#linuxcnc Logs
Jun 04 2025
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:48 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> moin
01:31 AM Deejay: moin
04:45 AM Tom_L: morning
05:40 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
07:15 AM rdtsc-w: meisterdippel, what are the chances of decoding Siemens Drive-Cliq? think the media is a proroprietary form of Ethernet: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=siemens+drive+cliq&t=opera&ia=images&iax=images Uses a custom RJ-45 connector; has 24VDC and 0VDC pins on the back side
07:34 AM rdtsc-w: our motor shop has to keep sending me motors to setup in a S120 test rack and test, because their Mitchell motor/encoder-tester cannot do drive-cliq
07:58 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> http://c.51hei.com/a/a/h/69241345470576.jpg
08:00 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> DRIVE-CLiQ should be an open protocol
08:03 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> I was afraid it was complex for FPGA's
08:04 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> * am
08:05 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> at least for me to implement
08:09 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> it's more like EtherCAT
08:32 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> lol - that link is geo-blocked on the work firewall
08:52 AM rdtsc-w: "DRIVE-CLiQ is a proprietary Siemens network, based on 100Mbit/s Ethernet, but without much of the lost packet and collision handling capability. This allows for a high speed deterministic system, but means that the protocol is not suitable for wireless or slip-ring communication."
09:15 AM pcw--home: slip-ring = token-ring?
09:49 AM roycroft: hi folks
09:49 AM roycroft: it is hump day already
09:49 AM mrec: does anyone have experience with cleaning baths? I wonder if that's suitable for putting my ugly waycovers in
09:50 AM rdtsc-w: pcw--home, I'm assuming there was some translation error :)
09:57 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
10:12 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> lol - we are still using dos based plc programs here.
10:13 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> took a half a morning getting the computer communicating with the plc - they forgot the baudrate. Assumed it was 9600 - the magic box was set to 2400
10:14 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> the also forgot that I had setup a usb that allows them to boot directly to dos..
10:15 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> so - as long as the laptop has hardware serial - it just works.
10:26 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> i did the feedforward cure on my lcnc lathe
10:26 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> it did work but i had to dial the accelerations way down to get extremely small positional error
10:26 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> well
10:27 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> i had to dial them down because of overshooting, the dynamic error didnt change much
10:27 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> but for perfect motion i had to go down to 1000mm/s²
10:27 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> seems really low
10:29 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> is this typical or am i missing something
10:50 AM lcnc-relay: <roguish> sodakaustik@: low accel is ok.. it all has to do with the motor's power, and the mass it's accelerating.... E=MC^2
10:50 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> what are you moving?
10:52 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> that is 40in/s^2? that doesn't seem bad
10:53 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uo9NGqQyJgM
10:53 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> I would have to look - but I think that is around 50in/s^2
10:58 AM lcnc-relay: <roguish> check it out . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic_energy
11:05 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> 1kw servos
11:05 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> lathe is quite small
11:05 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> about 60kg carriage (Z axis)
11:06 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> 1kw estun ac servos 20bit
11:06 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> how are they hooked into linuxcnc?
11:07 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> mesa 7i76 position control with no feedback
11:07 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> how did you know that you had to lower the accelleration?
11:07 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> checked the servo internal scope
11:08 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> it can record and spit out a graphing function
11:08 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> had slight overshoot at 2000mm/s²
11:08 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> completely dissappeared at 1000mm/s²
11:08 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> of course the overshoot is gone with no feedforward
11:09 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> but i need it for a tighter dynamic error
11:10 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> speed and positioning gains are to the brim, if i go up i get oscillation
11:10 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> i guess this is the limit of open loop control
11:10 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> you have pid setup?
11:10 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> i have no feedback on the Lcnc side
11:11 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> no linear encoders either
11:11 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> I am confused - you used feed forward within linuxcnc - but you don't have pid within linuxcnc?
11:26 AM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
11:26 AM lcnc-relay: <sodakaustik@> feedforward in the servo itself
03:53 PM Tom_L: cable lines must be waterlogged today
04:11 PM xxcoder: maybe
04:11 PM roycroft: anyway, indicators will be on their way from mouser very soon
04:11 PM xxcoder: just like drm, it inconviences legit people more than crinimals
04:11 PM roycroft: and nothing may ever be on its way from digi-key again, depending on how they respond to my email
04:13 PM Tom_L: got lucky with that. found a service manual for an old lexmark printer that has been discontinued
04:13 PM roycroft: i wonder, if i were a new customer, would digi-key hold my order for 2-4 business days while they verify my information?
04:13 PM roycroft: do they think they would ever get any new customers if they did that?
