website
[11:06:08] <cyanide> i dont really like watching the eevblog videos, mainly because he takes 3 hours to say something which could be done in 2 minutes tops, or 2 paragraphs. but fwiw, he's good with his information
[11:06:25] <amee2k> well, a price list that includes the maximum size and weight for each class
[11:07:08] <amee2k> cyanide: yeah... its like he is explaining it to some pre arduino fanboys surfing instructables
[11:07:34] <amee2k> i also get a migraine from his nasal voice >_<
[11:08:00] <cyanide> i cant blame him for his voice lol
[11:08:17] <amee2k> well, i don't blame him
[11:08:19] <cyanide> but yeah, too long winded if you're someone who has a day job
[11:08:26] <amee2k> i certainly hope he isn't doing it on purpose anyway
[11:08:32] <cyanide> lol
[11:08:51] <amee2k> doesn't really help the problem that i can't stand it
[11:14:46] <pentths> i have a fuse pb with a mega88 : impossible to connect with avrdude (rc = -1) but the program running on it (pwm generation) still work.
[11:15:08] <pentths> did someone already has this kind of issue?
[11:16:51] <pentths> the wrong fuse I put was : low power crystal 8-16 MHz
[11:24:14] <Kevin`> pentths: can you tell the clock speed the chip is running at? it might be lower or unstable with the wrong option selected
[11:24:23] <Kevin`> or just try your programmer at a low speed
[11:25:46] <pentths> Kevin`: thanks for answering
[11:26:33] <pentths> Kevin`: the chip seems to run at the sames speed it use to run befor ( internal clock 8 MHz )
[11:26:44] <amee2k> CapnKernel: mmh, did i muss the price for your example quote?
[11:27:09] <Kevin`> pentths: you have an 8mhz crystal connected to it?
[11:27:43] <Steffann> Why they didn't make the usb A connector a little bit more robust?
[11:27:46] <pentths> Kevin`: no . Nothing. The xtal1 give about 0.6v
[11:27:54] <Steffann> I changed the shape of them with the wheels of my chair all the time
[11:27:57] <Steffann> -d
[11:28:08] <Kevin`> pentths: why did you select the fuse option for an external crystal without one connected?
[11:28:24] <pentths> Kevin`: my mistake >_<
[11:28:39] <amee2k> Steffann: check out SATA connectors, then you'll think USB ones are an orgasmic explosion of sturctural integrity :P
[11:29:01] <pingec> Is code execution slower when debugging via debugwire? I mean will my "wait 1ms" routine take longer than it's supposed to when in debugwire mode?
[11:29:29] <Kevin`> pentths: you can supply a clock signal to the clock input pin even when it's set to the crystal oscillator mode. or just connect a crystal or similar to it
[11:29:40] <Steffann> True amee2k .. but most of the SATA cables are INSIDE your computer
[11:30:01] <pentths> Kevin`: clock input means XTAL1 ?
[11:30:19] <amee2k> they're still a bitch to handle in cases where a) the connector is outside for once or b) you're inside the computer with the connector ;)
[11:30:24] <Kevin`> pingec: if you just let the chip run, it will run the same speed. if you have it step through line by line, slower of course
[11:30:39] <Kevin`> pentths: it's specified in the datasheet, check
[11:30:51] <pentths> Kevin`: because i did, with a attiny45. but it's still impossible to change fuse or flash any code.
[11:31:08] <pingec> So if I don't have any breakpoints inside the wait routine it will execute without any overhead
[11:31:37] <Kevin`> pentths: did you disable isp or reset too?
[11:31:46] <Kevin`> pentths: or enable debugwire?
[11:33:25] <Casper> pentths: how did you provided the clock?
[11:34:58] <pentths> Kevin`: I did't change the 'high fuse bit'. Never use debugwire.
