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[00:18:46] <skorket> inflex, yes, servo pwm is still a bit noisy, but I can live with it. Maybe next version I'll either go for an ATTiny85 or use a burlier chip with a crystal. What was really nasty, though, was when I was using a 9v through an LM9805 to power the four servos and ATTiny13. The button input line would have so much noise that it would think the button had been pressed, triggering a servo movement, which would cause more noise, which would
[00:18:46] <skorket> cause more erratic movement
[00:19:21] <skorket> That's the real problem I wanted to fix. Moving over to LiPo (and a switched power supply) seemed to clear up that problem
[00:36:33] <inflex> skorket: go with external xtal / resonator, for sure
[03:48:43] <OndraSter> where is Dean when you want him
[03:48:54] <OndraSter> they now force you to register to download stuff on atmel
[03:48:58] <OndraSter> first it was direct link
[03:49:04] <OndraSter> then it was register and get direct link
[03:49:10] <OndraSter> now it is register and get direct link through email
[03:49:30] <OndraSter> I ofc used "name dfg, surname fgh, email sdf@wer.com" etc :P
[03:49:48] <OndraSter> it is bollocks to register to get this
[04:01:55] <amee2k> OndraSter: yes, thats what it usually is
[04:02:08] <amee2k> doesn't seem to stop whoevers idea crap like that is
[04:02:13] <amee2k> i presume marketing
[04:02:39] <amee2k> well, its not my database that gets clobbered with thousands of throw-away accounts :P
[04:02:58] <OndraSter> when I _have to_ register, I use name Ondra and surname Ster :D
[04:03:03] <OndraSter> and fake address
[04:03:34] <OndraSter> ofc Ster is made up
[04:03:45] <amee2k> there are like 50 facebook accounts to the email address "fuck@you.com" or some variation thereof :P
[04:04:01] <OndraSter> :D
[04:04:20] <amee2k> some crappy pdf hosting website requires registration and making a new account is easier than digging up the password again
[04:04:51] <OndraSter> or even worse, they want you to pay to download some manual
[04:04:53] <OndraSter> :o)
[04:04:59] <OndraSter> like $8 per one
[04:05:00] <amee2k> o.O
[04:05:21] <amee2k> apparently someone doesn't want to sell their products here :P
[04:05:21] <OndraSter> I was looking for manual for the counter Philips PM6622
[04:05:28] <amee2k> oh
[04:05:31] <OndraSter> it is old school
[04:05:32] <amee2k> you mean the fake sites
[04:05:35] <OndraSter> like 80s or 90s
[04:05:39] <OndraSter> dunno if they are fake
[04:05:42] <Tom_itx> OndraSter what did you need from atmel?
[04:05:50] <amee2k> i've heard some are
[04:05:57] <OndraSter> Tom_itx, wanted to try out avrstudio 5.1 beta
[04:06:03] <amee2k> someone i used to know in school tried to buy from one of them
[04:06:05] <OndraSter> I like betatesting
[04:06:15] <amee2k> money gone, no manual ever appeared
[04:07:05] <amee2k> to be fair, i once bought a schem from a manual selling comp in berlin and it worked fine
[04:07:32] <amee2k> but i got a printed copy from them, not just paid for a shitty download
[04:09:40] <OndraSter> hmm I should get up probably
[04:09:53] <OndraSter> Tom_itx, do you ever sleep? It must be something around 3 or 4 in the night at yours lol
[04:09:56] <amee2k> yes, that usually has certain advantages
[04:10:10] <OndraSter> duh, Friday... last day of holiday :(
[04:19:10] <Tom_itx> http://pastebin.com/8RGCFU5s
[04:19:15] <Tom_itx> that's what you were after
[04:19:49] <Tom_itx> Greasemonkey script for Firefox/Chrome to bypass the atmel reg page
[04:30:29] <OndraSter> (Opera UserJS? :D)
[04:30:29] <OndraSter> thanks
[04:30:43] <amee2k> neat
[05:54:39] <OndraSter> hmm why is AVR GCC reporting 3.3.1 in AVRStudio 5.1 (in about), when AVR Studio 5.0 is reporting 4.5.1...? (except that there it is AVR Toolchain component rather AVR GCC)
[06:05:28] <Steffanx> Pass
[06:31:38] <Tom_itx> OndraSter, maybe they realize 5.1 was a step in the wrong direction
[06:31:51] <OndraSter> I thought that 5.1 was just bugfixed 5.0
[06:31:54] <OndraSter> with who knows what changes
[06:43:03] <RikusW> http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/708/oilpcbsmall.jpg/
[06:43:17] <RikusW> my oily paper "transparency" :)
[06:43:46] <RikusW> on a pcb on which I tried toner transfer first, with a printer test page ;)
[06:44:39] <OndraSter> hmm
[06:44:49] <OndraSter> toner transfer from regular tracing paper?
[06:45:26] <RikusW> regular paper, didn't work too well, it was my first try
[06:45:38] <OndraSter> glossy papers work good
[06:45:47] <OndraSter> I found cheap photo papers... but they are for inkjets :(
[06:45:48] <RikusW> the circuit is on the oily paper
[06:46:17] <RikusW> cloudy today.. so I'll have to wait till tommorow to expose a pcb
[06:46:22] <OndraSter> huh
[06:46:26] <OndraSter> I have the mercury vapour lamp...
[06:46:29] <OndraSter> to test UV
[06:46:37] * RikusW don't
[06:46:42] <OndraSter> I want to switch to toner transfer though
[06:46:46] <OndraSter> cheaper to do
[06:46:49] <Roamin> i just use a neon?
[06:47:17] <RikusW> I've heard something about HP toner not working quite right ?
[06:47:54] <Roamin> hehe, i use a hp laserjet 1018, with original toner + neon + clear sheet, works perfect everytime
[06:49:12] <RikusW> now I have to get a 0.6 or 0.7mm drill bit....
[06:49:40] <RikusW> or try and make one with a bit of steel
[06:49:58] <OndraSter> I have HP LaserJet 2300dn
[06:50:08] <OndraSter> quite good piece of printer, just black & white :(
[06:50:12] <RikusW> HP Laserjat P1102
[06:50:25] <OndraSter> it has all - ethernet, duplex unit...
[06:50:30] <RikusW> my toner is almost the same price at the printer :(
[06:50:34] <OndraSter> hehe
[06:50:39] <RikusW> *as
[06:50:43] <OndraSter> I got "refill" from some dude... he also replaced the drum
[06:50:49] <OndraSter> 30€ for refill and new drum
[06:50:56] <OndraSter> and that is for 6000 pages approx
[06:51:03] <RikusW> maybe I bought a disposable printer with a cartridge ?!
