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[00:04:38] <sptrks> I heard I should wait a little bit to try 5.0
[00:06:04] <theDarkAura> ahh thats no fun :(
[00:06:07] <theDarkAura> hehe
[00:06:39] <sptrks> I am running this code in AVR studio
https://www.mainframe.cx/~ckuethe/avr-c-tutorial/lesson1.c
[00:06:53] <sptrks> And the simulator is not updating the port values as it loops
[00:07:00] <sptrks> Any idea why?
[00:07:05] <sptrks> (I am new to AVR Studio)
[00:12:25] <sptrks> I figured it out
[00:12:41] <sptrks> delay_ms() takes much longer in the simulator than RL
[00:21:09] <Roklobsta_> sptrks: 5.1 (just out) seems better than 5.0 and 4.19 is fine too.
[00:21:39] <sptrks> Alright well I may upgrade then
[00:22:10] <Roklobsta_> sptrks: don't foget you don't need either and you can use AVARICE and Insight and your favourite text editor
[00:22:31] <Roklobsta_> what are you using for a debugger or programmer?
[00:23:14] <sptrks> I just ordered a Avr MKII ISP
[00:24:20] <Roklobsta_> for US$49 the Dragon is not much more and lets you debug step by step too
[00:24:28] <theDarkAura> should get a dragon if you get a chance
[00:24:34] <theDarkAura> yeah
[00:24:37] <sptrks> I could cancel my order
[00:24:44] <sptrks> I literally ordered it tonight
[00:24:53] <theDarkAura> i would
[00:24:53] <sptrks> Should I?
[00:24:56] <Roklobsta_> i have the dragin and MCUZONEs mkII-CN which is about $US80
[00:24:56] <sptrks> K
[00:25:12] <sptrks> it will be able to program everything just like the mk2
[00:25:19] <Roklobsta_> cancel. dragon will do the same as mkii ISP PLUS IDE debugging
[00:25:34] <Roklobsta_> er... i think the dragon works with all AVRs
[00:25:34] <sptrks> nice
[00:25:42] <Roklobsta_> don't quote me on that.
[00:25:46] <theDarkAura> plus jtag and HVD
[00:26:00] <Roklobsta_> the JTAG mkII-CN works with AVR32 as well.
[00:26:05] <theDarkAura> jtag programming is much faster
[00:26:42] <Roklobsta_> i got my mkii-cn from hong kong off ebay. only took a week and their support is good.
[00:27:31] <Roklobsta_> just type "mkii-cn" into ebay search
[00:27:55] <sptrks> I am trying to figure out how to cancel my digikey order
[00:28:17] <Roklobsta_> it works with 5.0 and 4.19 and they told me today firmware to work with 5.1 should be out in a week.
[00:29:04] <Roklobsta_> there is nothing wrong with using an ISP but being able to set breakpoints and inspect the innards while your code is running is too nice a feature to miss.
[00:29:31] <Roklobsta_> and with the dragon it's only $20 more than the ISP
[00:29:53] <Roklobsta_> just cut up your credit card.
[00:31:07] <sptrks> do you use a regular programming cable with the dragon like you do with the mk2?
[00:32:47] <Roklobsta_> http://store.atmel.com/PartDetail.aspx?q=p:10500053 check the device you want will work with it.
[00:32:52] <Roklobsta_> yes.
[00:33:11] <Roklobsta_> 5x2 pin JTAG cable.
[00:33:22] <theDarkAura> yeah it has headers for JTAG -- also has a "prototype area"
[00:33:37] <sptrks> So it has all the cables/hardware I will need to use it out of the box?
[00:33:40] <Roklobsta_> prototype area is useless
[00:33:42] <theDarkAura> i havent foudn a use for the prototype area
[00:33:45] <theDarkAura> yeah
[00:33:59] <sptrks> good catch guys. I am glad you said something
[00:34:10] <theDarkAura> especially the landings for the smt stuff :P
[00:34:13] <Roklobsta_> no you just get a dragon. look
http://store.atmel.com/PartDetail.aspx?q=p:10500053
[00:34:46] <Roklobsta_> you will need to make your own header cables but that as easy as getting some ribbin cable and pressfit headers.
[00:34:59] <Landon> theDarkAura: I put a zif socket in the prototype area
[00:35:12] <sptrks> Header cables?
[00:35:16] <theDarkAura> you'll need a few header pins -- some idc connectors and some ribbon cable
[00:35:40] <sptrks> So I do need additional hardware... hmm
[00:35:46] <Roklobsta_> idc press fit. your favourite electronics store will have a tonne of theml
[00:36:01] <theDarkAura> :P if your going to do much dev its stuff youll need anyways
[00:36:01] <sptrks> gotcha
[00:36:08] <sptrks> True dat
[00:36:12] <Roklobsta_> idc headers and some ribbon cable might cost you $5 if that.
[00:36:37] <Roklobsta_> make sure you have a vice so you get and even press when you squeeze it togethher.
[00:36:56] <nevyn> or parallel jaw pliers.
[00:37:22] <Roklobsta_> or use the car tyres and *gently* drive over it.