[11:35:33] <pentths> Casper: I use a attiny with simple code ( 0-> PB3 1 -> PB3 in a loop)
[11:35:48] <pentths> Casper: but it only give about 200KHz
[11:36:07] <keenerd> Ugh, PCB cart wants an email before letting you use their quote calculator.
[11:36:08] <Casper> then if you have only such a slow speed you will need to slow down the programmer
[11:36:48] <asteve> keenerd: chest@icl.es
[11:36:55] <Kevin`> pentths: you have to run your programmer's clock at 50khz or less then
[11:37:19] <Kevin`> (at least I think it's 1/4, might be 1/2)
[11:38:07] <pentths> Casper: What a don't get so is : the chip work without the external clock.
[11:38:27] <Casper> maybe due to the noise?
[11:38:31] <pentths> how to change the programmer's clock?
[11:39:06] <pentths> Casper: it's about twice quicker without the external clock plug.
[11:40:20] <Casper> unstable clock due to noise..
[11:41:40] <pentths> Casper: maybe... a little bit creepy in fact
[11:41:53] <pentths> changing the avrdude bitclock seems to work.
[11:42:27] <pentths> Casper and Kevin`: thanks !
[11:44:01] <Casper> your avr was picking noise from a local noise source, possibly a local AM radio station
[11:44:08] <Casper> the pin was acting like an antenna
[11:45:05] <Kevin`> remember that the pin is also connected to the chip's oscillator
[11:45:21] <Kevin`> the crystal just regulates it
[11:46:48] <pentths> ok
[11:47:36] <pentths> is there any way to read the internal clock use ?
[11:48:47] <Kevin`> set the clkout fuse or just have some software output some random divided version of the clock to a pin
[11:51:29] <keenerd> Sigh. Now I rememeber why I don't watch EEV. Even at 130% speed, Dave is still too slow. Where did he get a bench scope with unisolated probe ground anyway?
[11:54:28] <pentths> Kevin`: finaly get the clkout set correctly.. thanks!
[11:55:34] <pentths> if the internal clock is at 8MHz, the maximum wave generation is about 4MHz ?
[11:56:55] <Kevin`> pentths: using software or a timer, 4mhz. using clkout, 8mhz of course
[11:57:38] <Kevin`> (probably 2mhz from software, but that depends on how you code it)
[11:58:37] <pentths> Kevin`: in fact i'll be generating something more close to PWM than simple wave
[12:21:12] <Jan-> hihi :)
[12:23:22] <pentths> hi!
[12:23:30] <Jan-> crikey
[12:23:34] * Jan- tries to work out how to say pentths
[12:30:24] <amee2k> i don't suppose there are many people in here sending stuff my german post on a regular basis, eh?
[12:32:04] <Steffanx> my = by?
[12:32:15] <amee2k> err, yeah >_>
[12:32:30] <Steffanx> I only receive 'stuff' from Germany :)
[12:32:56] <pthomas> I send stuff to Germany by usps sometimes
[12:33:21] <amee2k> https://www.efiliale.de/efiliale/katalog/produkt.jsp?Item=prod350034&parentCat=cat870003 << i just got kinda sick of finding this for the 20th time....
[12:33:34] <amee2k> http://www.deutschepost.de/dpag?tab=1&skin=hi&check=yes&lang=de_DE&xmlFile=link1015116_832 << ... before finding this
[12:33:50] <amee2k> http://omploader.org/vY3VxNg/post-schablone.pdf << ... so i made this instead >_>
[12:33:53] <Jan-> I don't speak good enough German
[12:33:58] <Jan-> what's it say
[12:34:46] <amee2k> oh, right. the first one by the picture is a stencil where you shove in your letter to find out what size class it is and what portage you need for it
[12:34:57] <Jan-> OK makes sense
[12:35:13] <amee2k> well, they want 5EUR for it. plus shipping.
[12:35:25] <Jan-> they want 5 euros
[12:35:27] <Jan-> plus shipping
[12:35:28] <Jan-> ...for the chart?
[12:35:32] <amee2k> yes.
