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[00:16:41] <crazy_pete> where is Dean Camera? Lets talk about AVR and USB ;-)
[00:16:57] <crazy_pete> (wants some discussion about something) ;-)
[00:19:22] <Casper> what about the possible soon discontinuation of 2.5" ide drives?
[00:22:18] <Casper> . . . are they discontinued?!?
[00:24:07] <crazy_pete> man what about the price jump in IDE drives
[00:24:12] <ziph> crazy_pete: He's in a new timezone.
[00:24:18] <Casper> crazy_pete: not just ide
[00:24:21] <crazy_pete> er in SATA
[00:24:23] <Casper> but yes ide is expensive...
[00:24:23] <crazy_pete> not IDE ;-)
[00:24:34] <Casper> hds almost doubled in price
[00:24:54] <crazy_pete> i was waiting to get some 1TB drives but wanted the price to drop from 70 to $50
[00:25:02] <crazy_pete> next time i looked they were $150 ;-)
[00:25:27] <crazy_pete> think china's getting scared? They won the cold war and all they have to show for it is an "IOU" from the USA ;-)
[00:26:09] <crazy_pete> (seriously some hardware engineers i know said that china is hoarding valuable metals like tantulum and that is why drive prices skyrocketed)
[00:31:47] <Casper> crazy_pete: I bought mine... they dropped in price... now they are almost twice as much as I paid
[00:31:52] <Casper> they are 3TB one
[00:32:06] <crazy_pete> yeah the price of drives has gone crazy
[00:33:07] <Casper> thailand flood
[00:37:15] <crazy_pete> that too ;-)
[00:38:47] <Casper> hmm
[00:39:02] <Casper> I hate to be unable to know what is the biggest hd size that the laptop is supposed to be able to handle
[00:41:28] <crazy_pete> damn i hate getting "womaned" ;-)
[00:41:41] <crazy_pete> just noticed on the grocery receipt that i got charged double for some stuff
[00:42:07] <crazy_pete> very cute cashier at the grocery store ... yet always manages to overcharge
[00:42:32] <Casper> here there is a law
[00:43:43] <Casper> if the price at the register is higher than the shelf price, they have to: if less than 10$, give the item free. if more than 10$, correct the price and give 10$ rebate. if multiple item, only the first get the rebate, other must be corrected to the right shelf price
[00:43:54] <Casper> the error do not have to be noticed right away
[00:44:05] <Casper> so you can go home, check it, then come back
[00:44:27] <eatyourguitar> I just did some reading on the tantalum thing and it looks like its not so bad
[00:45:09] <eatyourguitar> the factories that make harddrives were underwater not too long ago. thats why the price increase
[00:47:06] <Casper> . . . HP try to make us beleive that their wireless card in the laptop can do....
[00:47:28] <Casper> 300 feet – Indoor, Office environment
[00:47:37] <Casper> and even more laughtable
[00:47:42] <Casper> 1200 feet – Outdoor Open Area
[00:48:47] <Casper> eatyourguitar: I read that it's 90% of the world production that got flooded
[00:55:06] <crazy_pete> hi pepsi` :-)
[00:59:31] <Casper> crazy_pete: but look, he broke the net again! (somehow it happend often)
[01:47:48] <crazy_pete> hahah Casper
[01:48:22] <Casper> he seems to have a really bad timing as it happend often that he join... and a netsplit occur right after
[01:49:24] <crazy_pete> hhahha
[01:49:32] <crazy_pete> or he IS causing it :-)
[01:49:43] <crazy_pete> there might be some fortean principle at work
[01:50:16] <crazy_pete> (Charles Forte was the 19th century researcher who debunked superstitions by providing a scientific explanation where others dismissed the phenomena)
[01:50:39] <crazy_pete> My favourite was his research into bible belt reports of "Demons being cast out of the sky during storms"
[01:51:25] <crazy_pete> Sure as hell he was able to documented deformed humanoid bodies being cast down from heaven when these religious farmers claimed that "demons" were being thrown out of heaven
[01:52:02] <Casper> you know... I'm starting to wonder if I still can get 7200rpm laptop hds
[01:52:07] <crazy_pete> and then he was also able to document (remember this 1820) that everytime a "Demon" was cast down during a storm.... The Newspaper in the town 30 miles UPWIND reported someone getting sucked up in a tornado :-)
[01:53:15] <crazy_pete> hmm i dunno about ide Casper
[01:53:29] <Casper> WD only make 5400
[01:53:35] <Casper> seagate stopped to make them
[01:53:43] <Casper> I guess I'ld be stuck with a 5400
[01:53:45] <crazy_pete> i have had the worst luck in my life with WD products.... i dont know why
[01:54:17] <crazy_pete> and i know people that have had them for years, so it really is "luck" afait
[01:55:19] <Casper> I have all WD
[01:55:29] <Casper> and I don't have much problem with them
[01:55:51] <Casper> except my 3TB, I got a bad batch (probably a mishandled palet)
[01:56:30] <Casper> hmmm.... look like I would gain LOTS of speed by getting a new hd
[01:56:35] <Casper> current do 30MB/s
[01:56:55] <Casper> new should do 97MB/s
[01:57:20] <Valen> Casper: what do you want to do?