[00:37:24] <theDarkAura> Landon, yeah ... i tried that too -- kept breaking off wires trying to move them around for different uc's
[00:38:07] <theDarkAura> lol -- i squeeze mine with vise grips
[00:38:30] <theDarkAura> have broken a couple though..
[00:38:31] <sptrks> did you guys put the dragon in any kind of enclosure?
[00:38:37] <theDarkAura> not me
[00:38:38] <Landon> I keep it in the box :P
[00:38:41] <Landon> with a couple of holes cut out
[00:38:44] <sptrks> LOL
[00:38:48] <Roklobsta_> sptrks: i made my own. see
http://helix.air.net.au/helix/index.php/avrdude-and-ftdi-232h/ you can use the one cable for ISP and JTAG.
[00:38:51] <Landon> let me find a picture
[00:39:23] <Landon> http://lfowles.org/media/photologue/photos/DSCF2002.JPG
[00:40:02] <Roklobsta_> hey nice ZIF and rainbow mess.
[00:40:06] <sptrks> What are those two parallel things?
[00:40:24] <Landon> sptrks: which two parallel things?
[00:40:26] <theDarkAura> your poor zif lever cant go down :(
[00:40:42] <Landon> I cut a notch out after taking that picture
[00:40:58] <theDarkAura> maybe you mean the zif socket sptrks ?
[00:41:05] <Landon> oh
[00:41:09] <sptrks> Yea those are awesome
[00:41:13] <sptrks> do those come with it?
[00:41:16] <theDarkAura> nope
[00:41:16] <Landon> no
[00:41:21] <Landon> I had to buy that and the headers extra
[00:41:21] <sptrks> damn
[00:41:24] <theDarkAura> those run $5 or so
[00:41:28] <theDarkAura> can get on ebay cheaper
[00:41:30] <sptrks> That's what you were talking about
[00:41:45] <sptrks> Cool
[00:42:21] <theDarkAura> dont buy zif from digikey ;)
[00:42:27] <sptrks> Alright well thank you so much for your help everyone
[00:42:33] <sptrks> I have to go to bed
[00:42:34] <theDarkAura> i remember some being $40 on there when i was looking
[00:42:45] * Landon bought zif from digikey :(
[00:42:48] <Landon> it wasn't that bad though
[00:42:51] <Roklobsta_> sptrks: do you live near an electronics store:
[00:42:57] <sptrks> Rat shack
[00:42:59] <sptrks> that's about it
[00:43:04] <Roklobsta_> they will have it
[00:43:05] <Roklobsta_> them
[00:43:07] <Landon> that's probably what I spent on extras for the dragon (small quantities cost D:)
[00:43:20] <sptrks> they will have zif connectors?
[00:43:33] <Roklobsta_> two idc 2x5 (10pin) female headers and some ribbon. $5.
[00:43:47] <theDarkAura> they will have those sockets -- i doubt they have zifs
[00:44:16] <Roklobsta_> i haven't seen a zif socket since, oh, 1997
[00:44:34] <Roklobsta_> motherboards excluded.
[00:44:45] <theDarkAura> better to get a zif if you want to prgram the chips right on the board -- sockets are likely to break pins
[00:45:23] <theDarkAura> i got a dozen 3m zifs i got from HK for less then $15
[00:45:44] <sptrks> The headers are just standard pin headers right?
[00:45:53] <theDarkAura> yeah
[00:46:00] <theDarkAura> .1 spaced
[00:46:31] <sptrks> Cool
[00:46:39] <sptrks> alright bed time for me
[00:46:41] <sptrks> thanks for the help
[00:46:44] <theDarkAura> :)
[00:46:45] <sptrks> catch you later everyone
[00:48:01] <Roklobsta_> bedtime? you're no hacker.
[00:48:34] <theDarkAura> :P
[00:48:42] <theDarkAura> late here too
[00:52:15] <Roklobsta_> it's only 5:42 pm, not late at all
[00:53:06] <em> do you live in Hawaii?
[00:53:15] <em> oh maybe in aussi?
[00:53:46] <Roklobsta_> no, a coastline for which Antartica is the next lump of land.
[00:54:14] <em> wow cool
[00:54:27] <em> oh crap im so sorry everyone i just now realised i wasn't chatting in the channel I thought I was chatting in
[00:54:40] <em> I wondered why i didn't recognise your nicks!
[00:55:40] <em> lol
[00:55:57] <em> I partook of adulterants
[00:57:21] <Roklobsta_> stay off the PCB cleaner.
[00:58:06] <GuShH> rue_house: Do you have pics or information on your lawnmower bot?
[01:00:53] <rue_house> !assist robots/mowerbot/
[01:00:58] <rue_house> sigh
[01:01:38] <rue_house> !time
[01:01:39] <tobbor> My watch says its 22:58 Sun Feb 19 2012
[01:01:44] <rue_house> !assist robots/mowerbot/
[01:01:45] <tobbor> Possibly
http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/robots/mowerbot/
[01:01:48] <rue_house> or
[01:01:50] <rue_house> !assist robots/mowerbot2/
[01:01:51] <tobbor> Possibly
http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/robots/mowerbot2/
[01:02:59] <rue_house> GuShH,
[01:03:02] <rue_house> ^^
[01:03:13] <GuShH> thanks!