[06:51:20] <RikusW> thats cheap !
[06:51:31] <OndraSter> yeah
[06:51:39] <OndraSter> and toners on ebay are even cheaper, but not sure about the quality
[06:51:42] <RikusW> mine is like 89€ for 1600 pages... :(
[06:51:52] <OndraSter> eh
[06:51:59] * RikusW is thinking about refilling
[06:54:23] <RikusW> if this oily paper work I'll probably only use transparencies for 0.5mm pitch IC's
[06:54:53] <OndraSter> what oil did you use?
[06:55:30] <OndraSter> I hate the fact that you have to use NaOH or something else to get rid of the photosensitive stuff after lighting it up
[06:55:33] <RikusW> palm oil
[06:55:40] <OndraSter> ergo another chemical stuff
[06:55:46] <RikusW> sunflower would should work too
[06:56:07] <RikusW> or any cooking oil
[06:56:35] <RikusW> You only use a little NaOH, and its a drain cleaner anyways ;)
[06:56:48] <RikusW> But then you have to use a LOT more
[06:56:54] <OndraSter> I always did 10g/l usually
[06:57:01] <OndraSter> 7 - 10g/l
[06:57:24] <OndraSter> I got always 10g package, split it into four smaller same ones
[06:57:27] <RikusW> and you brush it while developing ?
[06:57:34] <OndraSter> and always used 250ml and 2.5g
[06:57:35] <OndraSter> no
[06:57:40] <OndraSter> just moved the tray
[06:58:08] <RikusW> I've seen someone use a paintbrush
[06:58:40] <RikusW> I have like 2m2 of blank pcbs here :)
[06:59:08] <RikusW> been here for like 10 years with no easy way to use it
[06:59:27] <OndraSter> blank PCBs or blank PCBs with photosensitive layer :P
[06:59:39] <RikusW> copper only...
[06:59:52] <OndraSter> hmm
[06:59:53] <RikusW> got some photoresist spray
[06:59:59] <RikusW> seems to work ok
[07:00:24] <RikusW> just not to happy that it expires, so now its in the fridge, and I hope for the best
[07:01:00] <RikusW> OndraSter: what drill bits do you use ?
[07:01:11] <OndraSter> no idea, I used it like year ago last time
[07:01:15] <OndraSter> and bought them 2 years ago
[07:01:19] <OndraSter> it was 0.7 I think
[07:01:20] <OndraSter> or 0.8
[07:01:23] <OndraSter> cheap ones
[07:01:31] <OndraSter> I don't even have proper drill itself
[07:01:36] <OndraSter> I had only small hand one
[07:01:42] <OndraSter> I did like two small PCBs only
[07:01:59] <RikusW> and didn't break any ?
[07:02:10] <RikusW> or all ?
[07:02:14] <OndraSter> none
[07:56:54] <Bushman> ave
[09:33:15] <OndraSter> why does Micron want me to register on their website to downlaod datasheet?
[09:33:16] <OndraSter> argh
[09:33:46] <Steffanx> aa bb cc dd ee ff is hard to type isn't it OndraSter ?
[09:33:52] <OndraSter> but reigster
[09:33:56] <OndraSter> why
[09:34:08] <CapnKernel> Because they wish they were Atmel?
[09:34:14] <OndraSter> haha
[09:34:25] <CapnKernel> Soon all the cool kids will be doing it.
[09:35:01] <CapnKernel> Seems a bit pointless now that the horse has bolted, the horse in this case being all the free datasheet websites.
[09:35:29] <OndraSter> yeah
[09:41:39] <dirty_d> its kinda discouraging when a google search for a problem youre having results in your own forum post describing the problem as one of the first results
[09:44:08] <Steffanx> :)
[09:46:50] <dirty_d> have any of you used twi on an xmega?
[09:47:15] <CapnKernel> dirty_d: You're such a pioneer...
[09:47:55] <dirty_d> lol
[09:48:35] <dirty_d> i think my chip is just plain borken
[09:48:41] <dirty_d> BORKEN
[09:49:48] <dirty_d> it works, it just refuses to set an interrupt flag in master read mode
[09:54:40] <Steffanx> Read the errata /
[09:54:41] <Steffanx> ?
[09:58:25] <dirty_d> yup
[09:58:27] <dirty_d> nothing
[09:58:34] <dirty_d> its a new xmega
[10:02:33] <Steffanx> New? xmega with usb?
[10:06:28] <dirty_d> yea
[10:06:32] <dirty_d> atxmega32a4u
[10:15:44] <dirty_d> Steffanx, i think this is just a mistake in the documentation
[10:15:53] <dirty_d> im seeing contradicting statements
[10:16:01] <dirty_d> but one of them is whats actually happening
[10:16:25] <dirty_d> maybe ill ask atmel
[10:17:14] <Steffanx> Call abcminiuser :P
[10:17:31] <Steffanx> Call Atmel and ask for Dean :)
[10:17:45] <dirty_d> i saw his name on the avrfreaks forum where i posted the problem
[10:17:52] <dirty_d> i havent seen him here in a while though
[10:20:56] <dirty_d> yea i think its just a mistake in the docs about the ADDR register
[10:21:24] <dirty_d> it says the WIF flag is set after the ADDR is transmitted and ACK is recieved
[10:21:33] <dirty_d> except i think that is only true in master write mode
[10:22:15] <dirty_d> in master read mode it sets RIF after the address is transmitted, ack is recieved, then the data is recieved
[10:27:17] * CapnKernel is actually tempted to call Atmel in Norway and ask for "Dean", just to see what would happen.
[10:28:59] <dirty_d> lol
[10:29:14] <OndraSter> lol
[10:57:30] <dirty_d> request posted
[10:59:17] <dirty_d> now ill just have to wait for them to never respond
[11:06:23] <OndraSter> hmm why am I missing CSV option in generating BOM in Eagle?
[11:06:30] <OndraSter> it should be there in default ulp, or not?
[11:07:27] <dirty_d> i dunno
[11:07:36] <dirty_d> i use crappy linux programs like pcb
[11:16:16] <RikusW> So I made myself a 0.8mm drill bit from a piece of spring steel :)
[11:17:17] <OndraSter> duh
[11:17:33] <RikusW> quite easy
[11:17:38] <RikusW> and quick
[11:20:33] <RikusW> and it drills through FR4 too
[11:22:42] <RikusW> though the holes aren't neat...
[11:25:32] <dirty_d> harborfreight has like a 20 pack of carbide pcb drills for $5
[11:26:17] <RikusW> maybe I should get some
[11:26:25] <dirty_d> thats what im using
[11:26:33] <dirty_d> variety pack
[11:26:34] <RikusW> but I'm _far_ away from the nearest electronics shop...