[01:57:25] <Valen> with your hdd?
[01:58:46] <crazy_pete> well i am off to bed, peace all
[01:59:18] <Casper> Valen: have something faster?
[02:05:02] <Valen> SSD
[02:05:07] <Valen> they are *fast*
[02:05:15] <Valen> you won't go back to spining media
[02:09:21] <Casper> find me one in ide for laptop
[02:09:44] <Valen> you can get 3TB laptop in pata?
[02:09:53] <Casper> nope
[02:09:57] <Valen> I was looking at a similar thing for my mum
[02:10:07] <Valen> you can get sata > pata adaptors
[02:10:21] <Casper> no you can'T for laptop
[02:10:25] <Casper> no space
[02:10:48] <Valen> they are basically one pcb thickness in size, so i figured it might work
[02:10:57] <Valen> might need to take the SSD out of its case perhaps
[02:11:16] <Casper> the only ssd option is compact flash
[02:11:23] <Casper> but 32GB is too little for me
[02:11:29] <Casper> and 64GB is way too expensive
[02:11:42] <Valen> as i said, take a look at decapsulating the ssd
[02:11:44] <Valen> might fit then
[02:11:59] <Valen> i was looking for a new hdd for my mums pata laptop
[02:12:00] <Valen> no joy
[02:12:04] <Casper> not unless you cut the pcb in most case...
[02:12:18] <dehuman> dremel calls you
[02:12:30] <Casper> and anyway, I never saw a laptop converter board
[02:12:51] <Casper> I'm not even sure if this laptop support lba48
[02:12:54] <Casper> most do not
[02:13:42] <Valen> http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-5-Laptop-SATA-44p-PATA-IDE-HDD-Adapter-Converter-/260778737551?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cb79fbf8f#ht_2117wt_1165
[02:14:11] <Casper> hmmm
[02:14:49] <Valen> for $5 or whatever it is, its worth thinking about
[02:15:33] <Casper> hmm could work actually
[02:16:02] <Valen> as i said if you had an issue with the length if you take the pcb out of a ssd it'd probably fit
[02:16:14] <Casper> I'ld have to make a new caddy
[02:16:18] <Valen> or that
[02:16:23] <Valen> depends on how it mounts
[02:16:41] <Casper> but it could maybe work
[02:20:01] <Casper> or I might just go mechanical hd... it's a laptop anyway
[02:21:13] <Valen> or get a 2nd hand macbook lol
[02:21:26] <Casper> nahhh
[02:21:29] <Valen> rag on em in any way you feel but the macbooks are pretty robust
[02:21:32] <Valen> physcially
[02:21:58] <Casper> http://www.ebay.ca/itm/350345457426?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649 ← but this might be what I'll get
[02:22:15] <Casper> and would fix all problems
[02:22:23] <Valen> well if you can do that, get it and a ssd and be happy ;-P
[02:22:33] <Valen> i have an ssd in my laptop as the main drive
[02:22:43] <Valen> and i want one of those for the 2nd drive to put large storage in
[02:22:47] <Valen> and my windows drive
[02:23:07] <Casper> here it will be the inverse... main drive will be the data drive, and second drive will be the os one
[02:23:18] <Casper> but you know
[02:23:27] <Casper> I'll first install a new wireless card
[02:23:35] <Casper> I ordered it
[02:23:44] <Valen> i was thinking about that for my mums laptop as well
[02:23:46] <Valen> an internal one
[02:23:56] <Casper> what brand is your mon laptop?
[02:24:06] <Valen> but its amd and all the intel wifi cards say centrino only
[02:24:19] <Valen> its TPG but i think its a medion thats rebadged
[02:24:29] <Casper> tpg? don't know it...
[02:24:38] <Valen> its an ISP here
[02:24:49] <Valen> some promotional thing
[02:25:02] <Casper> but beware, IBM and HP have wireless card whitelist in the bios
[02:25:25] <Valen> nasty
[02:25:44] <Valen> i learnt my lesson, i make sure i fully option all the laptops i get now ;->
[02:25:57] <Casper> I initially got an error when I put that better card in: 104- Unauthorized wireless card detected. Remove and restart the system.
[02:26:38] <Casper> some googling and found out a gem: cracked bios!
[02:26:53] <Casper> that new bios remove the whitelist
[02:27:11] <Valen> nice
[02:31:07] <Casper> yeah will have to test it early this week for the "third" card
[02:31:12] <Casper> I ordered a wireless N
[02:52:45] <Casper> http://www.tp-link.com/en/products/details/?model=TL-WN861N
[02:52:49] <Casper> let's hope it work
[05:18:32] <amee2k> mmmh, what is it with people and this power line ethernet crap lately?
[05:20:03] <Tom_itx> ?
[05:20:53] <amee2k> these things that look like a wall wart and have an ethernet bridge inside to extend the network over mains wiring
[05:21:22] <amee2k> and that incidentially are a huge pain in the ass to get to work if the building's wiring wasn't laid out with networking in mind
[05:42:11] <inflex> lo folks
[05:42:17] * inflex submits a job to GP
[05:49:44] <ziph> inflex: lo
[05:49:52] <ziph> inflex: Do they really have a web site to do that with now
[05:49:54] <ziph> ?