[01:03:28] <rue_house> I think the disk image of the older one is on there to
[01:03:31] <rue_house> its a 1.2M floppy
[01:05:33] <rue_house> GuShH, ask anything you want to know
[01:06:47] <Roklobsta_> Uh Sunday was so yesterday.
[01:10:56] <GuShH> rue_house: pretty cool, still functional?
[01:32:36] <rue_house> yes
[01:32:42] <rue_house> after waaay more than 10 years
[01:32:53] <rue_house> lots of mods tho
[01:33:35] <rue_house> new driver motors, new bumper, new drivers, new batteries, new drivetrain....
[01:33:53] <rue_house> its actually had 3 sets of batteries now
[01:49:11] <Casper> hi Richard_Cavell
[01:55:09] <Richard_Cavell> hiya
[01:55:13] <Richard_Cavell> today's a big day
[01:55:19] <Richard_Cavell> building an astable multivibrator
[01:55:39] <rue_house> 555?
[01:56:21] <Richard_Cavell> no, out of discrete components
[01:56:32] <Richard_Cavell> although a 555 obviously allows you to group some of those
[01:57:12] <rue_house> flipflop bipolar transistors?
[02:00:31] <Richard_Cavell> yep
[02:00:41] <Richard_Cavell> charged by resistor and capacitor in series
[02:01:58] <Richard_Cavell> I think the oscillator circuit is awesome
[02:02:05] <Richard_Cavell> Whoever invented it has my respect
[02:04:11] <Richard_Cavell> Tomorrow I'm going to improve on it. I want to put pots in, switches to vary the cap size
[02:14:40] <CapnKernel> Do it in software with an ATtiny85...
[02:15:06] <CapnKernel> You can get any frequency you want, and no need for hardware changes or switches.
[02:18:05] <Kevin`> heh
[02:21:52] <Valen> Richard_Cavell: you can get tuneable caps
[02:22:04] <Valen> though they are generally of a smallish value
[02:22:21] <Richard_Cavell> my circuit has 10 uF
[02:26:57] <Richard_Cavell> I'll just make it so that you can switch in additional caps in parallel or series
[04:46:07] <Richard_Cavell> Casper: rue_house see my circuit
http://imagebin.org/199789 http://imagebin.org/199788
[04:46:30] <Richard_Cavell> it turned out rather neat
[04:46:32] <Richard_Cavell> surprisingly
[06:03:25] <Roklobsta_> did you burn yourself at least once with the iron?
[06:12:09] <Kre10s> how can I make sure a certain global variable will be positioned at a certain position in sram?
[06:12:58] <specing_> Kre10s: something with __attribute__
[06:13:43] <specing_> Kre10s: also, if you want to call it from assembler, you can just add asm ("name") to its declaration
[06:14:08] <Kre10s> call?
[06:27:14] <ziph> Kre10s: A linker map.
[06:29:55] <ziph> Kre10s: You use an __attribute__ to tell it to go to a specific section and then use a linker map entry to put it where you want in memory.
[06:43:47] <Kre10s> nice.
[06:47:16] <CapnKernel1> I have a laptop LCD backlight inverter with four connections: "VIN/ON/ADJ/GND". I know VIN/GND is 12V. But I have no idea about the other two. Any ideas?
[06:47:47] <specing_> Its fricking abvious -.-
[06:47:59] <specing_> obvious*
[06:49:34] <Tom_itx> maybe: VIN/ENABLE/BRIGHNESS/GND
[06:52:38] <CapnKernel1> specing: It may be abvious to you, so how about you tell me whether those signals are +3.3v, +5V or +12V?
[06:53:07] <CapnKernel1> Tom_itx: I think you're right. ADJ is a PWM signal.
[06:53:16] <CapnKernel1> But I still don't know the voltages.
[06:53:26] <CapnKernel1> These inverters are suitable for IBM T61 laptops
[06:54:46] <Tom_itx> no clue beyond that
[06:55:05] <specing_> :D
[06:55:30] <Tom_itx> start with 3.3v and work your way up?
[06:55:43] <CapnKernel1> specing_: You have clue?
[06:56:31] <Roklobsta_> i'd start at 20V and work down.
[06:56:50] <Tom_itx> well that just goes to show where you come from!
[06:57:01] <Roklobsta_> unadvice.
[06:57:35] <Roklobsta_> when the smoke stops coming out you know you've hit the right voltage.
[06:57:41] <specing_> Better start at 250V and work your way down :D
[06:58:00] <Tom_itx> at 250v you wouldn't need the inverter
[06:58:11] <Roklobsta_> to similate PWM tap the wire on the pad as fast as you can.
[06:58:21] <specing_> Tom_itx: Are you sure it works at 250V?
[06:58:22] <CapnKernel1> But according to specing_, it's "frickin abvious"!
[06:58:27] <specing_> Tom_itx: maybe it does 1000V
[06:59:31] <Tom_itx> A) they've had one too few coffees B) they've had one too many tequila shots
[07:01:47] <Roklobsta_> A) for me.