[11:26:42] <dirty_d> online?
[11:26:44] <RikusW> might get some at RS though
[11:34:53] <RikusW> RSOnline
[11:35:30] <RikusW> not radioshack
[11:35:41] <RikusW> rs-online.com
[11:35:47] <dirty_d> oh
[11:35:51] <asteve> radioshack online brah
[11:36:05] <dirty_d> i have a soldering iron from radioshack
[11:36:22] <dirty_d> the 60W LCD temp controlled one
[11:36:31] <RikusW> its 2 different companies
[11:36:35] <dirty_d> its actually pretty good
[11:44:33] <RikusW> at RS its more like $5 per bit...
[11:45:54] <RikusW> 29 Euro for 5 bits :(
[11:46:29] <RikusW> seems like I'll be making some more myself...
[11:52:37] <RikusW> pcb milling bits is like 28E each moq 5 !
[11:52:41] <RikusW> ugh
[11:53:09] <WormFood> http://www.amateurengineer.com/?p=400 you guys (AVR geeks) can appreciate this project, if someone hasn't already shared the url before me.
[12:13:54] <amee2k> $oven->bake($cake); \o/
[12:14:00] <rudolf_> hi
[12:14:08] <amee2k> sup
[12:14:10] <rudolf_> I tried to make a time base of 1 ms using this code but it is not working
[12:14:13] <rudolf_> http://pastebin.com/8AEh7CZA
[12:14:23] <rudolf_> whats the error in it?
[12:14:56] <amee2k> what mcu?
[12:15:09] <rudolf_> There is some output on the LCD if i remove "TCCR1B=(1<<WGM12)|(1<<CS11)|(1<<CS10);" but the output isn't correct....atmega16l
[12:15:11] <specing> rudolf_: what should it do?
[12:15:22] <amee2k> (that is usually important because different MCUs have different registers)
[12:15:29] <rudolf_> specing..should start a timer sort of thing
[12:15:55] <amee2k> 8MHz ?
[12:16:09] <rudolf_> yeah
[12:16:37] <asteve> when working with AVR's always remember practice makes perfect:
http://i.imgur.com/Sgw56.png
[12:16:38] <rudolf_> but it is not giving anything on the LCD..LCD seems to be unresponsive
[12:16:55] <RikusW> rudolf_: do you have a jtag ice ?
[12:17:05] <rudolf_> no
[12:17:18] <RikusW> want one for free ?
[12:17:41] <rudolf_> well how are you gonna give it to me?
[12:17:43] <RikusW> http://sites.google.com/site/megau2s/home/jtag
[12:17:49] <RikusW> only the fw
[12:17:50] <amee2k> RikusW: that doesn't explain the issue but IMO your timer settings are off by a factor of two
[12:17:54] <RikusW> you'll need another avr
[12:17:59] <amee2k> 8MHz / 64 / 250 = 500Hz
[12:18:07] <RikusW> might help him debug it
[12:18:36] <RikusW> rudolf_: you know what a jtag ice does right ?
[12:18:57] <rudolf_> little..never used it
[12:19:18] <RikusW> on chip debug
[12:19:28] <RikusW> what software do you use ?
[12:19:34] <RikusW> AVR studio 4 ?
[12:19:36] <amee2k> rudolf_: does it at least clear the display and display the "time base demo" line?
[12:19:40] <specing> rudolf_: how about putting all those heavy procedures (LCD_, sprintf) into main?
[12:19:41] <amee2k> or are you getting nothing at all
[12:20:16] <rudolf_> amee2k..no it doesnt...
[12:20:51] <rudolf_> but as soon as i remove the line TCCR1B=(1<<WGM12)|(1<<CS11)|(1<<CS10);, it gives a wrong output
[12:20:51] <amee2k> rudolf_: then make a new program that only does lcdinit, write something to the display, then enter an infinite loop to halt
[12:21:06] <amee2k> hmm
[12:21:33] <rudolf_> amee2k, other programs work fine..i tried making the counter in overflow mode and it was ok
[12:21:35] <amee2k> without that line the timer interrupt is never fired
[12:21:56] <amee2k> i have a hunch it really works but the updates happen way too fast or the ISR crashes
[12:22:47] <rudolf_> and why the ISR crashes and why does it start working on removing that line?
[12:22:51] <rudolf_> TCCR1B=(1<<WGM12)|(1<<CS11)|(1<<CS10);
[12:23:13] <amee2k> firstly, use snprintf() over sprintf to avoid nuisance buffer overruns
[12:24:06] <rudolf_> ok
[12:24:12] <rudolf_> anything else?
[12:24:22] <amee2k> did that help? :P
[12:24:31] <rudolf_> should I slow it down a bit?
[12:24:47] <rudolf_> upto 10ms?
[12:25:18] <amee2k> might be a good idea. i don't know how long the display update takes but i'd suspect you're losing a few clocks after every update
[12:25:19] <rudolf_> ?
[12:26:21] <amee2k> if your display update takes longer than a millisecond, the timer will set the interrupt flag for the next compare event
[12:26:47] <rudolf_> ok..i will try..but if i remove that line from the code, the timer shouldnt get initialize then how is the interrupt fired?
[12:26:56] <amee2k> upond returning from the ISR, it will execute one instruction from the main program flow, then notice the int flag is set and fire the next ISR call
[12:27:28] <amee2k> if your display update takes >2ms, then the int flag will already be set so the compare event in the timer does nothing, and you're missing one interrupt
[12:27:56] <amee2k> you need to leave the TCCR1B line in there because otherwise the timer won't run
[12:28:11] <amee2k> but first try if the snprintf() change helps
[12:28:52] <amee2k> also, displaying clock_milliseconds on the display is redundant. it will always be 0 ;)
[12:29:45] <rudolf_> ok..thats bad programming
[12:30:31] <rudolf_> Is the initialization of timer necessary using "TCCR1B=(1<<WGM12)|(1<<CS11)|(1<<CS10);" for starting interrupt?
[12:30:42] <amee2k> yes
[12:31:11] <amee2k> if you don't set the CS10/CS11 bits, the timer is disabled
[12:31:59] <amee2k> check out the datasheet... chapter timer/counter 1, register description
[12:32:14] <rudolf_> ok
[12:32:32] <amee2k> CS1[0:2] = 000 -> no clock source; timer/counter stopped
[12:33:06] <amee2k> there is a table for it at the end of the TCCR1B heading under register description
[12:33:47] <rudolf_> ok..