[05:51:06] <mrfrenzy> they work fine aslong as you connect them to the same phase
[06:01:12] <inflex> ziph: yes, they do... but I thought I'd try using the old email method first
[06:01:22] <inflex> ziph: if they redirect me to use the www site I will
[06:34:41] <amee2k> mrfrenzy: not always
[06:35:02] <amee2k> last summer we tried to set up some fairly expensive ones at a client's home location
[06:35:44] <amee2k> in some rooms they only worked on very specific outlets. across the room is enough to make them work or not work
[06:36:35] <mrfrenzy> problems can occur if they are connected close to a big capacitance
[06:36:41] <mrfrenzy> there are special filters to work around that
[06:37:04] <Tom_itx> they pull power from the switch or whatever they're hooked to?
[06:37:17] <mrfrenzy> no from the wall outlet
[06:37:24] <amee2k> thats why i said they probably work better if the building's wiring was designed for it
[06:37:41] <mrfrenzy> you never design a buildings wiring for this, much cheaper to run cat5
[06:37:42] <Tom_itx> does PoE require a powered adapter on the end then?
[06:37:45] <mrfrenzy> these are for retrofitting
[06:37:47] <amee2k> Tom_itx: they supply themselves from the outlet, but their purpose is to modulate ethernet traffic on the power lines so you can use existing wiring
[06:38:03] <Tom_itx> oh i have some of those if you want em
[06:38:14] <Tom_itx> i'm talking about Poe
[06:38:18] <amee2k> mrfrenzy: well, much cheaper and as opposed to the adapters cat5/6/whatever also works
[06:39:18] <amee2k> imo they only are an option where drilling is a physical (or in that case last summer, mental) impossibility
[06:39:21] <Tom_itx> they should be wired on the same phase to work right
[06:39:33] <Tom_itx> some wiring is wired to balance the load so i doubt it would work there
[06:39:36] <mrfrenzy> we already covered that Tom_itx ;)
[06:40:00] <Tom_itx> but amee2k started off the discussion about PoE
[06:40:05] <amee2k> Tom_itx: different phases in the same room? o.O
[06:40:09] <Tom_itx> not etherenet over power
[06:40:13] <mrfrenzy> amee2k: yes that is very common
[06:40:15] <Tom_itx> amee2k yes
[06:40:26] <amee2k> i've never seen that around here
[06:40:34] <Tom_itx> in fact sometimes it's every other outlet
[06:40:35] <mrfrenzy> two breakers next to each other in a panel are always on different phases
[06:40:40] <amee2k> actually, we have a whole apartment on a single phase here
[06:41:18] <mrfrenzy> in most modern apartments you have two groups in each room, and those two groups also server other rooms
[06:41:26] <mrfrenzy> that way if one fuse blows an entire room won't go dark
[06:41:26] <amee2k> yeah, i know these rails with copper sheets that you run along the breakers
[06:42:13] <mrfrenzy> yep, and in a three phase system they are wired 1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3 etc
[06:42:26] <amee2k> mrfrenzy: i've seen different fuses for lights and outlets, but only in workshops where the possibility of the breaker tripping is there for normal operation
[06:42:27] <Tom_itx> less common
[06:42:59] <mrfrenzy> here in sweden it's very common
[06:43:01] <amee2k> but never seen more than one phase for (everything except lighting) in the same room
[06:43:13] <Tom_itx> yeah but they need to acount for geeks like you that may bring their workshop into their apartment
[06:43:28] <Sgt_Lemming> lo Tom_itx
[06:43:40] <mrfrenzy> vaccum cleaners, toaster ovens, ironing, heating
[06:43:40] <Tom_itx> hi
[06:43:43] <mrfrenzy> all uses lots of power
[06:44:08] <amee2k> Tom_itx: yeah, i can see that. thats probably the reason why this whole apartment (including lights) has a single fuse for everything
[06:44:13] <Tom_itx> and lighting can be wired on 14ga instead of 12 like outlets
[06:44:16] <amee2k> it totally makes sense >_<
[06:44:33] <Sgt_Lemming> anyone know if it's posible to use the RX pin of a UART to listen for serial data while using the TX pin as a normal GPIO pin?
[06:44:48] <amee2k> when i changed a light switch it looked like 1.0sqmm singlestranded in the walls
[06:45:04] <Tom_itx> Sgt_Lemming, i doubt it
[06:45:05] <amee2k> that is err...awg 18?