04:13 PM roycroft: nice, tom_l
04:14 PM Tom_L: i've got 2 of them and have replaced the power supply in one 2x
04:14 PM roycroft: when i was cleaning out the last of my stuff from one of the outbuildings at the old place i found a bunch of oem manuals for some '70s/'80s/'90s computer gear
04:14 PM xxcoder: man old manuals can be nightmare to find
04:14 PM Tom_L: this was just a settings issue
04:14 PM roycroft: i was going to toss them, and they're in fairly ratty shape
04:14 PM roycroft: but i put them in a box and hauled the up here
04:14 PM roycroft: i'll do some research and see if i can find them online
04:14 PM Tom_L: i thought i may still have a printed one but don't
04:15 PM roycroft: if not, i will scan them eventually
04:15 PM roycroft: they're too ratty to go on my sheet fed scanner, but i have a book scanner now that will work
04:15 PM roycroft: and who knows - i built that book press a couple years ago
04:16 PM roycroft: i may be able to flatten the pages enough to go through the sheet feed scanner if i press them first
04:16 PM roycroft: the universe can thank usagi electric for my keeping the manuals instead of tossing them
04:17 PM roycroft: when i saw them i thought of that guy and realized that there are other folks like him who are trying to restore/preserve vintage computer gear, and that archiving those manuals is the right thing to do vs just tossing them
04:17 PM JT-Shop: so a chap told me he opened the bag looked at the board and put it back in the bag
04:18 PM JT-Shop: however he sent it back in a random bag...
04:18 PM Tom_L: JT-Shop, the one that removed the labels?
04:18 PM Tom_L: or his brother :)
04:18 PM JT-Shop: yup, I just looked at his first email and he stated that he put it back in the same bag so he clearly lied to me
04:19 PM roycroft: and you can't resell it now
04:19 PM JT-Shop: I won't resell it now
04:19 PM Tom_L: didn't he want a different board?
04:19 PM roycroft: besides not being in the original packaging, you have no idea what you have
04:19 PM roycroft: whether it is functional or ont
04:19 PM roycroft: not
04:19 PM JT-Shop: he has not ordered it yet... I just replied to his original email againe
04:19 PM xxcoder: geez
04:19 PM roycroft: i would not sell him another
04:20 PM roycroft: if you do, he'll return that one too in an unsaleable condition
04:20 PM JT-Shop: well I can test the board and I "could" resell it but it's against my character to do that
04:20 PM Tom_L: 7i96?
04:20 PM xxcoder: can always test and resell as unreturnable and unrefundable used
04:20 PM Tom_L: 7i92?
04:20 PM JT-Shop: I won't accept any returns from him
04:20 PM Tom_L: imeant
04:20 PM roycroft: i would not do so after the experience with the person
04:20 PM xxcoder: with large price cut
04:20 PM JT-Shop: 7i92TH
04:20 PM Tom_L: yeah
04:21 PM JT-Shop: in his last email he said he thought it would not make any difference if he used the same bag or not or lie to me
04:22 PM Tom_L: that has 2 ribbon headers?
04:23 PM JT-Shop: I told him when he orders the 7i76eu I'll return the 7i92th to him
04:23 PM JT-Shop: yup
04:25 PM JT-Shop: I try and help people that order the wrong board but I don't refund shipping or paypal fees
04:26 PM roycroft: not so soon here
04:26 PM JT-Shop: and I've only done it 2-3 times in all the years I've been a mesa dealer
04:26 PM roycroft: mouser may not be much better than digi-key
04:26 PM roycroft: they just sent me an order confirmation and, while they have updated my shipping address, they still show my old billing address
04:27 PM roycroft: i phoned them and they told me that while i can update my billing address on their website they do nothing with that information and that i need to send an email to their credit department to update my billing address
04:27 PM Tom_L: tell them that was the other you
04:27 PM roycroft: and they acted like i should have known that
04:27 PM roycroft: because customers are omniscient?
04:28 PM Tom_L: the customer used to always be right ehh?
04:28 PM xxcoder: hate when people assume you know what they know
04:28 PM roycroft: NOTHING on their website indicated that i needed to email them
04:28 PM roycroft: at least when digi-key denied me they informed me of what they were doing
04:28 PM xxcoder: tom I never belive in "customer is always right". its both sides that need to be reasonable
04:29 PM roycroft: my motto is not "the customer is always right", because often they aren't
04:29 PM roycroft: but "the customer should always be listened to" is a good motto
04:29 PM xxcoder: I like that better
04:29 PM roycroft: it just so happened that i decided to use paypal for this purchase, otherwise my credit card would have been declined, and would not have known why
04:43 PM roycroft: the person i spoke with on the phone just sent me an email with a feedback link so i could rate my experience with mouser
04:43 PM Tom_L: hah
04:43 PM roycroft: when i click on the link it takes me to feedback.mouser.com, and displays the message "Unable to log in with the information provided."
04:43 PM roycroft: so i guess they don't want my feedback
04:43 PM roycroft: i don't blame them, actually :)
04:44 PM Tom_L: xxcoder, did you try the air fryer with the corn yet?
04:45 PM Tom_L: sry, i felt the channel had been OT quite a bit today...