[12:34:33] <amee2k> at this point i'd also put a pin toggle into the ISR so i can monitor the ISR calls on a scope
[12:35:30] <rudolf_> hmm..thats right
[12:35:37] <rudolf_> I'll also do it
[12:36:35] <amee2k> i usually put something like "PORTB |= (1<<5); ... PORTB &= ~(1<<5);" around ISRs that i want to monitor. this way i can see when interrupts fire and the approximate execution time
[12:37:30] <rudolf_> hmm
[12:39:12] <rudolf_> one more question..is there any value assigned to CS02, CS01 and CS00 by default?
[12:39:34] <amee2k> yes. all 0
[12:40:39] <rudolf_> then for example we do CS02<<1 and CS00<<1 for a prescaler of 1024.. how does it work?
[12:40:40] <amee2k> thats in the datasheet too... every register description has the names for the bit offset macros, whether that bit location is read-only, write-only or read-write access, and the initial value after a clean power-up
[12:41:09] <rudolf_> I know bitwise programming but this thing always confuses me
[12:41:09] <amee2k> o.O
[12:41:26] <amee2k> firstly, you do "1 << CS12" ;)
[12:42:11] <rudolf_> I am talking about the 8 bit timer of atmega 8
[12:42:15] <rudolf_> timer 0
[12:42:28] <amee2k> i thought you had a mega16?
[12:42:49] <amee2k> or was that someone else
[12:42:59] <rudolf_> yeah..but this example is from atmega8
[12:43:46] <rudolf_> in timer0 we need CS02, CS01 and CS00 as 101
[12:43:57] <amee2k> MCU code is considerably less portable between different hardware than PC code
[12:44:13] <rudolf_> and we do a TCCR0|=(1<<CS02)|(1<<CS00);
[12:44:30] <amee2k> well, what the CS00, CS01, CS02 macros expand to is the bit position of the relevant bits in the register
[12:44:50] <amee2k> so for your mega16 (because i have its datasheet open right now) that would be 0, 1 and 2
[12:45:09] <rudolf_> dint get this one. :|
[12:45:09] <amee2k> so what that line does is shift 1s into the bit positions you want them
[12:45:21] <rudolf_> oh
[12:45:21] <amee2k> then bitwise-or them all together and assign it to the register
[12:45:51] <rudolf_> oh..i wrote it in wrong direction
[12:45:54] <rudolf_> got it
[12:45:57] <rudolf_> :)
[12:45:59] <amee2k> so (1<<CS02)|(1<<CS00) = (1<<2) | (1<<0) = 0x04 | 0x01 = 0x05;
[12:46:19] <rudolf_> CS02 is bit position
[12:46:35] <rudolf_> so 1<<CS02 means 100
[12:46:47] <RikusW> ayes
[12:46:48] <rudolf_> and 1<<CS00 means 1
[12:46:53] <amee2k> using the macro names for that is just more descriptive... you could just do "TCCR0 = 0x05;" but noone would have any idea to know what it does
[12:46:56] <rudolf_> and or gives us 101
[12:47:19] <rudolf_> ok..and finally we or it with the register
[12:47:21] <rudolf_> :)
[12:47:26] <rudolf_> understood
[12:47:34] <rudolf_> thanks amee2k
[12:47:47] <amee2k> this way people see that you're setting up the clock source and changing the waveform generation mode, and possibly setting up output compare units too from the names alone
[12:47:56] <RikusW> aor just assign it if you don't care about the other bits
[12:48:31] <rudolf_> I dint know CS02 expands to its bit position
[12:49:00] <rudolf_> well thanks for your time amee2k
[12:49:12] <amee2k> you're welcome :)
[12:49:16] <rudolf_> :)
[12:50:00] <amee2k> thats also why knowing what MCU is being used is important to understanding program code... different MCUs have different registers and sometimes things work slightly differently on different types
[12:50:17] <rudolf_> hmm
[12:50:34] <amee2k> e.g. timer1 might be a second 8 bit timer on an attiny, for example. instead of the 16 bit timer that it usually is on atmega series ones
[12:50:51] <rudolf_> ok
[12:52:15] <rudolf_> ok..gotta go now..thanks a lot
[12:52:36] <amee2k> having the datasheet pdf handy for the MCUs you use is also a considerable advantage because they have all the details like which CS.. bit settings do what
[12:53:05] <RikusW> ds is __essenstial__
[12:53:13] <rudolf_> yeah..
[12:53:42] <rudolf_> And all that in simple language?
[12:53:55] <amee2k> well, if you feel like it you can just memorize it and never look at it again
[12:54:00] <amee2k> its only some 300 pages :P
[12:54:08] <RikusW> __required__
[12:54:14] <rudolf_> I mean people new to it can also easily understand it?
[12:54:32] <RikusW> yes
[12:54:37] <rudolf_> cool
[12:54:38] <amee2k> rudolf_: well, simple depends. for the first few times it is kind of a tough read i suppose
[12:54:39] <RikusW> you just have to read a lot
[12:54:53] <rudolf_> hmm..
[12:55:17] <amee2k> but if you have a basic general understanding of digital circuits in general, it'll be a considerable help
[12:55:50] <amee2k> it also is not really a cover to cover read. once you're familiar with the basics you'd only read or reference the chapters relevant to what you're doing at the moment
[12:56:33] <rudolf_> ok
[12:57:05] <amee2k> the most important ones are usually the "register description" headings because they have a lot of fiddly details like the register and bit names
[12:57:35] <Tom_itx> i sometimes start at the register summary page
[12:57:43] <rudolf_> hmm..
[12:58:23] <Tom_itx> you go to the end of a book to find out what it's about then you go back and read it
[12:58:38] <amee2k> hehe
[12:59:29] <rudolf_> hey one more question :) about HT12D
[13:00:04] <rudolf_> after connecting it to atmega with one of the ports, do i need to anything special in the program?
[13:00:15] <rudolf_> or I can simply read from the pins as i do?
[13:00:32] <amee2k> "i'm looking for a really good detective story to read over the holidays" asks the customer in the book store. "then i'd recommend this one" says the shop assistant, "you'll have to read all the way to the last page to find out that it was the buttler who killed them all"
[13:01:08] <rudolf_> ...
[13:01:41] <RikusW> >_<
[13:01:51] <rudolf_> what.
[13:01:52] <rudolf_> ...
[13:01:54] <Tom_itx> heh
[13:02:11] * rudolf_ is wondering what that means.
[13:02:12] <Tom_itx> did you pick a different book?
[13:02:13] <amee2k> HT12D, as in the address latch thingy by that name?
[13:02:37] <rudolf_> ?
[13:02:40] <amee2k> Tom_itx :P
[13:03:20] <rudolf_> "HT12D, as in the address latch thingy by that name?" ?
