#linuxcnc Logs
Mar 13 2025
#linuxcnc Calendar
01:21 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.@> Whois sed?
02:00 AM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> https://www.gnu.org/software/sed/manual/html_node/sed-script-overview.html
02:01 AM Deejay: moin
02:05 AM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> sed awk grep common linux commands for bash scripting
02:06 AM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> Good morning
02:08 AM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> Great morning, look at this https://manus.im/ the end of human society is inching closer 🤩
02:10 AM xxcoder: whois is also a command lol thats why I think capt was joking
02:11 AM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> I did not see that lol, sorry
02:12 AM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> capital W made me miss the joke
02:16 AM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> I guess a proper response would be
02:16 AM lcnc-relay: which sed
02:20 AM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> * "which sed"
02:21 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> moin
02:52 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> does anyone here actually have robots ?
02:58 AM jpa-: what counts as a robot?
02:59 AM jpa-: andy has half of a terminator ;)
02:59 AM rifraf: still have many body parts and the brain of my robot
03:00 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> robot arms / delta robots / scara robots
03:02 AM rifraf: http://www.roboreprap.com/robotics/images/body7.jpg
03:05 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> what is that ?
03:06 AM rifraf: thats Foxy
03:06 AM rifraf: http://www.roboreprap.com/robotics/images/foxy1.jpg soon making the legs and getting her walking
03:06 AM rifraf: you wanted a robot
03:07 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> wow, ok
03:07 AM rifraf: if you want arms scara etc have all those too
03:07 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> cool
03:08 AM rifraf: yep, currently biulding the cnc machines that will finish her one day
03:08 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> are you just playing around with it or do you have real applications for it?
03:09 AM rifraf: originally designed to keep me supplied with beers from fridge
03:09 AM rifraf: as well as a companion, she spoke with me many years before a siri existed
03:11 AM rifraf: and used to speak with several hundred others while driving around at the same time, one of the original chatbots, and 1 of a few with a real body
03:11 AM rifraf: so yeah, i have robots :)
03:12 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> thought more along the lines of industrial robots,
03:12 AM lcnc-relay: but that's cool too 🙂
03:13 AM rifraf: well i designed a few, and made them, bots to work on conveyors systems
03:13 AM rifraf: and tiptoes http://www.roboreprap.com/tiptoes/index.htm
03:14 AM rifraf: can't really show the commercial stuff due to NDAs
03:16 AM rifraf: what does an industrial robot do? like a CNC machine?, we all have them i think
03:17 AM rifraf: how about telescoping story high electric mobile gantry crane?
03:17 AM rifraf: 3 story*
03:18 AM rifraf: they were fun, especially when they want to fall over with 40 tonnes of oil in a shipping container
03:20 AM jpa-: our hacklab has an old industrial robot arm that we got for free.. we haven't figured any good use for it
03:20 AM jpa-: especially as it doesn't have any cobot or force limiting functionality, so you really need a cage to operate it
03:21 AM jpa-: i tried to use it for carving/cnc use, but the motion control is just not up to it; it's designed for precise endpoints, not necessarily precise paths
03:22 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> yes i mean robotic arms that can be controlled with linuxcnc, just not milling machines.
03:22 AM lcnc-relay: i got a small arm cheap but no real application for it, at the moment i cut foils with it 🙂
03:23 AM rifraf: pick and place machine?
03:23 AM jpa-: pick and place can work, but they are a bit slow for the purpose (too much mass) and take a lot of space
03:24 AM rifraf: most of the arm only robots i made never really found a good use either, costs alot to get good control and payload
03:26 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> have nothing to pick and place
03:27 AM rifraf: throw lego men in the air https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mn-QCJp0EE8
03:27 AM rifraf: or put them in a box https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbVwU4Qmx30
03:37 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> https://www.youtube.com/shorts/P-7WANepIWQ
03:40 AM rifraf: meisterdippel is that your arm?, you could do many things with that
03:42 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> yes, but what ?