04:47 PM xxcoder: not yet, no corn
04:47 PM Tom_L: maybe jt will send ya some
04:47 PM xxcoder: lol nice but nah
04:57 PM BorgPipe is now known as Netpipe
04:58 PM JT-Shop: JT +1 Squirrels -1
04:59 PM JT-Shop: LOL I just put some meatbird feed in the dog bowl and the rabbit just came running over
05:07 PM Tom_L: JT-Shop, i added some velocity labels to the tp3 example
05:07 PM JT-Shop: cool
05:07 PM Tom_L: that and an updated deb
05:08 PM Tom_L: i've been using it more than axis lately
05:08 PM JT-Shop: nice
05:09 PM Tom_L: now that i'm getting the following errors ironed out
05:10 PM JT-Shop: what was the issue?
05:10 PM Tom_L: mostly the accel was too high
05:10 PM Tom_L: i was able to get ferror down alot too
05:11 PM JT-Shop: that will cause following errors
05:11 PM Tom_L: .001 and .00005 for min
05:11 PM JT-Shop: nice
05:11 PM Tom_L: ran thru the hole ops and my torture thing with no problems
05:11 PM Tom_L: it would usually burp on one or the other
05:11 PM JT-Shop: when I build the plasma I did a lot of research and went with 80v power supply to get high acceleration
05:12 PM Tom_L: yeah i'm sure that would be better
05:12 PM Tom_L: i used what i could find here locally at the time
05:13 PM Tom_L: that guy isn't even around now
05:13 PM Tom_L: the geckos handle 80v ok then?
05:13 PM JT-Shop: guy at the feed store commented that one of his regular customers stopped coming in every morning
05:14 PM JT-Shop: he ran in to his wife and she told him he had died
05:14 PM JT-Shop: yup
05:14 PM JT-Shop: I researched the crap out of that build being my first
05:15 PM JT-Shop: LG tech wanted me to unplug the fridge for 30 minutes and plug it in and see if that fixed it... it's been unplugged for a week
05:16 PM Tom_L: heh
05:16 PM Tom_L: my partner dropped off a printer he'd screwed the top of form up on it
05:17 PM Tom_L: had to find an old manual which i got lucky with and figured that out
05:17 PM JT-Shop: dot matrix printer?
05:17 PM Tom_L: yeah
05:18 PM Tom_L: pretty old
05:18 PM JT-Shop: I haven't heard one in a long time
05:18 PM Tom_L: i still use one nearly every day
05:19 PM Tom_L: i'll be getting it back in july anyway when he retires
05:21 PM JT-Shop: what do you guys do?
05:22 PM Tom_L: service business
05:22 PM JT-Shop: cool
05:22 PM roycroft: well the scammer is still calling - i took the phone off dnd for a moment
05:22 PM roycroft: i must be on autodial now
05:22 PM Tom_L: dad started in '64
05:22 PM Tom_L: we took over in '93
05:23 PM roycroft: and my phone switch is not logging cdr for some reason, so i can't add him to call block
05:28 PM JT-Shop: what is cdr?
05:29 PM xxcoder: scam call reminded me of that interesting ai "old grandma" that wastes callers time
05:30 PM roycroft: call detail records
05:31 PM JT-Shop: is that transmitted with the call?
05:31 PM Tom_L: it must be
05:31 PM roycroft: this caller said he is from "ecommerce services" and demanded that i pay my "electricity" bill immediately or he would turn off my power
05:31 PM roycroft: yes
05:32 PM roycroft: and my phone switch has a call block app, where i can pull a number out of the cdr and block all calls from that number
05:32 PM roycroft: it's not working
05:32 PM JT-Shop: I would ask him what his relationship is with the deceased
05:32 PM roycroft: anyway, when the person tried to get a credit card number out of me i used a few colorful metaphors
05:32 PM roycroft: and hung up
05:33 PM roycroft: he decided that his best approach after that was to repeated call me back and yell at me
05:33 PM JT-Shop: please stay on the line while the pd are on their way
05:33 PM roycroft: i finally ended up pressing the dnd button on the phone after rejecting a dozen or so calls from him in rapid succession
05:33 PM roycroft: and now i'm trying to figure out why cdr is not importing
05:34 PM roycroft: freeswitch is logging the calls, but fusionpbx is not importing them into its database
05:34 PM roycroft: so it's a front end issue, not a pbx issue
05:34 PM * JT-Shop calls it a day
05:35 PM roycroft: i found a piece of metal at lunch today that should work brilliantly for the limit switch stops
05:35 PM roycroft: i think i'll go work on that for a bit before my dinner engagement
05:35 PM roycroft: maybe the scammer will give up by this evening
05:36 PM roycroft: he's calling one of my business lines, btw, and my power service is a personal, not business account
05:36 PM roycroft: so even if this were somehow otherwise legitimate, it's not
07:08 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