[12:35:40] <Jan-> no wonder germany is rich
[12:36:05] <amee2k> the second link is the "normal" price list with size and weight limits for each class. thats what all other parcel services i usually use have no more than 2 clicks away from their home page
[12:36:43] <amee2k> the third link is my own size chart... print on heavy weight paper, laminate, cut out the grey parts marked as "x", be happy >_>
[12:38:12] <Jan-> Germans eh
[12:39:12] <Jan-> You're German, right?
[12:39:37] * Jan- checks for "Hergestellt in Deutschland" on amee2k's butt
[12:39:44] <amee2k> yep
[12:39:45] <amee2k> 0.0
[12:40:13] <Jan-> so uh
[12:40:26] <amee2k> my chart looks better, costs two sheets of paper, and can measure all dimensions (minimum and maximum) for all classes except "small parcel" and the maximum length of the two large letter classes
[12:40:37] <Jan-> it's characteristically organised and precise of you to make a chart :)
[12:41:13] <amee2k> (the max length is 353mm which doesn't fit on an A4 page. it has markings on the side to measure the minimums of 100mm and 140mm though :)
[12:41:30] <amee2k> yep :)
[12:41:35] <Jan-> here in the UK, we'd walk down to the post office, scowl about it briefly, then pay extra for the proepr postage
[12:41:51] <Jan-> in Italy they'd have a huge argument with lots of arm waving and shouting
[12:42:18] <amee2k> well, ostensibly. in real life, i'm about to send a lot of small stuff by mail and since i was kinda pissed off by them wanting money for the fucking price list
[12:42:21] <Jan-> but in Germany, ve vill ensure ze package ist marked viz zer KORREKT postage, BEFORE ve take it to ze post office!
[12:42:38] * Jan- snickers evilly
[12:42:38] <amee2k> i thought why not make my own chart just to let off some steam >_>
[12:43:25] <Jan-> fuck the system eh
[12:43:27] <pthomas> note: wait for the 32kHz internal RC to be ready BEFORE trying to enable the DFLL, it's takes much longer than the 32 MHz to be ready, and if you try to enable the DFLL before that it won't let you
[12:43:29] <Jan-> how very ungerman of you :)
[12:43:41] <amee2k> well, i can ask for packages on the counter anyway
[12:44:10] <amee2k> but i can put the postage on letter-sized stuff on my own, then just drop it into a large box without having to wait in line for ages
[12:44:41] <Jan-> same here
[12:45:06] <amee2k> i haven't tried it but it looks like you can even "order" stamps online now and get a pic of a QR tag like barcode when you check out
[12:45:20] <amee2k> then print that and put it on the letter/package/whatever
[12:45:48] <Jan-> I'm pretty sure you can do that here
[12:45:51] <Jan-> I don't deal with a lot of mail
[12:46:23] <amee2k> they have a kind of vending machine for stamps at the post office though where you enter what kind and how many you want and it prints them
[12:46:52] <Jan-> a friend of mine just got back from frankfurt
[12:46:55] <Jan-> well, a colleague really
[12:46:59] <Jan-> she says it was really, really dull
[12:47:09] <Jan-> a lot of people from the UK say Germany is boring, I don't know if it is :)
[12:47:25] <Jan-> the only germans I knew liked to drink very large amounts of beer, so they didn't seem boring.
[12:47:43] <amee2k> well, it is kinda boring
[12:47:53] <Jan-> Compared to what
[12:48:13] <amee2k> compared to pretty much everything i guess
[12:48:26] <amee2k> except for germany, there is nothing here
[12:48:28] <amee2k> >_>
[12:48:32] * amee2k shrugs
[12:48:33] <Jan-> oh well
[12:48:38] <Jan-> being boring seems to be profitable
[12:48:45] <Jan-> you're the richest country in europe
[12:48:46] <amee2k> i've got a mild social disability though because i don't like beer
[12:48:47] <Jan-> including the UK
[12:48:58] * amee2k takes a long look in his wallet
[12:49:04] <amee2k> mmh... rich...