[07:02:23] <Roklobsta_> Arcade Fire isn't good for trying to read someone elses code.
[07:03:53] <Roklobsta_> oh progressive trace is better...
[07:05:17] <ziph> No music at all is better.
[07:06:57] <Roklobsta_> nah
[07:07:50] <ziph> There's some citations in The Psychology of Computer Programming, any kind of music is harmful.
[07:10:14] <Roklobsta_> yeah but music in 1971 when it was written was a bit twee.
[07:10:36] <Roklobsta_> there was no progressive trance to stream then.
[07:10:53] <CapnKernel1> Psychedelic trance means the difference between me concentrating for five minutes or five hours. I need it...
[07:11:39] <Roklobsta_> well, the music is drowning out the crickets and cows mooing.
[07:14:29] <ziph> If you can't concentrate for 5 minutes without entertainment you have bigger issues. :)
[07:17:05] <Valen> <- aqua for the tuning out of the backrounf
[07:17:09] <Valen> backround
[07:18:08] <Roklobsta_> that's all i am using it for is tuning out bg.
[07:21:17] <ziph> You don't have anywhere quiet to work?
[07:24:01] <Roklobsta_> it'
[07:24:05] <Roklobsta_> play, it's all play
[07:24:14] <Roklobsta_> midmight and I am playing.
[07:24:39] <Roklobsta_> good time to refactor code and debug.
[07:24:47] <Roklobsta_> what's the opionion on avrS5.1?
[07:25:14] <Roklobsta_> it seems better.
[07:25:35] <ziph> abcminiuse*r is the only person in here I recall using it.
[07:25:46] <Roklobsta_> oh are you all vi'ers?
[07:26:17] <ziph> I think it's more people resisting going from 4 to 5.
[07:26:37] <Roklobsta_> ah so. yes, 4.19 seems perfectly cromulent.
[07:26:50] <Roklobsta_> i am using notepad++ to edit but 4.19 to debug/
[07:28:16] <Roklobsta_> i've just written what must be the millionth GPRMC parser in the world.
[07:29:40] <ziph> You should've switched to binary mode and saved yourself the effort.
[07:31:20] <Roklobsta_> nah, the widget doesn't do binary.
[07:31:27] <Roklobsta_> poxy
[07:32:18] <Roklobsta_> i wonder how many systems only ever enable gprmc. i think most embedded system chew though all the other emitted garbage just to get the rmc message info.
[07:32:33] <Roklobsta_> and waste precious cpu cycles doing it.
[07:37:33] <ziph> Is it a SIRF based widget?
[07:38:19] <Roklobsta_> no
[07:38:23] <Roklobsta_> alas
[07:38:25] <Roklobsta_> no binary
[07:38:48] <ziph> I don't recall working with one that didn't have binary.
[07:38:59] <ziph> Some had undocumented binary based on the chipset though.
[07:39:01] <Roklobsta_> anyway, there are two possible gps sources, a telit modem and a gps 'mouse'
[07:39:36] <Roklobsta_> so a universal rmc handler is needed
[07:39:58] <Roklobsta_> i did have the misfortune of using sirf-ii stuff once. buggy crap
[07:40:27] <Roklobsta_> a sirf engineer admitted they stuffe dup the code.
[07:42:19] <Roklobsta_> I had the timestapms on the RMC message and ZDA message up to 20 mins different!
[07:42:46] <Roklobsta_> they had no idea why
[07:55:40] <norbi> hello guys, i know that tehre is a way to programm an atmega via serial if it has a bootloader
[07:56:14] <norbi> but a brand new chip, without any programmer how can be programmed in house made style?
[08:10:40] <Kevin`> norbi: avrdude and others can talk isp via a parallel or serial port used as gpio
[08:12:34] <Roklobsta_> norbi: how many do you need to do?
[08:13:53] <specing_> norbi: if you dont have a programer and you wish to program it in future through its bootloader, build yourself a dasa programmer
[08:17:15] <norbi> guys, the thing is that i have a friend, he is my colleague at college
[08:17:45] <norbi> and he wants to start learning mcu's, i sugested him to start learning with avr's
[08:18:19] <norbi> we are learning at school 8051 but, avr rocks and makes you wanna do this thing, so he said ok, i will but what you need to start with them?
[08:18:22] <specing_> norbi: You can program his bootloader, too
[08:18:41] <norbi> i give him one or two chips, but i cant give him my ISP
[08:19:06] <specing_> Ok, thats it
[08:19:14] * specing_ SLAPS norbi with a LARGE trout
[08:19:25] <norbi> specing_: yea i can, but i dont think that starting with bootloader is the best way, he doesnt know much about these things
[08:19:28] <Kevin`> assuming one of you can't afford the $20 or $50 for a proper programmer, just make an isp adapter with one of the avr chips
[08:19:50] * specing_ started with DASA :D
[08:20:07] * specing_ used DASA to program a USBtinyISP
[08:20:27] <norbi> Kevin`: i have some, but i dont know if he can afford it or not, i was just asking if it is necesary to buy one
[08:20:51] <norbi> specing_: why are you slaping me?:P:'(
[08:23:31] <norbi> specing_: i didn't meant that i don't want to give him my isp, i wanted to say that he needs something of his own, i can give it to him for a month for example, but still he needs to find his way to programm his chips
[08:23:56] <norbi> plus, again dunno if he can afford or not a programmer ordered online
[08:24:24] <norbi> i have jtag, isp, chip with bootloader so i have 3 methods to do that
[08:25:19] <norbi> Kevin`: you mean to make his own isp? with one of the chips?