[13:03:48] <amee2k> yes, i'm trying to figure out what exact part you're refering to
[13:04:50] <rudolf_> i connect 10, 11, 12, 13 pins of decoder to port b of atmega
[13:05:22] <rudolf_> now can i simply read the data as i do normally?
[13:07:14] <rudolf_> by doing DDRB = 0b00000000; and x = PINB;
[13:07:49] <rudolf_> ?
[13:07:52] <rudolf_> can i?
[13:12:05] <rudolf_> ?
[13:16:28] <amee2k> >_>
[13:19:20] <_abc_> Is there some clever script for timer and usart in avr-gcc for when U2X is used? It screws the way the UCSRA is reset (TXC), I had to write some conditionals around it also for baud rate computation.
[13:57:40] <OndraSter> fail, I have got on mz boards two 22p 0603 and two 22p 1206... they all could have been 0603 :(
[13:57:44] <OndraSter> my boards*
[14:32:57] <dirty_d> i bought like 2000 resistors and caps from mouser
[14:32:59] <dirty_d> all 0805
[14:33:12] <dirty_d> theyre a lot smaller than i though
[14:33:34] <dirty_d> so are the sot-23 transistors
[14:36:19] <Steffanx> Nah, it doesn't take that long before you think "It's time for 0603 now" :)
[14:42:00] <carp3> 0402
[14:42:14] <carp3> ( kidding )
[14:43:18] <carp3> or 01005 in english
[14:45:00] <OndraSter> carp3, did you ment to say "dust"? :D
[14:45:50] <carp3> lol, sometimes i have problem with soldering 0805 :p ( my hand shakes )
[14:46:22] <OndraSter> yeah, I am gonna put paste on the pads and reflow it with hot air soldering gun
[14:50:29] <carp3> i never used paste . how much heat they need ?
[14:51:40] <OndraSter> depends on lead or lead free
[14:51:46] <OndraSter> but regular soldering temps
[14:51:49] <OndraSter> something above 200C
[15:02:52] <carp3> how to use it ? with syringe?
[15:02:58] <carp3> how do you*
[15:04:32] <Steffanx> I used paste + solder iron a few times .. works pretty well
[15:06:14] <carp3> they don't stick to soldering iron ?
[15:06:34] <carp3> ( my english really sucks !! )
[15:06:52] <specing> ( indeeed !!1 )
[15:11:07] <OndraSter> carp3, ye, syringe
[15:39:42] <OndraSter> so, does 0603 part fit onto 1206 pads?
[15:39:45] <OndraSter> anyone tried? :P
[15:41:07] <dirty_d> i bought paste, but i havent found it useful for anything yet
[15:41:18] <dirty_d> it bridged like crazy on tqfp44
[15:41:27] <dirty_d> didnt even wanna attempt with qfn
[15:41:40] <dirty_d> its easier to just solder tqfp by hand
[15:42:17] <carp3> Ù†
[15:42:26] <dirty_d> qfn i tin the pads and make a qfn flux pcb sandwhich and cook it on a skillet
[15:42:32] <dirty_d> literally
[15:45:46] <open> hi
[15:45:59] <open> do you folks know about the X10 protocol?
[15:46:12] <open> I have some x10 equipment -- and an avr atmega32 board
[15:46:20] <open> I'm trying to make use of the two
[15:46:38] <open> any ideas on how I should go about trying to interface the atmega board with my equipment?
[15:47:41] <carp3> dirty_d, i think you should use template for QFN.
[15:48:22] <Kevin`> open: powerline interface or wireless interface?
[15:50:08] <Kevin`> actually in either case you probably want to get an interface module, since mains stuff needs safety design and certification, and wireless stuff is black magic
[15:51:20] <open> interface modules
[15:51:27] <open> do you have experience with any particular?
[15:52:02] <mrfrenzy_> elekhomica has one for like 20e I think
[15:52:39] <Kevin`> open: only on the wireless side. atmel even makes some chips themselves that could talk this protocol (among other things, since it's so simple)
[15:53:40] <Kevin`> the wired side wouldn't be particularly hard to do yourself with a few simple parts, but.. mains..
[15:54:27] <open> http://www.x10.com/instructions/tech_fc.htm
[15:54:29] <open> thoughts on that?
[15:55:50] <Kevin`> open: unless you can find implementation details, a windows device is useless
[15:56:10] <Kevin`> it's also probably fairly expensive, since it's designed for consumers instead of in products
[15:56:43] <open> http://www.lickey.com/flipit/ <- people seem to have written applications for it
[15:56:46] <open> for different platforms
[15:57:06] <open> it seems to go for $5 on ebay and other places
[15:57:33] <mrfrenzy_> ooh you're in 110V country?
[15:58:04] <Kevin`> open: take a look at the source for it. rs232 isn't very hard to interface to a uc, if you have to.
[15:58:06] <open> I could look at their implementation I think
[16:35:16] <Tom_itx> dirty_d, you can get an assortment of 5000 on ebay for like $11
[16:37:56] <dirty_d> Tom_itx, i think i paid like $5
[16:38:12] <dirty_d> but i might do that next time because it took forever to find everything
[17:00:15] <Tom_itx> http://www.ebay.com/itm/50-Value-0603-SMD-Resistor-Kit-0R-10MR-5-5000-pcs-/250988216434?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a70104072
[17:02:46] <Tom_itx> http://www.ebay.com/itm/50-Value-0603-SMD-Resistor-Kit-0R-10MR-5-5000-pcs-/230683558294?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b5cfc196
[17:02:52] <Tom_itx> that looks like the one i got
[17:03:25] <open> awwwww! they look so cute little itty bitty resistors
[17:03:55] <open> but why are you getting surface mount stuff
[17:03:59] <Tom_itx> a necessary evil when dealing with electronics
[17:04:06] <Tom_itx> because i solder smt
[17:04:25] <open> wow, how are you gonna solder that. do you have a precision solder gun or something?
[17:04:52] <Tom_itx> it's not that hard
[17:04:59] <Tom_itx> i use an iron or a toaster oven
[17:05:14] <Tom_itx> btw, get a firecracker and interface the serial
[17:05:38] <Tom_itx> if you know x-10 you know what that is
[17:05:41] <open> it's gonna be difficult to implement, I think
[17:05:59] <Tom_itx> not if you sniff the serial
[17:06:01] <Tom_itx> first
[17:06:05] <open> http://paste.pound-python.org/show/ayEXN9uhy9WkkQ22nIk0/
[17:06:40] <open> I'm not a very seasoned c programmer
[17:07:06] <Tom_itx> i don't like spicy food anyway
[17:07:07] <open> not to mention the atmega board's fickleness (I've had problems in the past that I couldn't get to the bottom of)
[17:08:01] <open> Anyway, I will indeed be looking into this tonight
[17:13:59] <OndraSter> Tom_itx, do you happen to know if 0805 or even 0603 items fit on 1206 pads?