[12:49:23] <Jan-> Yes but there are no pot holes in the roads and you aren't dismantling your military.
[12:49:37] <Jan-> And your healthcare can afford, you know, aspirin
[12:49:52] <amee2k> i know at least 3 potholes in this town off the top of my head
[12:50:04] <Jan-> Three?! Haaaaa. There's three in this STREET
[12:50:18] <Jan-> anyway can you please get rid of that Merkel woman
[12:50:22] <Jan-> her German is really hard to understand
[12:50:26] <Jan-> and she doesn't seem to speak English
[12:50:28] <amee2k> well, thats what it used to be like where i lived before
[12:51:24] <amee2k> and instead of dismantling the military and blowing the money on hookers instead, we go cleaning up behind other country's playing world police so we can get shot in the butt (and even deserve it)
[12:51:45] <Jan-> oh don't worry
[12:51:47] <Jan-> that goes for us too
[12:51:55] <Jan-> but seriously, you're a) german, and b) male, and you don't like beer?
[12:52:01] * Jan- suspects amee2k of being some sort of alien android
[12:52:02] <amee2k> nope
[12:52:18] * amee2k looks
[12:52:21] <Jan-> but germans love beer!
[12:52:22] <amee2k> hmm... i'm orange
[12:52:35] <Jan-> germans single-handedly invented the beer mug with a lid, so it doesn't overflow when you're conducting the singing!
[12:52:50] <amee2k> i think that is enough to qualify as industrial robot, but no alien android yet
[12:52:54] <abcminiuser> MannImMond, check your email
[12:53:00] <abcminiuser> There's hope, perhaps
[12:53:42] <amee2k> well, the taste is disgusting and so are people who have had excessive amounts of it
[12:53:55] <Jan-> Germans get drunk?
[12:53:59] <Jan-> Oh yes of course they do
[12:54:00] <amee2k> yes
[12:54:06] <Jan-> then they start singing Horst Wessel Lied
[12:54:07] <Jan-> :/
[12:54:09] <amee2k> or what else do you think they do with the beer??
[12:54:21] <Jan-> well I was thinking they're too organised and precise to get drunk.
[12:54:27] <Jan-> But then I remembered about Horst Wessel Lied
[12:54:36] <amee2k> and who the fuck is horst wessel?
[12:54:57] <amee2k> well, from the context nevermind
[12:55:02] <amee2k> i don't think i want to know anyway
[12:55:10] <Jan-> I thought it was rather inappropriate
[12:55:12] <Jan-> but it was hilarious
[12:55:31] <amee2k> maybe it was hilarious because it was inappropriate?
[12:55:36] <Jan-> Yes.
[12:55:43] <amee2k> :)
[12:55:51] <Jan-> I suspect if you'd done it in Germany you might have got arrested
[12:56:12] <amee2k> not that getting arrested is difficult in germany
[12:56:15] <Jan-> but this was a bunch of German students in the UK, who were bored of hearing jokes about a) being precise and organised, and b) hitler.
[12:56:33] <amee2k> well, *actually* getting arrested maybe. just fines are much more popular
[12:57:00] <Jan-> My friend told me there's laws about when you're allowed to cut your lawn in Frankfurt.
[12:57:05] <Jan-> That is quite obsessive, you have to admit
[12:57:24] <amee2k> german law is quite obsessive
[12:57:38] <Jan-> oh hell
[12:57:42] <Jan-> they really WOULD
[12:57:43] <Jan-> With the end of the Nazi regime in May 1945, the Horst-Wessel-Lied was banned, and the lyrics and tune are now illegal in Germany and Austria except for educational purposes.
[12:57:52] <amee2k> and german pigs err... cops are the last step before rapists and child molestors
[12:57:53] * Jan- now finds that incident even more hilarious
[12:58:02] <Jan-> Ouch. Have much trouble with the law?