[06:45:55] <amee2k> Sgt_Lemming: i remember on my megaX8s that receiver and transmitter can be enabled separately in the control register. not 100% sure that pin control is also separate, but i would suspect so
[06:46:16] <amee2k> why else would there be separate control flags for it otherwise
[06:46:33] <Sgt_Lemming> kk
[06:46:43] <Sgt_Lemming> Atmega 1280/2560 is the intended chip
[06:46:51] <Tom_itx> i would certainly test it first
[06:47:41] <amee2k> yeah... just saying i wouldn't exclude the possibility but it may differ from ic to ic
[06:49:48] <amee2k> Tom_itx: very much unrelated to mains, what i'd love would be a din rail 24V PSU in the fuse locker and low voltage outlets in the rooms
[06:50:34] <Sgt_Lemming> amee2k, if you are planning to do long DC power cables, it's much more advisable to use 48vDC
[06:50:57] <Tom_itx> what i was asking earlier was if PoE requires a powered source or if it draws power from the switch, router or whatever it's connected to
[06:51:31] <amee2k> Sgt_Lemming: no, i was thinking one PSU per apartment to reduce the length of high current runs
[06:51:38] <mrfrenzy> the whole idea of PoE is to draw power from the switch
[06:51:56] <Tom_itx> that's what i thought
[06:51:58] <Sgt_Lemming> Tom_itx, Standards compliant PoE (802.3af) requires a PoE source, it can be built into a switch, or seperate
[06:51:58] <mrfrenzy> but if you have a cheap switch without PoE you can put an adapter in between that feeds power into the cable
[06:52:10] <amee2k> Tom_itx: well, obviously it does require a power source ("injector") but there are quite expensive switches that have these built in
[06:52:17] <Sgt_Lemming> some switches have say 24 ports, and only 8 will be powered
[06:52:30] <Tom_itx> Sgt_Lemming so the switch would need that spec to be able to use it for that
[06:52:30] <mrfrenzy> there are also quite a few nonstandard PoE stuff that runs passive power over the free pairs
[06:52:33] <mrfrenzy> often at 24V
[06:52:38] <amee2k> these ports are usually clearly indicated as supporting PoE on the panel
[06:52:50] <Sgt_Lemming> Tom_itx, yes
[06:52:55] <Sgt_Lemming> 802.3af is awesome
[06:52:55] <Tom_itx> ok
[06:52:57] <Sgt_Lemming> so well designed
[06:53:10] <amee2k> makes sense imo... i'd say you rarely have a full switch full of PoE gear
[06:53:15] <Sgt_Lemming> problem with "passive" PoE is it's active capability to fry things
[06:53:20] <Tom_itx> i was considering getting an access point but want to be sure it'll work with my switch
[06:53:30] <Sgt_Lemming> amee2k, I've worked on a number of full racks of PoE gear
[06:53:39] <Sgt_Lemming> big call centres with PoE VOIP phones
[06:53:52] <mrfrenzy> well passive PoE can only really fry incompatible passive PoE gear
[06:54:01] <mrfrenzy> standard ethernet is completely unaffected
[06:54:01] <amee2k> well, for that you'd get something other than soho switches ;)
[06:54:05] <mrfrenzy> since the pairs are isolated
[06:54:14] <amee2k> http://www.netgear.com/images/gs108p_productimage_lowres18-5309.jpg << i mean like this one... note the yellow strip along the powered ports
[06:55:04] <Sgt_Lemming> the nice one was the phones also acted as a passthrough of sorts for the pc
[06:55:07] <Tom_itx> i suppose you can get powered adapters just like you can get powered USB hubs
[06:55:10] <Sgt_Lemming> they had a 2 port ethernet switch in em
[06:55:24] <mrfrenzy> yep that is very handy when you are using existing wiring
[06:55:31] <Sgt_Lemming> Powered > Unpowered when it comes to USB hubs
[06:55:39] <mrfrenzy> some even has capability for tagged vlan in the builtin switch
[06:55:48] <Sgt_Lemming> yeah mrfrenzy, these ones did
[06:55:50] <mrfrenzy> so you can have phone and pc on different networks
[06:55:52] <Sgt_Lemming> linksys somethings
[06:56:11] <Sgt_Lemming> we didn't though, as we had an inhouse app to controll the phone from the PC
[06:56:20] <Sgt_Lemming> so you never actually had to touch the phone basically
[06:56:37] <Sgt_Lemming> integrated into outlook and everything, was sooo handy
[06:56:53] <Sgt_Lemming> oh, and keyboard shortcut to dial a highlighted number, that was awesome
[06:57:55] <mrfrenzy> yep, that saves time
[06:58:12] <mrfrenzy> I have the same thing, just hit F12 in outlook to dial selected contact
[06:58:27] <mrfrenzy> but now I have switched over to gmail, so have to get another app
[06:58:33] <Sgt_Lemming> this worked system wide mrfrenzy
[06:58:57] <mrfrenzy> yes I know there are such apps
[06:59:05] <mrfrenzy> but this one also opened the outlook contact on incoming calls
[06:59:17] <Sgt_Lemming> yes, so did this
[06:59:22] <Sgt_Lemming> I said that
[06:59:30] <mrfrenzy> k
[07:00:33] <amee2k> Sgt_Lemming: oh, i almost forgot. i checked the mX8 datasheet because i had it handy. looks like one enable bit only overrides one pin so i'd recommend you check for yours but i'd expect it to be the same
[07:00:54] <Sgt_Lemming> eh?
[07:01:14] <amee2k> the uart question was yours, no?
[07:01:31] <Sgt_Lemming> yeah, not sure what you are referring to there
[07:01:36] <Sgt_Lemming> mx8?