[08:25:43] <specing_> norbi: WHY CANT YOU GIVE HIM A CHIP WITH PREPROGRAMMED BOOTLOADER?
[08:26:27] <norbi> specing_: i can, but what will he do with it? he needs rs232 converter or smth for serial comunication, right?
[08:26:50] <norbi> then i will overcomplicate his life at begining
[08:27:20] <specing_> norbi: he will need a serial port sooner or later
[08:27:43] <norbi> i want him to start learning these things, but with babysteps, when i started to learn i just needed the chip, a cap, 5V regulator and i had my isp ordered from the net, so it was easy to
[08:27:48] <specing_> And Im sure he has an old computer with a serial port.
[08:28:12] <norbi> specing_: probably...
[08:28:24] <norbi> but yet he is using a laptop just...
[08:28:46] <specing_> And many computer have a builtin serial port header anyway
[08:28:52] <specing_> Even easier to interface to
[08:29:14] <norbi> ok, then i will tell him this
[08:29:52] <norbi> another thing: did you ever tried to use grub with atmega?
[08:30:40] <Kevin`> grub is specific to x86. also it's for loading, not flashing
[08:31:15] <norbi> Kevin`: yea i know, its a bootloader too, but as i know there is a grub version for embedded
[08:31:29] <norbi> or not? ive readed about that somewhere and i cant find the article
[08:32:02] <Kevin`> grub is not usually a good choice for embedded, u-boot (or whatever it's called now) and reboot support a lot more platforms
[08:33:38] <norbi> what kind of mcu's deserve an operating system for embedded?
[08:33:56] <norbi> i think smth with arm architecture
[08:39:13] <norbi> what about this?
http://www.atmel.com/products/microcontrollers/ARM/sam9m.aspx
[08:41:32] <keenerd> Mips is common too.
[08:41:42] <Kevin`> norbi: you need external ram attached if you want to run an operating system. the few kilobytes built into the chip isn't enough for that
[08:42:32] <keenerd> norbi: The best board I found for getting started with embedded is the Teensy. Small, affordable, breadboardable and comes with a built in USB programmer.
[08:44:35] <norbi> keenerd: teensy? just a sec for look for it
[08:45:14] <specing_> < norbi> another thing: did you ever tried to use grub with atmega?
[08:45:18] <specing_> LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
[08:45:30] <norbi> Kevin`: external rams should be not a problem i think, the main problem is what architecture with minimal resources worth an operating system
[08:46:13] <norbi> specing_: i've readed about somewhere, with sdcard using grub and atmega for some project
[08:47:07] <norbi> specing_: these things are just for study, not for deploying real applications on the market
[08:53:36] <rudolf_> hi
[08:53:40] <rudolf_> I dont need to set or clear bits in GIFR register in order to activate or disable INT0 in atmega right?
[08:55:47] <specing_> no
[09:00:43] <rue_house> norbi, you know 8 bit avrs cant execute from ram right?
[09:01:15] <rudolf__> no?
[09:01:30] <rudolf__> I dont need to set GIFR or I am not right?
[09:01:45] <rudolf__> specing_
[09:02:17] <rudolf__> Actually I have this code of a program which uses INT0 and tis doin something with GIFR
[09:02:55] <os1r1s> Hey guys, can anyone answer a quick question regarding multiple UARTs on an avr?
[09:05:21] <os1r1s> I'm trying to change from receiving/transmitting on USART0 to communication on USART3 in an existing piece of code. Is it just a matter of changing the references from 0 to 3? Is there a listing?
[09:06:04] <keenerd> Check the data sheet for your chip, but 95% of the time it is that simple.
[09:07:28] <amee2k> hmm.... how much thickness can you build up on a PCB (compared to plain board with solder stop on it) by putting ground plane on it and tinning it during reflow soldering ?
[09:08:45] <os1r1s> keenerd: K. Thanks.
[09:09:20] <amee2k> os1r1s: yeah, usually changing the register names should do it. always check the datasheet though. i don't use multi-UART parts but other peripherals sometimes have subtle differences in available features
[09:09:34] <amee2k> (most notably timers i'd say)
[09:10:09] <amee2k> and make sure you really catch every instance that needs to be changed, including interrupts
[09:10:17] <rue_house> amee2k, about 25 thou if you go crazy
[09:10:32] <amee2k> "thou"?
[09:10:41] <rue_house> 1/1000"
[09:11:08] <os1r1s> keenerd: amee2k The data sheet looks like it contains some references, but not all. I'm wondering if some of the names are defined in an avr library.
[09:11:16] <amee2k> thats like 600um then?