[12:58:21] <amee2k> i don't. and i want it to stay that way :P
[12:59:02] <amee2k> that it is so easy to get into trouble could be the reason why germany is so boring
[12:59:10] <Jan-> "geschlossen" is like tight or close together, right?
[12:59:26] <amee2k> mmh, yeah
[12:59:33] <Jan-> well
[12:59:36] <Jan-> it's easy to get into trouble here too
[12:59:39] <Jan-> but it's not so boring
[12:59:45] <amee2k> mostly like closed i'd say
[12:59:54] <Jan-> ok that's a direct translation then
[13:00:04] <Jan-> die reihen fest geschlossen
[13:00:34] <amee2k> hmm... "the rows are very compact" ?
[13:00:39] <amee2k> hard to translate out of context
[13:00:45] <Jan-> I think it's a military term
[13:00:48] <Jan-> in which case "the ranks are closed"|
[13:00:50] <amee2k> or "the rows are tightly packed"
[13:01:01] <Jan-> "closed ranks" in english is "marching close together"
[13:01:06] <amee2k> yeah, ranks would fit better in a military context
[13:01:47] <Jan-> *sigh* why does everyone speak such good English
[13:01:56] <Jan-> I have no idea what "ranks" is in German
[13:02:02] <Jan-> other than from that example
[13:02:18] <Jan-> oh, I do know one german drill command!
[13:02:20] <amee2k> i have no idea either without any context
[13:02:25] * Jan- shouts: Die waffen, legt AN!
[13:02:31] <amee2k> it has like a dozen translations
[13:02:49] <amee2k> lol
[13:05:45] <Jan-> reihen, noun
[13:05:50] <Jan-> front or gemeinen?
[13:06:01] <Jan-> zahlt?
[13:06:21] <amee2k> hu?
[13:06:58] <Jan-> google translate is made of suck and lose
[13:07:05] <amee2k> yes, quite
[13:07:12] <Casper> it used to be better
[13:07:13] <amee2k> maybe try dict.leo.org
[13:07:27] <Jan-> actually I don't want to get sidetracked
[13:07:37] <Jan-> I'm trying to improve my Japanese
[13:07:42] <amee2k> hehe
[13:07:49] * amee2k is mildly considering russian
[13:07:50] <Jan-> nobody's impressed if you can speak romance languages
[13:07:59] <Casper> and google search is annoying me: it somehow link words to pages... but those are only pointing to it, but is in no way related...
[13:08:01] <Jan-> but japanese, everyone assumes you have an IQ of 170
[13:08:04] <Casper> and no way to turn that thing off
[13:08:11] <amee2k> germany is still the country of engineers
[13:08:12] <Jan-> of course, to learn Japanese, you need an IQ of 170.
[13:08:14] <Jan-> :(
[13:08:14] * amee2k peens forcefully
[13:08:20] <amee2k> italy was the romance fags
[13:08:22] <Jan-> peens?
[13:08:50] <amee2k> yes
[13:08:56] <keenerd> amee2k: I hope you are talking about the hammer.
[13:08:58] <pentths> no japanese is simple
[13:09:04] <amee2k> to peen, beat, hammer, pound
[13:09:20] <Jan-> right
[13:09:24] <Jan-> pentths: you're off your face
[13:09:26] * amee2k forcefully peens on a telegraph key
[13:09:30] <amee2k> like this, see?
[13:09:43] <Jan-> yeah, yeah, I know the word
[13:09:47] <Jan-> it's just a rather unusual use
[13:09:48] <amee2k> :P
[13:10:50] <keenerd> Interestingly enough, my dictionary only has it as a noun, not a verb. "the part of a hammerhead opposite the flat striking surface"
[13:11:07] <amee2k> okay
[13:11:12] <Jan-> well normally it's a "ball peen hammer"
[13:11:19] <Jan-> using it as a verb is unusual
[13:11:25] <dirty_d> i need a drink
[13:11:28] <Jan-> unusual enough that I had to ask you for clarification.