03:43 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> https://robodk.com/robot/de/Epson/ProSix-PS3 but converted to stepper motors
03:44 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> i got it without control and 6 servo amplifiers would have been too expensive for me
03:44 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> runs on linuxcnc
03:46 AM rifraf: make it scan your property and shoot intruders with a taser
03:47 AM rifraf: i could think of a million uses
03:50 AM rifraf: a cnc machine does what you tell it to, a robot should be able to react to things happening in its environment
03:52 AM rifraf: but an arm like that is a great starting point for a robotics application
03:55 AM jpa-: million uses, but what would be a few of them?
03:56 AM rifraf: sort your nut and bolt collection?
03:57 AM rifraf: copy and plot famous artworks?
03:57 AM rifraf: it all depends what you want
03:57 AM rifraf: if you have no ideas you do not need a robot
03:57 AM jpa-: heh, maybe if you like programming for days to do a task that would take less than an hour
03:58 AM rifraf: lol, jpa- very true
03:58 AM jpa-: but yeah, i agree our hacklab probably doesn't need it.. but we have it :)
03:58 AM rifraf: but the fun is making it, i tend to make something, see it work and move onto the next project
04:01 AM jpa-: i agree, if i had the energy to play with it, i probably would
04:01 AM jpa-: too bad that dayjob sucks all my programming energy so i have to find something else in hobby time
04:05 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> Initially, I just wanted to adjust and test my control system so that it would run with 6 axles.
04:05 AM lcnc-relay: That all works, now the robot is standing around here
04:05 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> and it's not the only one 😇
04:06 AM rifraf: get a few more and make a big hexapod
04:07 AM rifraf: to meet and greet all the hackerspace members and give them head massages as they code away
04:08 AM jpa-: "better have your head at correct location.. otherwise the arm will push until your head *is* at the correct location"
04:09 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> with the steppers it is no longer as fast as with servos, but still quite strong
04:09 AM rifraf: yep, thats why it needs to sense its environment a bit, people used to think Foxy could make a great sexbot, i would never be brave enough to put my bits near her
04:10 AM rifraf: but many girls would like a nice 6 axis arm well programmed
04:11 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> yes, otherwise I would also have an application for the arm
04:11 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> then only has to move up and down
04:12 AM rifraf: lots of those already, need to get more creative
04:13 AM rifraf: money to be made if you can think outside the box
04:13 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> prostate examination ? 😂
04:13 AM rifraf: no pun intended
04:14 AM rifraf: just imagine if you could do that, doctors would have a break from doing it and pay well for such a robot
04:16 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWPOJQfMGs8
04:17 AM rifraf: heh
04:19 AM rifraf: meister, a beer or tequila serving robot should be a big hit at any hackerspace, i would start somewhere like that
04:20 AM rifraf: and work your way up (or down) to more pleasurable tasks once you perfect that
04:23 AM rifraf: it could recognise members and make their favourite cocktails from a selection of fine spirits
04:24 AM rifraf: a dash of lime and pinch of salt with my tequila please
04:24 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> there is no hackerspace near here
04:24 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> i think i need to play more with opencv
04:24 AM rifraf: yep opencv is cool, wish i had more time for it
04:28 AM rifraf: make it sort garbage or plastics, turn it into a 3d printer, auto print removal and sorting machine to keep it going constantly
04:29 AM rifraf: see i dunno where you are from or what you like, hard to suggest suitable things but hope i gave you some ideas
04:31 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> all good, thought someone here had something in operation that I could have copied.