[17:14:11] <OndraSter> I forgot to scale down few resistors and caps to make them all the same size
[17:14:14] <OndraSter> like two or three
[17:22:20] <Tom_itx> probably would
[17:22:37] <Tom_itx> there would just be extra pad
[17:22:37] <OndraSter> 0603 would be k3wl, but 0805 is enough
[17:22:54] <Tom_itx> i think it would still bridge the gap
[17:22:59] <OndraSter> yeah
[17:23:02] <OndraSter> hopefuly :D
[17:23:03] <OndraSter> thanks
[17:23:29] <OndraSter> I need a lot of 100nF caps... might buy them in stock... but I need really literally few other values, might buy those 50 value boxes
[17:23:49] <Tom_itx> it may be a waste for caps
[17:23:56] <Tom_itx> up to you
[17:24:06] <dirty_d> i just got from 10uF to 1nF
[17:24:12] <amee2k> having lots of different values in low quantities has its advantages
[17:24:13] <OndraSter> well local stuff costs like $0.1 per one
[17:24:14] <Tom_itx> i usually just get the caps i need
[17:24:21] <OndraSter> and farnell has minimum of 100 values
[17:24:27] <OndraSter> 500 values for resistors sometimes even
[17:24:32] <OndraSter> 500 pieces*
[17:24:37] <amee2k> thats why i even salvage resistors... got me an extremely wide variety of funny values for free
[17:24:44] <OndraSter> amee2k, so do I
[17:24:57] <OndraSter> I wanted to buy those small boxes from DX... but they do not have them anymore :(
[17:24:59] <dirty_d> why bother
[17:25:00] <OndraSter> they were cute
[17:25:01] <dirty_d> theyre so cheap
[17:25:12] <Tom_itx> open, smt is spoken here:
http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/boards_index.php
[17:25:14] <amee2k> although the resistor/capacitor sets are usually overpriced, agreed
[17:25:34] <Tom_itx> OndraSter yeah i know, i got a bunch of em
[17:25:45] <OndraSter> they have them on itead
[17:25:49] <OndraSter> $.5 per box
[17:25:51] <amee2k> buying some cheap plasic boxes and ordering the parts from a regular supplier probably won't be cheaper but will usually get you more parts
[17:25:57] <OndraSter> DX was like $1.2 per three or so?
[17:26:02] <OndraSter> or was it more
[17:26:14] <Tom_itx> i dunno
[17:27:06] <Tom_itx> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/configurable-storage-toolboxes-3-pack-4727
[17:27:12] <Tom_itx> there's the bigger ones
[17:28:00] <OndraSter> yeah
[17:28:06] <OndraSter> the smaller ones are not there anymore :(
[17:28:10] <amee2k> http://www.companydepot.de/images/product_images/popup_images/sortimentkasten--blau-fuer-werkstatt-und-zuhause-2051.jpg << i like getting ones like these
[17:28:30] <OndraSter> that's too big for 0603 :D
[17:28:44] <amee2k> yeah, but they make them smaller too
[17:28:51] <amee2k> or just get 1k pcs of each >_>
[17:28:51] <Tom_itx> i use those for µC etc
[17:28:56] <Tom_itx> switches etc
[17:30:00] <amee2k> i use them for prettymuch everything except for screws
[17:30:07] <amee2k> i've got a different kind of box for that
[17:31:46] <Tom_itx> i still have a couple packs of the small ones i haven't used yet
[17:32:23] <amee2k> i got the first ones at a local hardware store
[17:32:36] <amee2k> and i've been buying the same type ever since so they stack properly
[17:33:34] <amee2k> http://ompldr.org/vY3Iwaw/CIMG9020b.jpeg << small boxes
[17:34:20] <Tom_itx> yeah i have a bunch of those too
[17:34:37] <Tom_itx> you're just too damn orgainzed
[17:34:38] <amee2k> i don't stock as many transistors anymore as i used to
[17:35:05] <amee2k> nah, i make lots of parts share compartments too
[17:35:35] <amee2k> like all the MCUs and discrete logic stuff i have fits into like three compartments on one of the larger boxes
[17:35:55] <amee2k> and i usually make complementary transistor types share too
[17:35:55] <Tom_itx> i keep alot of that stuff in the original packaging
[17:36:24] <amee2k> meh, the original baggies are even worse space-efficiency wise than the boxes
[17:36:38] <amee2k> and the farnell labels fade after a few months, you can see that on my pics :/
[17:37:58] <amee2k> the three (well back then it was 10, but still) TO3 transistors on that pic came in a piece of styrofoam in a baggy in a larger baggy in a carboard box the size of an entire of these set boxes
[17:38:40] <amee2k> they fit together with the TO3P ones into two compartments on the small blue box
[17:38:42] <amee2k> :P
[17:39:30] <OndraSter> btw, what is the advantage of using external crystal than whole crystal oscillator for use with ATmega?
[17:39:34] <amee2k> thats also why i don't like SMT stuff... when i get it i always have to relabel it because when the farnell labels fade i have no way to find out what it was
[17:39:40] <OndraSter> less junk on power lines?
[17:39:58] <OndraSter> err
[17:39:59] <OndraSter> opposite
[17:40:10] <amee2k> more link on power lines?
[17:40:22] <amee2k> more junk* even?
[17:40:29] <amee2k> on which power lines and what anyway?
[17:40:31] <amee2k> >_>
[17:40:57] <OndraSter> well the crystal gives you something like sinusoidal who knows what, where the crystal oscilator is "regular" square wave...
[17:41:00] <OndraSter> or should be
[17:41:01] <OndraSter> right?
[17:41:16] <OndraSter> but there must be some advantage
[17:41:23] <OndraSter> (I know, integrated PLL and such)
[17:41:27] <OndraSter> but others than that
[17:42:35] <amee2k> no loading and other analog details of a discrete xtal oscillator?
[17:42:41] <OndraSter> yeah
[17:42:53] <OndraSter> that's what I ment by the junk... it is all filtered out and cleared
[17:42:53] <amee2k> also, if you use a canned xtal osc you only need one MCU pin for clock input
[17:43:06] <OndraSter> that's another + for those low pin count devices
[17:43:12] <amee2k> whereas xtal or resonator directly on mcu usually needs two
[17:43:31] <OndraSter> the disadvantage I can see is price
[17:43:44] <amee2k> saving one pin for the xtal osc can enable you to use one mcu size smaller if you're exactly one pin short >_>
[17:44:18] <amee2k> also, ease of use probably has its savings too
[17:44:40] <amee2k> especially on high frequency designs or ones that need elaborate frequency scaling
[17:44:49] <Tom_itx> amee2k, if you put a piece of clear tape over the labels they won't fade
[17:45:00] <amee2k> Tom_itx: 0.0
[17:45:02] <amee2k> that works??