[13:11:37] <amee2k> dirty_d: perfect. i need to pee. deal?
[13:11:43] <dirty_d> lol
[13:12:09] <amee2k> :)
[13:12:12] * amee2k blinks
[13:17:57] * Jan- offers amee2k a little cake
[13:18:12] * amee2k noms
[13:22:56] <amee2k> hrm. is 15 ECTS credits too small for a semester?
[13:22:59] * amee2k scratches head
[13:23:38] <specing> You have to have 30
[13:24:08] <amee2k> well, i'm supposed to but i can't find anything else that'll fit
[13:24:29] <specing> "fit" as in?
[13:25:14] <amee2k> stuff that doesn't have requirements i don't have yet, and that i actually have a chance to show up for occasionally
[13:27:35] <amee2k> the last two semesters were pretty upside down for me because i had a couple operations and missed some things
[13:28:10] <amee2k> now i'm trying to fit together all the things that didn't work out so i can (hopefully) get back to the normal program next year
[13:29:49] <amee2k> i tried to push in as much as i can... even got two occasions where i have to find a way to be in two places at once
[13:29:55] <amee2k> but the time table is still pretty empty
[13:33:29] <amee2k> and i can't take two classes because i have other classes that are requirements this semester
[13:36:10] <amee2k> on the upside it gives me some spare time to do this free MITx thing that starts next month \o/
[13:41:25] <Steffanx> Nice monologue amee2k
[13:43:06] <amee2k> :P
[13:43:14] <amee2k> thats what i usually do, yes
[13:43:31] <amee2k> Steffanx: got any thoughts to share? :P
[13:44:38] <Steffanx> Nothing related to this channel, no
[13:44:49] <amee2k> and unrelated?
[13:44:57] <amee2k> :)
[13:46:47] <Steffanx> There's already enough off-topic talk here, so.. no :P
[13:47:50] <amee2k> lol
[14:00:51] <OndraSter> heya
[14:00:53] <OndraSter> daddy's home!
[14:06:55] <amee2k> Steffanx: well, at least we're having great on topic talk in the meantime \o/
[14:14:41] <Steffanx> Still better than the offtopic talk amee2k
[14:15:11] <amee2k> well, you're welcome to have no talk any time
[14:15:21] <amee2k> makes your nick look much cooler on the user list
[14:16:02] <Steffanx> Yep
[14:29:43] <Steffanx> I didn't say I don't like your monologues amee2k :P
[14:30:17] <amee2k> i didn't say otherwise i think >_>
[14:30:24] <Steffanx> okok
[14:47:03] <Kre10s> i don't know much about gas, or asm for that matter. is there something like the C preprocessor for asm in gas?
[14:48:32] <RikusW> in AVR Studio 4 there is
[14:50:52] <amee2k> hmm gcc can preprocess assembly but i'm not sure how exactly it does that
[14:51:06] <amee2k> in any case, you can manually run a preprocessor of your choice over it
[15:02:10] <timemage> Kre10s, someone asked a question like that so long ago. near as we could find, there isn't a separate proprocessor for gas. sometimes people run cpp proprocessor on assembly files. i suggested they try m4.
[15:03:38] <RikusW> http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn21494-single-atom-transistor-gets-precise-position-on-chip.html
[15:05:09] <uv_> yes
[15:05:30] <uv_> this IS important
[15:07:58] <OndraSter> http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c112:H.R.1981:
[15:22:44] <Kre10s> timemage, m4? whats that?
[15:23:00] <timemage> Kre10s, another macro preprocessor.
[15:24:00] <timemage> Kre10s, it's used for autotools. also if you've ever had to configure sendmail, well they use it, or at least did 15 years ago.