04:31 AM lcnc-relay: I'll find a good application one day
04:31 AM rifraf: am arm is the starting point, the end effectors are where its at
04:33 AM rifraf: while copying is the best form of flattery for the creator, making something new is the best for yourself
04:34 AM rifraf: am currently trying to make a bar feeder and auto collet chuck by not even looking at what is currently out there
04:35 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> that's good for breaking new ground
04:35 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> not to look at what the others are doing
04:35 AM rifraf: am getting closer day by day, https://www.youtube.com/shorts/rcXMSnGL6YQ
04:36 AM rifraf: that was a few weeks ago, is stronger and better now
04:37 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> cooool
04:39 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> I'll have to watch more of your videos when I get a chance 🙂
04:40 AM rifraf: no worries, most never makes it to video, but been trying to share a bit more
04:44 AM rifraf: made a spinning top that stopped standing up, no trickery https://www.youtube.com/shorts/9vXBPRe24_Y
04:46 AM rifraf: does it about 1 in every 4 spins
04:48 AM rifraf: ok better get back to fixing this FET driver, mods will be mad with me for going off topic, but you mentioned robots
04:48 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> wow
04:50 AM Tom_L: morning
04:50 AM rifraf: oh lookout, here he is now :P
04:51 AM rifraf: morning Tom_L
04:54 AM rifraf: Tom_L i found the spring i need, one of the wheelchair techs is replacing one next week, so is keeping it for me
04:56 AM Tom_L: good
05:01 AM rifraf: https://desire3d.com/images/public/sprung.jpg kinda like that but bit shorter
05:11 AM rifraf: they reckon will take a few hundred kg to compress it
06:30 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.@> A no spin top for clumsy kids
08:23 AM Unterhaus__ is now known as Unterhausen
08:51 AM JT-Cave: https://youtu.be/5V401ry7zTs
08:58 AM bjorkint0sh: Gracie did a nice job.
10:35 AM roycroft: it's snowing like crazy here all of a sudden, and there was no snow in the forecast
11:32 AM JT-Cave: sunny and 77°F here
11:34 AM roycroft: the snow has turned to rain
11:34 AM roycroft: and we're in for another deluge over the weekend
11:34 AM roycroft: we're getting our april showers early
12:45 PM rdtsc-w: supposed to be 75 tomorrow near Detroit - in the middle of March? That's two entire months early
12:49 PM roycroft: we got that warm last month - we tied all-time high records on several days
12:50 PM xxcoder: here was predicted to rain. its very sunny now
02:10 PM j2k: lcnc-relay is bot ?
02:12 PM roycroft: in a sense it is, but it's a very specific one that brides the irc network and the other network chat rooms together
02:13 PM roycroft: i don't believe it performs any other function other than to relay between the two ntworks
04:24 PM Tom_L: 80F
05:41 PM xxcoder: very warm sun here, then rain, snow, then hail, then sunny
05:41 PM xxcoder: fun
07:26 PM andypugh_: Mesa 7i53 (PCI) works on a cheap PCIe to PCI convertor (which includes a USB3 cable) with Bookworm on an N100-DC but does not work on a DN2800 with Wheezy. Curious.
07:28 PM andypugh_: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0CHM91KJB
07:29 PM andypugh_: If you have a PCI Mesa card, and find that your motherboard has died and can’t find a PCI port MB, then that might be worth looking at.
07:29 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> neat!
07:30 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> I have a bunch of pci motherboards for the K&T - but cool that there are options.
07:30 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> (still running on the original motherboard)
07:33 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> it has 2 5i20's in it
07:33 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> wonder if I can get any of those yet
07:33 PM andypugh_: I had a perfectly running mill, but decided that it was embarassing for the Release Manager to be running 2.8.0~pre on Wheezy when we are on 2.9.4
07:34 PM j2k: know anyone solution for mesa modbus bug that interefences the encoder input ?
07:34 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> I could replace them with 7i80's I guess
07:35 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> lol - yes - even the k&t is running something newer than wheezy..
07:35 PM j2k: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/52758-7i96s-mesa-modbus-encoder-count-interference?start=0
07:36 PM andypugh_: j2k: Is this included in: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/issues/2506
07:38 PM lcnc-relay: <andypugh@> skunkworks8841@ The 6i24 is probably a drop-in replacement for the 5i20 on a PCI-e motherbaord, and a lot cheaper too.
07:39 PM j2k: i don't think
07:39 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> ooh - I have been out of the loop.
07:39 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> thanks
07:39 PM j2k: the bugs is that when i have pktuart v2 in mesa card and connected working mdbus device
07:39 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> K&T is running stretch..
07:40 PM j2k: one encoder reads ghost data
07:40 PM j2k: the bug in github seems to be something else
07:42 PM andypugh_: Can you raise a new bug report then? I used to manage to read every forum post during my lunch break, but now I work from home and there is no lunch break.