[17:45:08] <Tom_itx> try it
[17:45:14] * amee2k facepalms
[17:45:25] <amee2k> will do
[17:46:02] * amee2k would still advocate his micro-dot idea
[17:46:15] <brentbxr^> Anyone know of a bootloader with software UART support? nothing fancy i just dont feel like making one if i dont have too.
[17:46:34] <amee2k> hmm arduino bootloader comes to mind
[17:46:41] <OndraSter> software UART there?
[17:46:52] <brentbxr^> arduino is software uart?
[17:46:54] <amee2k> oh, err. i didn't read the "software" part
[17:46:57] <amee2k> nevermind then
[17:47:08] <brentbxr^> i dont care for arduino
[17:47:14] <brentbxr^> but im pretty sure thats hardware uart
[17:47:31] <amee2k> arduino is just a popular dev board for megaX8 series ;)
[17:47:42] <amee2k> i'd gladly buy a microdot reader if it meant reliable and instant identification of any and all components i come across
[17:48:14] <brentbxr^> thats the smallest part of arduino
[17:48:23] <brentbxr^> i think the IDE is the seller
[17:48:39] <brentbxr^> rapid prototyping or whatever
[17:48:50] <brentbxr^> for the price though; I do like the arduino board nothing wrong with that
[18:35:31] <OndraSter> http://www.ebay.com/itm/FE-5680A-Rubidium-Atomic-Frequency-Standard-10MHz-OUT-/170771669194?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c2c8e0ca
[18:35:32] <OndraSter> anyone?
[18:38:11] <Kevin`> OndraSter: you are selling?
[18:38:20] <Kevin`> I should get one of those sometime
[18:39:35] <OndraSter> no
[18:39:37] <OndraSter> might buy
[18:39:43] <OndraSter> there is bazilion of them on ebay now
[18:39:55] <OndraSter> china must have discontinued them :P
[18:40:01] <OndraSter> those FE 5680A
[18:54:10] <Casper> is that even legal to sell and buy?
[18:56:51] <OndraSter> it is china
[18:56:52] <OndraSter> :D
[19:02:18] <Jan-> TGIF, everyone :)
[19:03:26] <Jan-> do you guys have any favorite ways of debouncing switches
[19:03:27] <OndraSter> heya Jan-
[19:03:34] <OndraSter> cap
[19:03:40] <OndraSter> in parallel with the button
[19:04:14] <Jan-> how big
[19:04:22] <Casper> Jan-: cap-n-resistor
[19:04:41] <Casper> tiny cap, probably 0.01 would work
[19:05:11] <Jan-> 0.01 whats :)
[19:05:33] <OndraSter> 10nF - 100nF, depends on what is in the drawer
[19:05:37] <OndraSter> bigger cap = slower response
[19:05:40] <Jan-> uhhuh
[19:05:45] <Jan-> I guess you can do it in software
[19:05:49] <Jan-> but that could get supercomplicated
[19:05:58] * Jan- has been reading about interrupt service routines
[19:06:01] * Jan- trembles in fear
[19:06:10] <OndraSter> actually
[19:06:13] <OndraSter> once the ISR fires up
[19:06:22] <OndraSter> it will be bouncing meanwhile the interrupt is serviced
[19:06:30] <OndraSter> hopefuly :D
[19:06:36] * Jan- isn't a big fan of "hopefully"
[19:06:43] <Jan-> anyway enough tech talk
[19:06:45] <Jan-> how're you, OndraSter?
[19:06:48] <Jan-> good friday evening?
[19:06:52] * Jan- offers OndraSter a beer
[19:08:25] <OndraSter> friday evening?
[19:08:28] <OndraSter> saturday night :P
[19:08:29] <OndraSter> yeah
[19:08:31] <OndraSter> beer is good
[19:08:39] <OndraSter> but I am in bed already... I would spill it probably
[19:09:22] <Jan-> Aw
[19:09:24] <Jan-> what time is it there
[19:09:29] <OndraSter> 2:00
[19:09:32] <OndraSter> in the night
[19:09:47] <OndraSter> I thought you were middle Europe (or at least UTC+2) too
[19:10:06] <Jan-> I'm in the UK
[19:10:51] <Jan-> where it is currently 1.01am saturday
[19:10:57] <OndraSter> oh
[19:11:48] <Jan-> I need pushbuttons.
[19:12:15] <Jan-> OK let me get this straight
[19:12:23] <Jan-> a "netduino" uses a 32-bit ARM7 processor
[19:12:28] <Jan-> and that's different to the 32-bit AVRs?
[19:12:48] <OndraSter> a lot
[19:12:52] <Jan-> ok
[19:13:52] * Jan- likes the idea of a microcontroller for which you can write .net
[19:13:54] * Jan- likes C#
[19:19:29] * rue_mohr shudders
[19:19:46] * Jan- tucks rue_mohr up warm
[19:19:50] <Jan-> What's wrong, rue?
[19:20:08] <rue_mohr> I dont like c#
[19:20:12] <OndraSter> I love C#
[19:20:23] <Jan-> There's nothing wrong with things being easy.
[19:20:45] <rue_mohr> who wants to do RF communications with an avr via RC-car circuit hacking?
[19:21:38] <rue_mohr> I know a super simple way to do 16 or 32 level fsk 'ing
[19:21:57] <rue_mohr> !time
[19:21:59] <rue_mohr> !time
[19:23:51] <rue_mohr> !time
[19:23:52] <tobbor> My watch says its 17:20 Fri Feb 10 2012
[19:23:52] <_tobbor> My watch says its 17:20 Fri Feb 10 2012
[19:23:56] <rue_mohr> hmm
[19:25:08] <rue_mohr> !time
[19:25:09] <tobbor> My watch says its 17:21 Fri Feb 10 2012
[19:25:25] <Jan-> My clock says it's one sixteen AM saturday
[19:25:28] <rue_mohr> ok tobbor restarts every 2(?) hours
[19:25:47] <Jan-> I thought tobbor was another name for you
[19:26:29] <rue_mohr> no
[19:26:42] <Jan-> oh, is he REALLY a bot?
[19:26:45] <Jan-> I thought they were kidding
[19:26:52] <rue_mohr> tobbor says its me so if someone gets annoyed I get contacted
[19:27:00] <rue_mohr> !thislog
[19:27:01] <tobbor> This one:
http://rueshouse.dyndns.org:82/~ircjunk/irclogs/html/%23avr-2012-02-11.html
[19:27:11] <rue_mohr> !seen Rifraf
[19:27:11] <tobbor> RifRaf was last seen in #robotics on Nov 15 23:48 2011
[19:27:16] <rue_mohr> !doresistors 3
[19:27:17] <tobbor> rue_mohr: What is the colour for the value 0?