[07:01:41] <amee2k> megaX8
[07:01:51] <amee2k> i checked when you asked, but kinda forgot to say so >_>
[07:01:52] <Sgt_Lemming> kk
[07:02:16] <amee2k> just found the open pdf in my task bar and was wondering "hmmm there was something about that"
[07:03:05] <Sgt_Lemming> looking at the data sheet for the RFID board, the enable pin only needs to be pulled low, so I might just do that on the board itself, rather than on the PCB, and just leave the TX line floating for those modules
[07:03:23] <Sgt_Lemming> anyways, I am gonna go to bed, freaking tired atm and have to be up in 5.5 hours
[07:03:25] <Sgt_Lemming> night all
[07:03:36] <amee2k> nighty
[12:44:45] <amee2k> when selecting values for a voltage divider on an ADC input, are there any useful guidelines how much quiescent current (at highest/expected signal level) to allow?
[12:46:29] <amee2k> the datasheet says the ADC is optimized for a signal source with 10kR or lower output impedance. at 5V that would be 500uA quiescent current. from that i would say values from 0.1 to 1mA should be a good choice. does that reasoning make any sense?
[12:47:11] <amee2k> or do i need to choose the values strictly based on the impedances, not the resulting currents?
[13:11:43] <grummund> amee2k: bear in mind the AC source impedance of your divider will effectively be the two resistors in *parallel*
[13:14:06] <grummund> also the ADC input impedance is dependant upon sample rate: lower sample rates being not so critical
[13:14:07] <Tom_L> http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Researchers_develop_paint_on_solar_cells-article-fajb_solar_paint_jan2012-html.aspx
[13:20:32] <amee2k> grummund: sampling rate will be extremely low. i'm monitoring a supply voltage rail
[13:31:20] <grummund> amee2k: shouldn't be a problem then i think...
[13:32:49] <grummund> i think the limitation with ADC input impedance is due to charging of the internal sample-and-hold capacitor
[13:35:51] <amee2k> i see
[13:36:31] <amee2k> kinda makes sense. if the "typical" input impedance of 100M is anywhere near accurate i shouldn't have problems with dividers into 100ks
[13:37:43] <asteve> voltage divider
[13:47:57] <OndraSter_> the problem is - with high resistance of the resistors the resistance nears the input impedance of the ADC input itself
[13:48:17] <OndraSter_> so the total impedance of those two "resistors" changes
[13:51:13] * grummund would guess worst case input impedance is ~100k so they say "optimized for a signal source <=10k" in order to give at least 10:1 ratio
[13:52:07] <RikusW> abcminiuser: in Norway already ?
[13:52:23] <abcminiuser> RikusW, since mid last week
[13:52:32] <abcminiuser> Had my first day back at Atmel today\
[13:52:47] <RikusW> nice
[13:53:15] <RikusW> jetlag ?
[13:53:31] <Steffanx> Nerds don't lag.. they have a good connection
[13:53:48] * Landon wishes
[13:53:51] <Steffanx> Except RikusW
[13:54:00] <Steffanx> :P
[13:55:47] <RikusW> maybe I should get a satelite connection :-P
[14:04:41] <amee2k> grummund, OndraSter_: sorry for the delay. the tiny24 datasheet says "analog input resistance, typ. 100MR" in electrical characteristics
[14:05:00] <OndraSter_> okay
[14:05:03] <OndraSter_> :)
[14:05:05] <OndraSter_> but at what freq
[14:05:20] <OndraSter_> I remember reading somewhere that xmegas had problems with high frequencies on ADC with dropping impedance
[14:06:07] <mrfrenzy> resistance = DC
[14:06:13] <grummund> xmega is 50k input imp. @ 2Msa/s. i know, i measured it ;)
[14:06:13] <mrfrenzy> impedance = some freq
[14:06:16] <amee2k> high frequency components should be insignificant for this circuit
[14:06:29] <amee2k> i'm even considering bypassing the divider in order to provide some low-pass filtering
[14:06:51] <grummund> amee2k: is your circuit sensitive to quiescent current? battery operated?
[14:07:07] <amee2k> not really, and no.
[14:07:45] <amee2k> say, it doesn't matter much as long as it doesn't significantly exceed 1mA i'd say
[14:09:03] <grummund> is the divider to be 50% ?
[14:09:12] <grummund> equal resistors
[14:10:14] <amee2k> preferably 2:3 (with the 2 towards ground)
[14:10:44] <amee2k> reference is 2.5V and i want to sample input in rage of 0-6V
[14:15:15] <amee2k> i'm wondering if i should use the internal 1.1V reference instead though
[14:15:38] <grummund> 10k//15k gives you a source impedance of 6k
[14:15:40] <grummund> 2k2//3k3 give you quiescent current of 900uA
[14:15:54] <amee2k> eyeing 10k/15k
[14:15:56] <grummund> so anywhere between those values should be in spec.
[14:16:04] <amee2k> but i'm considering 22k/33k
[14:16:41] <amee2k> mmh, if that is important, i'm only using one channel that will be selected all the time
[14:16:45] <asteve> http://www.sparkfun.com/products/10748
[14:17:16] <grummund> sure. and if you're adding a cap to filter the input then effectively you are providing a low impedance input anyway
[14:17:54] <grummund> i mean if you're adding a cap to filter the input then effectively you are providing a low impedance *source*
[14:17:56] <amee2k> where does the datasheet have the characteristics of the 1.1V reference?
[14:19:08] <amee2k> eeew... 10% only?