[09:11:26] <amee2k> sounds awesome. i'm only 400um short \o/
[09:11:43] <rue_house> You have: 25 thou
[09:11:43] <rue_house> You want: mm
[09:11:44] <rue_house> * 0.635
[09:12:01] <amee2k> os1r1s: the register names are defined as macros in some header files, yes
[09:12:35] <keenerd> rue_house: Don't most people call those mils?
[09:12:56] <rue_house> You have: 1 thou
[09:12:56] <rue_house> You want: mil
[09:12:56] <rue_house> * 1
[09:13:14] <amee2k> lol
[09:13:39] <amee2k> calling a milli-inch a "thou" is even worse than calling a milli-meter a "mil" >_<
[09:13:58] <norbi> rue_house: no didnt known that they cant execute from ram
[09:14:44] <keenerd> Thou art you clad in copper?
[09:14:52] <rue_house> norbi, I dont know what you can do with the ones that use an external bus
[09:18:25] <norbi> rue_house: but we can add external memory to the atmega 8bit, right? and use indirect addressing
[09:19:27] <Kevin`> norbi: you can't run code from it unless the instruction memory is also connected somehow, which it isn't on avr8
[09:21:40] <norbi> Kevin`: yea but avr32?
[09:21:56] <Kevin`> norbi: avr32 can run code from ram
[09:24:30] <dirty_d> if i need to store calibration vlaues etc, i should use eeprom right?
[09:30:02] <rue_house> yes
[09:30:14] <rue_house> norbi, bu
[09:30:17] <rue_house> norbi, no
[09:31:08] <rue_house> norbi, on 8 bit avrs the executable space and the data space are seperate, the processor cannot execute instructions from ram, it has to be in the write-cycle-limited eeprom
[09:31:13] <rue_house> er flash
[09:31:33] <dirty_d> rue_house, you program the initial values in the eeprom with avrdude?
[09:32:00] <rue_house> dirty_d, you can
[09:32:12] <dirty_d> what other alternative is there?
[09:32:28] <rue_house> have your program do it
[09:32:47] <dirty_d> how will it know that its not already initialized though?
[09:33:01] <rue_house> the avr will flash red
[09:33:17] <dirty_d> like ill probably have some buttons that will allow tweaking of PID values
[09:33:42] <dirty_d> so the first run its going to just gave 0s or garbage in the eeprom where they would be
[09:34:06] <serp___> checksum
[09:34:16] <dirty_d> hmm?
[09:35:23] <rue_house> hahaha i'm taking an open collector comparitor and going thru a diode to combine outputs
[09:35:26] <serp___> write pid values plus checksum to eeprom
[09:35:45] <dirty_d> that would work
[09:36:10] <dirty_d> there must be a simpler way though
[09:37:12] <dirty_d> like when i program it, i can just make every byte of eeprom 0xFF, if its 0xFF its uninitialized, and make sure i dont use uint8_t that are 0xFF or unit16_t that are 0xFFFF
[09:37:26] <dirty_d> which i wont anyway
[09:37:55] <Kevin`> FF is the value you get from erasing it, no need to actually write that
[09:37:55] <serp___> sure, eeprom is whiped p
[09:38:03] <dirty_d> oh, nice
[09:38:08] <serp___> by default on programming
[09:42:10] <serp___> but isnt it nice to keep pid values after programming?
[09:44:48] <dirty_d> it wqould
[09:44:50] <dirty_d> would
[09:45:12] <dirty_d> well, you can just erase it the first time its programmed, right
[09:45:32] <dirty_d> and not erase eeprom every time after
[10:04:17] <Kevin`> dirty_d: yes
[11:01:10] <dirty_d> what do you give avrdude to program flash without erasing eeprom?
[11:04:08] <specing_> Too keep its contents, obviously
[11:05:23] <dirty_d> specing, i mean how do i do it
[11:05:35] <dirty_d> i dont see any options to not erase the eeprom when you program the flash
[11:06:22] <specing> fuses...
[11:17:28] <mapee> hi
[12:39:12] <Tom_itx> dirty_d, possibly -U -D
[12:40:02] <Tom_itx> but that will leave the flash too
[12:47:21] <Tom_itx> there may be some combination of the -U option that would allow that, i'm not sure
[13:11:48] <grummund> dirty_d: check out the ESAVE fuse
[13:23:52] <keenerd> Well that is something I'd never expect to see from Intel. Their Rosepoint chip scales down to 3MHz.
[13:25:09] <RikusW> new x86 cpu ?!
[13:25:21] <RikusW> probably for low power...
[13:27:55] <keenerd> Yeah. Down to 2mW.
[13:28:02] <keenerd> No tech info, just
http://download.intel.com/newsroom/kits/isscc/2012/pdfs/ISSCC-IL-Press-Overview.pdf
[13:34:15] <RikusW> 2mW is impressive
[13:35:14] <Steffann> For an intel cpu?
[13:35:35] <keenerd> When you drop the clock speed by a factor of 500, it is not that hard ;-)
[14:46:09] <Roklobsta_> norbi: deserve? i am using rtos with atmega1280
[14:46:51] <Roklobsta_> bertos
[14:47:07] <Roklobsta_> it's nice - good abstractions
[14:47:14] <Roklobsta_> and has devices drivers
[15:17:09] <keenerd> "Bertos includes TENS of algorithms." Where do I sign up?