[15:43:30] <RikusW> https://gist.github.com/1672254 -- 140 byte tetris -- this guy got the WPL licence :-D
[15:45:28] <Richard_Cavell> ah, it's not that good
[15:45:55] <Richard_Cavell> Casper: more soldering today mate
[15:46:10] <Richard_Cavell> I want to make the capacitance variable on my oscillator circuit
[15:46:22] <Richard_Cavell> I still don't fully understand how it works
[15:46:29] <Richard_Cavell> I'll just keep studying other stuff and hope it comes to me
[15:46:48] <dehuman> wut
[15:46:53] <dehuman> 140 byte tetris?
[16:01:57] <pentths> Richard_Cavell: variable .. any value or just a few value?
[16:02:11] <Richard_Cavell> just a few
[16:02:21] <Richard_Cavell> I have a 3-position switch and I'll make it 10, 20, 32 uF
[16:03:37] <Richard_Cavell> To learn how the circuit works I was thinking I could make it run really slow and put ammeters and voltmeters everywhere
[16:03:47] <pentths> so put 3 parallel capacitor and a tranistor controlling the 'accessibitity' of each one
[16:04:06] <Richard_Cavell> yeah that's what I'm going to do
[16:04:25] <Richard_Cavell> a 10 uF already in the circuit and the switch adds either none, 10 uF or 22 uF cap in parallel
[16:04:47] <pentths> must be working ...
[16:15:25] <RokLobsta> 140byte tetris plus a Javascript engine. Colour me impressed when it's just 140 bytes in assembly on a microcontroller, an no other code.
[16:17:19] <voodoofish430> RokLobsta: very impressive
[16:30:39] <OndraSter> RokLobsta, the thing is, what would you run it on
[16:30:49] <OndraSter> handling any kind of display would take at least 30 lines of assembler on its own :P
[16:30:53] <OndraSter> but ye, challenge accepted lol
[16:32:02] * RikusW fitted a CDC USB stack into 800 bytess ;)
[16:32:24] <asteve> center for disease control?
[16:32:36] <asteve> they have a stack of USBs the size of 800 bytes? how wasteful
[16:33:38] <RikusW> comms device class
[16:33:49] <RikusW> for a virtual serial port
[16:34:16] <RokLobsta> i think it's a bit misleading to say it's only 140bytes. I presumed that meant everything including the keyboard and screen code.
[16:34:45] <RokLobsta> which it doesn't. plus it gets to use all the baggage behind functions like .tostring.
[16:35:23] <keenerd> Demoscene will say it is 140 bytes. The go so far as to use the default OS sound clips as a source of texture graphics.
[16:35:38] <keenerd> It is all about what you can do by added a very little.
[16:35:46] <RokLobsta> anyway, the guts of what he's done is clever.
[16:36:42] * RikusW didn't even try to understand it, feeling too lazy ;)
[16:37:13] <RokLobsta> i wonder though if the true efficiency of an algorithm would be measured by how well it compresses.
[16:37:29] <RokLobsta> the better it compresses the less efficient it is.
[16:38:21] <asteve> RokLobsta: you may find an algorithm better compressed by a specific algorithm for compressing, what does that mean?
[17:12:40] <Kre10s> how can i get avr-ld to give me the current linker map its using?
[17:41:45] <Tom_itx> ok what can we fix tonight?
[17:46:05] <RokLobsta> Have you fixed the washing machine like Mrs Tom_itx asked?
[17:46:44] <Tom_itx> did that last month
[17:47:03] <Tom_itx> bearings went out so i put new ones in it
[17:47:11] <Tom_itx> next.
[17:47:15] <RokLobsta> machines so cheap, just buy a new one
[17:47:15] <amee2k> depends. what broken stuff do you have around as potential candidates?
[17:47:26] <amee2k> RokLobsta: people are cheaper
[17:47:32] <RokLobsta> tom_itx what's your URL?
[17:47:57] <amee2k> well, if you don't have to pay for them if they get damaged anyway
[17:48:08] <Tom_itx> it's in /topic #avr
[17:48:22] <amee2k> got any power supplies to fix?