[19:27:17] <Jan-> oh well then
[19:27:20] <rue_mohr> black
[19:27:20] <tobbor> rue_mohr: Correct. What is the colour for the value 1?
[19:27:22] <Jan-> hello, tobbor, it's very nice to meet you
[19:27:23] <rue_mohr> brown
[19:27:24] <tobbor> rue_mohr: Correct. What is the colour for the value 5?
[19:27:27] <rue_mohr> green
[19:27:28] <tobbor> rue_mohr: Correct. Your score was: 100%
[19:27:32] * Jan- pats tobbor on his littlel metal head *clank* *clank*
[19:30:01] <rue_mohr> !design a machine capable of time and space travel, able to transport 1 being from earth to anywhere in the universe within 4 hours and maintain an environment they can survive in, allow for a window to see out of the machine
[19:30:11] <rue_mohr> oh, I havn't finished that command yet...
[19:30:16] <OndraSter> hehe
[19:30:27] <Jan-> well I think he's lovely anyway
[19:30:30] * Jan- oils tobbor's joints
[19:30:47] <Jan-> bots are cute :)
[19:30:53] <rue_mohr> so I scored!
[19:31:04] <Jan-> can I have a special command please?
[19:31:21] <rue_mohr> last night I found official schematics for both 27Mhz and 49Mhz rf reciever and transmitter circuits
[19:31:34] <rue_mohr> heh, what do you want tobbor to do
[19:31:52] <Jan-> well, if I say !drinks he should say "/me trundles around the channel with a tray of drinks"
[19:31:58] <Jan-> perhaps the same for !snacks
[19:32:11] <rue_mohr> heh
[19:32:11] <Jan-> bots like to be useful :)
[19:32:35] <rue_mohr> !seen the day when tobbor is a slave to mankind
[19:32:35] <tobbor> Screw off pepsi. ;)
[19:32:40] <rue_mohr> erp too long
[19:33:18] <rue_mohr> !seen someone tame tobbor
[19:33:19] <tobbor> I have never seen someone tame tobbor
[19:33:37] <Jan-> aww poor tobbor you're confusing him
[19:33:46] * Jan- polishes tobbor's casing
[19:34:13] <rue_mohr> someone was supposed to contact me at 17:00 about something
[19:34:13] <OndraSter> I am re-watching Red Dwarf
[19:34:17] <OndraSter> I am already in 6th season :D
[19:34:24] <Jan-> OndraSter: Red dwarf :D
[19:34:50] <rue_mohr> http://members.shaw.ca/novotill/StudSensorAutomatic/index.htm
[19:34:54] <rue_mohr> that guys work is good
[19:35:11] <rue_mohr> http://members.shaw.ca/novotill/RcCarsSimple/
[19:35:15] <rue_mohr> ther eis the rc car stuff
[19:36:55] <Jan-> someone tell me to go to bed like they're my dad :(
[19:36:59] <Jan-> I should go sleep
[19:37:02] <Jan-> but I can't be bothered to move
[19:37:09] <rue_mohr> I am, but I havn't notied yet
[19:38:10] <OndraSter> Jan-, I am already in bed :P
[19:38:13] <OndraSter> laptop ftw
[19:38:25] <Jan-> I have a wireless keyboard and infra-red headphones
[19:38:30] <Jan-> but they only work in this room
[19:39:07] <OndraSter> I prefer bluetooth technology
[19:39:10] <OndraSter> I have BT headphones
[19:39:17] <OndraSter> somewhere
[19:40:04] <Jan-> I've had these ages
[19:40:06] <Jan-> they sound great
[19:40:54] <dirty_d> jeez
[19:40:55] <Jan-> The opening line of the new Star Wars trailer is "gang on"
[19:40:59] <dirty_d> the twi on xmega is awfully confusing
[19:41:00] <Jan-> and the last one is "at last we will have revenge"
[19:41:04] <Jan-> it sounds like a really shitty movie
[19:41:08] <dirty_d> its working
[19:41:10] <dirty_d> sorta
[19:41:24] <dirty_d> with the help of a wdt
[19:42:32] <OndraSter> the SW Phantom Menace 3D?
[19:43:07] <rue_mohr> ok I keep falling asleep on my mouse and I'm clicking links I dont want to
[19:43:17] * rue_mohr goes to bed
[19:43:24] <rue_mohr> wake me when septembre comes
[19:45:35] <OndraSter> eh
[19:45:41] <OndraSter> (Green Day?)
[19:47:11] <buhman> I was looking at
http://www.ladyada.net/make/usbtinyisp/index.html but it claims that it only works with <= 64k uC's
[19:48:38] <buhman> Ideally I'd want something insanely cheap, but compatible with avrdude, that can program atmegas (without a need for any sort of "bootloader": /not/ how arduino does it)
[19:49:34] <Kre10s__> usbprog?
[19:49:59] <buhman> right, this should be something like usb -> isp
[19:50:45] <buhman> I wouldn't have a problem assembling it similar to what's described on the usbtinyisp; I just want to use it with a 128k controller
[19:51:01] <Kre10s__> what was that thing about word/byte offsets... If AVR says the bootloader section starts at 0x3F00 what to I have to pass avr-gcc? 0x3F00*2 ?
[19:51:27] <buhman> and I have another isp I can use to initially program the isp I intend to create..
[20:01:20] <OndraSter> programming programmer: han vs egg
[20:02:42] <OndraSter> <Jan-> someone tell me to go to bed like they're my dad :(
[20:02:50] <JansDaddy> go to bed!
[20:02:56] <OndraSter> I am going too
[20:02:57] <OndraSter> gn
[20:06:18] <dirty_d> garrrr!
[20:08:50] <Kre10s__> I once new exactly how it worked... now it is long ago...
[20:09:41] <Kre10s__> the avr docs will give addresses in words yes?
[20:13:36] <Casper> yes
[20:13:44] <Casper> for flash
[20:14:07] <Casper> but bytes for ram and eeprom, except some newer device where the eeprom address is in words...
[20:22:00] <buhman> I was wanting to get a ft232 anyway; can that be used for ISP?
[20:27:23] <Kre10s__> hm. ld takes byte offsets, so i sould multiply by 2, to pass to the linker...
[20:49:49] <dirty_d> bool twi_status = (twi->status & TWIM_STATUS_READY);
[20:50:11] <dirty_d> if TWIM_STATUS_READY is #defined as 0, then i dont see the point of that