[14:30:35] <RikusW> seems satellite internet is somewhat expensive :(
http://www.montanasatellite.com/idirect/idirect_equipment.htm
[14:30:59] * dofidum is very nearly buying an atmega168...
[14:31:31] <RikusW> why not try mega324a ?
[14:32:49] <dofidum> RikusW, cause there is too much choice and i'm sure any'd do the job
[14:32:56] <mrfrenzy> there are much cheaper solutions today RikusW
[14:33:43] <RikusW> m324a is cheaper then m328p
[14:33:54] <RikusW> only 3 Euro
[14:34:48] <RikusW> and have more pins
[14:35:12] <mrfrenzy> talking about sattelite, not atmega ;)
[14:35:48] <RikusW> ah
[14:36:39] <RikusW> dofidum: got mine from RS
[14:37:13] <dofidum> RikusW, well just ordering a bunch of things from rapidonline who unfortunately don't have all options available
[14:48:50] <keenerd> The 168 (the fancier version with temperature sensor) is so far my favorite avr :-)
[14:49:57] * amee2k <3 m88
[14:55:53] <Steffanx> 168 ftw
[16:10:33] <eatyourguitar> does anyone here use the dragon?
[16:13:09] <Valen> i have one but have never used it lol
[16:13:16] <Valen> i just use usb avrs ;->
[16:15:34] <amee2k> i'm contemplating getting one
[16:15:46] <amee2k> also contemplating getting a buspirate
[16:15:50] <mrfrenzy> I use the stk500
[16:15:56] <mrfrenzy> buspirat is on the to-get-list
[16:16:17] <Valen> buspirate would be usefull
[16:16:45] <amee2k> what are the differences between the buspirate versions exactly?
[16:16:51] <amee2k> looks like current is v3.5
[16:18:31] <impulze> hey, i want to measure how often an interrupt was enabled during a specific time period, though i can't use the timer registers as my operating system (contiki) is using those, and i want to write a modular driver that doesn't use the contiki os, any hints?
[16:19:06] <amee2k> please define "enabled"
[16:19:40] <impulze> that is how often it changed from low to high
[16:19:52] <impulze> i already have the service routine running that increments a 8bit variable
[16:20:14] <Steffanx> Just get the most recent version of the bus pirate amee2k ?
[16:20:27] <Steffanx> v3 and 3.5 are fully compatible with each other
[16:20:38] <amee2k> if the ISR isn't executed, then the firmware will have no way to know that the interrupt has happened
[16:20:58] <impulze> the isr is executed
[16:21:18] <Steffanx> You can also get verison 4 amee2k
[16:21:30] <Steffanx> Which is a version 'for developers'
[16:21:45] <amee2k> if incrementing a counter in the ISR isn't sufficient, you'll need an external counting mechanism (which will only work if the interrupt source is external too)
[16:21:56] <amee2k> Steffanx: 'for developers'? o.O
[16:22:03] <Steffanx> http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/bus-pirate-v4-for-developers-p-740.html?cPath=174
[16:22:15] <Steffanx> I guess it's a 'beta'
[16:22:30] <amee2k> then i'd rather take the 3.5 one
[16:22:35] <Steffanx> " but please keep in mind that v4 is still experimental, unproven hardware"
[16:22:56] <Steffanx> seeed also has a cable + box for it :)
[16:23:01] <amee2k> i like building experimental things, but experimental tools can be a massive pain in the ass
[16:23:22] <Steffanx> indeed
[16:23:54] <amee2k> ouch, wtf. jtag ice is 220EUR??
[16:24:04] <amee2k> now i know why people want a clone for it
[16:24:05] <asteve> ya
[16:24:10] <asteve> i was shocked as well ;)
[16:24:40] <amee2k> the bus pirate can't possibly be ghetto enough to warrant that price >_<
[16:25:03] <amee2k> paying* that price even
[16:26:11] <Valen> amee2k: normally in that situation I hook up an LED to a pin
[16:26:38] <Valen> turn LED on at start of ISR and off at the end
[16:26:43] <amee2k> Valen: you make enough money by hooking up a LED that you can buy a jtag ice for it? o.O
[16:26:52] <amee2k> oh
[16:26:56] <Valen> its like running "top" but digital
[16:27:03] <amee2k> well, it wasn't my question >_>
[16:27:27] <Valen> ahh i meant to be talking to impulze
[16:27:52] <OndraSter_> JTAG ICE
[16:27:53] <OndraSter_> which one?
[16:27:54] <amee2k> but on a related note, my ghetto trick for profiling MCU code is setting a pin during the section of code in question and setting the DSO to measure duty cycle
[16:28:02] <impulze> Valen: ?! i want to write a driver so that the user can ask how often the interrupt occured during some time period
[16:28:04] <amee2k> voila, CPU load indicator
[16:28:07] <OndraSter_> the original mkI is useless now... it is $14 but supports like 10 oldest chips
[16:28:25] <amee2k> OndraSter_: mk3
[16:28:28] <OndraSter_> oh
[16:28:29] <OndraSter_> yeah
[16:28:35] <OndraSter_> but it is quite pricey
[16:28:37] <amee2k> i think. already closed the tab
[16:28:38] <OndraSter_> I went with Dragon
[16:28:49] <OndraSter_> should arrive tomorrow
[16:29:00] <amee2k> wait, jtag adapters explicitly need to implement support for every chip? o.O
[16:29:11] <OndraSter_> in case of Atmel... appearantly yes :P
[16:29:16] <OndraSter_> in case of Atmel AVRs*
[16:29:17] <amee2k> ...