[17:48:27] * amee2k <3 power supplies
[17:48:29] <RokLobsta> well frickin' dug.
[17:48:31] <RokLobsta> duh
[17:48:36] <Tom_itx> i got 3 to build but i don't need them yet
[17:49:08] * amee2k . o O ( mmh big, manly power supplies... with big manly TO3s on it... )
[17:51:46] <RokLobsta> tom: i am looking into implementing a toaster oven. how have you found yours to be overall?
[17:51:55] <Tom_itx> super
[17:52:02] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/temp/cnc/psu1.jpg
[17:52:08] <Tom_itx> i got 3 of those to build
[17:52:28] <amee2k> thats some really nice transformers you've got there
[17:52:46] <Tom_itx> iirc, 32vac or so
[17:52:53] <Tom_itx> so ~48v dc?
[17:52:56] <Tom_itx> i forget
[17:53:03] <Tom_itx> 6A or so ea
[17:53:13] <Tom_itx> so 18A 48vdc?
[17:53:21] <Tom_itx> should be enough to blow something up
[17:53:26] <amee2k> lol yeah
[17:53:44] <amee2k> i've got the same kind of bridge rectifier on the right
[17:53:47] <amee2k> the silver one
[17:53:54] <Tom_itx> they're 25A i think
[17:54:00] <Tom_itx> one i got was 12
[17:54:15] <amee2k> got it and a 20-0-20 transformer from an old audio amplifier
[17:54:22] <Tom_itx> but i got some more and now have a set that matches
[17:54:40] <Tom_itx> dunno what these were off of but were surplus
[17:55:17] <amee2k> i'm estimating the transformer at 160-200VA from the size of it... all the other semis in the amp were trashed from a lightning event
[17:56:03] <amee2k> so i put the transformer, rectifier and caps into an old ATX PSU case to use as generic unregulated PSU, and sold the speakers of the amp systen to a friend of mine for some pizzas
[17:56:18] <Tom_itx> i was gonna use em on my steppers
[17:56:39] <Tom_itx> with some gecko drives or chinese counterparts
[17:56:47] <amee2k> nice
[17:57:56] <amee2k> i used the supply for playing with discrete regulator designs back then
[17:58:12] <amee2k> but i don't have much these days that needs a dual supply anymore
[17:58:51] <Tom_itx> these have 2 secondaries i paralled on each one
[17:59:07] <Tom_itx> gotta get the phases right when you do that
[18:00:14] <amee2k> center tapped winding on mine... measures 23Vac unloaded so i'm pointing at 20-0-20
[18:00:41] <amee2k> the xformer only has a manufacturer type number on it, no specs
[18:00:42] <Tom_itx> what's the V multiplier gonig from ac to dc?
[18:00:44] <Tom_itx> i forget
[18:00:49] <amee2k> 1.4 for sine
[18:00:49] <Tom_itx> going*
[18:00:53] <Tom_itx> yeah
[18:01:04] <amee2k> i usually use 1.5, then generously round off
[18:01:11] <amee2k> easier to do quickly in my head
[18:26:16] <amee2k> BANANULAR PHONE!
[19:01:25] <dirty_d> omg
[19:01:33] <dirty_d> yikes
[19:02:03] <dirty_d> looks like im gonna have to spend around $450 for all of these quadcopter parts
[19:02:27] <dirty_d> maybe some crazy son of a bitch will buy it for $1000 when its done
[19:02:39] <dirty_d> then i can build one for free
[19:03:22] <dehuman> have you seen the swarm video from GRASP at uni penn
[19:03:29] <dehuman> its on youtube
[19:03:35] <dehuman> nano quadcopter
[19:04:18] <dehuman> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQIMGV5vtd4
[19:04:29] <dehuman> there are other videos of other of tehir copters
[23:07:15] <rue_house> cool eh?