[15:21:18] <Roklobsta_> are you being sar-carstic?
[15:21:45] <keenerd> Yes. It does look quite neat though and I will try it before commenting further.
[15:22:11] <Roklobsta_> that's tens more algorithms than FreeRTOS
[15:22:44] <keenerd> Algorithms are cheap though.
[15:25:55] <Roklobsta_> true, but how many times does a wheel need reinventing?
[15:26:19] <Roklobsta_> bertos does have a bunch of functiosn for processing gps data but i have done my own
[16:50:36] <Kre10s> Roklobsta_, not reinvernting, but reimplimenting :P
[17:55:13] <Tom_itx> wollw, mail didn't move today.
[17:55:18] <Tom_itx> will go tomorrow
[17:57:04] <vectory> hi yall
[18:15:25] <wollw> Tom_itx: Yeah, that occured to me last night. Not an issue.
[18:39:46] <dirty_d> just threw together a super simple 150 line opengl soundcard oscilloscope if anyone wants at it
[18:39:49] <dirty_d> http://cisweb.bristolcc.edu/~klabs/scope.cpp
[18:39:52] <dirty_d> http://cisweb.bristolcc.edu/~klabs/scope.jpg
[18:50:20] <vectory> dirty_d: cool idea, suppose you aint the first one, but i certainly didnt think of that
[18:50:43] <vectory> looked how to build a cheap one with usb and afc chips >_<
[18:50:59] <vectory> adc*
[18:51:39] <vectory> this one is much simpler, your own "invention" or influenced by someone?
[18:53:09] <vectory> resolution round 10 kHz? i want more though >_<#
[18:53:30] <vectory> without investing a lot, which is contradicting itself
[18:53:35] <dirty_d> i just threw it togetehr to test this avr
[18:53:52] <dirty_d> i tried xoscope, but it only runs at like 7 fps
[18:54:51] <dirty_d> this is going as fast as the data is coming in, so like 125fps at the settings i have it at
[18:55:10] <dirty_d> i really want a real oscilloscope
[18:57:29] <vectory> bitscope - _only_ 295$ :)
[18:57:48] <keenerd> Hard to tell from that screen shot, but I take it you are on linux? The Hantek scopes are great and are like $200.
[18:58:06] <vectory> dirty_d: using soundcard reminds me of the lineout programmer for arduino
[18:58:19] <vectory> keenerd: easy to tell from the source, i guess
[18:58:26] <vectory> unless its bsd kind
[18:58:47] <keenerd> Heh. I was a little too busy for that close of an eyeballing.
[18:59:12] <vectory> btw, i spot gnome3 window title, if im not mistaken
[18:59:34] <dirty_d> yea im on linux
[18:59:36] <vectory> keenerd: tell me about it ;)
[18:59:47] <dirty_d> i wans gonna get one of the rigols
[19:00:07] <keenerd> Also good, if you want a full scope.
[19:00:41] <keenerd> My Hantek is the size of a VHS tap, great for site work.
[19:00:48] <keenerd> *tape
[19:01:41] <dirty_d> i think this thing is ready to fly
[19:01:50] <dirty_d> i just need to buy all the crap for the quadcopter now
[19:04:18] <dirty_d> this is gonna be expensive
[19:08:41] <theDarkAura> saw one that was 3d printed
[19:28:30] <vectory_> dirty_d: can you post your makefile plz?
[19:30:06] <buhman> dirty_d: O.o oss? why?
[19:30:40] <buhman> I was sure /nobody/ used the Obsolete Sound System anymore
[19:31:06] <vectory_> because dsp?
[19:31:50] <buhman> no, because #include </usr/lib/oss/include/sys/soundcard.h>
[19:32:17] <vectory_> or was dsp for output? i such a noob x)
[19:36:42] <RokLobsta> Rigol DS1052E 50MHz CROs are now US$329 great unit
[19:37:20] <RokLobsta> an of course it's "upgradeable" to 100Mhz.
[19:39:10] <CapnKernel> keenerd: That Intel chip must be completely static
[19:43:17] <keenerd> You mean the caches?
[19:43:39] <keenerd> I thought sram was more power hungry.
[20:03:17] <CapnKernel> No no, dram is hungry because it needs constant refreshing
[20:03:18] <RokLobsta> it is. but sram is whats in cache
[20:03:51] <RokLobsta> sram is has higher power usage than dram at same clock speeds i think.
[20:04:07] <RokLobsta> but yes, dram needs constant refrshing
[20:04:23] <CapnKernel> Each SRAM cell is larger, because it typically takes 3 transistors not one.
[20:06:35] <RokLobsta> oh that's right, dram is SMALLER than sram
[20:06:37] <RokLobsta> duh
[20:06:49] <nevyn> it's a transister and a capacitor
[20:06:53] <nevyn> it's like supersimple
[20:06:56] <nevyn> dram
[20:09:00] <CapnKernel> a wee dram
[20:12:08] <keenerd> I'm wondering if it'll be possible to run a bare CPU.