[16:29:27] <OndraSter_> way to make money
[16:29:37] <amee2k> now that is kinda gay
[16:30:33] <amee2k> LOL. this online shop is selling "arduino enabled" wall warts XD
[16:31:00] <OndraSter_> lol
[16:31:06] <mrfrenzy> is that like a standard one hung lo wall wart with a 3x price tag?
[16:31:31] <OndraSter_> I'd bet
[16:31:41] <amee2k> mildly expensive generic switchable-voltage (3-12V) wall warts
[16:31:48] <amee2k> for 0.3, 0.6 and 1.5A
[16:32:03] <amee2k> for 5EUR, 6EUR and 9EUR respectively
[16:32:48] <OndraSter_> 0.3A... that's for arduino only lol
[16:32:55] <amee2k> yeah >_>
[16:33:12] <amee2k> they look the same, i wonder if there is any difference besides the current limiter anyway
[16:33:44] <OndraLappy> well the internal transformator might be better (I doubt it is switched power supplies...)
[16:33:47] <OndraLappy> made for higher currents
[16:34:12] <amee2k> nah, these are the generic variable voltage ones with a rotary encoder on the bottom
[16:34:17] <amee2k> these are all SMP
[16:34:21] <OndraLappy> oh
[16:34:30] <OndraLappy> I remember having some old with internal transformator only LOL
[16:34:31] <amee2k> virtually noone here makes unregulated ones anymore
[16:34:54] <OndraLappy> I haven't bought any of those for 7 years for sure
[16:35:06] <amee2k> yeah, i have the massively multitapped transformer from a universal wall wart as my prized posession too
[16:35:22] <OndraLappy> hehe
[16:35:49] <amee2k> interresting... coolrunner-2 CPLD board is only 13EUR
[16:35:53] <OndraLappy> why are transformers so expensive? It is like 20 EUR for 100VA one
[16:35:58] <asteve> amee2k: that's a fun board
[16:35:59] <OndraLappy> altera CPLDs ftw
[16:36:13] <amee2k> Xilinx XC2C64A
[16:36:13] <OndraLappy> altera blaster clone costs $10 :P
[16:36:18] <OndraLappy> we had Xilinxes at school
[16:36:35] <asteve> i don't like the ADA relationship with CPLD's/FPGA's and VDHL; i wish I learned verilog instead
[16:36:58] <amee2k> never ever touched CPLDs and FPGAs before. dev boards are ridiculously expensive and have wonky toolchains
[16:37:18] <mrfrenzy> when buying from china transformers cost about 0.1 EUR per VA, including shipping
[16:37:25] <OndraLappy> hmm
[16:37:38] <amee2k> mrfrenzy: SMP or mains frequency?
[16:37:48] <mrfrenzy> regular 50Hz transformers
[16:37:49] <OndraLappy> I want mains transformer
[16:38:24] <amee2k> i want to wind a 1kVA isolation transformer, but i can't find a place selling suitable laminations
[16:38:47] <OndraLappy> wow
[16:38:51] <mrfrenzy> what voltages? and why do you want to wind it yourself?
[16:39:22] <amee2k> because noone sells them?
[16:39:27] <OndraLappy> you can order it
[16:39:32] <OndraLappy> it is not that funny to wind them
[16:39:37] <mrfrenzy> you didn't answer my first question
[16:40:02] <amee2k> 230V input, but i'd like to have at least 115 and 230 for output
[16:40:13] <OndraLappy> 1:1 or 2:1?
[16:40:20] <mrfrenzy> I have one of those, bought it used for like 40 euros
[16:40:24] <OndraLappy> isolation trafos?
[16:40:29] <mrfrenzy> sure there are companies that sell them
[16:40:32] <amee2k> let me guess, you are in the US?
[16:40:38] <mrfrenzy> no, sweden
[16:40:43] <amee2k> okay
[16:40:48] <mrfrenzy> you can get new site transformers from uk real cheap
[16:40:51] <mrfrenzy> check out axminster
[16:41:17] <OndraLappy> too bad that toroids for higher currents are heavy
[16:41:22] <OndraLappy> and heavy = expensive shipping
[16:41:33] <amee2k> "axminster tool centre" ? o.O
[16:41:37] <mrfrenzy> yes
[16:41:40] <mrfrenzy> search for transformer
[16:42:04] <amee2k> lol
[16:42:17] <amee2k> i just did. this came up:
http://www.axminster.co.uk/dickies-dickies-high-visibility-safety-polo-shirt-prod837538/
[16:42:20] <amee2k> \o/
[16:42:37] <mrfrenzy> http://www.axminster.co.uk/110v-site-transformers-prod23256/?searchfor=transformer
[16:42:38] <OndraLappy> lol
[16:42:47] <mrfrenzy> you have very strange search methods ;)
[16:42:55] <OndraLappy> we have some 230V -> 115V transformer
[16:42:58] <OndraLappy> in the basement
[16:43:02] <OndraLappy> looks big and is heavy
[16:43:13] <OndraLappy> no idea what current is it rated for
[16:43:16] <PWillard> The ones from the 70's were freaking huge.