07:42 PM j2k: after starting linuxcnc if i set in halshow update-hz to 0.000001
07:43 PM j2k: the crazy input to encoder stops
07:43 PM andypugh_: But this does feel like it is possibly related to the bug reported on setting the update rate.
07:43 PM j2k: yes it is related
07:44 PM j2k: is this https://forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/52758-7i96s-mesa-modbus-encoder-count-interference?start=0
07:49 PM j2k: i have tried to run ./mesaflash --device 7I80HD-16 --addr 10.10.10.10 --wpo 0x6800=0x00010000 before start linuxcnc but does not fix the problem
07:55 PM andypugh_: You have said that you have a bit of C experience, perhaps you can have a look at the (fairly simple) C code in the template file and try see what might be going on?
07:56 PM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> How many cables have you got on that encoder? is it shielded, twisted pairs?
07:56 PM andypugh_: I don’t have the right hardware to test with, I only actually tested mesa_modbus with a relay card and a VFD>
08:10 PM j2k: i found something
08:10 PM j2k: the problem stops by setting update-hz to non zero
08:11 PM andypugh_: Curious.
08:11 PM j2k: mesa_modbus.c.tmpl ?
08:12 PM j2k: some other reports division by zero error
08:12 PM j2k: and that glues
08:15 PM andypugh_: Yes, basically all that there is to mesa_modbus is a template file that gets compiled with your user-defined data structure.
08:16 PM j2k: here https://forum.linuxcnc.org/27-driver-boards/54323-strange-stepgen-behaviour-with-7i95t-1pktv2d-firmware?start=10
08:18 PM j2k: to line 516 of mesa_modbus.c.tmpl
08:18 PM j2k: when update-hz=0 there is division by zero
08:18 PM j2k: timer = 1e9 / inst->hal->rate;
08:30 PM andypugh_: Yes, that’s a clear problem if rate = 0.
08:32 PM j2k: in this struct definition
08:32 PM j2k: typedef struct {
08:32 PM j2k: hal_data_u **pins;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_float_t **scale;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_data_u **pin2;
08:32 PM j2k: rtapi_s64 *buff;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_bit_t *fault;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_u32_t *last_err;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_u32_t address;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_u32_t baudrate;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_u32_t parity;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_u32_t txdelay;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_u32_t rxdelay;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_u32_t drive_delay;
08:32 PM j2k: hal_float_t rate;
08:32 PM j2k: } hm2_modbus_hal_t;
08:32 PM j2k: rate is float_t
08:34 PM j2k: maybe a autotype cast incompatibility ?
08:34 PM Tom_L: paste.debian.net
08:34 PM j2k: sorry
08:35 PM andypugh_: It’s going to end up as NaN. So then the question is is NaN > 0 ?
08:36 PM andypugh_: I think that all comparisons to NaN fail?
08:36 PM andypugh_: So basically it will then get stuck in scase START. Which probably isn’t your proiblem.
08:37 PM andypugh_: Though it does need a fix.
08:39 PM andypugh_: You could replace timer = 1e9 / inst->hal->rate;
08:40 PM andypugh_: with timer = (inst->hal->rate == 0) ? 0 ;:1e9 / inst->hal->rate;
08:41 PM andypugh_: with timer = (inst->hal->rate == 0) ? 0 :1e9 / inst->hal->rate;
08:41 PM andypugh_: Then re-run modcompile.
08:42 PM andypugh_: But I very much doubt that is the problem, “timer” is only used in case START
08:43 PM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> https://trackso.in/knowledge-base/rules-perfect-cabling-modbus-rtu-rs485-communication-systems/
08:46 PM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> grounding and proper cable type is very important to get clean signal
08:48 PM andypugh_: If it’s a regular ghost tick, that doesn’t sound like noise. Quadrature is really remarkably noise resistant.
08:48 PM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> I've lost months debugging software, to then find out it was a cable issue, I would strongly reccomend to double check the hardware is following all best practices
08:53 PM andypugh_: 01:43 here, need to stop.
08:54 PM lcnc-relay: <grandixximo@> andypugh_: Good Night