[20:12:22] <keenerd> I don't think you could do that since the 8080.
[20:12:52] <keenerd> (Not that I'd want to, you'd have to work in x86 asm.)
[20:14:57] <dirty_d> buhman, simpler to use
[20:15:15] <dirty_d> it was just a quick test program
[20:18:58] <RokLobsta> huh? bare as in bare x86 cpu? i used a 386ex bare in the mid 90's.
[20:19:44] <RokLobsta> The AMD Geode is bare. (
http://www.pcengines.ch/)
[20:20:15] <nevyn> soc?
[20:22:19] <RokLobsta> i think the geode needs a support chip but the 386ex was SoC.
[20:23:02] <RokLobsta> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_80386EX
[20:23:45] <RokLobsta> I bet it's still made for some customers.
[20:35:37] <keenerd> Oh cool. I'd seen a few like that (I have a NAS with an RDC 486 SOC) but I thought intel was out of that market.
[20:41:13] <nevyn> RokLobsta: I think they still make a rad hardened version in particular
[20:47:47] <nevyn> actually only the cpu itself and the 82380 southbridge are availible rad hardened afaict
[20:52:28] <RokLobsta> I used it in an application that used to run on a 186.
[20:52:46] <RokLobsta> and then ran some experimental neural net code that was sloooooow
[21:35:25] <ThersiT> I've just added a Max232 to an ATMega644p loaded some code that should print out A...Z over and over however all I'm seeing in a terminal is a bunch of invalid characters.
[21:35:45] <ThersiT> Anyone know what could be wrong?
[21:40:58] <Tom_itx> baud off?
[21:41:13] <nevyn> that was my first thought ^^
[21:41:33] <Casper> ThersiT: you ain'T using a crystal, or one that isn't speed matched for the uart speed you selected
[21:41:39] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/how_to/atmega168/mega168_rs232_index.php
[21:41:45] <Tom_itx> check that over
[21:42:30] <ThersiT> That's what I was thinking but I took the UBRR right out of the datasheet.
[21:42:40] <Casper> common bad crystal frequency: 16MHz and 20MHz... example of good crystal: 14.746MHz and 18.432MHz
[21:42:50] <Tom_itx> you can use the internal oscillator at slower speeds
[21:42:59] <Tom_itx> i'd recomend getting it working slow first
[21:44:01] <ThersiT> I did just notice something stupid I did. After I added a 20 MHz xtal I forgot to change the setting in eclipse.
[21:44:03] <DanFrederiksen> Casper, why are those bad?
[21:44:13] <Tom_itx> woops
[21:44:28] <Tom_itx> also is F_CPU defined?
[21:44:37] <Tom_itx> i'm not sure that the uart stuff uses that but..
[21:46:17] <ThersiT> I just found out about 14.746/18.432 today but I have this 20MHz and the data sheet says I can get .2% error with it.
[21:48:09] <timemage> ThersiT, are you talking about the internal oscillator?
[21:49:07] <ThersiT> na, I'm using an external 20 MHz crystal.
[21:49:21] <timemage> ThersiT, ok.
[21:53:33] <timemage> ThersiT, i take it you're trying 38.4
[21:54:15] <ThersiT> I was trying 129. UBRR right?
[21:54:30] <timemage> ThersiT, sorry. was looking at the wrong column.
[21:54:50] <timemage> ThersiT, ok. for 19.2k yeah?
[21:55:43] <ThersiT> I'm trying for 9600 baud at 0.2% error.
[21:56:10] <ThersiT> What is 19.2k?
[21:59:23] <Tom_itx> ThersiT, did you see wormfood's baudrate calculator?
[21:59:29] <Tom_itx> http://www.wormfood.net/avrbaudcalc.php
[21:59:37] <WormFood> it needs to be updated ;)
[21:59:45] <Tom_itx> well dammit fix it!!
[21:59:49] <WormFood> with new features of the new chips
[21:59:50] <Tom_itx> :)
[21:59:51] <WormFood> it isn't broken
[22:00:31] <ThersiT> Yea I used it. And the data sheet says the same values.
[22:00:40] <Tom_itx> i'd hope so
[22:01:11] <WormFood> I programmed the calculator off the data sheet...I made sure I used the same formula for calculating the error rates
[22:02:13] <WormFood> and my page is popular enough, that if you google for "baud" it comes up #8 (your region may be different)
[22:03:00] <ThersiT> I just tried setting the right clock speed in eclipse, that did'nt help. Also defining F_CPU just made the term go slower.
[22:03:21] <Tom_itx> oh, what about ckdiv8?
[22:03:27] <Tom_itx> that may be messin with you
[22:04:04] <ThersiT> ha! That is set! Thanks. Letme try.
[22:05:56] <ThersiT> Yup that was it. Thank You!
[22:06:12] <Tom_itx> :)
[22:16:45] <Casper> DanFrederiksen: those don't divide well
[22:40:02] <lulznstuff> Anyone up?
[23:28:27] <buhman> lulznstuff: why would you think that
[23:42:17] <CapnKernel> Nope, no-one up.
[23:55:21] <CapnKernel> Seems he went back to sleep. Must be all the lulz.