[16:43:32] <OndraLappy> we used to have one of the first copy printers made in 80s? 90s? It was made for USA for 115V sockets
[16:43:49] <OndraLappy> it luckily worked on 50Hz
[16:43:58] <amee2k> yeah, thats not too bad price wise
[16:44:00] <mrfrenzy> once in a while some idiot comes in the swedish electronics forum
[16:44:20] <mrfrenzy> "I brought home my washing machine/tubmle dryer etc from USA when I moved, where can I buy a transformer?"
[16:44:42] <OndraLappy> hehe
[16:44:51] <amee2k> do they sell transformer iron laminations too?
[16:44:54] <PWillard> haha
[16:44:55] <mrfrenzy> it always takes a few dozen replies before they accept it is cheaper to buy a new machine
[16:46:08] <amee2k> either i'm doing it wrong, or apparently not
[16:46:29] <mrfrenzy> also, if you need a smaller transformer you can find it cheaper at other uk retailers
[16:46:58] <amee2k> see, i know you can't expect people to know what they're saying anymore these days
[16:47:19] <amee2k> but when i said i want to wind one, i didn't mean i want to scavenge one from an existing isolation box
[16:47:23] <amee2k> >_<
[16:47:40] <mrfrenzy> we are trying to tell you it is better to buy a ready made one
[16:47:58] <mrfrenzy> cause your reason for winding was invalid
[16:48:35] <amee2k> ...
[16:54:01] <mrfrenzy> 23:30:32 < amee2k> because noone sells them?
[19:44:44] <Tom_itx> on microSD is DAT0 MOSI and CMD MISO or vise versa?
[20:16:54] <BrentBXR_> DAT0 = output
[20:16:57] <BrentBXR_> CMD = input
[20:17:04] <BrentBXR_> wel DAT = output
[20:17:17] <BrentBXR_> so DAT = MasterINslaveOUT
[20:17:30] <BrentBXR_> and CMD = masterOUTslaveIN
[20:18:13] <BrentBXR_> I am an anti sparkfun guy
[20:18:32] <BrentBXR_> but if you want to do SD card development (not production) i dont reccomend one of these:
http://www.sparkfun.com/products/204
[20:18:41] <BrentBXR_> these are great:
http://www.sparkfun.com/products/9237
[20:19:03] <BrentBXR_> use it as a LA to analyze it; or just dont plug it in and use it as a direct SD card connection
[21:01:04] <pepsi> i like the ascii version of the product image that sparkfun has
[21:01:16] <pepsi> that's interesting
[22:03:11] <BrentBXR> i hate how they put there logo on everything
[22:03:15] <BrentBXR> even the plastic cases
[22:03:19] <BrentBXR> how can you use that?
[22:06:06] <pepsi> put a sticker over it
[22:06:20] <pepsi> i bet if you needed a bunch they'd take the logo off
[22:07:39] <BrentBXR> if you needed alot; sparkfun would be the last you would buy from
[22:07:43] <BrentBXR> there markup is crazy
[22:07:51] <BrentBXR> everything is too expensive; like radio shack
[22:07:56] <BrentBXR> i dont know why ppl buy from them
[22:08:11] <BrentBXR> everything they sell is sold in other places except a couple things
[22:08:26] <BrentBXR> but there own products arnt special just differnt version of anouther product
[22:08:57] <pepsi> i dunno.. everything's there, and useful, and easy
[22:09:54] <pepsi> i wish i could sell that stuff though..
[22:10:11] <pepsi> simple boards with 2 connectors, for $15
[22:10:42] <Casper> does anyone have experience with neweggs?
[22:12:27] <Tom_itx> they're fresher than oldeggs
[22:12:35] <Tom_itx> i order from them
[22:26:29] <crazy_pete> Newegg is OK but their paperless business model is both good and bad
[22:26:54] <Casper> how long does it take for them from invoice to shipping?
[22:27:02] <Tom_itx> not long
[22:27:05] <crazy_pete> saves paper but i have read that some manufacturers have refused to honour the printed out email that newegg uses for a receipt
[22:27:33] <crazy_pete> i have never experienced that, mind you, i have only read about it in online reviews so who knows
[22:27:39] <crazy_pete> they are pretty quick about shipping
[22:27:51] <crazy_pete> that is one of their advantages
[22:30:02] <Casper> I got the invoice today at 12:08pm
[22:30:13] <Casper> I wonder if it will ship tonight
[22:30:20] <Casper> if it do, I'll have it tomorrow
[22:32:38] <Casper> but I do not know if the printed email refusal is even true
[23:46:40] <crazy_pete> i dont know if it is true either
[23:47:05] <crazy_pete> futhermore you can get that from one uneducated worker even though it is not company policy
[23:48:58] <Casper> or there was other reasons behind it too
[23:49:34] <Casper> like shitty print that you can't read it
[23:51:57] <Casper> I've seen some printout that some do...
[23:52:04] <Casper> you barelly can see anything
[23:52:12] <Casper> could have been rejected for being unreadable
[23:52:30] <Casper> or they printed the wrong part
